Lets be honest here. The opening stages of the game last night was dire from both sides. It took a while for things to get going. The bigger worry for me was how we started the 2nd half. Has that pinball sequence form NYCFC ended up in our net, the game could well have evolved differently. Thankfully it didnt and we were able to get a second soon after which gave us a stranglehold on the gameQuote:
Originally Posted by OgtheDim
Exactly, agree with you... Can't rely on those two players all season to do the work of a whole team. Others (defense) need to step up a bit more to their abilities. I know it's still beginning of season. So still great teamwork altogether. Hopefully will only get better.Quote:
Originally Posted by ag futbol
But it can't be dire.Quote:
Originally Posted by General Woolfe
This is after Vanney says they spent the off season working on defence. The issue is these same issues have existed since 2016. The only season where the issue was muted was in 2017. In 2018 it was just horrible. We let in nearly as many goals in 2018 as 16/17 combined while not score more than we had in 2016. It was a horrible horrible year. This year we see the same defensive issues as in 2016 and 2018. Which year are we going to get 2016 or 2018 with the defence?
The only hope if we get 2018 is that we can also attack hard. So far that is happening.
The real test of this team is coming April 13th, April 9th to a lesser extent, but Away in Seattle that is going to be the test. The Number of goals scored, the number of goals scored against and the timing of the goals are going to be the data points that are important. First 20 minutes you have to not let goals in. First 10 minutes of the second half you can't let goals in. And if you score or are scored on you need to actually be able to defend for the 5 sometimes 10 minutes after that successfully. TFC fails in all three categories too often.
Chicago and Seattle are going to be important. If we let goals in at those key times it is going to be a short honeymoon for Pozo.
I love how a 4-0 win becomes a "Vanney out" by the usual suspects. The only way some will be convinced is if Vanney wins the MLS Cup. Oh wait...
The reason our defense is weaker than it should is due to personnel. If you look at organization, the plan Vanney has laid out is fine.
The braintrust has done the usual thing for this league and focused DP and TAM resources on offense. They need to add a TAM defender IMO.
Look at NYCFC. Their defense was considerably less organized than ours throughout the game and no one that I know of is suggesting that their coach be fired.
Greg has more wins than the previous eight coaches combined, simple as that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldtimer
i jus woke up ..did we win last night i cant tell by some of the commentsg:D
This, except that everyone at NYCFC does want Dome out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldtimer
Agreed. Can we not just enjoy a 4-0 win?!Quote:
Originally Posted by reggie
I thought many on the team played well on Friday. Those sexy triangles and interplay were delish. They looked much closer to the team of 2017 than the team of 2018. I was really impressed by DeLeon. Even the Delgado haters must be impressed.
Yes, really, the whole team played well. NYC only had like one good chance the whole game (which is fine - you can't expect a team to have 0 shots and 0 chances or else 'our defense sucks').Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMIN8R
Hes also been coaching here longer than every coach we had. He could end up coaching here as long as Arsene Wenger.Quote:
Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto
Could/should the defence be better? Hell yes. But this game was a lot less adventurous than the games against Philly and NER. Mavinga was better. Auro Jr was better. Moor looked composed. It's progress.
Bono, however... iyiyi. His distribution in the air is dire.
QFT.Quote:
Originally Posted by TFC/Everton
Can not believe what I've just seen.
https://media2.giphy.com/media/10aInegcfNMBnG/giphy.gif
Couple of concerns I noticed. Bono's distribution is getting iffy. At least two of them went straight into touch.
Mavinga looked shaky at the start but improved as the night went on.
There was one point in the second half where Oso was ripping into Morrow after a play went dead. Oso wanted a pass inside that didn't happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by ag futbol
Ya, saw that too. Oso was very frustrated that the ball didn't come his way in the run of that play. To be fair, he was unmarked and had a ton of room.Quote:
Originally Posted by magmadragon
Bono's distribution has been terrible since the season started. I wouldn't mind giving Westberg a run if he's doing well in training.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary10
https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7btT...hNlK/giphy.gif
Distribution! That's what he was trying to do! Okay.Quote:
Originally Posted by DinamoTFC
The Same defensive mistakes over and over and over no matter the personal is something to be worried about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldtimer
Three Championship Games just 1 win. 1 lost on PK due to poor decision making and preparation for a game that very likely could have gone to PKs
Champions League Final. Lost in the first 2 minutes due to a Defensive mistake that plagued the team in the same time frame all season and in 2016 and is still plaguing us.
Then lost on PKs because he didn't prepare the team for it.
The Season 8 goals against 5 of them fall under the same mistakes made last year. First 20 of the first half (most in the first 10) First 10 of the Second half and in the 5 minutes after a previous goal.
Good teams have about 35% or fewer goals that fall under that category. Bad teams have more than 35%. Right now 62% of our goals fall under that category. From a Coach that says they worked on Defence in the off season.
Off season changes. removed Hagglund replaced him with Cimian. Sideways move. Removed Irwin, Replaced him with someone downgrade. Some youth signings. No strong defensive pick ups in the second off season in a row.
We have 3 games with wins. yay I'm happy I hope we keep winning. However the three teams are not even middle table right now. They are games we should have won if we are what people here in the Cult of Vanney believe. I'm waiting to see what happens when stronger teams show up. Will it be like New York or Panama?
Right now I don't know so ya I rightfully, based on the play THIS year not 2 years ago, am concerned. I have had mods publicly accuse me of making false accusations because I said something they didn't like, I have been ridiculed by mods all because I don't like Vanney because I think we have done well 1 year in spite of him not because of him. Each year I eventually bow to the bullying by Mods and leave the boards, because public discussion isn't allowed apparently.
