hahaOriginally Posted by Canary Canuck
funny
my buddies and I call him the frat boy
He seems like he is here for the hookers and booze, but in reality he is a talented player that has been left behind/forgotten.
A professional he is not, but perhaps mentored correctly he can be.
This statement pisses me off.
Me too. It sounds on this board like a lot of unprofessional behaviour by some players is being excused because they don't like their bosses.
Well after DeRo threw some of his team-mates under the bus after the match, I'd say there's a HUGE problem in the dressing room, you could also hear it in the Cronin interview.
I heard Garcia likes to hide other players socks on a matchday.
They should hide Garcia on matchdays.
lofl
so is anyone going to list the bad apples
or at least list the apples that are not meshing with the oranges?
I just thought I'd point some things out that are closer to evidence than opinion
- Garcia: in his first game at BMO in July, maybe 2 weeks after we acquired him, was clearly "being the man" in the pregame huddle. Lecturing everyone, he was pretty animated/agitated. Every else stood in a circle stone faced. I don't care how much of a "leader"-type you are, I thought (and think) this was a pretty strange way to conduct yourself right after you've arrived midseason. Combine that with his history with Mo, and his obvious on-field difficulties...
- Gerba: held out for huge money, and then was absurdly out-of-shape. Was the one player not to go out onto the field to salute the fans postgame RSL...
- JDG: not one player or coach talked about him today (except Mo, in the most cursory way). Not one. Not even a cliche about getting a full camp in with him.....
Let me be clear: my points above may have more to do with "popularity", as opposed to who is a "bad apple"
Last edited by ensco; 10-27-2009 at 08:12 PM.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Ugh... Bottom line is that we're in for a loooong off-season of rumours, speculations and a shit-load of negativity.
Shakes has it right, there are no bad apples, or at the very least, just some egos clashing but, an experienced MLS manager (Yallop?) will in part sort that out. Additionally, shipping Barrett out on a fast boat to China (as my mom used to say) and bringing a goal-scorer (Can anyone see the benefit of JP Angel in Toronto?) and shoring up a couple of other positions, can only help sort out, settle down and focus that locker room. I think it is going to happen and I think good things are in store for next season.
We could use a coach like Dunga right now. Doesn't give two shits if you're Ronaldinho the hot shot, or if your Ramires the 17 year old who lives on the streets, if you're not working hard every game, and in practice, and if you're causing problems, bye bye. Dunga knows how to maintain the Brazil squad, and excludes names like Ronaldinho and Diego (Gerba and Vitti) for hard workers (Sanyang and Cronin).
Dunga is critisized because his selections aren't popular...but they work. We need a coach who doesn't care who you are and what your name is. You should have to work your way into the squad, and not one player is a given. CC would always say that he would put his best squad out on the field. That's great. But he continually placed players who didn't deserve to start over some that did (aka Danny Dichio)
CC to me seemed like a guy who would sit down and play FIFA 09 the game before and see what worked. Then he'd field that team. He didn't really know how to use the players he had. We need a Dunga.
Bring in Dunga.
I think that some players resent JDG's big contract because they are paid peanuts.
Also, the players are not respected by the organization. They see the revolving door and feel that Mo is just pulling at straws. They may disagree with Mo's decisions - like dropping Velez?
The coach doesn't command respect. It' s like having a substitute teacher - the kids run the asylum.
The bottom line is to CLEAN HOUSE - beginning with MoJo.
Let's not only talk about JDG... it's Vitti as well.
Vitti and JDG...
but I mean do I resent my less than skilled co-worker because he is getting paid more than me? No I got upset at my resume writing skills and my interview negotiations... that's what I got upset at...
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i bet De Ro thought Vitti was a bad character.. or somethin.. how many times did De Ro yell at Vitti, telling him where to position himself... or how many times would De Ro refuse to pass to Vitti... (well, De Ro refuses to pass to anyone most of the time, so maybe not!).
MLS' salary structure sucks. The bottom feeders barely survive and the rest fight for scraps from the table. When there is so little bread to share there's bound to be some bruised egos.
Haha... just listening to the DeRo interview.
"Championship calibre team is one to question. Because like I said champions are based off of tough game situations and rising to the occasion in tough games and I just don't think we had enough players that wanted to or maybe cramped under pressure." LOL
Jim Brennan doesn't think there are issues or bad apples. LOL
Oh man.
I know you're not a JDG fan, but did you just seriously compare him to your "less than skilled" co-worker? Really?
JDG is by far the most skilled on the team, so I fail to see the correlation.
hahaha
no I meant a hypothetical scenario more like DeRo looking at Vitti and thinking how is this guy getting $300k...
