ST package for 2011-update 20 Sep

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

^^ This is the kind of stuff I was trying to get at with my last post.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but when I try to factor in all the TFC home games this season compared to all the games in the 2011 ST package, isn't it pretty close to the same amount of games and dollars?

The criticism seems to be about not being offered the choice of non-league games,
And not so much the actual cost of renewing.

Am I correct, or confused?

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Well, it depends on the person I think. But that pretty much is my beef with the club.

I would like to be able to opt out of the MLS Cup.

I would also like to not be forced to pay for the CCL games that may not occur. I would buy them anyways if we did make it, but I feel I shouldn't have to give MLSE money for nothing right now.

The raising the cost of the tickets per game is annoying, but I have learned to accept it.

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Just to further your point. For one ticket in the south end this season I bought the following:

Season ticket: $323

15 MLS Games
1 Friendly
2 Voyageur Cup tickets

Game v Motagua - $19
CCL Group Stage (3 games) - $57

Total: $399 for 22 games.

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Originally Posted by AL-MO

I have no idea why we continue to get dinged with this charge.

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That charge is simply more money for the club.

In season one there was no account fee. Its not like they suddenly realized they had some new expense that needed to be covered with a $12 fee. It was simply added to skim a little more profit.

Ben Rycroft did a good job on the interview with Paul Bierne today on "It's Called Football". Just had a chance to listen to the interview. I wish he would have had the time to ask two more questions that Bierne did not get to address, namely will soccer fans be forced to buy hockey tickets again when they buy half packs and how can the club justify a price increase again for what might very well be four years of futility on the field. Bierne in my opinion also did not address the MLS Cup question at all.

And by the way, at gate three tomorrow before, at half time and after the game I will be taking video of anyone who wants to comment on the way the season ticket renewal campaign is being handled. If you are interested in saying a few words on video just see me at gate three or in 113.

I am the big guy in the yellow keeper jersey down in the front of 113 for those that dont know me.

Thanks

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Originally Posted by menefreghista

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Just to further your point. For one ticket in the south end this season I bought the following:

Season ticket: $323

15 MLS Games
1 Friendly
2 Voyageur Cup tickets

Game v Motagua - $19
CCL Group Stage (3 games) - $57

Total: $399 for 22 games.

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OK... so, for one south end ticket, you are paying $34 more in 2011 than you did in 2010 for the same number of games.
Sound about right?

I'd like to do the math on my section 111 tix, but I don't have the receipts.
I thought they would be in the account manager, but no.
So unless someone here has the numbers, I might have to call my rep on Monday.

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Originally Posted by Tim

When you get your MLS Cup Ticket(s). Pick up the phone and contact Brokers, they will pay you minimum face value to take those off your hands and will then in turn sell for a healthy mark up, especially if its NYRB v. LAG.

Or sell on line yourself. In some cases what you COULD get for those tickets it could significantly offset the cost of your season package. That really all depends which section you are in though.

Just my two cents.

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You're correct, althought a KC/Salt Lake final in november won't sell very well at all.

I think the problem that most have with this is that:

1) TFC management have essentially downloaded the ticket selling and distribution function to supporters.

2) As a result of #1, they have guaranteed their cash flow but also passed the risk to supporters as well. Granted we could make a profit on the tickets if it's a NY/LA final (this can be debated as well due to the November date) but in doing so need to scalp the tickets.

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

OK... so, for one south end ticket, you are paying $34 more in 2011 than you did in 2010 for the same number of games.
Sound about right?

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That's probably about right, the major difference is that there are people who could afford tickets when they were $322 - and opt not to buy the extras, or save up for the extras (given that the expense comes about 6 months later) but can't afford the $433 all up front. To a lower income person, having that $100 in thier own pocket and not MLSE's bank account could make a difference. I think that's a particularly important point given the number of student and other young supporters.

The quarterly payment plan helps, but even still the added (forced) cost makes those payments $25 (or so) more than they need to be.

Those numbers are based on the cheapest seats available.

