How would video replay be implemented in MLS? (if FIFA changes its stance one day)

[Dust2]

There are talks that video replay should be or should not be part of the game. This is not a thread for that.

This is about how video replay would be implemented if someday down the road (say 20-30 years from now), FIFA vote in favor of it. How would video replay be implemented and done in such a way that would not disrupt the game?











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I would suggest something like this:

1. Have a video official
2. Managers can only challenge Replay-able Challenges only. They are:

-------1. Referee decision: no goal. Manager believe it was actually: GOAL.
-------2. Referee decision: goal. Manager believe it was actually: No GOAL.
-------3. Referee decision: no penalty. Manager believe it was actually: Penalty.
-------4. Referee decision: penalty. Manager believe it was actually: No penalty.

3. Give each team 1 challenge per game with the option for a second challenge if the 1st challenge is correct (a third challenge if the second challenge is correct, 4th if 3rd is correct etc...)


4. Manager signal his intend to challenge by blowing an air horn or some other form of communication to get the referee attention. For example, in the NFL, the manager/coach throw a challenge flag onto the field. Manager will have about 20-30 seconds after the 'fact' to challenge. Referee would then point the index finger upstairs (1 second) indicating a video challenge . Video referee would give the verdict (15-20 seconds).

Because the manager is only guarantee 1 challenge (option for further challenges depending on the first challenge is correct), he will have to use them very wisely. In other words, he has to be sure that the referee decision is wrong and the video referee will overturn it.

In addition, a manager can only use the challenges on "goal, no goal, penalty, no penalty decision." So it's very possible that some games will have no challenges at all. And at most, each challenge would take up 1 minute max. A very good trade-off in my opinion (poor decisions overturn in exchange for 2-3 minutes of added time).




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1. Referee decision: no goal. Actual: GOAL. Manager challenges

Example: Player scored a legit goal. However, lineman deems player offside when he was clearly onside. The Play is already stopped because of the offside ruling...offside kick to follow . This stoppage in play will give the manager ample time to challenge.



2. Referee decision: goal Actual: No GOAL. Manager challenges

Example: Referee said it was goal when it wasn't a legit goal because the player was actually offside or scored illegally. The play is already stopped because a goal is scored/celebration/then re-start. This stoppage in play will give the manager the time to challenge.



4. Referee decision: penalty Actual: No penalty. Manager challenges

The play is already stopped because the referee ruled it a penalty. Usually, the penalty is taken about 45-60 seconds after the referee called penalty. This stoppage in play will give the manager the time to challenge.


3. Referee decision: no penalty Actual: Penalty. Manager challenges

Off the 4 replay-able challenges, only this one does not have a stoppage to give the manager time to challenge. When the referee stated that it was no penalty, the play continues on. It will up to the referee to decide when to stop the game after hearing the air horn, similar to how he would react after seeing a serious injury.

Players could do the sportsmanship thing (similar to a serious injury) by kicking the ball out of bound after hearing the air horn. However, they are under no obligation to do so. They could continue on their attack if the situation is presented to them.

So 2 possible stoppages: 1) referee blow whistle for stoppage 2) players kick ball out of bound though they are not required to.

[Dust2]

2. Referee decision: goal Actual: No GOAL. Manager challenges

Example: Referee said it was goal when it wasn't a legit goal because the player was actually offside or scored illegally. The play is already stopped because a goal is scored/celebration/then re-start. This stoppage in play will give the manager the time to challenge.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Y9GrbCHZhw

Here's an example: Offside, should be no goal.

Won't take more than 1 minute to over turn this.

[Dust2]

4. Referee decision: penalty........ Actual: No penalty. Manager challenges

The play is already stopped because the referee ruled it a penalty. Usually, the penalty is taken about 45-60 seconds after the referee called penalty. This stoppage in play will give the manager the time to challenge.

Example:


Celtic manager challenges the referee decision that it is a penalty. Referee asks for video help from the video official. Video official says it's not a penalty, it's a dive. Referee then book Eduardo for the dive.

