Will Johnson reportedly signs with MLS (no team, yet)

[oxygenatedbrain]

Has this been posted?

http://www.soccerbyives.net/soccer_by_ives/2008/08/canadian-strike.html

[Ossington Mental Youth]

It has not and FUCK, id put money on this biting us in the ass.
Itd be amazing to sign that guy, i wonder what we are going to give up and to who.
Good find.

[DigzTFC!]

Canadian Under-23 national team striker Will Johnson has signed with Major League Soccer and could join his new MLS team within a week, sources confirmed to SBI on Saturday. The former Heerenveen striker and one-time Chicago Fire player is the target of multiple MLS teams.

The Chicago Fire still holds Johnson's rights, meaning teams interested in Johnson must strike a deal with the Fire, which retained his rights after offering him an MLS contract in 2006, which Johnson turned down before accepting a deal with Heerenveen.

So where might Johnson go? Toronto FC makes sense, consider he is from Toronto and TFC needs a striker, but sources tell SBI that Toronto is not in the mix.

[DigzTFC!]

Now, Jloome before you blow a gasket that TFC is not the mix...all things considered it would be nice to have him but do we need another young unproven striker? And the Fire would try to get everything they can out of us to...probably allocation to help afford McBride while leaving flexibility under the cap.

And I guess he changed his tune about MLS when he went looking for a contract

[Fiin]

Lol, give them their draft pick back.. thus making it Barrett and Johnson for McBride.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

yeah i caught that
i wonder why?
(PLEASE SPARE THE MO HATES CANADIANS COMMENTS)
Sigh.
He'd be a great signing

[DigzTFC!]

I would give them allocation. If we get him that means no more Tello I would think. Anyways, I really don't see us making a move because of what its like to deal with Chicago. I would think Mo would want nothing to do with them anymore.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I think youre right.
I also have to agree (having looked at his record) that he is somewhat unproven (outside fo the U-23 situations he hasnt produced much).

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I suspect we will sign Tello instead.
How many open spaces do we have left?
2 or 3?

[Billy the kid]

I don't see him being an immediate improvement over what we have now. He is a player who is probably still getting better though. There should be no rush to sign him now, but if he becomes available later on, they should try and get him for a reasonable amount.

We need a healthy Dichio to complement Barrett.

[DigzTFC!]

Here's the deal...he's an attacking mid so he would be a good guy to replace Guevara when's he not playing. Furthermore, if we get him look for Jarrod Smith to be waived immediately.

Striker force: Barret, Ibbe, Dichio, Johann, Johnson....that's young and deep. And looking at that, we don't really need Johnson and I suspect Mo knew all this and it was cheaper to get Johann.

[shwade]

Instead of Mo signing young unproven American strikers, he could look at guys like this.

[DigzTFC!]

young unproven Canadian strikers?

[jloome]

I think he should be moved back to striker, where he played when he was younger. I assume he was moved to midfield because he can hold up the ball well and dribble, but I've seen him finish a few nice ones, too.

I don't think he's a huge player, Digz, but he has the air of a young player on the cusp of being something better. I'm surprised he didn't make it in Europe to be honest.

[S_D]

We don't need him. TFC has a lot of international slots so having a Canadian isn't critical right now. If Tello works out, TFC needs to address the CB hole that needs filling with Tebily gone. Either a starter that can force Velez/Marshall to the bench as depth or a decent backup.

And anyways, who wants to deal with Chicago? You know that they will demand an arm and a leg. Luckily we aren't in desperate need of Canadians. I'll bet they would want their first round draft pick back from McBride. Not worth it IMO as a draft pick may end up just being a cheap dev spot, or fodder for a trade to fill a desperate hole towards the end of the season or the beginning of next season.

[DigzTFC!]

