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  1. #301
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    Franchise quality centre backs grow on trees in this league. And yet we go get someone's garbage at the curb like Iro?!!! I have to conclude that Winter/Mariner have to go NOW! And MLSE FO is total shitw. Sell the team to someone who really wants to win - like Rogers!

  2. #302
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    Can't believe how much dero hand jobbing is going on in this thread. Getting rid of him was a great move and one I still agree with.

    Does he score goals? Of course.

    Is our problem scoring? Not really. Our biggest problem is defending - and a locker room cancer ball hog that doesn't really run back isn't going to help that.

  3. #303
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    ^^What he said.
    KD.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    Shakes, I'll acknowledge your well thought out pieces.

    As for a number of other posts from people other than Shakes, I cannot believe the number of folks that are acknowledging the team looked tired yet still conclude it should have been a non-factor.

    One team was home and cooled for a week. The other spent over 22 hours on planes, 4 hours on buses and put their heads down on pillows in 3 separate time zones.

    We can conclude that our new defensive player is shit, despite being a 6th overall draft pick, 3 NCAA Defensive Player of the Year honours and being a First Team All-American.

    Or we can say you know what? He, like quite a few others looked tired and if you were preparing an athlete to perform at their peak, you sure as heck wouldn't fly them out to Portland, Nicaragua, Toronto and then on to DC in the span of 7 days.

    Reasons aren't excuses folks. Step back from the ledge.
    I'm not one jumping all over Iro. But he hasn't played a game where he looked good with TFC. This is more of a pattern then an anomoly. It's also concerning that the same stuff we are seeing here is the same reason Columbass didn't care to see him gone and why he found his way on to the bench over there. So it's not as straight forward as you make it seem.

    And I haven't heard anyone say that the travel should have been a none factor. There were lots of factors in this game. From both team's standpoint.

  5. #305
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    This is the history of our club but I thought he treated his success at our expense respectfully, just as Carl Robinson did in New York a couple of years ago. I'm not sure who was credited with our third goal but I noticed that in the celebrations Koevermans was especially supportive of Iro. That is being a good team mate. The acquisition of Frings and Koevermans has already given TFC more fighting spirit and, with one or two exceptions, this is a pretty decent line-up.And this is not from a cheerleader, my son and I gave up our season tickets this year. I actually see grounds for optimism.

  6. #306
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    "Agent Iro, this is Columbus Center, your mission to destruct Toronto is complete. Please return to base."

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen View Post
    fuck all you haters, I'm getting Iro on my jersey
    i'm not calling you Liar i just don't believe you..

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by canadian_bhoy View Post
    Can't believe how much dero hand jobbing is going on in this thread. Getting rid of him was a great move and one I still agree with.

    Does he score goals? Of course.

    Is our problem scoring? Not really. Our biggest problem is defending - and a locker room cancer ball hog that doesn't really run back isn't going to help that.
    True... and what happened to De Ro last night? He scored three goals and his team didn't win. Where did we see that? Oh ya, in Toronto. De Ro has always been known for his individual performances -- but they don't always mean the team wins.

    Interestingly, all the quotes I've read this morning from DC are about how they have had trouble winning at home this year, how they should have beat a "bad team" at home last night etc.

  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary_canuck View Post
    This is the history of our club but I thought he treated his success at our expense respectfully, just as Carl Robinson did in New York a couple of years ago. I'm not sure who was credited with our third goal but I noticed that in the celebrations Koevermans was especially supportive of Iro. That is being a good team mate. The acquisition of Frings and Koevermans has already given TFC more fighting spirit and, with one or two exceptions, this is a pretty decent line-up.And this is not from a cheerleader, my son and I gave up our season tickets this year. I actually see grounds for optimism.
    I'll admit it...I have a man crush on Koevs. Very close to changing my Avatar.

