Carver Losing His Way a Little Bit?

[djking2]

What the article infers is that Carver had not made his mind up as to whom would be playing sunday. Edwards less than stellar performance in practice indicated that he thought the start was going to Sutton. Carvers statement should be considered in the context of the other statement regarding his displeasure with the CSA/international call-up situation. In a nutshell he was saying "I'll make the decisions just bring your a-game". Good point, he wasn't impressed with Suttons "mistake" in the DC game and I think he'd like to give Edwards the start.

[ag futbol]

What the article infers is that Carver had not made his mind up as to whom would be playing sunday. Edwards less than stellar performance in practice indicated that he thought the start was going to Sutton. Carvers statement should be considered in the context of the other statement regarding his displeasure with the CSA/international call-up situation. In a nutshell he was saying "I'll make the decisions just bring your a-game". Good point, he wasn't impressed with Suttons "mistake" in the DC game and I think he'd like to give Edwards the start.

I think that's a little unfair.

You can look at that one mistake but we got baraged with pressure all game. He made several saves we wouldn't normally expect a goalie to make, then he messed up an easy one.

If anything is to blame that game, it's bunkering in our own end.

[djking2]

"mistake" was the term Carver used in a post game interview, not my choice of words. I wasn't knocking Sutton. The thread title now that's a little harsh

[Flipityflu]

nothing wrong will a little public prodding. the message is this...don't mail it in.by making edawards think he had a shot at playing this weekend, it makes sure he is always training hard. thats a message for the team.

[Oldtimer]

A good professional coach knows that no one is untouchable and always makes players earn their shirt. That way everyone knows they have to perform, and new players step it up because they know that they can break in to the starting 11. It should apply to stars like Guevara and Robert as well.

That what was so wrong with Steve McClaren running the England squad. Everybody though they had a "divine" right to play, so they didn't perform well and some up-and-coming players were ignored. That's why the FA hired Capello, he's not impressed by your past (look, he benched Goldenballs), you have to perform for him now.

I'm very impressed with Carver, he knows what he is doing. Even tactics that I've sometimes questioned have turned out well.

[ensco]

I also thought this was odd (from the same article):

"We might still try to get (Guevara) there for Sunday. It's not easy getting in touch with people when they're in Honduras, if that's where he is.

There were over one million cellphones in Honduras in 2004 (which means there are a lot more now) so the first part of this statement is nonsense.

http://www.telegeography.com/cu/arti...041&email=html

As for the second part, how on earth can Carver not know where he is?

Is Guevara ducking Carver?

[stretchthetruth]

one match (a shit one at that) does not a keeper make... sutton all the way and let him play himself out of it... (which i doubt will happen)

wait, what? where the frig is guevara? did they lose him? haha geez what a weird thing to say...

yeah not sure about the cell phone situation in honduras, but my phone worked like a charm in costa rica...

[footyfan]

No way! He's just creating a competitive environment for his players. No free rides!

JC = JC

This over all in my opinion is what scares me about Toronto FC. Other than Houston, your coach is the only one with that menality and it is sorely lacking in MLS.

Teams which have competition for starting spots not only win championships but form dynasties in this league.

[Flipityflu]

and that is why JC is the best signing TFC has made.

[Mrs. Workie]

Earned the spot????? Are you freaking kidding me!!?!?!?! There was 1 shot on goal during the whole game... Galaxy was playing shit and barely attacking how could he have earned the spot? A lot of work was done by the defence NOT him...I think you guys need smarten up.

And he stopped it. How many times have keepers let in soft goals because they haven't had a lot of action down their end?

He stepped up when he had to. Whether it was for 1 shot, or 15. So let's put him in against a better team, and let him prove himself there.

[Bender]

And he stopped it. How many times have keepers let in soft goals because they haven't had a lot of action down their end?

He stepped up when he had to. Whether it was for 1 shot, or 15. So let's put him in against a better team, and let him prove himself there.

if this were last year and we were at the bottom of the table then i'd say yes, defintely... however this season we are fighting for the top spot in the league and a playoff berth, sutton has been our mvp thus far this season. we need our mvp in our lineup.

[kdzb]

And he stopped it. How many times have keepers let in soft goals because they haven't had a lot of action down their end?

He stepped up when he had to. Whether it was for 1 shot, or 15. So let's put him in against a better team, and let him prove himself there.