Compare that to FC Dallas. I understand that its a different market etc. but a season ticket there in the supporters section is $110 AND they offer payment plans!

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Originally Posted by Canada72

WOW!! CONCACAF Champions League is Mickey Mouse. I know, off topic in this thread, the timing of these games should be in their own thread.

At the end of the TFC AU game we won't know if TFC are through!

CA and RSL will be in a position that a tie will get them both through!

So much wrong with this :(

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sorry but the mls is Mickey Mouse league yeah the refs are bad in both. But any league that lets there team play at a baseball stadum is Mickey Mouse and the way backham made mls & LA his bitch!!.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

OK... so, for one south end ticket, you are paying $34 more in 2011 than you did in 2010 for the same number of games.
Sound about right?

I'd like to do the math on my section 111 tix, but I don't have the receipts.
I thought they would be in the account manager, but no.
So unless someone here has the numbers, I might have to call my rep on Monday.

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111 is 500$

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Originally Posted by bgnewf

Ben Rycroft did a good job on the interview with Paul Bierne today on "It's Called Football".

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LOL. I wouldn't exactly call it good.

They didn't press him at all on the pricing.

^ What were you expecting? Maybe it was a little softball, but he's not going to burn a guest like that.

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Originally Posted by UltraSuperMegaMo

^ What were you expecting? Maybe it was a little softball, but he's not going to burn a guest like that.

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Why the increase? Asked.

Why MLS Cup included? Asked (and not answered).

How the decision was arrived at? Asked.

Does TFC have to grow profits each season? Asked and confirmed.

Perhaps he could have followed up with some additional questions like the two I mentioned earlier, such as why an increase is justified based on the product we have had on the pitch and why soccer fans are often forced by MLSE to buy hockey tickets to the Marlies.

If by softball do you guys mean why did he not get indignant with Paul then that is certainly an opinion you are entitled to. I for one don't think it would have served him well to go that route.

I know Duane and Ben personally. Calling them MLSE Yes Men? How stupid is that??? It is about as far from the reality I know as anything can be.

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

^^ This is the kind of stuff I was trying to get at with my last post.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but when I try to factor in all the TFC home games this season compared to all the games in the 2011 ST package, isn't it pretty close to the same amount of games and dollars?

The criticism seems to be about not being offered the choice of non-league games,
And not so much the actual cost of renewing.

Am I correct, or confused?

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I think part of the problem is that they keep adding more games and increasing the overall price. People bought season tickets initially based on the total overall price. Now that the total overall price has increased quite dramatically in 4 years it is causing people to think if they can still afford to buy the entire season ticket package.

The cost per game is not really relevant. You HAVE to pay for all the matches, so the bottom line is that your bottom line is being affected drastically.

I for one cannot attend every single game. This wasn't so much of a problem in the first couple of seasons because I could get rid of my tickets easily for face value........this year I had trouble giving them away for free.

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Originally Posted by nascarguy

111 is 500$

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Wait a sec... 111 was $500 for all home games this year?

But the 2011 renewal price is $479?

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

Wait a sec... 111 was $500 for all home games this year?

But the 2011 renewal price is $479?

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It's not cheaper....light greys went up either $1 or $2 per game.

^ where is nascar getting that $500 number from?

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Originally Posted by bgnewf

Ben Rycroft did a good job on the interview with Paul Bierne today on "It's Called Football". Just had a chance to listen to the interview. I wish he would have had the time to ask two more questions that Bierne did not get to address, namely will soccer fans be forced to buy hockey tickets again when they buy half packs and how can the club justify a price increase again for what might very well be four years of futility on the field. Bierne in my opinion also did not address the MLS Cup question at all.

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Sorry big guy, gotta disagree. If you're going to claim to do an interview rather than simply do promotion for the guy, then ask the hard questions. Make them answer all facets of the question rather than letting them justify their position without presenting the fan side, and no you don't need to get indignant to be able to ask those questions. That interview asked the same questions their promotion department (GolTV) would have asked, in essence putting them on par with their own employees. I am looking for an outlet that will put them on the spot and ask hard questions, about the product on the field, about the justification for any price increases and about packaging of tickets. Ben did none of that and thus, I can't call it a "good interview". I felt like I was watching E-talk and they were interviewing a movie star promoting his film.

