new jerseys!!

[OneLoveOneEric]

And my last word on this -- I know I said that last time -- it's the basic contempt of the fans that really gets me upset. IMO, TFC is a passion project. The football's not great, the league's not great, the stadium's...... you get my drift. We go because we love it. The team would be wise to notice this, and to notice that they're nothing without the fans. How about a bit of value-added? I mean, what if instead of the email we got, we got one that said pre-order your shirt, and as a bonus for your early commitment, and as a valued STH you'll get to pick it up at a party with the players?
That would be nice. That would say something along the lines of "we value your contribution, and want to reward your unfettered support". Instead, it's buy the shirt. No, you can't see it yet. And while you're at it, buy a ticket to a party, where I'm sure there will be more shit available to buy.
It's disrespectful and aggravating, if you ask me.

[Roogsy]

At the start of August, I ordered the brand new Reading kit, long sleeve, with the Coca Cola League patches and lettering on the back. Add taxes and shipping, and it still cost less then the new TFC kit will cost.


At the end of the day...this is where I think the biggest problem lies.

They are not making these things competitively priced solely to ensure guaranteed income from the local fans. But in the process, they are pricing out possible fans in other cities and countries. And I think that is a mistake.

Putting aside the whole glory-hunting issue, Manchester United jerseys are found everywhere in the world. They probably outsell everyone except Real Madrid. Man Utd make a stinkload of money because of it. TFC have done the opposite. I think by pricing it as high as they do, TFC is pricing itself out of marketing outside of the GTA. If they keep pricing it this way, nobody but Toronto fans will ever buy the shirts and that is not good business. Manchester United however will have years of marketing exposure all over the globe.

[Dave67]

THERE WE GO!
There in lies an issue. Im not saying i wont buy one as i know i will but lets realllly start to think about it. Ive seen this play out many times and no one ever does anything until its too late.

I don't get it. It's an overpriced jersey to go along with overpriced concessions. Neither of which are necessary to have a decent priced ticket, which I believe we have.

[Shaughno]

I don't get it. It's an overpriced jersey to go along with overpriced concessions. Neither of which are necessary to have a decent priced ticket, which I believe we have.


It's the trend itself that's alarming. Perfect example (thanks Velvet :lol: )

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=593968&sec=england&cc=5901




Manchester United have been reported to the Office of Fair Trading by a group of their own fans. The Manchester United Supporters Trust (MUST), the group formerly known as Shareholders United that vehemently opposed Malcolm Glazer's takeover of the club in 2005, has lodged official papers with the OFT claiming the Red Devils have 'breached its statutory and legal obligations to season ticket holders'.
MUST's argument centres on the hotly disputed compulsory cup scheme, which forces season ticket holders to agree in advance to buy tickets for cup games even though they do not know how many they will have to pay for and who the opposition will be.
At one point all season ticket holders had to pay for all cup matches but this has now been relaxed to exclude Carling Cup games.
However, MUST still claims United are acting unlawfully given what they view as a dominant position in the market and the fact that fans do not transfer their allegiance just because the club acts in a way they do not like.
Specifically, MUST's three complaints are:
• United's season ticket terms and conditions are in breach of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999.
• Their compulsory automatic cup ticket scheme is in breach of The Competition Act 1998, Part II, Section 18(2).
• Their pricing policy is in breach of The Competition Act 1998, Part II, Section 18(2)(a).
In addition, they argue that massive ticket price rises in recent years - highlighted by sports minister Gerry Sutcliffe - contravene a pledge given by Glazer in the build-up to his takeover attempt.
''Over recent years we have seen unfair terms and huge ticket price rises imposed on supporters by club owners taking advantage of their loyalty,'' said MUST chief executive Duncan Drasdo.
''MPs from all political parties have raised concerns and even the minister for sport felt it necessary to launch an outspoken attack on the huge price rises at Old Trafford in recent years.
''For a long time Manchester United was by no means the worst offender having previously had an admirable policy of keeping prices relatively low despite the success of the club. All that changed when the Glazers took over.
''However now, with the help of a team of eminent competition lawyers, economists and experts in sports law, we have been able to compile a comprehensive complaint based on Competition and Contract Law, which could have welcome consequences for supporters at clubs throughout the country.''
While United are making no official comment, they are likely to mount a robust defence of their position.
In particular they are likely to point to the fact they have axed Carling Cup games from the automatic cup scheme and made Under-16 season tickets exempt from the scheme altogether.
In addition, senior citizens have been given permission to upgrade their tickets to adult prices for individual games to make them easier to sell through the official club website.
Even so, MUST believe they have a strong case, although the OFT may take some time to decide whether to take it, let alone hear it, which may take in excess of a year.

[Jack]

The bottom line is, the same jersey design for another team costs less.

That is brutal.

[Shaughno]

The bottom line is, the same jersey design for another team costs less.

That is brutal.

Thank you for a point that many had missed. ;)

[canadian_bhoy]

It's the trend itself that's alarming. Perfect example (thanks Velvet :lol: )

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=593968&sec=england&cc=5901

Anyone check their invoices? How much were we charged for this years playoff games?

[OneLoveOneEric]

The bottom line is, the same jersey design for another team costs less.

That is brutal.

Beautifully summarized.

[Parkdale]

Are you telling me that United jerseys should be cheaper than any other team in the EPL because there are more sold? Come on, you know better.

I'm not comparing them to other EPL teams. For the EPL, I think they should all be priced the same across the board with the ONLY exception being the jersey manufacturer. Adidas or Nike would probably charge slightly more than say Lotto or Puma. That's strictly the deal worked out between the team and their shirt manufacturer (and maybe the jersey sponsor). In the MLS, we're all wearing an Adidas top, so I think we should have parity across this league.

I was saying that if Manchester can sell 100 million kits per year, and TFC can sell 100,000 - then manchester is in a better position to offer value to the people who buy the product.

[Wagner]

i'd like to compare the number of order forms to the poll above....

I'm sure Paul is noticing...but it's the # of order forms coming that he'll care about.

[BakaGaijin]

I'm not comparing them to other EPL teams. For the EPL, I think they should all be priced the same across the board with the ONLY exception being the jersey manufacturer. Adidas or Nike would probably charge slightly more than say Lotto or Puma. That's strictly the deal worked out between the team and their shirt manufacturer (and maybe the jersey sponsor). In the MLS, we're all wearing an Adidas top, so I think we should have parity across this league.

I was saying that if Manchester can sell 100 million kits per year, and TFC can sell 100,000 - then manchester is in a better position to offer value to the people who buy the product.

I think the little children in third world countries who produce these jersey's were given a raise. Their salary jumped from 25 cents a day to 30 cents a day. Adidas decided to transfer all cost increases for all jerseys to the TFC merchandise consumer because they are the biggest suckers.

[GabrielHurl]

Just wait for the TFC wife beaters

yes wife beaters - they are a-comin'

[flatpicker]

^ I think they sit in section 115, no?

[Krazy_kid]

Its great to see that everyone is doing online research comparing prices and other jersey's etc. but what are you going to do about it?

i see and read about this all the time, people complain about the cost of this or that but still go out and buy drinks, food and even jersey's.

can we not organize a formal petition on jersey pricing or food pricing at MLSE. stop buying from them, this is the only way they are going to listen, when they stop makiing money!

[Ageroo]

^ I think they sit in section 115, no?

hey now...easy there!

[flatpicker]

^ just kidding!

[Ageroo]

^ just kidding!

ha ha....although some of the guys behind me...I am not so sure....:D

[Nodoubtguy]

^ I think they sit in section 115, no?

BOOOOO....115-4-LIFE!!!

[GabrielHurl]

Its great to see that everyone is doing online research comparing prices and other jersey's etc. but what are you going to do about it?

i see and read about this all the time, people complain about the cost of this or that but still go out and buy drinks, food and even jersey's.

can we not organize a formal petition on jersey pricing or food pricing at MLSE. stop buying from them, this is the only way they are going to listen, when they stop makiing money!

won't happen

Remember that protest that one time

[GabrielHurl]

and i mean something like this

http://www.subsidesports.com/uk/images/product/xlarge/LivSlvlWht0809b.jpg

[ilikemusic]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but Kingpin has it spot on.
I've said a million times here, and I always get told I'm whining, but the nickle-and-diming that we've seen from day one is simply continuing. And anyone who wants to talk about how the games are still great value, and they want a shirt so badly, etc. is certainly free to do so. But the trends are alarming.....
I give it 3-5 years (if MLS is still around then) before TFC games are out of reach for most of us on this board. And that's something the FO won't deny either.

Once grass roots supporters are priced out of the stadium the atmosphere will die and attendance will plummet.

MLSE is going to run this operation right into the ground and pass the problem of the empty useless stadium back onto the govt.

:canada:

[Parkdale]

and i mean something like this

http://www.subsidesports.com/uk/images/product/xlarge/LivSlvlWht0809b.jpg


there is a gray TFC tanktop some of the guy wear during practice. It's pretty slick.

[GabrielHurl]

there is a gray TFC tanktop some of the guy wear during practice. It's pretty slick.

well now you'll be able to buy it :cool:

although I dunno if I'd want to see those skinny arms of yours

[Parkdale]

well now you'll be able to buy it :cool:

although I dunno if I'd want to see those skinny arms of yours

it looks better over a long sleeve white top. Not sure if it will go for public sale.

[TFC Cityboy]

^ I think they sit in section 115, no?

OY-Don't you DARE accuse me of SITTING...in 115
:)

[The Kingpin]

Yeah but those are considered 'imported' no?

In Scotland a Celtic top when launched is 39.99(pounds).

I wonder how much a TFC shirt in UK costs!

TFC... UK.... :noidea:

MLS.... UK... :noidea:

That league Beckham plays in: :yessir:

[FluSH]

My response: NO

Reason: Credit Crunch

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Once grass roots supporters are priced out of the stadium the atmosphere will die and attendance will plummet.

MLSE is going to run this operation right into the ground and pass the problem of the empty useless stadium back onto the govt.

:canada:
I'm surprised it took ten pages to get to this point, usually we're this negative about 20 posts in. :rolleyes:

[The Kingpin]

^^^It's not extreme. It's all part of the same marketing plan -- Get 'em in the door, then jack the price. This was said to me openly by a TFC FO member.
They view this as adjusting introductory prices to fit the market. I see it as bait and switch. I won't keep posting about this, because it doesn't seem to sink in for many people, but keep extrapolating ticket price increases out for a few years. Keep adding "promotions" like this one, throw in a DP or stadium improvements, and you'll see where this ends up.
Add to that the basic slap in the face that things like parties that should be benefits of being a STH are charged for as well, and you'll see what I'm getting at.

Dude, I've been saying this since day one. You are simply wasting your breath, trust me. I'm enjoying things now, but I'm aware of the long term implications. At least in the UK they are starting to walk away from the gates, and I don't have the details but MUFC supporters a fighting back even harder according to very recent reports. When the supporters can get on the same page about ANYTHING, that's when there will be effect. See Leaf supporter protests, exceptionally lame. No unification, no effect...

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

I think it's a little extreme to be taking a jersey thread into a ticket price increase conversation...but if in 5 years I can't afford my seats in 112 anymore and have to give them up, I'm going to cry.

I was at the Leaf game on Monday. 1st row Upper deck and the face value was $86....$86 I pray that the day never comes where I have to say bye bye to my seats.Leaf games are about the worst value in town, and not just cause the teams a bit sh*te these days... The atmosphere is terrible unless you go to the standing room only sections, and they're damn expensive seats. I've honestly had more fun at Leafs games on the road in Buffalo and Montreal than at the ACC, because only the best fans are willing to travel to see their team.

^And Kingpin, Liverpool supporters have started their own club in protest to being priced out of Anfield. And prices are only going to go higher when they move to their new stadium in two years.

[JonO]

^^^It's not extreme. It's all part of the same marketing plan -- Get 'em in the door, then jack the price. This was said to me openly by a TFC FO member.
They view this as adjusting introductory prices to fit the market. I see it as bait and switch. I won't keep posting about this, because it doesn't seem to sink in for many people, but keep extrapolating ticket price increases out for a few years. Keep adding "promotions" like this one, throw in a DP or stadium improvements, and you'll see where this ends up.
Add to that the basic slap in the face that things like parties that should be benefits of being a STH are charged for as well, and you'll see what I'm getting at.
The problem with this thread is that there are too many points being debated. I disagree with the argument that this is a "get 'em in the door..." strategy because, as someone already pointed out, the jersey price is the same as last year. So the prices have not it fact gone up.