  10. #310
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    I have been a Canary fan since 1959 and go to their games every time I'm on holiday in Norfolk ( my younger brother still lives there and is on the waiting list for season tickets ). Still fondly remember the epic Eastern Daily Press headline " Bly, Bly Babes " after we beat Man U in the FA Cup in 1959. I saw both Carl Robinson and Jim Brennan play at Carrow Road. Preki should never have got rid of Robinson, his vision at the centre of defence was great. Nice to see another NCFC fan in Toronto. I once left a Canary pennant in a bar downtown and the bar manager told me that, two years later, noone had asked about it ( it was up on the wall ). I was crushed!!!!
    On the Ball, TFC!!!!

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    True... and what happened to De Ro last night? He scored three goals and his team didn't win. Where did we see that? Oh ya, in Toronto. De Ro has always been known for his individual performances -- but they don't always mean the team wins.

    Interestingly, all the quotes I've read this morning from DC are about how they have had trouble winning at home this year, how they should have beat a "bad team" at home last night etc.
    You are right, Dero should have been in net last night. I'm sure everyone in DC is thinking, fuck that Dero guy, everytime he's on the pitch we don't win.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    True... and what happened to De Ro last night? He scored three goals and his team didn't win. Where did we see that? Oh ya, in Toronto. De Ro has always been known for his individual performances -- but they don't always mean the team wins.
    Honestly, the guy scored a hat trick while his team was down a man for 90 minutes. What more do you want?

  13. #313
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    That was the first near full game I watched in a while, because the team has been painfully bad, still track the games but just didn't want to put my heart through it.

    I was sad to see Iro screw up so badly. But I don't think he should have been left on the field. You had to know that both DC forwards were going to work at countering. We needed a guy with legs that could keep up.

    It's still what we are missing. I kinda wish we had Marvel Wynne in CB right now.

    Of all the trades made in the last few weeks Iro was the only one that seems to have been really bad. It means one of three things.

    1) the other teams are hesitant to trade away a CB and toronto didn't have enough on the table to get someone with pace and skill.

    2) The other teams are scared of us and don't want to trade a CB to us.

    3) there is a break down in scouting with defensive players.


    The game played simple DC played a fortress system and hoped to catch us off guard on the counter. Which is exactly how it played out. They did exactly what they should have done in a 10 man situation, and they had Dero one of the few guys in the league that could do that.

    I hope Iro has another skill, maybe investment banking or welding

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    He, like quite a few others looked tired and if you were preparing an athlete to perform at their peak, you sure as heck wouldn't fly them out to Portland, Nicaragua, Toronto and then on to DC in the span of 7 days.

    Reasons aren't excuses folks. Step back from the ledge.
    Yup. Eckersley looked tired... wasn't himself... Dunfield looked dead when he was taken off. Plata wasn't running, was definitely tired and getting muscled off every ball -- didn't have that usual jump to fight against bigger players. Johnson seemed less active.

    The recent travels and the tiredness that comes with it definitely affected the team last night. That DC couldn't take advantage of this is the surprise to me. I predicted a sure loss.

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    True... and what happened to De Ro last night? He scored three goals and his team didn't win.
    Are you sure you didn't mean…"and his team played with 10 men for 80 odd minutes…and didn't win."
    “We changed the entire league’s opinion of the viability of soccer in North America. And then we blew it because we chickened out." —Tim Leiweke

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    No chance I'd want that greedy, me-first player MeRo back...he threw his teammates under the bus every chance he got....decent player, but a cancer...

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    Since noone asked, I'll give my two cents..

    We must start Iro next game, its crucial to his confidence and development; anyone can have a bad game - he looks like a real player to me. Even the best have howlers like that sometimes...

    Something that I really noticed...JDG is playing a little better - at almost the same level as Dunfield and Stinson...somehow, I expected more from this DP, who has never, ever delivered in the TFC colours anywhere close to his reputation, or to what he did in the past for the nat'l team...

    Thats about it really....watching the game I was wishing we had DeRo now, with this group of players, some real quality around him - instead of the jokers he had to carry on his back while he was here...can you imagine how devestating he'd be with Johnson, koover, Plata, Frings, Dunfield, and Ecks? Thats some real balance and menace...

