Onward! -- DP, or no DP? [Archive] - Red Patch Boys Forums

scooter

12-20-2008, 08:48 AM

great job again ben tks

tough call on whether we should pay that kind of money---everybody wants a dp but its a really tough call when you put it in this context. quite frankly i cant believe how low some of the players salaries are.

guevara,ricketts and harmse should go.

guevara is hot and cold. add to that the international commitments and if he wants to play for his country its time to move on.
ricketts is a great athlete and a fan favourite and super pr guy for the team and himself.does his play justify what we are paying him----no
harmse is a red card waiting to happen and we cant afford the penalties. his style of play is too risky for the team.

i am thinking if we free up some money then a dp could be a reality--and mo johnston is pretty savy--i am sure mo will not blow the budget. perhaps then we could go after a decent centre back and pay him ricketts kind of money. with dunivant back i like jimmy b to move up to mid field and be a playmaker with dero.

plus we still have the draft in a few weeks.

this is getting exciting "come on you reds"

Pachuco

12-20-2008, 11:37 AM

Oh boy, please not Tomasz Radzinsky. If Dero isn't getting DP money, how in the hell would Radzinsky get DP money? He ain't good enough. He's not the natural goal scorer we're looking for. In fact, he's kind of like Barrett in that he works his arse off and will score goals because of his work rate. So we'd have two very similar strikers.

BTW - I don't think losing Guevara would be wise. Our mid could be decent, but not like it could be if we had Robbo, Guevara, Dero and Ricketts in there at the same time. With Jo Smith first off the bench and maybe Dunivant second. I'd take that any day over Tomasz up front with no Guevara in the midfield.

Here's to hoping for a different DP.

Nuvinho

12-20-2008, 12:29 PM

here are my calculations so far:

So far the 20 senior spots:

1.Sutton $ 158,000.00
2.Edwards $ 44,750.00
3.Wynne $ 150,000.00
4.Nana $ 36,000.00 (senior contract)
5.Velez $ 60,500.00
6.Marshall $ 153,750.00
7.Dunivant $ 105,000.00
8.Brennan $ 183,250.00
9.Harmse $ 72,000.00
10.DeRo $ 400,000.00 (raise as per ives)
11.Robinson $ 300,000.00 (assuming less money)
12.Roselund $ 36,000.00
13.Guevara $ 185,750.00
14.Ricketts $ 213,000.00 (assuming same money)
15.Smith $ 91,000.00 (pro-rated maybe)
16.Dichio $ 125,000.00 (assuming less money)
17.Barrett $ 91,000.00 (new contract - estimation)
18.
19.
20.

4 developmental contracts:

1.Ibbe Does not count
2 Does not count
3 Does not count
4 Does not count

Total $ 2,405,000

MLS Salary Cap $ 2,300,000

Over/Under-$ 105,000.00

Allocation Money $ 1,000,000
Traded to Dynamo-$ 150,000

Money Left Over $ 745,000.00

S_D

12-20-2008, 12:46 PM

any word if Ruiz has been given the chop yet? I still see him on the MLS TFC roster and have been praying to see his name disappear since the day he came here.

rocker

12-20-2008, 01:25 PM

Ruiz was listed as released in a recent article on De Ro.

Razcle

12-20-2008, 01:26 PM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5iXAKRyqeuufL93VnJn4oNDaolu2A

"Toronto helped clear some of financial obligations by releasing high-priced Guatemalan forward Carlos Ruiz, acquired in an August deal with the Los Angeles Galaxy. In five games for Toronto, Ruiz did not add to his 82 career MLS goals. His salary for last season was a hefty $460,000"

wzhxvy

12-20-2008, 01:30 PM

^^ Oh no...what a loss...NOT

And can someone explain the allocation money...can that be used against the cap ? What is it exactly ?

rocker

12-20-2008, 01:32 PM

it's extra cash the league has that it allocates to teams based on certain criteria.
like if you miss the playoffs or finish last, they give the team some extra money. it doesn't count under the cap but it can be applied to a guy's contract to lower it before the contract applies to the cap. allocation money can only be used once and then it's gone.. it also has an expiry date.
teams can trade it too.

Lucky Strike

12-20-2008, 01:36 PM

Yohan

12-20-2008, 01:46 PM

i'm going to guess that Mo is playing around with the allocation money to pay off a lot of the salaries to keep under the cap, and hoping that next round of negotiations next year raises the cap?

unless DP is a CB, we still need a CB signed.

wzhxvy

12-20-2008, 01:52 PM

I know you guys dont like this is idea...but I thought Kozlowski was the best back for Team Canada...he was very solid...maybe it him. and thanks Rocker...so then Mo can technically over spend way over the cap for at least 1 year...hoping that means Guevara stays...

