Brilliant!!Originally Posted by s2cazz
Not so brilliant.
Brilliant!!
Not so brilliant.
As a kind of post-Columbus review.
I had some beers and discussed the events in Columbus with one of our RPB senior-statesman last night.
Here's a few points I wish to bring up regarding the touchstone NOW to be refered to as Columbus.
1 We brought an army of support. (all 3 times).
2 They don't like us. (Mayor, FO, supporters, etc. have gone on record).
3 We don't like them. (lack of toilets for 2,000+ visiting supporters, mace, tazing, etc.).
4 Why in the fuck would we even consider injecting more $$ into that fucking hole when other cities with a lot more potential are awaiting a spot in the MLS? (Philly, Portland, Montreal, etc.).
Hey Paul?
If you talk to some of the TFC 'Road Warriors' you will hear nothing but praise about our hosts in L.A., New England, D.C., and Charelston.
We travel well everywhere but 1 place!
So why in the fuck should we go back?
OOOOOOOOOOOhhhhhhhhCAAAAAANAADA!
KD.
TFC F.O cannot be looked to for public defense of the supporter groups on this issue. Its a slippery slope defending groups they have no control over, no matter how reprehensible the slander. They are not going to get into a mud slinging fight with writers who thrive on sensationalism because its a losing battle.
What F.O can do in the future is offer PRIVATE support and P.R resources to the Executive of the supporters groups on the best way to deal with difficult situations. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think any of the leadership would be against having the F.O's opinion and more importantly full time resources to help draft an action plan to deal with these types of problems.
Although they cannot get behind us publicly, MLSE needs to never forget how important the supporters are to the success of the club and privately help in whatever way possible.
BOYCOTT CREW STADIUM
10 points - Hustle!
KD.
That is all that needs to be said.
QFFT.
/end thread.
KD got it on the money......
TO THE POINT!...
KING DAVE FOR PRIME MINISTER!
oops sorry nevermind that would be a demotion... he's the king!
As one of TFCs supporter groups, we have to be held to account at the end of any match-day.
I don't think we need a PR/publicist/douchebag to give us the correct spin before/on/after any given match.
We are the largest, organized supporters group in North America.
And quite likely, the most friendliest.
Let the media attach themselves like the leeches that they are.
Hey, when you jump in a lake and you get a leech?
Just give it a flick!
KD.
This is what kills me the most. This group goes out of it's way to promote a safe and classy way to support our team, including establishing good relationships with other supporters groups, much to the chagrin of other supporters in Toronto and elsewhere, and yet somehow it is OUR name that was dragged through the mud. It's like blaming the Osmonds for death metal.As one of TFCs supporter groups, we have to be held to account at the end of any match-day.
I don't think we need a PR/publicist/douchebag to give us the correct spin before/on/after any given match.
We are the largest, organized supporters group in North America.
And quite likely, the most friendliest
Let the media attach themselves like the leeches that they are.
Hey, when you jump in a lake and you get a leech?
Just give it a flick!
KD.
This is a serious matter that has had me down this week ... but that comment just made me laugh!! Thanks for that.
Next invasion? UTAH!
they'd probably be friendlier!
Umm, to support the team. Isn't that the point of going to away games in the first place?
Below is the letter I sent to the editor of the Toronto Star. I wasn't surprised that they didn't bother to respond....
--------------------------
Dear Sir/Madam,
As an avid Toronto FC fan, I was greatly offended by the recent article on your newspaper from April 5th Keeping the lid on soccer fanatics, by Cathal Kelly.
Firstly, I was surprised to be labelled as belonging to a 'firm'. To clarify, I am not a member of any politically extremist organization and/or any group that engages in organized violent conflict with supporters of other teams and police. However, I can only suspect that Cathal Kelly did not bother to take the time to research what the term can actually mean. Nontheless, I'm sure you'll agree, ignorance cannot be an excuse for the press.
Secondly, I am not a "wannabe British hooligan", as Cathal Kelly implies by quoting an anonymous police officer. Further, if Cathal Kelly would like to prescribe how a Canadian is supposed to behave in the most diverse city in the world he is welcome to, but do not disparage my background.
Cathal Kelly reported that the "Police say they eject anywhere from five to 10 supporters a game". Cathal Kelly might be interested to know that this is not an exceptional number out of 20,000 spectators and is actually akin to the corresponding statistic at the ACC. However, Cathal Kelly's hyperbole is the point of his article I suspect.
Cathal Kelly also mentioned the supposed "racial abuse of a player last season". I suspect that Cathal Kelly is actually referring to one incident in Columbus, Ohio, last season when one member of a supporters group there was santioned for racially abusing a player. The league rightly responded at that time with condemnation of the incident. I absolutely resent being associated with racism. it is inudendo and accusation not based on any fact.
As a Toronto FC season ticket holder I know BMO Field is a place where people of all backgrounds and ages are welcome, and are welcome to express themselves to the fullest in support of Toronto FC in a respectful manner. Cathal Kelly's sensational and grossly unbalanced reporting is disappointing and I hope it will not detract from this.