I do agree that they are charging too much for the jersey, however, which is why I will not get it until it goes on sale. I am happy with my Toronto FC (sponsorless) jersey for now.

Disclaimer: This is from someone who's Man Utd jersey purchase this year replaces the last purchase made in '93 :o

[OneLoveOneEric]

Dude, I've been saying this since day one. You are simply wasting your breath, trust me. I'm enjoying things now, but I'm aware of the long term implications. At least in the UK they are starting to walk away from the gates, and I don't have the details but MUFC supporters a fighting back even harder according to very recent reports. When the supporters can get on the same page about ANYTHING, that's when there will be effect. See Leaf supporter protests, exceptionally lame. No unification, no effect...

Agreed. I've been trying to get this across all year. Even had a lengthy talk on the phone with Paul about it, wrote a letter to TFC FO, etc. Much like people are doing now with FCUM and the Supporters' Trust in Manchester, people will one day look back at these early signs as when we should have spoken up.
That is, if the MLS lasts long enough for that to occur.

[OneLoveOneEric]

The problem with this thread is that there are too many points being debated. I disagree with the argument that this is a "get 'em in the door..." strategy because, as someone already pointed out, the jersey price is the same as last year. So the prices have not it fact gone up.

I do agree that they are charging too much for the jersey, however, which is why I will not get it until it goes on sale. I am happy with my Toronto FC (sponsorless) jersey for now.

Disclaimer: This is from someone who's Man Utd jersey purchase this year replaces the last purchase made in '93 :o

I guess what I am trying to argue is that all of these things are related. The jersey price might be the same as last year, but you got to see that jersey first. It's the philosophy of this jersey email that gets me. They make it sound like an insider opportunity. But all they are offering is a chance to get it slightly ahead of other people. Then, they segue right in to the next sentence, which tries to sell you a ticket to a party where you can pick up your shirt. If they gave a shit, wouldn't the party be a perk for sending in your money early? How much does it cost to rent a bar in Mississauga or wherever else they hold these things? Pittsburgh Penguins fans had their seasons tickets delivered to their door a while back by Sidney Crosby. For free. They're doing similar things in Florida I think. Why does the TFC FO feel so entitled to us that we are expected to pay to go somewhere to pick something up that we've bought?
All of these things are related, and they're all part of the same poor attitude toward the fans.

[Nodoubtguy]

uh-oh.....pick up is at the same time as the Neil Young Concert!!!!
Guess that means I'll be skipping the opener (wilco)

[OneLoveOneEric]

^^Horrible idea! Wilco live are amazing.

[Parkdale]

Disclaimer: This is from someone who's Man Utd jersey purchase this year replaces the last purchase made in '93 :o


wait... are you saying that you're somewhat frugal, thrifty or even cheap?



just for comparison

An authentic Raptors jersey from NBA.com is $199.99
An authentic Leafs sweater from NHL.com is $299.99
(note: both are for the AUTHENTIC jerseys. Replicas are cheaper)

[Chapman]

Then, they segue right in to the next sentence, which tries to sell you a ticket to a party where you can pick up your shirt. If they gave a shit, wouldn't the party be a perk for sending in your money early?

Not trying to get into this whole thing, but I'm pretty sure the jersey is the ticket to the party then additional tickets cost extra. So if the jersey is the same price as usual then the ticket is free and the party is like a perk for sending money in. However i don't know what the price of these jerseys are so I'm not sure if they just embedded the ticket price into the cost of the jersey.
Also I know what you mean with the whole email coming off as a type of ad for this party more than a new kit.



We’re having a party to launch the new kit, and you’re invited!
The first chance you'll have to pick up your new jersey is at the official launch - The Kit Party, presented by Smirnoff Ice. Space is limited to the first 300 people to request tickets. You can get 1 free ticket per jersey, and any additionals can be bought for $25. You can request tickets for The Kit Party on the jersey order form. If you can't make it to The Kit Party, your jersey will be available for pick up at CentreSports from Monday, December 8th.

[OneLoveOneEric]

^^^ You are right. I stand corrected on that point.

[blackandwhite]

well the point is you can order one and pick it up at the launch...sooooo to show the jersey would be pretty counter productive, wouldn't it. just order one. you know you waaaant it. then you could put it on at the party, pop the collar and......d'oh!



I've said too much.


Of course you did... You have everyone by the balls!

Same guy who asked to not bring banners and drums etc to Columbus opener.. Wanted us to bring "pure support".

[Mrs. Workie]

Good to see the off season is in full effect! :D

[Parkdale]

Good to see the off season is in full effect! :D

http://www.monsterpants.net/offseasondvd.jpg

[The Kingpin]

When you look at the stats and discussion, it can be suggested that this is a very galvanising thread. And really, money talks. This is the core point OLOE makes some excellent points, and I've made similar points a nauseating amount of times. If you REALLY love watching this club and you enjoy the camaraderie that many of you have enjoyed, you will pull the reins a little. Many RPB's now avoid the boards as they don't like how they have changed and played out over time, I hope they know it's also their responsibility to take a stand as well as apposed to see the discussions here as the anthesis of what their opinion could be. I'm glad to see the likes of Jack here and a little disillusioned as well. The TFC fans are being absolutely screwed on so many levels now it's mind boggling. We should honestly remove Paul's account and move forward... Really, I do believe this. Anyway, I'm getting a touch emotional... Back away from the CPU!! Back away...

[Nodoubtguy]

^^Horrible idea! Wilco live are amazing.

maybe I'll just pick it up at the ACC after Dec 8th....:noidea:

[JonO]

I agree with what you're saying, but it's important to be accurate to strengthen your argument.


They make it sound like an insider opportunity. But all they are offering is a chance to get it slightly ahead of other people. Then, they segue right in to the next sentence, which tries to sell you a ticket to a party where you can pick up your shirt. If they gave a shit, wouldn't the party be a perk for sending in your money early?
Unless I have misread the email, if you buy the shirt you get a ticket. The tickets are limited to 300 people. You can buy and extra ticket for $25. The last part is a mistake imho.


Pittsburgh Penguins fans had their seasons tickets delivered to their door a while back by Sidney Crosby. For free.

Mr. Crosby, the NHL's reigning scoring champion and MVP, had emerged from the driver's seat of the Jaguar, climbed her front steps, opened the storm door and knocked.
"Hello," he said, smiling and handing her a box.
He was one of six Penguins players who hand-delivered season tickets to 24 homes around the Pittsburgh area. The others were forwards Evgeni Malkin, Colby Armstrong and Maxime Talbot, defenseman Ryan Whitney and goaltender Marc-Andre Fleury. (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07250/815380-61.stm)

Only four season ticket holders received their tickets from Crosby.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Do you think Penguins players go out and hang with the fans at bars? I doubt it, and not just cause Crosby's underage in the US. ;)

[jabbronies]

disagree with the argument that this is a "get 'em in the door..." strategy because, as someone already pointed out, the jersey price is the same as last year. So the prices have not it fact gone up.

:o

WTF? I bought my short sleeve TFC jersey last year (Season 1) for $100 after taxes...not $119 plus tax. And last season I saw BMO short sleeve jerseys going for anywhere between $89 - $99 (plus tax) a pop.

[The Kingpin]

Good to see the off season is in full effect! :D

Effecting change and growth... Just like last year!! We need this! Last year in the offseason we had Jack appointed, which has been great for the group... What amasing things will discussions this offseason bring! I'm stoked to have discussions that will help RPB galvanise themselves.

:canada:

[Parkdale]

Unless I have misread the email, if you buy the shirt you get a ticket. The tickets are limited to 300 people. You can buy and extra ticket for $25. The last part is a mistake imho.



you are correct. It's states in the email:


You can get 1 free ticket per jersey, and any additionals can be bought for $25.

that would mean, 4 jerseys = 4 tickets.

[Parkdale]

oh... one other minor detail: The Kit Party, presented by Smirnoff Ice.

Usually when there's a party 'presented by' an alcoholic beverage manufacturer, there's free drinks. I'm not going to say that for sure, but I guarantee I will make up any cost difference between this jersey and last years one in vodka.

your comrade,
Parkski

[giambac]

Hmmmmm don't like the fact I'm being asked if I want to buy something I can't see until after I buy it,in order to go to a party...or I have to wait until March.

Like I've been saying all along, they are a bunch of crooks. Only crooks do things like this.

It's the same as those guys selling swamp land in Florida.................

[alexintoronto]

Once grass roots supporters are priced out of the stadium the atmosphere will die and attendance will plummet.

MLSE is going to run this operation right into the ground and pass the problem of the empty useless stadium back onto the govt.

:canada:
Who let you back in?

:)


Is there going to be a long sleeve jersey?

I'll wait for that if there is.

[blackandwhite]

Do you think Penguins players go out and hang with the fans at bars? I doubt it, and not just cause Crosby's underage in the US. ;)

We are talking about a FOOTBALL CLUB here not a drinking club.. TFC should start holding events at the stadium where the fans would go for free.

You don't think there are facilities inside the BMO field for this?

But there is not a person in TFC who would understand that. Like we saw with the supporter's cup being renamed after a chain of bars which none of the supporter groups go to.

[Shaughno]

We are talking about a FOOTBALL CLUB here not a drinking club.. TFC should start holding events at the stadium where the fans would go for free.

You don't think there are facilities inside the BMO field for this?

But there is not a person in TFC who would understand that. Like we saw with the supporter's cup being renamed after a chain of bars which none of the supporter groups go to.

All for the greater good of ML$E I'm sure. ;)

[blackandwhite]

not to forget limiting access to the few good fan run websites we had early in the season... should we make a list?

[The Kingpin]

not to forget limiting access to the few good fan run websites we had early in the season... should we make a list?


I'd read it........

[JonO]

We are talking about a FOOTBALL CLUB here not a drinking club.. TFC should start holding events at the stadium where the fans would go for free.
Agreed - more free football-realted events would be nice. TO be fair, I think they had an open practice this summer... More events like that would be appreciated.

And i do think there is a place for the other stuff too. To ignore that sports today is a big business would be naive...

[Shaughno]

'AN' open practice. Didn't our original season ticket package say that both practices and reserve games were a perk that SSH's would get? It only took 3/4 of the first season to figure out how to organize people for the reserve games without booting people out and being told, "I don't care what your Season Ticket card says, nobody is allowed to stay inside".

[blackandwhite]

It's a big business because it's run by business people not by football people. How many of the FO or MLSE are real supporters? 5 out of 100??

There is a way to make money and stay true to football... selling out your own supporters the first people you go to in a product launch is not the way.

[OneLoveOneEric]

I agree with what you're saying, but it's important to be accurate to strengthen your argument.


Unless I have misread the email, if you buy the shirt you get a ticket. The tickets are limited to 300 people. You can buy and extra ticket for $25. The last part is a mistake imho.



Mr. Crosby, the NHL's reigning scoring champion and MVP, had emerged from the driver's seat of the Jaguar, climbed her front steps, opened the storm door and knocked.
"Hello," he said, smiling and handing her a box.
He was one of six Penguins players who hand-delivered season tickets to 24 homes around the Pittsburgh area. The others were forwards Evgeni Malkin, Colby Armstrong and Maxime Talbot, defenseman Ryan Whitney and goaltender Marc-Andre Fleury. (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07250/815380-61.stm)

Only four season ticket holders received their tickets from Crosby.

I corrected the first part. Second part -- what's the diff? Did 4 of us get tickets delivered by Jim Brennan? Do they want us to pay for other parties they "invite" us to? The point is that it shows teams willing to go the extra mile for their fans. Sydney Crosby is a zillionaire superstar, and his owners got him to do this. St. Louis has done this, the Sharks did, and I think it was done in Calgary too. These are the guys that are supposed to be the overpaid, uncaring mercenaries and they've been willing or coerced into doing this. Why do I want to pay to go to a "90th minute" party, or whatever it was called when other teams -- with big stars playing for them -- send players to fans houses. Even if it's just a lucky few.

[Shaughno]

OLOE, that's exactly it. Showing the people who pay your wages, that you actually care. Instead of making a buck at every turn, at the expense of those paying your wages.

[AL-MO]

I am not buying the new jersey. An especially not for that price.

I will still rock my original jersey that I sewed an embroidered badge on to.

[Parkdale]

How many of the FO or MLSE are real supporters? 5 out of 100??

there's 100 people working in that office? I think the number's more like 30.

[Parkdale]

'AN' open practice. Didn't our original season ticket package say that both practices and reserve games were a perk that SSH's would get? It only took 3/4 of the first season to figure out how to organize people for the reserve games without booting people out and being told, "I don't care what your Season Ticket card says, nobody is allowed to stay inside".



and let's not forget "early entry to the stadium for SSH". That one never even came close to happening

[Jack]

Deniz makes some very good points here.

[blackandwhite]

These guys who hold these event have been fucking up since first year...Dividing up fans according to their economical classes... $200 events with wine and cheese and for the rest of us common folks $50 which should have been named 91st min not 90th btw... Basically selling their player appearances to make money for the club. Yes it goes to charities but.. It looks like TFC is doing a community work.. If you care so much about the community then donate your own profits.

How many players where at the supporter's cup?

[Shaughno]

How many players where at the supporter's cup?


Exactly, probably one of the best times to have players... or ANY player for that matter show up to encourage the growth of the sport.

[OneLoveOneEric]

These guys who hold these event have been fucking up since first year...Dividing up fans according to their economical classes... $200 events with wine and cheese and for the rest of us common folks $50 which should have been named 91st min not 90th btw... Basically selling their player appearances to make money for the club. Yes it goes to charities but.. It looks like TFC is doing a community work.. If you care so much about the community then donate your own profits.

How many players where at the supporter's cup?

Exactly. Why do we pay to see the players? If they want to offer this, then just offer it. Even Joe McGrath could get his players to do a fashion show :)

SWM-fNJ1dO8

[alexintoronto]

Next year each team should have a player as a coach. And free beer on the sidelines.

[Parkdale]

...Dividing up fans according to their economical classes... $200 events with wine and cheese and for the rest of us common folks $50 which should have been named....


sorry, but dividing up people based on economic class is kind of the whole point when selling tickets to any sporting event / concert / anything with a range of seats. If BMO was general admission, it would be chaos.

There's always going to be prawn seats and nosebleed seats in any sports venue, and I don't think it hurts to have events that cater to each of these levels. Having said that... the really high end events that the Leafs do, usually for hundreds of dollars per personal, help out a Charity. There's a leafs fund and a raptors fund for helping out the community. If the $200 seats contribute to that, then I have no problem with it. If the cash just goest back into the MLSE purse, then it's a problem.

[Kickit09]

http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/picture.php?albumid=194&pictureid=1008

[JonO]

Exactly, probably one of the best times to have players... or ANY player for that matter show up to encourage the growth of the sport.
We seem to be at opposite ends today ;) I think the supporters cup would be the exact WRONG time to encourage the growth of the sport. Everyone playing in such an even already is a strong supporter... It'd be a better opportunity the players to show appreciation for the support.

[the-lower-eastsider]

first off. i dont like the design at all. but thats just personal opinion. personally i was disappointed when i saw the leaked photos of the new kit. i think MLSE could easily do way better but so far hasnt. so the design team gets a "C-" from me. "C" for crap. dont like the superimposed maple leaf either. think its lame.
high price+sight unseen(officially)+poor design (based on leaked photo)= NOT HAPPENIN' for craiger. i'll make my own supporters shirt as usual. rather than buy that overpriced lame crap.

hey, heres an idea: how bout a combat (cammoflague -sp) kit. can i get a hell yeah? lol. you know, to match my g-unit pants.

and for those saying that it's bull sh-t that TFC is charging $25 bucks for the party ticket and that it would have been nice if they would have thrown in the ticket to this thing for free...
THEY ARE! read above again. extra tickets are $25.

plus, ...(see above), did anyone else notice they say you get access to "A drink"? u realize people, that this likely means literally "ONE" drink (prolly in the form of a solitary drink ticket) and after that youre on your own. simple craiger fact: one drink isnt gonna cut it for me, so tack on a large bar tab in addition to my overpriced new kit. plus cab fare and bail money.
p.s. if i find out it was an open bar, i'm gonna be pissed. lol.

and finally, they also almost had me at "food". not at the "mingling with players", but food. although i would like to see the menu first. if i find out there was unlimited complimentary chip butties, then i'm gonna be pissed again.

neways, j/k about the food and drink. the bottomline is that the design is lame, the kit's overpriced, and they want me to buy the thing sight unseen. aint happenin from this cowboy.

and by the way, pat and nobodyloveseric made some really good points in this thread. to me, its a cash grab and its obvious MLSE is just capitalizing on a bunch of nerds willing to be the first to own the new kit and be in some sort of "exclusive" club. totally lame-o.

craiger

***** craiger - I edited out the email. People who might not have gotten the email do read these forums. Everyone knows the general info, but as far as the date - location - time of the party, let's try not to make it that obvious. thanks. oh, and did it take you 2 hours to write that?

[JonO]

These guys who hold these event have been fucking up since first year...Dividing up fans according to their economical classes... $200 events with wine and cheese and for the rest of us common folks $50 which should have been named 91st min not 90th btw... Basically selling their player appearances to make money for the club. Yes it goes to charities but.. It looks like TFC is doing a community work.. If you care so much about the community then donate your own profits.

How many players where at the supporter's cup?
I agree they should donate personally, but having events to raise money for charity is a good thing in my books. I don't care how it looks on TFC. If it means that some kids in a wartorn country is going to have the opportunity to participate in a footy camp then I am all for it.

[canadian_bhoy]

from my email:



hey, heres an idea: how bout a combat (cammoflague -sp) kit. can i get a hell yeah? lol. you know, to match my g-unit pants.




Check it out - FC St. Pauli!!! This kit rules.

http://www.subsidesports.com/uk/images/product/xlarge/StPauliHLS0506.jpg

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Some of the players donate personally. I don't think MLSE paid to have the 'Big Bruva' t-shirts and wristbands made up, and Danny D has given his own money to Sick Kids.

Also, it makes me sick how much any Leaf event involving the players costs. To go to the annual skate at Maple Leaf Gardens, it was maybe five bucks. These days at the ACC you're expected to donate around $150.

Also, I like the kit. I don't want some flashy Nike shit, you've got red, you've got white, you've got a TFC badge. What else do you want? I'm not a massive fan of the leaf on the front, but I prefer it to our current shirts to be honest. And I like football shirts with collars. :D

[Wagner]

St. Pauli,
Bundesliga 2.

has a camo jersey

http://www.subsidesports.de/de/images/product/large/StPauliHLS0506.gif

[alexintoronto]

nobodyloveseric


:rofl:

[OneLoveOneEric]

^^^^well done.
Scouse wit at its best.
And a useful contribution from alex as usual.
Why be a cunt?

[Parkdale]

.
.
anyone else rememeber the old days when a thread would shut at 17 pages?

[the-lower-eastsider]

Check it out - FC St. Pauli!!! This kit rules.

http://www.subsidesports.com/uk/images/product/xlarge/StPauliHLS0506.jpg
yeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh! *does happy dance*

[alexintoronto]

I used to have useful contributions until the day that shall not be mentioned.

[Parkdale]

I used to have useful contributions until the day that shall not be mentioned.

http://www.teaser.fr/%7Effrancq/ImagesSNL/connery.jpg

You'll rue tha day ya crossed me Trebek!

[OneLoveOneEric]

I know not this day, but I'm pretty sure I wasn't involved...

[Shaughno]

OLOE, we support United... we're always the ones to blame.

[OneLoveOneEric]

Ahhhh, I see.

[Dave67]

These guys who hold these event have been fucking up since first year...Dividing up fans according to their economical classes... $200 events with wine and cheese and for the rest of us common folks $50 which should have been named 91st min not 90th btw... Basically selling their player appearances to make money for the club. Yes it goes to charities but.. It looks like TFC is doing a community work.. If you care so much about the community then donate your own profits.

How many players where at the supporter's cup?

In relation to the party for the jersey launch, I don't get this? The jersey launch is not splitting up anyone by classes. If you were looking for a new jersey it's a chance to go to a party for no extra charge (above the point that TFC jerseys seem to be higher priced).

[alexintoronto]

I know not this day, but I'm pretty sure I wasn't involved...
I was just laughing. I thought it was extremely witty.

Everybody Loves Raymond + Everybody Hates Chris + OneLoveOneEric

=

______________________

(I won't mention it again since it seems to bother you, but I assume no offense was intended - certainly none from me.)

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

And just one more thing... You think that's an ugly kit?

These, my friends, are ugly kits:

http://www.premiershirts.net/wearthat/wearthatshirts/birmingham3_small.jpg


http://www.premiershirts.net/wearthat/wearthatshirts/lpoolgrey.jpg

http://www.premiershirts.net/wearthat/wearthatshirts/02352.gif

http://www.premiershirts.net/wearthat/wearthatshirts/00305.GIF

http://www.premiershirts.net/wearthat/wearthatshirts/Liverpool1.gif

[Bars92]

^ c'mon that grey Liverpool kit is a classic!

[Shaughno]

Classic piece of shit. :lol:

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

^ c'mon that grey Liverpool kit is a classic!
Nothing even marginally involved with Liverpool is a classic. :p

[Parkdale]

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii123/Liveru/Gk1996Red.jpg


^ England keeper jersey or Cosby Sweater?

http://gothamist.com/attachments/arts_jen/cosbysweater.jpg

[blackandwhite]

In relation to the party for the jersey launch, I don't get this? The jersey launch is not splitting up anyone by classes. If you were looking for a new jersey it's a chance to go to a party for no extra charge (above the point that TFC jerseys seem to be higher priced).

What I meant by that is they see you as walking dollar signs...some bigger signs than the others... Why else would someone make a condescending remark like "you know you waaaaant it" ?

Yes Paul we want the Toronto FC jersey not because it looks great or you are giving us a great deal on the price. We love this team we'll support it even when you move on to bigger and better jobs .We'll still be here in 10 years when all the FO will have moved to other careers..

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

^ 1991 meets Krusty the Clown?

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

What I meant by that is they see you as walking dollar signs...some bigger signs than the others... Why else would someone make a condescending remark like "you know you waaaaant it" ?

Yes Paul we want the Toronto FC jersey not because it looks great or you are giving us a great deal on the price. We love this team we'll support it even when you move on to bigger and better jobs .We'll still be here in 10 years when all the FO will have moved to other careers..
He was probably doing something generally known in Western society as 'kidding'. And secondly, since when has Paul been a TFC bigwig? Do you really think he's pulling in a seven-figure salary?

[blackandwhite]

He was probably doing something generally known in Western society as 'kidding'. And secondly, since when has Paul been a TFC bigwig? Do you really think he's pulling in a seven-figure salary?

Tell me more about this Western society. I'd like to know.. How long have you known Paul?

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Well, the predominant language is English, capitalism is the political philosophy of all but a few nations, the rate of increase of the average income is far outstripped by cost inflation, cars are the preferred mode of transportation, and we think mp3 players are a pretty neat idea.

;)

[GabrielHurl]

And secondly, since when has Paul been a TFC bigwig? Do you really think he's pulling in a seven-figure salary?

Behind Tom Anselmi and Trader Mo - you have Paul

[blackandwhite]

I stopped liking the guy after he told the supporter groups not to bring any banners, drums etc to the Columbus away game instead of talking to Columbus FO and making sure we had what we needed to support the team the way we always do.
The way he likes to use it in his ads and commercials.

[Dave67]

What I meant by that is they see you as walking dollar signs...some bigger signs than the others... Why else would someone make a condescending remark like "you know you waaaaant it" ?

Yes Paul we want the Toronto FC jersey not because it looks great or you are giving us a great deal on the price. We love this team we'll support it even when you move on to bigger and better jobs .We'll still be here in 10 years when all the FO will have moved to other careers..

Can't argue with you there in the larger sense. In relation to the jersey, I guess he was making a little joke and you sense he is being condescending. Just a different way of looking at things.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Do you think one man is in charge of all that? Think about that for a moment. This is one of the richest sports ownership groups in the world, and they put one guy to look after all the things you're pinning on him doing wrong?