[Across_The_Pond]

Players could do the sportsmanship thing (similar to a serious injury) by kicking the ball out of bound after hearing the air horn. However, they are under no obligation to do so. They could continue on their attack if the situation is presented to them.

When the ball goes out of play next would be the correct decision here.

You might have the situation where a player goes down in the box, the referee says no penalty, but the manager is convinced it is. Play continues and the defending team race up the other end of the pitch and score a goal straight from open play.

When the play is reviewed it was no penalty afterall, so it's a lesson to continue to play the ball until it goes dead.

[stugautz]

I think use replays only to determine if the ball has crossed the goal line.

In terms of offside, the rule would have to be that linesmen give the benefit of the doubt to the player. Because like in the NFL once the referee's whistle blows the play is dead...no matter what happens after the whistle.

One effective use I see for replay is to determine simulation fouls post game. It does not disrupt the flow of the game and the players who are chronic divers will be handled with appropriately.

[deltox]

i agree with the above stugautz.


this shouldnt be used during game or to determine an offside call.


if the whole ball crosses the line, then the refs watch should vibrate to let him know....then he can call a goal. video is not even needed in this case

[Dust2]

i agree with the above stugautz.


this shouldnt be used during game or to determine an offside call.


if the whole ball crosses the line, then the refs watch should vibrate to let him know....then he can call a goal. video is not even needed in this case

It's not going to be used to determine an offside/onside call unless it involves a goal. As I stated, it will only involved 'goal, no goal, penalty, no penalty decision.' And each manager will only guarantee 1 challenge.

Many goals have been given when they should be disallowed.
Many goals should have been given but they were disallowed.
Same with penalty decision.

If you watch Match of the Day (for EPL), you will see that each week there are at least a few wrong decisions made about an offside goal or on-side non goal or a penalty decision.

Video replay would be bad if it has constant interruption. But having 2-3 video replay interruptions a game will not ruin the sports. There are interruption in football already: injury, substitution, a direct kick which usually takes 30-40 seconds, goal celebration/restart etc....

[deltox]

i know what you said..

i am disagreeing with you.


the game is played by humans.....the game is reffed by humans.

like any sport there is subtle differences in opinions on calls.


in baseball, is it a strike or a ball for example.

the same thing in football.

calling a penalty is the refs decision. its not up to a video replay judge. and it shouldnt be

[Broadview]

I was in the waiting room at the doctor's office today and the girl beside me was watching teevee on her phone. Flipping channels and everything. The Jetsons have arrived.

Anyway, how long do you think it will be until managers are holding up televised replays to fourth officials right there on the sidelines? You can't stop this technology stuff.

I'm all for it and if I were an official I'd be all for it as well. Better right a little late than forever wrong.

[prizby]

TERRIBLE IDEA

the missed offside does not happen often enough to implement video replay, but the penalty call could have been made if there was another referee behind the net

i am totally against video replay, but would be for 2 more referees placed behind the nets

when I am watching football, i want to be watching football not a flipping replay decision, i yell enough at rogers for showing too many replays at terrible times!

this idea is just as bad as the champions league reformat idea

[Pookie]

- video replay has to occur on the next ball out of play or else you will have coaches using it as a tactic to blow play down at times of their convenience (ie. outnumbered
- Within the game, I think it should be limited to fouls within the box and "did it cross the line" questions
- Post-game, I am all for full game review of any and all dives, in the box or not and subsequent suspensions

I love to see something done about the "Speed healers" that slow the play down with the stretcher only to pop back up and ask to be brought on. I think you could do that without using video replay though. Simply make it a choice for the team. Either they sub the player or if the same player is to return, they have a mandatory 5 minute wait period to return.

[Fort York Redcoat]

this thread is not about wether or not replay should be implemented but how it can be implemented so as to least piss off the majority of people who don't want it to ever be implemented.

It can't. Your ideas are trying to improve but change the game to something most don't want to see.

To introduce the subject as if it's already happened really helps make the thread pro-replay but I won't accept a comprimise on something that doesn't have to happen.

[prizby]

this thread is not about wether or not replay should be implemented but how it can be implemented so as to least piss off the majority of people who don't want it to ever be implemented.

It can't. Your ideas are trying to improve but change the game to something most don't want to see.

