PDA

View Full Version : Atlanta In? * Rumour *



Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 12:32 PM
http://islanders.theoffside.com/rumors/rumor-atlanta-silverbacks-leaving-the-usl-1.html

This article speculates that because the Silverbacks are folding, then perhaps this means the Atlanta MLS bid has been accepted. They point to the precedent set by Toronto FC, which caused the Lynx (USL-1) to fold. They can actually be found in the PDL nowadays, but I don't know if they folded then re-formed at a new level or if the whole organization was simply downgraded wholesale.

Wagner
11-17-2008, 12:37 PM
Atlanta is a horrible sports town...

Fort York Redcoat
11-17-2008, 12:39 PM
Terrible decision if true.

Ossington Mental Youth
11-17-2008, 01:04 PM
i dont believe it, not when youve got waaaaaaaay better candidates

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 01:17 PM
Nearly all bids are better than the Atlanta one, IMO. Perhaps save the Ottawa one...

canadian_bhoy
11-17-2008, 01:25 PM
The Atlanta bid is from the owners of the Atlanta Falcons. That in itself makes it a solid bid.

The other team in the league that is owned by an NFL team is Seattle - and they just happen to have sold more season tickets than any other team in the league (17k at last check).

Does anyone have an actual reason why the Atl. bid is bad? Other than "Atlanta is horrible" because as much as I'd like to see some of the other bids succeed - the Atlanta bid looks like a good investment for the league.

Chewy Unikronik
11-17-2008, 01:34 PM
They point to the precedent set by Toronto FC, which caused the Lynx (USL-1) to fold. They can actually be found in the PDL nowadays, but I don't know if they folded then re-formed at a new level or if the whole organization was simply downgraded wholesale.

Ummm... The Lynx never folded. They REQUESTED the demotion as a cost cutting measure, and I'm pretty positive that this was done well in advance to any knowledge of TFC


Does anyone have an actual reason why the Atl. bid is bad? Other than "Atlanta is horrible" because as much as I'd like to see some of the other bids succeed - the Atlanta bid looks like a good investment for the league.
Because other than the Falcons, no team, INCLUDING the World Series winning Braves teams, attract any type of crowd or community support.

Trust me, I've been there.

ensco
11-17-2008, 01:35 PM
I said earlier that Atlanta and Miami would be hard to beat, and got slammed every which way to Sunday.

I just don't think enough people are thinking about how big a dog Arthur Blank is, or how big TV potential is to this decision.

Blank is not somebody's son, or a guy who borrows every dime he's got.

I'm still rooting for Montreal and Vancouver, but I'm a realist.

Ossington Mental Youth
11-17-2008, 01:36 PM
Whatever, none of the guys investing in teams are poor by any standards, my beef with atlanta is the fact (as mentioned previously) that they are a terrible sports town as well as its in the south, which supports college football, nfl and nascar. Theres also no talk about a stadium being built for this team (if im not mistaken) which means one more team in an NFL stadium. At least miami has Barcelona behind them, this doesnt even have that. Sorry, i say invest in cities that have proven support and money as well as stadiums (or at least plans for stadiums) before thinkign about gambles like this

mighty_torontofc_2008
11-17-2008, 01:37 PM
The Silverbacks drew about the same as the Lynx did, very small crowds with inflated numbers . The Fact that the silverbacks are gone does not mean MLS for Atlanta. St Louis and Ottawa will be the 2011 picks.

Ossington Mental Youth
11-17-2008, 01:39 PM
Dunno i wouldnt doubt seeing Montreal or Vancouver (cuz itll mean national coverage) and one american team, possibly out west meaning Portland or St Louis (St Louis being hte less likely of the two). I guess we will see next sunday

Ossington Mental Youth
11-17-2008, 01:40 PM
Garber has said he wants the same success as TFC for future teams, by allowing htese guys they would be going backwards on that theory and following the old mls way.

Azerban
11-17-2008, 01:45 PM
hmm a hypothesis extrapolated from a unconfirmed rumour

chalk this one up in the 'obviously going to happen' column, boys

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 01:56 PM
Ummm... The Lynx never folded. They REQUESTED the demotion as a cost cutting measure, and I'm pretty positive that this was done well in advance to any knowledge of TFC
.

