Carver's move was mysterious: don't take a guy having a tough year, and furthermore having his worst game, and debut him in a crucial defensive position with 5 minutes to go in a crucial game
Truth is, the goal conceded didn't matter, so I'm not that exercised about it
The bigger problem is, every move Carver makes to buck up Maurice's confidence is backfiring.
Last edited by ensco; 07-10-2008 at 11:51 AM.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
SOrry, you have problems when your only option is Harmse. I honestly think he cannot play and his first 3-4 touches on the ball were absolutely horrible as always. The game completely changed when he entered. Harmse or Harmsieas the announcer said it should be pronounced, should go back to Vancouver and his west coast.
Because you're developing your opinions on what you already know, not the full breadth of information you need. We all do it sometimes, sometimes it bites us in the ass.Originally Posted by James17930
If you look up his record before posting, you find he's played regularly at CB for the u.s. men's team, subbed there a few times in college, played there for the u-21 team etc etc. Coming out of the US draft he was dubbed "primarily a defensive-minded player" etc etc.
edit: ok, see, burned by my own hypothesis. He's played "a few times", not regularly. But it makes the point that if you check out his record, he has experience there. And he's a better athlete than either Harmse or Robinson, and so more likely to adapt to a different role (for other examples see: James, Julius and Smith, Jarrod).
Last edited by jloome; 07-10-2008 at 12:48 PM.
yeah, John Carver made Edu miss that header eh.
this thread is ridiculous, on par with your sutton analysis here
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=3048
I think you should give up on analyzing the game, you're not very good at it.
If Carver can be faulted for anything it is not switching up the formation to defend the lead they had. It is all really a moot point though because unless TFC won by 3 a draw was going to be the same result. So keep the formation and hope for a couple late goals.
I think Carver is a little smarter than the critics give him credit for. He knew that a draw and a 1 goal win are the same... so sub Velez for another midfielder... hell play with 2 at the back for a while... who cares? 1 point is the same is as 3 when you win by 1.
I don't know what other options he had. I think he put his most experienced option in that position. If he were to play with Hemming back there and Hemming made a mistake you'd all blame JC anyways. Who was on the bench at that time?
Ya, Mourinho used to do that with Essien all the time too.
What a shitty coach.
Players need to be adaptive, there are 11 positions to fill, and only 5 substitutes.
Velez is not a pre ordained tactical substitution, he is supposed to play the 90. You don't always have the right sub, so players have to shift about to adapt. It's part of a defensive players job to cover in such situations, theyre not supposed to be creative but they are supposed to be comptent. Edu made a huge error, and Carver couldn't have predicted that.
Exactly correct. Carver had no hand in that matter. He chose who he thought was the best man to adapt. Robbo was playing very will in the middle and moving him back would have eliminated our build up from the back completely.
CARVER has made several mistakes and they keep on growing, yet people don't seem to mind. I just don't get what the love affair is with him.
When was the last time TFC won a game?? Fuck it's been so long that I can't remember. Anyways it was June 14th (a month ago) against Colorado. They won 3-1. What has happened since?
1) June 21 tie vs KC. With all their international players back, Carver sits them out. The result is a tie against one of the worst teams. Also it was a tie at home. THIS WAS THE START IF A BIG SLIDE.
2) June 28th 2-1 loss to New England. What else is new this team can't win on the road.
3) July 1 loss to Vancouver. Fuck to make it worse it was Canada day, on home field turf against a USL team. Carver made mistakes yet again and had to substitute 3 players at half time. All of a sudden this team can't win at home.
4) July 5 loss to Pachuca. I know it was just a friendly and it was in PK's however, it was another loss at home.
5) July 9 tie to Vancouver. I mean they can't even beat Vancouver on the road. How are they going to beat a MLS team on the road.
Summary
TFC has not won a game in their last 5
They have lost their last 2 home games
They have played Vancouver twice and could not beat them once. They earned 1 out of a possible 6 points against a USL team.
With their slide, they have managed to let all the other teams in their divsion catch up to them in the satndings. Fuck KC is almost ahead of us for last place.
It all began on June 21 in the KC game. Somehow Carver has managed to ruin the chemistry on the team by treating his players like kids. I took alot of flak for my comments back then and continue to take flak for my comments. The facts/results speak for themselves.
Resting players who had been playing for the past few weeks and been travelling over continents. Losing at a place we have never won. Getting jobbed by the officiating. Holding a team who has won everything they have played in last year to a draw after 90 mins.......
It all began with MLS not reconizing the international FIFA calender.
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Yeah, "the fact" -- ok then, let's look at the facts, since the reason your comments always get flak is because they are typically stupid and reactionary.
1) This terrible spiral you're talking about features exactly one loss to an MLS team in league play.
2) Pachuca played their first team, generally considered one of the best club teams in the world after the big four leagues, and we played them to a standstill, before replays show we were robbed on pks.
3) I'll give you that the Vancouver results weren't good but let's face it, we dominated play in both games only to lose through a few moments of stupidity from individual players -- not tactical errors, not stupid public statements that cause dissension, not bad subs; none of the things that would make you lay blame on a head coach.
4) Last year's record vs this year's record.
5) Laurent Robert and Rohan Ricketts, neither of whom would likely be here without Carver's participation; he had a very good rep as a field coach in England.
Giambac, I swear to God that except for the fact that you occasionally mention your kids, I'd swear you were extremely young and cognitively underdeveloped. You lack basic common sense in your arguments and you NEVER change your mind, which is the sign of a lack of humility. Nobody is right all the time, and when most everyone thinks you're wrong most of the time, you usually are.