To introduce the subject as if it's already happened really helps make the thread pro-replay but I won't accept a comprimise on something that doesn't have to happen.

amen to that

well said

[Shakes McQueen]

You wouldn't need "video replay" for things like offside calls. Sew a tiny chip in the ball so a camera can paint a "line" across the field, and have a couple of guys in a booth monitoring for offside calls, using that computer-generated "line" on the screen to make sure you get it right. They've had this kind of "advanced" technology since the days of the "Fox Trax" glowing hockey puck, for fuck's sake.

Give the official a small earpiece. If he misses a clear offside call, radio down within a second or two to let him know to call it. If it's close, then let the official's decision stand. Simple.

The chip could also be used to decisively determine if the ball crosses the goal line - so no more controversy over goal-line clearances, and balls that go in and out of the net quickly. This also wouldn't require any stoppage in play.

I wouldn't institute video replay for dives, because that would require play to be held up while they review, and doesn't suit the flow of football. Plus, every game would have way too much extra time tacked on.

What I do support, is FIFA instituting a new policy whereby the video from every game is reviewed, and all clear divers get punished harshly - even if they get away with it in-game. Meaning suspensions, and the standard yellow card for diving as well, after the fact. In unclear cases, let the official's decision stand.

This is so easy to do, but football is so filled with stodgy old fuckers that resist any encroachment on "tradition", that simple, effective, fluid changes like these never get made.

- Scott

[Dust2]

This is so easy to do, but football is so filled with stodgy old fuckers that resist any encroachment on "tradition", that simple, effective, fluid changes like these never get made.

- Scott

True. But they will die someday and be replaced by others who are more in favor of technology.

[Big Bruva]

The Americans will most probably love the idea of this coz they love stop start sports.

Basketball
Hockey
American Football
Baseball

[Baggio2TFC]

The games will last like 4 hrs in this league!!!

[Shakes McQueen]

The Americans will most probably love the idea of this coz they love stop start sports.

Basketball
Hockey
American Football
Baseball

Like I mentioned above in my post, you can introduce simple technology to the game, that will cut down hugely on a lot of the officiating problems, without causing any break in the flow of play at all.

Of course, even these kinds of changes will be protested by the usual gaggle of idiots that like to wax poetic about how "natural" and "traditional" the game is - as though grown men pirouetting through the air and pretending they have broken legs, and goals not being called because the ball bounced out of the net too quickly, are beautiful things.

- Scott

[Sonny Cheeba]

what's the difference between the time it could take for a ref to look at a replay and the amount of time a player wastes with shit like this


or the time wasted with players yelling at the ref and whatnot during appeals and subsequent stops in play.

if UEFA ever sought to invest in this they could have a system that wouldn't take long at all.... (don't know about MLS though)

if they focus on only diving in the box or at the edge that have the potential to change the score, then i think it's fine. this is different from replays in sports over here where they aren't reviewing a potential cheater, they're looking at if a wide receiver gets his feet in the endzone, or if the puck crossed the line.

[Dust2]

The games will last like 4 hrs in this league!!!

Explains to me how two replay challenges (which will take up at most a minute each) will result in a 4 hours game?

In the majority of games, there will be no need for a challenge because there will be no dispute in the goal scored or not scored, penalty given, or penalty not given.

[Sonny Cheeba]

Explains to me how two replay challenges (which will take up at most a minute each) will result in a 4 hours game?

In the majority of games, there will be no need for a challenge because there will be no dispute in the goal scored or not scored, penalty given, or penalty not given.

to add to this point. if players know that they're going to be scrutinized and penalized on the spot, they'll eventually be less likely to dive.

are you more likely to steal thongs at a La Senza where there are cameras in the thong section? or at a no name store in a dirt mall without cameras where the thongs so close to the exit they beg you to take them.

yeah i bet all you dirty buggers choose the latter scenario.

[prizby]

how can you use video replay to make a subjective call on lets say an offside

unless the camera is perfectly parallel to the goal line and perfectly in line with the last defender (assuming the goalie is somewhere behind him), you will never, ever get an exact call!

