offer people in the south to move to the north for south prices.. they are there cause they are the cheap seats offer them something of the same price and i'm sure plenty will move
offer people in the south to move to the north for south prices.. they are there cause they are the cheap seats offer them something of the same price and i'm sure plenty will move
I'm in the North End now. I really like the vantage point and my kids benefit from the sloped seating in that they can see over someone in front. For the most part, you aren't staring into the Sun on late evening games either as it dips over section 226-227. Why should I move?Originally Posted by swan
What I'm going to say next may sound inflammatory but it is fundamental to this question. What would be different about an united voice in the North End vs the South?
And whose voice? RPB? U-Sector? Tribal Rhythm Nation? NEE?
Seems to me that you are asking the FO to set aside a section of the stadium for supposed like minded individuals to enjoy the game the way they want. And you currently have a a section of the stadium set aside for like minded individuals to enjoy the game the way they want. In fact, with 111 and 110, this was expanded. Whose fault is it that the "south end is in decline?"
Tourists, casuals, scalpers, etc will all find their way to whichever section is designated as a supporters section as it is the cheapest ticket and likely the only one moving on the secondary ticket market. These folks also come because they want to be a part of it. To this point, not one SG has been successful in engaging more individuals to get involved in numbers that will make a difference to the atmosphere on an ongoing basis.
In 5+ years, the RBP haven't influenced any section other than 111. U-Sector can barely influence anything above the middle of 114. People want TRN to shut up and NEE is virtually non-existent this year.
Heck, we had more unity in early year 2 Columbus road matches than we've had at BMO (Dichio TIFO, Streamer TIFO and a few other moments aside).
Make what we have work first and then start talking about preferred locations.
Last edited by Pookie; 06-05-2012 at 05:41 PM.
Pook has a point. If we can't unite where we are and we aren't united on moving then what magic will pissing off a bunch of paying ticket holders in the North presently do?
The North is nice but I don't prefer it and would only moved if there was no other alternative to staying and growing what we have.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
You won't be able to read this thread/poll because you aren't a member but for others who are RPB members here you go: http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showth...ht=north+stand
Basically a majority of members voted for this, and there was lots of good debate and ideas on the subject.
This was also a time when most of the North Stand was vacant of season ticket holders so it was prime time for this to happen. Many said the prices were too high and that they wouldn't drop them for us so we didn't act. But they dropped them the following year and the opportunity was lost.
Let's give it a try
let's build a new south end.
let's make it look like the north end.
let's give it to supporters.
let's give it a roof.
let's uhh.. fuck i don't know.
Take TRN with you wherever you all go please and thank you.
spend money that we don't have because neither mlse or the city of toronto are going to do it for us
It would be awesome to have vocal supporters at BOTH ends of the field, for sure. BUT, unless you have a roof, there is really no way of containing the noise genarated by a single area of the field, no matter if its the corner, or right behind the penalty area.
I've always been in 113, where its NOISY. But, I've also gone to other area of the stadium, and the noise from 113/112 is lost anywhere else in the stadium. I was in 119 for the Canada USA game last weekend, and the noise from 112/113 was almost nothing from 119.
I just remembered a few years back when Aston Villa hired Martin O'Neil and the away supporters use to be located in the North stand behind one of the goals...Martin O'Neil did not like this as he thought it effected the team since the away fans were right behind there own goal. O'Neil requested the away fans be moved to the side stand which is the Doug Ellis stand located from about the corner flag to almost mid field, this is where the away fans are now located. Since about 3,000 seats are saved for away fans when they moved them to the Doug Ellis stand there must of already been some Villa season ticket holders located in that section of the stand...my point is i wonder what they said/did for the Villa fans that had to be moved else where?? Could it work at BMO Field??
Last edited by james; 06-06-2012 at 09:49 AM.
Pookie. Bang on, 100% right. I would add that winning will help with any atmospheric concerns. It's simply not a novelty anymore. The surprising amount of enthusiasm fed on itself originally. Moving around the stadium and dividing the support even further will only serve to satisfy, if that's possible, the RPB who feel a need to be isolated from other supporters.....which is somewhat offensive to everyone in the South end, 111 and 110 who stand, support and cheer for 90 minutes but isn't a card carrying RPB.