VPjr

12-20-2008, 01:57 PM

Oh boy, please not Tomasz Radzinsky. If Dero isn't getting DP money, how in the hell would Radzinsky get DP money? He ain't good enough.

Radz would get DP money if he came home because...wait for it....Radz is a better overall footballer than DeRo.

Radz is the best Canadian of the past 20 years. I truly do not believe that this statement can not be argued...not even remotely.

DeRo is an exciting, sometimes awe inspiring player. But he goes through periods of long inactivity. I still love the guy but the stuff that frustrated me about him when he was a teenager playing for the Lynx still frustrates me today.

Radzinski is simply a better all around player. He doesn't necessarily do the highlite reel stuff that De Ro can do but he does everything well. I simply don't think enough Canadian soccer fans have had the pleasure of watching him play to fully appreciate his ability. I used to love watching him with Anderlecht, Everton and Fulham. He might not be a spring chicken but the man got 14 goals in 21 games last year for Xanthi...that's a hell of strike rate in a quality league. This year he's got 8 goals in 12-13 games in a lesser league but still a good strike rate.

having made what I think is a good argument for Radz, I'll finish by saying I don't think he will be coming to TFC. it's just a hunch but I think he's not leaving Belgium.

rocker

12-20-2008, 01:58 PM

yes Yohan and wzhxvy, i think this is what Mo is doing. Notice that Robbo said he had a verbal contract with Mo and Dichio seemed to suggest the same thing. (nothing is yet in writing)

As well, we have not yet seen Ricketts formally signed, yet Ricketts keeps sticking around and pimping TFC.

it's most likely Mojo is sitting there with his pot of allocation money and is telling these three "Look, I guarantee you I'll sign you at this amount.. I just need to knock it down with some allocation once we get the DP signed."

You can't use that allocation to knock down the DP's 400K against the cap, so it makes sense to get that guy signed first before then forcing Robbo, Ricketts, and Dichio's salaries onto the cap.

Oldtimer

12-20-2008, 02:08 PM

here are my calculations so far:

Money Left Over $ 745,000.00

In other words, we're okay for the upcoming season, don't need to cut anyone, and can add a DP and a defender to boot.

GeorgeB

12-20-2008, 02:35 PM

so it looks like Jan.6 is the big day.somebody should call Morgan Campbell. LOL

Pachuco

12-20-2008, 03:00 PM

Radz would get DP money if he came home because...wait for it....Radz is a better overall footballer than DeRo.

Radz is the best Canadian of the past 20 years. I truly do not believe that this statement can not be argued...not even remotely.

DeRo is an exciting, sometimes awe inspiring player. But he goes through periods of long inactivity. I still love the guy but the stuff that frustrated me about him when he was a teenager playing for the Lynx still frustrates me today.

Radzinski is simply a better all around player. He doesn't necessarily do the highlite reel stuff that De Ro can do but he does everything well. I simply don't think enough Canadian soccer fans have had the pleasure of watching him play to fully appreciate his ability. I used to love watching him with Anderlecht, Everton and Fulham. He might not be a spring chicken but the man got 14 goals in 21 games last year for Xanthi...that's a hell of strike rate in a quality league. This year he's got 8 goals in 12-13 games in a lesser league but still a good strike rate.

having made what I think is a good argument for Radz, I'll finish by saying I don't think he will be coming to TFC. it's just a hunch but I think he's not leaving Belgium.

What a joke, JDG has already surpassed anything Radz ever accomplished in Europe and you can bet he's not done.

Listen, I've only ever seen him play for the Canadian national team, and I've seen him play quite a few times so that is what I base my opinion on. The guy is not what we need right now. He is certainly no Big Splash. Dero in my opinion is a more skilled player and a bigger splash, therefore if you told me we were signing both of them, I'd have to give DP to Dero. Even if you convinced me Radz is better then Dero, he still wouldn't deserve big splash money over Dero who will sell 1 million more jerseys then Radz ever would.

Oh, did I forget to mention Radz is 35? that's right, 5 years older then Dero. So where is the upside to this guy that we would bring him here for DP money? Fuck I'd be surprised if any of my buddies even know who Radz is. On the other hand, they've all been talking about Dero coming to Toronto.

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB

12-20-2008, 03:02 PM

As much as i would be disapointed if TFC use there DP spot on RADZ....on the other hand i still think he has alot to offer still...but not as a DP...

Basically i want him at TFC...but not as DP..if that makes any sence..:)

What do you guys think....WOULD you make RADZ...TFC's DP? or would you be very disapointed?

Nodoubtguy

12-20-2008, 03:06 PM

Look, I like Radz.....but as our DP?? I don't think so

I don't think your DP should be a 35 year old coming from a small European second division. I don't know how that qualifies as a "big splash"

MG42

12-20-2008, 03:09 PM

Look, I like Radz.....but as our DP?? I don't think so

I don't think your DP should be a 35 year old coming from a small European second division. I don't know how that qualifies as a "big splash"

+1 :)

Nuvinho

12-20-2008, 03:16 PM

In other words, we're okay for the upcoming season, don't need to cut anyone, and can add a DP and a defender to boot.

