And I have no issues with Cann at all now that he went on camera and threw himself under the bus like that ...... not an easy thing to do but i have full respect for him now.
And I have no issues with Cann at all now that he went on camera and threw himself under the bus like that ...... not an easy thing to do but i have full respect for him now.
Good for Cann to admit to making a mistake.
On the plus side, the message to players is quite clear.
not holding my breath on this one.Originally Posted by UltraSuperMegaMo
Good on Cann for manning up and apologizing. I gained some respect for him. Hopefully he won't let this issue affect his performance on the pitch.
As for DeRo, he did issue an apology through the media for the cheque signing incident. DeRo never walked off the team...
Ya, I think 160k is more than reasonable, but it's really poor management for the club to back out if 175k was verbally promised the first year. Like Cann's agent said, its a matter of principle. The club really needs to get regain a really poor reputation from when it was managed by Mo, but it doesn't really help when they continue to do this.
Do we have any confirmation that he was promised 175k or is that speculation based on the situation? Personally, I don't think his base salary would be "topped up" to $175 to cover for last year's shortcoming. Rather it would be in some form of bonus. Once you bump up the base salary, it's difficult to come down... for both sides.
Anyway, what's done it done. It was a stupid move to leave the team, but he has come back and apologized, so good for him. Let's move forward and try not to suck too much this year!
No I think he took a plane to Glasgow to train without permission. It would have been a long walk.
LOL. Seriously? Again?
DeRo never walked out on the team. There was a misunderstanding with interim management. DeRo thought he had permission, and was eventually granted permission to trial. Winter denied a loan request, and DeRo immediately reported to camp. End of story.
I guess DeRo really hasn't done anything specific to apologize for.
Using the team's press conference with new management as a personal soap box to threaten walking out on his team isn't exactly the same as actually doing it. Of course, it creates tension, potentially hurts team performance, attempts to undermine the new coaching staff, and is generally a selfish, douchbaggy kind of move for any team member, let alone the supposed captain, but what's he going to do, apologize for being himself?
The baggage comes with this guy wherever he goes. And hopefully, he goes somewhere else soon.
I'm not getting into the DeRo debate again. I'm not going to change the opinions of his detractors. Hate away.
I never condoned DeRo's actions in the past, but as far as I'm concerned, he apologized for the only crime he ever committed. Other than that, he is what he is, and as long as he contributes to the success of the club on the pitch and isn't a distraction in the locker room, I won't vilify him.
It's been quite obvious over the course of the preseason that this team is far more dangerous with DeRo in the lineup.
I think in one article, his agent said that he was promised $15k more. So ya, assuming that information is correct, bad form by the club.
Why? No one else can take a penalty kick?
Last edited by Pookie; 03-13-2011 at 11:43 AM.
He set up the play that led to the penalty kick in the first place. Other than that, his mere presence on the forward unit opens up space for other players, the team creates more opportunities when he is on the pitch, and he is still the best offensive player on the roster at this point in time. If your disdain for him as a person blinds you to his obvious skills on the pitch then I don't know what to tell you.
Anyway, I don't want to get into this again. Let's just agree to disagree.
Agree to disagree. He's got skills, that's why he is paid so well.
At the same time, 2 years of DeRo and 2 more years of missing the playoffs. He brings baggage (selfish play, off field leadership shortcomings, etc) and so far, hasn't demonstrated an ability to lead the team anywhere.
My frustrations comes from playing high level competitive sport and having the Captain title put upon me by my teammates. I know what a selfish personality can do to a team and shudder at the thought of a player who acts like this on the roster, let alone having the Captain title.
"Attitude reflects Leadership" ("Remember the Titans") and while no success is ever guaranteed, a team that respects each other, believes in the coaching staff and each other stands a much better chance at success than a team that has warring factions within.
I don't see DeRo ever contributing to a positive culture within this team given what he has displayed in his time here. Should he not change, addition by subtraction might be the best thing for this team.
What the whole DeRo-Cochrane issue (and to a lesser extent the Cann issue) really pointed out is that MLS is still not "high level." It's full of these power struggles and personality issues between players and management because both sides are looking to get to a higher level in their careers and MLS is either a stopping off point or a fall-back. No one (or at least not many) players or management are fully committed to MLS - and we don't really expect them to be, but we do want them to fake it better.