^ people can and do disagree on this board, but don't expect everyone to agree with you. If that's what you want you are in the wrong place.
The problem with your posts from a moderation perspective is not your point of view. It's that you attack people. For example the term "cult of Vanney" implies that people who disagree with you are unthinking followers of Vanney, just like Peoples Temple members followed Jim Jones to their deaths. Can you understand that using language like that is extremely insulting?
This board is not divided into people who think and therefore agree with you, and people who disagree with you and therefore are "cultists" who don't think.
Kaz maybe if there was a bit of nuance at all to your stance you would be taken at face value more often. But I have literally never seen you say one positive thing about Vanney, ever.
When other people criticize him for something it's easy to think they've noticed something particular they dislike because they aren't banging the same drum 24/7, and I would like to think others have thought the same of me when I've criticized some of his decisions. But by your pattern of posts it's incredibly difficult to see you as anything but a guy who will just always hate Vanney no matter what.
He was their Man of the Match.Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary10
I agree that the term "cult of Vanney" could be considered insulting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldtimer
But do you think that your own term '"Vanney out" by the usual suspects' could be considered an implication that those are unthinking haters of Vanney?
This is is only a little bit related to the above, but: I don't consider myself a member of either or any cult. I thought the last game was amazing. I do still have some concerns after the last three games (and the CCL games were also part of this season). Generally I try to avoid the high highs, and the low lows. For example, I don't think TFC was as perfect in 2017 as their record suggested; nor were they as bad in 2018 as their record suggested; nor are they as amazing in 2019 as their 3-0 record suggests. Luck & circumstances also play a big role, among other things.
However even after a great game, I think it can be very interesting and useful to discuss what didn't go well. I think TFC can & need to do better in 2019 in a couple of areas, in order to have a great season. But I do get worried about saying anything in depth after a generally great game. It seems some folks just skim the threads after a win, see a couple of posts that aren't 100% positive, and then put out the strawman argument "wow sounds like we lost based on what people are posting."
That's a good question, tbh you made me think about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Auzzy
I think what I meant by my expression "the usual suspects" is that there is a small group of people who will dislike Vanney no matter what he accomplishes. Key to this is considering that any success is for reasons other than his leadership, or even despite his leadership. I think any objective viewer of this board would agree there is such a group on this board (and even more so on Twitter).
I don't think these people are unthinking. After all, it's about interpretation of events. I do disagree with them and feel there is some bias against Vanney based on his earlier inexperience and lack of foreign experience (many would prefer that TFC would spring for an elite foreign coach).
I should note here that I was very dubious about Vanney myself for most of his first season. He was inexperienced, made some bizarre decisions at first, and didn't seem to know what he was doing. I was willing to give him some benefit of doubt because he was clearly a deep thinker, but I would have taken Kreis any day over him.
By mid 2017 there was quite a bit of evidence (for a lot of us) that he had learned a lot and was by then one of the more decent coaches in MLS. A lot of us changed our minds by then who were cool to him at first. That doesn't mean he's an excellent coach. If he was excellent he would be in a higher league, not MLS.
I would agree with the criticisms that he doesn't practice defending set pieces enough, and they don't seem to have spent enough practice on PKs. However, I'd take him over a majority of MLS coaches.
Honestly at this point I'd like to be able to mute Kaz on any Vanney related subject. The kneejerk reaction he has to anything regarding coaching is more than tiresome, it's unoriginal (except when it's bizarre - calling Ciman for Hagglund sideways and, anyway, hanging it on him in the first place when it's a GM decision - wtf).
I mean, come on, let's not rehash the loss on PKs to Seattle here. That was 3 seasons ago. This is *this* year.
Moderators are still members of the community and subject to the same rules as everyone else in terms of how we treat each other. If you feel attacked by something someone says, mod or not, or if you feel ridiculed, report the post and the other moderators can help. You are making a wide-ranging generalization about "mods" in your post, which we don't appreciate. Moderating a forum is a volunteer job and can often be a pain in the ass, to be honest. Everyone has their opinions on the job mods do and you usually can't please everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaz
We're all here to support TFC. Step back a bit, realize we're all on the same side here and don't take things said on the forum so seriously or personally. And again, if you ever feel like a post is attacking you, rather than the points you are making, then hit that report button.
They were solid defensively but the ball would die on that side moving forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMIN8R
Deleon pulled an MLS and ran the ball str8 into a player. Auro was beat 4/5 times.
That side definitely needs to improve. Delgado and DeLeon are good MLS calibre players but It needs someone a bit sharper
100%, Bono has not improved whatsoever over the years. His distribution is not at a professional's levelQuote:
Originally Posted by DinamoTFC
I actually thought this was one of Auro's much better games. He looked more solid and less panicky. Held onto the ball well and opened up for teammates and even got out of some tight spots (one of them lead directly to the first goal from our corner of the field).Quote:
Originally Posted by C.Ronaldo
As long as he keeps improving and continues to be tighter on defenders he will progress nicely.
Deleon didnt do as great attacking wise as he did in the previous two games. But his defensive tracking back is very helpful for the team (as in giving Auro support and keeping the entire midfield organized).
magnets on magnets on magnetsQuote:
Originally Posted by RichieRich
without going through all the posts has there been any reaction to Pozeulo's first game by VV and Gio? Just curious but likely they did not?