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denime
12-15-2008, 07:04 AM
Canadian content to fuel TFC
De Rosario a good start but more moves should be on the way
By GARETH WHEELER (gareth.wheeler@suntv.canoe.ca)

If patience is a virtue, Toronto FC is better off for it.
It was the middle of June, a time when TFC was among Major League Soccer's best clubs, when it was asked in this space what was needed to take the team to the next level.
Toronto native Dwayne De Rosario, who was starring for a Houston Dynamo team that likely was headed towards a rebuilding phase, was mentioned as the perfect addition.
Obviously, nothing transpired and the team paid the price for its inactivity.

Read more (http://www.torontosun.com/sports/soccer/2008/12/15/7750526-sun.html)



Blame Canada
Toronto scores big with trade for De Rosario
By Ives Galarcep,

So how does a blockbuster trade such as the one that sent three-time MLS Cup MVP Dwayne De Rosario to Toronto FC for rookie defender Julius James and an allocation get made? It happens only when you have two teams desperate to make a deal and a special player with an unyielding desire to return home.
In one corner was a young franchise in Toronto FC that needed an iconic figure, a franchise player who could capture the imagination of its fan base while making an impact on the field. In the other corner was a once-dominant Houston club that suddenly needed to revamp its roster after seeing its reign as league champion ended.

Read more (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=602378&sec=mls&root=mls&cc=5901)


SUNSHINE (http://www.torontosun.com/sunshinegirl/)

Mark in Ottawa
12-15-2008, 07:15 AM
Thanks D.
What with the bus strike here in Ottawa I have been getting to work early... too early... even before you put up the days news :eek:

It's a great way to start the day.
Now if I can just get some tickets when I get my red-list chance!

Fort York Redcoat
12-15-2008, 07:47 AM
Ives called us rebuilding.

I think it's just building at this point but here we go...

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 08:28 AM
The addition of DeRo has lifted the spirits of everyone on the board. Though I find it puzzling that the first article by Wheeler wants to put Robbo in at central defence. That's a no go, IMHO.

The best option for TFC as it stands now is for a diamond attacking 4-4-2 with a bit more emphasis on the centre of the pitch. I always get the impression that BMO is on the narrower side. So you could have something like:

-----------Barrett – Dichio------------
--------------DeRosario--------------
----------Guevara – Ricketts---------
---------------Robinson--------------
Brennan – Harmse – Marshall – Wynne

Where Guevara and Ricketts can choose to play near the centre or stretch to the outside as appropriate. That, and Robinson can focus more on staying behind to help out the backline and to make the connection from the defence to the rest of the midfield.

James17930
12-15-2008, 08:57 AM
The addition of DeRo has lifted the spirits of everyone on the board. Though I find it puzzling that the first article by Wheeler wants to put Robbo in at central defence. That's a no go, IMHO.

The best option for TFC as it stands now is for a diamond attacking 4-4-2 with a bit more emphasis on the centre of the pitch. I always get the impression that BMO is on the narrower side. So you could have something like:

-----------Barrett – Dichio------------
--------------DeRosario--------------
----------Guevara – Ricketts---------
---------------Robinson--------------
Brennan – Harmse – Marshall – Wynne

Where Guevara and Ricketts can choose to play near the centre or stretch to the outside as appropriate. That, and Robinson can focus more on staying behind to help out the backline and to make the connection from the defence to the rest of the midfield.

Je like.

But where are you going to put JDG? ;)

CoachGT
12-15-2008, 09:01 AM
^^I'd consider Dunivant ahead of Harmse in that spot. Bear in mind we don't know what the draft might bring.

graeme117
12-15-2008, 09:02 AM
wow ives puts our allocation at $800,000!?! awesome!

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 09:10 AM
^^I'd consider Dunivant ahead of Harmse in that spot. Bear in mind we don't know what the draft might bring.

I do think Dunivant is a better player but I don't think he's capable of playing CB, is he? As for the draft (or anything else), I've (obviously)constructed the line-up with what we have now. Sadly, there's very little we can do to predict what players we're going to pick up. Not that I think you were attacking me or anything. :D

Anyway, I'm getting really excited because new signings will potentially mean that we're starting to have real good players on the bench. In the midfield for example, if I had to drop one of the players to the bench, it would be Ricketts. Not that I have anything against him, just that you can't NOT play the other three.

