Sounders hosting Chelsea

[ThunderTundra]

http://www.soundersfc.com/News/Articles/2009/02-February/Chelsea-Announcement.aspx

I can't find it posted on here anywhere.

this is a crazy high profile friendly, They have some stand up people working in that organization, I like the way they are running things there in Seattle. I think they will be up there near us in terms of quality football clubs

[gmacpheetfc]

just beat me to it damn.


http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=9926

[flatpicker]

they got their shit in order it seems.

[Jack]

Well...we got Aston Villa here.

They're likely to finish higher than Chelsea in the standings :D

[ccopela]

they got their shit in order it seems.

Except for that whole picking the wrong J. Smith haha. Not that I'm complaining!

But seriously they do really seem to be a quality organization at this stage, which should only bode well for the health of the league.

[boban]

I think they will be up there near us in terms of quality football clubs
What does that mean? :confused:
We suck on the field and, while continually forking over the cash and selling out the place (in the process making it the envy of the league) MLSE continually brings in second rate opponents for friendlies.
If that your definition of quality club I'm speechless.

[Jack]

What does that mean? :confused:
We suck on the field and, while continually forking over the cash and selling out the place (in the process making it the envy of the league) MLSE continually brings in second rate opponents for friendlies.
If that your definition of quality club I'm speechless.

Continually? You mean during the first two years of our fledgling existence?

Second rate opponents?

A top level Premier League club? Top ten then and now top 4!

The third most decorated club in the rich football history of Argentina?

A 100 year old Mexican club steeped in tradition?

What do you want, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Inter or Juve? Do you know how much these so-called "first-tier" clubs cost to bring here? You'd have to pay $200 per ticket to make enough money at BMO Field to bring one of them here, never mind what the expensive seats would cost!

Or do you think MLSE should just fork over the cash and take the loss since we've bought all their tickets and beer for a year or two?

Sorry dude, but that sounds pretty ridiculous to me. Seattle can afford to bring in Chelsea because they have a huge stadium. I suppose if you want to watch TFC play one of those big clubs at the Skydome, it would work, but not at BMO Field and certainly not as part of our season ticket package.

I'm certainly not all about defending MLSE, but at the same time, we do need to live in the real world, not fantasy land.

[Whoop]

In the end, we make too much of these friendlies.

What do they accomplish?

Though I missed the Pachuca game and some said it was the best game at BMO last year.

[Daveisonfire]

Well...we got Aston Villa here.

They're likely to finish higher than Chelsea in the standings :D
:iamwithstupid:





:p

[Shakes McQueen]

What does that mean? :confused:
We suck on the field and, while continually forking over the cash and selling out the place (in the process making it the envy of the league) MLSE continually brings in second rate opponents for friendlies.
If that your definition of quality club I'm speechless.

You have a short memory. As Jack mentioned, we played Aston Villa (who are currently higher than Chelsea in the EPL standings).

This is just Seattle making a splash in their inaugural season, and I say good for them. A lot of people here have this innate desire to covet what other teams around the leagues have, or are getting.

- Scott

[MartinUtd]

I never rated benfica either :P

[Jack]

I never rated benfica either :P
Ah right...another one that slipped my mind there!

That only makes my point even more!

[boban]

Continually? You mean during the first two years of our fledgling existence?

Second rate opponents?

A top level Premier League club? Top ten then and now top 4!

The third most decorated club in the rich football history of Argentina?

A 100 year old Mexican club steeped in tradition?

What do you want, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Inter or Juve? Do you know how much these so-called "first-tier" clubs cost to bring here? You'd have to pay $200 per ticket to make enough money at BMO Field to bring one of them here, never mind what the expensive seats would cost!

Or do you think MLSE should just fork over the cash and take the loss since we've bought all their tickets and beer for a year or two?

Sorry dude, but that sounds pretty ridiculous to me. Seattle can afford to bring in Chelsea because they have a huge stadium. I suppose if you want to watch TFC play one of those big clubs at the Skydome, it would work, but not at BMO Field and certainly not as part of our season ticket package.

I'm certainly not all about defending MLSE, but at the same time, we do need to live in the real world, not fantasy land.
And yet other teams can bring them into their stadiums with less crowds than what we in Toronto have.
With all due respect to the Argentinian fans and Mexico's fans, those two clubs don't offer any cache or name recognition (save for their followers).
Try selling tickets to those games last year. You couldn't give them away. Again with all due respect to their fans but nobody gave a shit.
Todays world is about cache and quality of a team. And the teams MLSE brings in have none of that, at least not to the level of the 1st tier teams do. You speak of money, but save for 1 or 2 other teams in this league, most other teams (the ones losing money) bring in 1st tier teams for thier fans. MLSE just lines their pockets from TFC. MLSE can afford it. Thats the real world!!

[boban]

You have a short memory. As Jack mentioned, we played Aston Villa (who are currently higher than Chelsea in the EPL standings).

This is just Seattle making a splash in their inaugural season, and I say good for them. A lot of people here have this innate desire to covet what other teams around the leagues have, or are getting.

- Scott
No I don't have a short memory. You don't know me, are not me. So don't go assuming shit about me.
Villa was a middle pack team that year. And even today does not have the name recognition, nor the stars, that Chelsea had back then or has now.

The first post was how great MLSE is running the club over the past few seasons. I am just pointing out it ain't all that good as he thinks it is.

[Whoop]

I thought the rumour was that Rangers were coming to BMO?

[boban]

I thought the rumour was that Rangers were coming to BMO?
They were here 4 years ago.
19,000 people showed up. Over 12,000 of which were Croats.
So I guess that tells you their draw power in the city.

