Bad News for DC

[Toronto Gunner]

Those who signed the online petition to get DC their own SSS should have received this email. Essentially, the idea was shot down. What's this mean for DC? Time will tell:

Screaming Eagles, Barra Brava, los Norteños, and other DC United fans,


Thank you for writing to express your support of stadium-anchored transit-oriented development in Prince George’s County. I am unhappy to report that House Bill 1282 – which would have allowed the Maryland Stadium Authority, the Maryland-National Capital Park and Planning Commission and Prince George’s County to study and make recommendations on this new facility for America’s most successful soccer team, DC United – will not pass this year.
Though I represent part of Montgomery County in the Maryland General Assembly, I feel strongly that the health and vitality of communities in many jurisdictions are interdependent. Growth in the Washington metropolitan area is primarily regional, and underdevelopment in Prince George’s County leads to additional pressure on neighborhoods closer to home. You need only look as far as the Capital Beltway and US-50 to see that development patterns over the last several decades have left Prince George’s County with more residents than jobs. During morning rush hour, thousands head towards Montgomery County, Northern Virginia, and the District because growth there has mostly meant affordable housing for those working in other jurisdictions, a pattern that has created more needs than a narrowly residential tax base can support.

As the metropolitan area continues to grow, Prince George’s County can add employment centers and retail opportunities efficiently and sustainably by locating new development in areas with existing infrastructure. In fact, fifteen of our region’s most valuable transportation assets – Metrorail stations – are currently underutilized in Prince George’s County.
DC United and its owners, MacFarlane Partners, understand that potential. After being approached by the County, they proposed partnering with the County and State on a soccer stadium and concert venue that would have anchored and catalyzed a new urban mixed-use neighborhood at a Metrorail station in the heart of the County’s developed tier. This transit-oriented development would have also include homes, shops, and offices, all integrally connected to the rest of Prince George’s.

Unfortunately, this legislation will not pass, and we will have to wait until early next year to see if anything might be done to revive the idea. I hope you will stay in touch on this and other priorities.
Best,
Heather
~~~~~~~~~~
Heather R. Mizeur
Delegate, Maryland General Assembly
20th Legislative District

heather.mizeur@house.state.md.us
Lowe House Office Building
6 Bladen Street, Room 219
Annapolis, MD 21401
(301) 858-3493 Annapolis office
(301) 270-0064 Silver Spring office
(301) 858-3445 fax

[FluSH]

....

sad to see this... how many championships did they bring? Best supporters in the MLS bar none... and they get no love from their city.

They must be smoking crack down there... they have to.

[James Oliphant]

*sigh*

This is getting ridiculous. That team - and those fans - DESERVE a stadium.

[sulfur]

Yah. Give 'em time. They'll be in Montreal.

[Oblio2]

Im in Montomery county (MD)right now, visiting my in-laws....it's lovely down here

[Kevin]

This is a shame really. They need to get their heads out of their NFL redskin asses.

[Jack]

....

sad to see this... how many championships did they bring? Best supporters in the MLS bar none... and they get no love from their city.

They must be smoking crack down there... they have to.

I thought Marion wasn't the mayor anymore

[rocker]

actually the crack smoking guy (Marion) was one of the DC politicians who approved of the Poplar Point stadium plan..

so maybe the other guys need to smoke some crack! then they'll see the light.........

[Jack]

actually the crack smoking guy (Marion) was one of the DC politicians who approved of the Poplar Point stadium plan..

so maybe the other guys need to smoke some crack! then they'll see the light.........

LOL...maybe!

But seriously, this sucks for DCU and it sucks for MLS.

[S_D]

anyone know how much longer RFK will be around?

[Cashcleaner]

Just crazy that a deal can't be reached with the District. I'm pretty sure some sort of arrangement will be made with any one of the area colleges or universities, though.

[S_D]

It seems that the owner always wants adjacent land to develop real estate, and yet wants the county to fork over the bulk of the cash. Makes me think that he is more interested in the real estate than he is in the soccer team.

The guy needs to just pony up the cash himself. It is time that owners start using their own money rather than sponging off of the taxpayer. If he doesn't have the money to pay for a stadium perhaps it is time that MLS looks for someone with deeper pockets to take over DCU.

[twistedchinaman]

It seems that the owner always wants adjacent land to develop real estate, and yet wants the county to fork over the bulk of the cash. Makes me think that he is more interested in the real estate than he is in the soccer team.

