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NF-FC
09-12-2008, 09:38 AM
The title says it all. Apparently newt Tuesday at 9am there will be an official bid announcement with stadium plans at the Scotiabank Place.
http://www.marketwire.com/press-release/Senators-Sports-And-Entertainment-899294.html

I can't wait to see what they've come up with for the stadium, but if they build in Kanata it'll be nothing short of a failure.

Huginho
09-12-2008, 09:44 AM
Sigh, why Ottawa? I'll say it now, this won't work because of were Scotiabank place is located. I don't care how much money Melnyk has the MLS won't work in Ottawa. If they do get a team I don't see them being around longer then 5-10 years, 10 years if there lucky.

Wagner
09-12-2008, 09:52 AM
it's the fact that BMO is right on the TTC and GO that make it a success.
they should build a stadium as close to the downtown as possible.
How can OTT beat MTL to the punch??

MrHawk
09-12-2008, 09:53 AM
I say they should focus on bringing back that CFL team that has come and gone over the years.

Now, this is only a bid correct? This does not guarantee them the MLS Expansion spot?

flatpicker
09-12-2008, 09:53 AM
well, regardless of what the potential success might be...

I think it's great that so many people are lining up to get into the soccer business!

This is great! The fever is spreading!

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 09:55 AM
I say they should focus on bringing back that CFL team that has come and gone over the years.

Now, this is only a bid correct? This does not guarantee them the MLS Expansion spot?

Ya, they are just announcing their bid

Damien
09-12-2008, 09:57 AM
This league is going to be gigantic in 10 years, lol.

ccopela
09-12-2008, 09:58 AM
Sigh, why Ottawa? I'll say it now, this won't work because of were Scotiabank place is located. I don't care how much money Melnyk has the MLS won't work in Ottawa. If they do get a team I don't see them being around longer then 5-10 years, 10 years if there lucky.

They won't build it out near Scotiabank Place. They're probably going to redevelop landsdown (the old football stadium) They've already blown up half the stands. It's on Bank Street (a main street) and just south of Downtown. It's easy to get to by bus and or train.

Eugene Melnyk is behind this bid and he isn't the one that built Scotiabank Place, he bought the Senators after they were already there. Lansdown is where the Senators originally played. There's a hockey arena under the south stands. (weird i know)

cuecas_red
09-12-2008, 10:01 AM
if they get a place at scotia bank place, is MLS going to come up with a cheesy name for when TFC and Ottawa play each other like the Finanical Derby or The banking classic

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 10:03 AM
They won't build it out near Scotiabank Place. They're probably going to redevelop landsdown (the old football stadium) They've already blown up half the stands. It's on Bank Street (a main street) and just south of Downtown. It's easy to get to by bus and or train.

Eugene Melnyk is behind this bid and he isn't the one that built Scotiabank Place, he bought the Senators after they were already there. Lansdown is where the Senators originally played. There's a hockey arena under the south stands. (weird i know)

If they build it at Lansdown i have much higher hopes. If they build in Kanata they will be no better then the Crapids.

I don't know if it still exits but on Google maps satellite images it looks like there is a large amount of empty land bordering the west of downtown. If it is still available that would also be a great place to build.

bangersandmash
09-12-2008, 10:05 AM
Has anyone else noticed how many cities in the east are lining up for team? MTL, NY2, Ott, (east) St. Louis, etc. In the west it is only Portland and Van. It'll be very hard to balance the conferences AND get the best cities into the league (If MTL puts forward a great bid, but MLS needs another team in the west, who wins?). There is finally a business case for a single table. :) With no conferences you can put teams wherever is most viable.

Good luck to Ottawa, though. A Battle of Ontario is always a good thing.

I_AM_CANADIAN
09-12-2008, 10:45 AM
I seriously doubt that an expansion to Ottawa would be a success. This is a city that has lost two CFL teams and nearly lost their hockey team twice. And I've never heard anything about Ottawa having anything close to the kind of support for football that would justify an MLS team.

alexintoronto
09-12-2008, 10:49 AM
I hope they get it. It's only - what - 4 hours away? I hope Barfalo (aka Buffalo) gets on too. 2 hours away would be sweet for away trips.

FluSH
09-12-2008, 11:00 AM
it's the fact that BMO is right on the TTC and GO that make it a success.
they should build a stadium as close to the downtown as possible.
How can OTT beat MTL to the punch??

MLS and the commissioner probably turned to watch the Canada vs Honduras game... That would have made them look at OTT =P

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 11:03 AM
I seriously doubt that an expansion to Ottawa would be a success. This is a city that has lost two CFL teams and nearly lost their hockey team twice. And I've never heard anything about Ottawa having anything close to the kind of support for football that would justify an MLS team.

The Renegades attendance the first 3 years was over 23,000. Crap for the CFL but great for MLS. Even the last season when the Gleibermans ran it into the ground they got 18,700 and change.

The Sens problem is Kanata. It's too far for anyone to bother going out there. Thats why the 67's get over 8,000 a game. They are right in Ottawa.

If they had a 18,000 SSS at Lansdown i think they'd sell out for sure

Dub Narcotic
09-12-2008, 11:13 AM
Sigh, why Ottawa? I'll say it now, this won't work because of were Scotiabank place is located. I don't care how much money Melnyk has the MLS won't work in Ottawa. If they do get a team I don't see them being around longer then 5-10 years, 10 years if there lucky.

Not only is Ottawa not that great of a sports city, but this hurts the league in terms of a big-money American television contract that is needed to grow the league. I just don't get it.

ilikemusic
09-12-2008, 11:16 AM
Garber has talked before about the NHL and how it generates a huge portion of its revenue almost exclusively in Canada. He has this idea/dillusion that MLS is going to become the next NHL.

BuSaPuNk
09-12-2008, 11:20 AM
Jeez what is next Fredercition and Halifax??

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 11:23 AM
What a joke, got i hope it fails, id be really pissed to see Ottawa over Montreal or Vancouver, guaranteed itll do terribly

Billy the kid
09-12-2008, 11:28 AM
At this rate, the MLS could almost start a second league just for Canada. They could just play U.S. teams in the champions league.

ManUtd4ever
09-12-2008, 11:31 AM
As long as Montreal and Vancouver are given prior consideration, I would love to see another rivalry created with TFC and Ottawa, my favorite city to hate. As mentioned in this thread, a downtown location is crucial to the viability of a potential Ottawa franchise, which could concievably begin play at Frank Claire Stadium until a SSS is built. Ottawa did a great job selling out Frank Claire Stadium for all their matches during the FIFA U-20 World Cup...

Don Julio
09-12-2008, 11:31 AM
This will not happen. There is no chance.

werewolf
09-12-2008, 11:45 AM
I hope this happens. Forget Montreal. Hopefully Melnyk builds the stadium with the national team in mind as a secondary facility.

wzhxvy
09-12-2008, 11:50 AM
Melnyk has time on his hands now, and a healthy ego...would not be surprised if he buys his way in but I agree...Montreal, then Vancouver, then Calgary before Ottawa...they are cleary looking to be a majour league city but Ottawa is far from it.

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 12:00 PM
I hope this happens. Forget Montreal. Hopefully Melnyk builds the stadium with the national team in mind as a secondary facility.

well if i was a billionaire i'd build a 50,000 seat national stadium. Hold the majority of CMNT games there and package them like a club team with season tickets...but i digress.

giambac
09-12-2008, 12:06 PM
This league is going to be gigantic in 10 years, lol.


If you let city's which shouldn't be in the league come in, the league won't survive for another 10 years.

FluSH
09-12-2008, 12:09 PM
The problem is that it seems the league is snobbing USL teams... I mean Portland should have been in the league a long time ago in my opinion, before they placed a gamble on Toronto... I just don't see any love between USL and the MLS.

So yeah... I can see OTT before MTL

Beach_Red
09-12-2008, 12:14 PM
Garber has talked before about the NHL and how it generates a huge portion of its revenue almost exclusively in Canada. He has this idea/dillusion that MLS is going to become the next NHL.

Why is this delussional? Hockey is a regional game that has maxed out its potential. Like everything is, globalization is happening in sports, too, so soccer will ride that wave.

Inswingingwingman
09-12-2008, 12:14 PM
Perhaps Wiarton should get a team. They give me the willies. The Wiarton Groundhogs.

I won't quit my day job yet.

Beach_Red
09-12-2008, 12:15 PM
The problem is that it seems the league is snobbing USL teams... I mean Portland should have been in the league a long time ago in my opinion, before they placed a gamble on Toronto... I just don't see any love between USL and the MLS.

So yeah... I can see OTT before MTL

It may be like the NHL/WHA that will compete for a while until there are only a few USL teams left and they'll be absorbed into the MLS.

werewolf
09-12-2008, 12:18 PM
Perhaps Wiarton should get a team. They give me the willies. The Wiarton Groundhogs.

I won't quit my day job yet.

:rofl:

ilikemusic
09-12-2008, 12:27 PM
Why is this delussional? Hockey is a regional game that has maxed out its potential. Like everything is, globalization is happening in sports, too, so soccer will ride that wave.

But hockey doesnt have to compete with leagues all over the world for talent. Soccer may very well be more popular with Canadians than with Americans but that doesnt mean more Canadian teams in MLS is going to turn MLS into what the NHL is (that being, a top-flight league that attracts the absolute best players in the sport).

Beach_Red
09-12-2008, 12:40 PM
But hockey doesnt have to compete with leagues all over the world for talent. Soccer may very well be more popular with Canadians than with Americans but that doesnt mean more Canadian teams in MLS is going to turn MLS into what the NHL is (that being, a top-flight league that attracts the absolute best players in the sport).

I hope the NHL continues to attract the top players in the world, but the Russian league is going to offer some serious competition and a European Super League could someday also make it tougher. The thing is, there are just so many fewer hockey players in the world and there are no new territories taking up the game.

In terms of pro leagues, though, I think Garber is right, the MLS will overtake the NHL in popularity in the US in the next ten years. Partly just because of the growing popularity of soccer - both by people playing it and watching it on TV.

It's possible in ten years the MLS can be a league like European leagues - that is one in which four teams compete at the highest level in the world.

I do think some kind of Champions League for hockey would really help it because there are places in the world where it's more popular and taken more seriously - like Russia and Scandanavia - than places like Atlanta and Florida and I wish the best teams in the world were in the same locations as the best fans, but there you go...

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 12:48 PM
Sigh, why Ottawa? I'll say it now, this won't work because of were Scotiabank place is located. I don't care how much money Melnyk has the MLS won't work in Ottawa. If they do get a team I don't see them being around longer then 5-10 years, 10 years if there lucky.


people said the very thin about Toronto, and guess what they are wrong and you are wrong Otawa will be a good MLS site better the Montreal and Vancouver.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 12:48 PM
opps

rocker
09-12-2008, 12:53 PM
i am not certain Ottawa would be a success. that whole city is just built on the government being there and not much else. do they have great sponsorship potential??? We don't need another columbus, where the opportunities for that are low.
I'd put a team in Edmonton before Ottawa.

But if they somehow get in (after Vanny and Montreal, please) then it would be great for Canada. So while I am not optimistic it would succeed, and I would only like it after the Vanny and Montreal, I wouldn't say "no" to it. The more Canadian teams the better.....
Imagine if it ever got to the point where there were all these Canadian teams and they were selling out 20000 a game... it could overtake the CFL in 20 years.

flatpicker
09-12-2008, 12:55 PM
as long as they always schedule their games against Toronto on a weekend!
we would rock the place!

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 12:56 PM
I seriously doubt that an expansion to Ottawa would be a success. This is a city that has lost two CFL teams and nearly lost their hockey team twice. And I've never heard anything about Ottawa having anything close to the kind of support for football that would justify an MLS team.


people said that about TO too.....were they right? losing a cfl means nothing...chicken shit league should go out of Business... Ottawa would be a success in the MLS, no question about it...

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 01:00 PM
i am not certain Ottawa would be a success. that whole city is just built on the government being there and not much else. do they have great sponsorship potential??? We don't need another columbus, where the opportunities for that are low.
I'd put a team in Edmonton before Ottawa.

But if they somehow get in (after Vanny and Montreal, please) then it would be great for Canada. So while I am not optimistic it would succeed, and I would only like it after the Vanny and Montreal, I wouldn't say "no" to it. The more Canadian teams the better.....
Imagine if it ever got to the point where there were all these Canadian teams and they were selling out 20000 a game... it could overtake the CFL in 20 years.


Edmonton? haha what a joke city that is when it comes to soccer.
more empty seats then paying customers when the Nats are in town,
what pro team has aver had success there....Drillers....failed
Brick Men....failed....Avaitors....failed......no chance for this city ever again.

Cashcleaner
09-12-2008, 01:02 PM
I love Ottawa as a city, I really do. It's gotta be one of my most favourite places to visit in Canada, but even I gotta question the wisdom of trying to put an MLS franchise in the city. Having a good central location in the city will help, but an overall desire to win and dominate the league on the part of the ownership will help a lot more.

Mark in Ottawa
09-12-2008, 01:03 PM
They won't build it out near Scotiabank Place. They're probably going to redevelop landsdown (the old football stadium) They've already blown up half the stands. It's on Bank Street (a main street) and just south of Downtown. It's easy to get to by bus and or train.

Train?? What Train?? There is no train anywhere near Landsdowne Park.
It is on the canal though... so I guess you could get there by boat :rolleyes:
or the bike path that runs along the canal.

Melnyk wants in to the Landsdowne redevelopment and maybe this is how he is trying to work his way in with the other developers who already have a "handshake agreement" with the city.

Good luck to all of them.

Mark in Ottawa
09-12-2008, 01:13 PM
people said that about TO too.....were they right? losing a cfl means nothing...chicken shit league should go out of Business... Ottawa would be a success in the MLS, no question about it...
Actually there are a lot of questions about it:

Would they expect any help from the city government?
If so they are dreaming. Municipal politicians in this city have been anti sports for quite a while.

Does "sports in the city" track record count?
If so Ottawa doesn't look so good. Outside of hockey the city and it's populace have killed the CFL (more than once in the last 20 years), a Triple A baseball franchise and a Lacrosse team. If the team needs 8,000+ fans to succeed it might be a tough go.

Are there other and maybe better options open to the league?
Montreal already has a stadium and a successful team, ditto for Vancouver but a new stadium wouldn't hurt there. Why put a location with no stadium and no team at the front of the line?

So I wouldn't say there is no question about it.
Ottawa might be better to take over Montreals USL slot if the get promoted to MLS. Get a working arrangement with an MLS franchise and maybe other football teams from around the world and build a fan base.
Then they could look for promotion to MLS.
Who knows... maybe by then North American football will have grown up enough to entertain the concept of promotion/relegation.

Inswingingwingman
09-12-2008, 01:18 PM
The Otterwa Otters. The ought not to bother. Better if they went to Hull. Or we could call 'em the Re-Dough Rednecks.

Red CB Toronto
09-12-2008, 01:35 PM
If Ottawa were to be granted a MLS team they would be sharing a renovated Lansdowne Park with the CFL expansion team that has already been awarded.

Mark in Ottawa
09-12-2008, 01:38 PM
If Ottawa were to be granted a MLS team they would be sharing a renovated Lansdowne Park with the CFL expansion team that has already been awarded.
A possibility but not a definite. There has been speculation that Eugene Melnyk might look at building his own Soccer specific stadium ala Saputo.

In that way he would control the whole shooting match!

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 01:39 PM
A possibility but not a definite. There has been speculation that Eugene Melnyk might look at building his own Soccer specific stadium ala Saputo.

In that way he would control the whole shooting match!

ya, the press release said that they would unveil stadium plans so it sounds like a SSS

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 01:40 PM
hey Mark, you'd know better. What is all that empty land to the west of downtown along the river? Can it be developed?

Mark in Ottawa
09-12-2008, 02:10 PM
Sounds like the Bayview yards. Serves as the cities main downtown snowdump and still has black sludge melting down late in June every year :eek:

I'm not sure how old the map is that you are using as reference.
Lebreton flats was all expropriated in the late 1950's and sat empty until just a few years ago when the built the new Canadian War Museum there. They are adding condo's and housing to the site next.
This is in the shadow of Parliament Hill downtown right adjacent to the Chaudiere bridge connecting Ottawa to downtown Hull (Gatineau now that they have amalgamated a bunch of Quebec cities).

This should have been the site of the Senators Hockey arena but some retard decided that the fields in Kanata would be better :noidea:

Mark in Ottawa
09-12-2008, 02:12 PM
The problem with development in Ottawa is that most prime land is owned by the National Capital Commission which just seems to gum up the works a lot of the time.

Land along the river... west of downtown... there are a few takers just now.
New Museum of Science & Technology and a new main branch of the Ottawa Public Library have been mentioned most often.

I_AM_CANADIAN
09-12-2008, 02:15 PM
The Renegades attendance the first 3 years was over 23,000. Crap for the CFL but great for MLS. Even the last season when the Gleibermans ran it into the ground they got 18,700 and change.

The Sens problem is Kanata. It's too far for anyone to bother going out there. Thats why the 67's get over 8,000 a game. They are right in Ottawa.

If they had a 18,000 SSS at Lansdown i think they'd sell out for sure
You're right about the whole Kanata thing, that was very poor planning on someone's part. Still, I think both Vancovver and Montreal have to be considered for an expansion team before Ottawa.

Huginho
09-12-2008, 02:16 PM
I don't buy it. Melnyk and his ego are riding TFC's success. I'm telling you now it won't work,


people said the very thin about Toronto, and guess what they are wrong and you are wrong Otawa will be a good MLS site better the Montreal and Vancouver.

Huginho
09-12-2008, 02:17 PM
and considering MLS wants SSS I'd hope they don't consider giving them a team.


If Ottawa were to be granted a MLS team they would be sharing a renovated Lansdowne Park with the CFL expansion team that has already been awarded.

olegunnar
09-12-2008, 02:32 PM
Ottawa might be better to take over Montreals USL slot if the get promoted to MLS.

I think they should have to prove themselves successful in the USL before they are considered for a MLS team.

Otherwise it's an exercise in finger crossing and wishing on a star and crystal ball gazing. That may have worked with us, but it's not a good business model

Maple Leaf Red
09-12-2008, 02:52 PM
Hopefully Ottawa won't win. They are the biggest bandwagon fans in the country. They haven't been able to support any pro sports team aside from the sens.

I_AM_CANADIAN
09-12-2008, 02:54 PM
I think they should have to prove themselves successful in the USL before they are considered for a MLS team.

Otherwise it's an exercise in finger crossing and wishing on a star and crystal ball gazing. That may have worked with us, but it's not a good business model
For one thing, Toronto's a lot bigger, and even though we've had NASL and CSL (the old CSL) teams fail here, there are enough football supporters to justify having a team here- it was just a question of generating interest and convincing the public that this would be a real pro club that was worth supporting.

StandUpIfYouHateChelsea
09-12-2008, 02:55 PM
the bottom line is , the more canadian teams in the league the better , personally id like to see how another team would do in toronto ....... for all those nay sayers out there, just do the math

2million Torontonians
5.5 mil in the whole gta


5.5 MILLION PEOPLE! almost half immigtrints from footy loving countries heck there could be a team in every neighbourhood in toronto

Little Portugal (Caledonia park)
Little Italy
Greek Town
brampton(South east- asain)
eglinton west(jamaican)

the point is there are alot of footy loving people , with the right sponsorship and leadership we wouldnt need the mls to make a top league , it only takes the cash to get it done, people would come!

heck if we wanted to wer could make a CHL based in toronto and all the teams would sell out but no they had to take away the only ohl team.

RealG-TFC
09-12-2008, 03:03 PM
The whole immigrant thing is exactly what not to do! That's why TFC has their slogan as All For One. Why target a specific communitiy when you can traget the whole city. Just look at Chivas..

RealG-TFC
09-12-2008, 03:07 PM
Edmonton? haha what a joke city that is when it comes to soccer.

Not exactly...

http://media.canada.com/8b155442-1233-4729-a252-c06490ca0f9f/aerialstadium.jpg

I_AM_CANADIAN
09-12-2008, 03:12 PM
Like they say, a picture is worth a thousand words...

adampz
09-12-2008, 03:25 PM
Oh god, mls out in kanata. Im from ottawa, and I REALLY dont wanna go out to kanata for a soccer game. Why not fix up landsdowne?

rocker
09-12-2008, 03:52 PM
Edmonton? haha what a joke city that is when it comes to soccer..

huh?

Edmonton U-20 attendance:

July 2 - AUT vs CGO 19,899
July 5 - AUT vs CAN 31,579
July 5 - CHI vs CGO 30,352
July 8 - MEX vs NZL 29,792
July 8 - CAN vs CGO 32,058




more empty seats then paying customers when the Nats are in town,
what pro team has aver had success there.

The same could be said of BMO field last year when the Nats played that friendly. But you're forgetting that Commonwealth stadium has 60000 seats... you'd see a lot of empty seats at Rogers centre too if TFC played there.



what pro team has aver had success there....Drillers....failed
Brick Men....failed....Avaitors....failed......no chance for this city ever again.

dude, basically the whole CSL and NASL failed -- and those leagues folded 16-24 years ago. If we only chose cities based on prior success then Toronto wouldn't have a team. Toronto Lynx had really low attendances in the USL days, same with the Blizzard in the CSL.

Anyways, I said in my previous post I'd choose Edmonton before Ottawa. Do you disagree? or are you saying Ottawa is better? What are you reasons? I don't see how Ottawa's soccer history or market is any better than Edmonton's. This isn't to say I would suggest teams in any of these cities, just that if Garber said "Rocker, we really want another Canadian team after Montreal and Vancouver.... we've got Edmonton of Ottawa, which should it be?" I'd say Edtown.... with the key factor that Edmonton gets an SSS and doesn't play in Commonwealth.
It'll never happen tho.

RYANTFC
09-12-2008, 03:58 PM
Ill be attending this press conference, along with a lot of other people. Hopefully its good

NF-FC
09-12-2008, 04:24 PM
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=f901200c-2128-4c95-a645-3d11e6b5a936

seems Gene wants to build a SSS, so no worries about playing at a renovated Frank Claire

Redcoe15
09-12-2008, 04:37 PM
Canada would be better served having both Montreal and Vancouver join Toronto in MLS. Those are the only markets in this country capable of supporting the growing league. Melnyk should concentrate on bringing a CFL team to Ottawa.

David_Oliveira
09-12-2008, 04:55 PM
If in Ottawa I think I found the perfect place. Not being from there, I have no idea what it is but It seems awesome. Look for Walkley Rd and 417. Train tracks there and everything. Lots of space too.

jloome
09-12-2008, 05:02 PM
I seriously doubt that an expansion to Ottawa would be a success. This is a city that has lost two CFL teams and nearly lost their hockey team twice. And I've never heard anything about Ottawa having anything close to the kind of support for football that would justify an MLS team.

Half the population of the city is either a foreign student or a foreign diplomat or a foreign diplomat's staffer. I was there for Euro one year and watched it at the Canadian pub down in the market. Place was packed for half the games, even during the day.l

jloome
09-12-2008, 05:05 PM
Canada would be better served having both Montreal and Vancouver join Toronto in MLS. Those are the only markets in this country capable of supporting the growing league. Melnyk should concentrate on bringing a CFL team to Ottawa.

That's simply not true. The Edmonton NASL team averaged over 10,000 a season until the league was on its death bed (at which time it was moved to a 4,000 seater and still managed to sell out numerous games.) And that was when the population of the city was about 350,000. It's now 1.1 million.

It's a multicultural city, with Alberta attracting more than 100,000 a year right now in positive migration, and the bars are full on Saturday morning owith people watching other leagues.

Don't base anything on the Aviators; I did a piece on them for my paper and it was entirely poor management that led to that team's demise.

Plus, we get between 15,000 and 25,000 walkup for the average men's Nats game, which is why until BMO was built, Commonwealth Stadium was the official home of the Nats.

I have very little doubt that, in the current excited climate and with the right team promoting and running it, it could be very succesful.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 05:19 PM
Half the population of the city is either a foreign student or a foreign diplomat or a foreign diplomat's staffer. I was there for Euro one year and watched it at the Canadian pub down in the market. Place was packed for half the games, even during the day.l

Gotta disagree here with ya, i was reading stats not long ago which showed that Ottawa is like much of the country overwhelmingly white (with no distant ties to europe). Fact of the matter is that our most multicultural cities happen to be our biggest ones, with a few slowly increasing (predominantly in AB like Calgary and Edmonton due to Oil).

Their history with sports teams is poor, I know thats no gage but it is of some importance.

They dont currently have any sort of interest groups outside of Melnyk who wants money that are clamouring for a team.

I really really sincerely think that an MLS team in Ottawa would be a monsterous mistake a la Columbus/KC especially when we have a team like Montreal which has a financial backing as well as a relatively successful (and old) FO.

Now individually these elements wouldnt necessarily have an impact but together they are significant. As mentioned previously in this thread and others, it really is best for the sport and interest in the sport for smaller cities outside of the big three to work on USL/CSL teams as Hockey is still king and CFL is still Prince.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 05:21 PM
Id be all for Ottawa if i truly believed they could do it but in sincerely have no doubt in my mind that they would make a terrible francise city. I would take Portland and St Louis and even arguably a second team in New York over Ottawa. In all honesty Vancouver and Montreal are the best that Canada has to offer as far as further expansion cities are concerned.

Marc"2L"
09-12-2008, 05:57 PM
well if i was a billionaire i'd build a 50,000 seat national stadium. Hold the majority of CMNT games there and package them like a club team with season tickets...but i digress.

Ding ding., we have a winner....


If you've never been to lansdown, you'd be surprised how nice that little strech of land next to the canal is. http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2109/1603326562_871944857b.jpg?v=0

If they build a NICE stadium (I'm talking on the level of the shite bulls new house) then it could be a wild card. Anybody saying right away that it won't work is far too short sighted...they probably thought the LHC was going to create a black hole that would suck in the earth too...idiots...

wzhxvy
09-12-2008, 06:07 PM
Melnyk has a serious Toronto envy thing happening. Maybe he should bring a second team to Toronto :-) What you gonna call your team Eugene ?? Ottawa FC ?

And yeah Landsdown Park is in a good spot...right by canal, easy access to airport, and downtown, closer to the more expensive downtown neighbourhood but not exactly an OC Transpo hub down there...

As someone said, would be fun to overtake their stadium when TFC plays there...but outside of the expansion money, no value for MLS to have a team in Ottawa...zero...

Cashcleaner
09-12-2008, 06:14 PM
Ding ding., we have a winner....

If you've never been to lansdown, you'd be surprised how nice that little strech of land next to the canal is.

If they build a NICE stadium (I'm talking on the level of the shite bulls new house) then it could be a wild card. Anybody saying right away that it won't work is far too short sighted...they probably thought the LHC was going to create a black hole that would suck in the earth too...idiots...

Actually, that could just do it. Imagine if they build a stadium that puts BMO Field and most of the other team's facilities to shame. Would raise quite a few eyebrows in Ottawa just over that.

Toronto Ruffrider
09-12-2008, 06:36 PM
This sounds like an interesting development. I'd very much like to see a large soccer stadium in Ottawa. I think it would be fitting to have a national soccer stadium in our nation's capital. The commute wouldn't be too long either, so lots of T.O. area supporters could easily make the trip.

redcard
09-12-2008, 06:51 PM
I like the NSS in toronto thanks.

Redcoe15
09-12-2008, 07:29 PM
That's simply not true. The Edmonton NASL team averaged over 10,000 a season until the league was on its death bed (at which time it was moved to a 4,000 seater and still managed to sell out numerous games.) And that was when the population of the city was about 350,000. It's now 1.1 million.

It's a multicultural city, with Alberta attracting more than 100,000 a year right now in positive migration, and the bars are full on Saturday morning owith people watching other leagues.

Don't base anything on the Aviators; I did a piece on them for my paper and it was entirely poor management that led to that team's demise.

Plus, we get between 15,000 and 25,000 walkup for the average men's Nats game, which is why until BMO was built, Commonwealth Stadium was the official home of the Nats.

I have very little doubt that, in the current excited climate and with the right team promoting and running it, it could be very succesful.
The owner of the New York Mets will soon put in a bid for a team, and the league will find any excuse to put a second team in New York, whether it makes sense or not (Red Bulls attendance, or lack thereof). St. Louis has a stadium deal already in place as well as financial investors finally brought in. And there are rumblings of FC Barcelona wanting to put a team in Miami.

This is a league based in the United States. And they will be looking for the big American corporate dollars to fill their coffers. Montreal and Vancouver, despite their strong bids, will be in tough to get a team over an American one. Ottawa has no chance.

Given that Edmonton is viewed as a mid sized hockey town, and nothing else by American minds, what makes you think they'll be taken seriously, much less have a chance?

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 07:37 PM
Not only is Ottawa not that great of a sports city, but this hurts the league in terms of a big-money American television contract that is needed to grow the league. I just don't get it.


Montreal and Vancouver are bigger busts is the sports city department,
Montreal Lost the Expos (MLB) Express (NLL) Manic (NASL)...Vancouver
lost Ravens (NLL) where lacrosse is bigger then Hockey...The Grizzlies (NBA) so Ottawa is better off then those twon they only lost a shitty cfl team.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 07:40 PM
Melnyk has a serious Toronto envy thing happening. Maybe he should bring a second team to Toronto :-) What you gonna call your team Eugene ?? Ottawa FC ?

And yeah Landsdown Park is in a good spot...right by canal, easy access to airport, and downtown, closer to the more expensive downtown neighbourhood but not exactly an OC Transpo hub down there...

As someone said, would be fun to overtake their stadium when TFC plays there...but outside of the expansion money, no value for MLS to have a team in Ottawa...zero...


No its Toronto thats has Ottawa envy...they want a winning sports franchise like Ottawa.... and what you said about Ottawa and no Value to the league, the same was said for Toronto!!

Sonny Cheeba
09-12-2008, 07:42 PM
isn't kanata a place with a couple of dumps? my homeboy is studying the effect of the dumps on people's perceptions.

that's too fuckin far out of the city.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-12-2008, 07:46 PM
The problem is that it seems the league is snobbing USL teams... I mean Portland should have been in the league a long time ago in my opinion, before they placed a gamble on Toronto... I just don't see any love between USL and the MLS.

So yeah... I can see OTT before MTL

Portland should be in no question...they might want to purchase a club like Columbus and move them there. USL cant see it surviving much longer
If MTL and VAN, PORT do make it into MLS that would wipe the USL right out.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 07:51 PM
Columbus isnt going anywhere as much as we dislike it.
I do think that New York might be in the running, as are mont and van, miami i think its still completely in doubt and very little has been said about St Louis financially, there is a great deal of support there however there is a differing between groups as far as MLS fees are concerned

wzhxvy
09-12-2008, 08:09 PM
No its Toronto thats has Ottawa envy...they want a winning sports franchise like Ottawa.... and what you said about Ottawa and no Value to the league, the same was said for Toronto!!

Dude, if you are going to quote me and respond then you should read my post. I said Melynk has Toronto envy, I didn't say Ottawa did. However since you seem eager to want to make this about Ottawa...Ottawa is an artificial capital like many around the world, designated as capital based on its location, its boring as I heck ( I grew up there)...its only redeeming feature is its proximity to Hull on Saturday nights !

Beach_Red
09-12-2008, 08:35 PM
Montreal and Vancouver are bigger busts is the sports city department,
Montreal Lost the Expos (MLB) Express (NLL) Manic (NASL)...Vancouver
lost Ravens (NLL) where lacrosse is bigger then Hockey...The Grizzlies (NBA) so Ottawa is better off then those twon they only lost a shitty cfl team.

When you put it like that...

I do think Montreal will have trouble sustaining interest at Saputo for reasons mentioned in another thread and why did the Grizzlies fail in Vancouver?

Edmonton is looking better all the time.

Cashcleaner
09-12-2008, 08:56 PM
Canada would be better served having both Montreal and Vancouver join Toronto in MLS. Those are the only markets in this country capable of supporting the growing league. Melnyk should concentrate on bringing a CFL team to Ottawa.

Normally I would agree with you, but consider this: a team in Ottawa does not mean we can't have others in Montreal and/or Vancouver.

How do 4 Canadian MLS franchises sound to you?

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 09:01 PM
Normally I would agree with you, but consider this: a team in Ottawa does not mean we can't have others in Montreal and/or Vancouver.

How do 4 Canadian MLS franchises sound to you?

Not to be rude but it sounds unrealistic.

Cashcleaner
09-12-2008, 10:07 PM
That's not rude at all, Ossington. But if Vancouver and Montreal already have most of their ducks in a row, I don't think it's beyond the realm of possibility to include Ottawa in the whole plan.

You do have to admit, it would be kinda cool. :D

Ossington Mental Youth
09-12-2008, 10:09 PM
Oh yeah, provided they have the support, im totally game (just really sincerely, as ive mentioned a billion times previously dont think its possible), id be totally ok with being wrong tho, HA

bones
09-12-2008, 10:10 PM
Normally I would agree with you, but consider this: a team in Ottawa does not mean we can't have others in Montreal and/or Vancouver.

How do 4 Canadian MLS franchises sound to you?


It sounds great Cash!

Toronto
Montreal
Vancouver
and
HAMILTON

FFS, Hamilton is more footy/eurocentric than Ottawa. Neither of which has a snowballs chance in hell but I'm just sayin.

Bones...

adampz
09-12-2008, 10:39 PM
Aslong as theres a bus out to scotia bank for the games id be fine with that, just like sens games. Many of you rpb's on here take the go train to games, and that takes just as long as a bus from downtown to kanata. From what i remember Ajax to BMO was a bit under an hour. I think it would definetly be worth it even if it's in kanata. I'm not sure how realistic this is, but it would be amazing for us footy fans in ottawa!

Sonny Cheeba
09-12-2008, 10:41 PM
yeah that's right. but travelling to the city is a lot different than going to the middle of nowhere. you know?

adampz
09-12-2008, 10:46 PM
I understand, the 50 minute bus ride would be worth it though. Too bad they cant find anywhere closer to downtown. I'm positive there are closer places to buy the amount of land needed.

Sonny Cheeba
09-12-2008, 10:51 PM
i think keeping things central is key. kanata isn't central compared to downtown. where people can travel from quebec, orleans, petawawa..... wherever.. if they can do something with Lansdown that would be dope. Carleton also has some space from what i've seen. it's not as central as Lansdown, but would be better than out in Kanata.

adampz
09-12-2008, 11:08 PM
I know the big supporters in ottawa would go out to kanata every saturday. Im thinking about the families though, or the older folks that just want to spend an afternoon out, watching some footy. I think there would be more families, older people, and just general football fans who would come if it was somewhere closer, like landsdowne, carleton. There are many places that im sure Melnyk could buy.

Sonny Cheeba
09-12-2008, 11:11 PM
how many pubs are there out there? enough to fuel some supporters?

RYANTFC
09-12-2008, 11:12 PM
yo im goin to this press conference tuesday so it better be good

Ladies Love Julius James
09-12-2008, 11:13 PM
yo im goin to this press conference tuesday so it better be good


Goto fuckin school.

adampz
09-12-2008, 11:21 PM
^ Forget about school, hopefully i can get out to this press conference too. Id like to have a couple of words with mr melnyk, maybe give him my email so he can send me updates and give me insider information. Id tell him to not build in kanata, and not name the team "ottawa senators FC" or something stupid like that.

RYANTFC
09-12-2008, 11:22 PM
Goto fuckin school.

go smoke or drink lol

Ladies Love Julius James
09-12-2008, 11:23 PM
go smoke or drink lol


No LOL I've found myself and my calling.

RYANTFC
09-12-2008, 11:25 PM
No LOL I've found myself and my calling.

looooool kk good stuff JULIUS, go to UNI

adampz
09-12-2008, 11:27 PM
We all want MLS in ottawa, i think melnyk has a lot of money and is a somewhat intelligent guy when it comes to marketing and what not. I think hed choose a good place for a stadium, good ticket prices, he'd advertise for the team a lot, and hopefully give the team a traditional football name

Axeman
09-13-2008, 01:27 AM
I've worked and lived in Kanata(right near Scotiabank place) for most of my life and can tell you that location is not a huge problem, Melnyk has obviously had a big influence(Ottawa being mentioned in League-wide address) on this and that having a stadium right downtown(i.e.Landsdowne, or for you Torontonians Frank Clair Stadium) was a pain in the ass for anyone not living in the Glebe(area of Ottawa) to get to. At least with Scotiabank you got the 417 to get to it.

Ottawa's problem is the lack of soccer awareness in this city and moreso the lack of media acceptance. If you by the Ottawa Sun or Citizen their is nomention of soccer ever being on TV, let alone half a page of MLS news, but we'll have all the figure skating news though???
When I tell people I love TFC they start talking to me about UFC???
Don't get me wrong we're the city that die-hardedly supported(and still would) our beloved CFL team(though the Gleiberman's turned it into a striptease?).
That being said any chance to go see TFC and host party's(mainly drunken singing) for fellow visiting RPB without leaving the city would be a dream come true,

Onward for Melnyk and the Ottawa bid!

TFC 4 Life!!!

Axeman
09-13-2008, 01:28 AM
I've worked and lived in Kanata(right near Scotiabank place) for most of my life and can tell you that location is not a huge problem, Melnyk has obviously had a big influence(Ottawa being mentioned in League-wide address) on this and that having a stadium right downtown(i.e.Landsdowne, or for you Torontonians Frank Clair Stadium) was a pain in the ass for anyone not living in the Glebe(area of Ottawa) to get to. At least with Scotiabank you got the 417 to get to it.

Ottawa's problem is the lack of soccer awareness in this city and moreso the lack of media acceptance. If you by the Ottawa Sun or Citizen their is nomention of soccer ever being on TV, let alone half a page of MLS news, but we'll have all the figure skating news though???
When I tell people I love TFC they start talking to me about UFC???
Don't get me wrong we're the city that die-hardedly supported(and still would) our beloved CFL team(though the Gleiberman's turned it into a striptease?).
That being said any chance to go see TFC and host party's(mainly drunken singing) for fellow visiting RPB without leaving the city would be a dream come true,

Onward for Melnyk and the Ottawa bid!

TFC 4 Life!!!:canada:

And Cheers for the Humping Smiley Face!:hump:

UltraSuperMegaMo
09-13-2008, 02:04 AM
I’m torn on this one. More Canadian teams would great, but why Ottawa? Certainly Montreal and Vancouver make more sense.

Also in terms of the health and growth of the league does Ottawa really make much sense? Do I want more Canadian teams now or the league to be around for the rest of my life? If it was between having a team in Ottawa or having one in NYC proper (the Mets bid), I think I would prefer NYC.

Keystone FC
09-13-2008, 03:20 AM
Iím torn on this one. More Canadian teams would great, but why Ottawa? Certainly Montreal and Vancouver make more sense.

Also in terms of the health and growth of the league does Ottawa really make much sense? Do I want more Canadian teams now or the league to be around for the rest of my life? If it was between having a team in Ottawa or having one in NYC proper (the Mets bid), I think I would prefer NYC.


I have a feeling that Garber is just covering his bases on franchises to be added. I hate to say it but Ottawa is going to be played like a violin and toyed with like a cat chew toy. Ottawa is going to be used to get stalled franchises like St. Louis and NYC into gear for fear that they would lose their spot to the Canadian capital.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-13-2008, 04:26 AM
I have a feeling that Garber is just covering his bases on franchises to be added. I hate to say it but Ottawa is going to be played like a violin and toyed with like a cat chew toy. Ottawa is going to be used to get stalled franchises like St. Louis and NYC into gear for fear that they would lose their spot to the Canadian capital.

Yep, I really gotta agree with this statement

Fort York Redcoat
09-13-2008, 05:22 AM
It's not a bad thing if Ottawa gets in the mode for it and then could join the USL. I think it would be a step forward if Ottawa raised their status from USL PD to USL taking Montreals place in the league.

Draracle
09-13-2008, 07:19 AM
FAIL! Ottawa is the worst sports town in Canada. They can't support a CFL team, they berely support an NHL team (which is mind boggling), and the surely can't support anything else.

rocker
09-13-2008, 08:51 AM
http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/OtherSports/2008/09/12/6747741.html

vergilg
09-13-2008, 09:16 AM
FAIL! Ottawa is the worst sports town in Canada. They can't support a CFL team, they berely support an NHL team (which is mind boggling), and the surely can't support anything else.


#1 You failed at birth.
#2 FACT: 40/41 home game sellouts for the Sens last year. 10 Straight post-seasons.

Ok... Back on topic...


DID ANYONE ACTUALLY READ THE ARTICLE THAT STARTED THIS THREAD?!!?:noidea:

1. MELNYK IS LAUNCHING AN OFFICIAL BID FOR AN MLS TEAM AND ANNOUNCING PLANS TO RE-DEVELOP FRANK CLAIR STADIUM (THE EX-CFL STADIUM DOWNTOWN)
- NOT KANATA/SCOTIABANK PLACE WHERE THE SENS PLAY.


2. The stadium won't be ready for probably (this is just a guess) 3-5 years, because the city hasn't decided what to do yet, and no construction has started on site! SOOOOOOOOOO, MONTREAL, VANCOUVER, SEATTLE, PORTLAND, ETC. will get in before Ottawa is FORMALLY APPROVED.


3. WHY ALL THE NEGATIVITY, ESPECIALLY WHEN THIS WOULD BE GREAT FOR CANADIAN SOCCER IN GENERAL?!

This is such great news and everyone (from Toronto mostly) is jumping the gun to bash with negativity something that hasn't even happened yet. My guess, all of this is pent up, misdirected Leafs frustration.

vergilg
09-13-2008, 09:25 AM
http://www.ottawasun.com/Sports/OtherSports/2008/09/12/6747741.html


Just read THAT article and I wanted to amend my comment above...

If Melnyk decides to build the stadium out in Kanata on land HE ALREADY OWNS, all the better for that new business. Also, all the better for the future soccer team because HE will own the stadium, he won't have to share it with a possible CFL franchise, and he will likely put in real grass, or something better than the carpet at BMO.

If 19,000 people make it out for hockey games 41 times a year, I am SURE the same can be done for soccer for several reasons:
- Kanata is a large soccer community
- ticket prices for soccer will be much lower than hockey AND soccer won't be directly competing with hockey for the fans


Bottom line: I hope Melnyk builds in Kanata if only to avoid all the City of Ottawa red tape.

vergilg
09-13-2008, 09:27 AM
Yep, I really gotta agree with this statement


Possibly.

But business is business. If Melnyk has a stadium, a team, and season's tickets sales and all he needs is a green light, do you think the MLS will push the money off the table to wait for an American team?

Kooper
09-13-2008, 09:41 AM
it's the fact that BMO is right on the TTC and GO that make it a success.
they should build a stadium as close to the downtown as possible.
How can OTT beat MTL to the punch??

Ottawa fans will drive to a hockey game but they won't drive to a soccer game in Kanata. It has to be Lansdowne or nothing. Unfortunately for Melnyk there will be a big protest by the old baby boomers and retirees that live across the street from Lansdowne who have been trying to get rid of the stadium and the EX for years.

Kooper
09-13-2008, 09:48 AM
How do 4 Canadian MLS franchises sound to you?

If they do put 4 teams in Canada we need to change the amount of Canadian content required on the teams. As it stands trying to find enough talented Canadian players to fill TFCs requirements can be difficult. Imaginee a bidding war and Lombardo signing a huge contract because Edmonton needs to fill the spot. Granted over time the number of good Canadian players would improve but it would take time.

Keystone FC
09-13-2008, 10:13 AM
It's not a bad thing if Ottawa gets in the mode for it and then could join the USL. I think it would be a step forward if Ottawa raised their status from USL PD to USL taking Montreals place in the league.
:eek:
I hadn't thought of that. That sounds like a good plan and it would give us a 4th for the Canada Cup.
:canada:

Keegan
09-13-2008, 10:34 AM
If they do put 4 teams in Canada we need to change the amount of Canadian content required on the teams. As it stands trying to find enough talented Canadian players to fill TFCs requirements can be difficult. Imaginee a bidding war and Lombardo signing a huge contract because Edmonton needs to fill the spot. Granted over time the number of good Canadian players would improve but it would take time.

There are a ton of good Canucks in this league. Will Johnson, De Rosario, Jazic, Onstad, Serioux. Add to this the amount of Canucks in leagues across Europe there is more than enough talent to go around 4 teams especially since Vancouver and Montreal already have a lot of Canadian talent (Placcentino, Grande, Nash, Clarke). Not to mention our ever improving youth programs who seem to pop out their share of good players as I type this I am watching David Edgar start vs. Hull City in the Premier League.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-13-2008, 10:45 AM
Possibly.

But business is business. If Melnyk has a stadium, a team, and season's tickets sales and all he needs is a green light, do you think the MLS will push the money off the table to wait for an American team?

yeah i do if its the likes of a high profile city like NYC2 or Miami that looks like they have some serious promise or cities that have had their name thrown around forever like Portland and St Louis,

Nothing wrong with more Canadian teams, its just that the MLS was originally put together to help build up american soccer, while american soccer is alot stronger than it once was, its still a theme thats on the back burner. Now thats not to say that they wont add another Canadian team or two, it just means that Canadian teams are going to have to put in a bit of a greater effort and things such as being an existing organization is definitely going to help.

NF-FC
09-13-2008, 11:05 AM
lets just make a real fucking Canadian league already!

S_D
09-13-2008, 11:24 AM
Having lived in Ottawa for a long time, I just can't see this working out.

I question the drive behind the Ottawa bid. The want a CFL franchise as it has been talked about for ages. Can't legitimately hit up the City of Ottawa for a new stadium (and lets face it Landsdown should have been demolished 20 years ago when the railing collapsed during Panda) with only a few home dates from football (pointyball), so they need another tenant and MLS just happens to fit the bill.

I would rather see that the demand for soccer is the reason for the application, not the need for another tenant in a building that may or may not get built.

I was a season ticket holder for the Rough Riders (Southsider) and I will say it was a lot of fun. The southside was rowdy and consumed ample amouts of beer. I paid $70.00 for season tickets and yet the southside was rarely full. For $70.00 I felt guilty paying so little but obviously others didn't see that as value.

As for others who have said that there are lots of quality Canadians available, I have only seen 3 first teamers in the MLS willing to play in Toronto. Brennan, Sutton and Serioux. Where are the others going to come from again? Seems like we have this talk every time Cdn content comes up for discussion.

Hugh Jazz
09-13-2008, 11:26 AM
I would much rather see Ottawa take the slower approach and develop a USL side first, maybe build a smaller stadium that can expand when the time comes like Saputo.

I think Ottawa's bid will simply help the MLS keep its expansion fee high, a team like St. Louis will be under more pressure to put the money up sooner rather than later as the fee will most likely continue to rise. An Ottawa bid shows that there is that many more teams interested in a franchise.

Now as a little aside:
I think a USL team in Ottawa could also potentially do big things for the development of Canadian talent if it wanted to. A few years from now both Toronto and Montreal will potentially have well established academies but what happens to most of these young players? The odd one or two will stay with the team (dev roster), with many others going south for 3-4 years, what about the remaining players? A well organized USL team with proximity to both Toronto and Montreal would be much more appealing than the CSL, and it could be exactly what 18-21 year old Canadian players need to bring their game to the next level. As much as I want to see Canada produce more DeRos and De Guzmans, I think the development of soccer in this country also depends on creating a sea of Attakora-Gyans, Rosenlunds etc.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-13-2008, 11:28 AM
S_D makes some great points

If there are an abundance of great Canadian players how come we dont have more on our team? They are in europe (and not coming back until they are ready to make less money and/or retire) or they just simple cant make the cut. This is a discussion thats been had a billion times.

One thing people should look at is the fact that so many people from or living in Ottawa even think its a poor decision.

ccopela
09-13-2008, 12:05 PM
Train?? What Train?? There is no train anywhere near Landsdowne Park.
It is on the canal though... so I guess you could get there by boat :rolleyes:
or the bike path that runs along the canal.

Melnyk wants in to the Landsdowne redevelopment and maybe this is how he is trying to work his way in with the other developers who already have a "handshake agreement" with the city.

Good luck to all of them.

The Carleton O-train stop is like a 10-15 minute walk from lansdowne

Redcoe15
09-13-2008, 12:11 PM
lets just make a real fucking Canadian league already!
Not enough cities here to make it viable. Remember the old CSL from the late 80s, early 90s?

Inswingingwingman
09-13-2008, 12:27 PM
If the lie-berals win the federal election and get wind of this they will conspire to put the team in Hull for the their buddies in the Bloc. Le Bloc de Hull will be the team name and they'll play Sundays before the peeler bars open. And you'll be able to buy yer own beer and take it in. Topless french cheerleaders....poutine and smoked meat sandwiches.

Or maybe the Poutines de Hull/Gatineau?

hmm.......

S_D
09-13-2008, 12:34 PM
^^ OMG you sound like those mindless political hacks on the G&M feedback forums....time to cut down on reading time there :D

NF-FC
09-13-2008, 01:26 PM
Not enough cities here to make it viable. Remember the old CSL from the late 80s, early 90s?

Ya but that was a piece of shit league with no proper financial backing. . I honestly think that with proper owners, that a Canadian league could work this time.

adampz
09-13-2008, 01:52 PM
The Carleton O-train stop is like a 10-15 minute walk from lansdowne The O-train is truly shite. I personally don't use it at all, cause it wouldnt take me anywhere I need to go. Getting downtown by bus on the expressway is much faster, and I dont see the carleton o train stop affecting the decision to put a stadium at Landsdowne.

Lucky Strike
09-13-2008, 02:15 PM
I don't think I would want an MLS team here (although I have to admit I'm still at sea on the issue):

- The stadium location is less of an issue for me. It's pretty clear that people are willing to go to Kanata to see a sports event they like (for the Sens). But... will there be enough people who like footy in the same way? I really don't know but I would lean towards "probably not". To be brutally honest, Ottawa is dominated by hockey.
- As someone who lives in Ottawa, I would want the team to do well in terms of attracting support and such... It would really bum me out if they became the butt of the league like Columbus.
- I'd feel really conflicted since I already support TFC. Since that's the case, I'd feel guilty not going to support the Ottawa team and be like one of those losers in Columbus or Colorado, teams that have SSSs but can't pay people to fill them. I'd really only go when TFC is in town.
- Like it or not (and leaving comparisons to other cities aside) Ottawa does not have a good track record for sports franchises. Things like the CFL leaving twice and the Lynx (AAA baseball) packing up last summer (where the stadium was right in the city near Hurdman station - one of two huge and major public transit stations for those who don't live here). It might not be appropriate to compare other sports but it's enough to make you go "hmmm...".

Anyway, those were the thoughts of an Ottawa resident.

P.S. If a team does come, I hope it has a traditional name. None of this naming after geological phenomena/features, fictional magical men who have powers, combustion, the act of changing the state's form of government, or one of the many synonyms for the word "group". (Quick! Which are which?)

RYANTFC
09-13-2008, 03:38 PM
im gonna start making up chants already

Ladies Love Julius James
09-13-2008, 03:41 PM
im gonna start making up chants already


I want in. Could I be an executive club member?

RYANTFC
09-13-2008, 03:44 PM
yes sir

adampz
09-13-2008, 04:00 PM
Ottawa folk only, sorry god save JJ

Ladies Love Julius James
09-13-2008, 04:02 PM
Ottawa folk only, sorry god save JJ


How dare you talk to the new President of the Black Patch Boys like that. I'd smack you with my Pimp Glove If I saw you. We shall start the march from the Rideau Canal before every game.

adampz
09-13-2008, 04:06 PM
black patch boys, ahaha. I hope you like the drive from scarlem to ottawa

Ladies Love Julius James
09-13-2008, 04:11 PM
It aint the black patch boys we were just brainstorming.

vergilg
09-13-2008, 04:13 PM
I don't think I would want an MLS team here (although I have to admit I'm still at sea on the issue):

- The stadium location is less of an issue for me. It's pretty clear that people are willing to go to Kanata to see a sports event they like (for the Sens). But... will there be enough people who like footy in the same way? I really don't know but I would lean towards "probably not". To be brutally honest, Ottawa is dominated by hockey.
- As someone who lives in Ottawa, I would want the team to do well in terms of attracting support and such... It would really bum me out if they became the butt of the league like Columbus.
- I'd feel really conflicted since I already support TFC. Since that's the case, I'd feel guilty not going to support the Ottawa team and be like one of those losers in Columbus or Colorado, teams that have SSSs but can't pay people to fill them. I'd really only go when TFC is in town.
- Like it or not (and leaving comparisons to other cities aside) Ottawa does not have a good track record for sports franchises. Things like the CFL leaving twice and the Lynx (AAA baseball) packing up last summer (where the stadium was right in the city near Hurdman station - one of two huge and major public transit stations for those who don't live here). It might not be appropriate to compare other sports but it's enough to make you go "hmmm...".