[Jack]

And yet other teams can bring them into their stadiums with less crowds than what we in Toronto have.
With all due respect to the Argentinian fans and Mexico's fans, those two clubs don't offer any cache or name recognition (save for their followers).
Try selling tickets to those games last year. You couldn't give them away. Again with all due respect to their fans but nobody gave a shit.
Todays world is about cache and quality of a team. And the teams MLSE brings in have none of that, at least not to the level of the 1st tier teams do. You speak of money, but save for 1 or 2 other teams in this league, most other teams (the ones losing money) bring in 1st tier teams for thier fans. MLSE just lines their pockets from TFC. MLSE can afford it. Thats the real world!!

In the real world when you bring in a team for a friendly, you need to make the money back from said friendly. They bring in those teams precisely because they're losing money and they know they can get a big payday from those teams.

If Seattle is playing in a 65k seat stadium, I'm pretty sure they can bring in enough revenue to pay Chelsea and get some money out of it and not charge their fans an arm and a leg for the game. Same with NYRB playing Barcelona and a host of other teams that brought in bigger clubs to VERY LARGE STADIUMS. They play in American football stadiums or baseball stadiums. As I said, if you want to pay $150-$600 for your seats to see those teams at BMO Field, go ahead. About the only team I'd pay that money for is Barcelona.

Benfica
Aston Villa
Independiente
Pachuca

Four very good teams.

It's not all about the big bad MLSE bogeyman.

I don't think they're angels. They're out to make money, but they're not out to specifically screw us. We got to see those four very good football teams basically for free. If you tried to sell your free tickets to make a buck off of those games, that's what would leave me speechless.

Was Barcelona included in the Red Bulls season ticket package? Was Chelsea in Seattle's? I'm willing to be that they weren't.

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

I thought the rumour was that Rangers were coming to BMO?

That was the rumour on the usector board. Rangers would be a nice fit with Edu and all. It’s nice to see Seattle getting such a high profile game, but I’m not burning with envy

[boban]

In the real world when you bring in a team for a friendly, you need to make the money back from said friendly. They bring in those teams precisely because they're losing money and they know they can get a big payday from those teams.

If Seattle is playing in a 65k seat stadium, I'm pretty sure they can bring in enough revenue to pay Chelsea and get some money out of it and not charge their fans an arm and a leg for the game. Same with NYRB playing Barcelona and a host of other teams that brought in bigger clubs to VERY LARGE STADIUMS. They play in American football stadiums or baseball stadiums. As I said, if you want to pay $150-$600 for your seats to see those teams at BMO Field, go ahead. About the only team I'd pay that money for is Barcelona.

Benfica
Aston Villa
Independiente
Pachuca

Four very good teams.

It's not all about the big bad MLSE bogeyman.

I don't think they're angels. They're out to make money, but they're not out to specifically screw us. We got to see those four very good football teams basically for free. If you tried to sell your free tickets to make a buck off of those games, that's what would leave me speechless.

Was Barcelona included in the Red Bulls season ticket package? Was Chelsea in Seattle's? I'm willing to be that they weren't.
Don't assume things you don't know nothing of. You made that mistake before already ;)

Yes they are good teams. But not 1st tier teams. Not saying all should be, but also not saying we shouldn't have any.

MLSE is not the bogey man. But they certainly are not the man to make a nice gesture either. It would be nice if they could do just 1 game.
And you're right, clubs look to make money back from these friendlies. There is a lot more MLSE can do to make that money back when they do have these friendlies. They are dropping the ball on this.

[Brooker]

hah.... having a Chelsea or Barcelona come to BMO Field to play is the only ridiculous thing i see in here. it's simply not big enough. bringing in teams like Benfica, the Villians, Pachuca, Independiente is more realistic.

let Chelsea go play half assed in some ugly Seattle football stadium.

you'd have to sell your car to get a ticket for a Chelsea Toronto game. sure as hell arent going to include it in seasons.

[Shakes McQueen]

Yes they are good teams. But not 1st tier teams. Not saying all should be, but also not saying we shouldn't have any.

This is an entirely subjective opinion, dependent upon your personal interpretation of what "1st tier" means. Yes, they don't have the recognizeable stars that Chelsea has, but what are you looking for - a good match, or a football-equivalent of the Oscars?

I'd love to see us play teams like Barcelona, but it just isn't financially viable in our little stadium. Seattle and New York both have/had NFL stadiums to work with.


It would be nice if they could do just 1 game.

Sure, it'd be nice. But businessmen have to think of business first, not blowing millions on an unnecessary friendly, because it'd be nice. I also have no doubt that Seattle wouldn't be hosting Chelsea either, if they could only fit 20,000 in their house.


And you're right, clubs look to make money back from these friendlies. There is a lot more MLSE can do to make that money back when they do have these friendlies.

Like what? The only option that immediately comes to mind, is charging out the nose for tickets, which isn't fun for anyone.

Independiente was a good match. So was Aston Villa. I'm not really interested in the pure vanity of bringing in a club like Chelsea. I also highly doubt they would be willing to play on the turf in the first place.

And one more thing:


No I don't have a short memory. You don't know me, are not me. So don't go assuming shit about me.

Don't be so sensitive. It was a rhetorical device, not a medical observation.

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

hah.... having a Chelsea or Barcelona come to BMO Field to play is the only ridiculous thing i see in here. it's simply not big enough. bringing in teams like Benfica, the Villians, Pachuca, Independiente is more realistic.

let Chelsea go play half assed in some ugly Seattle football stadium.

