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Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 04:10 PM
Roster here: http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=3237

Grella's on there, but likely won't actually be there come the start of the season, considering he's trialing with Leeds right now.

So, what does this give us for depth?

I see a 4-5-1 developing personally:

------------------Sutton-------------------
---Wynne---Velez------Marshall----Dunivant
----------------Robinson-------------------
Ricketts-----------------------------Brennan
----------Guevara------DeRosario-----------
------------------Barrett-------------------

With this the case, who do we have as backup in each position?

GK: Edwards, Frei
RB: Attakora, Harmse
CB: Attakora, Harmse
LB: Attakora, Gala (?)
DM: Harmse, Cronin
RM:
LM: Smith, Gala
CM: Cronin, Rosenlund
ST: Dichio, White, Ibrahim, Grella, Hall

Now, I realize there are options like moving Brennan back to LB, or having DeRo play RM, but I was curious on what our bench players would be like, without changing formation.

To be honest, we look weak in the obvious CB position, but if we intend to play a 4-5-1 we also look a little weak on the wings. We also look like we have way too many attacking options.

Maybe it lines up a little better as a 4-4-2 instead?

----------------Sutton---------------
Wynne----Velez------Marshall--Brennan
------------------Robinson-----------
DeRosario---------------------Ricketts
----------Guevara--------------------
------Barrett--------Dichio------------

GK: Edwards, Frei
RB: Attakora, Harmse
CB: Attakora, Harmse
LB: Dunivant, Attakora, Gala(?)
DM: Harmse, Cronin
RM:
LM: Smith, Dunivant
CM: Cronin, Rosenlund
ST: Grella, White, Ibrahim, Hall

We still seem a little weak on the back and wings....somethings gotta give I think, since we can't expect Ricketts to play every single minute of every single game...or can we?

I also don't like the idea of fiddling with the formation every time we want to substitute someone.

Thoughts?

jrey
01-16-2009, 04:17 PM
Personally I'd prefer a 4-4-2, because we don't have a quality striker who can take the reins and operate up front alone.

I realize that with De Ro and Guevara both suited as AMs that 4-5-1 makes more sense... but we'd be assuming a lot about how much they are going to produce.

I would still support trading Guevara for a proven CB and bringing in a DP striker, in which case a 4-4-2 would be perfect.

S_D
01-16-2009, 04:24 PM
Neither Barrett nor Dichio work well as the lone striker. They both need a partner.

Barrett suffered at Chicago, and we saw how Dichio worked out as the lone man up front last season when he was playing.

Dero doesn't like playing as a withdrawn forward and Guevara is much better in the mid. I think a 442 diamond in your second example would be something to look at.

BuSaPuNk
01-16-2009, 04:43 PM
Yeah i really like the diamond. I would however go with this:
----------------Sutton---------------
Wynne----Dunnivant------Harmse--Brennan
------------------Robinson-----------
DeRosario---------------------Ricketts
----------Guevara--------------------
------Barrett--------Dichio------------
This is with Marshall being shipped off to Seattle as everyone suspects and well Velez still doesn't do it for me. Would rather have Harmse play there....was very good last year when he played.

Stryker
01-16-2009, 04:48 PM
Maybe it lines up a little better as a 4-4-2 instead?

----------------Sutton---------------
Wynne----Velez------Marshall--Brennan
------------------Robinson-----------
DeRosario---------------------Ricketts
----------Guevara--------------------
------Barrett--------Dichio------------


You've got the forwards completely ass backwards.

Stryker
01-16-2009, 04:55 PM
My line up:

Wynne----Velez---Marshal----Brennen
---------------Robinson--------------
------Rickitts------------Guevara----
--------------De Rosario-------------
-------Dichio------------Barrett------

Im not a fan of Guevara playing there but its the only way I can see having him hook up with DeRo other than a single striker which doesn't work worth shit for us unless we get one whos top notch.