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Originally Posted by UltraSuperMegaMo

^ What were you expecting? Maybe it was a little softball, but he's not going to burn a guest like that.

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Burn a guest?

That's what you call asking that he do more than pitch the standard response?

We basically got Anselmi part 2. In other words, they have their opening statement in defence but did not have to answer indepth questions about their rationalizations. All we got was their justifications, we got no real answers about how they respond to the fan point of view of a shit product on the field and why ANY hike was necessary after years of double-digit hiking. How another year of restructuring necessitated fans enduring another year of poor results and how can they expect fans to remain in the seats. Nobody at ICF has ever challenged them about the fact that their initial projections for TFC could never have had such great results and now that they are years ahead of business models they had, how they can continue to place the onus on the loyal fan who has stuck with this team through the worst start in MLS history. Nobody at ICF has asked them about the many games now where the stadium is not full. He didn't call Paul out when Paul claimed it was only due to lack of time to promote seats (one week I believe he claimed) but what about league games with less then full stadiums, or current CCL games that have had long lead times to sell tickets that still remain unsold. All these questions pointing to real fan disillusion and none were asked by ICF. All they did was basically ask Paul "tell us, do you believe you needed to raise ticket prices?"

"Yes"

"OK thanks for answering our hard questions".

Yeah right.

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

^ where is nascar getting that $500 number from?

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I dunno.

Whatever you paid last year in total (season tickets + the add-ons), that total for 2011 is about $20 or $40 more (I can't remember if light greys went up $1 per or $2 per). I'm basing that total on 20 games, if its 19 games then its $19 or $38 more, 21 games $21 or $42 more etc.

The major difference is that the "add-ons" aren't optional any more, so while your per-game cost has only gone up by $1 or $2 your sum total has gone up by $100 or so. And one of the "add-ons" that you're being forced to buy almost certainly won't be a TFC game.

Three things:

Just because they sell the tickets doesn't mean the people forced to buy them will show up. Empty stadium would put heat on the club and FO with the league

Most Americans don't have passports so there'll be less people planning to attend regardless of who makes it

If the tickets are sold to supporters of the finalists or others due to TFC not being there and SSH having been forced to buy them, are the SSH going to be punished if the buyers are tossed out/arrested? There's no plan for segregation as was stated earlier and clearly this isn't a case of you stupidly giving them to a mate who gets drunk and/or rowdy enough to be tossed. The front office is more or less forcing you to sell on the ticket by their actions because a large number of SSH have no interest in a TFC-less mls cup final

Quote:

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

Wait a sec... 111 was $500 for all home games this year?

But the 2011 renewal price is $479?

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my season was 360$ with tax for 2010 season for 1 ticket
2011 ticket is 491$ in 111

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bgnewf

Why the increase? Asked.

Why MLS Cup included? Asked (and not answered).

How the decision was arrived at? Asked.

Does TFC have to grow profits each season? Asked and confirmed.

Perhaps he could have followed up with some additional questions like the two I mentioned earlier, such as why an increase is justified based on the product we have had on the pitch and why soccer fans are often forced by MLSE to buy hockey tickets to the Marlies.

If by softball do you guys mean why did he not get indignant with Paul then that is certainly an opinion you are entitled to. I for one don't think it would have served him well to go that route.

I know Duane and Ben personally. Calling them MLSE Yes Men? How stupid is that??? It is about as far from the reality I know as anything can be.

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It's a no win situation for Ben on this one. It's a podcast which makes paul being on there more of a favour than if he were on the fan for example. Ben doesn't have the ability to go off on Paul like Bob Iruschi will next week. But that's not nesessarily a bad thing.

I think Paul did answer the MLS Cup question - he said that MLSE needs to make sure the building is sold out. Pretty honest way of saying that they were tring to cover their butts (I give him credit for that one).

