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Stencils
09-14-2008, 02:21 PM
Anyone feeling the same way about Ruiz as me? Admittedly he hasn't had much time to blend into the team, but what I've seen of him has left me feeling underwhelmed.

He has trouble controlling the ball on first touch (a big problem playing for TFC since we have this 'play the ball to the foot instead of play the ball into space' mindset). I saw one (maybe two) moments of good play out of him during the Columbus game and I can't recall any from the Chivas game. It looks like he wants to try little flick ons and dummy passes but the rest of the team isn't on the same page. It'll be hard to adjust the way the team plays to accomodate that style.

From the excitement about him I thought we might be getting something a little more. Maybe it's just jitters or not being bonded to the group yet. I hope so. Otherwise I'm thinking we've basically got a lesser Guevara up front (flits in and out of the game...only more out than in).

Come on, Ruiz! Step it up!

Beach_Red
09-14-2008, 02:26 PM
There was excitement? I thought this was a guy we picked up for basically nothing.

Yohan
09-14-2008, 02:43 PM
I smell Cunningham II.

LucaGol
09-14-2008, 02:46 PM
I just don't see why he was brought in.

Ditto for Hunter Freeman.

If we're looking forward to next year, why do players such as Tyler Rosenlund, Johann Smith, Gabe Gala, Nana Attakora, and Derek Gaudet not get more time.

We seem to play better when they're in the lineup anyways.

I realize Ruiz didn't cost us much ... but why bother really.

Axeman
09-14-2008, 03:08 PM
I like John Carver, but I can't explain why Ruiz played for so long out there. It had to be one of the worst performances by a striker that I've seen for TFC(and that's saying alot). He did nothing out there! This guy's supposed to be a proven MLS striker??? I know he's new but he gave no effort at all. Man put Jarrod Smith in or something.

Kickit09
09-14-2008, 03:17 PM
i have a feeling ruiz saves his game (and heart) for international call ups. i know its only been 2 games but i just dont get the feeling he cares the slightest. isn't that what happened in LA too?..... he's just here for a paycheck, and he's not the only one.

ensco
09-14-2008, 03:19 PM
I liked Cunningham better, which isn't saying much.

sampace
09-14-2008, 03:31 PM
Cunningham looks faster than Ruiz, he walks back when the ball isn't passed to him. He has little hustle in his steps, he is lazy. He would fit perfectly well with the Canada National Team that played Mexico last week, they were standing pat while Mexico was passing back and forth. Let's draft Ruiz for Canada's team.

rocktml
09-14-2008, 04:15 PM
I think Ruiz is overwhelmed ;)

Pachuco
09-14-2008, 04:18 PM
Ruiz was horrible yesterday. I can't stress how pissed I was everytime I saw him lose the ball and then saw him walk. Carver is an even worst coach for not recognizing that and taking him off. Every single person in our section was schocked when we saw Barrett come off and Ruiz stay on the field.

a.ungaro
09-14-2008, 04:27 PM
ruiz is shit.

thread closed thnx and good night

Damien
09-14-2008, 04:45 PM
He was good in the old days of the MLS when the caliber was lower... it's caught up and passed him now unfortunately.

brad
09-14-2008, 04:48 PM
I just don't see why he was brought in.

Ditto for Hunter Freeman.



We got Freeman for a couple of more or less useless draft picks to provide cover when we lose more players. We also have his rights if he flops in Europe and returns the the MLS. All in all a good move.

I wasn't impressed with Ruiz either, but he really didn't look match fit to me.

sampace
09-14-2008, 04:56 PM
Based on his lack of speed, all we need is another old timer, let's trade for Blanco and they can head up one of the worst one two punches in the MLS. Then we can bench Barrett. Why isn't Issy playing by the way? I thought he had some speed and energy, I know he is young but at least he TRIES.

