Away Travel in the MLS...

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Without getting into little squabbles here and there, I would just like to say that the list provided below is just a framework for the bigger idea.

Don’t you guys and gals think that one thing that the MLS has going for it, is it’s uniqueness of having world class cities under one league umbrella. Each team or city in the MLS has the opportunity to be champion. This situation presents a rather interesting Travel and Tourism scenario. Of course the traveling costs can be quite expensive for us, due to the fact that we are covering great distances, but on the flipside, if you conduct due diligence you can usually find great travel deals also!.

I’m not downplaying the major European cities. Its just that they only get pitted against one another in Champions league play, which tend to be the same teams over and over again. Our MLS situation tends to be a very unique one, in which we have

Toronto
New York City
Los Angeles
Chicago
Boston
Philadelphia
Seattle
Dallas
Denver
Miami(possibly)

All these major centers bring with them interesting and fun travel opportunities which because of the distance, can be very different from one another. I find it very cool that not only can I watch my team here at home, but I can also interlace my travel plans with their away games! Each major away city can provide excellent world class culture, entertainment, museums, bars/nightclubs etc…The leagues referred down below don’t provide this sort of thing to the DEGREE that we get here…yes they get to travel but it can’t be as exciting for supporters of Man Utd going to an away game in Liverpool, as it is for us going to an away game in NYC right?? I think you guys catch my drift…


What are your thoughts??



All these major leagues are pretty boring TRAVEL wise if you were a resident of that leagues country no?? I mean they only have like 2-3 options when you break it down...


La Liga – Real Madrid, Barcelona, Villareal, Valencia

Premiership – Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool

Serie A – Inter, AC Milan, Juventus, Roma

Bundesliga – Werder Bermen, Bayern, Schalke

Erdivisie – Ajax, PSV

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

It’s an interesting perspective. I have to admit that there’s not a city on your MLS list that I wouldn’t be interested in visiting.

It’s probably a little too apples and oranges to compare the situation in the MLS to the travel situation in the big European leagues. I would assume that in most cases fans travelling to domestic fixtures in the European leagues would be doing it as a day trip, where as MLS trips would need to be overnight. If you’re just making a day trip you probably less interested in what a city has to offer than if your staying for a day or two.

[Chevy]

Definitely agree with this. The only issue with North America is the distance between the major centres. You can get more bang for your travel buck in Europe vs. over here.

One question - Why isn't Columbus on the list?? :)

[zeelaw]

Interesting perspective. Your example about Liverpool kind of falls flat considering this year it was crowned one of the European Capital's of Culture lol...

I would use something like Stoke City or Portsmouth lol...

[BC101]

Interesting perspective. Your example about Liverpool kind of falls flat considering this year it was crowned one of the European Capital's of Culture lol...

I would use something like Stoke City or Portsmouth lol...MMMMMMM interesting theory... Wont take you up on it thoughLOL.
Interesting perspective of the original poster as well.　There are quite world class cities in the MLS。

[Bobo]

Are all those American cities "big" on the world stage? I think things depend on the perspective you take. Many Europeans would probably look at this thread and laugh since its quite possible that they wouldn't have even heard of all those those cities. In Italy for instance, there are so many beautiful cities, somehow I doubt they'd be envying us for boasting Seattle and Dallas, nice as they may be. Not to mention it's difficult to find Columbuses there too.

I think that Europeans take travel more lightheartedly than we do, which is why there is more buzz for us.

[werewolf]

The US has more population and land then any country in Europe (besides Russia, which is half in Asia), they would have an advantage to begin with. Though outside of LA, NY and Chicago, there really aren't any other eye-popping 'World Class' cities that dwarf european cities of similar relative size and importance to their country.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Are all those American cities "big" on the world stage? I think things depend on the perspective you take. Many Europeans would probably look at this thread and laugh since its quite possible that they wouldn't have even heard of all those those cities. In Italy for instance, there are so many beautiful cities, somehow I doubt they'd be envying us for boasting Seattle and Dallas, nice as they may be. Not to mention it's difficult to find Columbuses there too.

I think that Europeans take travel more lightheartedly than we do, which is why there is more buzz for us.