Please let me know the steps the Toronto Star will take to put to rights this appalling reporting.
Fail to prepare, prepare to fail.
Roy Keane
I'm confused here. Does everybody here really have that hard of a time understanding why the 'supporters' are getting such a bad rep. In columbus Toronto fans ripped out part of the Crew Stadium and threw it towards the field, and there was no response from the Front Office. It seems to me like the open letter has asked the office to make sure everybody understands that the TFC supporters are as cool as Garber says they are. none of that needs to happen, what the front office needs to do is single out the perpetrators, name them, and ban them from MLS games for life.
If the clubs response is to pat the supporters on the back as is what seems to be being asked, the hooligan like behaviour from a few will continue (beer throwing/Ljungberg). If the club bans the idiots who do wrong and make examples of them, it will stop.
Ok, let's clear something up here. No-one is asking for the club for to come out and praise the supporters, or they shouldn't be if they are. Doing so would make the fans and the club look like smoke blowing idiots.
But there's no reason why MLSE cannot come out and make a simple factual statement about actual statistics from TFC games to dispel the shit that is being hinted at by some sections of the media. It doesn't have to be a fan kiss-ass session, it can easily be MLSE protecting its image and investment. AT the very least they could compare TFC games to leaf and raptor games and point out that there is no difference. Why the fuck should we be hung outto dry by the media when we support our team louder and better than any other fans in the city?!
Besides which irrespective of the fans this is now impacting on the club itself (see above posts). So regardless of how we feel we've been treated, MLSE should be taking steps to defend the club and the game day atmosphere simply to ensure a generation of kids aren't kept away from the non-existent hooligans. because it seems like that's where the media is pushing things at the moment.
Last edited by Hitcho; 04-08-2009 at 10:29 PM.
We are the Angry Mob, we read the papers every day
We like who we like, we hate who we hate
But we're also easily swayed
Have you been paying attention at all or simply decided to jump in at the last moment without a shred of knowledge of the facts?
Just one question. Were you in Columbus?
Settle down Roogsey, he makes a half decent point! Media will ALWAYS pick up on the negative, fuck, negative sells and they found what COULD be perceived as negative from the first two matches!! If the FO or ML$E came out and told reporters that it is infact what it is (a few idiots spoiling it for our reputation) no one would print it, no one would read it and no one would care......boring story!!!! It would make me feel better to know that they are aware that we are for themost part "good" or at least not "hooligans".
Either way, the bad press does suck. I'm in a professional client management position and i hate to say it but due to funny looks and questions over these past days from clients......I no longer wear my TFC pin on my jacket.
His half-decent point gets undone by the completely erroneous statement.
TFC supporters did not "rip out" part of Crew stadium. I was right there. I saw it. Yes, some idiot threw it over...I still shake my head at that. But this has been discussed over and over. And inaccurate statements like that is exactly what Catheter picked up on to the exclusion of the facts. So yeah...I have a problem with it.
That and the "hooligan like behaviour" which he describes the beer throwing instances. Another ridiculous statement.
So make your point. But just like we want to hold the media accountable, we will not permit inaccuracies here to go unchecked either. Especially since it has become obvious WE are the medias "source" as ludicrous as that is, it's true.
The looks on the street are nuts & I agree, being asked if I was one of the 'firm members' is just nuts. I have a sewn the RPB logo into my left sleeve - Instantly, That meant I was a hooligan with the rest. Simply not fair, and somewhat profiling. I'm proud to belong, I'm proud to state that I've been around since the start.. I'm proud to be red - Regardless of what the media says.. If you were truly in Columbus, You'd see the pain we are pushed through - It's not right, but it's an opinion... in a public forum at that...
I don't even have the star, and I wrote a letter for them either way. It is not acceptable for a national paper to run inaccurate information.
As for the 'idiots in Columbus' - I'm under the impression that those who were responsible for the idiot acts were promptly identified through picture submissions and the RPB Mgmt group did their piece. I was embarrasd by this individual.
Let's focus on the positives
- This Saturdays Food Drive
- This Saturdays crushing defeat of Dallas
- We have a mgmt group who CARES about us
I also support the screw Columbus in July option - The bottom line is going to hurt - I've seen better attendance at a JR A hockey game then Columbus. Its unfortunate since we brought all that cash to them.. I'm all for a charity event
We know we are better then what was wrote - Send the letter, make the point & move on.
Bring your voices, Bring the noise, Bring your flags & hang your banners. Let's forget about Seattle & Columbus and show that we will not be held back, We will not succumb to the media.
We are Supporters - Support! -AllForOne
(For the record, Kelly's a douchebag)
Last edited by Gixmo; 04-08-2009 at 11:25 PM.
Agreed. But as supporters, we can't send 2,000+ to each away game.
We will have to pick and choose the road trips where we will represent in numbers. Sure, Columbus being the closest MLS team to Toronto (at the moment) will always have a couple of hundred TFC supporters traveling to the match. That's a given.
Just saying that the RPBs and all the other SGs are very important to MLS. Just ask DG.