Heck, we can bring DeRo as well (the DeRO of Canada's last three world cup games, missing in action and taking bad yellow cards DeRo). Hard to beleive some fans want to pay DeRO DP money when he is nothing more than an average player in the MLS. The only time he shines is when he is surronded by good players, but on his own he is not good enough to change the pace of a game. Even with JDeguzmen he didn't stand out.:eek:

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 05:00 PM
retarded thread.
Dudes been here for 2 games, is out of shape, had no time to gel.
Too soon to say.
People didnt like him previously, thats cool, we get it, but hes ours now and hes out there playing. 2 games is far from being enough time to judge him.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 05:01 PM
Hes 28 btw which is prime age for a striker. Just needs to get fit and play with the team (Fuck, they all need to gel together). Im not saying its definite, i am however saying hes not had a chance to prove himself.

sampace
09-14-2008, 05:04 PM
Ruiz is a professional and they pay him big big bucks to stay in shape. I know he did not play alot in L.A. but he should be working out and staying in game shape for the team considering they are paying him close to $400K I believe a year. No excuses for him. If Issy can come and make an impression in his first two games, if Barrett can come and make an instant impression, so could Ruiz. He did not, and is behind the 8 ball. He has shown clearly why L.A. was eager to get rid of him.:(

Jack
09-14-2008, 05:28 PM
I'll give Ruiz some more time before I make a judgement.

GBV
09-14-2008, 05:40 PM
who-iz?

dude was brutal yesterday.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 05:40 PM
Ruiz is a professional and they pay him big big bucks to stay in shape. I know he did not play alot in L.A. but he should be working out and staying in game shape for the team considering they are paying him close to $400K I believe a year. No excuses for him. If Issy can come and make an impression in his first two games, if Barrett can come and make an instant impression, so could Ruiz. He did not, and is behind the 8 ball. He has shown clearly why L.A. was eager to get rid of him.:(

Barretts also been out of shape, remember all those games he was subbed out at the 60th?

Barrett also made an instant impression because he played in a depleted line up. Gotta say youre being a bit unreasonable. Give Ruiz some time as 2 games just isnt enough even Carver said as much.

Dirk Diggler
09-14-2008, 05:42 PM
Underwhelmed? The mere fact that he showed up to Toronto has exceeded my expectations. Anything from here on in (aside from own goals) would be an added bonus.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 05:44 PM
This is not to mention that Ruiz has been in a slump over the last two or so years, a slump that CAN be changed (not to say it will happen for certain but its a possibility).
Barrett has been consistent as of recent. You cannot compare the two.

Damien
09-14-2008, 05:58 PM
I think people would be willing to cut him slack if he actually created some chances or at least had some close calls. We haven't really seen anything significant in the games we've had him.

The good news is we gave up a bag of peanuts for him and only need to hold on to him until seasons end.

Batman
09-14-2008, 05:58 PM
Way too early to judge. We sound like typical fanATICS on this thread.

tfc007
09-14-2008, 06:39 PM
he looks lazy running for the ball and looks like he wasnt to interested in challenging for the ball.I know its been a few games, we shall see!

David_Oliveira
09-14-2008, 06:46 PM
give it time

Kickit09
09-14-2008, 07:04 PM
I think people would be willing to cut him slack if he actually created some chances or at least had some close calls. We haven't really seen anything significant in the games we've had him.



exactly, its not the performance its the effort. he's shown none. no heart.

brad
09-14-2008, 07:07 PM
Ruiz is a professional and they pay him big big bucks to stay in shape. I know he did not play alot in L.A. but he should be working out and staying in game shape for the team considering they are paying him close to $400K I believe a year.:(

There is a big difference between being physically fit and being match fit. The only way to get truly match fit is to play in competitive matches. Ruiz is very clearly not match fit.

Toronto_Bhoy
09-14-2008, 07:19 PM
I'll give Ruiz some more time before I make a judgement.


Way too early to judge. We sound like typical fanATICS on this thread.

I don't disagree with either of these comments but the least I expect is a turn of effort…personally I didn't see that yesterday.

I've now seen the game twice and seen "half-hearted" efforts…especially after poor first touches. A professional coach, from the old NASL days, once told me at a coaching clinic that, "that is a tell tale sign of a lazy footballer." Its a lack of commitment to "clean up your own errors".