I'm not Italian, but i have friends here and in Italy who would take a spot on both sides...

I think that Ultra Super Mega Mo, brings a good point in that the European Domestic games are more of a Day trip...with that being said, i think you are looking at the Italian Serie A being one big beautiful amazing place(which it is) but people living there don't see it that way...they would view the "away game" as more of the same...does that make sense??

[Roogsy]

Bobo...I am quite sure Europeans have heard of most of those cities...and would indeed love to visit them just as much as you or I would love to see Florence. To them, America is just as "exotic" and far away as they are to us. And just like we are awed by European cities in the movies, they too would love to see "New York" and all it's grit, or South Beach Miami and all the lovely ladies.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

The US has more population and land then any country in Europe (besides Russia, which is half in Asia), they would have an advantage to begin with. Though outside of LA, NY and Chicago, there really aren't any other eye-popping 'World Class' cities that dwarf european cities of similar relative size and importance to their country.

Again, i'm talking about domestic leagues....Your looking at Europe as a super continent where its one BIG league, which is not what i'm refering to...You would have to break it up into each countries own league, then it becomes a much smaller place...Look at Spain for instance...if you were a domestic fan/resident an away game might take you to Madrid or Barcelona but thats about it in terms of big cities....

[werewolf]

No. I am looking at the individual country. Thats why I put "relative size and importance to their country".

Seattle...Dallas...nice towns sure, but lets not overstate their importance.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

No. I am looking at the individual country. Thats why I put "relative size and importance to their country".

Seattle...Dallas...nice towns sure, but lets not overstate their importance.


aaaaahhhhh but look at how different they are to one another...

cities within germany are probably much more similar or homongenous then Seattle is to Dallas, i mean there is quite a contrast there...

[werewolf]

Spend a weekend in Leipzig, then a weekend in Cologne or Munich. They are about as homogeneous as Edmonton and Cape Town.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Spend a weekend in Leipzig, then a weekend in Cologne or Munich. They are about as homogeneous as Edmonton and Cape Town.

sorry i've personally been to both Berlin and Frankfurt my friend and tend to respectively disagree...

[werewolf]

there was a reason I mentioned the cities I did. Berlin and Frankfurt are both industrial/commercialized cities.

[Bobo]

Again, i'm talking about domestic leagues....Your looking at Europe as a super continent where its one BIG league, which is not what i'm refering to...You would have to break it up into each countries own league, then it becomes a much smaller place...Look at Spain for instance...if you were a domestic fan/resident an away game might take you to Madrid or Barcelona but thats about it in terms of big cities....

So perhaps the question is better suited for Big Soccer where you can ask American posters. We're crossing borders when we go on MLS trips, which adds a lot.

But saying there are only two big cities in Spain is pretty small minded. Ibiza is only the party capital of the world. (It's considered part of Spain no?) Valencia, Sevilla and maybe even Bilbao I think are deserving of being called "big" as well, more so than Denver, Dallas or Seattle in the US. There is more to a "big" European city, than a top class football team.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

So perhaps the question is better suited for Big Soccer where you can ask American posters. We're crossing borders when we go on MLS trips, which adds a lot.

But saying there are only two big cities in Spain is pretty small minded. Ibiza is only the party capital of the world. (It's considered part of Spain no?) Valencia, Sevilla and maybe even Bilbao I think are deserving of being called "big" as well, more so than Denver, Dallas or Seattle in the US. There is more to a "big" European city, than a top class football team.

I think you're missing the point.....:rolleyes:

[Dub Narcotic]

So perhaps the question is better suited for Big Soccer where you can ask American posters. We're crossing borders when we go on MLS trips, which adds a lot.

But saying there are only two big cities in Spain is pretty small minded. Ibiza is only the party capital of the world. (It's considered part of Spain no?) Valencia, Sevilla and maybe even Bilbao I think are deserving of being called "big" as well, more so than Denver, Dallas or Seattle in the US. There is more to a "big" European city, than a top class football team.

The metro area of Dallas is over six million people; the metro area of Bilbao is not even a million, although I think they would both be interesting to visit, BTW.