Listen, I've been on numerous road trips in the last 3 years and every city but one boasted a healthy, welcoming, well supported and competative football team and atmosphere.
KD.
It's funny to me how quickly people forget things they hear in the media. For the first 2 days after all the hooligan reports a lot of people were bugging me about how it must be dangerous at the games etc etc..
I guess the news must have moved on to something else already because the last couple days now everyone has reverted back to "are you going to the game this weekend? I wish I had tickets!"
I know it's anecdotal evidence but I think it's pretty telling of how much of a short term memory people really have when it comes to these things. In the span of just a week I've felt it improve already so in a couple months I doubt anyone will even be thinking about this (I hope)
However, this is still an important issue that needs to be dealt with because if it keeps getting repeated over and over by hack "journalists" then it will really become permanently ingrained in the average person's mind.
I haven't been on as many away trips as some but enough to see the important differences between going to Columbus or say KC. Almost all of our away trips are SG affairs, involving people very closely aligned with the SGs, knowledgable about away trips,etc. The beginning of the season Columbus trip is the exception, in its size and in the wide variety of people attending in the away section. Maybe we need to change the character of that one odd trip to Columbus.
This may be a dumb suggestion but I'll make it anyway. The Toronto SG groups should control the entire away Columbus ticket allocation, even if it is a smaller allocation. If somebody out of the blue wants to go, let them sit in the general seating. This is not an ideal arrangement but how can we self-police when half the people in the section we may not have ever seen before.
I think there are two issues/complaints that are vaild....the "firm" references and the accusation of racism. Those two errors are very serious and flat out wrong.
The rest...get over it and grow up. You expect the FO to babysit the media and take the heat for your actions?
Don't want people from the national post writing articles about people pissing on fences...don't post pictures of it.
Don't want the sun to have a picture of a guy getting tased on the front page? Don't post youtube videos of it.
I saw a picture on flickr of someone throwing the broken railing at Columbus...how did I find it? It was posted here. How do you think the other stuff was found? How many threads do you think are used as material for articles? Positive AND negative.
I'm not saying we should cover up negative behaviour...I'm just saying people have to be smarter and realize that pimping yourself in the media and online as the biggest group, will get you a lot of attention. Positive and negative attention. People need to be adults and understand and handle this.
It seems to me like people like to bask in the positive attention...but a little bit of self inflicted negative attention and they cry to their mommy (MLSE) for help.
Like I said...I think the FO should use their influence to squash the "firm" and "racisim" stuff...that's wrong and unwarrented.
The other stuff...it's up to the groups to figure out. Dont' want the finger poitned at you when things arent' rosey?
Then don't be the biggest f-ing target.
Seriously Carts?I must echo the statements to re: work and co-workers (Hitcho / Shaughno)...
I unfortunately have gone back to wearing my black jacket to work over my TFC jacket... First because I was getting sick of the jokes about being tasered - but then the clincher was when I was actually asked by a superior if I was one of the "trouble makers at all the games..." Worst part of that quote 'all the games'...
I wear the team gear and colours with pride, but when it might hurt my career - I must change...
I guess I can consider myself lucky that I haven't experienced the same ostracism, if you want to call it that, from colleagues and people on the street for being a TFC supporter - at least not yet. However, it saddens me that so many people have felt the need to stop wearing TFC-related clothing, or pins, etc. or have stopped talking about TFC or RPB around the watercooler at work because of disapproval from bosses, etc. for being associated with them.
This just goes to show how willing people are to believe whatever is written in the newspapers, and how much influence hacks like Cathal Kelly can have, and how their lack of journalistic integrity has gotten us into this mess.
It will be a sad day if I feel I need to stop wearing my TFC jersey or scarf because I might get looks of suspicion or disapproval from people on the subway, that doing so might somehow hinder my career path. If someone makes a comment to me about it, I'll look at it as an opportunity to set the record straight - and I think that's what we all need to do to a degree. I think we need to think of these situations as opportunities to educate people that what happened in Columbus or at BMO is NOT hooliganism, because let's face it, most people who are not soccer fans won't know the difference and will latch on to it because the media says so.
Remember, crisis = opportunity.
Are you guys serious?
You are actually going to think about not wearing the colours because of what other people may think about you?
Nice to see Paul is stepping away from the vehicle.....
Not I. That's what I was more or less trying to say. Screw what other people think, I'm still going to wear the "colours" with pride - if people make comments or accusations, I'll just set the record straight.
Its absolutely unbelievable that it has come to this point, all the more reason for us to fight back and make our voices heard above the obnoxious din of the Cuntal Kellys and Gareth Wankers.
Last edited by tfcleeds; 04-09-2009 at 09:03 AM.
Not think, Gabriel, but actions.
If this media-driven perception costs you a promotion or even costs you your job or a future job, then that's taking food off your family's table.
I know it's an extreme example and I also know that I have nothing to hide, but not everyone is surrounded by such understanding people.
Toronto FC baby...best team everrrrrrrrrr -Jozy
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote