If the fix was in then Iro would have been called for that tackle in the box...Originally Posted by brad
If the fix was in then Iro would have been called for that tackle in the box...
we are improving to a piss poor team there are no excuses now results dont lie, toronto played a bad team and were played off the park in the second half,winter does not seam to be able to motivate this team, there is a big difference from coaching a youth team with no pressure for results and bringing on the youth players,to toronto where results do matter as i have said stats dont lie this is the worst toronto team in our history ,we have some nice players but no tactics or great subs from the bench,it was mentioned earlier abt morall it must be low in the dressing room players know they will be moved in the close seasonm so we are back to rebuilding again but we are not moving forward anyone who thinks we are look at the table, performances, results,winter has half a season at most to prove himself to the support iff not 9 to 10 tho will be the norm for bmo
some positives as we progress to the end of the season - namely Morgan becoming a sold starter, Iro improving, and decent fluency up front.
The lads looked tired after 1.5 games wed/thursday, while the offside call was wrong, those are tough to call when the defender steps up and the attacker breaks. The linesman gets one quick view in real time and while I get frustrated at OBVIOUS wrong calls, this was understandable.
Season's over as far as MLS goes, so while it would have been nice to get the points, at the end of the day it will make little difference aside from the debate between us and the Shitecaps for MLS's worst team.
Onwards and upwards. Let's judgee the Winter project this time next year.
TFC Draw At Home to San Jose
http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/20...e-to-san-jose/
In this video blog I take a look back at what was in retrospect another frustrating night for Toronto FC as poor man marking led to San Jose getting a late goal from Chris Wondolowski who scored on a free header to draw San Jose level with TFC 1-1.
Going into the international break I also take a look ahead to what is next for the team upon their return to action on September 10th and how a surprising result in the Champions League has given Toronto FC a renewed opportunity to possibly qualify out of their group and into the knockout stages this winter. And I ask if the rebuilding of Toronto FC would have been further along than it is today if the club would have made it into the knockout stages last year.
they maybe do if theres something at stake.
Surely they are more likely to be fixed if there's nothing at stake.
The fixing is all about gambling - nothing to do with the teams, fans, and supporters.
I was watching the Man U game on TV and noticed that the fans sat in their seats unlike at BMO where everybody is moving around all the time. Looking for the seats, buying beer, taking a piss, going for a walk. Can't blame us for leaving our seats empty for long stretches of time. And, many season ticket holders that I have talked to throughout the season have given up on the team, finding other things to do on Saturdays. I think this Winter experiment is a disaster, and the suits in the mlse head office are going to roll heads at the end of the season. Winter sporting a horrible win loss record means little to the ownership until they are faced with having to work hard to reclaim fan interest and it is going to be harder to gouge us for higher prices in 2012. I predict the whole management team is fired by December or January.
I'd be pretty surprised.. as well as disappointed.
Sure, I'd love them to be doing better.
Winter and team started with a pretty dismal group of players, only about 2 weeks before the preseason, and some significant long term baggage and grievances with some of the few players that were half decent.
Starting over all over again isn't going to be a great solution for next year.
I'd be inclined to give them to the middle of next season. If we are not seriously in contention at that point.. so be it, and off they go.
I think the ownership will base there decision on two factors; One, the renewal rate and effort/cost incurred (they hate freezing prices, but may have to, and that will piss them off), and Two: Who else is available, and at what price? We have had one rookie manager after another, and the only one with mls experience was given the boot after a very short time (Preki). The decision to keep or boot Winter will be based on the bottom line. The team as it stands is in a rebuilding phase all of the time, so holding onto a losing coach will not be easy to market to fence sitting fans when season ticket sales begin.
I think Viator and/or Harden were the ones not marking on the San Jose goal, no? There were two players unmarked, Viator definitely should have been marking one of them. I'm not sure if Harden actually had a man-marking assignment on that play (in that case, his marking was really bad).
Yes, it would be very disappointing to start over again and it's very unlikely to happen. Winter was given a three-year contract (first TFC coach ever given more than one year) for a reason. Everyone knew that it would take a while to build the team.
This!
If they sack them, they're going to have to do a lot to convince me to pony up for next year. i'm not saying I'm satisfied, I'm just not interested in breaking with what both sides looked at and agreed upon. i.e. bring someone in and give them at least 1.5-2 seasons to put their stamp on the club
Blah, blah, blah.
He's on for two years at least. Winter is quality, one of the top midfielders in the world for his time and he's well regarded in the world footballing community. He's earned a chance to show what he can do as a coach. We wouldn't have a shred of credibility left if he were let go. It's a non-starter so let's move the conversation beyond this.