[ensco]

It's apples and oranges because of the distances.

Most away games in Eoropean leagues can be done in a single, although long, day. There are obvious exceptions, I know, I'm talking about the majority of games, not all of them. So tourism is generally much less important to the travel decision over there

I was at the Bayern Munich at Frankfurt game in October. I would say most of the away support came up on the train - it's about a 3 hour trip - in the afternoon (I saw them arrive by the dozen in the Frankfurt main train station), and they mostly went back the same night at 11pm. NB: This was a midweek game.

[BuSaPuNk]

^ It's more or less location that makes it so much eaiser in europe. If you look at here and even do like a 6 hour trip there, there isn't much to get to....Colombus, New York, Chicago, Montreal and that is about it. Away travel is so much harder in North America. If there was someway of getting like cheap charter flights to San Jose and Salt Lake and stuff I think there would be more interest.

[Cashcleaner]

New York, Boston/Foxborough, Chicago are all pretty "big" cities when you look at it from a cultural point of view and each of them are less than a day's travel from Toronto. Miami, Seattle, and LA are as well, but obviously it takes much longer to get there.

Sure, places like Columbus or Salt Lake City don't float a lot of people's boats, but I think there is a good overall mix of place to visit.

[Fort York Redcoat]

So we're lucky to be able to travel further than most domestic leagues in the world because of the culture and pop density?

Agree that the distance makes the trip special to us.

Disagree that these cities offer more than the Capitals of Europe even on a domestic league scale. Saying bigger is better doesn't mean there's more culture there.

[druid]

Barcelona, Munich, Amsterdam, Milan, Rome
vs
Salt Lake, Philadelphia, Dallas, Denver, Columbus

Is this thread for real?

[Fort York Redcoat]

Barcelona, Munich, Amsterdam, Milan, Rome
vs
Salt Lake, Philadelphia, Dallas, Denver, Columbus

Is this thread for real?

No read above he's trying to compare domestic leagues. So his point is other than the Capitals in Europe what does the other teams cities have to offer?

[Cashcleaner]

Barcelona, Munich, Amsterdam, Milan, Rome
vs
Salt Lake, Philadelphia, Dallas, Denver, Columbus

Is this thread for real?

Oh yeah, I forgot that because Europe is the greatest place on earth for football and we all have to be more like them or something.

Let's just move the whole city of Toronto to somewhere in the North Sea. While we're at it, let's all learn Spanish, French, and German so we can worship our masters better.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Oh yeah, I forgot that because Europe is the greatest place on earth for football and we all have to be more like them or something.

Let's just move the whole city of Toronto to somewhere in the North Sea. While we're at it, let's all learn Spanish, French, and German so we can worship our masters better.

But that would mean we have to agree on which masters to choose for the entire city and that would be near impossible Cash.;):D

[Cashcleaner]

^ That's right, because they're all so powerful and omnipotent!

Oh woe! Oh merciless languish!

[Boschmeister]

One question - Why isn't Columbus on the list?? :)

I think the OP answered that question

"Each major away city can provide excellent world class culture, entertainment, museums, bars/nightclubs etc…"

[druid]

No read above he's trying to compare domestic leagues. So his point is other than the Capitals in Europe what does the other teams cities have to offer?

Shorter bus rides. Kidding... sort of.

But the list of comparisons is a bit stilted. I'd agree for some place like Denmark or Scotland but the list for Spain is a bit short. You can add

Bilboa, Sevilla, Malaga, Vigo, Mallorca, and Pamplona.

Similar expansions could probably be done for the other European countries. Its also worth remembering that most of the larger European nations will have better transportation links between the cities and the football grounds. We're very lucky in Toronto to have such a good links. Might not seem like a biggie but its huge to me when I'm an away supporter.

The MLS list, on a cultural basis, could probably be shortened to:

New York
Chicago
Boston
Denver (for natural attractions)
LA (if you're into that kind of thing)

I think the others have questionable cultural value but that's where this exercise gets highly subjective.

[jabbronies]

The MLS list, on a cultural basis, could probably be shortened to:

New York
Chicago
Boston
Denver (for natural attractions)
LA (if you're into that kind of thing)

I think the others have questionable cultural value but that's where this exercise gets highly subjective.