Yohan
01-16-2009, 04:59 PM
My line up:

Wynne----Velez---Marshal----Brennen
---------------Robinson--------------
------Rickitts------------Guevara----
--------------De Rosario-------------
-------Dichio------------Barrett------
pretty much my idea too, except put dunny on LB, Jimmy B in CB. until new CB gets signed anyways

Stryker
01-16-2009, 05:02 PM
pretty much my idea too, except put dunny on LB, Jimmy B in CB. until new CB gets signed anyways

Yeah Im hoping Jimmy stays there and we get someone to replace Velez so him and Dunny can sit on the bench.

tfcmanu
01-16-2009, 05:08 PM
---------------Frei----------------

Wynne----Marshal----Brennen---Duni--

--------------Robinson--------------

------Rickitts----Cronin-----Guevara----

--------------De Rosario-------------

---------------Barrett-----------------

dantdot
01-16-2009, 05:09 PM
I like this.

------------------Sutton-------------------
-Wynne---New CB------Marshall----Brennan-
----------------Robinson--------------------
Ricketts-----------------------------Smith(or Duni)
--------------Guevara----------------------
----------------------DeRosario-------------
------------Barrett-------------------------

Stryker
01-16-2009, 05:12 PM
I like this.

------------------Sutton-------------------
-Wynne---New CB------Marshall----Brennan-
----------------Robinson--------------------
Ricketts-----------------------------Smith(or Duni)
--------------Guevara----------------------
----------------------DeRosario-------------
------------Barrett-------------------------

Thats exactly how Ive been setting my line up for Fifa 09 manager mode.
If Barrett gets gassed I sub out him and Smith for Dichio and Ibbe and play with 2 up front and move Guevara opposite of Rickitts.

dantdot
01-16-2009, 05:23 PM
Thats exactly how Ive been setting my line up for Fifa 09 manager mode.
If Barrett gets gassed I sub out him and Smith for Dichio and Ibbe and play with 2 up front and move Guevara opposite of Rickitts.

I quite like that lineup but if we get that new striker, could change things completely.

Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 05:44 PM
My line up:

Wynne----Velez---Marshal----Brennen
---------------Robinson--------------
------Rickitts------------Guevara----
--------------De Rosario-------------
-------Dichio------------Barrett------

Im not a fan of Guevara playing there but its the only way I can see having him hook up with DeRo other than a single striker which doesn't work worth shit for us unless we get one whos top notch.

You spelled half the players names completely ass backwards.

Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 05:46 PM
pretty much my idea too, except put dunny on LB, Jimmy B in CB. until new CB gets signed anyways


I don't see Jimmy playing any CB this year, unless things get absolutely desperate. I don't think Carver rates him there, and I don't know why anyone would, his aerial ability is atrocious. Robinson starts at CB before Jimmy does IMO.

Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 05:48 PM
My line up:

Wynne----Velez---Marshal----Brennen
---------------Robinson--------------
------Rickitts------------Guevara----
--------------De Rosario-------------
-------Dichio------------Barrett------

Im not a fan of Guevara playing there but its the only way I can see having him hook up with DeRo other than a single striker which doesn't work worth shit for us unless we get one whos top notch.

If this is the formation, then Guevara will be gone really quickly, the only way the diamond works is to have DeRo and Ricketts as the two outside players, and Guevara at the top.

I don't like it either, as I think DeRo is best suited for the AM role, but from what I've seen and read, Guevara just isn't suited, at all, for playing an outside role. Offensively it might not be so bad, since we can just run it through the middle, but defensively, the left side will be a shit show.

Jeffro
01-16-2009, 05:59 PM
Wynne---New CB---Marshall---Brennan
--------Cronin------Robinson--------
----Ricketts----DeRo----Guevara----
--------Barrett(new striker?)--------
Essentially 4-5-1, or 4-2-3-1... two holding mids allow Ricketts, De Ro and Guevara do the business up front, and also allows Wynne and Jimmy B to get forward on the flanks to provide width.

Stryker
01-16-2009, 07:34 PM
If this is the formation, then Guevara will be gone really quickly, the only way the diamond works is to have DeRo and Ricketts as the two outside players, and Guevara at the top.

I don't like it either, as I think DeRo is best suited for the AM role, but from what I've seen and read, Guevara just isn't suited, at all, for playing an outside role. Offensively it might not be so bad, since we can just run it through the middle, but defensively, the left side will be a shit show.

You could be right or wrong depending on Guevaras mood.
If he's giving it his all he's more than capable of defending the side.
If he's not in the mood he'll stand there and occassionally nudge a toe out as attackers go by.

Ossington Mental Youth
01-16-2009, 08:29 PM
Wooster you forgot Ricketts, Dichio

Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 09:05 PM
Wooster you forgot Ricketts, Dichio

Where did I forget them?

Wooster_TFC
01-16-2009, 09:07 PM
You could be right or wrong depending on Guevaras mood.
If he's giving it his all he's more than capable of defending the side.
If he's not in the mood he'll stand there and occassionally nudge a toe out as attackers go by.

I would tend to agree with that, and if last seasons performances are what we can expect this season, I would say about half the time he wouldn't bother tracking back. Then again, who knows if DeRo will bother? Maybe having DeRo and Wynne on the right would be even worse?

Still don't like the depth on the wings.

Ossington Mental Youth
01-16-2009, 11:03 PM
sorry homie, dunno how i missed them, HA
gotta get my eyes checked

Shakes McQueen
01-16-2009, 11:17 PM
Dichio is a good poacher, so I'd prefer to have him in the starting XI. But we also benefitted greatly from Barrett's phenomenal work rate. So I'd say we are going to have to go with some form of a 4-4-2.

The more I look at our depth, the more it seems likely that Guevara is going to be dealt. I don't see a workable formation with both him and DeRo, that doesn't result in him being put out on the wing, where he will likely be ineffective. And I don't see Carver choosing to go with one striker up front. Especially not if he's currently about to add yet ANOTHER striker to our lineup, the same year they made sure Dichio got re-signed.

It'll be a 4-4-2 of some sort.

- Scott

Ossington Mental Youth
01-16-2009, 11:40 PM
I keep thinking that Guevara will stay (i really dont think he wants to be dealt) and that DeRo will play the wing BUT not in the typical wing sense (thatll still be left to Ricketts), DeRo will be a roaming AM/striker, whereas Guevara will play back more but still play as an attacking mid, more or less what Jeffro suggested but with one DM and two strikers

--------------Sutton-----------------
Wynne---New CB---Marshall---Brennan
-------------Robinson--------
-------------Guevara---------------
-----Ricketts--------DeRo----------
--------Barrett----New Striker------

Im not entirely convinced we will have Marshall at the start of the season either

druid
01-16-2009, 11:45 PM
Wynne---New CB---Marshall---Brennan
--------Cronin------Robinson--------
----Ricketts----DeRo----Guevara----
--------Barrett(new striker?)--------
Essentially 4-5-1, or 4-2-3-1... two holding mids allow Ricketts, De Ro and Guevara do the business up front, and also allows Wynne and Jimmy B to get forward on the flanks to provide width.

I'd like to see that. Might be great for away matches. Not sure how good Guevara is at running the channels but it would be worth a try, particularly if Cronin is a good passer and calm on the ball.

Stryker
01-17-2009, 01:12 AM
Dichio is a good poacher, so I'd prefer to have him in the starting XI. But we also benefitted greatly from Barrett's phenomenal work rate. So I'd say we are going to have to go with some form of a 4-4-2.

The more I look at our depth, the more it seems likely that Guevara is going to be dealt. I don't see a workable formation with both him and DeRo, that doesn't result in him being put out on the wing, where he will likely be ineffective. And I don't see Carver choosing to go with one striker up front. Especially not if he's currently about to add yet ANOTHER striker to our lineup, the same year they made sure Dichio got re-signed.

It'll be a 4-4-2 of some sort.