That's why I wrote what I did because I always thought the Lynx voluntarily descended through the levels. The article stated otherwise so I made sure to point it out. :D

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 01:57 PM
hmm a hypothesis extrapolated from a unconfirmed rumour

chalk this one up in the 'obviously going to happen' column, boys

Hahaha, well it's the offseason right? We need to keep ourselves alive somehow.:rolleyes:

nascarguy
11-17-2008, 02:01 PM
Atlanta is a city I would like to go to maybe go watch some NFL maybe

if Atlanta gets a team then it is not to far off that a team will be in FL state

here are some things that we could do
http://www.atlanta.net/visitors/seedo.html

Azerban
11-17-2008, 02:02 PM
Atlanta is a city

i agree

Oldtimer
11-17-2008, 02:43 PM
The Lynx didn't fold, they requested to move down to pdl.

It was after MLSE said they were getting an MLS team.
Bruno Hartrell (co-owner of the Lynx) met with Peddie in order to work out a deal whereby the Lynx would be the academy team to what became TFC. Peddie didn't go for it, and Hartrell (facing economic disaster) asked for his team to be relegated. Moving to the pdl meant that the team would not be relying on ticket sales to cover expenses, but would make money from running their academy. Ironically, this has worked out very well for the Hartrells, as the Lynx have moved into the black for the first time in their existance.

ensco
11-17-2008, 02:52 PM
Whatever, none of the guys investing in teams are poor by any standards

OK just for the record, yes, some of these people are "poor" when compared to Paul Allen (the majority owner of Seattle), Arthur Blank, or AEG or MLSE:

Seattle:

Paul Allen - Net Worth $18 billion
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/10/07billionaires_Paul-Allen_1217.html

Atlanta:

Arthur Blank - Net Worth $1.3 billion
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/54/400list08_Arthur-Blank_6Q6S.html

Montreal:

Lino Saputo - Net worth $2 billion, but he's not the sponsor of the Montreal MLS bid, it's his son Joey. It's unclear how much access to the family money that Joey has. It also should be noted that there have been stories alleging links between the Saputos and the Italian mafia, which have been denied by the Saputos. These stories may be wrong or unfair, but they're unhelpful to the Montreal bid.
http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/285131

George Gillett - Net worth may be zero. He has done it all with borrowed money. He has hundreds of millions of dollars owing against his interests in both Liverpool and the Canadiens. His net worth was estimated to be $250 million in 2006, but has almost certainly been severely impacted by the current financial crisis.
http://www.bonham.com/NewsDetails.aspx?NID=335

Vancouver:

Greg Kerfoot - mystery man. Endless threads on the Voyageurs boards trying to estimate is net worth. There are lots of rumours that he's a billionaire, because the business he owned got sold for a billion dollars, but it's unclear how much of it he actually owned. Nobody knows. Not saying he's a bad guy (he's sprinkled a lot of dough on the CMNT and CWNT), just that he's secretive, which is his right.

It's my guess that his net worth isn't "impressive", in the Blank/Allen sense, given that he needed to add Luzco (this was done very late in the game) and Nash to the MLS bid.

Steve Luczo - Chairman of Seagate Technologies, net worth unknown but made "hundreds of millions" via 2000 buyout of Seagate, and subsequent IPO

Steve Nash - Net Worth of $50-100 million, and brings some cachet for sure

Chewy Unikronik
11-17-2008, 03:30 PM
nascarguy http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?p=266616#post266616)
Atlanta is a city


i agree

Ahhh... That made my day! :)

Fort York Redcoat
11-17-2008, 03:46 PM
The thrashers.

That is all.

ensco
11-17-2008, 04:26 PM
The thrashers.

That is all.

