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tfcmanu
12-24-2008, 09:35 AM
For Some MLS Teams, It's DP or Bust!

In the offseason, a handful of MLS clubs have been clamoring to add their own Designated Player. That isn’t the wisest team-building option, says Goal.com’s Zac Lee Rigg.

The Designated Player rule has been in place for two years now. In that time, only one team has reached the MLS Cup final with a DP, and that was the fairytale story of Red Bull New York in 2008 that featured Juan Pablo Angel. NY was a heavy underdog and left the final match with a runners-up medal.

The only one who could be considered an on-field success, aside from Angel, is Cuauhtemoc Blanco of the Chicago Fire. With a solid squad already in place

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110/major-...tary-dp-or-bust (http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110/major-league-soccer/2008/12/24/1026714/goalcommentary-dp-or-bust)

TFCREDNWHITE
12-24-2008, 09:55 AM
isn't schelletto DP? or wait, isn't he now a DP??

deltox
12-24-2008, 10:01 AM
i guess that depends on how you guage if a DP is successful.

theres the on field part.
- can one man on a 11 player team really make a difference

theres the off field part.
- more Galaxy shirts were sold last yr compared to any other shirt in the world. the merchandise part of the deal could bring a team millions in revenue.

Ron Manager
12-24-2008, 10:22 AM
I've said since the start that snagging a DP at any expense is a poor and very short sighted way to build a club. The best approach IMHO is to build a club and a playing style and an identity and THEN, if the right guy can be found, slot in a DP who adds to your system.
Based on that, I'm a little indifferent to the idea of a DP for next year. I will wait and see and if they find a gem who will fit in with the team, I will be excited but if they don't sign one at all I will be happier then seeing them sign a Denilson just because they can.

TorontoBlades
12-24-2008, 10:25 AM
those guys get a dp because they need the marketing exposure - we're different because we're getting one for the talent, we don't need the marketing

CoachGT
12-24-2008, 10:40 AM
If we're looking at one for talent alone, then I'd rather see the money spent differently. $200,000 each for a good CB and another holding mid/FB type would be worth more than a nearing-the-top-of-the-hill striker. what we have up front seems pretty solid right now, and with the roster size changes depth would be more of an issue to be a contending team.

rocker
12-24-2008, 10:45 AM
the only qualification I will say about that article is that it doesn't take into account allocations. Yes, a DP's 400K is a lot of the cap space to devote to one guy. But if you do what Mo's doing, knocking down contracts of players you already have with allocation to fit in a DP, then the impact is lessened.

in real terms, that DP could end up being only 200K-250K against the cap if you factor in the salary taken off the cap thanks to allocation for Dichio, Ricketts and Robbo. So it doesn't displace any players at all. I saw some comments from Houston and others about how you'd have to knock off 2-3 good players if you got a DP. That's true, but only if you don' have allocation.

I doubt, for example, that NE and Houston have much allocation in reserve to do that sort of thing. I love their systems tho, and I think you don't need a DP to succeed.
But I think Mo has a sort of a middle ground position between "no allocation and DP taking up 400K+ of the cap" and "no DP".

The longer term implications of that strategy are hard to tell since allocation is gone when you use it. Maybe Mo's gonna keep some of that allocation in reserve for the 2010 season, if it doesn't expire in 2009. Or he may be banking on some concessions by the league that will make the following season easier to adapt to financially (raising the cap, changing allocation rules etc.).

Oldtimer
12-24-2008, 11:03 AM
The longer term implications of that strategy are hard to tell since allocation is gone when you use it. Maybe Mo's gonna keep some of that allocation in reserve for the 2010 season, if it doesn't expire in 2009. Or he may be banking on some concessions by the league that will make the following season easier to adapt to financially (raising the cap, changing allocation rules etc.).

all good points. Remember also that at the end of 2009, the DP rule will be reevaluated. Look for the cap hit to be decreased for teams that sign a DP (LA is pushing hard for this).