Jloome, I see the talent Will Johnson has as he was the engine of U23 team with Ornoch and Hemming. I think he could be something special for sure. I would give them allocation and that's it and maybe a 4rth. Jarrod Smith would be released immediately. Anyways, I just think Mo doesn't want to deal with the Fire again. Look for him to be traded to either San Jose or Houston

[TFC USA]

Come on......Mo doesn't have time to sign unproven Canadian strikers, he's too busy signing unproven American strikers and proven but old and of no use League 1 British strikers! :D

[ensco]

I don't believe this for a second - Mo HAS to be interested - he must be just playing it cool for Ives

If the league is going to steer guys (Donovan to LA, McBride to Chicago) then it has to steer guys like this to Toronto

This is not trivial - the health of Canadian soccer is not great, TFC have to grow some roots here

[Smenge]

You "grow" Canadian roots and they leave for Holland or England. Similar to Canadian medical students who receive a hundred grand in subsidies to become a doctor, and then they leave for Dallas to operate on hook worms and gall bladders for a million per year. Forget about TFC bonding with Canadian players, MLSE is a business, not a gov't agency.

[RPB_Brantford_08]

Let hope Mo does not make this deal, at least fro a high price. I would rather him not Deal again with Chicago or Rangers for that matter. But if we could get Johnson in with a draft choice why not?

[DigzTFC!]

Just out of curiosity....wouldn't he develop just as well at any MLS team? Him playing is the most important thing

[rocktml]

Will is a must great young talent

[arsenal]

Guessing that TFC wants nothing to do with dealing with the Fire FO ...... if he comes cheap enough perhaps some other team acquires him then deals to TFC.

[Fiin]

Just out of curiosity....wouldn't he develop just as well at any MLS team? Him playing is the most important thing
We have super powers.

[T_Mizz]

Reading this was a swift kick to my maple leaf Buds if you know what I am talking aboot eh?

[Ron Manager]

I wouldn't mind giving up a draft pick (maybe not a first round) for Johnson as you have a much better idea of what you are getting, plus he is Canadian. If a deal could be worked out, great. He looked good in the U-20's.
Another thought - Smith for Johnson, probably of equivalent value, everyone gets a domestic player, striker for striker, everyone gets to play closer to home.

[Keegan]

Johnson an unproven striker?

FIRST
He isn't a striker.
Second he is more than proven
1) STARTED and scored for Chicago as an 18 year old
2) Played and scored for Heerenveen as a 19 year old
3) Best player in Olympic U-23 Qualifying 3 goals in 3 games as an attacking Mid
4) Scored and featured regularly for De Graafschap last season
5) HAS BEEN CAPPED by the SENIOR men's team

[DigzTFC!]

Johann would be just as proven then. I think this is semantics. I like Will Johnson. I would like him on the team. However, I don't know if we need him or it would be in Will's best interest to come here.

But it would be amazing if he developed here and became a sort of Steven Gerrard figure of the MLS in our midfield

[Wooster_TFC]

I suspect we will sign Tello instead.
How many open spaces do we have left?
2 or 3?

http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?t=3237

Technically speaking with Smith signed, we have no open senior roster spots. As far as I understand it, Dunivant has yet to be placed on SEI (since you need to name a replacement player in order to place someone on SEI), so that leaves 1 "open" spot. I'm guessing that Mo will want to replace him with a defender though.

Oh, and I almost forgot, we also have a spot opening up once the Edu transfer becomes official (if it hasn't already?).

[SoccMan]

I watched Will Johnson play in the U20 World Cup in Canada in 2007 and he was lousy, no better or worse than our beloved Adriano Lombardo, who also played in the U20 tournament last summer. Therefore, I would not waste a dime on him .

[Yohan]

I watched Will Johnson play in the U20 World Cup in Canada in 2007 and he was lousy, no better or worse than our beloved Adriano Lombardo, who also played in the U20 tournament last summer. Therefore, I would not waste a dime on him .
The entire Canadian team was pretty much shite, due to Mitchell's lousy coaching

[ensco]

Mo's spooked on Canadians - remember the advance press for Braz and Reda?

[rocker]

the thing is, a guy like Johann Smith is more valuable within MLS than Will Johnson because he counts as a domestic to all the American teams.
So if they are "even" as players (which is up for debate, I know) then you sign Johann Smith. Same with our keepers in spring training -- if Edwards and Wagenaar are even, you sign Edwards, because he was more value within MLS than Wagenaar.
I know that we need domestics to fill quota, but you can't just ignore the market that the rest of the teams work under... you know you won't always keep all the canadians anyways, so if you have to unload them, there will be few takers in MLS. You just have to release them (like Hemming was earlier this year). you would never have to release Johann Smith.