The one that makes me laugh is "We're pricing according to supply and demand". That's just a fancy way of saying "wer're charging as much as we think the demand will buy".

I didn't think Ben asked many hard questions, but it doesn't really matter does it? The answers from MLSE always sound slightly disingenuous and that's because there is only really one answer.

Yes they've upgraded facilities, yes they've brought in a DP...bla bla bla. At the end of the day, they charge more because they think they can. And that's BS.

If people are waiting for MLSE to say "sorry, we didnt' realize we were screwing you so we're lowering prices", it's not going to happen. Their attitude is "we're charging as much as we can, you don't like it, don't renew"....which they are about to get bitten on.

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Originally Posted by nascarguy

my season was 360$ with tax for 2010 season for 1 ticket
2011 ticket is 491$ in 111

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Dude... you are forgetting to include all the other games that were not part of the original package.
How much did we pay for the CCL games?
And wasn't our friendly an extra cost as well?

I just want to find out the grand total that I paid this year for tix.
I was hoping that info would have been on the account manager page... but no.

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

Dude... you are forgetting to include all the other games that were not part of the original package.
How much did we pay for the CCL games?
And wasn't our friendly an extra cost as well?

I just want to find out the grand total that I paid this year for tix.
I was hoping that info would have been on the account manager page... but no.

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$365 for season plus $84 ($21 each for light gray)for Montagua & 3 CCL games - $449

dal524

We didn't, nor would we ever with any guest, agree to ask 'soft' questions

Roogsy

Because of some scheduling issues with Carmine, we had to have Paul on first and didn't get as long as we'd planned. I had a list of things I wanted to get asked and would have asked the appropriate follow up questions if we'd had the full time. We didn't. So, I can understand why people think I was letting him off the hook. Our record and work won't be reflected by one average interview. Sorry to hear 'you're done with ICF.'

Cheers

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Originally Posted by MG42

$365 for season plus $84 ($21 each for light gray)for Montagua & 3 CCL games - $449

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Thanks for that info dude.

So, the price of 2011 is $479...
Thus, I am paying $30 more for games that I would have bought anyway.
It backs up what folks were saying about the 1-2 dollar rise in price.

I'll will continue to hold a grudge against MLSE for not giving us the option on tickets,
But I will still renew.
I'm not prepared to give up my seats because of a $30 price hike.

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Originally Posted by flatpicker

I'm not prepared to give up my seats because of a $30 price hike.

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What?!?! You'll still be able to afford food, water, and shelter?

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Originally Posted by rocker

What?!?! You'll still be able to afford food, water, and shelter?

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Well, maybe not shelter.
But I figured I could just sleep in one of the BMO concession stands.

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Originally Posted by Roogsy

Sorry big guy, gotta disagree. If you're going to claim to do an interview rather than simply do promotion for the guy, then ask the hard questions. Make them answer all facets of the question rather than letting them justify their position without presenting the fan side, and no you don't need to get indignant to be able to ask those questions. That interview asked the same questions their promotion department (GolTV) would have asked, in essence putting them on par with their own employees. I am looking for an outlet that will put them on the spot and ask hard questions, about the product on the field, about the justification for any price increases and about packaging of tickets. Ben did none of that and thus, I can't call it a "good interview". I felt like I was watching E-talk and they were interviewing a movie star promoting his film.

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The truth is spoken.

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Originally Posted by canadian_bhoy

The one that makes me laugh is "We're pricing according to supply and demand". That's just a fancy way of saying "wer're charging as much as we think the demand will buy".

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This is the one that I'm surprised nobody has called BS on. If there is so much "demand", why were the CCL games nowhere near sold out? If there was so much demand for TFC, then it should have been a breeze to get in touch with the 14,000 waiting list (on top of the 16,000 existing seat holders) and say "hey you are so lucky! we have four more home games!". To me, looks like when the supply was available the demand wasn't there.

And I reiterate my point...the demand was created not from the product on the pitch and not by their marketing department but by the atmosphere created by the very people they are pissing off. How does this make sense?