Anyway, those were the thoughts of an Ottawa resident.

P.S. If a team does come, I hope it has a traditional name. None of this naming after geological phenomena/features, fictional magical men who have powers, combustion, the act of changing the state's form of government, or one of the many synonyms for the word "group". (Quick! Which are which?)




As we discuss this issue, the 417 West that takes you to Kanata is being expanded (doubled in fact). So, transportation and convenience won't be an issue - there will be less traffic if you don't live in Kanata.

Also, the MLS season runs during the off-season in the NHL (slight overlap during playoff time, but only for teams who make it to the Conf. finals). There are enough soccer fans in Ottawa to match the season ticket holders that are in Toronto.

Bottom line:
- convenient transportation;
- SSS built and owned by the potential TEAM;
- relatively inexpensive tickets;
- not in direct competition with hockey.

vergilg
09-13-2008, 04:17 PM
On the topic of different stadium possibilities, I wish Melnyk would take over Lynx/Rapids' Stadium (whatever it's called now). That baseball park already holds 10,000+ seats and could easily be expanded/modified for soccer.

The only problem with that facility is limited parking. There is the mall nearby, but they give out tickets if you park there. Other than that it's a perfect venue if you are looking for a central location for a stadium.

The Ottawa Rapids baseball team has that lease for another 2 years starting this summer and will be negotiating with the City of Ottawa to renew it.

Lucky Strike
09-13-2008, 04:39 PM
As we discuss this issue, the 417 West that takes you to Kanata is being expanded (doubled in fact). So, transportation and convenience won't be an issue - there will be less traffic if you don't live in Kanata.

Also, the MLS season runs during the off-season in the NHL (slight overlap during playoff time, but only for teams who make it to the Conf. finals). There are enough soccer fans in Ottawa to match the season ticket holders that are in Toronto.

Bottom line:
- convenient transportation;
- SSS built and owned by the potential TEAM;
- relatively inexpensive tickets;
- not in direct competition with hockey.

Those are good points, can't really dispute any of them. I'm still not convinced there are physically enough people who would be willing to buy season tickets.

JamboAl
09-13-2008, 09:45 PM
I don't think I would want an MLS team here (although I have to admit I'm still at sea on the issue):

- As someone who lives in Ottawa, I would want the team to do well in terms of attracting support and such... It would really bum me out if they became the butt of the league like Columbus.
- I'd feel really conflicted since I already support TFC. Since that's the case, I'd feel guilty not going to support the Ottawa team and be like one of those losers in Columbus or Colorado, teams that have SSSs but can't pay people to fill them. I'd really only go when TFC is in town.


Well, I live here and if (and that's a big "IF") we got an MLS team, I'd still have to say I'm a TFC supporter. You can't just abandon a side you've supported since day one.

Lucky Strike
09-13-2008, 09:52 PM
Well, I live here and if (and that's a big "IF") we got an MLS team, I'd still have to say I'm a TFC supporter. You can't just abandon a side you've supported since day one.

No of course not, that's not at all what I meant. It's TFC 'til death: bleed red, piss yellow. It would just be a shame that I wouldn't be participating in giving this potential new team support. I'm sure I'd get over it though... :D

tylerdangelo
09-13-2008, 10:14 PM
Dont get me wrong...im TFC and TFC for life. But im also a montreal boy. If any other canadian city should get a team it should be the well established clubs of montreal or vancouver. they already have good stadiums and good clubs. as much as i want to see montreal in the MLS i would still support tfc. but ottawa? really? like really? are you serious? really?

Cashcleaner
09-13-2008, 10:18 PM
^ The same could be said about a place like Columbus, Commerce City, or Kansas City.

MLS doesn't seem to have a problem placing teams in the middle of nowhere and with that considered, you would have to admit that Ottawa is not as far down the list as those three as a large cosmopolitan city.

tylerdangelo
09-13-2008, 10:21 PM
but what kind of soccer support does ottawa have? im sure columbus must have had some sort of following before they threw a club in there. they arent just gonna waist their money and plant a team somewhere it cant grow. the only time ive heard of ottawa and soccer is TFC driving through there to get to saputo...

RPB_Brantford_08
09-13-2008, 10:27 PM
If the lie-berals win the federal election and get wind of this they will conspire to put the team in Hull for the their buddies in the Bloc. Le Bloc de Hull will be the team name and they'll play Sundays before the peeler bars open. And you'll be able to buy yer own beer and take it in. Topless french cheerleaders....poutine and smoked meat sandwiches.

Or maybe the Poutines de Hull/Gatineau?

hmm.......


or the communist conservitves put a team in out in Alberta for all the soccer fans, all two of them, nicknamed PC UTD?

Cashcleaner
09-13-2008, 10:31 PM
but what kind of soccer support does ottawa have? im sure columbus must have had some sort of following before they threw a club in there. they arent just gonna waist their money and plant a team somewhere it cant grow. the only time ive heard of ottawa and soccer is TFC driving through there to get to saputo...


Other than the Ohio State university team, I can't think of any previous soccer team Columbus had. Don't think they ever had USL there.

Like I said previously, I think people have a fear that a team in Ottawa will take away from a possible franchise in Montreal or Vancouver. I'm starting to think accomodations would be made for all potential Canadian clubs.

tylerdangelo
09-13-2008, 10:37 PM
Other than the Ohio State university team, I can't think of any previous soccer team Columbus had. Don't think they ever had USL there.

the only reason columbus got a team when the MLS was born was because they had the financial support. I think putting a franchise in ottawa is a big mistake for mls...especially when there are two well established clubs in montreal and vancouver which could both support an mls franchise in the same way toronto has. Ottawa has a history of problems with professional sports franchises...anbody remember the Ottawa renegades of the Cfl? me neither.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-13-2008, 10:43 PM
the only reason columbus got a team when the MLS was born was because they had the financial support. I think putting a franchise in ottawa is a big mistake for mls...especially when there are two well established clubs in montreal and vancouver which could both support an mls franchise in the same way toronto has. Ottawa has a history of problems with professional sports franchises...anbody remember the Ottawa renegades of the Cfl? me neither.


But the CFL only maters to fans in those cities, so Otawa missing out on the CFL is not a big deal...they Do support the Sens, and their minor league baseball team, so soccer should be no problem. the only thing i would like to see in Ottawa bid is a soccer only stadium, no room for the cfl ever..!!

tylerdangelo
09-13-2008, 10:53 PM
Putting a club in ottawa takes away from the effect of putting a club in montreal. The cities are two close together. Ottawa is not as big a sports city as Montreal or even vancouver for that matter. Putting a club in ottawa creates an Ottawa Toronto rivalry that fans of either teams would love. However, putting a club in Montreal creates the Montreal Toronto rivalry, the New England (Boston Bruins) Montreal rivalry, and also one with New York. It just seems like a club in Ottawa will negatively effect the chance of other mls opportunities in Canada (in the event the club flops). It may also possibly take away from the chances that montreal and vancouver deserve, both of which had clubs in the now defunct north american soccer league, which crossed over into USL division one, where as Ottawa seems to have had no support in the terms of soccer besides the bankroll to support a team. We dont want another Columbus in the league do we?

Cashcleaner
09-13-2008, 11:25 PM
Putting a club in ottawa takes away from the effect of putting a club in montreal. The cities are two close together. Ottawa is not as big a sports city as Montreal or even vancouver for that matter. Putting a club in ottawa creates an Ottawa Toronto rivalry that fans of either teams would love. However, putting a club in Montreal creates the Montreal Toronto rivalry, the New England (Boston Bruins) Montreal rivalry, and also one with New York. It just seems like a club in Ottawa will negatively effect the chance of other mls opportunities in Canada (in the event the club flops). It may also possibly take away from the chances that montreal and vancouver deserve, both of which had clubs in the now defunct north american soccer league, which crossed over into USL division one, where as Ottawa seems to have had no support in the terms of soccer besides the bankroll to support a team. We dont want another Columbus in the league do we?

Chivas and the Galaxy groundshare. San Jose isn't that far away either. And what about Dallas and Houston? I don't think the league really cares how close franchises are to each other. All that matters is the money to cover the franchise fee and having enough people to buy tickets on a regular basis.

Again, the league is a business. They're not going to give American cities priority over others that may have a better business plan. There really isn't any point of nationalism in the eyes of MLS; and if Ottawa, Montreal, and Vancouver can pull together the cash then they get the team. Trust me, Garber isn't going to turn down the cash simply because it's from a Canadian city.

tylerdangelo
09-13-2008, 11:58 PM
Chivas and the Galaxy groundshare. San Jose isn't that far away either. And what about Dallas and Houston? I don't think the league really cares how close franchises are to each other. All that matters is the money to cover the franchise fee and having enough people to buy tickets on a regular basis.

Again, the league is a business. They're not going to give American cities priority over others that may have a better business plan. There really isn't any point of nationalism in the eyes of MLS; and if Ottawa, Montreal, and Vancouver can pull together the cash then they get the team. Trust me, Garber isn't going to turn down the cash simply because it's from a Canadian city.

you are however talking about california...which if it were its own seperate country would rank 8th in the world in terms of GDP. LA has two teams in almost every major sport. california, like new york, and like texas, can support multiple teams. Look at basketball in texas. Houston, Dallas and San Antonio all in close proximity. Basketball in California. Clippers and Lakers in the same arena. Hockey, kings and sharks. Both of those states, also new york, have stronger economies and financial support than our country as a whole. Though the three other canadian cities could financially support a team, i think ottawa in the long run would be more of a burden than anything

Ossington Mental Youth
09-14-2008, 04:29 AM
Nevermind the fact that its california, its also Los Angeles. In this case itd be Ontario and Quebec (yes, we regard it as the same but MLS might see it as different and frankly their not far off).

greatwhitenorf
09-14-2008, 07:03 AM
Ottawa got its NHL team because then-owner Bruce Firestone was willing to pony up the league expansion fee no questions asked. Other potential expansion sites got left behind because they wanted to haggle with the NHL.

Melnyk will get an MLS franchise because he's willing to do the same thing. Plus build a proper soccer stadium. There's also some very appealing aspects to his personality that would make him an attractive owner to MLS honchos.

He has the sort of personal wealth to pay the entry fee and build the stadium without a nickel's worth of financing. His track record in successful sports management is headlined by the prosperity now enjoyed by the Senators.

He's also done a good job in getting the St. Michael's Majors OHL team relocated to new digs at the Hershey Centre in Mississauga and installing an excellent coaching and management team. They'll be hosting a Memorial Cup final out there soon.

He also paid for the new football field and winter dome facility at St. Michael's school, his alma mater.

Wealthy, worldly, principled and patient. Willing to pay the whole shot. The league has to be paying close attention to an offer like this.

Plus, he also puts a torpedo or two across the bow of Jeff Hunt and the Ottawa Old Boys trying to restore the CFL to Ottawa. Take away even 15% of the CFL's potential ticket sales, suite sales or corporate support and he may force that group to abort the rebirth of gridiron football. It's margins are that thin.

At the end of the day, we wind up with an even closer potential derby matchup in a very civilized setting. It also serves to kick the Saputo's in the ass for mouthing off about MLS in past years and sends a wake-the-fuck-up call to the ditherers in Vancouver.

What's not to like?

ensco
09-14-2008, 09:38 AM
I posted this elsewhere but thought I'd put it here too, rather than start a new thread......

These discussions over cities like Portland, Vancouver, Ottawa etc are a waste of time. Those cities are very unlikely to get an MLS team.

Ranking likelihood of getting in based on who is holding pressers doesn't make sense.

Just because a candidate city is geographically connected to an existing MLS city and/or has a decent USL following, is not really important.....

Here's a link that should be stickied for any expansion conversation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropo...atistical_Area (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolitan_Statistical_Area)

If Montreal were on this list, it would be 15th (MSA of 3.5 million), so they have a chance.

Vancouver and Ottawa wouldn't come close to making it on that list.

Notice the big cities that aren't in yet - Miami, Atlanta, Minneapolis, San Diego, Detroit and Phoenix (this last one only if they can get a workable indoor/outdoor stadium - it's simply too hot in the summer otherwise). That's where MLS wants to go. Bigger population equals better market, and better national TV potential (which is the holy grail). Period.

Looking at the sheer size of NY and LA, it's easy to see why two teams in each makes sense. These derbies would also be more compelling nationally than Seattle-Portland or Toronto-Ottawa.

Remember, MLS is probably capped at 20 teams.

The last 4 teams to get in are San Jose (ranked # 12 on that list), Toronto (would be number 7), Seattle(15) and Philly (5).

Columbus (ranked 29th) and Kansas City are probably going to move - bet on it.