The guy needs to just pony up the cash himself. It is time that owners start using their own money rather than sponging off of the taxpayer. If he doesn't have the money to pay for a stadium perhaps it is time that MLS looks for someone with deeper pockets to take over DCU.

As much as I feel for DC United, I have to +1 to that. If Lew Wolff could build something like this with his own money:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Earthquakes_Stadium

Then why can't DC do it? Hell...wasn't the Crew Stadium financed by Hunt himself and not the county that Columbus is in?

[Cashcleaner]

It seems that the owner always wants adjacent land to develop real estate, and yet wants the county to fork over the bulk of the cash. Makes me think that he is more interested in the real estate than he is in the soccer team.

The guy needs to just pony up the cash himself. It is time that owners start using their own money rather than sponging off of the taxpayer. If he doesn't have the money to pay for a stadium perhaps it is time that MLS looks for someone with deeper pockets to take over DCU.

That's crazy talk! Its a know fact that the world's millionaires and billionaires have a strong psychic attachment to their money and we must ensure that they keep all of it as to prevent a possible backlash of telepathic energy.

Or some stupid shit like that.

[Mark in Ottawa]

It seems that the owner always wants adjacent land to develop real estate, and yet wants the county to fork over the bulk of the cash. Makes me think that he is more interested in the real estate than he is in the soccer team.

The guy needs to just pony up the cash himself. It is time that owners start using their own money rather than sponging off of the taxpayer. If he doesn't have the money to pay for a stadium perhaps it is time that MLS looks for someone with deeper pockets to take over DCU.

Welcome to Ottawa... er DC... er... Different capital cities but same situation in both.

[ryencoke]

RFK will be around until it crumbles.

Maybe thats why they stick away support on the upper deck

[S_D]

That's crazy talk! Its a know fact that the world's millionaires and billionaires have a strong psychic attachment to their money and we must ensure that they keep all of it as to prevent a possible backlash of telepathic energy.

Or some stupid shit like that.

lol

Yeah there is a reason why they stay billionaires or millionaires. They use and risk everyone's money but their own.

And what is it with the cost of the stadium? Do they want a stadium to play soccer or do they want their stadium to be the best in the MLS? It is obvious they don't have the cash for what they want to have, so it is time they look at what they can afford.

Shave off 70-80 million off of the price tag and build a mechano set stadium liike BMO, Crew stadium, or San Jose with the ability to expand and add all of the frills later. With a reduced cost just MAYBE the county will be willing to throw in a few bucks.

I feel for the DCU fans, but this owner is an idiot. I think that Garber's warning was directed at the county/ district AND DCU ownership. The good thing about the MLS is there are cities who want teams and if they can't pull it together, move them.

[rocker]

ya that stadium proposal was even more expensive than the Red Bull Arena.

i said this to the Houston fans on Bigsoccer who complained about the cheapness of the proposals for their new stadium: get it built even if it's not a grand thing. an $80 million stadium is better than no stadium at all. 80 million will build you a decent MLS stadium.
then once it's in place, you can expand/upgrade later.

getting it built is the hard part.

it's the same with the portland thing. right now they are still trying to find the money to fill the funding gap. the funny thing is, much of the gap is for the baseball stadium for the triple A team. Why not just fold the triple A baseball team? then the gap is gone and actually the funding would be reduced much further.

[S_D]

it's the same with the portland thing. right now they are still trying to find the money to fill the funding gap. the funny thing is, much of the gap is for the baseball stadium for the triple A team. Why not just fold the triple A baseball team? then the gap is gone and actually the funding would be reduced much further.

or they could <gasp> pay for it themselves instead of looking for hand outs.

I can understand asking the cities to pay for say an exit ramp off of the highway if there is one close by as it is city infrastructure but asking them for funds to build the actual stadium is going too far.

There was a funny quote in one of the papers the other day when MLSE was looking at getting some funds or land from the city. Once the deal is done, it usually means the taxpayer has to check their hands to see how many fingers they lost.

It surprises me to no end that many say the MLS is a great investment, yet nobody is willing to spend the money. Even look at BMO. MLSE wants to expand and yet not pay for it, or at least pay as little as possible out of their own pocket, either through personal seat licenses or bumming cash off of the city. Yes I know it is a business, but if you aren't willing to fork over the cash and look at it as an investment then perhaps you shouldn't be in the business in the first place.

