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  1. #1
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    Default Kristian Jack tears Mo a new one

    http://my.thescore.com/footyblog/arc.../26/29172.aspx

    Mods please delete if this is already here....

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    Can't say that there is a lot in here that I disagree with.

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    There are sooo many threads... but I was with Christian Jack until this:

    FACT - Amado Guevara has to go. I give Guevara a lot of credit for the way he has changed his game but his continued desire to drop deep, coupled with his 300K contract, means he needs to be moved on. He will also have two eyes firmly on South Africa in 2010
    I mean is he fcking mad? We will lose Amado because of 2010 WC but he was one of the better players this season... gave us 3 real chances in that POS game vs NYC when other players were walking around with their heads cut off like chickens....

    Unfortunately his focus will be the WC... but all things aside I wish Amado stays with the team...
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    its in the daily news thread, and mentioned elsewhere, but I think this is valid enough to warrant its own thread.
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    I usually don't watch or read a lot of stuff by The Footy Show guys but KJ is bang on the money here.

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    Great article. Hard to take fault with any of it.

    The more I think about it, the more I wonder if maybe we should just make a clean break with a new GM - or even better, become one of the few (if any?) teams that just have a manager, instead of a GM/Coach combo.

    No use bitching about it, unless we as a SG are willing to come forward with a unified face in demanding such a change, though. Scattered calls for Mo to be fired or resign, aren't going to resonate with the ownership.

    - Scott
    Last edited by Shakes McQueen; 10-26-2009 at 06:28 PM.
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    Amado showed up when he felt like it this year. I dont want him back because of WC and the fact he will be 1 year older. Time to move to someone who wants to be here game in game out. Oh not to mention his convenient injuries here for us and getting back in shape JUST before the Honduras games...please.

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    I think Amado is a good player, but I don't want him back next season. He has an ego, a temper, and a tendency to show up some days, and not others. We can't afford to waste $300k on someone like that, under this cap. Especially when you consider the number of central midfielders we already have.

    I'd like to see de Guzman take over his role in the center of the pitch, as a central attacking option, and creative fulcrum.

    - Scott
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    ^^^
    I think Amado has taken alot of undue slack for the above... how many players have not shown up at all.... for the entire season?!

    The man played more international games than anyone in the team... and still came back to play for the team even after arriving at 11:00pm at night the day before an MLS game... it's a reputation that stuck with him (because apperantly he can be better...) and now he will never shake it off....

    For the above, I hope that if Amado leaves for another team, he will get the respect that he deserves...
    Last edited by FluSH; 10-26-2009 at 06:34 PM.
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    If people want to talk about egos and tempers... Chad Barett doesn't even shake hands when he gets subbed-out... but for some reason we seem to over look this... and Jimmy B's temper? Well... no let's talk about Amado instead he is the easier target...
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    I agree with most of what Kristian has wrote but i take his Carl Robinson / Amado Guevara talk with about half a container of salt as his personal friendships seem to cloud his sense of reality.

    Guevara has been fighting a lot of nagging injuries this year and was involved in WCQ with honduras. I agree he is getting older, and probably due to all the mids we have a good candidate to leave. Very talented but needs the ball, if this team is going to run through JDG, better to stick someone else out there who can be more of a complementary part rather than a central figure.

    Robinson - great character, good guy to muck up the defense, but anytime you're team has the ball you are playing 10 v 11. If KJ really wanted to open his eyes he'd see that the defensive midfiedler spot is one of the most well played in MLS. There are plenty of guys out there who win the ball nearly as well as robinson but blow him out of the water easily when it comes to passing ability.

    Why does he think Guevara always has to come back for the ball (Dero has been doing the same thing)? It's because Robinson can't link play for shit and the backline can't pass. So our attacking players have to sprit down field to try and do all the work going forward themselves.