I suppose you could expand the midfield to five but at the cost of either a striker (if we have an Angel like DP, then OK) for a 4-5-1 which I'm not a huge fan of, or go to a 3-5-2 but we need one hell of a CB to boss it back there. Wynne (probably) and a Bennan/Dunivant combo (maybe) would be capable of being wingbacks.

Dave67
12-15-2008, 09:14 AM
Like the lineup Lucky Strike. I do think that whomever we bring in next, and pretty much regardless of what position they play, Dichio will end up on the bench. I see Dichio as a 70th min sub this season. I love him as a player for TFC but if we are to go forward I hope the big man becomes a sparkplug sub.

BuSaPuNk
12-15-2008, 09:18 AM
Morning D! If only Wheelers right and step 2 is getting De Guzman. That would be amazing. But in all this comotion I can't help but realize if the CMNT play who would play for TFC??

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 09:27 AM
Like the lineup Lucky Strike. I do think that whomever we bring in next, and pretty much regardless of what position they play, Dichio will end up on the bench. I see Dichio as a 70th min sub this season. I love him as a player for TFC but if we are to go forward I hope the big man becomes a sparkplug sub.

Thank you. I'd tend to agree sadly. I love Dichio but another quality striker will probably see him to the bench. Which actually may turn out to be a blessing: if he plays less, he has less chance of being injured.

As for the statement I bolded, for some reason it got me thinking: could Dichio play defence if we have enough attacking options? More specifically, if this is at all possible I see him as a sort of sweeper.

He's huge, he's 'ard, he's strong and can head the ball very well. I can't find fault with his positioning and the only problem I see is a lack of pace. But as a sweeper, you don't stray too far from your goal regardless. Anyway, just a random though to entertain.

DOMIN8R
12-15-2008, 09:45 AM
[quote=Lucky Strike;301419]Thank you. I'd tend to agree sadly. I love Dichio but another quality striker will probably see him to the bench. Which actually may turn out to be a blessing: if he plays less, he has less chance of being injured.

quote]

:iagree:

Dave67
12-15-2008, 09:46 AM
Thank you. I'd tend to agree sadly. I love Dichio but another quality striker will probably see him to the bench. Which actually may turn out to be a blessing: if he plays less, he has less chance of being injured.

As for the statement I bolded, for some reason it got me thinking: could Dichio play defence if we have enough attacking options? More specifically, if this is at all possible I see him as a sort of sweeper.


He'd win balls in the air and punish opposing players. The real problem I see is that refs in this league seem to like to punish him for his aggresiveness. I fear he would concede to many freekicks.

tfc
12-15-2008, 09:46 AM
regarding other Canadian players to bring in, deguzman would obviously be a massive signing, but what about Rob Friend? I haven't really heard his name being thrown around much ... If its a DP forward we get (and Mo has stated that whoever it is, he was hoping to get a Canadian) what are our options? Friend, Hume (who wont come now) ... Gerba?

Cashcleaner
12-15-2008, 09:54 AM
Ives called us rebuilding.

I think it's just building at this point but here we go...

LOL! True that. Though I'll admit that it has been a somewhat lengthy "building" process.


regarding other Canadian players to bring in, deguzman would obviously be a massive signing, but what about Rob Friend? I haven't really heard his name being thrown around much ... If its a DP forward we get (and Mo has stated that whoever it is, he was hoping to get a Canadian) what are our options? Friend, Hume (who wont come now) ... Gerba?

I just want to mention that while I like the general idea of bringing in an influx of Canadian players, should we spend a DP slot on a domestic player? I don't think we should, specifically because we could take a big hit in the roster with regards to national team commitments. That would be my only concern.

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 09:55 AM
regarding other Canadian players to bring in, deguzman would obviously be a massive signing, but what about Rob Friend? I haven't really heard his name being thrown around much ... If its a DP forward we get (and Mo has stated that whoever it is, he was hoping to get a Canadian) what are our options? Friend, Hume (who wont come now) ... Gerba?

I don't know if it's just me, but it seems Mo shouldn't restrict himself to only Canadian DP forwards. If there's another guy who's better and at the right price, we shouldn't ignore him because of his nationality.

After, Hume is hurt and Barnsley recently paid £1.2 million for him, Gerba has just recently signed for MK Dons so it's hard to see him quit that team so soon and as for Friend...well there's nothing I can think of but still, we should consider non-Canadians.

tfc
12-15-2008, 10:11 AM
I totally agree, I just remember him saying at the end of the season he was looking at a Canadian DP.

nimamalek
12-15-2008, 10:22 AM
I think Rob Friend would be a perfect replacement for Dichio, our team plays well with someone like Dichio up front and Friend plays a similar game, and if De Guzman is on the radar I dont see any reason why friend cant be persuaded to come over here.