[Technorgasm]

*sigh*

This is getting ridiculous. That team - and those fans - DESERVE a stadium.

the only American team to WIN a C.C. League title. and still struggle to find their own home.


all in due time?

this dream just took a big hit.

[rocker]

or they could <gasp> pay for it themselves instead of looking for hand outs.

It surprises me to no end that many say the MLS is a great investment, yet nobody is willing to spend the money. Even look at BMO. MLSE wants to expand and yet not pay for it, or at least pay as little as possible out of their own pocket, either through personal seat licenses or bumming cash off of the city. Yes I know it is a business, but if you aren't willing to fork over the cash and look at it as an investment then perhaps you shouldn't be in the business in the first place.

well, i can understand their approach. Why pay for it yourself when someone else will?

everything's a negotiation.. it's a struggle. I think Garber's comments on DC are just ammunition for negotiation. DC United will now look elsewhere for some county to hand out the cash.

Paulson in Portland actually wasn't looking for a handout.. he wanted the gov to work out some tax deal or bonds that would cover it.... but they see it as taking tax money from one thing and putting it in another. I think though if it came down to it, Paulson could just nuke the baseball team and suddenly they'd be all set. That's probably why Garber approved the expansion without a deal in place. the $15 million gap is less than the price of the baseball stadium.

now, if it causes the expansion team to be folded before it starts, or it causes a team to move from the city, then it's a failed strategy.

I don't know enough about the business side of funding a stadium to know if you can build a 170 million stadium for 18-25 games and expect to see a good return on investment. 80 million stadium? probably.

[S_D]

well, i can understand their approach. Why pay for it yourself when someone else will?

Paulson in Portland actually wasn't looking for a handout.. he wanted the gov to work out some tax deal or bonds that would cover it.... but they see it as taking tax money from one thing and putting it in another.

now, if it causes the expansion team to be folded before it starts, or it causes a team to move from the city, then it's a failed strategy.

I don't know enough about the business side of funding a stadium to know if you can build a 170 million stadium for 18-25 games and expect to see a good return on investment. 80 million stadium? probably.

Yep I realize that it makes business sense to get everyone else to pay for it. But it is time the cities and whoever else put their foot down and say if you want it you pay for it. MLSE had no problem building the ACC. They forced seat licences for it though.

Well it depends on how you look at it with Paulson. The bonds would have had to been secured by the city, so no risk to him if it failed. Looks like a handout to me. I understand though that it changed and he is now backing some if not all the bonds himself.

As for the stadium profiting, Columbus said that when their ranking came in from forbes, they weren't as bad off as it seemed as they made cash from concerts and events, so take that for what it is worth.

[nfitz]

All these shenanigans, delays, etc., in D.C., Vancouver (the long-proposed SSS), Ottawa, really start to make Toronto and Miller look good, in terms of moving fast, and making a decisions. Sure there are issues with BMO field ... but I think if we were elsewhere, we'd be playing in Lamport Stadium on King Street!

[Keystone FC]

If I was the owners of DCU I would 'let it slip' that I was talking with Baltimore, Charlotte, Atlanta, Nashville...etc. Cities that are still 'close' to DC but yet have their own identity. That would hopefully have some impact on the city.
It would be bad on the part of the DCU owners to try and play DC but DC has been playing with them all this time.
The real people who get hurt here are the fans and supporters. They are the ones who truely get the punch in the stomach.
I really want DCU to stay DCU but if they can get a SSS of their own in...Vegas...then I guess that whats' need to happen.

[Steve]

or they could <gasp> pay for it themselves instead of looking for hand outs.

I can understand asking the cities to pay for say an exit ramp off of the highway if there is one close by as it is city infrastructure but asking them for funds to build the actual stadium is going too far.

There was a funny quote in one of the papers the other day when MLSE was looking at getting some funds or land from the city. Once the deal is done, it usually means the taxpayer has to check their hands to see how many fingers they lost.

It surprises me to no end that many say the MLS is a great investment, yet nobody is willing to spend the money. Even look at BMO. MLSE wants to expand and yet not pay for it, or at least pay as little as possible out of their own pocket, either through personal seat licenses or bumming cash off of the city. Yes I know it is a business, but if you aren't willing to fork over the cash and look at it as an investment then perhaps you shouldn't be in the business in the first place.

Why do I always throw myself to the wolves like this?