[Shaughno]

Do you think one man is in charge of all that? Think about that for a moment. This is one of the richest sports ownership groups in the world, and they put one guy to look after all the things you're pinning on him doing wrong?

Not all his fault, but it's part of his job to make sure everyone under him is doing their job. If anyone in my division at work does something wrong, the first person to take flak is my boss.

[jabbronies]

http://www.calciopro.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/jorge-campos-94.jpg

Another classic goalie kit

[blackandwhite]

Do you think one man is in charge of all that? Think about that for a moment. This is one of the richest sports ownership groups in the world, and they put one guy to look after all the things you're pinning on him doing wrong?


Fine the whole MLSE top boys... they are all wrong. Not just Paul.

[ensco]

I do wonder how the supporters groups are viewed behind closed doors at MLSE/TFC.

I have a sneaking suspicion the suits have a strong "Dr Frankenstein" view of things. They see RPB and U Sector as their creation, their "brand", and view the supporters as the unconscious subjects of a sort of ongoing social experiment whose ultimate purpose is their for-profit objective.

I'm not calling Paul B out, I think his part in this is much more complex, having met him my read is that he is both a suit and a genuine supporter. I think he must think about these issues himself, but the compensation for him is that he has a genuinely special, great job.

We'll never know, as nobody would ever admit to this.

[The Kingpin]

He was probably doing something generally known in Western society as 'kidding'. And secondly, since when has Paul been a TFC bigwig? Do you really think he's pulling in a seven-figure salary?

In tiny TFC terms, Paul would be part of the senior leadership. I'm willing to suggest very few MLSE employees draw "seven figures", let alone TFC. To be blunt, you are sounding just a touch naive. Your opinion is noted, but I think you need to understand how hierarchy works. Paul is in charge of day-to-day operations of TFC, thus he it the main contact with respect to issues. Cesar used to be a main contact as the Marketing Director, but he has been proven to be somewhat useless. In this case Paul needed to take over to ensure that supporter relationships stayed strong. Cesar continues to overpay for poorly targeted ad campaigns, and TTC Streetcar wraps. If you have an issue with TFC, you speak with Paul. Anyone higher in the MLSE org chart will dismiss you, as in their mind you are just another sucker minion. Just taking the piss a bit, but you know what I mean.

[Dave67]

I do wonder how the supporters groups are viewed behind closed doors at MLSE/TFC.


As a wild guess? They say the various groups are a great thing for the club. Beneath their collective breaths they probably wish they never had to deal with any of us. I sure as hell would not want to deal with the supporters groups.

[Parkdale]

Your opinion is noted,

you're keeping notes on all of this?

[The Kingpin]

you're keeping notes on all of this?

I've been keeping note since day one.

[blackandwhite]

I've been keeping note since day one.

I thought Damiiano was the secretary??? :)

[Parkdale]

I've been keeping note since day one.

cool. I've got the notes from before that.

[JonO]

^^ Nahh - he just role plays :D

[The Kingpin]

I thought Damiiano was the secretary??? :)

No, he's the Sunshine Boy... :)

[ensco]

As a wild guess? They say the various groups are a great thing for the club. Beneath their collective breaths they probably wish they never had to deal with any of us. I sure as hell would not want to deal with the supporters groups.

I disagree.

The supporters are "the spectacle", they're almost solely responsible for the "atmosphere".

MLSE wanted supporters, and did everything they could to encourage their formation and growth. If the supporters disappeared, I wouldn't count on that waiting list filling the stadium for more than a year, as the gameday experience would be much impaired.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

As a wild guess? They say the various groups are a great thing for the club. Beneath their collective breaths they probably wish they never had to deal with any of us. I sure as hell would not want to deal with the supporters groups.
And this is what many people on here and I'm sure in the TFC boardroom don't understand. Without supporters, a football club is nothing. The Columbus Crew are in the MLS Cup, yet you don't ever hear anyone talking about them. Nobody cares. If TFC made the final, it would be a f*cking massive deal.

Also, the rest of MLS is green with envy over TFC's support. And the reason the rest of the stadium is full is essentially because of us, people want to experience the atmosphere. We're the reason we had the All-Star game here, we're the reason the commissioner raves about us every time he opens his mouth.

Anyway you look at it, we're beneficial to MLSE. The only people who aren't are the drunken beer-throwing idiots, and we hate them too.

Players, managers, coaches and even execs are only around for a few years. We're here forever. We're far more important than they are in the long term.

[GingerNinja]

:eek: WOW!!


http://www.calciopro.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/jorge-campos-94.jpg

Another classic goalie kit

[blackandwhite]

No, he's the Sunshine Boy... :)

He used to walk around with pen and a notebook at the meetings...
probably kept pictures of other sunshine boys!! :)

[OneLoveOneEric]

And this is what many people on here and I'm sure in the TFC boardroom don't understand. Without supporters, a football club is nothing. The Columbus Crew are in the MLS Cup, yet you don't ever hear anyone talking about them. Nobody cares. If TFC made the final, it would be a f*cking massive deal.

Also, the rest of MLS is green with envy over TFC's support. And the reason the rest of the stadium is full is essentially because of us, people want to experience the atmosphere. We're the reason we had the All-Star game here, we're the reason the commissioner raves about us every time he opens his mouth.

Anyway you look at it, we're beneficial to MLSE. The only people who aren't are the drunken beer-throwing idiots, and we hate them too.

Hence my concerns about rising prices, cash grab PR ideas, and leaning on this idea of an unconditional waiting list, and a "thank you sir, can I have another please, sir?" mentality among supporters.
Prices go up ---> supporters can't show up ---> interest dies ---> waiting list gone ---> quick realization that the football just isn't that good on its own.

[Shaughno]

:rofl:

[Kickit09]

http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/picture.php?albumid=199&pictureid=1023

[Dave67]

I disagree.



Ah but I agree the supporters are the spectacle and that the atmosphere brings people in. What I am saying (guessing) is that beneath their breath they wish they never had to deal with the supporters.

[SLBuu]

i think players at the Supporters cup would be a fan-fuckin-tastic IDEA!!!! have a bit of a coach/helpful kinda of role.

do i think it will happen, thats another question!

[Parkdale]

The Columbus Crew are in the MLS Cup, yet you don't ever hear anyone talking about them. Nobody cares. If TFC made the final, it would be a f*cking massive deal.

thinking about what you just said.

If TFC made the Final it would be a big deal here in Toronto (and surrounding area). It wouldn't be a big deal anywhere else. There's no team in MLS that's bigger than the league. Teams like Manchester, Madrid, NY Yankees and even the Leafs are bigger than their league, and people will care no matter what the result is.

TFC isn't there yet

[ensco]

Meanwhile.....I think the market dropped 300 points in the 15 minutes I just spent reading/posting on this.

[The Kingpin]

He used to walk around with pen and a notebook at the meetings...
probably kept stickypictures of other sunshine boys!! :)

Altered for accuracy... :cool:

[canadian_bhoy]

This is why no one listens to you when you make good points! You go off the deep end and make attacks and over the top comments.

You were doing so well! People were agreeing with you and everything.

Oh well.


In tiny TFC terms, Paul would be part of the senior leadership. I'm willing to suggest very few MLSE employees draw "seven figures", let alone TFC. To be blunt, you are sounding just a touch naive. Your opinion is noted, but I think you need to understand how hierarchy works. Paul is in charge of day-to-day operations of TFC, thus he it the main contact with respect to issues. Cesar used to be a main contact as the Marketing Director, but he has been proven to be somewhat useless. In this case Paul needed to take over to ensure that supporter relationships stayed strong. Cesar continues to overpay for poorly targeted ad campaigns, and TTC Streetcar wraps. If you have an issue with TFC, you speak with Paul. Anyone higher in the MLSE org chart will dismiss you, as in their mind you are just another sucker minion. Just taking the piss a bit, but you know what I mean.

[The Kingpin]

This is why no one listens to you when you make good points! You go off the deep end and make attacks and over the top comments.

You were doing so well! People were agreeing with you and everything.

Oh well.

"Just taking the piss a bit, but you know what I mean." shoulda put.. :)

[Gobi]

I can't believe I read this whole thread!

http://img486.imageshack.us/img486/1870/wholethingvm7.jpg

My position: too poor to buy one right now.

I also don't like the idea of being considered a salavating hound at the door, eager to throw good money down on something sight-unseen in order to belong to an 'exclusive' group and catch a free drink.
And right after forking over a whack of cash to renew our seats; right before the holidays; right in the middle of the worst economic climate of our generation... um, no.

I own the 'original' jersey and already belong to a swell group of supporters and can grab a Smirnoff pretty cheap at the LCBO if I really want one.

That said, I might just crash the party anyway... :D;)

[Parkdale]

That said, I might just crash the party anyway... :D;)



that's an option for girls. Not so much for the rest of us dorks

[SilverSamurai]

While the pricing certainly sucks, back when our dollar was on par or over the gringo buck, we were STILL paying more. Really the only retailer that did it was walmart which forced zellers and others to do the same.
Ever try going into Chapters and asking them why their books are so much more? Their excuse is that they would have to buy months in advance. Ok, well try after 4-6 months they still did not adjust prices.
I guess the point of this rant is that we do get ripped off here in Canada. It's been documented in the news many times.
I don't buy the excuse that "shipping" is a factor since they come from the same factory on the same boat.
I'm not buying until their is a sale.

[DOMIN8R]

How many pages will this thread get to?

http://toughpigs.com/uploaded_images/count_von_count-1-720177.jpg

[flatpicker]

I'm not stupid! Or stoopid!!!

[JonO]

I love lamp

[AL-MO]

While the pricing certainly sucks, back when our dollar was on par or over the gringo buck, we were STILL paying more. Really the only retailer that did it was walmart which forced zellers and others to do the same.
Ever try going into Chapters and asking them why their books are so much more? Their excuse is that they would have to buy months in advance. Ok, well try after 4-6 months they still did not adjust prices.
I guess the point of this rant is that we do get ripped off here in Canada. It's been documented in the news many times.
I don't buy the excuse that "shipping" is a factor since they come from the same factory on the same boat.
I'm not buying until their is a sale.

Yeah man. We get royally screwed up here.

[KrazyKanadian]

Holy crap, my bookie was off with his odds. 13 pages and the day isn't even over yet... get back to work you slackers!

[SilverSamurai]

Yeah man. We get royally screwed up here.

I can't remember if it was here or someone on a dif board, but they e-mailed adidas to ask why their was such a difference b/w the pricing in Canada and the US. They got a huge BS response that looks like the poop on Columbus pic.
In short, I choose to vote with my wallet.

I don't buy the excuse that the kits for Canada need some type of translating or something into French. And look at how bad/tough it is to find any Canada merch, but that also includes the CSA factor...

[redcard]

We're the reason we had the All-Star game here, we're the reason the commissioner raves about us every time he opens his mouth.



actually the reason we got the mls cup is because it was part of the deal when mlse signed up for the franchise...it has nothing to do with the support that the team gets. also part of the deal TFC only Canadian team until 2010 and i believe i get the mls cup also can remember which year.

[Kickit09]

actually the reason we got the mls cup is because it was part of the deal when mlse signed up for the franchise...it has nothing to do with the support that the team gets. also part of the deal TFC only Canadian team until 2010 and i believe i get the mls cup also can remember which year.


MLS cup??? don't you mean all-star game? or did we get the MLS cup too while i was under a rock? :noidea:

[Sonny Cheeba]

While the pricing certainly sucks, back when our dollar was on par or over the gringo buck, we were STILL paying more. Really the only retailer that did it was walmart which forced zellers and others to do the same.
Ever try going into Chapters and asking them why their books are so much more? Their excuse is that they would have to buy months in advance. Ok, well try after 4-6 months they still did not adjust prices.
I guess the point of this rant is that we do get ripped off here in Canada. It's been documented in the news many times.
I don't buy the excuse that "shipping" is a factor since they come from the same factory on the same boat.
I'm not buying until their is a sale.

your chapters example doesn't work. they just sell the books. it's the publishers that price them. sure chapters could cut the price, but they'd be losing as they pay the same amount to the publisher. yes it's cost, but something like that doesn't look good in their books i guess.

the only books that chapters has complete control over are their bargain books. that's it. they could put every book on sale, but they need to keep their profit margins high.

i used to work at coles/smithbooks (all indigo anyways) and someone told me to change the price. i told them i'd go in the back and adjust the machine that binds the books.


shop online, it's the best way to buy books, music and dvds

[sidvan]

Let it fester all night and broke down early this morning...gotta get the new kit. Faxed the order in from work this morning at 5:30. A fool and his money are soon parted. What the hell even the banks don't have money these days.