If Miami gets in, then add them to the list.
Also, not tooting our own horn, but Toronto is a well known city in the world.

[Hitcho]

What's this thread actually about? The cities in which there are MLS teams, compared to cities in Europe which have football teams?!

Not sure what it's driving at!

[jaahuuu]

All these major leagues are pretty boring TRAVEL wise if you were a resident of that leagues country no?? I mean they only have like 2-3 options when you break it down...


La Liga – Real Madrid, Barcelona, Villareal, Valencia

Premiership – Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool

Serie A – Inter, AC Milan, Juventus, Roma

Bundesliga – Werder Bermen, Bayern, Schalke

Erdivisie – Ajax, PSV
Interesting list of cities you've got there. I love Schalke and patiently wait until the day I can again return to Gelsenkirchen, but how does that city make your list and Berlin does not? I'd also tack on Cologne, Stuttgart, Frankfurt and Hamburg. In Italy you have to go to Florence and Naples, and I, for personal reasons, would love go to Palermo, but I can understand it not being on most peoples' lists. I agree on the cities in England (though there are 9 prem teams in those 3 cities), you have to look what there is to do in the city. I've visited about half the North American cities on your list, and a 3 or 4 day weekend is about enough time to do everything I want to do, I was in London for the better part of 2 weeks and that wasn't nearly enough time.

If you want to compare things, it would probably be a better comparison sizewise to compare North America to Europe, in which case there is no contest.

[Fort York Redcoat]

TR&W started this thread (correct me if I'm wrong) to say the MLS leaguewide has more to offer on a city by city basis than any Country in Europe on its own which is a nice thing to say about our league.

But I disagree. I have no love for America in general and less interest in most of the MLS cities but...

I will get to them all and will more than likely find reasons to return but...

I doubt it will have much to do with the culture or attractions in the cities and more about the experience of being away with my brethren and that's a draw no matter if it's Coventry, Elgin, or (insert other obscure unattractive place you know here)!

[Hitcho]

^ Oh, in that case I definitely disagree. US cities are basically all lacking in any meaningful history, and many of them have the same kind of grid-based, commercial US feel about them. The biggest variation they have lies in geographical surroundings and climate, which stems from the fact that it's such a big country geographically.

I'd say there's more to see and draw you to in Rome than in the entire USA put together, MLS presence or not, quite frankly. Add in Milan, Turin and Florence and the US is beaten sideways and into a pulp. The same goes for Spain with Barcelona and Madrid - those two alone offer more than anything you'll ever find in the US. Same goes for France - you've got Paris, Monaco, Lyon, Bordeaux. The history, culture, architecture, cuisine and ambience in all of these places puts US cities in the shade, imho.

I'm not saying that MSL comes last on the list, far from it. And I do agree that the cities you listed each have their own draws and attractions for different reasons and yeah, for sure I'd love to take an away trip to most of them turned into a long weekend or week away. But as an overall package, I'd take any of the countries listed above over the US MLS cities hands down. Can't really speak for countries like Norway and Sweden because I've not been there. But if I was given the choice of doing a football tour in those countries or the US, I'd pick Scandinavia for sure.

I would put the US above England though, and given that I'm English, that's quite a statement! You just don't get the weather there, and most of the big footballing cities are pretty industrial, which stems from the fact that football is and was traditionally a working man's game in England. I think the same thing can be said about Germany, although don't quote me on that.

[TFC Via Buffalo]

^ Oh, in that case I definitely disagree. US cities are basically all lacking in any meaningful history, and many of them have the same kind of grid-based, commercial US feel about them. The biggest variation they have lies in geographical surroundings and climate, which stems from the fact that it's such a big country geographically.

I'd say there's more to see and draw you to in Rome than in the entire USA put together, MLS presence or not, quite frankly. Add in Milan, Turin and Florence and the US is beaten sideways and into a pulp. The same goes for Spain with Barcelona and Madrid - those two alone offer more than anything you'll ever find in the US. Same goes for France - you've got Paris, Monaco, Lyon, Bordeaux. The history, culture, architecture, cuisine and ambience in all of these places puts US cities in the shade, imho.

