Expansion Draft - Confirmed Protection Lists - Published?

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by rocker

As Garber clearly explained at the Supporters' Summit, Canadians can't be domestics on US teams because it's favouritism to one nationality over others.
Why shouldn't Mexicans be domestics too? Or Argentines? He said you cannot selectively discriminate against foreigners by law.

This is just political excuses for the rule.

First, if you're going to let a team "join" the league, then you have to let that team join on a full and equal basis. To have a different set of rules for one or more teams within the league is discriminatory in itslef, and results in inequality. Sport is all about a level playing pitch for all participants. MLS are not giving us that (whether it goes for or against us, the point is it's unequal).

Second, what did MLSE pay the money for if they get shafted on the unequal application of the rules?

Third, why should we be charged to see a team that is playng against a handicap? Where's the discount on ticket prices that the league picks up for that? (And beers

)

Fourth, none of this is even necessary, you can keep the domestic and non domestic split and just change the rules on how many of each must or must not be contained within a roster. MLS is always changing this anyway so clearly there's not a concrete rule set down by the government. They could just as easily reduce or increase the numbers to a point where we;re basically not handicapped anymore, without even being affected by the immigration issue.

There may be a genuine reason why this has to be in place, btu I have yet to see or hear about one.

**rocker** · 11-25-2009, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by Lucky Strike

Well, we don't really care about Canadians being domestics in the US, what we really want are Americans counting as domestics here in Canada.

Why would you want that? I thought the argument earlier in the thread was about equality?

Anyways, consult your Canadian labour lawyer on the question

**Lucky Strike** · 11-25-2009, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by rocker

Why would you want that? I thought the argument earlier in the thread was about equality?

Anyways, consult your Canadian labour lawyer on the question

Lol, I'm not saying it's doable, just as a TFC supporter, that's my interest since it would allow greater flexibility in building the roster.

**rocker** · 11-25-2009, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Hitcho

This is just political excuses for the rule.

First, if you're going to let a team "join" the league, then you have to let that team join on a full and equal basis. To have a different set of rules for one or more teams within the league is discriminatory in itslef, and results in inequality. Sport is all about a level playing pitch for all participants. MLS are not giving us that (whether it goes for or against us, the point is it's unequal).

Second, what did MLSE pay the money for if they get shafted on the unequal application of the rules?

Third, why should we be charged to see a team that is playng against a handicap? Where's the discount on ticket prices that the league picks up for that? (And beers

)

Fourth, none of this is even necessary, you can keep the domestic and non domestic split and just change the rules on how many of each must or must not be contained within a roster. MLS is always changing this anyway so clearly there's not a concrete rule set down by the government. They could just as easily reduce or increase the numbers to a point where we;re basically not handicapped anymore, without even being affected by the immigration issue.

There may be a genuine reason why this has to be in place, btu I have yet to see or hear about one.

I totally agree with you. I'm saying this inequality is impossible to change because of US labour laws.

The only way to create total equality would be to eliminate all restrictions completely. So teams could hire players of any nationality, as in Europe.

But MLS was designed to provide spots for Americans (same with the CFL for Canadians). So some domestic protection is needed and it's legal.

Regarding changing the makeup of the roster nationalities -- MLS already changed it for TFC after year 1, easing up on things.

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by rocker

I totally agree with you. I'm saying this inequality is impossible to change because of US labour laws.

The only way to create total equality would be to eliminate all restrictions completely. So teams could hire players of any nationality, as in Europe.

But MLS was designed to provide spots for Americans (same with the CFL for Canadians). So some domestic protection is needed and it's legal.

Regarding changing the makeup of the roster nationalities -- MLS already changed it for TFC after year 1, easing up on things.

I just don't believe what Gareber is telling us on this issue.

If MLS holding all the contracts is a factor and US labor law applies equally to all franchises as a result, then how come we have different rules from everyone else? Surely Canadians are already being discriminated against (either positively or negatively, it doesn't matter which) vis a vis other nationalities, by having different roster rules for them at TFC even though MLS is still the emplioyer and it's still a US league?

It just doesn't add up. The only way Garber's reasons would make sense were if TFC had the same roster restrictions as every other MLS franchise. And we don't. So it's bullshit.

And anyway, what we're asking for is to have MORE Americans given jobs with TFC as players, so that helps Americans both in terms of jobs and the USMNT.

I should watch the clip but it all just reeks of BS to me.

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 01:53 PM

I hope Ives is wrong, I like Guevara and what he brings to the table.

Then again, we could use the cap space, we have too many CM players already, he's old, off to the WC for a chunk of time and has a bad history with our new head coach.

On the other hand, he'd have good trade value if he stayed.

Oh man, I'm so conflicted on this!

**menefreghista** · 11-25-2009, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by Hitcho

I just don't believe what Gareber is telling us on this issue.

Agreed.

The USL, a league with teams in Canada and the USA, has a rule that Canadians and Americans would be domestic players for all clubs.

Why is MLS different?

Originally Posted by rocker

The only way to create total equality would be to eliminate all restrictions completely. So teams could hire players of any nationality, as in Europe.

European leagues do have rules limiting the amount of non-EU players.

**Nodoubtguy** · 11-25-2009, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by Hitcho

I hope Ives is wrong, I like Guevara and what he brings to the table.

Then again, we could use the cap space, we have too many CM players already, he's old, off to the WC for a chunk of time and has a bad history with our new head coach.

On the other hand, he'd have good trade value if he stayed.

Oh man, I'm so conflicted on this!

Don't these points really diminish the trade value? I personally don't mind just freeing all the cap space

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by menefreghista

Agreed.