[SilverSamurai]

your chapters example doesn't work. they just sell the books. it's the publishers that price them. sure chapters could cut the price, but they'd be losing as they pay the same amount to the publisher. yes it's cost, but something like that doesn't look good in their books i guess.

the only books that chapters has complete control over are their bargain books. that's it. they could put every book on sale, but they need to keep their profit margins high.

i used to work at coles/smithbooks (all indigo anyways) and someone told me to change the price. i told them i'd go in the back and adjust the machine that binds the books.


shop online, it's the best way to buy books, music and dvds
The point is we're getting hosed. And I was just going by the sign in the store that said that they buy it 3-6months ahead of time.

Ever notice how the magazines stopped putting the US/Canada price on the front?

[TFC Cityboy]

thinking about what you just said.

If TFC made the Final it would be a big deal here in Toronto (and surrounding area). It wouldn't be a big deal anywhere else. There's no team in MLS that's bigger than the league. Teams like Manchester, Madrid, NY Yankees and even the Leafs are bigger than their league, and people will care no matter what the result is.

TFC isn't there yet


No offence, but if you are referring to Manchester United, please don't just call them Manchester...us City fans are insecure enough as it is
:)...

[BakaGaijin]

MLSE only get's the profit from the jersey's they sell. All other profit from jersey sales get's divided up between the rest of the teams in MLS. So this appears to be an attempt by MLSE to capitilize on the pre-Christmas selling oppourtunity by freezing out retailers, and also maximize profit by freezing out the rest of the MLS teams.

If it results in two quality DP's and a grass pitch. I am okay with these shenaneghans.

[nascarguy]

we are not going a grass at bmo field the city will never say yes. But grass at a tfc training field that is own by mlse is a yes

[GeorgeB]

Holy crap, my bookie was off with his odds. 13 pages and the day isn't even over yet... get back to work you slackers!i wonder what the odds were of the thread being started by the mayor's seatmate.LOL im calling William Hill.

[RealG-TFC]

I actually think this looks nice.

http://i1.iofferphoto.com/img/item/649/698/81/o_8cP17V3b7u8xrr9.jpg

[Cambridge_Red]

I don't /\

[andyc]

Just faxed in my form - I'm going to have a very happy 9 year old and I have to admit I have a grin on my face too...

So I got screwed over for a few bucks and I bought a shirt that I'm taking a risk that I might not personally like... The reality is that I would be buying that shirt next year for sure and I'll still love it even if I don't like the design. I'll admit I could be a sucker but at the end of the day I may have spent $20 or so more than I should but I get a new shirt now and I get to meet some players and maybe even get a beer and food.

In the big scheme of things this isn't the end of the world... I've certainly wasted money before now on a whim or for convenience. Just don't ask me how much I spent on the LCD tv a few years ago!! :eek: How many times have you missed the last subway and got a taxi?? Or am I the only drunken idiot on here?? :drinking:

Another thought that I had while I considered this over the last day or so. Consider this alternative reality....


TFC FO announced their new shirts would be launched at a party in TO in early December. Attending would be press, players and a few rich and famous invitees that the MLSE decided worthy. Real fans could wait outside and maybe watch through the window and grab a glimpse of the new shirt if the security guys were feeling generous... Shirts would go on sale in March in time for the new season so no chance for the "Real Fan"tm to get one...

MLSE is happy. TFC FO have an easy life. Fans are pissed off...



Hmmm so maybe fans are pissed off either way??? Tough job keeping everyone happy.... And let's be real here, the incremental revenue $'s are really not even close to being material to MLSE.

For the record, I'm not an MLSE employee or a Leafs fan. I see the fact that prices are going up year after year - believe me look what happened to the kids season ticket discount this year... I bet my % increase was way worse than yours! :hump: But this is the reality of business... If people don't want to buy then all power to you but let's not blow this out of proportion.

Just my 2 cents and BTW there better still be tickets to the party available or I'm going to be super bitchy and whiney about those MLSE pricks... :D

[Parkdale]

I actually think this looks nice.

http://i1.iofferphoto.com/img/item/649/698/81/o_8cP17V3b7u8xrr9.jpg


mine is already in the mail!!!

Yo sunnycheee, I think a new baby blue kangol is in order. You agree?

[Parkdale]

Just faxed in my form - I'm going to have a very happy 9 year old and I have to admit I have a grin on my face too...

So I got screwed over for a few bucks and I bought a shirt that I'm taking a risk that I might not personally like... The reality is that I would be buying that shirt next year for sure and I'll still love it even if I don't like the design. I'll admit I could be a sucker but at the end of the day I may have spent $20 or so more than I should but I get a new shirt now and I get to meet some players and maybe even get a beer and food.

In the big scheme of things this isn't the end of the world... I've certainly wasted money before now on a whim or for convenience. Just don't ask me how much I spent on the LCD tv a few years ago!! :eek: How many times have you missed the last subway and got a taxi?? Or am I the only drunken idiot on here?? :drinking:

Another thought that I had while I considered this over the last day or so. Consider this alternative reality....


TFC FO announced their new shirts would be launched at a party in TO in early December. Attending would be press, players and a few rich and famous invitees that the MLSE decided worthy. Real fans could wait outside and maybe watch through the window and grab a glimpse of the new shirt if the security guys were feeling generous... Shirts would go on sale in March in time for the new season so no chance for the "Real Fan"tm to get one...

MLSE is happy. TFC FO have an easy life. Fans are pissed off...



Hmmm so maybe fans are pissed off either way??? Tough job keeping everyone happy.... And let's be real here, the incremental revenue $'s are really not even close to being material to MLSE.

For the record, I'm not an MLSE employee or a Leafs fan. I see the fact that prices are going up year after year - believe me look what happened to the kids season ticket discount this year... I bet my % increase was way worse than yours! :hump: But this is the reality of business... If people don't want to buy then all power to you but let's not blow this out of proportion.

Just my 2 cents and BTW there better still be tickets to the party available or I'm going to be super bitchy and whiney about those MLSE pricks... :D


thread done.

fatality. this post killed it.

[Parkdale]

oh, for clarification....

remember in the video game Mortal Kombat, when you win so decisively, when it just can't get any better... well that post from andyc was the fatality. Everything after that is just an epilogue.

[stretchthetruth]

what about 'animality'?

[andyc]

what about 'animality'?

Isn't that illegal - at least in several US states??? :D

[The Kingpin]

oh, for clarification....

remember in the video game Mortal Kombat, when you win so decisively, when it just can't get any better... well that post from andyc was the fatality. Everything after that is just an epilogue.

So, for my personal clarification. Take on the chin, don't fight it, the powers that be will always win in the end so it's best not to fight???

fatality is right.... :(

[andyc]

So, for my personal clarification. Take on the chin, don't fight it, the powers that be will always win in the end so it's best not to fight???

fatality is right.... :(

My view is that this is about personal choices and limits... Is paying $20 extra for a shirt and getting a party the line I won't step over?? My view is that there are much bigger battles to fight than this one.

The lines will always be personal... Look at that Newcastle club - People care a whole lot but have consistenly demonstrated that they can't control direction. At best the fans have a veto...

At the end of the day this is not a take it on the chin decision. This is a personal cost/value decision like every other product. At some point the line is crossed at enough of a collective volume that it affects a suppliers decision. The battle will be won and lost at the collective "line-cross" level not the individual surrender and bend over view point.

Good morning to you and goodnight!

[James Oliphant]

In the big scheme of things this isn't the end of the world... I've certainly wasted money before now on a whim or for convenience. Just don't ask me how much I spent on the LCD tv a few years ago!! :eek: How many times have you missed the last subway and got a taxi?? Or am I the only drunken idiot on here?? :drinking:

Did you willingly miss that subway? 'Cause you willingly paid for the shirt...

Did you not view the TV in action before you bought it? 'Cause you're not being allowed to see the shirt before ordering it...

Just saying.

I also don't know what your "alternative reality" has to do with anything. Are you saying it could be worse? That we could be in the middle of a class war? Is this a real-world scenario that actually happened somewhere and you're using it as an example? If not, it's entirely irrelevant.

You also seem to think that the main complaint here is that people are paying $20 more to get a shirt...that's not the case at all, as no one has to pay the extra money to get it early. You can order the shirt without ordering the ticket to the party, if I understand it correctly.

The real complaint is that the deadline for ordering the shirt is more than a week before the unveiling, so we're being asked to shell out $100+ for a shirt none of us have ever seen (or wouldn't have, if not for one fan who happened to snap a photo during a random visit to a Brampton store in July). How does that make sense? Who buys clothes sight-unseen?

[The Kingpin]

My view is that this is about personal choices and limits... Is paying $20 extra for a shirt and getting a party the line I won't step over?? My view is that there are much bigger battles to fight than this one.

The lines will always be personal... Look at that Newcastle club - People care a whole lot but have consistenly demonstrated that they can't control direction. At best the fans have a veto...

At the end of the day this is not a take it on the chin decision. This is a personal cost/value decision like every other product. At some point the line is crossed at enough of a collective volume that it affects a suppliers decision. The battle will be won and lost at the collective "line-cross" level not the individual surrender and bend over view point.

Good morning to you and goodnight!

Actually, if you use the NUFC scenario you could suggest (right or wrong) that they fans were the ones that ousted Ashley after the firing/quitting of Keegan. That probably was not the best example... And I'm a long time Newcastle supporter here...

Look, I'm not admonishing your decision in any way... Do what you will, who am I to say. I just have had avery strong opinion about things like this for a long time. As Deniz said, just make a list... It gets a little frustrating that after only two years they are starting to tear at the souls of supporters and force discussions of this nature. It's just a bit sad, not the end of the world... People are frustrated. Just as you should be with the ticket hikes... Just my thoughts, I'm not judge nor jury...

[the-lower-eastsider]

bottom line: i dont buy any clothes till i see if it fits over my belly and doesnt look like a sausage skin and has room to shrink in the dryer. and has the potential for unforseen expansion in the future...
and btw, good points andy, james and pat.
craiger

[Roogsy]

I hit a tree tonight at the end of the skating rink that was the hill at the end of my street tonight.

I am looking at covering a deductible of probably $1000 plus whatever costs occur when you get your car fixed after you trash the quarterpanel.

Choosing to pay $100+ for a shirt won't break me. Stuff like this accident are what really hurt.

I don't get what the complaints are in this thread. Has anyone taken your choice away? For those who choose not to buy sight unseen...has anyone taken your ability to wait until you see the shirt away? No. For those who don't like collars, has anyone forced you to buy a collared shirt? No.

I am still unclear what exactly we are complaining about here. Nobody is reaching into your pockets and taking your money. Until that happens, I don't see where your complaints have any validity. All of you still have the choice to buy these shirts when and where your decide to do it. Until then...save your money, don't buy the shirt and you are no worse for the wear. For real people... :rolleyes:

[andyc]

Did you willingly miss that subway? 'Cause you willingly paid for the shirt...

Did you not view the TV in action before you bought it? 'Cause you're not being allowed to see the shirt before ordering it...

Just saying.

I also don't know what your "alternative reality" has to do with anything. Are you saying it could be worse? That we could be in the middle of a class war? Is this a real-world scenario that actually happened somewhere and you're using it as an example? If not, it's entirely irrelevant.

Oh boy I was just about to go to sleep...

Did I willingly miss the subway - Wow I'm sure my wife asked me that one as well! It was a bit of an oops sorry thing.... But then when I keep doing that did I just want to stay out drinking late??? At the end of the day the decision was driven by under the usual pain/pleasure principle... I was having fun so I decided to stay and was willing to pay the penalty. No different to the party only this was a sober decision.

I saw the TV in the store but the picture and sound could be completely different at home. Any change from the shirt decision based on the Go TFC picture??? Not so much... I certainly didn't try it on for size in the intended environment...