I'm not saying that MSL comes last on the list, far from it. And I do agree that the cities you listed each have their own draws and attractions for different reasons and yeah, for sure I'd love to take an away trip to most of them turned into a long weekend or week away. But as an overall package, I'd take any of the countries listed above over the US MLS cities hands down. Can't really speak for countries like Norway and Sweden because I've not been there. But if I was given the choice of doing a football tour in those countries or the US, I'd pick Scandinavia for sure.

I would put the US above England though, and given that I'm English, that's quite a statement! You just don't get the weather there, and most of the big footballing cities are pretty industrial, which stems from the fact that football is and was traditionally a working man's game in England. I think the same thing can be said about Germany, although don't quote me on that.

Considering the country was officially formed in 1776 and only had sporatic visitors untill the early pilgrims AND we pretty much destroyed the past history with the Native Americans to begin with........ it's safe to say that our history would obviously pale in comparison to that of a city like Rome or Athens. It's hard to have amazing, historic land marks in some cities when they weren't even formed untill less then 200 years ago.

But we do have "The Biggest Turd In The World", it's called Columbus. It's like Rome, if Rome was filed with rednecks, racisits, morons, terrible architecture and a complete disregard for civility. Come Visit!

[stugautz]

Anybody get the latest e-mail from MLS about their promotion with AA? The 10% off flights with AA?

I can understand departure locations within the US only...but destinations include: US, Mexico and the Caribbean? What is the big deal about including Canada? Doesn't Canada have an MLS team?

[Hitcho]

But we do have "The Biggest Turd In The World", it's called Columbus. It's like Rome, if Rome was filed with rednecks, racisits, morons, terrible architecture and a complete disregard for civility. Come Visit!

:hump:

[jloome]

Having lived on both sides of the Atlantic for more than a decade, this thread seems utterly loony to me. The one problem I've always had with North American cities is that they're soooo cookie cutter!

Why? Simple: age. Old cities tend to retain much more architectural diversity, which in turn tends to be tied to broader cultural implications. So while some North American cities (New York, Chicago, Montreal) have a genuinely cosmopolitan sense to them, most simply don't. They're just big cities. I've lived in Ottawa, and I've lived in Edmonton. There is virtually no difference.

In Europe, even VILLAGES have culture, history, hundreds and even thousands of years of tradition. Most of us only arrived in North American after the 1600s, so we only have a few hundred years to build on.

Really, I'm sure that sounds Euro snobbish or something, but when it comes to having a sense of broader culture, comparing North America to Europe is like comparing a silent film with the lastest in Imax.

[SilverSamurai]

Oh yeah, I forgot that because Europe is the greatest place on earth for football and we all have to be more like them or something.

Let's just move the whole city of Toronto to somewhere in the North Sea. While we're at it, let's all learn Spanish, French, and German so we can worship our masters better.

Well I have 2/3 down! lol

I wouldn't consider really any cities besides NYC and Chicago really cultural. I guess LA to an extent, but it depends on what you want to do.

If you want to consider "history" it's a lot harder to do so on the continent since things are generally not as old. Once you take out the former Spanish colonies (Mexico for example), we pretty much are only left w/ Montreal and Quebec City. English North America was settled permanently much later. Take TO for example, how much is really "colonial"?

[Cashcleaner]

^ Not a lot anymore.

But I think there is some bad logic getting tossed about in that history = culture. For example, while London was the world's first megalopolis and has centuries of interesting history (ie: bloodshed, fire, plague, etc.) I'd say Boston is equally interesting, especially when you consider its role in the creation of the United States. The same can be said for New York and Washington DC for obvious reasons. Personally, I'm a big fan of museums and all three cities have a good share of them - notably the Smithsonian in DC.

[Hitcho]

^ Not a lot anymore.

But I think there is some bad logic getting tossed about in that history = culture. For example, while London was the world's first megalopolis and has centuries of interesting history (ie: bloodshed, fire, plague, etc.) I'd say Boston is equally interesting, especially when you consider its role in the creation of the United States. The same can be said for New York and Washington DC for obvious reasons. Personally, I'm a big fan of museums and all three cities have a good share of them - notably the Smithsonian in DC.