  18. #318
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    Undefeated in 4 matches when is the last time you could say that team is making progress ... its a little disappointing that Iro had to make all those errors but i think this is his preseason too. When everyone gets into form we will play well. lots of positives from the match. the next few games will have a different story line with TFC wins i an liking the progress. adrian cann whould be on that back line we need to sign a mccenna considering cann might not come back or recover. that game sould of been 3-0 TFC if cannHope winter gives him a game or twho as a sub

    TFC all the way..,....... PROGRESS!

  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    Yup. Eckersley looked tired... wasn't himself... Dunfield looked dead when he was taken off. Plata wasn't running, was definitely tired and getting muscled off every ball -- didn't have that usual jump to fight against bigger players. Johnson seemed less active.

    The recent travels and the tiredness that comes with it definitely affected the team last night. That DC couldn't take advantage of this is the surprise to me. I predicted a sure loss.
    Even after getting a man advantage at the beginning of the game?

  20. #320
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    Like I've posted previously Iro was voted PLAYER OF THE YEAR at Columbus LAST YEAR(by the coaches and players)....Can a young guy DETERIORATE that badly in one year???....beginning to look like it....

  21. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Honestly, the guy scored a hat trick while his team was down a man for 90 minutes. What more do you want?
    You can't expect more from De Ro. Who said I expected more from De Ro? I expected more from the DC *team*.

    Just like in Toronto, people get blinded by De Ro's individual brilliance. They think "well, ok, thank god we got a tie thanks to the wonderful De Rosario!!!"

    But De Ro is perfect for last night's situation, when the DC keeper fucks up royally, when his teammates don't play that well. He's a lone wolf. He takes charge in situations like this.

    DC's success will come from improving the players around him, not relying on De Ro to score three goals.

    But fitting De Ro into a proper team system will be the challenge for DC. If the plan is "let De Ro save us every night" then they're fine (they'll be an average team). Once they try to put him into a proper system, they'll get frustrated.
    Last edited by rocker; 08-07-2011 at 09:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary_canuck View Post
    I have been a Canary fan since 1959 and go to their games every time I'm on holiday in Norfolk ( my younger brother still lives there and is on the waiting list for season tickets ). Still fondly remember the epic Eastern Daily Press headline " Bly, Bly Babes " after we beat Man U in the FA Cup in 1959. I saw both Carl Robinson and Jim Brennan play at Carrow Road. Preki should never have got rid of Robinson, his vision at the centre of defence was great. Nice to see another NCFC fan in Toronto. I once left a Canary pennant in a bar downtown and the bar manager told me that, two years later, noone had asked about it ( it was up on the wall ). I was crushed!!!!
    On the Ball, TFC!!!!
    I cannot BELIEVE there is another NCFC fan on this board. Awesome! My mum's cousin played with the in the 80s - Andy Mendham.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maninb View Post
    No chance I'd want that greedy, me-first player MeRo back...he threw his teammates under the bus every chance he got....decent player, but a cancer...

    So you must work for the club each day, travel with them, attend practices and meetings to have this insight.

    He wanted to get paid what he was worth, and TFC didn"t do that and last night proved what a terrible mistake it was.

    Who did he throw under the bus anyway?

    It's about winning, is his attitude 100% mr. nice guy, probably not, but he's the best player we ever had, and probably one of the best the league will ever have. Part of managing professional athletes is also the ability to manage ego's and personalities. Just look at any professional sport, and to make a judgement call as to whether the skills and abilitites of the athletet is worth the time, effort and concessions to manage that person. TFC didn"t do that with DERO and it was proven last night what a mistake that was.

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    That should say Peter Mendham. Andy is my uncle. Duh.

  25. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    DC's success will come from improving the players around him, not relying on De Ro to score three goals.
    There is still no evidence that Dero is a hindrance to their team. DC has improved since he's arrived, we have regressed since he left.

    We can talk about subjective things like attitude but we have no basis to speak because we're not in the room, so we don't know what the real story is. He could have been the most vocal guy in a room of desperately unhappy players or a petulant jerk. We have no context.