[Fort York Redcoat]

Explains to me how two replay challenges (which will take up at most a minute each) will result in a 4 hours game?

In the majority of games, there will be no need for a challenge because there will be no dispute in the goal scored or not scored, penalty given, or penalty not given.

How long is replay in other NA sports take? I bet that's what they started with was the same formula "It won't take more than a minute." Is there more than a minutes stoppage in every NA sport?(Uh Huh.)

This would be the first in many changes unappreciated by traditional viewers. To think sponsor breaks wouldn't be the next step would be niave for anyone who's grown up on this continent.

[prizby]

How long is replay in other NA sports take? I bet that's what they started with was the same formula "It won't take more than a minute." Is there more than a minutes stoppage in every NA sport?(Uh Huh.)

This would be the first in many changes unappreciated by traditional viewers. To think sponsor breaks wouldn't be the next step would be niave for anyone who's grown up on this continent.

wasn't it the nfl replay that was suppose to be 60 seconds...and now what, the coach challenges, ref goes over to find out what they are challenging and discuss whether this can be challenged (good time wasting tactic), they then go over and check the replay, they make sure that they do infact have the right call, the refs then announce the call, then they go over and explain it to both coaches...all this, the tv goes on commercial now

you can barely say this all in 60 seconds

[Shakes McQueen]

How long is replay in other NA sports take? I bet that's what they started with was the same formula "It won't take more than a minute." Is there more than a minutes stoppage in every NA sport?(Uh Huh.)

This would be the first in many changes unappreciated by traditional viewers. To think sponsor breaks wouldn't be the next step would be niave for anyone who's grown up on this continent.

Do they go to commercial now, while players are being attended to on the field?

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

how can you use video replay to make a subjective call on lets say an offside

unless the camera is perfectly parallel to the goal line and perfectly in line with the last defender (assuming the goalie is somewhere behind him), you will never, ever get an exact call!

My damn computer chip in the ball idea solves this problem!

- Scott

[Blazer]

[prizby]

video replay would be an epic fail...just add refs for the goal line stuff

[Dust2]

How long is replay in other NA sports take? I bet that's what they started with was the same formula "It won't take more than a minute." Is there more than a minutes stoppage in every NA sport?(Uh Huh.)

This would be the first in many changes unappreciated by traditional viewers. To think sponsor breaks wouldn't be the next step would be niave for anyone who's grown up on this continent.

How about following cricket example of video replay? They take about 20-30 seconds after the umpire point upstairs to the video official for a decision.

Is there a sponsor break in NA sports during an instant replay challenge? Don't they show the 'event' that caused the challenge instead of a commercial? At least, that's how it's done in NFL.

[Dust2]

wasn't it the nfl replay that was suppose to be 60 seconds...and now what,

Then don't follow the NFL example.

the coach challenges, ref goes over to find out what they are challenging and discuss whether this can be challenged (good time wasting tactic),

No need in soccer because it's obvious what is being challenged. If a goal is given, the challenge is obviously that the goal should be disallowed. If a goal is disallowed, the challenge is obviously that the goal should be allowed. Same with penalty decision.

they then go over and check the replay,

Referee will not see the replay. He delegates this task to the video official. This will save a lot of time.

they make sure that they do infact have the right call, the refs then announce the call,

No need to announce the call. Referee can give a visual signal. For example a GREEN card means the challenge is successful and a WHITE card means the challenge is unsuccessful.

then they go over and explain it to both coaches...all this

NFL referee go over to both coaches one at a time and explain to both NFL coaches why he makes the decision? This is news to me. If they do in NFL, this doesn't mean it will happen in soccer.

the tv goes on commercial now

that's NFL. This is soccer.

you can barely say this all in 60 seconds

I disagree.

The "fact" (goal, penalty) took place at 0 second.
The video staff told the manager to challenge at 20 second with one single word: CHALLENGE.
Manager blow the horn at 22 second.
Referee heard the horn and pointed upstairs at 25 second.
Video official gave the referee the decision with a single "GREEN or WHITE" at 50 second (he will have 50 seconds from start to finish to make a decision)
Referee raised green or white card at 55 second.