Let's say we keep all our draft picks - get 3 GA players (don't count towards the cap), then add a CB ($300K+) and a DP Striker ($400K cap hit). We'll have 19 senior roster spots, and 4 developmental roster spots filled.

S_D

12-20-2008, 03:39 PM

is there a limit on the number of GA players you can have on a team?

VPjr

12-20-2008, 03:44 PM

What a joke, JDG has already surpassed anything Radz ever accomplished in Europe and you can bet he's not done.

Listen, I've only ever seen him play for the Canadian national team, and I've seen him play quite a few times so that is what I base my opinion on. The guy is not what we need right now. He is certainly no Big Splash. Dero in my opinion is a more skilled player and a bigger splash, therefore if you told me we were signing both of them, I'd have to give DP to Dero. Even if you convinced me Radz is better then Dero, he still wouldn't deserve big splash money over Dero who will sell 1 million more jerseys then Radz ever would.

Oh, did I forget to mention Radz is 35? that's right, 5 years older then Dero. So where is the upside to this guy that we would bring him here for DP money? Fuck I'd be surprised if any of my buddies even know who Radz is. On the other hand, they've all been talking about Dero coming to Toronto.

What a joke????? Sadly, having read your post, I'm wondering if your not actually a comedian trying to play devil's advocate just for the hell of it.

I am a big Julian fan...he's my favorite Canadian at this moment...but what exactly has Jules done to surpass Radz? Please enlighten me...I'm sincerely curious.

Julian has never played Champions League. He's only just become a consistent starter in La Liga in the last 18 months. He's a holding midfielder with a huge heart but he doesn't score goals at the club level. In his entire professional career, spanning almost 8 years, he's got 3 goals. For Canada, he has 5.

Radz has been in Europe, playing at the highest levels (EPL, Champions League, etc..) for almost 14 years. He had 5 goals in one highly memorable Champions League campaign for Andrelecht and was the leading goal scorer in Belgium that season (2000 I think...Andrelecht won the league title that year too).

He scored 25 goals for Everton over a 3 year run...he was a big game player for Fulham in his time there and one of their most popular players. He torched Greece last year, scoring at a 1 goal per 1.5 games played clip. He has over 130 goals in his European career and 11 goals for Canada (despite not playing for Canada for many years after a big dispute with the coach Osieck).

If you've only seen him play for Canada and you make your judgements of him based on that, then you are working with a very incomplete picture of the man's career..

DeRo is a nice player who gets on lots of highlite reels, especially for his little post goal strut.

Radz is a pro's pro, who is proficient in so many parts of the game, doesn't need to strut because it gets tiresome to do it when you score as many times in your career as he has.

Oh, did I forget to mention that the MLS MVP this past season was a 35 year old from Argentina....didn't seem to hurt Columbus' run to the title. Schelotto is actuall 6 months older than Radz.

Radz is certainly worth a DP contract...Not a huge one but 2 years at $750K per year would be very justified.

rocker

12-20-2008, 03:55 PM

is there a limit on the number of GA players you can have on a team?

since a GA takes up a DEV slot, the only limit is the number of available DEV slots.

UltraSuperMegaMo

12-20-2008, 04:01 PM

The thing which I hate about the DP rule is that although the DP’s the highest paid player on the team, he’s unlikely to be the centre around which the team is built. Speculation has linked us with a couple of 35-year-old players and in both cases they’d probably do well for us - for a couple of years. I wonder if there’s a 28-year-old out there who would fit the bill? Even a 30-year-old player could be here for a good stint.

BakaGaijin

12-20-2008, 04:11 PM

I am a big Julian fan...he's my favorite Canadian at this moment...but what exactly has Jules done to surpass Radz? Please enlighten me...I'm sincerely curious.

Julian has never played Champions League. He's only just become a consistent starter in La Liga in the last 18 months. He's a holding midfielder with a huge heart but he doesn't score goals at the club level. In his entire professional career, spanning almost 8 years, he's got 3 goals. For Canada, he has 5.

Radz has been in Europe, playing at the highest levels (EPL, Champions League, etc..) for almost 14 years. He had 5 goals in one highly memorable Champions League campaign for Andrelecht and was the leading goal scorer in Belgium that season (2000 I think...Andrelecht won the league title that year too).

Oh, did I forget to mention that the MLS MVP this past season was a 35 year old from Argentina....didn't seem to hurt Columbus' run to the title. Schelotto is actuall 6 months older than Radz.

Radz is certainly worth a DP contract...Not a huge one but 2 years at $750K per year would be very justified.

I agree 100%.