    BTW the shot of the bench last night of guys sitting down when we scored said it all, and maybe should be a cue to anyone who is going to bullhorn the message that the team atmosphere has improved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rocker View Post
    You can't expect more from De Ro. Who said I expected more from De Ro? I expected more from the DC *team*.

    Just like in Toronto, people get blinded by De Ro's individual brilliance. They think "well, ok, thank god we got a tie thanks to the wonderful De Rosario!!!"

    But De Ro is perfect for last night's situation, when the DC keeper fucks up royally, when his teammates don't play that well. He's a lone wolf. He takes charge in situations like this.

    DC's success will come from improving the players around him, not relying on De Ro to score three goals.

    But fitting De Ro into a proper team system will be the challenge for DC. If the plan is "let De Ro save us every night" then they're fine (they'll be an average team). Once they try to put him into a proper system, they'll get frustrated.
    Is there really such a thing as a "proper system" in the MLS?

    I'll take the individual talent of his calibre to win games own his own, because it's not just skill, it's heart. Despite the bs on this board about his attitude and even calling him a "cancer", which by the way is very insulting to anyone who has or has someone in their family with cancer, Dero play with heart and that can't be denied. Which player, with ability, other than Dichio played with more heart for TFC than Dero ever?

  27. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by InDa_110 View Post
    Is there really such a thing as a "proper system" in the MLS?

    I'll take the individual talent of his calibre to win games own his own, because it's not just skill, it's heart. Despite the bs on this board about his attitude and even calling him a "cancer", which by the way is very insulting to anyone who has or has someone in their family with cancer, Dero play with heart and that can't be denied. Which player, with ability, other than Dichio played with more heart for TFC than Dero ever?
    DUDE.. I'M NOT ARGUING THAT HEART DOESN'T MATTER>

    HE IS A GREAT PLAYER. HE SCORES GOALS.

    I agree with you on those points.

    But let's look at this: TFC has had goals from what, 4 different players in the past two league games. DC has had 5 goals from 1 player. Over the long run, that is bad. You cannot succeed in this league by depending on a lone wolf player who doesn't play a system but who will take you on his back sometimes. Cuz when he stops scoring, who do you turn to?

    Winter's offensive system means we can get contributions from more than just De Rosario.

    I think De Ro is a fucking amazing wonderful, INDIVIDUAL. I don't think he's great within a system.
    NYRB realized this. Toronto realized this. DC will realize this, with time, if they try to create a proper system. If their goal is just "give it to De Ro" they will never be more than average. RSL, LA, Dallas -- they do not rely on 1 guy to score all their goals.
    Last edited by rocker; 08-07-2011 at 09:48 AM.

  28. #328
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    Who did he throw under the bus anyway???

    Well here's just one example.....In that disasterous 5-0 loss to NY on the final game of the season a while back he SAID.."I showed tonight but it's a shame NOBODY ELSE on this team did".....FYI...HE SUCKED AS BAD AS EVERYONE ELSE THAT NIGHT!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by InDa_110 View Post
    Is there really such a thing as a "proper system" in the MLS?

    I'll take the individual talent of his calibre to win games own his own, because it's not just skill, it's heart. Despite the bs on this board about his attitude and even calling him a "cancer", which by the way is very insulting to anyone who has or has someone in their family with cancer, Dero play with heart and that can't be denied. Which player, with ability, other than Dichio played with more heart for TFC than Dero ever?
    I'd say he's all heart. He's actually not a particularly skilled player. He showed class last night. Didn't think he had that in him. I'm glad he's gone though. Those types of players are really frustrating to play with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    DC has improved since he's arrived, we have regressed since he left.
    That was true earlier in the year, but I don't think it's the case now.
    The team that currently suits up for Toronto is better than the one DeRo was traded from.


    Also, I feel bad for Iro.
    He looked like he wanted to crawl under a rock last night.
    He has shown great things in the past (not with Toronto).
    So, I wouldn't give up on him just yet.
    Push him hard, try to get his confidence back, and see what happens.
    Our season is already fucked, so there isn't a rush to replace him immediately.
    Hopefully he can get his act together in time for CCL.

 

 

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