I wasn't the least bit impressed with Ruiz's "effort" yesterday…lets see what he brings next week…

S_D
09-14-2008, 07:22 PM
I just don't see why he was brought in.

Ditto for Hunter Freeman.

If we're looking forward to next year, why do players such as Tyler Rosenlund, Johann Smith, Gabe Gala, Nana Attakora, and Derek Gaudet not get more time.

We seem to play better when they're in the lineup anyways.

I realize Ruiz didn't cost us much ... but why bother really.

Yeah they cost us basically nothing so why not. :noidea: Besides having some warm bodies on the team, I think Mo is looking at the upcoming expansion draft.

Hunter Freeman will not have to be protected, and neither will Ruiz. From what I have read on BS, Ruiz's contract is up at the end of this year. All contracts run until some time in December and last year's expansion draft took place towards late November. And remember if it is like last year's draft only 11 players can be protected, and all but 1 international must be protected.

As for how many internationals we have that is up for debate. There are 2 lists going, one by our very own Wooster TFC here: http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=3237 and one by MLS here: http://web.mlsnet.com/players/roster.jsp?club=t280. Notice that on Wooster's list there are 5 internationals and on the MLS site there are 10 :eek:. After going through it all I think that the MLS site is wrong but who knows in this screwy league.

Now I am not sure if Ruiz can be waived at the end of the TFC season and can just be paid off or not but based on his play so far and obvious absences due to WCQ, it is hard to justify his salary. (anyone know if he can be waived prior to the draft?) I don't think he is worth protecting, especially when there is a core of players that I think are more valuable.

Wooster_TFC
09-14-2008, 08:26 PM
Yeah they cost us basically nothing so why not. :noidea: Besides having some warm bodies on the team, I think Mo is looking at the upcoming expansion draft.

Hunter Freeman will not have to be protected, and neither will Ruiz. From what I have read on BS, Ruiz's contract is up at the end of this year. All contracts run until some time in December and last year's expansion draft took place towards late November. And remember if it is like last year's draft only 11 players can be protected, and all but 1 international must be protected.

As for how many internationals we have that is up for debate. There are 2 lists going, one by our very own Wooster TFC here: http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=3237 and one by MLS here: http://web.mlsnet.com/players/roster.jsp?club=t280. Notice that on Wooster's list there are 5 internationals and on the MLS site there are 10 :eek:. After going through it all I think that the MLS site is wrong but who knows in this screwy league.

Now I am not sure if Ruiz can be waived at the end of the TFC season and can just be paid off or not but based on his play so far and obvious absences due to WCQ, it is hard to justify his salary. (anyone know if he can be waived prior to the draft?) I don't think he is worth protecting, especially when there is a core of players that I think are more valuable.

If you read a little more closely in my thread, you'll notice that we are currently using 11 (updated because I forgot about Ibby and to add Freeman) international spots. The list of players are actually what they COULD count as. So, while we only have 5 full internationals, due to the fact that we only have 5 US spots, we have to list the others as Internationals.

The problem when it comes to protecting players, is we are only allowed to leave 1 international player unprotected from my understanding.

Stugatzo
09-14-2008, 08:33 PM
Ruiz was shite yesterday...complete shite.
Which, given his Red Bulls ties, makes sense.
I wanted to see 25 for 9 go up on the sub board instead of 19 for 9.

Roogsy
09-14-2008, 08:35 PM
He was good in the old days of the MLS when the caliber was lower... it's caught up and passed him now unfortunately.

That was the same reasoning for Cunningham, and I agree with it.

The question is, where are we going to get better players?

Damien
09-14-2008, 09:00 PM
The question is, where are we going to get better players?

Norway, Division II :lol: just kidding.

I think this is where Mo/Carver/Regan have to share ideas. With Regan on board they can send him across Canada and into Central/South America this winter to gather some data on players.

stoked
09-14-2008, 09:05 PM
The entire team is underwhelming. Know what the funny part is? It's that it has been like this for an entire season, yet everyone is picking on the guy who has played for a mere two games with the club.

MG42
09-14-2008, 09:15 PM
The question is, where are we going to get better players?