Same goes for the other negative regulars on here. Jesus wept, I've never seen so much horseshit before.
LOL can't let go of that game can you GIAMBAC. Did you have proline on it or something??
We gave up that goal through poor defending. Who should we blame ?? Well anyone in the defensive position including the keeper. It was a hail mary ball that somehow evaded everyone.
No the facts are as follows.
we are only 4 points out of last place. The same team (KC) who Carver thought the regulars didn't have to play are now breathing up our asses.
The fact is that this team can never win on the road. They can't even beat Vancouver. Is it in the players mind. Can't the coach change the game plan. Can't he motivate the players.
The fact is that with only 1 game left in the CC challenege TFC may not represent Canada.
The fact is Carver is always busy on the sidelines yelling at the other coach or the 4th referre. why doesn't he just keep his cool and focus on the game and concentrate on making the best player selections/substitutions.
This team is better this year because of the players Mo has brought in. Carver hasn't been able to use them to their maximum capabilities. I mean if it was hocky, baseball, basketball the fans and media would be questioning the coaches decision making. why does Carver get a pass?
No. These are facts.
If we win our games in hand, we are 3 points out of first.
At the half-way point in the season we have as many wins (total and away) as all of last year.
Animals Eaten:
pig, cow, lamb, moose, chicken, quail, kudu, ostrich, kangaroo, octopus, alligator, rabbit, shark, springbok, goat, bison, boar, caterpillars, turkey, fish, lobster, crab, oyster, prawn, antelope, camel, eel, squid
The way this team has been playing lately it is A BIG IF
Most of the time this wouldn't make any sense except that in the NCC, goal difference is the first tie-breaker, which means we'd have to win against Montreal anyway, because if we beat Van and were tied with Mon. at 6 points each, they would beat us on GD if we drew them.
But still, you post, unintentionally, seems to imply that Carver wouldn't care if we won the game or not. Which obviously I don't think is true.
I know... this is exactly what I said in my post.
My post implies exactly the opposite. It implies that up a goal Carver was risking the draw (up a goal) by putting on another midfielder... thus pushing for a bigger win.But still, you post, unintentionally, seems to imply that Carver wouldn't care if we won the game or not. Which obviously I don't think is true.
News Flash this just in... PEOPLE MAKE MISTAKES...
I have no doubt that JC had the right move judging from the experience on the bench. Edu messed up you can also chalk that up to his limited experience and the fact that apart from his goal he had a shakey game against Vancouver.
Lets move on win or draw we had to beat the impact @ home.
In Carver We Trust ... all others pay cash
http://www.onesecondleft.com/ Please visit the one second left blog that I contribute to.
My MLS now includes Montreal... we needed someone to hate.
Edu fucked up a fairly routine mop up. He's been shite all fucking season, he should be dropped, or traded while his value is still high.
I keep hoping for improvement from him, he's regressing from a stellar 1st season.
I think we're all forgetting that no matter whether you're a central defender, striker or my damn grandma you should be able to head that ball back to your keeper NO PROBLEM. Edu has pissed me off alot this season but when I saw that I wondered if he should even be in the MLS I mean come on, what the FUCK was that?
People are overlooking the obvious...Edu has had a bad year. He's played some D in his past (and will likely play CB in the Olympics) so Carver took the opportunity to give him some time in that roll when we had the lead knowing that if we gave up the tying goal it wouldn't have made a difference. It wasn't a mistake, it was giving a struggling player a chance to resurrect his season by putting him in a new position.
I think only a handful are overlooking the obvious. Many people don't blame Carver, it is the vocal minority.
Most people from what I have seen seem to agree that Edu is a shadow of what he was last year.
I think a half season isn't enough to write the guy off, I still think he can be a great player. But then... I think I may in the minority there
The only thing it resurrected was another thread about how shit Edu has been, and rightly so. That was a horrific mistake that cost us 2 points and possibly a birth in the CL.
The mistake was Edu's, not Carver's. It didn't cost us anything. Whether we won or tied, we still need to beat Montreal. Only a loss would have changed anything.
It was Edu's mistake, not Carver's.
Whether a 2-2 tie or a 2-1 win, it still meant a must win at home against Montreal on the 22nd.
But this thread began as a criticism of Carver's decision to sub in MF Harmse for an injured CB Velez with 5 minutes to go, nursing a precarious 1 goal lead. In all honesty, when you saw the 4th ref's pixelboard flash up "4" and "5", how many of you said "WTF? Harmse for Velez??!" and how many of you said "Oh, good move...now move Edu to centreback.".
I was definitely in the 1st category, even knowing that Dunivant, Tebily and Brennan were all out. I'm guessing the 2nd group would have been pretty lonely.
^He put in the player with the most experience (Harmse) and tested Edu at CB...again, knowing that giving up a goal wouldn't make any difference in the world. No risk or gamble was involved and he gave Edu a chance to establish himself in a new roll. All in all it was a smart tactical play for a number of reasons, even if those reasons weren't immediately obvious to some of us watching.
It was Edu's mistake because he is a player and was directly involved in the play. He has to be accountable. However it is also Carver's mistake because he manages the team and he has to know what playersto use and in what situations. Everyone on this thread is in agreement that Edu has had a terrible season , so why does Carver continue to use him? Ultimately it is Carver who decides who plays and his mistakes are costing the team. Like I said look at the teams record in the past 5 games. Look at the remaining schedule. TFC has more road games than any other team. If you think all of a sudden they will start winning on the road then you are fooling yourselves.
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