Nazzer
09-14-2008, 09:54 AM
Remember, MLS is probably capped at 20 teams.

.

This is where your entire argument falls apart.

ensco
09-14-2008, 10:07 AM
This is where your entire argument falls apart.

There are a ton of stories out there about how FIFA wants to reduce the existing "top league" size limit from 20 to 18 clubs.

http://english.cri.cn/2886/2006/09/08/881@136572.htm

Care to share a shred of evidence to support your comment?

rocker
09-14-2008, 10:15 AM
that argument by blatter didn't win cuz the big leagues opposed it.
and the purpose of it was to reduce clutter of games for the international calendar.
MLS doesn't even follow the international calendar, yet somehow FIFA doesn't seem to care about that.
so i think Garber could go to any number of teams he wants.

he could also add more teams than 20 and then mess around with the schedule the way NHL teams do. MLS is not a balanced schedule now... with for example 22 teams he could have two 11 team conferences. you play each team in your conference twice, for 20 games.. then you play each team in the west once for 11 games, with those 11 games between home and away. awkward schedule, but they could do 31 games with 22 teams there. they could do anything really...

i think Garber will follow the North American league standard and go beyond 20 at some point.
not that I want it to happen, but it think he will. he stated the "18" number once as a limit, then changed his mind and said 20.. I think he just says that to ensure competition.. he doesn't want all the candidates thinking they have a guaranteed, easy shot.

ensco
09-14-2008, 10:24 AM
that argument by blatter didn't win cuz the big leagues opposed it.
and the purpose of it was to reduce clutter of games for the international calendar.
MLS doesn't even follow the international calendar, yet somehow FIFA doesn't seem to care about that.
so i think Garber could go to any number of teams he wants.

he could also add more teams than 20 and then mess around with the schedule the way NHL teams do. MLS is not a balanced schedule now... with for example 22 teams he could have two 11 team conferences. you play each team in your conference twice, for 20 games.. then you play each team in the west once for 10 games, with those 10 games balanced between home and away. awkward schedule, but they could do 30 games with 22 teams there.

i think Garber will follow the North American league standard and go beyond 20 at some point.
not that I want it to happen, but it think he will. he stated the "18" number once as a limit, then changed his mind and said 20.. I think he just says that to ensure competition.. he doesn't want all the candidates thinking they have a guaranteed, easy shot.

I agree with some of this, but you're wrong to think the 20 team limit would be easy to fudge or break. This is a huge beneath-the-surface issue in world football.

FIFA would absolutely, guaranteed, vociferously object to any top league going beyond 20 teams. It's about more than the international calendar - there is huge pressure in every country to expand the top division, as none of the existing top division teams want to be relegated. FIFA is fighting to protect teams in secondary leagues and secondary markets, and won't want any precedent to the contrary that can be pointed to as an exception.

The fact that MLS doesn't have relegation won't help, as FIFA doesn't much like that either! FIFA have cut the MLS, USSF and CSA a lot of breaks (including foregoing relegation, and allowing Toronto to be in the US league) in order to help the North American game, but they will draw the line somewhere with MLS eventually, if pushed too far.

vergilg
09-14-2008, 10:57 AM
I posted this elsewhere but thought I'd put it here too, rather than start a new thread......

These discussions over cities like Portland, Vancouver, Ottawa etc are a waste of time. Those cities are very unlikely to get an MLS team.

Ranking likelihood of getting in based on who is holding pressers doesn't make sense.

Just because a candidate city is geographically connected to an existing MLS city and/or has a decent USL following, is not really important.....

Here's a link that should be stickied for any expansion conversation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropo...atistical_Area (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolitan_Statistical_Area)

If Montreal were on this list, it would be 15th (MSA of 3.5 million), so they have a chance.

Vancouver and Ottawa wouldn't come close to making it on that list.

Notice the big cities that aren't in yet - Miami, Atlanta, Minneapolis, San Diego, Detroit and Phoenix (this last one only if they can get a workable indoor/outdoor stadium - it's simply too hot in the summer otherwise). That's where MLS wants to go. Bigger population equals better market, and better national TV potential (which is the holy grail). Period.

Looking at the sheer size of NY and LA, it's easy to see why two teams in each makes sense. These derbies would also be more compelling nationally than Seattle-Portland or Toronto-Ottawa.

Remember, MLS is probably capped at 20 teams.

The last 4 teams to get in are San Jose (ranked # 12 on that list), Toronto (would be number 7), Seattle(15) and Philly (5).

Columbus (ranked 29th) and Kansas City are probably going to move - bet on it.




Population is not a stand-alone deciding factor of the success of soccer in a city. North American where larger cities usually have 2-3 major sports franchises. Example, you put a soccer team in a Californian city and it will be competing with MLB, NFL, College football, NHL, etc. You'll need BRAND NAMES like Beckham to even have respectable attendance.

You have to examine each MLS soccer bid on individual basis. Many factors go into place: ownership, stadium, city/government influence, population (like you mentioned), disposable income, competition from other sports, etc.

You can't just say, well Miami and New York are bigger than Ottawa so screw Ottawa. No, if Ottawa has a solid business plan they will get a team. They PROVED that that they can be successful as a business in the NHL. And Ottawa has a large grass roots soccer community, notwithstanding the various amateur teams (the Fury, Algonquin College, the Universities, etc.)

Lastly, I read that the MLS Commissioner wanted 24 teams in the next few years. I say, the bigger the better, because the MLS operates during the NFL's off-season in the USA and the hockey off-season in Canada. I think the MLS will do quite well up against MLB.

Red Skies At Night
09-14-2008, 11:13 AM
The problem Ott faces is that eastern ont does not have a dense enough mass of people to be able to generate a base of hardcore fans to support a struggling team through the tough times. In fact this is true of many of the struggling franchises in NA in general. Very few people are driving in from Gatineau or the Oot or Kemptville to watch a team go 3, 10 and 17 or some similar #.

The essential reality for a sports franchise is that your lowest crowds(fanbase) have to be able to keep you above water until your bigger crowds return/show up.

ensco
09-14-2008, 11:18 AM
Population is not a stand-alone deciding factor of the success of soccer in a city...

...

You have to examine each MLS soccer bid on individual basis. Many factors go into place: ownership, stadium, city/government influence, population (like you mentioned), disposable income, competition from other sports, etc.

....



I agree re the importance of ownership. The rest of your point, I disagree.

Population is destiny. Forget what they say, look at what they do. MLS are going where the people are.

tylerdangelo
09-14-2008, 11:31 AM
The argument about the population in a city like montreal or ottawa being not dense enough to support a team is completely invalid for one reason. New England. If Ottawa (with a population of around 6-700 000 people) is not big enough to support a team, then surely Foxborough MA is not. Foxborough has 17000 inhabitants. Boston, the closest major city is almost 40 miles away. Ottawa and Montreal are closer together than that.

ensco
09-14-2008, 12:00 PM
Foxborough has 17000 inhabitants. Boston, the closest major city is almost 40 miles away. Ottawa and Montreal are closer together than that.

Words cannot express what I think about this point.

Azerban
09-14-2008, 12:04 PM
FIFA have cut the MLS, USSF and CSA a lot of breaks (including foregoing relegation, and allowing Toronto to be in the US league) in order to help the North American game, but they will draw the line somewhere with MLS eventually, if pushed too far.


The day that FIFA cracks down on MLS and North American soccer for an ideological reason and takes a hit in the prospective wallet is the day you can walk down to Baskin Robbins and get my shit in a waffle cone with sprinkles.

tylerdangelo
09-14-2008, 12:12 PM
my point is not that ottawa is too close to other potential mls cities...the point is population is irrleveant. Ottawa wont not get a team because of population. they wont get a team because people in that area will continue to support Toronto or Montreal because they have a stronger fan base than a completely new team. A team in ottawa just wont last.

Beach_Red
09-14-2008, 12:21 PM
Population is destiny. Forget what they say, look at what they do. MLS are going where the people are.

Or, where the TV revenue is.

MLS would like to be like the NFL, which has a team in Green Bay, Wisconsin but no team in Los Angeles.

Most of what we see now is stages of development. Maybe the ultimate goal is a single table, relegation-style league like the rest of the world, maybe even one in Canada and one in the USA, but it won't happen over night. Are these the right steps to take to get to that goal? Who knows....

ensco
09-14-2008, 12:22 PM
The day that FIFA cracks down on MLS and North American soccer for an ideological reason and takes a hit in the prospective wallet is the day you can walk down to Baskin Robbins and get my shit in a waffle cone with sprinkles.

I don't disagree. FIFA wouldn't object to a 24 team MLS for ideological reasons, but because any 24 team top league is a threat to their wallet.

Bigger top leagues diminishes non-top-league participants in international competitions, and also means that the teams in the top league are less inclined to participate in these competitions and/or are more likely to participate by using reserves, which hurts the gate at those competitions.

Mark in Ottawa
09-14-2008, 12:28 PM
My son & I had a good brain storming about this while driving home from BMO after yesterdays game. There is a perfect spot for a SSS right there at Dow's Lake off the Rideau Canal. Chris & I parked in the back parking lot at Carleton University when we attended the U-20 world cup last year.

Carleton U is serviced by the O-Train and Dow's Lake is just a rocks toss from Preston St. (Little Italy) and Carling Ave (an east west bus corridor). There are two driveways along the canal just there and these would assist in getting people to and from the stadium as well.

During the summer Carleton U could rent out the University residences to visiting fans. This would be a great location.

ensco
09-14-2008, 12:37 PM
My son & I had a good brain storming about this while driving home from BMO after yesterdays game. There is a perfect spot for a SSS right there at Dow's Lake off the Rideau Canal. Chris & I parked in the back parking lot at Carleton University when we attended the U-20 world cup last year.

Carleton U is serviced by the O-Train and Dow's Lake is just a rocks toss from Preston St. (Little Italy) and Carling Ave (an east west bus corridor). There are two driveways along the canal just there and these would assist in getting people to and from the stadium as well.

During the summer Carleton U could rent out the University residences to visiting fans. This would be a great location.

For your sake I hope I'm wrong about Ottawa. I know there would be a core group of really terrific people/fans up there.

Sonny Cheeba
09-14-2008, 12:41 PM
ottawa has some solid pubs too. i'd like a team to get there. i just don't see it being successful if the stadium is located at the scotiabank location.

adampz
09-14-2008, 01:13 PM
I know people like me, ryantfc,and mark would have to start a ottawa supporters group if we got a team. How come so many RPB's on here from ottawa said theyd still support toronto over ottawa?

Beach_Red
09-14-2008, 01:32 PM
For your sake I hope I'm wrong about Ottawa. I know there would be a core group of really terrific people/fans up there.

Plus with no CFL or baseball team, there's not much competition.

I can see where a lot of owners see their chance to get into soccer becoming way too expensive in the near future and feeling like they have to act now. Such a different environment from even three years ago.

Marc"2L"
09-14-2008, 01:49 PM
I know people like me, ryantfc,and mark would have to start a ottawa supporters group if we got a team. How come so many RPB's on here from ottawa said theyd still support toronto over ottawa?

Because I only go to school here. I might end up "going" to the matchs, but that wouldn't place them before TFC.

adampz
09-14-2008, 02:07 PM
Very good reason! I was born in toronto, moved up to this boring town when i was 6, I would definetly have to be an ottawa supporter till I die if ottawa got a team. But it would be nice to know some people from the other teams SG's, and obviously it wouldnt be any hoolie fighting stuff. Of course it would be a great rivalry though

ccopela
09-14-2008, 02:09 PM
My son & I had a good brain storming about this while driving home from BMO after yesterdays game. There is a perfect spot for a SSS right there at Dow's Lake off the Rideau Canal. Chris & I parked in the back parking lot at Carleton University when we attended the U-20 world cup last year.

Carleton U is serviced by the O-Train and Dow's Lake is just a rocks toss from Preston St. (Little Italy) and Carling Ave (an east west bus corridor). There are two driveways along the canal just there and these would assist in getting people to and from the stadium as well.

During the summer Carleton U could rent out the University residences to visiting fans. This would be a great location.

In theory that would be a great location for the stadium. Unfortunately I don't see it happening. Carleton University owns that property and they intend to expand the university there eventually. (I got to Carleton) Obviously things can change but I know it's in their long term plans to expand into that field. Also if a stadium was built there it would take out a ton of parking space that the University currently uses.

I do see Carleton University being used as a training ground though for any potential team. There's a little stadium that the Carleton Ravens use as well as the Ottawa Fury (PDL team) And the Athletics facility has top class equipment. (The Toronto Raptors are having part of their preseason training here this year)

JamboAl
09-14-2008, 02:13 PM
I know people like me, ryantfc,and mark would have to start a ottawa supporters group if we got a team. How come so many RPB's on here from ottawa said theyd still support toronto over ottawa?

Adam: I guess it's the same with people who were always Leafs or Habs fans living in Ottawa but not siding with the Sens when they got the team (I'm not a fan of any of the three and in fact, have turned off hockey).

In soccer, loyalty to the team you support supercedes everything (supporting the CNMT being the exception for me). If Ottawa gets a team, I'll watch it with interest and hopes it gets and maintains a good fan base, but my team is still TFC. I'm actually surprised you & Ryan would switch allegiances.