    Really we should be looking at both these guys similarly in a sense of "are they worth the money?" In my opinion it's probably a no in both cases.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FluSH View Post
    If people want to talk about egos and tempers... Chad Barett doesn't even shake hands when he gets subbed-out... but for some reason we seem to over look this... and Jimmy B's temper? Well... no let's talk about Amado instead he is the easier target...
    I think people overlook Chad Barret's potential temper issues because he gets so much flak for more important things ... i.e. his lack of talent. No use complaining about his ego when people feel he shouldn't even be on the field based on his skillset.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FluSH View Post
    ^^^
    I think Amado has takeb alot of undue slack for the above... how many players have not shown up at all.... for the entire season?!

    The man played more international games than anyone in the team... and still came back to play for the team even after arriving at 11:00pm at night the day before... it's a reputation that stuck with him (because apperantly he can be better...) and now he will never shake it off....

    For the above, I hope that if Amado leaves he will get the respect that he deserves...
    If Amado leaves, I will absolutely give him the respect he deserves. He wasn't a headcase with us, the way he was in the past.

    And you're right, other people haven't shown up as well - and they need to be held accountable for that. And that might mean shipping them out.

    But in our crowded midfield, we can't afford to waste $300k on extraneous players - especially if he's considered a "bad apple" in the locker room, like jloome's sources indicated in that thread

    As for Jimmy B - I've already gone on record as saying he's lost a step, and shouldn't be our starting LB next season. I also suggested at the beginning of this season that maybe he shouldn't be the captain.

    And targets don't get much "easier" than Chad Barrett.

    - Scott
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler View Post
    I think people overlook Chad Barret's potential temper issues because he gets so much flak for more important things ... i.e. his lack of talent. No use complaining about his ego when people feel he shouldn't even be on the field based on his skillset.
    True... but yet people slag on Amado for what... an ego? The man keeps to himself in this team that is full of egos...
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    I dont think the WC will be as big of a deal as people think. MLS breaks for it, and Honduras will not be getting out of the group stage. We'll miss him for two weeks (preparation) at most.

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    Was there not lots of talk that Guevara was going to go back to play in Hondruas after this season anyway?

    - Scott
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shakes McQueen View Post
    Great article. Hard to take fault with any of it.

    The more I think about it, the more I wonder if maybe we should just make a clean break with a new GM - or even better, become one of the few (if any?) teams that just have a manager, instead of a GM/Coach combo.

    No use bitching about it, unless we as a SG are willing to come forward with a unified face in demanding such a change, though. Scattered calls for Mo to be fired or resign, aren't going to resonate with the ownership.

    - Scott
    I agree.

    In regards to having a single manager (i.e Mo in year one) I would prefer that as well ... although considering the extremely complex nature of MLS, I think it is preferable if one guy is solely dedicated to that side of the game without worrying about managing the team on the field as well. I think there are a few guys who have the dual role that we might be able to snag up (for the right money). Failing that, I would like to see a well respected and more authorative manager ... one who dictates the GM on what needs to be done, rather than the other way around, which seems to be the case under the current set up where Mo has been a much more significant voice compared to the under qualified head coaches in Carver and Cummins.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shakes McQueen View Post
    If Amado leaves, I will absolutely give him the respect he deserves. He wasn't a headcase with us, the way he was in the past.

    And you're right, other people haven't shown up as well - and they need to be held accountable for that. And that might mean shipping them out.

    But in our crowded midfield, we can't afford to waste $300k on extraneous players - especially if he's considered a "bad apple" in the locker room, like jloome's sources indicated in that thread

    As for Jimmy B - I've already gone on record as saying he's lost a step, and shouldn't be our starting LB next season. I also suggested at the beginning of this season that maybe he shouldn't be the captain.

    And targets don't get much "easier" than Chad Barrett.

    - Scott
    Where is this thread? I was pretty sure Amado kept to himself... I mean he speaks little English... Even Big Bruva disclosed this a couple of months ago... that mostly jokes about him go through Amado... how is that a bad apple?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shakes McQueen View Post
    Was there not lots of talk that Guevara was going to go back to play in Hondruas after this season anyway?