[Roogsy]

You "grow" Canadian roots and they leave for Holland or England. Similar to Canadian medical students who receive a hundred grand in subsidies to become a doctor, and then they leave for Dallas to operate on hook worms and gall bladders for a million per year. Forget about TFC bonding with Canadian players, MLSE is a business, not a gov't agency.

This is a real sore point for me. In a country with a shortage of doctors, ours get subsidized education and then go elsewhere to practice. In that regard, I wish we were more like Cuba. Not only do they churn out doctors by the buckets..they are forced to stay in Cuba.

As for Canadian players...until TFC came along, they had nothing to attach themselves to here. Now there is...and if another franchise comes into MLS, there will be two choices.

Fact of the matter is...I think in 5 or 6 years, we will see the first crop of decent Canadian-born talent. Not that there isn't any now...but what I mean is that they will start coming out consistently as a result of the system and not just individual talent. People like JDG and DeRo came about because they grew up in families that loved soccer and they did everything they could to establish themselves as professionals, even though the odds were against them. For every DeRo, there are 10 Canadian kids that should be making it but aren't. That number will start coming down now I think.

[OneLoveOneEric]

^^^Sorry guys, stick to football.
I'm in medical school. Anyone I know who has left the country for work has done so because we have no good jobs here. Competition is insane for good jobs, unless you want to be a GP or practice in Nunavut. If you want a job in a hospital in Toronto, you'd just as soon drop back and punt.
And unless by "100 grand in subsidies" you mean 100 grand of debt (which is about the avg debt load of a graduating med student -- actually, over $150,000), your head is way up your ass.
Stick to what you know, unless you want further digressions from me :)

[Roogsy]

I don't disagree with what you wrote in terms of jobs and such. My point though is that education here is still subsidized compared to the US where you would have a much bigger debtload to carry. Point is, we need doctors here but a large percentage go to the US. I don't think that should be allowed when the taxpayer foots some (not all) of the bill.

[OneLoveOneEric]

^^^This is where you are wrong. Medical School in the USA is more expensive (except for state schools), but WAY more private and public funding exists for students, and it is often in the form of grants, not loans, so it doesn't have to be paid back, and they do not go in to debt the way we do (less than $100,000, vs avg of $168,000 in Canada). Add to that the fact that once graduated they can make on the order of 10 times what we do (seriously. 10 times for some specialties), and what little debt they have is much more manageable. SO when you finish med school in Toronto over $150,000 in debt, and then are offered a job in the USA that will pay that back in 2 months, it's very tempting.
Oh, and estimates of the # of doctors going to the USA are far from a "large percentage".

[Smenge]

What percentage of your undergraduate and graduate (med school) tuition is subsidized by the taxpayer? If you attend school for 8 years, or longer if you flunk some courses, that works out to roughly $7-10k per year, plus your tuition. Then, you add the 12 years of elementary and high school, and you have over $100,000. These are not debatable, just check it out, if you know how to use a library....shit, hope you are a foot doctor or something that does not involve cutting into the body......back to soccer, please.

[ag futbol]

There is no comparison between Smith and Will Johnson.

Smith is going to sit on the bench and needs to hone his skill before making a contribution.

Will Johnston is expected to come play right away. He played two divisions above Johann Smith and actually started on the regular. Smith had trouble making it off the bench playing league 1. Now aparently Johnson was out of favor and his strike rate need only be proof of that.

Will Johnson is no less unproven than most of the guys who stumble into MLS out of Europe. Of most of the signings coming into MLS (short of the guys earning the bigger money and dp's) what exactly is proven? not much.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

havent watched either play enough to make an educated opinion.
Not entirely sure i believe that Smith will sit tho, hes starting today for instance and hes had enough first team play to warrant that. The big question if anything is where will he play

[OneLoveOneEric]

What percentage of your undergraduate and graduate (med school) tuition is subsidized by the taxpayer? If you attend school for 8 years, or longer if you flunk some courses, that works out to roughly $7-10k per year, plus your tuition. Then, you add the 12 years of elementary and high school, and you have over $100,000. These are not debatable, just check it out, if you know how to use a library....shit, hope you are a foot doctor or something that does not involve cutting into the body......back to soccer, please.