Radzinski 2 - Man United 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIsyGNNMM1k&NR=1

Radzinski 1 - Lazio 0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUOPgkbqSfw&feature=related

I think he could still rip up the MLS.

Pachuco

12-20-2008, 04:17 PM

What a joke????? Sadly, having read your post, I'm wondering if your not actually a comedian trying to play devil's advocate just for the hell of it.

I am a big Julian fan...he's my favorite Canadian at this moment...but what exactly has Jules done to surpass Radz? Please enlighten me...I'm sincerely curious.

Julian has never played Champions League. He's only just become a consistent starter in La Liga in the last 18 months. He's a holding midfielder with a huge heart but he doesn't score goals at the club level. In his entire professional career, spanning almost 8 years, he's got 3 goals. For Canada, he has 5.

Radz has been in Europe, playing at the highest levels (EPL, Champions League, etc..) for almost 14 years. He had 5 goals in one highly memorable Champions League campaign for Andrelecht and was the leading goal scorer in Belgium that season (2000 I think...Andrelecht won the league title that year too).

He scored 25 goals for Everton over a 3 year run...he was a big game player for Fulham in his time there and one of their most popular players. He torched Greece last year, scoring at a 1 goal per 1.5 games played clip. He has over 130 goals in his European career and 11 goals for Canada (despite not playing for Canada for many years after a big dispute with the coach Osieck).

If you've only seen him play for Canada and you make your judgements of him based on that, then you are working with a very incomplete picture of the man's career..

DeRo is a nice player who gets on lots of highlite reels, especially for his little post goal strut.

Radz is a pro's pro, who is proficient in so many parts of the game, doesn't need to strut because it gets tiresome to do it when you score as many times in your career as he has.

Oh, did I forget to mention that the MLS MVP this past season was a 35 year old from Argentina....didn't seem to hurt Columbus' run to the title. Schelotto is actuall 6 months older than Radz.

Radz is certainly worth a DP contract...Not a huge one but 2 years at $750K per year would be very justified.

Ok Radz brother in disguise. I was referring to Julian being MVP of mid a table team in La Liga and he's still young as hell. Julian to me is the best Canadian we've had in 20 years BY FAR. And to start throwing out number of goals scored against Julian's shocks me, knowing full well that you know the difference in the positions they play. So I guess Robbo sucks when you compare him to Cunningham, being that Cunny had more goals then Robbo in his TFC career. Tomasz is 35, has been relegated to playing in 2nd league in Belgium, but yet this guy is worth more money then Dero? who gives a shit what he's done the past 20 years? We need someone who can produce TODAY. Dero will give us 5 more years of solid football before he catches up to Radz age, how many can Tomasz give us? Dero has WAY more upside, way more SPLASH then Radz ever will.

At the end of the day, the only point I'm really trying to make is that if you are going to sign both Radz and Dero, and Radz at this point in his career is going to make more then Dero, then that's a joke. It all makes sense to me now why there are rumours Dero wants a raise. Sign Radz for 400K and give Dero DP and I can live with it, but not the other way around, and I'm beginning to think Dero feels the same way (pure speculation on my part).

VPjr

12-20-2008, 04:26 PM

Ok Radz brother in disguise. I was referring to Julian being MVP of mid a table team in La Liga and he's still young as hell. Julian to me is the best Canadian we've had in 20 years BY FAR. And to start throwing out number of goals scored against Julian's shocks me, knowing full well that you know the difference in the positions they play. So I guess Robbo sucks when you compare him to Cunningham, being that Cunny had more goals then Robbo in his TFC career. Tomasz is 35, has been relegated to playing in 2nd league in Belgium, but yet this guy is worth more money then Dero? who gives a shit what he's done the past 20 years? We need someone who can produce TODAY. Dero will give us 5 more years of solid football before he catches up to Radz age, how many can Tomasz give us? Dero has WAY more upside, way more SPLASH then Radz ever will.

At the end of the day, the only point I'm really trying to make is that if you are going to sign both Radz and Dero, and Radz at this point in his career is going to make more then Dero, then that's a joke. It all makes sense to me now why there are rumours Dero wants a raise. Sign Radz for 400K and give Dero DP and I can live with it, but not the other way around, and I'm beginning to think Dero feels the same way (pure speculation on my part).

DeRo is not a DP...sorry...he's just not. Again, he's an exciting player but i would not use the DP on him. We'll have to agree to disagree.

Radz was more effective for team Canada in the WCQ than DeRo

he had a better 2007/2008 season than DeRo (14 goals in 21 games)...which proves he's got lots left in the tank.

BTW, he only moved to 2nd div in belgium so his Belgian wife could be close to her family now that they have a new baby. his club is expected to get promoted to 1st division next season. And no, I'm not his brother (although I met his brother at a coach's dinner last year and he's a very cool guy).