Alex

RYANTFC
09-14-2008, 02:29 PM
I wouldn't switch, I would stay being a tfc fan. Just because Ottawa would get a team doesn't mean im going to switch but I would go the matches because I live here.

JamboAl
09-14-2008, 02:39 PM
I wouldn't switch, I would stay being a tfc fan. Just because Ottawa would get a team doesn't mean im going to switch but I would go the matches because I live here.

I'd be in the same boat. I would definitely be there but would be just as quiet as the soccer moms or if Ottawa scored, would give it a polite applause. TFC is a different matter!

:hump:

Fort York Redcoat
09-14-2008, 05:12 PM
Adam: I guess it's the same with people who were always Leafs or Habs fans living in Ottawa but not siding with the Sens when they got the team (I'm not a fan of any of the three and in fact, have turned off hockey).

In soccer, loyalty to the team you support supercedes everything (supporting the CNMT being the exception for me). If Ottawa gets a team, I'll watch it with interest and hopes it gets and maintains a good fan base, but my team is still TFC. I'm actually surprised you & Ryan would switch allegiances.

Alex

It's a valid switch. If it's your local. I wouldn't fault him for it.

Axeman
09-14-2008, 08:02 PM
It would be hard for me to switch to Ottawa City FC(hopefully that's the name) unless of course the first signing was Jim Brennan, than jump ship it is!:D

adampz
09-14-2008, 08:11 PM
I understand all the rpb's from ottawa saying they'd stay with tfc even if we got a team. As fort york redcoat said, ottawa is my hometown, and its really a territorial thing.

I think the rest of you from toronto would feel a stronger connection with tfc then I do just because youre there week in and week out.

I think supporting your city's team is also about supporting your city, and uniting with the rest of your cities citizens. Thats just my perspective on it though. We're all looking for something to call our own, and as much as I like tfc, i dont find its completely my own because im not there every home game.

RYANTFC
09-14-2008, 08:32 PM
yeah I know what your saying adam.

Keegan
09-14-2008, 09:47 PM
Adam has "TFC till I die" in his sig. O shit

Dirk Diggler
09-14-2008, 10:02 PM
Adam has "TFC till I die" in his sig. O shit

LOL exactly what I was thinking.

adampz
09-14-2008, 10:11 PM
Answer this honestly: What would you do, if you were a supporter of the first mls team in canada, and this team was ottawa. Would you support toronto once toronto got an mls team, or would you follow ottawa even though you're hometown was toronto.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-14-2008, 10:29 PM
fans have been complaing that there are not enough teams in this country,but yet when a city comes forward and tries to get in the league they all go nuts....
Montreal has more drawbacks to it then positives ones for entering MLS, Its not a market american TV advertisers would want nor would make money from, Ottawa they could, Vancouver would be a wasy in if they had a stadium underway but that doesn't look like happening anytime soon. If the Sens owner is willing to fianance a stadium and team with out public funds all the power to him, let him in..

billyfly
09-14-2008, 10:32 PM
Oh Yeah. Ian Mendes reporting on soccer.

adampz
09-14-2008, 10:49 PM
well dark diggler, whats the answer?

rocker
09-14-2008, 10:59 PM
fans have been complaing that there are not enough teams in this country,but yet when a city comes forward and tries to get in the league they all go nuts....

i think while we all have concerns about Ottawa to varying degrees, if we could get Montreal, Vanny, and then Ottawa into the league, nobody up here should complain about it.
While I don't think it would be a rousing success, as canadians we should at least hope Ottawa gets in to see if it would work. If not, move the team.. simple as that. But I just hope it's not an either/or thing... where they go for ottawa over Montreal or Vanny. If they all get in, and Ottawa succeeds, then it's awesome! if not, then no harm done.

Yohan
09-14-2008, 11:11 PM
Honestly, is Ottawa a viable long term market, considering Mtl and Toronto?

Frankly, all I'm seeing is Columbus II in terms of fan support and doesn't dick all for MLS (good for Canadian football though)

JamboAl
09-14-2008, 11:12 PM
I understand all the rpb's from ottawa saying they'd stay with tfc even if we got a team. As fort york redcoat said, ottawa is my hometown, and its really a territorial thing.

I think the rest of you from toronto would feel a stronger connection with tfc then I do just because youre there week in and week out.

I think supporting your city's team is also about supporting your city, and uniting with the rest of your cities citizens. Thats just my perspective on it though. We're all looking for something to call our own, and as much as I like tfc, i dont find its completely my own because im not there every home game.


It's a valid switch. If it's your local. I wouldn't fault him for it.

Adam: I'm sure you have a very valid reason and what you say, I can't argue with. Let's cross that bridge if/when we get there.

Cashcleaner
09-15-2008, 12:01 AM
fans have been complaing that there are not enough teams in this country,but yet when a city comes forward and tries to get in the league they all go nuts....
Montreal has more drawbacks to it then positives ones for entering MLS, Its not a market american TV advertisers would want nor would make money from, Ottawa they could, Vancouver would be a wasy in if they had a stadium underway but that doesn't look like happening anytime soon. If the Sens owner is willing to fianance a stadium and team with out public funds all the power to him, let him in..

Which leads me to thinking...

What if the intention of an Ottawa franchise is to become a psuedo "Team Canada"? If you catch what I'm saying. Like what Franco did with Real Madrid decades ago (ie: elevated it into a flagship club to represent Spainish football internationally). Obviously, we wouldn't have any facist dictators involved, but I think that's a pretty good way to explain it.

Or maybe take the Montreal Canadiens as an example as well. They have been "Quebec's team" for almost all of their history and continue to this day developing and playing mostly Quebeqois players. What if the idea for the Ottawa teams is to load it full of domestic players and insert a bit of nationalism into the league?

Yohan
09-15-2008, 01:13 AM
Which leads me to thinking...

What if the intention of an Ottawa franchise is to become a psuedo "Team Canada"? If you catch what I'm saying. Like what Franco did with Real Madrid decades ago (ie: elevated it into a flagship club to represent Spainish football internationally). Obviously, we wouldn't have any facist dictators involved, but I think that's a pretty good way to explain it.

Or maybe take the Montreal Canadiens as an example as well. They have been "Quebec's team" for almost all of their history and continue to this day developing and playing mostly Quebeqois players. What if the idea for the Ottawa teams is to load it full of domestic players and insert a bit of nationalism into the league?
lol

you really can't be serious

Cashcleaner
09-15-2008, 01:59 AM
^ You sounds totally sure that it's not even a possibility. Begin your explanation...

Now!

Fort York Redcoat
09-15-2008, 06:46 AM
Nationalism. You mean like wearing Redcoats to away games?

No but really you have a point in that we only have the one team in the league so the competition is on. If Ottawa or any other Canadian city wants to begin dominating MLS before we do and try to grab the Canada team moniker then they need to show us $$$.

The branding would be difficult since red is already taken (a couple of times) and they wouldn't dare use a Maple leaf too prominent in the crest.

adampz
09-15-2008, 06:56 AM
Red is already taken....hmm whats the next best colour when it comes to football after red. Red really is my colour when it comes to footy, just because of tfc, liverpool, poland

tylerdangelo
09-15-2008, 08:07 AM
Honestly, is Ottawa a viable long term market, considering Mtl and Toronto?

Frankly, all I'm seeing is Columbus II in terms of fan support and doesn't dick all for MLS (good for Canadian football though)

Thats what ive been saying from the beggining. Theres no doubt Melnyk can bank roll a team with his pocket change. However wre looking at another Columbus, and theres no avoiding it.

phonzo
09-15-2008, 08:38 AM
it comes down to a balance of whats good for Canadian football as a whole (another team = more money into talent development one would hope) and what is good for the league.

The argument of whether its a good market in Ottawa is moot when there is a backer willing to poor millions into it..in the end its his investment and not "ours"

Oldtimer
09-15-2008, 09:20 AM
Melnyk takes kick at soccer

A world-class soccer stadium in Ottawa? A pitch for a Major League Soccer franchise? Skeptics are of no concern to Cyril Leeder, COO of Senators Sports and Entertainment. He's heard it all before.


Richard Starnes, The Ottawa Citizen

Published: Saturday, September 13, 2008
Eugene Melnyk is planning to build a "world-class" stadium in Ottawa.


http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/sports/story.html?id=accdf1bb-e872-4198-b176-b2ad5486f0da

Vindaloo
09-15-2008, 01:30 PM
Well if some hockey dude is going to go around flogging the words "world class stadium", he better build a stadium with AT LEAST at the MINIMUM - double tiered stands on all four sides with a roof over them; stands right to the pitch; natural grass; seating for at least 25k; and a design with architectural merit. Anything less than this and the words "world class" should never be used.

Angelo1405
09-15-2008, 01:35 PM
Red is already taken....hmm whats the next best colour when it comes to football after red. Red really is my colour when it comes to footy, just because of tfc, liverpool, poland

Black & White. MLS is lacking there... a clean looking, authentic, striped jersey kinda similar to newcastle would be nice...

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 01:38 PM
Which leads me to thinking...

What if the intention of an Ottawa franchise is to become a psuedo "Team Canada"? If you catch what I'm saying. Like what Franco did with Real Madrid decades ago (ie: elevated it into a flagship club to represent Spainish football internationally). Obviously, we wouldn't have any facist dictators involved, but I think that's a pretty good way to explain it.

Or maybe take the Montreal Canadiens as an example as well. They have been "Quebec's team" for almost all of their history and continue to this day developing and playing mostly Quebeqois players. What if the idea for the Ottawa teams is to load it full of domestic players and insert a bit of nationalism into the league?


If it helps increase the canadian player pool for the national side thats a bonus. If its become more of a nationalistic team good there too. It would
be a great rivalry for TFC and i would finally would be able to take in a road game!!!

ccopela
09-15-2008, 01:53 PM
Black & White. MLS is lacking there... a clean looking, authentic, striped jersey kinda similar to newcastle would be nice...

How about black, red and gold. Similar to the hockey team colours. I do like the black and white idea though.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 02:19 PM
How about black, red and gold. Similar to the hockey team colours. I do like the black and white idea though.

black red and gold would look cool, the only problem with addidas jerseys is they are all bland. Lets hope Ottawa beats Montreal and Vancouver to the punch in getting in MLS that would be great.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 02:20 PM
Lets hope Ottawa beats Montreal and Vancouver to the punch in getting in MLS that would be great.

No thanks at all

adampz
09-15-2008, 03:46 PM
I find that some people can look at this positively and say "well, having another canadian mls team can only help soccer in canada grow" They aren't very concerned about attendance for Ottawa MLS.

There are others though, who are saying no no, ottawa would be terrible for MLS, Garber is better off giving a team to st louis, portland, NY II, montreal and vancouver. As I said before, an MLS team in ottawa can only help expand the sport through out Canada. And you know what, if MLS isn't a success in ottawa, the ONLY person who will be losing out is MELNYK. Lighten up people, some of you dont like this idea about MLS in ottawa, and I understand that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but stop repeating over and over.

NF-FC
09-15-2008, 03:46 PM
black red and gold would look cool, the only problem with addidas jerseys is they are all bland. Lets hope Ottawa beats Montreal and Vancouver to the punch in getting in MLS that would be great.


No thanks at all

I actually wouldn't mind if Ottawa snuck in. It'd be our closest road trip and Montreal and Vancouver bids are too strong, they'll get in eventually.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 03:54 PM
Dont get me wrong, i wouldnt mind having ottawa in the league IF they were going to be supported in a major way. I just dont see it and as a result i dont support it especially with two other teams that have support already, potential for more and FOs that have been doing this for years.

adampz
09-15-2008, 03:59 PM
You make a good point ossington, the only real soccer we've had in a while was the under-20 world cups. I dont know the numbers exactly but I thought they went pretty well. Did we expect Toronto to sell out for the first 2 season? Probably not, so you never know

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 04:01 PM
Dont get me wrong, i wouldnt mind having ottawa in the league IF they were going to be supported in a major way. I just dont see it and as a result i dont support it especially with two other teams that have support already, potential for more and FOs that have been doing this for years.

Dont forget people predicted doom for TFC based on the fact pro soocer had never been a success in TO!! were the right? Vancouver is not a solid lock for support, its a lacrosse hotbed too but they didn't support the NLL's Ravens. Montreal has lost the Expos and 2 cfl teams the original
alouettes and the concorde and the NLL express, NASL Manic, so Montreal is not a gimme either...Ottawa wil suprt MLS im sure of it and
it would make good competition between Toronto, Montreal and Vacouver and make the Canada cup a decent tournament,

adampz
09-15-2008, 04:05 PM
We all have our opinions, by the time ottawa gets a team though, hopefully im gone, In university somewhere else. Also I dont want to live in Ottawa when I am older and out of university

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 04:33 PM
I know all that info about Van and Mont but the fact is that Mont is a soccer city (see euro cup when greece won, city went nuts, or world cup when Italy won), you dont see that in Ottawa, arguably you dont see that in Van but ya do have a billionaire whos buddying up with a hometown hero celeb. Regardless, i do think Ottawas a mistake and i dont think they will get it. But as everyone has said who knows anything is possible.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 05:26 PM
I know all that info about Van and Mont but the fact is that Mont is a soccer city (see euro cup when greece won, city went nuts, or world cup when Italy won), you dont see that in Ottawa, arguably you dont see that in Van but ya do have a billionaire whos buddying up with a hometown hero celeb. Regardless, i do think Ottawas a mistake and i dont think they will get it. But as everyone has said who knows anything is possible.


just because a few ethnic communities go out and celebrate euos/world cup that does not make that a soccer city more bandwagon jumping then anything else....lets see if Vancouver or Montreal would go the nuts for their USL teams...doubt it very much,

Canary Canuck
09-15-2008, 05:34 PM
Well if some hockey dude is going to go around flogging the words "world class stadium", he better build a stadium with AT LEAST at the MINIMUM - double tiered stands on all four sides with a roof over them; stands right to the pitch; natural grass; seating for at least 25k; and a design with architectural merit. Anything less than this and the words "world class" should never be used.