You mean the team my friends from Quebec call "Da Trash"

Keyman
11-17-2008, 05:19 PM
Atlanta is one of the largest media markets in the entire United States, and it has been relatively untouched by soccer. I know that there is a growing hispanic community in Atlanta, while there is also a great deal of local pride; sometimes that's all you need. When Atlanta gets behind a team, they support it well. I think it's completely unfair to state that Atlanta is a poor choice, because really, they've never really tried to expand the sport in that area. There's a big risk of failure, yet, there is also a great chance of success. Atlanta teams are followed throughout the south, and if the south became interested in soccer, then that's an entire portion of the United States behind one team. Sometimes you have to take risks, and in my opinion, Atlanta could potentially be a worthwile risk. It's just a matter of having strong ownership and strong marketing.

Azerban
11-17-2008, 06:26 PM
atlanta is bad, every atlanta team is terrible and poorly supported, and you can sum up southern culture with the words "barbeque" and "lynching"

the south will never become interested in soccer, because they are a backwater wasteland inhabited by people more interested in fucking their sisters than watching some of them foriegners kick a ball around

nascarguy
11-17-2008, 07:52 PM
mmmmmmmmmm barbeque

nascarguy
11-17-2008, 07:54 PM
the south will never become interested in soccer, because they are a backwater wasteland inhabited by people more interested in fucking their sisters than watching some of them foriegners kick a ball around

just like Quebec

Dunc
11-17-2008, 08:06 PM
bigotry's fucking hilarious. do mexicans or black people next, i'm sure everyone will find that just as funny

Azerban
11-17-2008, 08:23 PM
**** out of line dude.

you can voice your opinion on the south, but please leave out the nasty visual references. besides, generalizing everyone from the South as a racist is almost as bad as them generalizing about everyone from the north, or of a racial minority, or a religion etc etc etc.

If you have a legit complaint about the city as it relates to their expansion bid, post it. otherwise, this isn't the place

Azerban
11-17-2008, 08:25 PM
hahahaha just kidding fuck the south i hope they choke

http://xs133.xs.to/xs133/08471/welp784.png

Dunc
11-17-2008, 08:47 PM
What the fuck does any of that have to do with football? You'd really might as well post a bunch of pics of dead kids and civilians in central/south america, the middle east, and vietnam about every one of the American MLS teams.

Actually, no, you might as well not. Because it's got no fucking place here.

Dunc
11-17-2008, 08:49 PM
And could you be cool and remove all the pics you just posted? I don't think anybody browsing the forum at work or when their family are in the room want to see lynched/burnt people and KKK shit

Azerban
11-17-2008, 09:06 PM
You wanted bigotry, you got bigotry. Don't throw the word around like a little child.


Sure, Parky, take out the pictures, hurf-a-durf, but my assertion that the south still needs another 40 years to get its act together before being part of civilized society (much less our league) isn't quite as visually impactful without the pictures of a smiling group of white folk in their Sunday finery gathered around a burnt corpse or a painful reminder that even 45 years ago African-Americans were forced to drink out of different water fountains because they were dirty.

And what does this have to do with soccer? You thought we had a problem with Columbus?!

rocker
11-17-2008, 09:07 PM
sorry guys, but the rumour has to be bullshit, at least in its current form.

When Seattle was awarded a team, the Seattle USL side did not fold upon the announcement. It played on.

Even if Atlanta gets a team, the Silverbacks would likely play until 2011 or whenever the expansion side comes in.

Plus, I don't believe Arthur Blank owns the Silverbacks, so it's not the same situation as Seattle. They could conceivably just keep playing in their stadium.

Someone should also tell the Silverbacks to stop selling 2009 season tickets if this is true ;)

Dunc
11-17-2008, 09:13 PM
You wanted bigotry, you got bigotry. Don't throw the word around like a little child.


Sure, Parky, take out the pictures, hurf-a-durf, but my assertion that the south still needs another 40 years to get its act together before being part of civilized society (much less our league) isn't quite as visually impactful without the pictures of a smiling group of white folk in their Sunday finery gathered around a burnt corpse or a painful reminder that even 45 years ago African-Americans were forced to drink out of different water fountains because they were dirty.

And what does this have to do with soccer? You thought we had a problem with Columbus?!

Sorry but I call it bigotry when some douchebag calls a whole culture of people backward sister-fuckers (my post was directed at nascarguy too when he threw in the Quebec comment, but I'm sure he was joking whereas after the KKK picture tirade I think you're 100% serious). I don't see how that's childish. I don't even want to know what you think of Germans.