Alternative reality that I was painting was purely my conjecture on how TFC could have approached this decision. It may not be real for sure but I bet the TFC FO folks thought about that type of scenario... Remember the grumpy thread a month or so ago about no 90 minute party and a certain person calmed everyone by suggesting a much better party in December - this is it folks... Do you think this was always "PLAN A"...

[andyc]

Actually, if you use the NUFC scenario you could suggest (right or wrong) that they fans were the ones that ousted Ashley after the firing/quitting of Keegan. That probably was not the best example... And I'm a long time Newcastle supporter here...

\

I chose that example deliberately... I remember your old board name...

In the NUFC example (probably one of the strongest supporter groups) they couldn't keep Keegan. The best thing they could do was generate a veto against the ownership - and he's still in charge and demanding a premium price...

Who would replace TMLSE in TO??

[the-lower-eastsider]

i get the feeling that some people involved w/ runnin this team catagorically (sp) dismiss the notion that we matter. i really think that many of them truly think we can be easily replaced. the lip service says that we do matter. but certain actions prove otherwise. dollars wise, i guess we can be replaced. sad but true. but atmosphere-wise, we cant. and thats where theyre wrong. these guys should know all too well that leaf fans that go to the games now are a joke. lots of $$$ to spend, but no atmosphere, passion or soul. leaf supporters these days (the ones at the home games) are the laughing stock of the league. and its well documented. everyone knows it.
i gotta get a drink...
craiger

[James Oliphant]

Oh boy I was just about to go to sleep...

Did I willingly miss the subway - Wow I'm sure my wife asked me that one as well! It was a bit of an oops sorry thing.... But then when I keep doing that did I just want to stay out drinking late??? At the end of the day the decision was driven by under the usual pain/pleasure principle... I was having fun so I decided to stay and was willing to pay the penalty. No different to the party only this was a sober decision.

Yeah, but I'll bet you ran your ass off (well, stumbled your ass off) trying to get to that last train. :p


I saw the TV in the store but the picture and sound could be completely different at home. Any change from the shirt decision based on the Go TFC picture??? Not so much... I certainly didn't try it on for size in the intended environment...I don't wanna know what kind of home you have that changes the picture and sound. Get some blinds, man.

And just pretend the GoTFC picture of the jersey doesn't exist, because that's basically how TFC is treating us in this instance. The vast, vast majority of people who got that email have likely never seen that picture. Remember that the people on these and other boards are in the minority when it comes to TFC season ticket holders...there are several hundred of us who read/post regularly here, on Usector, on GoTFC and on Kickabola, of whom many had still not seen that picture until I posted it again last night (based on reactions to it).


Alternative reality that I was painting was purely my conjecture on how TFC could have approached this decision. It may not be real for sure but I bet the TFC FO folks thought about that type of scenario... Remember the grumpy thread a month or so ago about no 90 minute party and a certain person calmed everyone by suggesting a much better party in December - this is it folks... Do you think this was always "PLAN A"...Yes, I'm certain it was...hence the lack of "90 Minute Part Deux". Don't kid yourself; this company (like all corporations) will take any opportunity to have us spend money on very little (if not nothing), but they know that two events like that in such a short time will, with this group, essentially cancel each other out. And in the end, tying in new merchandise with player apperances will make them more money than player appearances alone.

[SilverSamurai]

oh, for clarification....

remember in the video game Mortal Kombat, when you win so decisively, when it just can't get any better... well that post from andyc was the fatality. Everything after that is just an epilogue.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/BPyIK_Vnbl4&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/BPyIK_Vnbl4&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[Parkdale]

And in the end, tying in new merchandise with player apperances will make them more money than player appearances alone.


totally.

How about this angle: instead of paying $50 for the 90min party, you can pay $25 to come to this one AND it's not outside of the downtown core. Take the jersey out of the equation, and it's a better situation than last year.

[The Kingpin]

No = 82.35%

This speaks volumes to me. Even if I factor a 10-15% variance based on a 100 vs. 1000 votes it's still a landslide. This isn't an individual complaint about an individual issue, this is about a trend. By trying to isolate this incidence whilst eliminating the accumulating incidences, it could be suggested your are buying into the rhetoric. I have never denied that TFC are "in it to make money", of course they are. It's how tyou make that is being discussed.

I have come to realise very quickly that "organic growth" to the club means let the fans pay for it, whilst corporate growth means.... Let the fans pay for it. I have probably said this 75+ times here, the supporters do all of the marketing for TFC and then they charge us to do some more. The video's, flags, everything is done or has been done by the supporters... Once they get some legs and the groundwork is done, the club lifts the concept and applies a bigger budget whilst squeezing out the supporter(s) who put in the effort. I must regularly ask myself, where are my loyalties. Are they to the club or to the friends and enemies in RPB. The answer for me is simple, I'll support the people who built what RPB has become. Think or thin, I'll never walk away and never stop voicing my opinions. But I always must challenge myself and my loyalties. Just some internal ramblings anyway....

[Parkdale]

I have probably said this 75+ times here, the supporters do all of the marketing for TFC and then they charge us to do some more. The video's, flags, everything is done or has been done by the supporters... Once they get some legs and the groundwork is done, the club lifts the concept and applies a bigger budget whilst squeezing out the supporter(s) who put in the effort

I do agree that the majority of the imagery they use in their marketing was inspired by the supporters in the stands, but there are things that aren't based on our actions. Remember the wrapped streetcars where they had logos from all the areas of Toronto to play up the 'All for One' tagline? Well there's an example of some of the clubs marketing that had nothing to do with us. There are other examples.

I agree the most impressive stuff (like the "TFC 300" spot) does seem to be a creative interpretation of our image.

[guelphguy1965]

I never got email about this party so I guess I am not worthy. Oh well maybe next time.

[Shaughno]

I do agree that the majority of the imagery they use in their marketing was inspired by the supporters in the stands, but there are things that aren't based on our actions. Remember the wrapped streetcars where they had logos from all the areas of Toronto to play up the 'All for One' tagline? Well there's an example of some of the clubs marketing that had nothing to do with us. There are other examples.

I agree the most impressive stuff (like the "TFC 300" spot) does seem to be a creative interpretation of our image.

The All For One streetcars were made before we played a game, IIRC. Which makes that point moot because, well we hadn't had a chance to give them marketing material yet.

Just saying.

[Krazy_kid]

Just want to clarify the jersey pricing over the years

The first jersey that was launch said "Toronto FC" on the front and it was $99.99

The authentic jersey with "BMO" on the front launched a few months after at a retail of $119.99

This years authentic jersey will be $119.99

[The Kingpin]

I do agree that the majority of the imagery they use in their marketing was inspired by the supporters in the stands, but there are things that aren't based on our actions. Remember the wrapped streetcars where they had logos from all the areas of Toronto to play up the 'All for One' tagline? Well there's an example of some of the clubs marketing that had nothing to do with us. There are other examples.

I agree the most impressive stuff (like the "TFC 300" spot) does seem to be a creative interpretation of our image.

And to be fair Mikey, I did mention the wraps a few pages back. I'll give credit where it's due, I really will. Cesar and his team have proven to be excellent opportunists, and I will give them full kudos for this. I'd do the same if I was in their position. You consistently have excellent market research from the individuals in touch with the pulse right on your doorstep; what are you going to do, walk around them a pay (Insert research company name here...).

This is the mild issue I have with having Paul access these boards, he seeds concepts and drives promotions. They still need to execute their other strategies, but the supporters have been proven to be the lightening rod in the past. I'm not so arrogant to think we make it or break it, but we certainly are an important driving force. Take the supporters out of the equation and let's see how great their "pub nights" are. Take your videos away and maybe I float into the distance because I'm even further out of touch. Don't demean your importance, but also let's keep our heads in the clouds.

Our core issue is the ability to immobilise and function as a singular unit. This is important because when push eventually does come to shove they will be armed and we will not be prepared. I do have this in perspective, this is not necessarily an us vs. them scenario, it's about respect. And we need to regain the respect they are stripping from us and stop feeding their marketing team. I know for a fact that they are still tapping up members for concepts and approval on ideas and using members as sounding boards.

I ask that they give us our freedoms back and really bring it back to the "organic" element they promised since day one. Was that the trust or was it an attempt to placate via hyperbole, or in essence talk out of both sides of their mouthes. Paul once suggested I'm like a dog after a bone, he couldn't be more correct, I am. I hate the fact they have reduced something so passionate down to a convoluted or opaque ploy. I will not be placated or pushed into a corner, I'm here to stay, and I'll be back and I will want the atmosphere to be a genuine as always. I hope this is what Jack is working on, I hope Rooney is working on... Everyone.

I would hate to find out that TFC has discovered how the insure and make profit off road trips and suddenly strip Connie and her team of their efforts. I would hate for one day that only "TFC Approved" banners are allowed in the stadium. It would drive me insane if they started to make tailgates and strip the work and habit forming effort of Pat and Boris. I would be incensed. But they have been slowly doing this anyway, and that is what perturbs me, this to me is what this thread is about. It's the systematic and conniving theft of concepts and ideas. It's the taking advantage of passions. Like I said, I have both friends and enemies here, but they are my friends and enemies, and no one from the outside will take that away from me. Ever.

[JonO]

^^^ But the pub nights, as I see it, are principally for the supporters. And it basically gives us what everyone in this thread is complaining we lack: free access to a few players. In fact, I think the pub nights are a good example of what the club does right...

As for your last paragraph, I agree 100% until you say that they've being doing this slowly. The only thing I have had a problem with is their restriction of player access to various "fringe" media. Maybe I'm just uninformed, but I don't know of any other systematic theft of our concepts and ideas...

[Parkdale]

very good points there Pat. I tend to agree with most of what you're saying.

One thing I'm going to point out, that is worth noting, is that there are really two distinct camps of supporters. No, it's not casuals vs hardcores, it's organized (or group affiliated) and independents. The organized groups are certainly a useful place for the club to test out ideas and get instant feedback, but I think the FO understands that they also need to include the unaffiliated supporters.

When you look at a TFC pub crawl that's out of the downtown core, the place is filled up with these unaffiliates. I went to the last pub night in Missuauga and out of the 100 or so people that were there, I recognized maybe 10 or 15 tops. I'm not going to claim that I know all the organized supporters, but I think I know enough of them by face to have accurate numbers.

What's my point? The majority of people in BMO who show up at every game, buy the jerseys and slap the bumper stickers on their car are NOT part of the organized supporters groups. The things we see as 'issues' like canceling the 90min party, removing the GoTFC press access, using the boards as a marketing research tool.... these aren't issues at all for the independent SSH out there. I'm not sure if I have a point to this. Maybe I'm just wondering is these random supporters feel the same way we do, or are we just getting more worked up over it because we feel that we've got some ownership in this thing we've helped create. I think it would take a hell of a lot to push those outsiders away, as they aren't as emotionally involved as we are.

I need coffee.

[canadian_bhoy]

very good points there Pat. I tend to agree with most of what you're saying.

One thing I'm going to point out, that is worth noting, is that there are really two distinct camps of supporters. No, it's not casuals vs hardcores, it's organized (or group affiliated) and independents. The organized groups are certainly a useful place for the club to test out ideas and get instant feedback, but I think the FO understands that they also need to include the unaffiliated supporters.

When you look at a TFC pub crawl that's out of the downtown core, the place is filled up with these unaffiliates. I went to the last pub night in Missuauga and out of the 100 or so people that were there, I recognized maybe 10 or 15 tops. I'm not going to claim that I know all the organized supporters, but I think I know enough of them by face to have accurate numbers.

What's my point? The majority of people in BMO who show up at every game, buy the jerseys and slap the bumper stickers on their car are NOT part of the organized supporters groups. The things we see as 'issues' like canceling the 90min party, removing the GoTFC press access, using the boards as a marketing research tool.... these aren't issues at all for the independent SSH out there. I'm not sure if I have a point to this. Maybe I'm just wondering is these random supporters feel the same way we do, or are we just getting more worked up over it because we feel that we've got some ownership in this thing we've helped create. I think it would take a hell of a lot to push those outsiders away, as they aren't as emotionally involved as we are.

I need coffee.