Well, MoJo and company better have this figured out by now...they should have their targets picked out and a plan for the makeup of the team with 2nd and 3rd options on their charts...if they don't, we'll be just as shite next year.

edit: And as for Ruiz, he needs some games with the team before we can really say...I have a feeling he was just a quick fix for this year anyway.

Stencils
09-14-2008, 09:29 PM
Like I said in the initial post, I'm hoping it's just that he hasn't had time to work himself into his proper role with the team.

Maybe with training and time he'll provide some of what we need up front. But from what I've seen the last couple of times he's been on the pitch, I don't think we'll see what we paid for until next spring.

Maybe I just had the wrong impression of who we were getting in Ruiz.

rocker
09-14-2008, 09:30 PM
you guys are never gonna be satisfied if you're starting up threads based on 2 games judgment. it's like some of you guys are expecting players to just walk into a new team and destroy the opposition.

From section 125 I actually saw a heck of an effort from Ruiz, particularly in the first half... He has running into guys to get the ball, he was jumping high in challenges. did you not see this? he has some problems with chemistry with his teammates, but that's expected. then later in the game he got nailed and was down for a while. Then he was limping as he tried to get back into the play. At that point you could see he was pissed off and tired (not surprising since he played on wednesday in a distant country).

napoli73
09-14-2008, 09:43 PM
The problem is not Ruiz...the problem is that all of the strikers that have put on a TFC jersey have not had the service they need. Right now the chemistry is not there, we really only have one player in midfield that can carry the ball. The long ball over the top is not service.... especially the quality of our long ball. This team needs to learn to keep the ball on the ground and keep possession..we don't have to rush to get our opportunities...no need to fire the ball upfield and hope someone can chase it down.

stoked
09-14-2008, 09:52 PM
i agree with everything you just said. Just to add a bit more..What we're lacking is an attacking option behind the strikers. Now we have Guevara, problem is that he usually has two or more guys covering him or closing down on him. Robinson plays too far back, and thus attack breaks down in the middle. The other teams know that and it forces us to play the ball to the wing and eventually back to our defense who just boots the ball up the field. Or to Ricketts who cuts in and takes a shot from the outside. Both rarely result in a goal or a strong scoring chance.

The solution would be to get Robinson forward more to aid Guevara or play one striker in front of the other. I'd say Ruiz in front of Barrett because he has a better touch and see the play better than Chad.

This goes for everyone....How often do you see the opposition play with the ball in the middle of the pitch near the semi-circle in our half? Compare that to TFC in the next game and people will see what I mean.

sampace
09-14-2008, 10:03 PM
The basic point on Ruiz, he is playing for a Canadian team, Canada which is big on their hockey captains and hockey. HEART is what he did not show in two games. He plays like Vince tinman Carter did for the Raptors. No doubt he has football skill, but he does not try very hard. I do not buy the match fitness argument, if he is not match fit, he should still start strong with his heart, and then fade as the game goes on. He has not started strong, I agree it is only two games, but someone with his pedigree I would expect more. THey should also let him share duties on the free kicks with Guevera.:p

napoli73
09-14-2008, 10:04 PM
This goes for everyone....How often do you see the opposition play with the ball in the middle of the pitch near the semi-circle in our half? Compare that to TFC in the next game and people will see what I mean.

Agree...we have a tough time getting into those areas.

reggie
09-14-2008, 10:46 PM
i was totally underwelmed by carver yesterday,playing freeman on right wing yesterday
his he not a defender,WTF...
how about going for the odd win(2 wins in the last 17 games).
to boot he puts on the wrong smith in the last 5 min....johan anybody.....

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 10:50 PM
This thread is underwhelming

reggie
09-14-2008, 10:57 PM
yes carver was also underwhelming....wow i feel like i'm in highschool again........

Pachuco
09-14-2008, 11:10 PM
you guys are never gonna be satisfied if you're starting up threads based on 2 games judgment. it's like some of you guys are expecting players to just walk into a new team and destroy the opposition.