    - Scott
    What would you do with a mess of this organization? The man is getting older, he won't be able to retire into a coaching role here in Canada like most of the Anglo guys... so in my opinion he needs to re-establish his roots in Honduras... where he is respected.... and rightly so... Amado was a pivotal point in getting Honduras qualified for the WC.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FluSH View Post
    Where is this thread? I was pretty sure Amado kept to himself... I mean he speaks little English... Even Big Bruva disclosed this a couple of months ago... that mostly jokes about him go through Amado... how is that a bad apple?
    It's in the general TFC forum, about the "bad characters" on the team. You'll have to ask jloome what was said specifically.

    - Scott
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    Quote Originally Posted by FluSH View Post
    What would you do with a mess of this organization? The man is getting older, he won't be able to retire into a coaching role here in Canada like most of the Anglo guys... so in my opinion he needs to re-establish his roots in Honduras... where he is respected.... and rightly so... Amado was a pivotal point in getting Honduras qualified for the WC.
    Man you're getting defensive about Guevara, haha. I wasn't antagonizing him for it - I was just pointing out that there was talk of him leaving the team anyway, so this discussion of whether he should leave may just be purely academic in the end.

    - Scott
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    Guevara is leaving? If so, I am going to miss him. I don't know what happened in the past, but he was a class act during his time in Toronto.

    As for the article itself, well done KJ. I hope rest of media outlet continues writing these sort of articles in off-season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shakes McQueen View Post
    Man you're getting defensive about Guevara, haha. I wasn't antagonizing him for it - I was just pointing out that there was talk of him leaving the team anyway, so this discussion of whether he should leave may just be purely academic in the end.

    - Scott
    You are right...

    Only Because I feel a certain bias against Guevara that I feel I need to speak on...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler View Post
    I agree.

    In regards to having a single manager (i.e Mo in year one) I would prefer that as well ... although considering the extremely complex nature of MLS, I think it is preferable if one guy is solely dedicated to that side of the game without worrying about managing the team on the field as well. I think there are a few guys who have the dual role that we might be able to snag up (for the right money). Failing that, I would like to see a well respected and more authorative manager ... one who dictates the GM on what needs to be done, rather than the other way around, which seems to be the case under the current set up where Mo has been a much more significant voice compared to the under qualified head coaches in Carver and Cummins.
    The thing is - if you have a coach who is dictating who to draft, and what players to sign, aren't they doing all of the work anyway? Under that scenario, the GM is just a glorified accountant and head negotiator.

    They could have someone negotiating contracts and keeping tabs on the cap, without needing a general manager, no?

    - Scott
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    I wish Amado well. And as far as appreciating his talent...I think we can all agree he is probably the most skilled player we have right now despite his age.

    However, his focus on WC2010 and the fact that he really did disappear this year after June...I'd like to use that contract space elsewhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roogsy View Post
    I wish Amado well. And as far as appreciating his talent...I think we can all agree he is probably the most skilled player we have right now despite his age.

    However, his focus on WC2010 and the fact that he really did disappear this year after June...I'd like to use that contract space elsewhere.
    Exactly. That's all it boils down to, for me. That $300k could get us a really good center-half.

    - Scott
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    Guevara was a like a lot of players on this team, showing up when he wanted to.

    I will give him credit for being one of the few who did something in NY, but when he went cold in the summer, that's when we lost the points we needed.

    But I think the point that Kristian Jack, and others here, are making is that with DeRo, JDG and Amado, you have too many cooks in the kitchen. One of them has to go and guess which one it's going to be?

    EDIT: I think Roogsy just summed it up nicely.

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    By the way, Kristian Jack nailed every point DEAD ON.

    It was the most precise, succinct, accurate analysis article I have seen yet about this team. And if TFC don't pay attention, it's because they are too stubborn and proud to listen. I will even have to agree with the Vitti point...despite the fact that I like having him on the team...at the price he is costing us on the roster...he isn't worth it.

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    Guevara is expendable. Push De Guzman forward into either a more central, or even attacking role and you make up for the loss of Guevara. Yes, De Guzman rose to prominence as a result of his play at the holding position, but that was against far better competition. He may not have the skill to be a influential attacking player in Europe, but I feel as though he would do well against lesser competition in MLS.


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    ^^
    I don't have faith in JDG playing a more attacking role...
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