Not to worry, he will get his chance with the big boys I'm sure.
The thing is that we are pushing for a possible playoff spot and we need the best 11 out there at the moment. When that spot is guaranteed, I'm sure Edwards will get plenty time to play when Sutton is resting for the playoffs and possible Champions League games.
Edwards is a professional player and he should be professional in training as well.
I trust Carver to lead us to Glory

[CretanBull]

Gotta say I'm a little confused by Carver's actions in the past two days.

First, he says that Sutton might not start on Sunday since Edwards kept a clean sheet last weekend. He keeps saying that if you play and do well and the team wins, then you get to 'keep the shirt.' Well, using that logic, then Robert, Sutton, Dichio, Robbo and Guevara shouldn't play against Houston, even if all are available and healthy, because, really, none of their replacements made any mistakes -- it was an almost perfect game against L.A. But really, does that policy make sense?

Brian Edwards seemed not to think so, and so assumed in training on Friday what with Sutton back, he (Edwards) would be the back-up again. And then Carver lambastes him in the press for it? I mean, WTF???

The difference is that even if they end up on the bench, the other 'replacements' trained as if they wanted to/expected to start the next game, whereas Edwards took it easy assuming that Sutton would automatically get the nod. I wouldn't start Edwards, just like I wouldn't start Dunivant (if Guervara is back) but I'd still expect them to train like they want it.

[jloome]

This is transparently an excuse on Carver's part to renege on the 'you win, you play' to get his number one goalie into the net. Having said that, it may just as easily be legitimate that Edwards was doggin' it expecting to sit on the bench and was told "you expected to sit? you get your wish", which is just good coaching.

May also be he talked to the press about it to curtail any possible rumours of 'friction' in the dressing room, which is often how one small incident like that can be misconstrued.

[Dozitwin]

^^^ the press may also have been field side with the whole thing happened, after that he'd likely want to talk to them for the same reason listed above

[SanStarko]

Seems like a bit of a nothing story IMO. From what's been said it seems like Edwards, for reasons known only to himself, decided he wouldn't be playing in the next game and so just half assed it in training. Not surprisingly he's gotten called on it and been made an example of. Carver mentioning it in the press is nothing. It just serves as a big wake up call for Edwards on what is expected from him while at TFC and a nice warning for the rest of the guys in the squad too.

To be honest Edwards should think himself lucky that this is all that's happened to him. I can think of a number of managers who would have went a lot further and probably dropped Edwards from anything to do with the First Team squad for a few weeks, including telling him to train with the kids instead of the First Team guys.

[colman1860]

I think that's a little unfair.

You can look at that one mistake but we got baraged with pressure all game. He made several saves we wouldn't normally expect a goalie to make, then he messed up an easy one.

If anything is to blame that game, it's bunkering in our own end.

What extraordinary saves did Sutton make in that game. He was to blame on the first goal, when he came out and hesitated on the corner. The third goal was a shambles. I didnt see the penalty, but I heard that as far as penalties go, it was stoppable. He cost us that game. Period.

[James17930]

This is transparently an excuse on Carver's part to renege on the 'you win, you play' to get his number one goalie into the net. Having said that, it may just as easily be legitimate that Edwards was doggin' it expecting to sit on the bench and was told "you expected to sit? you get your wish", which is just good coaching.

May also be he talked to the press about it to curtail any possible rumours of 'friction' in the dressing room, which is often how one small incident like that can be misconstrued.

Yes -- someone has finally figured it out.

Which is why I stick with my original point that this whole 'keeping the shirt' thing is a bit silly. Look at all the potential problems that could some up with a strict policy such as this -- players potentially losing their starting spot when they go on international duty etc.

Sure, it might make them work harder to impress Carver, but it could just as easily make them resent them too. If this policy sticks around, and we gonna have problems with Jimmy and Sutts playing in the WCQs? I certainly, certainly hope not because we need them on the Canadian squad.

[ExiledRed]

^^ I think your taking what is a normal part of being a player on a squad, and having to compete for your position, and turning it into something 'unusual'

Carver has stated before, that training and fitness (match readiness) after international games, was a factor in his decision making process. Edwards earned a start last week and lost it in training, to a regular starter.

Why the melodrama?