I have a few friends that are "unaffiliated" supporters (all STH's).
The major difference is the complacency. On the boards, when TFC sent out the jersey email everyone here had an opinion right away. The majority felt that sight unseen wasn't a good deal.

The unaffiliated supporters I've talked to say things like "Oh yeah, I saw that email" (i.e. I opened it and didn't really pay too much attention). If pressed, they have said things like "yeah, I guess it is weird to not even show us a pic"

I think there are certainly things that TFC can do to engage these more complacent fans and even people who aren't fans - to get them to show the sort of committment and passion that you see from people on the boards (and some not on the boards).

The biggest way to get people to care though is pretty simple - and it's also MLSE's corporate philosophy.

WIN.

[Parkdale]

The unaffiliated supporters I've talked to say things like "Oh yeah, I saw that email" (i.e. I opened it and didn't really pay too much attention). If pressed, they have said things like "yeah, I guess it is weird to not even show us a pic"

I wonder how things would be different if they said something like put down a $50 deposit and you'll be guaranteed first crack at the 2009 jersey. Quantities are limited to 300 units, so act now. And then didn't show a picture. I wonder how that would have gone? Just curious really.

[Kevvv]

^ Who in their right mind would plunk down $50 for a product they had never seen before?

[canadian_bhoy]

I think they would have gotten a lot further if they had made up a poster with Jimmy B or Dichio in a teaser pic (you don't see the whole shirt).Then have a Caption about the launch. It would have gotten people talking and guessing (viral marketing anyone?).

But what would I know...

Examples:

http://www.cardiffcityfc.premiumtv.co.uk/javaImages/27/ac/0,,10335~3320871,00.jpg

http://www.irishfa.com/filestore/images/library/northern-ireland-shirt.jpg

http://www.saintsfc.co.uk/uploads/images/jun_08/sfc_1213181531_awaykit0809tease3.gif

http://www.afc.premiumtv.co.uk/javaImages/1e/48/0,,10284~3688478,00.jpg

[Nodoubtguy]

mine is already in the mail!!!

Yo sunnycheee, I think a new baby blue kangol is in order. You agree?

Where did you order from?? been looking for one for a while.....

[Phil]

I wonder how things would be different if they said something like put down a $50 deposit and you'll be guaranteed first crack at the 2009 jersey. Quantities are limited to 300 units, so act now. And then didn't show a picture. I wonder how that would have gone? Just curious really.


Do we know if things went badly with the way that it was pushed?

I assume it wasn't a smashing sucess but 300 spots offered to 16000 potential customers (those that did get the email) seems that they anticipated a lowish turnout.

As far as some of Kingpins points, I agree. We are moving twords some the of the goals that were pointed out and its a concern of mine.

[canadian_bhoy]

Do we know if things went badly with the way that it was pushed?

I assume it wasn't a smashing sucess but 300 spots offered to 16000 potential customers (those that did get the email) seems that they anticipated a lowish turnout.

As far as some of Kingpins points, I agree. We are moving twords some the of the goals that were pointed out and its a concern of mine.

They were only able to get a small shipment of jersey's. Since you can bring a guest for an extra $25 - they really only need 150 people to buy the shirt for this promotion to sell out. Whether it is a success or not is another story. Personally, I think the negative comments coming from people here lead me to believe that it hasn't been a success (sell out or not).

[alexintoronto]

They should make the party free, open it up to the first 1000 people that sign up and allow those people to buy jerseys if they want to at the party. If they don't want to buy jerseys after seeing them - oh well - the person got some finger foods and a free drink from Smirnoff.

The Season Ticket Holder:
Became a happier customer because he/she got to meet players, got a free drink, got to see (and buy if desired) the new jersey before the general public and was able to spill beer on Parkdale with no reprecussions.

MLSE:
Gets more exposure for the brand, gets some money from Smirnoff and(or?) the drinks given out to fans paid for, gets customer feedback on the jersey, gets a captive group who will likely buy dozens if not hundreds of jerseys, goodwill from the fans.

Why not have it at BMO?


I'm sure there will be, if there isn't already, 300 people who will go to the event as it is, it doesn't upset me - because I simply don't have to go. but I think they could have done it better and are missing a pretty good opportunity.

[Parkdale]

Where did you order from?? been looking for one for a while.....

my buddy works in a soccer shop in Vancouver. He got it from his adidas rep. Apparently, they aren't getting sold in North America (no big surprise)

[Parkdale]

got to see (and buy if desired) the new jersey before the general public and was able to spill beer on Parkdale with no reprecussions.


gawndamnyou!

[canadian_bhoy]

my buddy works in a soccer shop in Vancouver. He got it from his adidas rep. Apparently, they aren't getting sold in North America (no big surprise)

I saw it in a shop in Montreal on rue St. Catherines. Man - Montreal is such an awesome town.

It was in one of those dinky sports shops like you see on Yonge street. They also had the Chelsea and Liverpool Adidas shoes.

[Parkdale]

Man - Montreal is such an awesome town.


when the Impact gets promoted to the MLS, they NEED to change the name to Olympique Montreal.

[canadian_bhoy]

when the Impact gets promoted to the MLS, they NEED to change the name to Olympique Montreal.

That's what they were called in the NASL in the 70's.

Hopefully they have a better logo this time

http://www.sportslogos.net/images/logos/52/1389/thumbs/6024.gif

http://www.sportslogos.net/images/logos/52/1389/thumbs/6025.gif

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

hope these new jerseys have a stiched crest and not the felt ones.

[GabrielHurl]

my buddy works in a soccer shop in Vancouver. He got it from his adidas rep. Apparently, they aren't getting sold in North America (no big surprise)

should have bought one from http://www.thefootballshirt.com - with names, number and badges - shipped for $30

:cool:

see: http://www.thefootballshirt.com/teamdetail.php?team_id=41

[Parkdale]

should have bought one from http://www.thefootballshirt.com - with names, number and badges - shipped for $30

:cool:

see: http://www.thefootballshirt.com/teamdetail.php?team_id=41


and that beats my free jersey how?

[GabrielHurl]

you got it for free - :eek:

[Parkdale]

you got it for free - :eek:

well I'm bartering some design work for it, but that's essentially 'for free'

[alexintoronto]

you got it for free - :eek:

"In trade" ????

[Rudi]

That's what they were called in the NASL in the 70's.

Hopefully they have a better logo this time

http://www.sportslogos.net/images/logos/52/1389/thumbs/6024.gif

http://www.sportslogos.net/images/logos/52/1389/thumbs/6025.gif
Not gonna happen.

The IOC has cracked down on teams/organizations using the Olympic name and its variations without their consent. Teams like Olympique Marseille are grandfathered, but no new teams can use similar names.

Besides, there is no way in hell the Impact would change their name after 15 years of building their brand in Quebec. The only way a Montreal MLS team is called anything other than "Impact" is if a different ownership group is involved.

[mighty_torontofc_2008]

Not gonna happen.

The IOC has cracked down on teams/organizations using the Olympic name and its variations without their consent. Teams like Olympique Marseille are grandfathered, but no new teams can use similar names.

Besides, there is no way in hell the Impact would change their name after 15 years of building their brand in Quebec. The only way a Montreal MLS team is called anything other than "Impact" is if a different ownership group is involved.


They have made an name for themselves with Impact so they should stay with that.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Impact is a crap name. They can keep it for all I care.

[James Oliphant]

I agree the most impressive stuff (like the "TFC 300" spot) does seem to be a creative interpretation of our image.

I'd like to claim TFC 300 as my intellectual property, given that it alludes to last year's New York trip.

At least give me that...the trip was a fucking nightmare otherwise. ;)

[James Oliphant]

Impact is a crap name.

But a fine font...strange how that works.

[canadian_bhoy]

I'd like to claim TFC 300 as my intellectual property, given that it alludes to last year's New York trip.

At least give me that...the trip was a fucking nightmare otherwise. ;)

http://www.super-smileys.com/images/smileys/1068.gif

[James Oliphant]

http://www.gnu.org/people/jag/lulz/sparta.gif

[canadian_bhoy]

http://www.gnu.org/people/jag/lulz/sparta.gif

http://www.funny-city.gr/templates/content/this-is-sparta/this-is-sparta-7.jpg

[nascarguy]

http://www.super-smileys.com/images/smileys/1068.gif
:hulk:

[nascarguy]

just fax my form away

[James Oliphant]

http://www.sign-pros.com/icyhotstuntaaaaaz.jpg

[icecoldbeer]

should have bought one from http://www.thefootballshirt.com - with names, number and badges - shipped for $30


Is this legit?

[Oblio2]

Is this legit?


+1

Spurs 08 Shirt
w/ Numbers and Name
w/Premier League Badge
$8.99

WTF?

[canadian_bhoy]

+1

Spurs 08 Shirt
w/ Numbers and Name
w/Premier League Badge
$8.99

WTF?

Isn't there something written somewhere about is something looks too good to be true - something something...

[MFG1]

the website doesnt really say anywhere that they are official licensed products. I have seen some sweet ass replicas at the flea market and in kensington that look pretty believeable. Anyhoo, for about 15 buks with the exchange, they look pretty good.

[canadian_bhoy]

http://www.sign-pros.com/icyhotstuntaaaaaz.jpg

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i132/Stephensolofo/sparta8.jpg

[icecoldbeer]

Isn't there something written somewhere about is something looks too good to be true - something something...

I'm waiting for confirmation from GabrielHurl...not sure if he has purchased before and what his experience was. However, for $30 its worth the try...especially if I can pay via paypal.

[Shaughno]

From what I've heard they are quality knock off's. FWIW obviously as I've never ordered one myself.

[icecoldbeer]

From what I've heard they are quality knock off's. FWIW obviously as I've never ordered one myself.

merry xmas to icecold,

love shagginhoes?

[Wagner]

I would like to bring up again how stupid the following will sound:

OH WHEN THE PINKS....

or

They're Pink, Their White, Their F'ing Dynamite...

or

Come on you Pinks...

etc...

(will we re-name our beloved drum?? Pink thunder?)

[mclaren]

When Sunderland launches its shirts, the official website has a picture of the shirt. Each day, leading up to the launch, one block of the photo is revealed so that on launch day you see the full image. It builds up anticipation and gets people visiting the website each day.

[James17930]

When Sunderland launches its shirts, the official website has a picture of the shirt. Each day, leading up to the launch, one block of the photo is revealed so that on launch day you see the full image. It builds up anticipation and gets people visiting the website each day.

Yeah, but -- with something like Sunderland's, it's pretty obvious what it's going to look like anyway -- red and white stripes.

Don't see how little tweaks here and there really make much of a difference.

[jaahuuu]

When Sunderland launches its shirts, the official website has a picture of the shirt. Each day, leading up to the launch, one block of the photo is revealed so that on launch day you see the full image. It builds up anticipation and gets people visiting the website each day.
The Buffalo Sabres did that when they switched from the red/white/black jerseys to the blue/gold ones a few years ago, or at least that was the plan. It only took a couple hours for somebody to read through the html code and find the full image.

[Whoop]

Before I think of new jerseys I'm waiting for the Gold waiting list e-mail from FO.

[BuSaPuNk]

I'm waiting for confirmation from GabrielHurl...not sure if he has purchased before and what his experience was. However, for $30 its worth the try...especially if I can pay via paypal.

Make that two of us....Looking to buy 5 or 6 jerseys. Great x-mas gifts and cheap too!! lol

[Steve]

And this is what many people on here and I'm sure in the TFC boardroom don't understand. Without supporters, a football club is nothing. The Columbus Crew are in the MLS Cup, yet you don't ever hear anyone talking about them. Nobody cares. If TFC made the final, it would be a f*cking massive deal.

Also, the rest of MLS is green with envy over TFC's support. And the reason the rest of the stadium is full is essentially because of us, people want to experience the atmosphere. We're the reason we had the All-Star game here, we're the reason the commissioner raves about us every time he opens his mouth.

Anyway you look at it, we're beneficial to MLSE. The only people who aren't are the drunken beer-throwing idiots, and we hate them too.

Players, managers, coaches and even execs are only around for a few years. We're here forever. We're far more important than they are in the long term.