- Scott

So in agreement here. Even if we were to sign an amazing DP striker it'd be such a waste to play just a single ST.
We have a fresh four year contract with Barrett and two young guys with huge potential in Ibbe and White that are gonna need some minites to develop. Then of course theres Danny. You CAN'T sit Danny for much more than half the time.
DeRo needs to play right behind the strikers to be most effective. If you were to play Guevara in that spot and move Dero to the wing then the only way you're gonna make that work and still have 2 strikers is to have 3 DB's and nobody wants that.
Throw Cronin into the mix and Guevara quickly becomes the odd man out.
I like Guevara alot.. hugely talented and I was really pleased to see him happy with TFC but it just doesn't look like theres a place for him here now. Not unless he can play left wing better than Smith.

Ossington Mental Youth
01-17-2009, 01:59 AM
DBs?

Stryker
01-17-2009, 02:23 AM
DBs?
Defending Backs. Catch all term for the back line, both CB and FB.
And yes it probley is some bastardized american term.

Ossington Mental Youth
01-17-2009, 02:40 AM
ah kk
generally if youre playing 3 at the back its all CBs (see the 3-5-2 formation)
as you pointed out noone wants that and we'd be leaving one or two of our best/favorites out.
I still dont see Guevara being traded. Im pretty excited to see how the formation works tho.

Nuvinho
01-17-2009, 03:10 AM
Isn't there a rumour going around that Robbo may place CB??

---------------------------Sutton-------------------------
(Edwards)

Wynne------------CB (ask Mo)-------Robbo--------Brennan
(Nana) (Velez) (Marshall) (Dunnivant)
------------------------Cronin-----------------------------
(Harmse)
-------------Ricketts--------------Guevara----------------
(Smith)
------------------------DeRo-----------------------------

--------------Barrett----------South American------------
(Ibbe) (Dichio)
(White)

That leaves: Frei, Roselund, Hall, and Gala as Dev. I think Ibbe is no longer a GA.

Yohan
01-17-2009, 03:26 AM
problem with playing a diamond mid game i see it is that there might not be enough width involved, and everything running through the centre.
cant really see guevara liking coming off the bench, but it would be darn cool to see that sort of quality available on bench. depth is good

dichio imo is most effective when he starts, where he can set the 'tone' of the game. i cant recall dichio having a lot of impact as a sub

Ossington Mental Youth
01-17-2009, 03:50 AM
Nah Robbo said on a recent interview he can and will play anywhere but he prefers mid and thats where he believed he was playing this season

Wooster_TFC
01-17-2009, 11:48 AM
Based on specific responses, I think we'll see DeRo playing wide right, with Ricketts playing wide left, but we'll see more of our attacks concentrated through the middle, so that both Ricketts and DeRo can slide in with ease.

On paper, I really like the 4-5-1, but I also agree that we have a lot of options at ST that will need playing time, although I'm not too sure OBW will be seeing game time until July or August. But, assuming they sign another ST, we'll be seeing two up top, since there's no way you try and rotate three ST through the 1 position, especially since both Barrett and Dichio resigned.

Big Bruva
01-17-2009, 12:33 PM
I like this formation and idea, i think allowing DeRo, Ro and Amado to concentrate on attacking will create and help TFC to get more goals but at the same time if Cronin is ready and him and Robbo concentrate on just holding then it builds a barrier in front of the backline and helps the goals against.

I think the depth is very good with a young healthy striker (O'B) and a vet (DD) up top then you have a young hungry Smith on the wing and Harmse would always be on my bench.

I been going back and forth with O'B on the phone and he is hungry to get healthy and play well




Wynne---New CB---Marshall---Brennan
--------Cronin------Robinson--------
----Ricketts----DeRo----Guevara----
--------Barrett(new striker?)--------
Essentially 4-5-1, or 4-2-3-1... two holding mids allow Ricketts, De Ro and Guevara do the business up front, and also allows Wynne and Jimmy B to get forward on the flanks to provide width.

Stryker
01-17-2009, 12:50 PM
I firmly stand by my analysis that we just can't go with single striker.
Just too many of them in the stable.