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 09:45 PM
What the hell happened to the thread I started? I thought people were joking at first but it seems downright serious? It was supposed to be a discussion on a rumour.

Chewy Unikronik
11-17-2008, 09:48 PM
Welcome to the fabulous Interweb!!!

Azerban
11-17-2008, 09:54 PM
What the hell happened to the thread I started?

in a single run-on sentence;

"dunc likes to throw around the word bigotry but he actually doesn't know what it means, how dare i talk poorly about the glorious south, the people who stockpile guns as soon as a black man is elected"

Azerban
11-17-2008, 09:55 PM
also i'm bored and philosophy sucks

Parkdale
11-17-2008, 10:02 PM
way too many generalizations in here, and not related to the subject matter.

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 10:03 PM
also i'm bored and philosophy sucks

And very drunk for your reputation, I hope. This thread really ought to be closed.

TFC OZZ
11-17-2008, 10:05 PM
Atlanta is one of the largest media markets in the entire United States, and it has been relatively untouched by soccer. I know that there is a growing hispanic community in Atlanta, while there is also a great deal of local pride; sometimes that's all you need. When Atlanta gets behind a team, they support it well. I think it's completely unfair to state that Atlanta is a poor choice, because really, they've never really tried to expand the sport in that area. There's a big risk of failure, yet, there is also a great chance of success. Atlanta teams are followed throughout the south, and if the south became interested in soccer, then that's an entire portion of the United States behind one team. Sometimes you have to take risks, and in my opinion, Atlanta could potentially be a worthwile risk. It's just a matter of having strong ownership and strong marketing.

I would say that there is a chance of GREAT SUCCESS, but a greater chance of failure in general.

*Insert Borat joke here*

Azerban
11-17-2008, 10:07 PM
way too many generalizations in here, and not related to the subject matter.

if i go back and replace all instances of "the south" with "the republican south" would that be ok? that would make it no longer a generalization.

and i tried to re-rail the discussion, next time i'll just call him a douchebag right back and save my effort.

rocker
11-17-2008, 10:08 PM
ok back on topic...the whole media market thing makes me wonder. All I ever hear is how great a media market Atlanta is... but MLS has teams in bigger media markets that still get shitty TV ratings, at least in comparison to other sports. And since MLS is a gate-driven league, the media market thing doesn't really matter yet. Yeah, maybe 10 years down the line...but not now.

Parkdale
11-17-2008, 10:09 PM
if i go back and replace all instances of "the south" with "the republican south" would that be ok? that would make it no longer a generalization.



again dude, not all republicans are racist. I know it's hard to believe, but it's just not the case. It would clearly still be a huge generalization.


thread has gone off the deep end. any more talk that is NOT about the MLS bid will get the thread closed and result in an infraction to the poster

Lucky Strike
11-17-2008, 10:13 PM
again dude, not all republicans are racist. I know it's hard to believe, but it's just not the case. It would clearly still be a huge generalization.


thread has gone off the deep end. any more talk that is NOT about the MLS bid will get the thread closed and result in an infraction to the poster

Oh thank God! Alright, I think I remember saying Atlanta would be a very poor choice: it just doesn't strike me as a city that will actively support an MLS franchise. Add to that there's no SSS and you've got a fairly poor bid.

TFC OZZ
11-17-2008, 10:20 PM
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j163/dj_xtort/Borat_Great_Success.jpg

mighty_torontofc_2008
11-17-2008, 10:51 PM
Back to topic...Atlanta never supported the Chiefs in the NASL days and cant really see a MLS team getting the support dispite the wealthy owner. Miami didn't support the MLS the first time round and having Barca involved might help a little till they get bored. Moneys on St Louis and Ottawa being selected in 2011....Portland and Montreal in 2012....then a break for a few years.

Ossington Mental Youth
11-18-2008, 12:08 AM
delusional about ottawa but youre pretty correct for some of the other points

Cashcleaner
11-18-2008, 02:29 AM
I'm not a big fan of Atlanta getting a team, but I must point out that last year the potential owners of the Atlanta club did meet with Toronto FC execs about the ins and outs of the expansion and team-building process. It is also in an area that the league is wanting to expand into (after moving teams out of it, though), so that could count for something.