Plus, how can I not support Radz when he wore one of my Sack The CSA shirts on TV after the Canada v Mexico WCQ in Edmonton....

Pachuco

12-20-2008, 04:36 PM

DeRo is not a DP...sorry...he's just not. Again, he's an exciting player but i would not use the DP on him. We'll have to agree to disagree.

Radz was more effective for team Canada in the WCQ than DeRo

he had a better 2007/2008 season than DeRo (14 goals in 21 games)...which proves he's got lots left in the tank.

BTW, he only moved to 2nd div in belgium so his Belgian wife could be close to her family now that they have a new baby. his club is expected to get promoted to 1st division next season. And no, I'm not his brother (although I met his brother at a coach's dinner last year and he's a very cool guy).

Plus, how can I not support Radz when he wore one of my Sack The CSA shirts on TV after the Canada v Mexico WCQ in Edmonton....

That's pretty cool he did that.

wzhxvy

12-20-2008, 04:38 PM

I would have to agree with VP Jr on the WCQ campaign this year...Radz was better than Dero. As a matter of fact, I think we would have won that game in Montreal had Radz not been injured early in the game. He was playing incredibly well that game, and set up the goal against Jamaica.

Anyways...outside of the WCQ...I have not seen either play for an extended time so cant really compare. But JDG is by far and away the best Canadian I have seen play in a long time...my two cents.

Ossington Mental Youth

12-20-2008, 04:39 PM

God i really hope our DP isnt Radz, if it is, itll be curious to see what changed his view on playing on turf

alexintoronto

12-20-2008, 04:47 PM

Maybe it's Jonothan De Guzman or Owen Hargreaves :)

VPjr

12-20-2008, 04:50 PM

JDG is by far and away the best Canadian I have seen play in a long time...my two cents.

JDG is definitely Canada's best player at the moment...I won't argue that.

Over their careers, Radz has been better, but Julez has 7-8 years to try to eclipse Radz's accomplishments.

Roogsy

12-20-2008, 04:53 PM

At the end of the day, the only point I'm really trying to make is that if you are going to sign both Radz and Dero, and Radz at this point in his career is going to make more then Dero, then that's a joke. It all makes sense to me now why there are rumours Dero wants a raise. Sign Radz for 400K and give Dero DP and I can live with it, but not the other way around, and I'm beginning to think Dero feels the same way (pure speculation on my part).

Who cares who gets the DP designation of BOTH would cost us 400k under the cap? This conversation is nonsensical.

Roogsy

12-20-2008, 04:55 PM

JDG is definitely Canada's best player at the moment...I won't argue that.

Over their careers, Radz has been better, but Julez has 7-8 years to try to eclipse Radz's accomplishments.

I agree.

The potential for JDG to do more than Radz is there.

But Radz has actually accomplished it and is now at the tail end of his career.

JDG Is still moving up and while I have not doubts one day we will look back and say JDG accomplished more...he's not there yet and Radz should continue to be respected for what he has done, not just for himself but for Canadian soccer.

flatpicker

12-20-2008, 04:55 PM

hmmm... I just dunno...

at 35 years of age I wonder if he is a little too old?

I would prefer a younger talent, someone with some years left.
Someone who will spend enough time in Toronto to build a relationship with the fans.

I would like to see a player like Rickie Lambert who is only 27, is scoring big goals, and could really ignite the league.

but that's just me making a Christmas wish...

... not to mention he does not play for a national team... which is useful in MLS...

DigzTFC!

12-20-2008, 05:01 PM

You know what I want. Mo to go get a South American world class talent. Lock him up for a while, naturalize his ass and get him on the national team. I want a Canadian Deco....that's my wish list.

werewolf

12-20-2008, 05:01 PM

^ not until 2011...

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11719_4118340,00.html

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB

12-20-2008, 05:09 PM

wzhxvy

12-20-2008, 05:10 PM

You know what I want. Mo to go get a South American world class talent. Lock him up for a while, naturalize his ass and get him on the national team. I want a Canadian Deco....that's my wish list.

I think MO is all for naturlizing asses...that might be even a speciality of his :-)

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB

12-20-2008, 05:28 PM

Maybe it's Jonothan De Guzman or Owen Hargreaves :)

a young dutchman..and a broken down englishman......naw id prefer some CANADIAN TALLENT....thanks!:canada:

Cashcleaner

12-20-2008, 06:03 PM

Radz is certainly worth a DP contract...Not a huge one but 2 years at $750K per year would be very justified.

Seconded. Or is that thirded?

ensco

12-20-2008, 06:14 PM

Seconded. Or is that thirded?

I would like to bring Radz in, but would it really take DP money? Robert went from here (earning $335K) to Larissa, who are pretty similar to Xanthi....and Robert had a bigger resume than Radz...so why would Radz be making DP-type money there? And if he isn't, why should he make DP-type money here?