I am reading a lot of valuable feedback in terms of suggestions and perspectives in this thread in which are all steps in the right direction. This specifically pertains where want to go or be as supporters i.e. north end relocation, stay put in the south end etc.
I am going to throw something out there...Everything can be tweaked; again this is just a suggestion .
We could possibly create a team to run with this in terms of scoping it out in the initial stages. Create say a team of 4 individuals within RBP. It would be beneficial that these individuals are logical, can think out side of the box and the ability to articulate. Ask the other supporter groups U-Sector/NEE/TRN to do the same. Start meetings on a bi-weekly basis between the groups or how frequently they chose. The teams can take a SWOT analyses approach as the same logic will apply. Outline the suggestions/visions between the groups that have been brought forward or would like to see accomplished. Then outline all the positives, negatives, opportunities and challenges of the potential options/visions.
Come back with the findings by a certain date and present this to a limited audience in which it would just consist of the top dogs of each group. From there, the top dogs can digest/dissect this amongst themselves and come to a decision of the best option (if at all) to move forward with.
If we were looking to implement something and collectively amongst the other supporters groups, especially for next season as this will not happen overnight, the ball needs to get rolling. If we want to achieve something, we will have a better opportunity to do this if the proper steps are taken.
Last edited by toronto toronto; 06-06-2012 at 12:31 PM.
If you were a regular at away games you would know that the best TFC support is always away. Why? Because it's a GA set-up and united, no matter group affiliation.
It is pretty amazing that with this set-up, TFC supporters have absolutely pwned the home support in Montreal, New England, Kansas City, and Columbus. Even with vastly smaller numbers we gave a great account of ourselves in Philly, New York, DC, and Chicago.
Make the north stand GA and give it to the supporters to control. Anyone who says they cant make seating GA by law is full of shit. Move the existing SSH there to the south. The vertical incline of the north stand would be amazing for overheads and displays. Yeah I guess we had our chance, pissed it away and now our support is fucking garbage at league games. Only ourselves to blame.
I was at the Canada/American friendly on Sunday and I sat about center field right at pitch level alternating on both the east and west side of the stadium.
The sound from the American supporters in the North stand traveled MUCH BETTER across the stadium than the supporters in the south. I think being up higher helped with the sound movement across the pitch.
I'm not talking slightly better, I'm talking a huge difference better. It had nothing to do with the level of support they brought or anything like that. The sound just seemed to carry across, where as the south just seemed to die before centre of the pitch.
I'm conviced that south end is acoustically challenged in design.
Last edited by jabbronies; 06-06-2012 at 12:59 PM.
^ Well that should dispel concerns that it's a bad idea because it is 10 feet farther back from the pitch than the south end. When we took that stand over in that crazy rain game against Van, it left zero doubt in my mind that it was simply made for supporters.
I have to disagree that it worked well.
The US-Canada game was the first time I'd been in the north end for an entire game (I was there for a few minutes of the Van NCC game last year). I'm not sure how things are in the south end, but compared to my seats at the top of 110, the view from row 7 of the north stand sucked when play was at the other end, you could not hear a single thing being said over the PA, even when the american supporters weren't singing, and it was a pain in the ass turning around to look at the scoreboard to see the replay of what you just missed at the south end goal.
Being higher up, I'm sure the singing carries better in to the rest of the satdium, and it was nice not having the sun in my face, but I think these positives are far outweighed by the negatives.
In the rain against Vancouver there were a couple hundred maximum that marched to the North Stand. I think it was only impressive to those who moved. Personally, I felt like it was kind of weak, and just severed the support. I'm guessing chants of "This is our house" would return, but the select chosen supporters would be reffering to the North Stand. It's sad that, as Pookie says, the supporters don't willingly try and find new ways of engaging the enthusiasm all around them. I said the same thing after Montreal, look in the mirror if you don't like the support. I see THOUSANDS standing at BMO for the full 90 in the South Stand and South East corner. If you want to get away from that, maybe there is something wrong with you.
after 5+ years, if people aren't engaged by now, not even circus clowns will help.......people know the songs by now, they just don't sing.......how would you "engage" these people at this point?
what it is that people want to get away from are those who are standing in the south end simply because they either have to in order to watch the game, or because the seats are cheap.......
its not at all about card carrying; its about knowing who is in the section because when you get a person who you don't know in the section and they light a flare or put off a smoke bomb or toss a beer onto the field, then take off before anyone can catch that person, who gets in trouble?