Wow. Aren't you a prize.
Trying to bring elementary school in to this? So basically nobody over age 11 should leave the country?
Serves me right for trying to have a real conversation here.

[Roogsy]

What percentage of your undergraduate and graduate (med school) tuition is subsidized by the taxpayer? If you attend school for 8 years, or longer if you flunk some courses, that works out to roughly $7-10k per year, plus your tuition. Then, you add the 12 years of elementary and high school, and you have over $100,000. These are not debatable, just check it out, if you know how to use a library....shit, hope you are a foot doctor or something that does not involve cutting into the body......back to soccer, please.

Keep it civil please, no need for personal shots Smenge.

And yes...back to soccer.

[Keegan]

Johann would be just as proven then. I think this is semantics. I like Will Johnson. I would like him on the team. However, I don't know if we need him or it would be in Will's best interest to come here.

But it would be amazing if he developed here and became a sort of Steven Gerrard figure of the MLS in our midfield


Ya man? Johann Smith has trouble starting in League 2 (4th division). Will Johnson has started for De Graafschap and Chicago.

Don't try and compare Smith to Johnson. Smith is just quick and couldn't even make the US U-23 team, while Johnson was busy being the best player in the CONCACAF U-23 tournament. No contest.

[Dirk Diggler]

Ya man? Johann Smith has trouble starting in League 2 (4th division). Will Johnson has started for De Graafschap and Chicago.

Don't try and compare Smith to Johnson. Smith is just quick and couldn't even make the US U-23 team, while Johnson was busy being the best player in the CONCACAF U-23 tournament. No contest.

I agree. I don't want to sound like a booster for Canadian players but really, in my eyes, Will Johnson would clearly be a better choice. Even if they are even in talent, I'd much rather sign a Canadian player than an American ... the heck with the potential trade value. I think every professional club should try to include as many domestic players as possible ... seriously, throw us a bone here Mo. I think winning, obviously, is the top priority but we don't seem to be setting the league on fire anyways so why not establish as big a Canadian base as possible ... please the majority of the tax payers as well.

[Limani_Ole]

smith better than Johnson? you gotta be kidding.. some of you guys sound like Leaf fans taking the most mediocre hockey player and making him into a god.. The sad part about this thread is some who consider themselves football fans but have NO clue on the players raised in their own back yard.. what a joke you are..
I should respect other peoples opinion.. but when its that stupid how can I?

MO's feet need to be put in the fire for this crap.. cuz thats what it is.. CRAP
he obviously doesnt value the opinion of toronto football fans when he doesnt even try and sign one of its best young stars.. and some of you rather see Barrett and the Smiths play.. haha..


Mo has to realize that just because the MLS arrived here two years ago that isnt how old the fans are.. toronto produces good players.. most real football fans knows this.. when player like johnson knocks on the door.. you should be the first one in line to take him in.. how the fck does ives know more about this kid than Mo..

WTF?

and we need to find a replacement fo guevara in a couple of years anyway.. wouldn't this be a perfect replacement.. ?

[sully]

.. when player like johnson knocks on the door.. you should be the first one in line to take him in.. ?

Is he knocking on our door?

(personally I don't know if he's any good..I've seen him play a few times and wasn't very impressed).

[rocker]

smith better than Johnson? you gotta be kidding.. some of you guys sound like Leaf fans taking the most mediocre hockey player and making him into a god.. The sad part about this thread is some who consider themselves football fans but have NO clue on the players raised in their own back yard.. what a joke you are..

what's with this "leaf fan" shit?
If anything, you're the leaf fan - you take a Canadian born boy and make him sound like the saviour. and you downplay an american. I remember this same behaviour for Darcy Tucker.........

Will Johnson was not raised in our backyard. You don't even have a clue about the guy's development. He grew up in Illinois and England.

I think he's a good young player but people need to stop criticizing players they barely know with other players. Smith does not deserve criticism at this point as some way to make Will Johnson look better.

Ever since the founding of TFC this board has seen people come on and pimp out some Canadian .... and none have taken the team by storm despite the advance pimping. Hey, if Will Johnson wanted to come here, and it wasn't a big cost to get his rights from Chicago, then go for it. But to get so angry at people, saying they are joke because they don't love him, is a bit much.