I'm not going to deny that JDG doesn't have skill... he certainly does... but I would have prefered a different role as our DP...
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Johns Article is out
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/stor...c-cummins.html
doesnt name any names but i suppose it confirms some suspicions we all had
Yeah, there's no excuse for Vitti, although I disagree about his skill.
Vitti's problem is - like Barrett - all mental. Unlike Barrett, Vitti is blessed with boundless skill. Something is keeping him from using that skill to becoming the world class player that he had the potential to be 3-4 years ago.
Of course, if he were to unlock that potential, he wouldn't be here regardless.
As for JDG, with Amado seemingly gonzo, the keys to the midfield go to him by default. That is, if DeRo doesn't step on his toes. JDG has all the tools to be a dominant player in this league, but he can't be limited to sitting in front of the defence and making short passes to other (lesser skilled) players to do the bulk of the work.
That comes down to tactics. Hopefully that will be rectified in 2010.
As for the topic of the thread, Gerry Dobson alludes to Nick Garcia being part of the problem in his latest blog entry:
Several players have also hinted at a bad culture in the locker room. Nobody wanted to say who the bad apples are. That's natural. As I stated in a previous blog, Carl Robinson is not one of them. He is well-liked in the dressing room. Anyone who covers this team on a regular basis by attending matches and training sessions knows that. Reporters also know that defender Nick Garcia could be shipped out tomorrow and there would be few complaints.
Well... it's time for some of this during the off-season:Media speculation has run rampant the past few months about a divisive Toronto FC locker-room with cliques, feuding players and a general lack of team cohesion. Cummins didn't exactly substantiate those claims — he's a decent bloke, as the Brits are fond of saying, and he understands the perils of burning bridges.
Team Building Activities
Do not drop the HR girl!
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Reading molinaro's article and hearing the interviews.
Maybe there aren't any bad apples but there certainly seems to be a divided room.
Who's responsibility is it to bring the guys together on the pitch? The captain? The star? The GM? The coach?
I can't remember which player said it, but being a teammate means "dying" for your teammate. Meaning you give it your all and support one another. You might not like each other off the pitch but on it you will everything in your power to help each other out. To break it down in simple terms, I mean there are a lot of RPBs who I don't like and I'm sure there are some that don't like me, but when we're in the stands, we're arm in arm, singing, supporting the team.
In the end, I don't think the guys cared about each other.
And after all those stories about how team chemistry on this team was top notch and one of the strengths of this team.
I think you look at a couple of big issues...
1) The JDG signing and it's ramifications.
JDG is the most skilled player on the team, but the ensuing fallout since the rumour of that signing created a mess. That's on Mo. Either for making promises to others and then reneging on them and/or not reading the affected parties properly.
2) The handling of the Dichio situation
You know that was going to cause problems because you know for sure Dichio had friends in the room and seeing him handled the way he was just killed your spirit a bit. This has to be on someone higher up. Coach or the GM, you pick.
3) To lesser extent the Real Madrid debacle and bringing in grass
Sports teams treat their players like cattle for the most part. But as an athlete that's one of the caveats you accept when you play sports for a living. However, you don't want your team to outwardly demonstrate that. Getting grass for a friendly and in the middle of the season is a little bit of a slap in the face that you just can't shrug off. That one falls on the feet of the FO.
^ +1 on all accounts!
1) Would amend this to say: The JDG thing may be exactly like the Beckham thing. It's not the signing or the money, it's JDG's actions as a teammate since he showed up. Has JDG been a committed teammate from day one? Or is here to collect a big paycheque? The fact that no one talked about him at all yesterday was disconcerting/worrying.
2) +1
3) No.. The Revs don't have this problem, they lay down grass for friendlies without a team revolt. Plus that RM game was instrumental in getting grass for TFC.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Agreed that we need a coach who commands respect. Also, if TFC is keeping Mo, the team needs someone who can stand up to him and be a real coach.
MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto
A Dunga type would work well, or a Capello type. Someone who understands formations and how each player fits in. They would have to be strong to demand that Mo brings in the right type of players, not friends like Garcia. They would have to also understand how to deal with the mix of good and not-so-good talent that forms any MLS squad due to the cap.
MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto
Hire Steve Nicol for 3 years guaranteed to be the coach. Then if they don't make the playoffs under Mo next year, it's obviously not a question of coaching. Then fire Mo, and move Nicol into both positions. They won't want to eat the last 2 years of his contract, so they'll just give him full control. this is realistic given the fact that Mo is back next year.
It's the tea ladies. Always the tea ladies.
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