Cashcleaner
12-15-2008, 10:25 AM
I don't know if it's just me, but it seems Mo shouldn't restrict himself to only Canadian DP forwards. If there's another guy who's better and at the right price, we shouldn't ignore him because of his nationality.

After, Hume is hurt and Barnsley recently paid £1.2 million for him, Gerba has just recently signed for MK Dons so it's hard to see him quit that team so soon and as for Friend...well there's nothing I can think of but still, we should consider non-Canadians.

True to a point, but I think the argument for more Canadians (at least my argument) is that they'll likely play with a lot more drive and focus than a player who's really got no loyalties to the city or country. Look at DeRo, for example. As soon as Toronto was awarded the franchise, he was pumped with all the speculation surrounding him and a possible move here. You could easily tell he loved the idea of playing for his hometown, and I think the same would apply to most other domestic players.

I agree with what you're saying in that we shouldn't rule out anyone who isn't from Canada, but I just wanted to point out the advantage of local players playing for Toronto FC.

denime
12-15-2008, 10:27 AM
LOL! True that. Though I'll admit that it has been a somewhat lengthy "building" process.



I just want to mention that while I like the general idea of bringing in an influx of Canadian players, should we spend a DP slot on a domestic player? I don't think we should, specifically because we could take a big hit in the roster with regards to national team commitments. That would be my only concern.


This should be a reason #1 to bring Canadian DP.There is no such a thing as national team commitments for Canadain players.
We are out of WCQ,we still have an Idiot for a NT coach,who doesn't want to resign and best players dont want to play under his comand for CMNT. CMNT will play only at Gold Cup next summer,comparing to so many other NTs that still have WCQ to play in the next year.
DP is DP "domestic" of "foreign" who cares.
Domestic DP is not concern at this point,only concern we should have is if Mo is going to sign any DP after bringing DeRO home.

Technorgasm
12-15-2008, 10:29 AM
Toronto's reward is a player who will boost a Toronto attack that struggled at times. Whether TFC groups De Rosario with Amado Guevara and Carl Robinson in a 4-5-1 formation or plays De Rosario as a withdrawn forward in a 4-4-1-1, the prospect of having the creative tandem of De Rosario and Guevara working together is a scary proposition. Especially if you consider that Toronto is expected to use its designated player slot on a forward.

Just seeing the news, with formation that include De-Ro make the shittiest monday bright and beautiful.

*sigh*

WALK ON TFC!

Cashcleaner
12-15-2008, 10:33 AM
This should be a reason #1 to bring Canadian DP.There is no such a thing as national team commitments for Canadain players.
We are out of WCQ,we still have an Idiot for a NT coach,who doesn't want to resign and best players dont want to play under his command for CMNT. CMNT will play only at Gold Cup next summer,comparing to so many other NTs that still have WCQ to play in the next year.
DP is DP "domestic" of "foreign" who cares.
Domestic DP is not concern at this point,only concern we should have is if Mo is going to sign any DP after bringing DeRO home.

World Cup is over and done with for Canada, but as you said we've got the Gold Cup coming up and there's always Friendlies that could throw a monkey wrench into TFC's plans.

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 10:37 AM
True to a point, but I think the argument for more Canadians (at least my argument) is that they'll likely play with a lot more drive and focus than a player who's really got no loyalties to the city or country. Look at DeRo, for example. As soon as Toronto was awarded the franchise, he was pumped with all the speculation surrounding him and a possible move here. You could easily tell he loved the idea of playing for his hometown, and I think the same would apply to most other domestic players.

I agree with what you're saying in that we shouldn't rule out anyone who isn't from Canada, but I just wanted to point out the advantage of local players playing for Toronto FC.

That's true, and in my view, undeniable. But would there be that much of a difference? I know it's hard (read near impossible) to measure this effect but for some reason which I can't explain, it seems to me like the effect wouldn't be huge.

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 10:38 AM
World Cup is over and done with for Canada, but as you said we've got the Gold Cup coming up and there's always Friendlies that could throw a monkey wrench into TFC's plans.

Didn't Carver consider not releasing players for friendlies? Do we know what his latest stance is on that?