Not only that, but bringing in teams like Independiente made for a far more entertaining match.

The only reason Seattle are bringing Chelsea in, is for the spectacle of it all. Same with Barcelona in New York. It won't be an entertaining game, it'll be a massacre, much like Barca vs. Energy Drinks was. If anything, that game was just sort of embarrassing for New York.

You can fault MLSE for lots of things, but not wanting to waste millions on useless vanity is not one of them.

- Scott

[boban]

hah.... having a Chelsea or Barcelona come to BMO Field to play is the only ridiculous thing i see in here. it's simply not big enough. bringing in teams like Benfica, the Villians, Pachuca, Independiente is more realistic.
I use to think the same thing.
But when you see other teams in the league pulling it off with stadiums about the NSS size it leaves you scratching your head.

[Brooker]

im lost.... are u saying Seattle will only draw 20k like we would?

cuz thats all we'd get.

[boban]

Like what? The only option that immediately comes to mind, is charging out the nose for tickets, which isn't fun for anyone. - Scott
I was going to respond to each of your points individually.
But then this line caught my eye and I realized there would be no point.

[boban]

im lost.... are u saying Seattle will only draw 20k like we would?
No, I am saying RSL has REAL Madrid in Rinto Stadium, and there were others in previous years. Too late in the night to recall specifically.

[Shakes McQueen]

I use to think the same thing.
But when you see other teams in the league pulling it off with stadiums about the NSS size it leaves you scratching your head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qwest_Field <--- Capacity: 67,000
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giants_stadium <--- Capacity: 78,741

And now, drumroll please...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMO_Field <--- Capacity: 21,978

- Scott

[boban]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qwest_Field <--- Capacity: 67,000
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giants_stadium <--- Capacity: 78,741

And now, drumroll please...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMO_Field <--- Capacity: 21,978

- Scott
Wake up Scott.

[Brooker]

maybe if we got 22 more seats... bump us up to 22k haha

[Shakes McQueen]

No, I am saying RSL has REAL Madrid in Rinto Stadium, and there were others in previous years. Too late in the night to recall specifically.

The situation between RSL and Madrid is a different kettle of fish altogether. They have a 10 year business agreement, which includes the building of a youth academy, letting them practice at RM's practice facility in Spain, etc. etc. etc.

It is also rumoured to have cost RSL's owner, SCP Worldwide, a small fortune.

Wake up boban.

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

I was going to respond to each of your points individually.
But then this line caught my eye and I realized there would be no point.

How convenient.

- Scott

[boban]

maybe if we got 22 more seats... bump us up to 22k haha
Yeah I don't know where those numbers come from.
Never was more than 20,000 and change for TFC games.
It always was listed as a 20,500 capacity stadium.

[boban]

The situation between RSL and Madrid is a different kettle of fish altogether. They have a 10 year business agreement, which includes the building of a youth academy, letting them practice at RM's practice facility in Spain, etc. etc. etc.

It is also rumoured to have cost RSL's owner, SCP Worldwide, a small fortune.

- Scott
Thank you Scott. Just reinforced my point.

[Shakes McQueen]

Yeah I don't know where those numbers come from.
Never was more than 20,000 and change for TFC games.
It always was listed as a 20,500 capacity stadium.

My guess is that 21,978 includes whatever the legal capacity of the beer garden is. That 21,978 figure was also the official attendance at the Canada/Jamaica WCQ game.


- Scott

[Brooker]

Thank you Scott. Just reinforced my point.

hmmm but you make it sound too easy for TFC to do that. like we could go out tommarow knocking on doors and we'd be welcomed with open arms.

[boban]

My guess is that 21,978 includes whatever the legal capacity of the beer garden is. That 21,978 figure was also the official attendance at the Canada/Jamaica WCQ game.
Yeah I know they get that figure from that game. But that doesn't mean the capacity is actually that number. Over capacity happens all the time.
Its true number is under 21,000.

[Brooker]

My guess is that 21,978 includes whatever the legal capacity of the beer garden is. That 21,978 figure was also the official attendance at the Canada/Jamaica WCQ game.


- Scott

i can never tell with BMO... actual figures and all.

beer garden people really confuses the seating. overcrowded north and south section's n all.

[Shakes McQueen]

Thank you Scott. Just reinforced my point.

What point is that, though? We already have a strong youth academy, and a great training facility (that is actually the envy of the league, since we share it with the Leafs and Raptors, I believe)

RSL's owner is paying through the nose to attract more people to RSL's games, through their partnership with Madrid. Toronto has no need for that.

You want to do all of this, in order to get a Champion's League club to play our little stadium once? And you're the one being relentlessly condescending with me?

These are nice wish list items, but they aren't financially prudent in the slightest.

- Scott

[boban]

hmmm but you make it sound too easy for TFC to do that. like we could go out tommarow knocking on doors and we'd be welcomed with open arms.
Can't let someone let you in their house without knocking.
But that's another story.
Fact is TFC is not a great club in this league, unlike the first poster's argument who thinks they are.

[Shakes McQueen]

hmmm but you make it sound too easy for TFC to do that. like we could go out tommarow knocking on doors and we'd be welcomed with open arms.

Exactly. RSL no doubt had to wave an unholy sum of money in the face of RM's board, before they got that deal.

- Scott

[Brooker]

but it would be worth all the millions of wasted money to get to see a Chelsea b team and oodles of part time supporters they'd attract. i can just imagine the conversations at half time. when does the 2nd period start? whats going on?!?