Well, maybe I over-stated playing "high level" if you are comparing my background with MLS players
Point taken though. MLS is a stepping stone. If these players didn't have flaws, talent and/or character, they probably wouldn't be here. For young players, I see it as a place to learn more and success is found by moving on. For older players, they are either on the downside of their careers and looking to extend an income or they have talent but are missing some connections between the ears to put it all together in a marketable package.
^ Yes, but not just the players, the same applies to management. No one expects Winter to be here much longer than his three year contract if he does well. So far he has been very professional which is great, but it's also what means he'll be gone in three years. Again, that's fine if he gets replaced by someone else who has the right professional attiutude.
Of course, with no salary cap on management that doesn't really have to be the case.
Two things.
1) This is a Cann thread. Try sticking to the topic.
2) There are a whole lot of factless assumptions and baseless accusations in this comment about DeRo. You're like a dog on a bone. Let it go already.
I can't believe I am reading this comment from you Roogsy!
Factless assumptions? Ok, we can stick with the factbased argument of 2 years of DeRo, 0 years of playoffs... perhaps time for a change. But I digress. On to the topic:
Isn't the thread about holding out on contracts? And in the 27 pages, I guess I'm the first to see a link between the 2 situations? But ok, we can just discuss the one situation which ended with an apology, humble pie and a focus on moving ahead and accepting the contract terms.
Not really. When a topic doesn't come up, I don't bring it up. But if a topic comes up, I participate. Two different things. I view myself as pretty consistent.
I'm not so sure that it would be the same case with Management. I guess it all depends on his long term goal. Think about JK, what is a guy with his pedigree doing consulting for lowly MLS teams when he could effectively own ply his trade anywhere?
For him, it probably has more to do with establishing a post-playing career legacy and having a choice of lifestyle (California is a decent place to live).
Who knows what Winter's long term goals are but I don't think we can assume he ultimately wants a top tier coaching gig. As you suggest, a person could make a handsome living as the head of an MLS Club if the owners choose to make it so.
So I guess we should get rid of Nana and Frei as well. Since you know, they haven't lead us to the playoffs yet.
^ Geez, you mean Nana takes up over $300k in cap space? Cann too?
So if you take up 300K in cap space, and your team doesn't make the playoffs, it's all your fault. I mean really?^ Geez, you mean Nana takes up over $300k in cap space? Cann too?
Obviously the guy who takes up 300k in cap space is more influential than the guys who make up the 1.9mill in cap space left. It's not up to them, it's up the guy who makes the 3rd most on the team.
If you are building a team and have over $300k invested in 1 player but are not getting the results, do you not consider whether spending that +$300k elsewhere (perhaps amongst 2-3 different players) might be a better spend?
You know, like countless other teams have done in sport all over the world?
The 2nd part of that is whether we'd be better positioned for better results if we had a captain that spoke like this:
"I never really thought about my individual accomplishments" - Mark Messier.
Anyways, it was said that we need to stay on topic so on the topic of a player making a bad decision, owning up to it, appearing to commit to the team and honouring the terms of his agreement, hats off to Mr Cann for ending an ugly situation quickly and without any lingering doubt.
Your first argument really is absurd. It isn't even a coherent argument that I can bother responding too. Surely you realize there is a heck of alot you aren't considering when the basis of your argument is: "We didn't make the playoffs with our best players, so let's just dump them and get some cheaper players instead".
There is so much I could say but I just can't be bothered.
What is lost in all of this shit is that Cann walked out on the team.
The team saw it as unacceptable. (so did a lot of supporters)
Cann apologized and now all is well.
It worked out properly.
Player steps out of line and the club puts him back in and puts it in the past.
For all of you defending Cann walking out....maybe you should go scold him for making you look stupid. He's admitted his mistake...maybe you guys should too.
He KNEW it was wrong when he did it. You don't walk out on your team. End of.
Apart from Cann coming back, another bonus is that players now know where Winter stands. He's in charge and he has standards. I'm very happy to see this.
Well, considering most everyone agreed that he didn't deal with this the optimal way I can only be left to wonder who you are calling out.
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