Technorgasm
12-15-2008, 10:40 AM
============ SUTTON ===========

Wynne === Brennan = Marshal === Dunni

============= ROBO ============

Rickets ======= DERO ====== Guevara

========= Barret = Danny ==========


= WIN

Roogsy
12-15-2008, 10:41 AM
I still don't like any formation with Jimmy B in the middle. He should be on the flank. We gotta sort out this defender situation next.

tfc
12-15-2008, 11:05 AM
Say the wheeler article came true and we did get DeGuzman, what do we do with Robbo? Does he play in the back? Mo loves the mid haha

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 11:05 AM
============ SUTTON ===========

Wynne === Brennan = Marshal === Dunni

============= ROBO ============

Rickets ======= DERO ====== Guevara

========= Barret = Danny ==========


= WIN

I don't know, I also don't like Brennan in the middle and Guevara isn't exactly a wide player. He can go there once in a while but his strength I would argue is principally in the middle of the pitch.

Oldtimer
12-15-2008, 11:07 AM
A new MLS policy will affect Barry McLean (Mo's agent):


The MLS board of governors voted unanimously last month to prohibit agents from simultaneously representing MLS players and coaches, a policy that top labor lawyers say may violate both U.S. antitrust law and labor law.
MLS Deputy Commissioner Ivan Gazidis alerted MLS coaches and their agents of the new policy in a memo dated Nov. 24, writing “the Board believes that simultaneous representation of both a Player and an MLS Coach/Team Management Employee by the same agent results in a conflict of interest that is damaging to the integrity of MLS.”
The memo applies to all agents who represent not only coaches, but team general managers, presidents and other team management staff and any player playing in MLS as well as any prospective player that may play in MLS in the future.


http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/60950

rocker
12-15-2008, 11:36 AM
I don't know, I also don't like Brennan in the middle and Guevara isn't exactly a wide player. He can go there once in a while but his strength I would argue is principally in the middle of the pitch.

i like Brennan in the middle. he looked good there the few times he played there.. better than on the left, where he gets burned running sideways/backwards as the wingers try to deke him.

then slot Dunny into the left, his natural position, and things are lookin pretty good. but a solid CB from the market would be nice.

mighty_torontofc_2008
12-15-2008, 11:40 AM
Its nice to see other players taking a pay cut to bring Dero home, but its sad that the players have to do this. MLS up the salary cup for the lower wage earners to make a decent living over here.

MUFC_Niagara
12-15-2008, 11:46 AM
"If de Guzman believes he's better off being a major player on one of England's or Europe's middle of the pack clubs, then so be it. On the flip side, returning home to become one of the faces of Canadian soccer may be a profitable and worthwhile venture."

If Wheeler seriously thinks JDG would choose the MLS over the BPL at 27 years of age, he is seriously out of touch with the ambitions of a young footballer.....

tfc
12-15-2008, 12:00 PM
By the way, no De Guzman:
http://my.thescore.com/footyblog/default.aspx

MUFC_Niagara
12-15-2008, 12:05 PM
What an irresponsible piece of journalism by Wheeler....

tfc
12-15-2008, 12:48 PM
With our 800K in allocation, can we sign a few guys and pay their full salary in allocation rather than take the hit to our cap? That would be an absolutely massive advantage for us in signing good quality CB's...

denime
12-15-2008, 01:02 PM
World Cup is over and done with for Canada, but as you said we've got the Gold Cup coming up and there's always Friendlies that could throw a monkey wrench into TFC's plans.

FIFA friendlies,WCQ and Gold cup will affect TFC no matter who is DP.Most of
DP are NT players and they will be called to play for their country anyway,so why not have domestic one,when we have less official games to play than any other European or S.American country,even top 6 CONCACRAP teams have more games to play,than Canada.

Just bring DP I don't care if he is Domestic player or not.

Oldtimer
12-15-2008, 01:54 PM
With our 800K in allocation, can we sign a few guys and pay their full salary in allocation rather than take the hit to our cap? That would be an absolutely massive advantage for us in signing good quality CB's...

Yes we can!

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 02:00 PM
With our 800K in allocation, can we sign a few guys and pay their full salary in allocation rather than take the hit to our cap? That would be an absolutely massive advantage for us in signing good quality CB's...

Though at some point, allocation money is used up. I'm sure we'd receive some more at some point but potentially (and likely) not as much as this year. We don't pawn our players at £2.6 million every day! Running out of allocation would mean we'd need to get rid of these players for 2010. Not a good way to build a team.