From section 125 I actually saw a heck of an effort from Ruiz, particularly in the first half... He has running into guys to get the ball, he was jumping high in challenges. did you not see this? he has some problems with chemistry with his teammates, but that's expected. then later in the game he got nailed and was down for a while. Then he was limping as he tried to get back into the play. At that point you could see he was pissed off and tired (not surprising since he played on wednesday in a distant country).

No idea what game you were watching. We were making fun of him in 109 that he didn't know how to win a ball and he couldn't jump for shit. I wish I recorded the game because I would kindly count the number of times he lost possession.

Fort York Redcoat
09-15-2008, 06:57 AM
Watched the tape when I got home. Ruiz and Guevara look like they want to make plays happen that worked on the practise pitch (if they have practised together with all these intnls.) but don't have each others timing down. I hope that they can get on page with each other. I saw Freeman a lot more than Ruiz but him running doesn't mean he's winning us games. It's a start and I hope it improves.

This roster is too inconsistent for these guys to look further ahead then a game at a time.

BuSaPuNk
09-15-2008, 06:59 AM
He just seems to give up on the play way too easily. If the ball isn't excactly where he wants it, he just leaves it alone.

Fort York Redcoat
09-15-2008, 07:19 AM
2 games is not enough for me to write him off but when he protested the hand ball and didn't even make a stride to the ball my jaw dropped.

Shaughno
09-15-2008, 07:35 AM
The entire team is underwhelming. Know what the funny part is? It's that it has been like this for an entire season, yet everyone is picking on the guy who has played for a mere two games with the club.


Thank fucking god someone sees it. We can't keep possession of the ball, individually and as a team, and resorting to long ball has gotten us so far in the past...

CretanBull
09-15-2008, 08:09 AM
It's still to early to judge, his team mates don't know him or his tendencies well and he doesn't know theirs. I think he'd benefit from playing with Dichio more than Barrett though. If Ruiz could finish Dichio's flick-ons and clever passes and we could develope a short-game in front of the net we could score some goals by opening more space on the wings for crosses etc. we'd be a lot less predictable than we are now.

trane
09-15-2008, 09:38 AM
I think people would be willing to cut him slack if he actually created some chances or at least had some close calls. We haven't really seen anything significant in the games we've had him.

The good news is we gave up a bag of peanuts for him and only need to hold on to him until seasons end.


I am in the north end, so toward the end of the game, particularly after Dichio came on, he seemed to get more into the flow of the game, and he did create some half chances. Stil I would rather see a Dichio and Barrett, if they can play a full game.

I am not a fan of Ruiz, but give him some more time. He seems to have a beter understading of the game then Cunny.

rocker
09-15-2008, 10:11 AM
No idea what game you were watching.

I have an opinion and you tell me I wasn't watching the game?
Great way to win an argument. I could say "maybe you were drunk" or too busy chanting to see.. but i won't. ahhh, the experts on the message boards... think everything is black and white.

i saw Ruiz right in front of me for much of the game (I have good seats on the west side).
He was jumping into challenges all the time... really hustling. I counted at least 4 times he did that. And that was just one type of play. Disagree? Or are you just gonna say I wasn't watching this game?

What about the non-call when he was taken down? Did I miss that too? It was about as bad a penalty as the one columbus "earned" in the first half (which was right in front of me too).

Some people are quick to judge a guy without taking in everything a guy does. Don't just focus on a couple plays you didn't like -- that colours your judgement. I see it with Robbo critics too. The guy makes one or two bad passes and that's all people remember cuz they are biased.

He got pissed off at the end cuz the ref was shit, but for about 60-70 minutes he was doing what he could. His teammates and him were out of sync on passes. You could tell he was trying his heart out for most of the game (1 day after arriving on time from Guatemala.. he wasn't late as everyone says he usually is).

trane
09-15-2008, 10:20 AM
Thank fucking god someone sees it. We can't keep possession of the ball, individually and as a team, and resorting to long ball has gotten us so far in the past...

I have found the team disapointing for some time, the problem is when you say it on the boards, people think you are being negative or not a true supporter. All I know is that Everton got booed of the filed at Goodison, after its last home loss. Milan is getting shit for losing the first two games. While agree that back home in europe people need to take a step back at times, but here we are way to patient. The other thing is I do not think we are total shit, it just we have been underperforming for some time. How can you pretend that it is otherwise? Do we realy need a third shit season, before we wakeup.