[Shakes McQueen]

Fact is TFC is not a great club in this league, unlike the first poster's argument who thinks they are.

But if they wasted the money it would take to get Chelsea's reserves to come and play here, they would be?

We have a soccer-specific stadium right in the heart of Toronto, a good youth academy, a good training facility, a great fanbase, the strongest attendance in the league, stable ownership, and great public transportation to and from the stadium.

We are, in my opinion, one of the model citizens for a "great club" in this league. Flashy transfers (Beckham), and friendlies (Chelsea) are just periphery fluff, that have no bearing on how good of a club we are.

- Scott

[boban]

What point is that, though? We already have a strong youth academy, and a great training facility (that is actually the envy of the league, since we share it with the Leafs and Raptors, I believe)

RSL's owner is paying through the nose to attract more people to RSL's games, through their partnership with Madrid. Toronto has no need for that.

You want to do all of this, in order to get a Champion's League club to play our little stadium once? And you're the one being relentlessly condescending with me?

These are nice wish list items, but they aren't financially prudent in the slightest.
All I am saying people are putting ideas together to make shit happen.
To me MLSE is taking the easy road.
As far as RSL's owner losing money. Not my problem if MLSE does that.
I'm more concerned with them taking care of its fans.

[boban]

But if they wasted the money it would take to get Chelsea's reserves to come and play here, they would be?

We have a soccer-specific stadium right in the heart of Toronto, a good youth academy, a good training facility, a great fanbase, the strongest attendance in the league, stable ownership, and great public transportation to and from the stadium.

We are, in my opinion, one of the model citizens for a "great club" in this league. Flashy transfers (Beckham), and friendlies (Chelsea) are just periphery fluff, that have no bearing on how good of a club we are.
Youth academy just started last year. Jumping the gun are we?
And the rest you speak of, MLSE/TFC (take your pick) pretty much had zero to do with.
Oh btw, we suck on the most important factor on what truly makes a club great - on the field.

[Shakes McQueen]

Youth academy just started last year. Jumping the gun are we?

The club has been around for two seasons, and had an academy for one of them. Everything I've ever seen about the academy, has talked about what a well-run, top-noth organization it is.

Our training facility has the best conditioning coach in the league running it, in Paul Winsper.


And the rest you speak of, MLSE/TFC (take your pick) pretty much had zero to do with.

MLSE made the deal with the city to get that land. MLSE fronted a large percentage of the money to build the stadium. MLSE pays for the academy, and the training facility. MLSE fronted the expansion fee and operating costs to create the club around which the TFC fans have coalesced. What are you talking about?


Oh btw, we suck on the most important factor on what truly makes a club great - on the field.

We have completed two seasons, and look to be significantly stronger this season, which has left most people here very optimistic about our hopes. Are you giambac in disguise or something? Why are you so down on all of this?

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

As far as RSL's owner losing money. Not my problem if MLSE does that.
I'm more concerned with them taking care of its fans.

In other words, you want them to waste whatever money is necessary in coddling the fans (in this case, you), and their every whim and desire.

They gave us a club, a stadium to cheer in (in a great location), and some great friendly opponents so far. They have done a decent job of "taking care of us".

- Scott

[boban]

The club has been around for two seasons, and had an academy for one of them. Everything I've ever seen about the academy, has talked about what a well-run, top-noth organization it is.

Our training facility has the best conditioning coach in the league running it, in Paul Winsper.
You do realize this all means fuck all right?




MLSE made the deal with the city to get that land. MLSE fronted a large percentage of the money to build the stadium. MLSE pays for the academy, and the training facility. MLSE fronted the expansion fee and operating costs to create the club around which the TFC fans have coalesced. What are you talking about?
It's actually you with the short memory. The stadium was going to be built where the city said/wanted it. MLSE was just the whore chasing the money. Had no input into location. MLSE didn't pay more than 16% of construction costs. Even less if you factor in land value.
Other owners front expansion fees also, as well as operating costs. That doesn't make them defacto great clubs.
BTW, where is this training facility?? :confused:



We have completed two seasons, and look to be significantly stronger this season, which has left most people here very optimistic about our hopes. Are you giambac in disguise or something? Why are you so down on all of this?
Nope. Just realistic. I don't have my head stuck up my ass thats for sure.
I'm not down at all. Not in the least. But also not glorifying this franshise as you seem to be. They haven't accomplished anything to warrant that.
I am symply stating TFC is not a great club now.

[boban]

In other words, you want them to waste whatever money is necessary in coddling the fans (in this case, you), and their every whim and desire.
Don't be putting words into my mouth. Read form my early posts. Never did I say 'every whim...'. One is not every?


They gave...a stadium to cheer in (in a great location), and some great friendly opponents so far. They have done a decent job of "taking care of us".
You and I gave the stadium more than they.
Location, as stated earlier, was government, not MLSE.
Great friendlies .. meh .. Good .. yes.

[Shakes McQueen]

You do realize this all means fuck all right?

Having a good youth and training infrastructure means nothing? Do go on.


It's actually you with the short memory. The stadium was going to be built where the city said/wanted it. MLSE was just the whore chasing the money. Had no input into location. MLSE didn't pay more than 16% of construction costs. Even less if you factor in land value.
Other owners front expansion fees also, as well as operating costs. That doesn't make them defacto great clubs. BTW, where is this training facility?? :confused:

MLSE paid $8 million dollars towards construction, and another $10 million towards securing the naming rights. They also paid the (I believe) $20 million dollar expansion fee. My point was that they have spent plenty of money on giving us a club, and a stadium. They took a risk, on an unproven league, and gave us a club.