P.S. I'm pretty sure this is how allocation works in terms of expiration. If it doesn't, I'd like to know. :D

tfc
12-15-2008, 02:17 PM
That is pretty freaking awesome. Even if you signed 2 CB's worth 200K each and paid 100K of their salary in allocation, that is a massive advantage over another team signing a 100K CB in terms of quality. It will be interesting to see how much we get for Wynne if and when he leaves.

What do you guys think about MLS teams partnering up with teams in other countries ... Do you think is advantageous/detrimental to the development of the league or quality on the pitch? In some ways I guess it could be seen as detrimental as it accentuates MLS's position as a feeder league to Europe, while at the same time, being partnered to a team in Europe might also improve our position when sending players overseas or bringing guys in (like Edgar on loan for example) ... Is the trade-off worth it?

tfc
12-15-2008, 02:23 PM
oooh what do you think about this possibility too: Instead of giving teams the ability to sign a DP (and when one isn't signed, its literally wasted) why not put a cap on it when not used (say 1 million) and allow teams to distribute that 1mm however they would like? But, if your going to sign a big name DP, the 1 mm cap is taken away and you can sign a DP for whatever you want ...

jloome
12-15-2008, 04:15 PM
i like Brennan in the middle. he looked good there the few times he played there.. better than on the left, where he gets burned running sideways/backwards as the wingers try to deke him.

then slot Dunny into the left, his natural position, and things are lookin pretty good. but a solid CB from the market would be nice.

Oh come on Rocker! He wasn't awful, but he was hardly a starting centre back. He's slight of frame and was beaten over the top several times. His positional sense may be somewhat less damaging there, but his strengths are only strengths because of whom he's ahead: Velez and James, who are both useless as teats on a bull.

If Jimmy isn't a good enough left back, he's certainly not a good enough centre-half. And he is a good enoguh left back for this league, he just has to be positionally restrained -- they managed to get Wynne to sit back more in the second half of the season, so surely they can get Brennan to do the same.

I want a big, scary mofo at centre half who's quick nevertheless and a good marker. Brennan is not an intimidating presence back there.

jloome
12-15-2008, 04:16 PM
What an irresponsible piece of journalism by Wheeler....

It was an opinion column, not journalism. Learn the difference. The former is expected to be opinionated and based at least part in the writer's own perspective. The latter is not. There was nothing irresponsible about this; myopic and silly, yes. Irresponsible, no.

Alonso
12-15-2008, 06:41 PM
That's true, and in my view, undeniable. But would there be that much of a difference? I know it's hard (read near impossible) to measure this effect but for some reason which I can't explain, it seems to me like the effect wouldn't be huge.


On the contrary, look at the Montreal Canadiens, who unlike the leafs (in my mind) have nutured home talent to there benefit. Or the all-blacks New Zealand rugby team, home pride brings out the best in them, its tangible.

If TFC started a long standing tradition of nuturing and supporting home grown/nutured talent, it would be better off IMHO.

Beach_Red
12-15-2008, 07:58 PM
On the contrary, look at the Montreal Canadiens, who unlike the leafs (in my mind) have nutured home talent to there benefit. Or the all-blacks New Zealand rugby team, home pride brings out the best in them, its tangible.

If TFC started a long standing tradition of nuturing and supporting home grown/nutured talent, it would be better off IMHO.

Just for conversation, the Canadiens never really nurtured talent - when the NHL was six teams they automatically got all the French players. After expansion in '67 (though really not until Buffalo joined and put together the French Connection Line in the '70's) Montreal's record at local talent hasn't been that great. They stole Lafleur in the draft and picked up a few guys like Patrick Roy but they haven't had much in the way of homesgrown talent (like Lemieux, Lecavalier, and so on) since the whole league started treating the players the same. The Leafs never had the advantage of the rest of the league leaving Ontario-born players for them.

keem-o-sabi
12-15-2008, 10:07 PM
well here is today's daily hottie (http://coedmagazine.com/daily/46680/) sorry it's late tonight :)

Lucky Strike
12-15-2008, 10:34 PM
On the contrary, look at the Montreal Canadiens, who unlike the leafs (in my mind) have nutured home talent to there benefit. Or the all-blacks New Zealand rugby team, home pride brings out the best in them, its tangible.

If TFC started a long standing tradition of nuturing and supporting home grown/nutured talent, it would be better off IMHO.

Well actually it's not tangible! :D You can't touch it. But that's not the point. Like I said, I don't deny it exists, I suppose we just disagree on the degree of the effect.