[Draracle]

Carver is basing his decision off of practice effort, not game effort. I don't see how any of us can comment on that. My guess is Edwards just laid off during practice while Sutton worked hard. Good choice IMO, as long as Edwards learns and doesn't get his back up. Carver's track record with moody players suggests the former.

[bhoybobby]

Carver is tuning these guys to get used to being part of a competitive squad & that includes training. He is only doing what top class managers do, keeping his boys motivated.

He want's the to believe that they pick the team with their commitment & effort in games & practices alike.

That's the way it's done at all the top clubs. Way to go JC

[Rawkus_420]

the title of this thread made me angry....Whats the fucking pont of criticizing the head coach whos led us to our best season in franchise history. Fuck some ppl are never happy.

[pat416]

Carter is doing great imo. Yes i think Sutton is the mvp this year so far and i just cant wait to see who we bring to the temain the next few weeks!

[Pachuco]

Although I like Carver. I think he needs to take some responsibility for yesterday's loss. Personally some of the moves he made yesterday shocked me. Taking off Velez for Marshall, instead of James. Taking out Ricketts so quick. Benching Robert in the first half?

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Although I like Carver. I think he needs to take some responsibility for yesterday's loss. Personally some of the moves he made yesterday shocked me. Taking off Velez for Marshall, instead of James. Taking out Ricketts so quick. Benching Robert in the first half?

Agreed 100%, I do however think he is smart enough to not to that again.
Those are the kind of lineups/subs id expect to see from Mo.
God that game was garbage.

[Limani_Ole]

Carver took a left turn somewhere for me..

For Sutton to loose his spot because he played for his country is BULLSHIT no matter where in the world you play.. and lets face it.. Sutton is in his prime and playing well for TFC.. Edwards is a rookie and hasn't shown anything to deserve the #1 over Sutton.

second - why sit Robert? arguably our best player available.. then you sub him in at the half, acknowledging you mistake in not starting him..
third - why did Marshall loose his spot? was it because of his international absence? then Velez got beaten by DeRo and got the yank in the second.. we all know Velez has done worse and never got the subbed off.. so why do it now? what will that do for his confidence since they have been building it all season long..?

and Ricketts was playing well and was taken out....

in both the above cases Carver went against his policy of starting his best 11, for his 'do not change a winning team' policy..

confusing.. lets hope he knows what he is doing..

[Jack]

My post from the other thread also applies here.

It was one game. Fucking relax.

Before this, Carver hasn't put a foot wrong. When brought in, Marshall was utter shite, so I don't know what the benefit would have been of having him from the start. Dichio could hardly move out there due to his injury. The only thing I would have done is put Robert in ahead of Dunny, and that could well be a discipline issue due to the red card and Carver wanting Laurent to know he'd better keep in line.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Carver took a left turn somewhere for me..

For Sutton to loose his spot because he played for his country is BULLSHIT no matter where in the world you play.. and lets face it.. Sutton is in his prime and playing well for TFC.. Edwards is a rookie and hasn't shown anything to deserve the #1 over Sutton.

second - why sit Robert? arguably our best player available.. then you sub him in at the half, acknowledging you mistake in not starting him..
third - why did Marshall loose his spot? was it because of his international absence? then Velez got beaten by DeRo and got the yank in the second.. we all know Velez has done worse and never got the subbed off.. so why do it now? what will that do for his confidence since they have been building it all season long..?

and Ricketts was playing well and was taken out....

in both the above cases Carver went against his policy of starting his best 11, for his 'do not change a winning team' policy..

confusing.. lets hope he knows what he is doing..

He does, i think he used those line ups either because a) he felt they were capable of playing the way they did last week regularly or b) he wanted to see if they were capable. Either way i would assume that you will not see that type of line up again unless its absolutely necessary.

[James17930]

Not saying we would have won the game otherwise, but Carver definitely blew it with his line-up today. It's like throwing away a whole game just to use it as an excuse to drop a policy he realized in hind-sight wouldn't work.

I'm not out for blood with him -- I fully respect what he's done so far and how he's transformed this club in such a short span of time. However, I think it's fairly obvious that he's running into trouble with this policy (or, really, two conflicting policies) of his and he's probably going to have to rethink it.

[PureTFC]

Omg, Omg, Omg.... Sky is falling after 2 days.............