The current training facility, I believe, is located in the ACC (and is shared with the Raptors and Leafs), with a new separate training facility just for the club being planned right now.


Nope. Just realistic. I don't have my head stuck up my ass thats for sure.
I'm not down at all. Not in the least. But also not glorifying this franshise as you seem to be. They haven't accomplished anything to warrant that.
I am symply stating TFC is not a great club now.

I'm not glorifying them at all. I laid out why, in terms of infrastructure and support, this club is a great club by MLS standards. If your only metric for greatness is how much money they waste on bringing in clubs for friendlies, and whether they are the MLS Cup champions in any given season, then so be it.

- Scott

[canadian_bhoy]

Chelsea? Fuuuuuuu***k off Chelsea FC, you ain't got no history.


MLSE IS TRYING TO SCREW US AGAIN! FIRE MO! NUKE BMO!!!!! :p

[Mark in Ottawa]

Fact is TFC is not a great club in this league, unlike the first poster's argument who thinks they are.

TFC not a great club in this league? Hmmm...
If not TFC then who is?

It is an interesting question.
What constitutes "a great club"?

Respect for the fans?
Good supporters groups?
Value for money for the fans?
Winning consistently?
Community Support by the club?

Hmmm... yes a very interesting question.

[Jack]

Don't assume things you don't know nothing of. You made that mistake before already ;)
Sorry, but what are you talking about? Where am I assuming things that I "don't know nothing of". Are you confusing me with someone else?

I said "willing to bet" which means I wasn't sure but I have a strong theory. That's different than assuming ;)


Yes they are good teams. But not 1st tier teams. Not saying all should be, but also not saying we shouldn't have any.
There you go with "first tier" again. They are all top teams from top-level leagues around the world. There are more than three "first-tier" leagues in the world. You have euro tunnel vision.


MLSE is not the bogey man. But they certainly are not the man to make a nice gesture either. It would be nice if they could do just 1 game.
And you're right, clubs look to make money back from these friendlies. There is a lot more MLSE can do to make that money back when they do have these friendlies. They are dropping the ball on this.

It would be nice, but "dropping the ball"? What would be the "lot more" they could do to make the money back from these friendlies? You do realize that the prime source of revenue from a friendly is still ticket sales, right?

[Shakes McQueen]

It would be nice, but "dropping the ball"? What would be the "lot more" they could do to make the money back from these friendlies? You do realize that the prime source of revenue from a friendly is still ticket sales, right?

Maybe he wants them to sell Shamwow's outside BMO.

- Scott

[Lucky Strike]

What's with all the self-deprecating talk around here? Seattle got a big club in Chelsea to come and good for them; I'm happy for them. In fact, I plan to watch the game myself.

As for our international friendlies, I'm actually opposed to them: we have enough fixtures already with a pretty slim squad. But that being said, while our opponents didn't have the pedigree and "ooh" factor that Chelsea has, they were far, far from the Kettering Town and Farsley Celtic AFCs of the world.

[brad]

let Chelsea go play half assed in some ugly Seattle football stadium.


I saw Manchester United - Celtic in that stadium, and I can assure you it is anything but a half assed ugly stadium. Great place to watch a football match (granted, they laid real turf for that match).

[djking2]

The only way I'd be happy to see Chelsea or Man U or Inter or Barca or even Bayern play is if the deal calls for them to leave a quality CB behinds when they leave:)

[jwfm1985]

I really don't understand where you are coming from at all Boban. We have played against some fantatastic teams, and for the most part, they have been entertaining matches. Why on earth would you want to see our boys embarassed in a 5-0 beating (See RBNY vs Barcelona) at the hands of a team like Chelsea or Real Madrid?

We should be playing some more top Mexican teams like Pachuca. They are becoming more and more relevant with the growth to TFC (hopefully) with the growth of the champions league....

[boban]

Having a good youth and training infrastructure means nothing? Do go on.
You are correct. It means nothing. That does not make any academy great.
It's nice to have, and could attract some kid, but in terms of actual success its fuck all. What matter is what is produced. And right now its waaaayyyyyyy to early to declare anything about the academy.




MLSE paid $8 million dollars towards construction, and another $10 million towards securing the naming rights. They also paid the (I believe) $20 million dollar expansion fee. My point was that they have spent plenty of money on giving us a club, and a stadium. They took a risk, on an unproven league, and gave us a club.
Expansion was $10 million and the $10 million naming rights is paid back to them. Therefore there actual/final cost in the stadium is $8 million. You said they paid a great chunk. 8 million out a total of ~ 63 million is not even close to a great chunk.
As far as taking a risk, other clubs/ owners are doing the same. Does that make the club great and/or greatly run?



The current training facility, I believe, is located in the ACC (and is shared with the Raptors and Leafs), with a new separate training facility just for the club being planned right now.
Ok so its basically a weight room for the most part.
More important to have proper fields and facilities around that then in the middle of some concrete jungle.




I'm not glorifying them at all. I laid out why, in terms of infrastructure and support, this club is a great club by MLS standards. If your only metric for greatness is how much money they waste on bringing in clubs for friendlies, and whether they are the MLS Cup champions in any given season, then so be it.
Read my very first post Scott. I notice you like to put words into my mouth. Before my comment about int. friendlies I stated the club on the pitch sucks balls. Which, as I also stated in a previous post, is a far greater measure on a clubs success factor.
Your only point I notice is since they came up with some cash the club therefore is run great. By that metric we have 15 greatly run clubs in MLS.