I 100% agree. As soon as the words "world class" came into play then he just raised the expectations on what we should expect. If he shows off a rendering of another bland 3 sided concert venue tomorrow then we can conclude that he doesn't understand what a world class stadium is.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 05:34 PM
i understand what you are saying but i disagree, the euro/world cup celebrations are a result of a united love of soccer (band wagon jumping doesnt even factor into it, theyd have to support a local team to all of a sudden jump on another local team). This great love of soccer would translate into local pride. USL everywhere is not well supported, it would help retain some of the original fans and then ideally with good marketing expand to people who enjoy the sport but enjoy it at a higher level.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 05:36 PM
Van and Mont already have this going for them. Ottawa does not.
We can argue this till we are blue in the face and im not going to see it your way (and your prob not going to see it my way, which is fine).

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 05:37 PM
Van and Mont already have this going for them. Ottawa does not.
We can argue this till we are blue in the face and im not going to see it your way (and your prob not going to see it my way, which is fine).


we agree to disagree:)

Mark in Ottawa
09-15-2008, 07:33 PM
I still say that Ottawa should offer to take Montreal's place in the USL when they move to MLS. Then they can get started on a supporters group and an academy.
They can try to build a fan base and see if this thing will fly.

It will give Melnyk a chance to fight the inevitable battle he will have with the Ottawa city government and see if he really wants to be in this business.

Who knows... a business connection with a few overseas teams might even spice things up a bit.

RPB_Brantford_08
09-15-2008, 08:00 PM
I still say that Ottawa should offer to take Montreal's place in the USL when they move to MLS. Then they can get started on a supporters group and an academy.
They can try to build a fan base and see if this thing will fly.

It will give Melnyk a chance to fight the inevitable battle he will have with the Ottawa city government and see if he really wants to be in this business.

Who knows... a business connection with a few overseas teams might even spice things up a bit.

if the USL loses MTL and Van you can see this league going under, its
not going to expand much further as football fans in north america want MLS. Melnyl will make the MLS fly in Otawa, just hope its sooner then later.

vergilg
09-15-2008, 10:44 PM
fans have been complaing that there are not enough teams in this country,but yet when a city comes forward and tries to get in the league they all go nuts....
Montreal has more drawbacks to it then positives ones for entering MLS, Its not a market american TV advertisers would want nor would make money from, Ottawa they could, Vancouver would be a wasy in if they had a stadium underway but that doesn't look like happening anytime soon. If the Sens owner is willing to fianance a stadium and team with out public funds all the power to him, let him in..


AMEN.

vergilg
09-15-2008, 10:47 PM
Well if some hockey dude is going to go around flogging the words "world class stadium", he better build a stadium with AT LEAST at the MINIMUM - double tiered stands on all four sides with a roof over them; stands right to the pitch; natural grass; seating for at least 25k; and a design with architectural merit. Anything less than this and the words "world class" should never be used.



Would you say our National Stadium is world class?

vergilg
09-15-2008, 10:51 PM
just because a few ethnic communities go out and celebrate euos/world cup that does not make that a soccer city more bandwagon jumping then anything else....lets see if Vancouver or Montreal would go the nuts for their USL teams...doubt it very much,


I don't know where Ossington was, certainly NOT in OTTAWA, when Italy won the cup, because Little Italy and City was painted in Green White and Red, there was car horns all over the city, half the downtown core was closed down, etc.

Ottawa celebrates its soccer.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-15-2008, 10:54 PM
Nothing would bring me greater joy than to be proven wrong vergilg, i just dont think that will be the case (especially because Ottawa wont get a team)

ccopela
09-15-2008, 11:46 PM
if the USL loses MTL and Van you can see this league going under, its
not going to expand much further as football fans in north america want MLS. Melnyl will make the MLS fly in Otawa, just hope its sooner then later.

Ottawa is probably the type of market USL would be looking to expand to. Not a major market but a big enough market without many major sports. USL is expanding to Tampa Bay (I know Tampa has many sports teams) and Austin next year. So USL is still trying to expand or at least fill in the gaps being left by teams moving to MLS. Ottawa makes sense because there's not much competition for the sports dollar. Victoria has also had rumours that they might get a USL team, although they're starting in PDL next year and would probably scratch plans to move to USL-1 if Vancouver and Portland get into MLS.

Mark in Ottawa
09-16-2008, 10:02 AM
Held this morning.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/2008/09/16/melnyk_mls_bid/

"The proposed stadium, which could seat up to 30,000 people, would be located adjacent to Scotiabank Place in the city's west end."

Great :( A stadium with little to no public transit accessibility.

The Melnyk group did not think their bid would disrupt Hunt's plans for an outdoor football stadium in downtown Ottawa. But they also did not rule out the possibility of using the soccer stadium to house a professional football team down the road.

"Our plan currently does not include football, but if the timing is right, we could make the modifications to host a football team," said Senators COO Cyril Leeder.

I thought that MLS dictated that new franchises be placed in Soccer Specific Stadiums?

So far... I am not impressed.

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 10:03 AM
Melnyk serious about MLS in Ottawa (http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/story/2008/09/16/melnyk-mls-bid.html)

cbc.ca

The owner of the NHL's Ottawa Senators and junior hockey's Mississauga St. Michael's Majors wants to add a Major League Soccer franchise to his portfolio, and made his intentions known Tuesday.
Eugene Melnyk and his Senators Sports and Entertainment group made their bid for a MLS team public in Ottawa, along with plans for a west-end stadium that would seat up to 30,000.
MLS will add four teams over the next four years, with Seattle and Philadelphia expected to join the 14-team league by 2010. An expansion franchise in Ottawa, considered a long shot by some, would have to wait until a three-year Canadian exclusivity agreement with Toronto FC runs out before the 2010 season.
In July, basketball superstar Steve Nash announced he has invested in the USL's Vancouver Whitecaps as part of the team's bid to bring MLS to the city.
Montreal, Vancouver and Ottawa are among nine teams in the running for two expansion clubs, MLS commissioner Don Garber said earlier in the summer.
In the United States, there is reported interest from Atlanta, Las Vegas, St. Louis, Portland, Ore., and a second team for the New York area.
Ottawa's stadium — the development is contingent on the franchise — would be built in Kanata, just down the road from the Senators home arena, Scotiabank Place.
A group headed by Jeff Hunt, owner of junior hockey's Ottawa 67's, has already been awarded a conditional franchise by the Canadian Football League and is interested in revitalizing Lansdowne Park, former home of the CFL's Ottawa Rough Riders and Renegades.
The deadline for MLS applications is Oct. 15.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-16-2008, 10:05 AM
People cry about MLSE being greedy, this dude is being forthright about it.
I wouldnt stress it, Ottawa is not getting a team

Cannon
09-16-2008, 10:06 AM
Built in Kanata = would NEVER work

simple as

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 10:08 AM
Not to be a thread Nazi... but we already have a thread for this topic.

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 10:09 AM
^ that's what I was thinking... Unless they plan some serious development of the area, I think a soccer stadium needs to be more accessible.

People are more willing to travel farther for hockey I would think.

Mark in Ottawa
09-16-2008, 10:10 AM
Not to be a thread Nazi... but we already have a thread for this topic.
Yeah.. I know. It was discussing Ottawa as a viable MLS city.
This is more news about the news conference and announced plans.

I am sure that the board moderators will merge em if they see fit.
I mean after all... the other thread was getting to be many pages long :rolleyes:

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 10:11 AM
^ I usually just skip to the end when threads get long-winded.

:)

Ossington Mental Youth
09-16-2008, 10:12 AM
People are more willing to travel farther for hockey I would think.

totally true, soccer, remains to be seen (dont have high hopes for it)

Dirk Diggler
09-16-2008, 10:16 AM
Answer this honestly: What would you do, if you were a supporter of the first mls team in canada, and this team was ottawa. Would you support toronto once toronto got an mls team, or would you follow ottawa even though you're hometown was toronto.

I know what I wouldn't do.....I wouldn't put "Toronto till I Die" in my sig if I knew I was going to switch allegiances several years down the road.

fetajr
09-16-2008, 10:24 AM
Awesome stadium for Ottawa, i hope they get a team simply b/c that stadium is sick.... REAL FUCKING GRASS!!!!

Toronto Ruffrider
09-16-2008, 11:15 AM
Here's a pic of Ottawa's proposed stadium:

http://www.bringtheworldtoottawa.ca/images/stadium/stadium-1-lg.jpg

http://www.bringtheworldtoottawa.ca/home.php

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 11:17 AM
^ ZOWIE!!!!

that is a sweet stadium!!!

MrHawk
09-16-2008, 11:17 AM
Stadium looks awesome.

I wonder how their rivalry with Montreal and us would be.

Ossington Mental Youth
09-16-2008, 11:20 AM
Their badge or what have you looks pretty amateur

flatpicker
09-16-2008, 11:22 AM
^ the badge may just be a temporary filler until a final design is picked.

rocker
09-16-2008, 11:22 AM
beware that these drawings are supposed to suck you in and get hyped. .. but they often don't turn out as planned.. look at Philly's stadium now.

that "stadium in the middle of nowhere" thing really sucks tho... guess melnyk didn't learn from TFC.

ccopela
09-16-2008, 11:29 AM
My Opinion on the plan:
- Location sucks but Ottawa has been expanding the highway and transitway to Kanata so by the time it's built it might not be too bad.
- The Sportsnet article says they wouldn't rule out sharing the stadium with a CFL team which is bad.
- The stadium will not seat 30,000 and will not look like that in the end.
- I kind of like the fake temporary crest they have and it shows that they want to keep the same colours as the Sens
- Grass field is excellent but plans could change especially if they want to use it for multiple concerts.
- Close to Scotiabank Place means any potential team would be able to share indoor training facilities with the Sens is a positive

Ossington Mental Youth
09-16-2008, 11:31 AM
i dont like the soccer ball in the crest, looks amateur/mls circa 1997, cool with the colors tho

Ossington Mental Youth
09-16-2008, 11:32 AM
Note the stage at the far end, guess they didnt learn from columbus

ccopela
09-16-2008, 11:37 AM
Unfortunately the Stage is necessary in making most stadiums financially viable. At least if a CFL team were ever to play in this stadium all they would have to do was move the stage back so all the seats would be permanent. It would destroy a grass pitch though so it would still be terrible.

Also I think part of the bid process for an MLS team requires the owners to show that the city wants a team and will support a team. I think Melnyk should bring TFC in for a friendly if TFC doesn't make the playoffs. Similar to how TFC went to Portland at the end of last year. I'd say a friendly against Montreal but I don't think the Impact would go for that seeing as they're competing to get into MLS as well. They would have to play in the half demolished Frank Claire stadium. Ottawa Gee-Gees football still plays there so the building isn't condemned.

rocker
09-16-2008, 11:44 AM
stages are OK if they are worked into the design seamlessly. the Carlsberg patio at BMO is the stage for concerts (well, the 1 concert they've had!). But you don't think of it as a stage when yer there, because it works as a patio too. It helps that Gate 1 leads right into that area, while in many of the US stadiums, the stage is an area nobody is supposed to enter.

arbogast
09-16-2008, 11:53 AM
That Stadium Puts Bmo To Shame.

ccopela
09-16-2008, 11:54 AM
That Stadium Puts Bmo To Shame.

Won't look like that in the final design. If it's built.

Angelo1405
09-16-2008, 11:55 AM
Beautiful stadium. kinda looks like a Bigger and better BMO :D i think they "leapfrogged" lots of competition city's with this one. seems like theyre going "full force" with their MLS plans. Montreal + Vancouver's got to step it up....

Roogsy
09-16-2008, 11:55 AM
That Stadium Puts Bmo To Shame.

Sure...and so does Red Bull Park.

But would YOU want to go out to Harrison to see such a nice stadium or enjoy the breeze off of Lake Ontario as you get off the Go Train/TTC/Gardiner/Lakeshore?

arbogast
09-16-2008, 11:57 AM
How are you so sure? stadiums do go through re-designs, but even if it's slightly altered it would still makes BMO look like the low budget venue it is.

Besides, Ottawa would have to sweeten the pot with a stunning venue to get the leagues attraction.

arbogast
09-16-2008, 11:57 AM
Sure...and so does Red Bull Park.

But would YOU want to go out to Harrison to see such a nice stadium or enjoy the breeze off of Lake Ontario as you get off the Go Train/TTC/Gardiner/Lakeshore?


i'm talkin about the design, NOT the location.