:rofl: sorry, I take your point and I can agree with you to some point, but to just post it that boldly on a forum like this sounds like a total nerdy kid voting for a musem trip instead of gym class!!! The ROM is open on game days at BMO Field if you'd rather be hanging out there instead mate! :rofl: :D

[Cashcleaner]

^ I'm comfortable in my geeky personality. I'm pretty sure I didn't imply that going to the ROM is preferable to going to BMO, though.

I like driving my friend's Toyota, but that doesn't mean I'll spend all gameday in the parking lot doing doughnuts, either.

[Hitcho]

^ yeah sorry dude, cheap shot, it's just a rare comment to see on these boards. No offence intended, i just couldn't resist the opportunity.

for what it's worth, if you're ever in London (the real one) there are a TON of top museums to head into, and many of them are either free or donation-based entry. I should have made better use of it while I was there actually.

[Roogsy]

Um...who goes to away games for "culture". Somebody answer me this please.

[Cashcleaner]

^^ I used to take flights down to London from Edinburgh quite a bit to watch Chelsea and Palace play. Usually I'd spend the time on the Saturday watching the game and drinking copious amount of alcohol, and then spend the next day taking in the sights before heading back north.

[Daveisonfire]

But there isn't even a team located in New York City..

[Dave67]

Um...who goes to away games for "culture". Somebody answer me this please.

I go to an away game for the sake of going to an away game. However if I need to choose between one city or another I will always choose the city that allows me to make a weekend out of it with some museums or galleries thrown in.

If all of our away games were within a 4 hour drive I would not care about 'culture' but as the trips are all far I find it helpful to add on some other attraction. Of course to the hyperventilating types on the boards that probably makes me a tourist. Whatever, I did Chicago both seasons, it's a great city. I have pretty much come to accept that means I am not a 'real' supporter because I chose a 'popular' away game instead of say, Kansas. But like I said, whatever.

[Hitcho]

Um...who goes to away games for "culture". Somebody answer me this please.

I'm with you Roogsy, but that (apparently) is what this thread is about (see my earlier post asking what the point of the thread was).

:rolleyes:

[Crocodile Silver]

Without getting into little squabbles here and there, I would just like to say that the list provided below is just a framework for the bigger idea.

Don’t you guys and gals think that one thing that the MLS has going for it, is it’s uniqueness of having world class cities under one league umbrella. Each team or city in the MLS has the opportunity to be champion. This situation presents a rather interesting Travel and Tourism scenario. Of course the traveling costs can be quite expensive for us, due to the fact that we are covering great distances, but on the flipside, if you conduct due diligence you can usually find great travel deals also!.

I’m not downplaying the major European cities. Its just that they only get pitted against one another in Champions league play, which tend to be the same teams over and over again. Our MLS situation tends to be a very unique one, in which we have

Toronto
New York City
Los Angeles
Chicago
Boston
Philadelphia
Seattle
Dallas
Denver
Miami(possibly)

All these major centers bring with them interesting and fun travel opportunities which because of the distance, can be very different from one another. I find it very cool that not only can I watch my team here at home, but I can also interlace my travel plans with their away games! Each major away city can provide excellent world class culture, entertainment, museums, bars/nightclubs etc…The leagues referred down below don’t provide this sort of thing to the DEGREE that we get here…yes they get to travel but it can’t be as exciting for supporters of Man Utd going to an away game in Liverpool, as it is for us going to an away game in NYC right?? I think you guys catch my drift…


What are your thoughts??



All these major leagues are pretty boring TRAVEL wise if you were a resident of that leagues country no?? I mean they only have like 2-3 options when you break it down...


La Liga – Real Madrid, Barcelona, Villareal, Valencia

Premiership – Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool

Serie A – Inter, AC Milan, Juventus, Roma

Bundesliga – Werder Bermen, Bayern, Schalke

Erdivisie – Ajax, PSV

Who follows football to visit cities? Sure it can be fun...but going up to Wigan on a cold, wet Tuesday night and singing songs sounds great to me.