In the USL, Canadians and Americans are both considered domestic players for all clubs.

Why is the MLS different? Its sounds more like a cop out to say it can't be done.

Exactly. It's all total bullshit and hypocrisy. A deal has been struck somewhere and they've totally fucking missed the point that what they're doing is screwing over the most basic and fundamental principle in sport.

We don;t mind too much now because we have De Ro and JDG and we've had a Canadian captain and goalkeeper in our recent past. But what happens five years from now when Mtl and Van are in the elague and fighting for the next set of decent Canadian players, and the likes of De Ro and JDG have gone? Then, we're fucked, as are Mtl and Van. At that point, the fan clamour for equality of roster rules will get much, much louder.

**Billy the kid** · 11-25-2009, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by menefreghista

Agreed.

In the USL, Canadians and Americans are both considered domestic players for all clubs.

Why is the MLS different? Its sounds more like a cop out to say it can't be done.

I didn't think the US soccer federation would allow it.

**menefreghista** · 11-25-2009, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Billy the kid

I didn't think the US soccer federation would allow it.

It is the case though.

But I believe its the USSF that is blocking it from happening in the MLS.

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Nodoubtguy

Don't these points really diminish the trade value? I personally don't mind just freeing all the cap space

some of them only apply to us though, and whilst other teams may try and hold that against you, when it comes to getting a lpayer of Guevara's quality you can only push those points against the trading club so far.

But yeah, point taken and I agree to a certain extent.

The fresh break under Preki (ie, no locker room crap in 2010) bothers me a lote more than the cap space issue. Amado and preki may be able to bury the hatchet, but if not it's best he goes now befoe the Preki reign even begins. Also get rid of Garcia and anyone else that was causing shit in the locker room. new coach, new lseason, new leaf.

**Hitcho** · 11-25-2009, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by menefreghista

It is the case though.

But I believe its the USSF that is blocking it from happening in the MLS.

Wouldn't surprise me. They don't care about the USL as it's a backwater compared to MLS.

Once Mtl and Van join this needs to be renegotiated though. MLS needs to say "ok, no more than three non-US teams in the league, all of whom are in (tfc, mtl, van) and now let;s give them a break on players because A) how much damage can it really do, B) they add value to the league and without that value US soccer doesn't benefit as much and C) they're just going to get more US players anyway, so in fact what you;re doing is making the situation better for USMNT.

**pekduck** · 11-25-2009, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by menefreghista

Agreed.

The USL, a league with teams in Canada and the USA, has a rule that Canadians and Americans would be domestic players for all clubs.

Why is MLS different?

European leagues do have rules limiting the amount of non-EU players.

Official answer from CSA is that USL's players contract are not considered full time status thus exempt from the provision.

**prizby** · 11-25-2009, 02:19 PM

so the picks were submitted at 1...any speculation at what those picks might have been???

i see mls.net has a live chat at 3 with pitor nowak at 3...any hints before this?

**Nuvinho** · 11-25-2009, 02:28 PM

some coded twitter messages that could mean nothing or something. Robbo seems really interested in the expansion draft.

**anonymiss** · 11-25-2009, 02:37 PM

Ditto on that. I'm wondering what his latest means...
"Had a great today sorting out some business....... Good times ahead!!!"

**Nuvinho** · 11-25-2009, 02:40 PM

some tidbits:

SoccerInsider

rumors: andrew jacobson, alejandro moreno, shavar thomas among those selected by philly. also a trade for chris seitz? awaiting confirmation

**Nuvinho** · 11-25-2009, 02:43 PM

more:

SoccerInsider

james riley too? official details soon

SoccerInsider

RSL goalkeeper Chris Seitz apparently traded to Philadelphia for allocation money

SoccerByIves

Sources: Nick Zimmerman and Brad Knighton go in Expansion Draft.

SoccerByIves

Latest expansion draft word I'm hearing: LeToux, Salinas and David Myrie also taken. List should come out shortly.

**Nuvinho** · 11-25-2009, 03:00 PM

combining both of those guys sources....that's 9 out of 10 taken.

**Nodoubtguy** · 11-25-2009, 03:01 PM

listening live to the stream on mlsnet.com........I think a mic that should not be on yet is on....lol

**Rochdale** · 11-25-2009, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by Nodoubtguy

listening live to the stream on mlsnet.com........I think a mic that should not be on yet is on....lol

l think l heard the word shit a few times.

**anonymiss** · 11-25-2009, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by Rochdale

l think l heard the word shit a few times.

hahaha!
wish i could listen...stupid lecture going on...

**Nodoubtguy** · 11-25-2009, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by Rochdale

l think l hear the word shit a few times.

lol...now someone is explaining the draft rules. A women just asked "are they a new team?"

pretty sure were listening to reporters talk before the draft

**DOMIN8R** · 11-25-2009, 03:03 PM

Link please

**sidvan** · 11-25-2009, 03:04 PM

http://web.mlsnet.com/media/player/m...e=a_free&_mp=1

**sulfur** · 11-25-2009, 03:04 PM

web.mlsnet.com

first story has a link and all of the "rules" too.

**Nuvinho** · 11-25-2009, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by DOMIN8R

Link please

http://web.mlsnet.com/media/player/m...e=a_free&_mp=1

**Rochdale** · 11-25-2009, 03:05 PM

www.mlsnet.com/

**TheRenter** · 11-25-2009, 03:05 PM

yup, few s bombs...dis is funny

Thread: Expansion Draft - Confirmed Protection Lists - Published?

Thread Tools

Display

Posting Permissions