To be honest, despite the bad decision I think it would be - it wouldn't surprise me if Garber and the league actively encouraged an ownership group to place a team there. There are several more valid cities ahead of Atlanta in terms of prospective expansion, but I wouldn't rule them out completely.

My Lord! I think I just posted something that's actually about the topic at hand!!! :rolleyes:

Brooker
11-18-2008, 03:07 AM
oh yeah... give Ottawa a team. Who's next.... Winnipeg?

At this point nothing surprises me in the MLS. it's the most confusing league I've ever tried to follow. It hurt's my brain. Seeing Atlanta get a team over St Louis or Montreal sounds kinda possible.... even though it doesnt make sense to me. go on MLS!

ensco
11-18-2008, 07:27 AM
ok back on topic...the whole media market thing makes me wonder. All I ever hear is how great a media market Atlanta is... but MLS has teams in bigger media markets that still get shitty TV ratings, at least in comparison to other sports. And since MLS is a gate-driven league, the media market thing doesn't really matter yet. Yeah, maybe 10 years down the line...but not now.

It's about national TV, not local TV. You cannot get meaningful national TV contracts in any sport if you don't "deliver" the vast majority of the big MSAs.

You're still right, though, getting major TV dollars is a long way off for this league.

Mark in Ottawa
11-18-2008, 07:46 AM
Given the turmoil in Ottawa re stadiums I can't see them getting selected anytime soon.

Atlanta may not be a town that turns out for sporting events, as evidenced by some low attendance figures over the years, but it is one of the largest TV markets in the US and that may count for something.

King Jeff
11-18-2008, 08:05 AM
http://islanders.theoffside.com/rumors/rumor-atlanta-silverbacks-leaving-the-usl-1.html

This article speculates that because the Silverbacks are folding, then perhaps this means the Atlanta MLS bid has been accepted. They point to the precedent set by Toronto FC, which caused the Lynx (USL-1) to fold. They can actually be found in the PDL nowadays, but I don't know if they folded then re-formed at a new level or if the whole organization was simply downgraded wholesale.

I know a guy in Atlanta who has ties to the Silverbacks (sounds like the start of an MLS Rumors story, I know). A few days ago, he told me that a few USL teams, including Vancouver and Montreal, were all going to withdraw from the USL and look at forming a breakaway league.

The idea didn't make any sense to me, but it's certainly in line with this story -- based on what he's said, it sounds like this has nothing to do with any MLS bid, it's just the USL teams wanting out of the league to start their own breakaway. Take this for what it's worth.

Parkdale
11-18-2008, 08:19 AM
My Lord! I think I just posted something that's actually about the topic at hand!!! :rolleyes:


and not a week after the rest of the conversation! :cool::rolleyes:;)

Fort York Redcoat
11-18-2008, 08:20 AM
It's about national TV, not local TV. You cannot get meaningful national TV contracts in any sport if you don't "deliver" the vast majority of the big MSAs.

You're still right, though, getting major TV dollars is a long way off for this league.


You are absolutely right even though they are absolutely wrong. I get the tv marketing thing but it hasn't worked for hockey ( example only used because it's ongoing) and it already failed in MLS (Florida).

Atlanta is a delta hub. As previously mentioned they would be a great sports city if they got behind a team.

Cashcleaner
11-19-2008, 01:05 AM
and not a week after the rest of the conversation! :cool::rolleyes:;)

Don't try to change me. :(

Keystone FC
11-20-2008, 04:55 AM
I know a guy in Atlanta who has ties to the Silverbacks (sounds like the start of an MLS Rumors story, I know). A few days ago, he told me that a few USL teams, including Vancouver and Montreal, were all going to withdraw from the USL and look at forming a breakaway league.

The idea didn't make any sense to me, but it's certainly in line with this story -- based on what he's said, it sounds like this has nothing to do with any MLS bid, it's just the USL teams wanting out of the league to start their own breakaway. Take this for what it's worth.

I've heard this too. Some are saying that there may be a showdown at the USL AGM in Tampa:
http://www.uslsoccerfest.com/agm/schedule.html