LucaGol

12-20-2008, 06:34 PM

You know what I want. Mo to go get a South American world class talent. Lock him up for a while, naturalize his ass and get him on the national team. I want a Canadian Deco....that's my wish list.

I like this idea.

We need a Roger Guerreiro. Help TFC and the CMNT.

RedRum

12-20-2008, 06:41 PM

I can't believe people are bitching about Radz being a DP. The guy is a proven goal scorer at a high level. I dont care that he's 35 he's still got the wheels and the finish.

Have you guys forgotten it's like pulling teeth to get anyone to play here, both because of the turf and the fact that most accomplished guys would only consider a move to MLS if it was to a well known US city like NY/Chicago/LA.

And how extra sweet would winning the MLS Cup with at least 4 Canadians playing a major role in that? Bill Archer would throw himself off a fucking bridge.

rocker

12-20-2008, 06:51 PM

Radz is younger than Blanco.
Radz is younger than Schellotto.

Mark in Ottawa

12-20-2008, 06:52 PM

Maybe it's Jonothan De Guzman or Owen Hargreaves :)
Would Hargreaves injured knees hold up on the turf?

twistedchinaman

12-20-2008, 07:01 PM

twistedchinaman

12-20-2008, 07:02 PM

And how extra sweet would winning the MLS Cup with at least 4 Canadians playing a major role in that? Bill Archer would throw himself off a fucking bridge.

Now that we'd pay to see! :D

twistedchinaman

12-20-2008, 07:05 PM

Maybe it's Jonothan De Guzman or Owen Hargreaves :)

If that's the one -- you'll win a whole shatload of westerners. And makes my life easier out here. I think.

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB

12-20-2008, 07:12 PM

Seconded. Or is that thirded?

that's that then...

Call MO....the RPB Board of GOV's have passed the vote!:D

RADZ is the new DP!

Dirk Diggler

12-20-2008, 07:22 PM

Who cares who gets the DP designation of BOTH would cost us 400k under the cap? This conversation is nonsensical.

LOL I was thinking the exact same thing. If we can't get a striker who is by far more deserving of a DP spot than Radz, I really wouldn't mind if it is used on him. Gotta utilize the DP spot on someone.

CretanBull

12-20-2008, 09:50 PM

I like Radz, but he's play in Belgium and his wife & family are from there...he may not want to come here.

Cashcleaner

12-20-2008, 10:02 PM

that's that then...

Call MO....the RPB Board of GOV's have passed the vote!:D

RADZ is the new DP!

Democracy in action. ;)

VPjr

12-20-2008, 10:50 PM

[quote=VPjr;309025]Radz would get DP money if he came home because...wait for it....Radz is a better overall footballer than DeRo.

Radz is the best Canadian of the past 20 years. I truly do not believe that this statement can not be argued...not even remotely.

quote]

Please explain....... Imp in no way down playing the talents of RADZ.....he is a quality player for sure!!...but to come out and say he is an overall better player then dero...or has been our BEST player over the last 20 years is very debatable and could be argued

MORE goals??? Dero on top there.....Creativness....Dero.....Vison...DERO...
I let you fill in the rest!;)

I have followed both DeRo and Radzinski's career closely.

I remember Radz when he played for North York in the old CSL. I never would have believed that the same guy who needed 5-6 scoring chances to bury a goal in the CSL would one day develop into a scoring champion in a very good European league and singlehandedly beat Machester United in a UEFA CL match, but he did. He has had a very solid career, playing in 3 very good leagues, including a 6 year run in the EPL. And he's still producing, as evidenced by his 1:1.5 strike ration last year in Greece and 9 goals in 14 games this year so far (he scored again today).

I remember watching DeRo as a teenager for the Lynx. Then, as now, he was a player you loved watching...he would regularly find a way to do something exciting but that doesn't mean he was always effective. As he has gotten older and gained experience, he's dropped many of his bad habits and he still possessed moments of brilliance that make you shake your head and say "how the hell did he do that" but he still goes through significant spells in many games when he is fairly invisible or simply makes alot of wrong decisions that result in unnecessary turnovers.

If you compare career stats, Radz is hands down the better player.

Radz - 130+ goals in Europe, 11 for Canada
DeRo - 66 career goals, only 1 in Europe (in 3 years), 20 of the 66 goals in USL1, 15 senior goals for Canada

They both have had good careers....DeRo has been a very important member of our national team and he's done alot for making MLS exciting. He's one of the 10 best MLS players of all time in my opinion. However, there is a huge difference between a player who has been consistently solid in European top divisions for 14 years and a guy who has been one of the best players in what are essentially tier 2 leagues from the global soccer perspective. I don't want to take anything away from DeRo because I'm a big fan but people who think that DeRo's professional accomplishments are on par with Radzinski's career accomplishments are lying to themselves. I think many of you have simply not seen enough of radzinski to fully appreciate what he accomplished in his career and how good he still is.