[boban]

Are you confusing me with someone else?
No confusion at all.




There you go with "first tier" again. They are all top teams from top-level leagues around the world. There are more than three "first-tier" leagues in the world. You have euro tunnel vision.
You are the one who first mentioned 1st tier. 'Euro tunnel vision' .. assuming again Jack? ;)

[Whoop]

International friendly = overrated

[boban]

In fact, I plan to watch the game myself.
And how do plan to do that?

[Jack]

No confusion at all.




You are the one who first mentioned 1st tier. 'Euro tunnel vision' .. assuming again Jack? ;)


You called the teams we've had in for friendlies "second rate", which would seem to imply that there's a "first rate" category of team. When you post something, people will interpret what you actually type out on the screen. Assumptions will happen because what you mean and feel isn't always what actually spews out of your keyboard. If you can't get over that, then maybe you should quit the internet.

And the euro tunnel vision comment was a conclusion I drew based on your disparaging remarks made about the teams that came here. Perhaps I was wrong. You never have stated what teams you would expect to see here. What teams would you consider to be "1st tier"?

[Lucky Strike]

And how do plan to do that?

Television, of course (or an Internet stream thereof). The article at the beginning of the thread stated it would be shown on ESPN2.

[boban]

You called the teams we've had in for friendlies "second rate", which would seem to imply that there's a "first rate" category of team. When you post something, people will interpret what you actually type out on the screen. Assumptions will happen because what you mean and feel isn't always what actually spews out of your keyboard. If you can't get over that, then maybe you should quit the internet.
Testy Jack? Maybe we need a time out? ;)


And the euro tunnel vision comment was a conclusion I drew based on your disparaging remarks made about the teams that came here. Perhaps I was wrong. You never have stated what teams you would expect to see here. What teams would you consider to be "1st tier"?
River Plate, Boca, Flamingo, and a host of Euro teams.
Look, I didn't say the teams were horrible or bad. But to say MLSE is doing a first rate job on them is stretching it is all I am saying.

[Jack]

Testy Jack? Maybe we need a time out? ;)

River Plate, Boca, Flamingo, and a host of Euro teams.
Look, I didn't say the teams were horrible or bad. But to say MLSE is doing a first rate job on them is stretching it is all I am saying.

I'd take one of those teams you listed, but I don't agree that the teams we've had in are "second rate".

And I'm not testy at all, just explaining to you the mechanism of this medium. :noidea:

You tend to post aggressively and make abrupt and personal comments.

[Tintin]

I would like something different like a team from the Eredivisie, League 1 from France or the Bundesliga but it probably will not happen since it does not feflect our cultural Moasaique. So than I would like a team from Brazil.

[boban]

I'd take one of those teams you listed, but I don't agree that the teams we've had in are "second rate".

And I'm not testy at all, just explaining to you the mechanism of this medium. :noidea:

You tend to post aggressively and make abrupt and personal comments.
Or people read into them too much and don't take them with a grain of salt.
Of course they are abrupt. I'm not about to write a novel on here for FFS.

[Shakes McQueen]

I'd take one of those teams you listed, but I don't agree that the teams we've had in are "second rate".

And I'm not testy at all, just explaining to you the mechanism of this medium. :noidea:

You tend to post aggressively and make abrupt and personal comments.

Indeed, and I'm done banging my head against this particular wall.

- Scott

[boban]

I would like something different like a team from the Eredivisie, League 1 from France or the Bundesliga but it probably will not happen since it does not feflect our cultural Moasaique. So than I would like a team from Brazil.
I don't know for the life of me how you can make a comment like that.

[Jack]

[quote=Jack;378842]I'd take one of those teams you listed, but I don't agree that the teams we've had in are "second rate".

And I'm not testy at all, just explaining to you the mechanism of this medium. :noidea:

You tend to post aggressively and make abrupt and personal comments./quote]
Or people read into them too much and don't take them with a grain of salt.
Of course they are abrupt. I'm not about to write a novel on here for FFS.
Could be...

[boban]

Indeed, and I'm done banging my head against this particular wall.
Don't sweat it. Not everyone has a business acumen.

[Shakes McQueen]

Don't sweat it. Not everyone has a business acumen.

Indeed. I clearly haven't learned the "losing millions on a friendly = win" business equation yet.

- Scott

[boban]

Indeed. I clearly haven't learned the "losing millions on a friendly = win" business equation yet.
Neither do I.
See you only want to believe your own shit and refuse to listen to reason, and new ways of thinking.
You have your conclusions and stuck in your own paradigm.

[jwfm1985]

^ "New ways of thinking"... oh boy, I am glad you are not running the show at MLSE

[Beach_Red]

Neither do I.
See you only want to believe your own shit and refuse to listen to reason, and new ways of thinking.
You have your conclusions and stuck in your own paradigm.

It's just too new.

Certainly we can agree that right now soccer is not top priority for MLSE. It will be someday (or close to it), but not today.

[jloome]

Don't sweat it. Not everyone has a business acumen.

Clearly. Some of them are deluded enough to think Toronto has the same TV, advertising and gate drawing power as major U.S. cities with much larger stadiums.

It's not just about gate.

[ExiledRed]

If anybody is really concerned that our international friendly is not going to be against one of the top 10 richest teams in the world, then they've lost the plot.

Who gives a shit if Seattle want to go balls out playing a team that will rip them 11 new arseholes in the midseason? let them, I hope Seattle play TFC the next weekend.

[Roogsy]

If anybody is really concerned that our international friendly is not going to be against one of the top 10 richest teams in the world, then they've lost the plot.