And you listed Chelsea AND arse*al in there...you realise they're both in London...

shouldnt be surprised with an avatar like that though

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Who follows football to visit cities? Sure it can be fun...but going up to Wigan on a cold, wet Tuesday night and singing songs sounds great to me.

And you listed Chelsea AND arse*al in there...you realise they're both in London...

shouldnt be surprised with an avatar like that though



Anyways, you and lot of others are "missing the point" of the thread...

We are all here because we are footy fans first, and that should really go unsaid.

If you read the OP you would see that i'm not saying you have to go to Boston to go see musuems and "enrich" yourself the whole time. Im saying that "Travel and Tourism" and the "feeling" that comes with it, is much more acute and pervasive for us here(TFC fans)...as opposed to our "mirror" image in any of the domestic european leagues.

My friends, we here in Toronto love the game of FOOTY with a passion, and we love our REDS(this is a given), combine that with the excitement of insert major MLS City(as an example NYC!) Drinking, Bus Charters, Hotels, Bars, Nightclubs, Passports, Weekends, Musuems, Broadway, possibly flights, Times Square, NBC Studios, 5th Ave, Empire State Building, Letterman, Hello Deli, SoHo, Madison Sq Garden etc..etc..We have a much different experience than our counterpart german citizen who travels from Berlin(his home city) to an away game 3 hours up the road in Hamburg. Its kind of like a Leafs fan going to Ottawa to catch a game, its just not the same.....

Hope this makes sense a bit.....???

[werewolf]

Did you just compare Hamburg to New York City?

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Did you just compare Hamburg to New York City?

No i compared a german fan going from one major city in his league to another major city in his league...

Just like us going from one major city in OUR league to another major city in OUR league..

Does that make sense to you??

[werewolf]

Sure, I just find that example flawed. What if you had used KC or Columbus as an example? Hamburg > Columbus.

We do have good places to visit when watching a game, but I don't see it as great of an advantage you are making it seem. If we are using Germany (for arguments sake) to compare, they have nearly as many exciting cities as well as being MUCH smaller then the US in population and size.

[Daveisonfire]

New Jersey ≠ New York City

[TFCREDNWHITE]

Sure, I just find that example flawed. What if you had used KC or Columbus as an example? Hamburg > Columbus.

We do have good places to visit when watching a game, but I don't see it as great of an advantage you are making it seem. If we are using Germany (for arguments sake) to compare, they have nearly as many exciting cities as well as being MUCH smaller then the US in population and size.

NO they don't.

You're saying that as a Canadian Citizen, you wouldn't have the same perspective about Hamburg if you were a German Citizen living your whole life in Berlin...

[TFCREDNWHITE]

New Jersey ≠ New York City

I know that...You are taking the location of the stadium quite literally, which you shouldn't........

[werewolf]

It's all relative.

By the same token, having lived almost my whole life in Toronto, New York and Chicago don't impress me that much, and the cities you mentioned earlier; Seattle, Dallas etc...nothing special. I see Columbus as Hamilton South.

If I was from Topeka, Kansas it might be a big deal to go to these places, like a person from Augsburg traveling to Hamburg.

[TFCREDNWHITE]

It's all relative.

By the same token, having lived almost my whole life in Toronto, New York and Chicago don't impress me that much, and the cities you mentioned earlier; Seattle, Dallas etc...nothing special. I see Columbus as Hamilton South.

If I was from Topeka, Kansas it might be a big deal to go to these places, like a person from Augsburg traveling to Hamburg.


Well if those don't impress you, than i'm sure Tokyo, Sydney, Paris and London won't either....because weather you like it or not, Toronto, New York City and Chicago are World Class Cities...that is a FACT, not opinion.

[werewolf]

London and Paris do impress me, they have something different to offer. Sydney as well. Haven't been to Tokyo yet, but I have a slight feeling its a bit more different to Toronto then New York is...

Toronto and Chicago are the same city, there is very little difference when speaking in global terms.

Munich and Berlin are world class cities. That is also a fact, regardless of my citizenship.