BTW, Radz was one of the top 3 Canadians in what was a generally woeful world cup qualifying campaign. In the game against Honduras in Montreal, he was the best player on the pitch until that honduran asshole shoved him into the ad boards, forcing him to leave the game. Conversely, DeRo was widely criticized as being one of the most disappointing players on the team in the games he played.

Finally, its looking likely that Radz will win the voyageurs player of the year award....not bad from a guy many of you are writing off as too old. Again, I remind you that the best player in MLS in 2008 is an Argentine who is actually 6 months older than Radz. MLS is NOT that tough of a league. If Radz came home, which I doubt will happen, he would have little trouble repeating the scoring prowess he has demonstrated the past 18 months in Greece and Belgium.

I would love a team with both Radz and DeRo...that would be awesome. Just not likely to happen, sadly.

UltraSuperMegaMo

12-20-2008, 11:20 PM

If not Radz, who else would be on a realistic Canadian DP list? Simeon Jackson?

CretanBull

12-20-2008, 11:34 PM

^ Pretty much no one else (and not Jackson)

Dirk Diggler

12-21-2008, 01:10 AM

^ Pretty much no one else (and not Jackson)

Stalteri?

CretanBull

12-21-2008, 01:26 AM

I can't imagine a team using a DP slot on a defender...and if they did, it would have to be someone better than Stalteri for it to have an impact.

Corpand

12-21-2008, 01:38 AM

What about Rob Friend?

Torcida

12-21-2008, 01:46 AM

According to wiki, Radz scored 14 goals in 21 games in Greece last year, he has 9 goals in 983 minutes already in Belgium 2nd division this year according to the team's official website.

AHHHH, where's the problem?

CretanBull

12-21-2008, 01:50 AM

What about Rob Friend?

I don't think he'd we willing to leave the Bundesliga...

Keyman

12-21-2008, 01:55 AM

I'll bet that it's a defender, then they introduce an attacking player (De Rosario) along with someone to stabilize our backline (pick your Canadian). That way, management does not feel as though they are under pressure, from fans and the media, to use the slot on a goal scoring machine. The problem is that I feel quite strongly that not one Canadian defender is worthy of accounting for such a large portion of our cap space.

If it's not a defender, then you have a very diminutive collection of attacking players to choose from if it is indeed a Canadian. Rob Friend is definitely a potential target; however, he seems quite settled at BM. He would be a fantastic addition as he possesses all of the attributes that it takes to become a successful striker in this league, but again, I doubt he comes. Then, if I'm not mistaken, Radz moved to Belgium because of family, which would leave me wondering why exactly he would suddenly jump ship and come to Toronto. So, that leaves no one else really, unless of course Mo Johnston is insane and he uses our DP slot on Ali Gerba or Andrew Ornoch. The only other possibility I see is Atiba, who I heard whispers about earlier, because he can play out wide on the left and sometimes in an attacking role, but that seems more far-fetched than everything else.

So, basically, I'm very confused.

Keyman

12-21-2008, 02:00 AM

Oh and for anyone suggesting that Radz would not make an impact in this league....

Well, you're entitled to your own opinion, but in MY opinion...You are very, very wrong. The guy can play.

Torcida

12-21-2008, 02:04 AM

I bet the whispers of it being Canadian are just misdirection.

CretanBull

12-21-2008, 02:11 AM

We need the best player available, Canadian or not.

Pachuco

12-21-2008, 02:39 AM

Who cares who gets the DP designation of BOTH would cost us 400k under the cap? This conversation is nonsensical.

nosensical cause you are being short sided. If Dero trully wants DP money, and we can't give it to him because we're signing Radz, then I CARE. At the end of the day, Dero can give us 5 good years before he reaches Radz age, I would want to keep him happy over bringing in a Canadian playing in a 2nd league Belgium team who is coming here to play retired football for a couple of years. For me, it's about keeping the future happy over some short term solution. Dero to me, can still be the future of this team, someone we can build around for the next 5 years. Someone who I think will show is still in his prime at age 30. Someone who none football fanatics recognize and someone who will sell jerseys and attract people to the stadium. Radz is a short term fix, who won't sell many jerseys and most people in the stadium won't know who the guy is until he plays a few games for TFC. Now, if we were telling Dero too bad because we are signing De Guzman for DP, different story.

Pachuco

12-21-2008, 02:50 AM

Oh and for anyone suggesting that Radz would not make an impact in this league....

Well, you're entitled to your own opinion, but in MY opinion...You are very, very wrong. The guy can play.

Not sure anyone is suggesting that he wouldn't make an impact in this league. For the record, I'm certainly not.

Pachuco

12-21-2008, 02:54 AM

BTW - the other thread is suggesting Stalteri could be the guy as well. I'll take Radz in a heartbeat over Stalteri.