Personally I've seen Will Johnson. Good player.. bit small... would be nice to have but I'm not dreaming at night of him. Smith I've seen less of. He looked decent yesterday. Very fast, has some skill. But I'm not dreaming at night of him either. Neither guy is gonna change things drastically. TFC needs to be looking for people better than both. In the meantime, these guys could contribute and are nice to have at the right price, but not at any cost.

[DigzTFC!]

What the fuck is wrong with some of you guys? I said Smith was just as proven as Johnson. I didn't indicate who was better than anybody but merely referring to the games and strike ratio. Both are unproven talented commoditites.

Well Will Johnson played his balls off for Canada...yes he did. Johann Smith has played well for the Americans and would have made the team but injury prevented that.

I'm torn on this debate because I want him on the team, but then again I can't stand the misinterpretation of my posts anymore. Reading is a skill we all have, but we'd rather yell and scream at each other.

[Limani_Ole]

Is he knocking on our door?

(personally I don't know if he's any good..I've seen him play a few times and wasn't very impressed).

^
is that a quote? never said our door..

[sully]

^
is that a quote? never said our door..

my point is that he may not want to play for Toronto...so even if Mo wanted him it wouldn't matter in that case..

[Limani_Ole]

what's with this "leaf fan" shit?
If anything, you're the leaf fan - you take a Canadian born boy and make him sound like the saviour. and you downplay an american. I remember this same behaviour for Darcy Tucker.........

Will Johnson was not raised in our backyard. You don't even have a clue about the guy's development. He grew up in Illinois and England.

I think he's a good young player but people need to stop criticizing players they barely know with other players. Smith does not deserve criticism at this point as some way to make Will Johnson look better.

Ever since the founding of TFC this board has seen people come on and pimp out some Canadian .... and none have taken the team by storm despite the advance pimping. Hey, if Will Johnson wanted to come here, and it wasn't a big cost to get his rights from Chicago, then go for it. But to get so angry at people, saying they are joke because they don't love him, is a bit much.

Personally I've seen Will Johnson. Good player.. bit small... would be nice to have but I'm not dreaming at night of him. Smith I've seen less of. He looked decent yesterday. Very fast, has some skill. But I'm not dreaming at night of him either. Neither guy is gonna change things drastically. TFC needs to be looking for people better than both. In the meantime, these guys could contribute and are nice to have at the right price, but not at any cost.


born and lived in toronto.. thats good enough for me..
ive seen Smith play before.. but not much.. either way cant compare the two.. Will J has way better control can create goals in his position.. Smith has legs PERIOD and only plays the wings. I never said he was a saviour.. but why aren't we aggressively persuing talent who are coming back from europe? he would be a great addition and could potential start at some point..

the point is Mo has his head up his ass and most people are defending him and his signings.. which suck..

and as far as pimping out Canadian players.. they are many good ones that were available but we didnt even trial.. either way.. only brennan played in a top level and could make an easy transition.. braz and Reda played like crap but there coach wasent much better.. and thats a whole another topic..

[Limani_Ole]

my point is that he may not want to play for Toronto...so even if Mo wanted him it wouldn't matter in that case..

you'll find out if you dont try is my point....

[sully]

you'll find out if you dont try is my point....

In this league managers must keep their cards close to their chest..its tactical from that point of view...so its hard to critisize Mo when we really don't know what's going on...Mo has said he wants Canadians, and he's got to in any case the way the roster rules are set up

[Limani_Ole]

In this league managers must keep their cards close to their chest..its tactical from that point of view...so its hard to critisize Mo when we really don't know what's going on...Mo has said he wants Canadians, and he's got to in any case the way the roster rules are set up

you can critisize him for what he isn't doing.. which is actively pursuing Will Johnson... and the list can go on..

[Ossington Mental Youth]

well unless youve heard it from Mos mouth or Wills mouth its all speculation.
That source may have said one thing while doing another. Dont forget we just went through a 2 month long attempt at trading with this same club, why would this be any easier...

[Inswingingwingman]

FFS guys someone be the designated spy and ride the Go Train with Mo and get the real poop. The Red Bulls may be shite but we are myconium.