Beach_Red
12-24-2008, 11:38 AM
all good points. Remember also that at the end of 2009, the DP rule will be reevaluated. Look for the cap hit to be decreased for teams that sign a DP (LA is pushing hard for this).

That would be great and even better would be an increase in the cap as well.

Pookie
12-24-2008, 02:35 PM
For Some MLS Teams, It's DP or Bust!
The Designated Player rule has been in place for two years now. In that time, only one team has reached the MLS Cup final with a DP, and that was the fairytale story of Red Bull New York in 2008 that featured Juan Pablo Angel. NY was a heavy underdog and left the final match with a runners-up medal.


If the argument is based on 2 finals, then you have 1 of the 4 teams making it with a DP. That's 25% of the teams that make it to the final have a DP.

Admittedly, stats are silly with such a small sample size. Clearly, teams with a top talent have an advantage and this should play out over the long term.

In reading the article the author did highlight a number of flops which begs expanding the question. Why haven't teams been successful in recruiting the right DP?

Obviously, the players were attracted by the cash but why couldn't they stay? Was it cultural? Was it a function of the quality of training facilities or medical staff?

Do teams have the right scouting staff to be able to evaluate both a player's skill and their character?

So the question isn't whether you get a DP but how do you get the right one?

rocker
12-24-2008, 02:38 PM
all good points. Remember also that at the end of 2009, the DP rule will be reevaluated. Look for the cap hit to be decreased for teams that sign a DP (LA is pushing hard for this).

ya, given that half the teams apparently wanted a much more liberal DP rule back when they created it, I have a feeling that's gonna change. It certainly can't get more restrictive than now. All Mo needs is that amount to drop a few hundred thousand and the cap to go up a few hundred thousand and the allocation money wouldn't be needed to knock anybody down in the second year of the DP's contract.

Shakes McQueen
12-24-2008, 05:03 PM
The Galaxy's problem didn't come from having Beckham as a DP - it came from the exorbitant salaries of Beckham, Donovan, and Ruiz combined, and having a bum like Xavier starring in their backline for half the season.

Schellotto was a great addition for Columbus, Angel has been great for RBNY (both teams were in this year's final, BTW), and Blanco has been terrific in Chicago.

The real issue, is when there isn't a decent squad around the DP player - but if teams like Chicago and Columbus can do it, there is no excuse for why we couldn't.

The Galaxy just had far too much cap money tied into a few players, meaning they had to skimp elsewhere.

- Scott

Dunkers
12-24-2008, 07:36 PM
isn't schelletto DP? or wait, isn't he now a DP??


In 2008 he was a DP, kind of, he made more then leauge max, but instead of using a DP slot, the crew used Allocation money to lower his salary (for cap purposes) to under leauge max. They could have just as easily used the DP slot on Schelleto, the only difference is the leauge pays Schelletos wage if he is NOT a DP, whereas the Crew would have to pay all of his wage above $400,000 if he was a DP. So being the cheap buggers they are in Columbus, they used allocation money, and stuck it to the leauge.

So really, 2 of 4 teams have had players that are paid above leauge max and made the final, one of which won the MLS cup and in the process the "DP" was named Leauge MVP and MLS Cup MVP

King Tut
12-25-2008, 02:46 PM
If there's a chance that the DP will be like Juan Pablo Angel, then it's totally worth it. Ofcourse the DP could be a flop, but some risks have to be taken. A well calculated DP signing is totally worth it. I don't care if the majority of the DPs flopped. The fact that one was influential, means that it's worth a shot.

Brooker
12-26-2008, 04:53 AM
what does the Galaxy or any other team with a DP have to do with Toronto FC and our possible signing of a DP?

history can fuck off. irrelevent.

Shakes McQueen
12-26-2008, 07:40 AM
There isn't even enough history to judge the statistical effectiveness of a DP. The DP rule has been in effect for two seasons.

- Scott