Against San Jose, Winter finally did something I thought was a good idea, by bringing in defensive oriented subs to protect the lead. This team has rarely done this in the past, and always finds a way to lose in the last 20 min of close games. Thus, these changes he made were, in my view, a good idea. Then San Jose scores on a goal where the defender lost his man, it happens in soccer, this time you cannot blame the coach. This team is simply not very good. We have to stop comparing the individual talent to previous years, and instead, compare it to the opposition, that is where it matters most. And, like many of you have said, over and over again, mls has improved. But, starting from scratch every season has resulted in this futility; many of these younger players are simply not good enough, and perhaps, never will be. \it is important to be patient, but you have to have something of quality to start with.
Really? Coaches in pro sports are fired all the time. That is normal. What is not normal is to lose money, and mlse will fire the coach before the latter becomes the norm.
TFC is a cash cow for MLSE with the salary structure of MLS. Losing money is not something that will happen any time soon. He's started with a crap team and everyone knows it . No one with reasonable expectations thinks it can be turned around that fast. He's here to stay and so he should.
If he started with a crap team then he's so far got an even worse one. He did that pretty fast.
Actually, he took a crap team and tried to make them play an actual game of football unlike preki who took a crap team and sat them behind the ball for 90 minutes and prayed DeRo somehow got away from the 3 guys marking him. Their biggest mistake was giving some of these guys a chance to prove themselves. Our biggest mistake was waiting so long to actually hire someone
You think this team is worse now than in april, may, june and most of july?
For what it's worth, this team is finally starting to find it's identity. Our 4-3-3 looks dangerous, like never before. Whenever we get the ball, I know that a lot of the times we'll at least get a chance on goal.
I'm very upset about the result, but I am happy with the way the team played. One individual screwed it up for TFC- ONE!.
9/10 nights that would be a win. TFC actually scored 2, and the last goal against can be sorted out next season by Cann or Williams or whoever else they want to bring in at CB.
Stinson, Morgan and Plata are only going to get better next year. And they are already burning MLS vets with their pace.
I can see TFC being the team that tires out it's oponents with fast attacks for 90 minutes next year. And with improved backline and DP midfield, we can be tough to break down as well.
Coaches in this TEAM are fired all the time. One doesn't have to look to other teams or sport. It's time to give someone a full year.
We have a better core of players to build around than at the start of this year. The problems the team had at the start of the year were not going away without some turnover.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
If crowd disinterest is your basis for fan support level of this team's management I'd like to welcome you to sports in North America.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
You know we've reached an all time low when we are discussing possible match fixing as a reason for a TFC result! bahahahaha!
Honestly, I think its down to poor management, poor tactics, and poor players! I don't think we need to look beyond that!
Uh... NO.
TORONTO FC, 2017 MLS CHAMPIONS!!! (Still the greatest in league history!)
What would all of you say to the Manchester United, Arsenal result over the weekend, I mean a top class team of the EPL allowing 8 goals, horrendous, fire the lot. I know it is off topic, but I thought I would throw it in.
TFC should have won the match, but Football is Football.
I would say Wenger is under severe pressure right now. I think the only thing that is saving him is the number of injuries Arsenal have right now, coupled with their two best players leaving. I think everybody is assuming that Wenger will replace those two players before the end of the deadline as they "should" have a large amount of money available.
I don't think "football is football" is an excuse. I think just as much as Wenger is under pressure to replace his two lost stars, Winter should also be under pressure right now.
I think if TFC end up last in the conference, which is worse than last season, Winter should be held accountable.
If Preki was held accountable, then Winter equally should be.
In my experience with football, if a new manager or head coach CANNOT turn things around for a team within a few months of joining the team, he won't be able to do so at all. If Winter can't make the on field product BETTER by the end of the season, this is more than enough time to have done so.
Look at Roy Hogdson and Kenny Dalglish at Liverpool, this is a prime example. Hodgson couldn't turn them around, while Dalglish could with the same players. Two or three months is more than enough in soccer-land to see if a new manager has the ability to turn a team around.
I don't think Wenger will finish the season personally. Not just because of this result, but he's failed to find a decent keeper for years now, and the team morale is at an all-time low. And they're losing badly...all of that adds up to the end for him.
Of course, big international teams playing in the Champions League have their pick of managers who would go there. That's not true in TFC's case. There a few established managers who would want to come to MLS, and not many unestablished managers either. I think we're really lucky to get a guy of Winter's playing quality here, who understands football at the highest level, has a playing career not matched by very many people, and has the experience playing in huge games. I'd take that any day over some guy in the NCAA or NASL or even MLS who has some experience playing or coaching in a North American system that still can't compete globally. Winter has so much experience he can impart on young kids. His goal is to change the way we develop and play football in this country, which I agree with totally. He still needs time for that to really start paying dividens at the TFC level, but it IS starting to show now. I know patience is hard for fans who have seen 5 years of failure, but patience is what's needed.
Not at ALL the same situation. Liverpool had the players in place. Winter is trying to make playground footballers into a team.
Guys, international threads are here:
Man United
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=9370
Arsenal
http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=187
Or feel free to start a thread about that game in particular in that section.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
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