CretanBull

12-21-2008, 03:17 AM

Radz is a short term fix, who won't sell many jerseys and most people in the stadium won't know who the guy is until he plays a few games for TFC.

I don't really disagree with your over-all point, but I think you're selling Radzinski a little short here. Anyone who follows the CMNT knows who he is and he had many successfull years in the Premiership. Without question, globally he's a more well known player than De Ro. De Ro has made his mark on our national team, but the bulk of his league play has been in the MLS - a league that was widely ignored by Torontonians before we got a franchise. When De Ro was playing in San Jose (how many people in Toronto even knew San Jose had a team?) Radzinski was playing for a big club in Everton (mentoring a young Wayne Rooney) in the most watched sports league in the world.

Cashcleaner

12-21-2008, 04:02 AM

I don't think he'd we willing to leave the Bundesliga...

People are willing to step over their own grandmothers for the right price. ;)

For the record though, I don't think he's being considered.

The Kingpin

12-21-2008, 06:43 AM

Personally I think Radzinski would be good for a single season, but other than that he could prove to be a cap burden. At the age of 35, he is on the extreme downturn of his career and has been performing rather poorly of late. A core positive is that he never had much in the way of pace, and his game doesn't rely on this currently. But Radzinski as DP would be pandering even further to the Canadian element. The best player available is the best way to go, and let's be sure this player can integrate well into the roster for years to come... Three years at least.

BuSaPuNk

12-21-2008, 08:02 PM

Radzinski would be a great pick up for us. He is a little old sure....but still can bring it...look at how he played against Mexico in Edmonton this past year. I really don't care who the players is Canadian or not....we need someone who can put the ball in the net on a consistant basis....end of...(so when is Ameobi coming??)

greatwhitenorf

12-22-2008, 02:18 AM

I'd take Stalteri over Radzinski. Younger, versatile in the back four, leadership qualities, consistent model pro at top levels with title-winning team and CL playing experience, has a good eye for jumping into the attack. And a home town boy.

We also need to shore up our back four with James' departure. A DP is supposed to have influence on the team he plays for. A defender of Stalteri's stature and probable longevity - on a par with DeRo's - would have a great overall, long-term impact on TFC. Radzinski would be someone to be unsure about beyond the coming months.

CretanBull

12-22-2008, 02:42 AM

Radzinski would help us win games, Stalteri wouldn't. One defender on his own can't significantly influence a game. Even if one could Stalteri isn't good enough (not even in the MLS) to do it on his own. Good MLS defenses defend in zone, by numbers...adding a DP to that mix would be a waste. There's no question that we need to improve our D in a significant way, but that's a problem that can be addressed more cheaply than with DP money. Top end goal scoring can only be added with DP money...there aren't any cheap 15-20 goal scores out there lining up to play for us.

King Tut

12-22-2008, 06:22 AM

Maybe it's Jonothan De Guzman or Owen Hargreaves :)

Maybe it's Mauro Camoranesi..:p

http://www.juventusclubdoctoronto.com/images/member_pics/gallery/ItalyTrip2008/images/tiziana%20pace%20dona%20acamoranesi%20maglia%20tor ontof_c_jpg.jpg

http://www.juventusclubdoctoronto.com/images/member_pics/gallery/ItalyTrip2008/images/camoranesi%20firma%20per%20i%20nostri%20soci%20doc _jpg.jpg

BuSaPuNk

12-22-2008, 07:20 AM

I can just see the caption when Camoranesi seen that jersey. WOW!! This looks sharp! Wonder how I can wear this? lol..... Where were these pics from King Tut?

Steve

12-22-2008, 08:50 AM

nosensical cause you are being short sided. If Dero trully wants DP money, and we can't give it to him because we're signing Radz, then I CARE. At the end of the day, Dero can give us 5 good years before he reaches Radz age, I would want to keep him happy over bringing in a Canadian playing in a 2nd league Belgium team who is coming here to play retired football for a couple of years. For me, it's about keeping the future happy over some short term solution. Dero to me, can still be the future of this team, someone we can build around for the next 5 years. Someone who I think will show is still in his prime at age 30. Someone who none football fanatics recognize and someone who will sell jerseys and attract people to the stadium. Radz is a short term fix, who won't sell many jerseys and most people in the stadium won't know who the guy is until he plays a few games for TFC. Now, if we were telling Dero too bad because we are signing De Guzman for DP, different story.

Except for the fact that, I believe, MLS has essentially stepped in and said "No DP slot for current players". That means DeRo won't get a DP slot (which is actually probably good for Mo. DeRo is getting to the point where Europe is no longer an option, which means Mo can just say "sorry, not my fault, league mandate" and DeRo will have little choice but to accept it).

As for Canadian DPs, Friend would be my number one choice. I'm sorry, but that goal he scored against Brazil when he skied the keeper was amazing.