Stencils
09-15-2008, 10:36 AM
The discussion of whether the team as a whole is playing at a level we want to see is a different subject really.

I think the majority opinion on Ruiz is that he's not playing well right now, but it's too early to tell if it's indicative of how he'll perform when given time to get to know the squad.

I'm happy to leave it there.

v00d00daddy
09-15-2008, 11:14 AM
Guys, he's only played two games with TFC. Give him a chance.

For those of you who want to see what he brings watch the game in 6 minutes and watch from the 3:50 point.
http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/console.jsp

No bullshit long ball. Just smart play. When's the last time you saw a build up like that from a couple of TFC players? How do you think Edu would have done bringing down that ball from Robbo?

This is what we need more of. If he can consistently do this kind of stuff I'll be happy. I'd like to see Guevara and Ruiz a little more. I think the pairing has potential.

Marco2K
09-15-2008, 12:54 PM
I thought Ruiz looked pretty good!

Shakes McQueen
09-16-2008, 09:36 PM
He had a few cringe inducing misses and giveaways against Columbus, but he picked up a little as the game went on.

He also was integral in sending Barrett on his SEVERAL breakaways during our match at Chivas, with smart through passes. They weren't converted, but then again, they SHOULD have been.

Too soon to judge his effectiveness.

- Scott

Captain Croatia
09-16-2008, 10:13 PM
Ruiz to me, seems to have more of a footy sence then most of our players, he will play the smart ball into the right gap...will another player always run to that gap, maybe not, but hopefully Ruiz can find his groove in the next game.

brad
09-17-2008, 09:56 AM
His movement looked good to me, his touch looked rusty. He is an intelligent player, that much was obvious.

There is no way his touch is actually that bad. He wouldn't have made into the old MLS squads if that was the case. My first touch is better than what he showed on a number of occasions. Could also have been adjusting to strange bounces off the turf.

To people complaining about his effort - that's the style that a lot of Central American players have. The tend to be a bit appear a bit "lazy". That's not a detracting factor IMHO. Certain people value effort of production, I don't. Granted, Ruiz hasn't produced yet, but two games with a new team, after being injured is far too early to judge.

Shaughno
09-17-2008, 10:00 AM
^^ Last few comment there are spot on.

jloome
09-17-2008, 11:09 AM
To people complaining about his effort - that's the style that a lot of Central American players have. The tend to be a bit appear a bit "lazy".

It's deceptive because they use their energy, I think, more efficiently. When they're miles off the ball, they're not always chasing back to the middle, they're moving predictively. Guevara's a good example; I've ragged on him for not showing heart, but it's true that if you aggregate everything he does over a game he's still well more productive than most of the team.

TicTacTabarnack
09-17-2008, 11:26 AM
Originally Posted by stoked http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?p=184569#post184569)
The entire team is underwhelming. Know what the funny part is? It's that it has been like this for an entire season, yet everyone is picking on the guy who has played for a mere two games with the club.

Thank fucking god someone sees it. We can't keep possession of the ball, individually and as a team, and resorting to long ball has gotten us so far in the past...

Ding Ding Ding!

Sonny Cheeba
09-17-2008, 11:30 AM
i'm just hoping for some good to happen. with ruiz and the team as a whole. i'd like to see ruiz complain less.... i guess refs need to hear it, but still play the ball.

it was a treat to see the team play together for once. i'm still hopeful.

brad
09-17-2008, 11:45 AM
It's deceptive because they use their energy, I think, more efficiently. When they're miles off the ball, they're not always chasing back to the middle, they're moving predictively. Guevara's a good example; I've ragged on him for not showing heart, but it's true that if you aggregate everything he does over a game he's still well more productive than most of the team.

That's exactly what it is. If you take into account that they are playing in extreme heat most of the time, it makes a lot of sense as well.

brad
09-17-2008, 11:46 AM
You could drop a World Class goal poacher like Van Nistlerooy into our starting 11 and he would look pedestrian with the way we are playing.