Who gives a shit if Seattle want to go balls out playing a team that will rip them 11 new arseholes in the midseason? let them, I hope Seattle play TFC the next weekend.

:lol:

QFT!!!

[djking2]

Inter playing in Edmonton, who'd a thought

[Marc"2L"]

Boban if you've ever bitched about stadium expansion or installing grass or a DP I suggest you shut the hell up about the quality of friendly opponents we've brought in.

[Marc"2L"]

If anybody is really concerned that our international friendly is not going to be against one of the top 10 richest teams in the world, then they've lost the plot.


QTF x2

[jloome]

Inter playing in Edmonton, who'd a thought

Edmonton has hosted many international friendlies over the years:; Roma, Benfica, Inter....it's Commonwealth's 63,000 seats and good walkup that has kept them coming back.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Neither do I.
See you only want to believe your own shit and refuse to listen to reason, and new ways of thinking.
You have your conclusions and stuck in your own paradigm.


HAHHAHAAHA Thank god you are not running the show or else we would all be doomed!!...:lol::lol::lol:

[Shakes McQueen]

Clearly. Some of them are deluded enough to think Toronto has the same TV, advertising and gate drawing power as major U.S. cities with much larger stadiums.

It's not just about gate.

:D

- Scott

[Azerban]

Neither do I.
See you only want to believe your own shit and refuse to listen to reason, and new ways of thinking.
You have your conclusions and stuck in your own paradigm.

you're a baby who is rolling around on the ground after being told he can only have a single gi joe and not the super deluxe war room with missiles that really fire

shove that up your paradigm

[DRock]

Sooo, i hate to be off topic, but this is about Chelsea, does anyone know if the Champions League game with Juve is being broadcasted? I can't seem to find it anywhere

[james]

Boban guy seems like he only wants to see the top richest teams in the world play at BMO field or else he is not happy. Yet if TFC was in say England we probably would be in like the 4th division or as he says it "tier 2".

[james]

and friendlies in the middle of a busy regular season are bad anyways. Just makes are players at risk of getting hurt for a meanningless game. Also alot of big clubs rest there best players in friendlies as well. Its a waste of money i think considerring the tickets are usualy very high/ Also Chelsea are probably just gonna kill Seattle just like Barcelona beat Red Bulls what 6-2!

[Azerban]

Boban guy seems like he only wants to see the top richest teams in the world play at BMO field or else he is not happy. Yet if TFC was in say England we probably would be in like the 4th division or as he says it "tier 2".

Aston Villa is tier 2. We'd be tier 6.

[Rochdale]

The two meaningless friendlies last year paid off my season tickets for this year.

[james]

Aston Villa is tier 2. We'd be tier 6.


true :p
You get some TFC fans saying awww man we only get to play shitty 2nd rate Aston Villa or Benifica or Independiente....now imagine what the fans of the other clubs would be saying? They Probably be saying somethin like who the FUCK is TFC? ive never herd of them. We support a team that has won many major Championships and are in top flight divisions in are countries and we gotta go play some team called Toronto FC...what the fuck!! haha



I hate when you get people who only wanna see the few 1% of soccer clubs that are billionair giants. Out of the other 99% of pro soccer clubs in the world there is many other good teams to see.

[boban]

true :p
You get some TFC fans saying awww man we only get to play shitty 2nd rate Aston Villa or Benifica or Independiente....now imagine what the fans of the other clubs would be saying? They Probably be saying somethin like who the FUCK is TFC? ive never herd of them. We support a team that has won many major Championships and are in top flight divisions in are countries and we gotta go play some team called Toronto FC...what the fuck!! haha



I hate when you get people who only wanna see the few 1% of soccer clubs that are billionair giants. Out of the other 99% of pro soccer clubs in the world there is many other good teams to see.
You and your lot read into things too much and only want to hear comments that suit your viewpoint. God forbid if someone deviates from that as you shout them down.
This board has become too predictable.

[Jack]

You and your lot read into things too much and only want to hear comments that suit your viewpoint. God forbid if someone deviates from that as you shout them down.
This board has become too predictable.
Wow...now we get a sweeping generalization!

[boban]

Wow...now we get a sweeping generalization!
Well Jack what are you reading. Everyone is putting words into my mouth, drawing conclusions about nothing close to what I think.
And you continue to slag yourself. I said a while ago, this is more of a boys club of the few than any real exchange of ideas or discussion.

[Jack]

Well Jack what are you reading. Everyone is putting words into my mouth, drawing conclusions about nothing close to what I think.
And you continue to slag yourself. I said a while ago, this is more of a boys club of the few than any real exchange of ideas or discussion.
Where am I slagging myself?

I don't agree with your point. That's about it.

You are continuing to argue your point, despite the fact that I don't agree with you. That's your prerogative, but I'm not interested in discussing it further with you because it's obvious we don't see eye to eye on this issue and I see no point in continuing the discussion.

But you continue to look for more points and, frankly, it seems to me that you are being argumentative. If people are drawing conclusions about what you think, then set the record straight.

[Azerban]

boban you've posted nothing close to a coherent point stop complaining that no one gives a shit about your crap reasoning

[boban]

Where am I slagging myself?

I don't agree with your point. That's about it.

You are continuing to argue your point, despite the fact that I don't agree with you. That's your prerogative, but I'm not interested in discussing it further with you because it's obvious we don't see eye to eye on this issue and I see no point in continuing the discussion.