Now, granted, I don't know all the intricacies of tax law, but it seems to me the owners of the stadiums are approaching the cities not looking for handouts, but looking for pseudo-partners. Think of it this way: You take a piece of land, you build a stadium (and other real estate development) on it. Now, that stadium (and development) is a draw, it generates revenue, it brings people from out of town. X percent of that revenue is taken as tax. The city gets Y percent of that. So, what the owner is saying is "If I build this stadium, you benefit, so why don't you put in some money for the stadium (less than you will benefit from its construction) and we'll both be happy".

I know some people are saying "they're just being greedy, they should just spend their own money!" but that's not the whole story. It's a fairly easy calculation. Maybe the owning group has decided that it isn't financially feasible (not to say they don't have the money, more to say they don't see a sufficient ROI) to build a stadium with their own money. So, the choices are, the city puts some money in, or no stadium is built.

[S_D]

That is their arguement and a fair one. The problem is the owners are asking the cities to put in a ton of money, not just "some money".

Since it isn't their money to risk DCU came up with 170 million plan for a stadium. In this economic environment is that a wise thing to do? Actually in any econimic environment?

Cities and counties are under severe budgetary restraints as it is, and if they have to float bonds, they pay more in interest as most if not all do not have perfect AAA ratings. And what happens if the team goes belly up? It is the city that gets stuck not the MLS owner. Look at what happened to Saint John's Maple Leafs. The city built them a rink and MLSE moved them to Toronto where they have been an absolute failure attendance wise.

The DCU owners have to look at what SJ did instead of coming up with these super expensive plans to make them more palatable to taxpayers.

This sort of thing reminds me of the NASL. Idiot owners living beyond their means.

[Steve]

That is their arguement and a fair one. The problem is the owners are asking the cities to put in a ton of money, not just "some money".

Since it isn't their money to risk DCU came up with 170 million plan for a stadium. In this economic environment is that a wise thing to do? Actually in any econimic environment?

Cities and counties are under severe budgetary restraints as it is, and if they have to float bonds, they pay more in interest as most if not all do not have perfect AAA ratings. And what happens if the team goes belly up? It is the city that gets stuck not the MLS owner. Look at what happened to Saint John's Maple Leafs. The city built them a rink and MLSE moved them to Toronto where they have been an absolute failure attendance wise.

The DCU owners have to look at what SJ did instead of coming up with these super expensive plans to make them more palatable to taxpayers.

This sort of thing reminds me of the NASL. Idiot owners living beyond their means.

I'm not blaming the city for turning them down. They have to do what's right for them (though their position is actually a worse one, since even if it's the best financial investment in the world, they have to deal with public perception of it). At the same time, the owners need to do what's right for them, which is, make money.

So, let's say they come to the realization that they won't be able to get more than X amount from the city, what do they do? Is it as easy as taking the amount they would have spent, adding the amount they think they can get from a city (which may be 0) and get off to the races? Not quite, since their profit projections are all based on the construction of a $170M stadium. Those are going to need to change. Maybe fewer people will come, maybe there are fewer seats, maybe they can book fewer third party events, maybe the concessions situation is worse. All of these things have to be considered, and the ownership might come to the realization that by spending out $60M for a $70M stadium (assuming modest help) they will just not get a suitable ROI. That isn't "greed" in the sense people are referring to, that's just good business. Frankly, at the end of this, there may be no villian. The right situation for both ownership and city might be to walk from the deal. A sad result, surely, but one you can't really blame anyone for.

[BBBulldog]

It seems that the owner always wants adjacent land to develop real estate, and yet wants the county to fork over the bulk of the cash. Makes me think that he is more interested in the real estate than he is in the soccer team.

The guy needs to just pony up the cash himself. It is time that owners start using their own money rather than sponging off of the taxpayer. If he doesn't have the money to pay for a stadium perhaps it is time that MLS looks for someone with deeper pockets to take over DCU.

that email was for PG county.

Original offer with DC was for owners to fully finance the stadium and all surrounding development with city financing infrastructure (electricity, water, roads etc that they would have to do for anyone).

[S_D]

that email was for PG county.

Original offer with DC was for owners to fully finance the stadium and all surrounding development with city financing infrastructure (electricity, water, roads etc that they would have to do for anyone).

Well that sounds a lot better than what we have seen lately. Was that poplar point or the new site?

And just as an edit, sorry to hear you DCU fans being caught in the middle of all of this.