What about me, I am in the north stand because I don't want to feel obligated to stand or sing the whole game, trust me I'm not the only one that picked seats there for this reason.
Perhaps it's because the wind was blowing from north to south.
There are what, 3,000 seats in the North Stand? It's probably likely that not everyone is going to know the folks beside them. Beer tossing, flare loving issues would happen there too.
Uniting the South End should be the focus, regardless of how great it would look in the North. Much like the idea of moving to the same sized house in the same neighbourhood. It is a more expensive and stress filled option with minimal to no gain.
I'd love to hear ideas on how to get 111 more involved. How to expand to 114-115. Seems to me that moving (or adding) a Capo stand is a lot easier than moving 6,000 fans from one side of the stadium to the other.
I'm in the North stand for the view. When there is a little wind, the south end can not be heard, simple. At the US game, i was right behind the US bench, slightly south of mid field and with the wind, the Outlaws in the north stand could be easily heard but the south end with 5 times as many people sounded the same.
The sooner we get a basic simple ampitheatre type of roof over the south end, the better, if only for the sound across the whole ground.
You answered your own question. On that note, good luck to the capos trying to synchronize across multiple sections. As it is, it's hard enough for the 112 and 113 capos to coordinate nevermind stretching across the entire south end. Simply too much ground to cover. These days even 111 seems disinterested. Not throwing any blame around, just stating the facts.
Not sure what the solution is at this point. Starting over by way of the north stand seems visionary but is it practical? That I do not know. If I was to speculate, I would say that there is too many obstacles in the way of this proposition. STH relocation being front and centre but other factors such as various MLSE concerns would undoubtly be brought up as well by the big wigs.
It's a shame the south end wasn't built on a greater slope and contained more rows a la the north end. It would have eliminated at least part of the problem.
Until GA happens, (Somewhere....ANYWHERE) Support in Toronto will always be fractured and we'll continue to spin our tires in the mud like we have been for the past 3 years.
what happened to NEE? this season they seem non-existant.....
Ding ding ding. The way sound carries changes game to game. Some game I can hear the south end a bit, other games I can't. Some games I could here NEE, other games I couldn't.
I don't think that that one location over another would be inherently better or worse in this regard.
There are 1500 seats or so in the North End.
When I say embrace the people who are all around you I mean stop caring about singing for 90 straight minutes. It's a ridiculous idea to think that is ever going to happen. Get over it. Is it really so bad that people actually care about what's happening in the game or with the team too? When players come for a corner I get the impression that disorganized yet passionate screaming is as intense as showing your passion in sing song form, which at times everybody does anyway.
I just can't understand this obsession with control and knowing everybody and having support done only your way. It's messed up in my opinion. I guess that's all I have to say. I'm taking a break from this board so the official RPB can be alone from the taint of a TFC supporter.
Control/Knowing Everybody; isn't necesarily "knowing them", but having someone vouch for them as well. Unless you want to go back to having to drop the drum/banners/flags off an hour before kickoff like last year; because all it takes is one person to ruin for the rest; and the fact is, this has happened in the past and you can guess who got the blame for it.
Support isn't done "our way" because so many people here want to support in different ways, which i think goes right back to pookie's point about the lack of unity which goes to the next point
"I mean stop caring about singing for 90 straight minutes."
its amazing when you look at the Timbers Army or Seattle Sounder supporters...they pretty much go for 90 straight and funny, they seem to be able to get a few thousand to do that...don't they sound great too?
Ditto. Having been stuck in the Olympic stadium in Montreal for the second half only a few yards from the relocated capo bawling his head off telling me to sit down stand up jump around and barely being able to see the game because of it i say no thanks. Your south side is just fine.
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