But you continue to look for more points and, frankly, it seems to me that you are being argumentative. If people are drawing conclusions about what you think, then set the record straight.
Your not slagging yourself. I meant me.
I don't care if you agree with me or not, I'll respect your difference of opinion. However, there posters who feel that I think the friendlies were horrible and useless and that I ONLY want to see the big 10-15 Euro clubs here. That is simply untrue. All I am saying improvements on that front can be made. I have said that from the outset. And given the success of this club, MLSE could and should figure out a way to bring in 1, that's 1 for you who may have missed that, big Euro club in 3 seasons, not 6 (2 per season).
But that is only 1 aspect of where MLSE could improve, relative to other MLS clubs, yet everyone seems to focus only in on this friendly point.


boban you've posted nothing close to a coherent point stop complaining that no one gives a shit about your crap reasoning
Exhibit A Jack. This guy has no clue what my point is or my contention yet he finds it necesaary to chirp in.

[Jack]

Your not slagging yourself. I meant me.
I don't care if you agree with me or not, I'll respect your difference of opinion. However, there posters who feel that I think the friendlies were horrible and useless and that I ONLY want to see the big 10-15 Euro clubs here. That is simply untrue. All I am saying improvements on that front can be made. I have said that from the outset. And given the success of this club, MLSE could and should figure out a way to bring in 1, that's 1 for you who may have missed that, big Euro club in 3 seasons, not 6 (2 per season).
But that is only 1 aspect of where MLSE could improve, relative to other MLS clubs, yet everyone seems to focus only in on this friendly point.


Exhibit A Jack. This guy has no clue what my point is or my contention yet he finds it necesaary to chirp in.

Well, one could argue that Benfica comes close to having the pedigree you are looking for, but I see what you mean. It's not that big of an issue for me.

As for whether Azerban wants to chirp you or not, what has that got to do with this particular message board? That kind of stuff happens on every message board I've been on.

[BC101]

Continually? You mean during the first two years of our fledgling existence?

Second rate opponents?

A top level Premier League club? Top ten then and now top 4!

The third most decorated club in the rich football history of Argentina?

A 100 year old Mexican club steeped in tradition?

What do you want, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Inter or Juve? Do you know how much these so-called "first-tier" clubs cost to bring here? You'd have to pay $200 per ticket to make enough money at BMO Field to bring one of them here, never mind what the expensive seats would cost!

Or do you think MLSE should just fork over the cash and take the loss since we've bought all their tickets and beer for a year or two?

Sorry dude, but that sounds pretty ridiculous to me. Seattle can afford to bring in Chelsea because they have a huge stadium. I suppose if you want to watch TFC play one of those big clubs at the Skydome, it would work, but not at BMO Field and certainly not as part of our season ticket package.

I'm certainly not all about defending MLSE, but at the same time, we do need to live in the real world, not fantasy land.

Benfica was nothing to sneeze at too. They knocked both us and Liverpool outta the CL once in recent years... I love these guys expectations.

PS alot of the kids we saw that summer night at BMO are now starting players for Villa.

[boban]

... I love these guys expectations.
Damn with people wanting to push the envelope eh?

[Beach_Red]

But that is only 1 aspect of where MLSE could improve, relative to other MLS clubs, yet everyone seems to focus only in on this friendly point.


I have no interest in friendlies, no matter who the opponent is.

What are some of the other ways MLSE culd improve relative to other teams?

[BC101]

Damn with people wanting to push the envelope eh?
Correct... BTW they also have real grass over there. Teams would prefer to play on it that turf.. Not just that but Chelsea's been out there before for the whatever it was called cup a few years ago along with Real madrid and celtic and even United... Iam sure deals were made back then for their return. Theres more factors here than just "Seattle got Chelsea"

[Azerban]

Exhibit A Jack. This guy has no clue what my point is or my contention yet he finds it necesaary to chirp in.

it's not a very long thread

you want mlse to pay for these elusive teams that are better than benfica/pachuca/aston villa yet not necessarily one of the top 10 teams in the world (yet you do think that we should have one of these top teams over), whatever these teams are, to come play us friendlies out of their own pocket, and recoup the costs in some magical way that you didn't really expound on because there's really no way to have a barcelona in bmo without charging $150 a head for it

furthermore, you feel entitled to this because you've shown up for an entire two years maybe at most

this is your arguement

i wonder how often Racing Genk have Real Madrid or Inter over to play a friendly, much less a two year old team in some other middling league that hasn't accomplished a thing ever

[james]

Your not slagging yourself. I meant me.
I don't care if you agree with me or not, I'll respect your difference of opinion. However, there posters who feel that I think the friendlies were horrible and useless and that I ONLY want to see the big 10-15 Euro clubs here. That is simply untrue. All I am saying improvements on that front can be made. I have said that from the outset. And given the success of this club, MLSE could and should figure out a way to bring in 1, that's 1 for you who may have missed that, big Euro club in 3 seasons, not 6 (2 per season).
But that is only 1 aspect of where MLSE could improve, relative to other MLS clubs, yet everyone seems to focus only in on this friendly point.


Exhibit A Jack. This guy has no clue what my point is or my contention yet he finds it necesaary to chirp in.

see when you say it like that i can see your point. When you come out just saying every team we have seen play at BMO field is a "tier 2" club and we need a team like Chelsea here and blah blah blah it makes you sound like you think every club besides the few giants are complete shit when people read it. You gotta explain it better.

But anyways to me friendlies durring the season are a complete waste of money. Are schedules are busy enough without them. And anyways we play half of are benched players as do the visiting teams comming here. You arent gonna see the top quality you see them playing in say Champion League games but you sure as hell pay the same big bucks to watch it!