Really? Is that how it works? You mean the only reason anyone other than RPB (though I'll assume you choose to include all of the organised supporter's groups) goes to games is to watch you? Hmm, interesting. If that was the case, I really wonder how TFC sold out over 14,000 season's tickets for the first year. I also wonder how the first game was completely sold out. I mean, I assume word didn't just get out that "there were some guys that would sing".

Look, I think the supporter's groups do a great thing for MLSE. I think they are a good marketing tool. But, if you think for some reason we are EVERYTHING, you're sadly mistaken.

As for the main purpose of this thread, I agree that the price is high, but so what that they're site unseen? They're saying "hey, we're having a launch party to show off the new jerseys, since showing you a picture of the jersey first would make the entire point of a launch party useless, we're not going to. Of course, we know that some people are going to want to buy one anyway, so if you do want to buy one and come to the launch party, we'll have them ready so you can get one as soon as they're available"

I'm not saying MLSE are angels, but come on, did you seriously expect them to show you the jersey before they had the official launch? Does that really make sense to you?

[Oblio2]

It does if they want us to buy it

[canadian_bhoy]

Really? Is that how it works? You mean the only reason anyone other than RPB (though I'll assume you choose to include all of the organised supporter's groups) goes to games is to watch you? Hmm, interesting. If that was the case, I really wonder how TFC sold out over 14,000 season's tickets for the first year. I also wonder how the first game was completely sold out. I mean, I assume word didn't just get out that "there were some guys that would sing".

Look, I think the supporter's groups do a great thing for MLSE. I think they are a good marketing tool. But, if you think for some reason we are EVERYTHING, you're sadly mistaken.

As for the main purpose of this thread, I agree that the price is high, but so what that they're site unseen? They're saying "hey, we're having a launch party to show off the new jerseys, since showing you a picture of the jersey first would make the entire point of a launch party useless, we're not going to. Of course, we know that some people are going to want to buy one anyway, so if you do want to buy one and come to the launch party, we'll have them ready so you can get one as soon as they're available"

I'm not saying MLSE are angels, but come on, did you seriously expect them to show you the jersey before they had the official launch? Does that really make sense to you?

See teaser pic comments and examples.

[Steve]

It does if they want us to buy it

But, you see, they don't really care if you buy it now. This isn't like a "buy it now, sight unseen, or you never get the chance!". You'll be able to buy it later anyway. Besides, this looks to be a small production run anyway, so is probably more for giving people the chance at getting it first, than it is for realising any real revenue.

So, your choice is: Buy it now, without seeing it, and be the first one possible to own one. Or don't, wait, see if you like it, and if you do, buy it later when it comes into full production. Why do those choices upset you?

[Fort York Redcoat]

teaser pic makes sense but how many people are not going to buy it because of this launch? How many of those will change their mind when the season starts?

[Oblio2]

But, you see, they don't really care if you buy it now. This isn't like a "buy it now, sight unseen, or you never get the chance!". You'll be able to buy it later anyway. Besides, this looks to be a small production run anyway, so is probably more for giving people the chance at getting it first, than it is for realising any real revenue.

So, your choice is: Buy it now, without seeing it, and be the first one possible to own one. Or don't, wait, see if you like it, and if you do, buy it later when it comes into full production. Why do those choices upset you?

Having a party for STH which you can go to, ONLY IF you buy a jersey which you haven't seen yet....is just not cool

[Pigfynn]

But, you see, they don't really care if you buy it now. This isn't like a "buy it now, sight unseen, or you never get the chance!". You'll be able to buy it later anyway. Besides, this looks to be a small production run anyway, so is probably more for giving people the chance at getting it first, than it is for realising any real revenue.

So, your choice is: Buy it now, without seeing it, and be the first one possible to own one. Or don't, wait, see if you like it, and if you do, buy it later when it comes into full production. Why do those choices upset you?


Actually, the email sent out stresses that this will be your only chance to get the new shirt before Christmas. So I would say they are trying to get you to buy one now with holiday shopping as the motivation.

[Oblio2]

...and what he said

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Really? Is that how it works? You mean the only reason anyone other than RPB (though I'll assume you choose to include all of the organised supporter's groups) goes to games is to watch you? Hmm, interesting. If that was the case, I really wonder how TFC sold out over 14,000 season's tickets for the first year. I also wonder how the first game was completely sold out. I mean, I assume word didn't just get out that "there were some guys that would sing".

Look, I think the supporter's groups do a great thing for MLSE. I think they are a good marketing tool. But, if you think for some reason we are EVERYTHING, you're sadly mistaken.

As for the main purpose of this thread, I agree that the price is high, but so what that they're site unseen? They're saying "hey, we're having a launch party to show off the new jerseys, since showing you a picture of the jersey first would make the entire point of a launch party useless, we're not going to. Of course, we know that some people are going to want to buy one anyway, so if you do want to buy one and come to the launch party, we'll have them ready so you can get one as soon as they're available"

I'm not saying MLSE are angels, but come on, did you seriously expect them to show you the jersey before they had the official launch? Does that really make sense to you?
People bought season's tickets because of David Beckham. I'm sure you remember that season's ticket sales jumped dramatically after his signing was announced.

Also- you missed the point as it was, anyway. I'm talking theoretically. If a tree falls in the forest and nobody hears it, does it make a sound? If Columbus win the Cup and nobody cares, do they really win it? If Nottingham Forest win back to back European Cups but their fans aren't loudmouth braggarts like Liverpool fans, does anyone remember?

Supporters give a club's accomplishments meaning. Not only that, but I'd rather be a famous club at the lower end of the table than a team in first place that nobody cares about. I wasn't claiming that people come here to watch us and not the football. What I meant was that, one, the supporters as a collective will be around forever while any individual involved with the club is only temporary. It's only the legends (Dichio...) whose names live on for years. Will anyone care about Carlos Ruiz 30 years from now? I doubt it. Will we still be here 30 years from now? Yes.

And by 'supporters', I don't mean only the organized supporters clubs. I mean anyone who loves Toronto FC.

It's not a tough concept. Ask a supporter of any European club and they'll tell you the same thing. The problem over here is that in hockey/American football, etc. culture the fans aren't considered to be as important as they are in soccer.

[Steve]

Having a party for STH which you can go to, ONLY IF you buy a jersey which you haven't seen yet....is just not cool

No, this is a launch party for a jersey, this isn't a "meet the players" event. Yes, you can meet the players there, but you can also meet a bunch of players at the pub crawls, without paying anything.


Actually, the email sent out stresses that this will be your only chance to get the new shirt before Christmas. So I would say they are trying to get you to buy one now with holiday shopping as the motivation.

First, they said it may be your only chance. Second, how many do you reasonably think they expect to sell? Since there are 300 coming to the party, and you can buy additional tickets, I don't think they forecast a huge number of sales. It's a limited run, a way for people to have the CHANCE of buying a jersey first, and of attending the official unveiling party for it. That's all it is. As has been said, the number of jerseys they will sell here is not going to account for that much revenue on MLSE's books. It's a publicity thing. It's a way to combine a launch event with what they've come to be known for, their fans. It's a way to allow the most hardcore of fans (who would buy the jersey sight unseen) to come to their 300 person event (which would likely otherwise have only press and bigwigs), and show the world that "hey, we're a team of the people". It's a way to get a few jerseys (who knows how many they could even get from addidas this quickly) into the hands of people that will wear them throughout the holiday season, reminding people that Toronto has a football team, reminding them of the season past, and the season to come.

Are all of these reasons designed to make MLSE more money? Of course they are! But that doesn't mean they're somehow stealing your money. Personally, I'm not getting a jersey. I might get one next year, haven't decided yet. But, they are giving you a CHOICE! Since when is giving you a choice considered a bad thing?

As far as the vote on this poll, of course it's that skewed! They never expected it to be otherwise. Again, this isn't their main jersey sales tactic, it's a publicity move, buy it or don't buy it, it's up to you.

[Kevvv]

I still don't get what people are afraid of - it will be red or mostly red. They aren't going to unveil a yellow or green jersey, it'll be red. It'll likely say BMO and have a TFC crest. It's rumoured to have a collar. It may have Mo's picture on the back.

I'm sure a couple hundred people have enough faith in the owners to produce a kit that won't be revolting.

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

Teams just don't do the unveiling thing over here, for instance, when the Leafs change their design they usually don't tell anyone. MLSE still have a lot to learn about how football works...

[billyfly]

The colours may change and the shirt design but I think we all have to admit that the design firm for MLSE did an awesome job on the TFC crest/emblem. http://www.burlingtonsoccer.com/pub/images/TFC%20Logo.JPG

[GabrielHurl]

I'm waiting for confirmation from GabrielHurl...not sure if he has purchased before and what his experience was. However, for $30 its worth the try...especially if I can pay via paypal.

Myself and quite a few of the NEE guys have ordered from that site - check the thread here

http://www.kickabola.com/showthread.php?t=15134

Here's a sample of their stuff


http://i38.tinypic.com/ddp7qp.jpg http://i37.tinypic.com/4lhdlf.jpg

http://i36.tinypic.com/2z4zp0h.jpg http://i33.tinypic.com/2j5xjsl.jpg

[Parkdale]

*re: billyfly's post with the crest.

^ I don't think anyone has ever questioned that. The crest is near-perfect.

the only thing it needs....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/mike24k/TFCLogo.jpg

[BuSaPuNk]

Myself and quite a few of the NEE guys have ordered from that site - check the thread here

http://www.kickabola.com/showthread.php?t=15134

Here's a sample of their stuff


http://i38.tinypic.com/ddp7qp.jpg http://i37.tinypic.com/4lhdlf.jpg

http://i36.tinypic.com/2z4zp0h.jpg http://i33.tinypic.com/2j5xjsl.jpg

What about waiting times? How long did it take from order to delivery? Looks like great quaility stuff too!!

[billyfly]

^Parkdale

Amen

[GabrielHurl]

What about waiting times? How long did it take from order to delivery? Looks like great quaility stuff too!!

2 to 3 weeks

[I_AM_CANADIAN]

What about waiting times? How long did it take from order to delivery? Looks like great quaility stuff too!!
Shame about the choice of shirt.... :p

Just had a look and they only have a select few teams, no Udinese available = no point for me.

[brad]

2 to 3 weeks

How much did you nailed for brokerage?

[GabrielHurl]

Customs - nada :cool:

[BuSaPuNk]

Yeah it's under i believe $100 there is no brokerage.

[Martin Groove]

this smells of a cash grab, trying to push the jack astors brand, rather then the kits, the kits would sell no matter what, even if they were released at centre sports, this way, you have to purchase the kit at regular price, not receiving your discount, and you will then attend an event at jack astors, and lets be realistic, we love to drink and eat, like all humans, so you will then attend this bar, and consume, therefore spending money at a sponsors location, very well played, its getting too way too corporate lately for a football club

[Technorgasm]

NEW JERSEY!

http://content.imagesocket.com/images/sunshine_LRG430.gif

[billyfly]

That's a jersey I could get into....

Way to go Cassandra.

[icecoldbeer]

Customs - nada :cool:

Thanks for the heads up! Just put in my order!

[BuSaPuNk]

Thanks for the heads up! Just put in my order!

I as well putting in an order sometime this weekend! Thanks!

[Bars92]

nice one


*re: billyfly's post with the crest.

^ I don't think anyone has ever questioned that. The crest is near-perfect.

the only thing it needs....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/mike24k/TFCLogo.jpg

[the-lower-eastsider]

*re: billyfly's post with the crest.

^ I don't think anyone has ever questioned that. The crest is near-perfect.

the only thing it needs....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/mike24k/TFCLogo.jpg
i likey

[MUFC_Niagara]

Yeah it's under i believe $100 there is no brokerage.

$50 or under, anything over that means you pay on the entire amount. Too bad they don't sell size L :(

[Boondaddy]

I think it's safe to assume that we'll dig it...especially the home kit.

[Redcoe15]

NEW JERSEY!

http://content.imagesocket.com/images/sunshine_LRG430.gif
I'd rather have what's inside the jersey! ;) :D

[Nodoubtguy]

Just ordered a OM Ben Arfa jersey from thefootballshirt.com, $44 including shipping. Not bad at all, just ordered one to see the size, but if it's good.....I'll defenitly order again.

Anyone know when we actually find out if we were one of the first 300 who get to go to the launch party?? haven't got any kind of confirmation.....