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View Full Version : MLS Match Day 14 Chicago @ TFC Sat May 28 7:08pm - Come On Party People



OgtheDim
05-25-2022, 07:52 PM
Everybody here we go


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Adgx9wt63NY



*************

Have at It People

Initial B
05-25-2022, 08:00 PM
Hmm, battle for the wooden spoon between two teams that probably shouldn't be here...

MightyDM
05-27-2022, 12:23 AM
Everybody here we go


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Adgx9wt63NY





*************

Have at It People

Hmm. Home for the deaf eh, OG? Interesting choice...

Ultra & Proud
05-27-2022, 10:11 AM
Hmm, battle for the wooden spoon between two teams that probably shouldn't be here...
We won't win this. I don't think we'll be great or anything but we should be solidly mediocre come September.

OgtheDim
05-27-2022, 06:53 PM
Some game info

Jersey is the annual "we recycled this" thing - very blue



https://www.torontofcstore.ca/en/mens-adidas-blue-toronto-fc-2022-primeblue-replica-jersey/p-37082674652062+z-9772-2612318214?_ref=p-DLP:m-GRID:i-r0c0:po-0



I prefer this, to be honest

https://images.footballfanatics.com/FFImage/thumb.aspx?i=/productimages/_4534000/altimages/ff_4534808-c1a81c3957a9f03b7a5aalt1_full.jpg&w=900

Officials


Toronto FC vs Chicago Fire
BMO Field (7PM ET)
REF: Guido Gonzales Jr
AR1: Chris Wattam
AR2: Gianni Facchini
4TH: Pierre-Luc Lauziere
VAR: Jose Carlos Rivero
AVAR: Jeremy Hanson

stevep
05-28-2022, 12:48 PM
I can get a single seat for $21
good price
cant pull the trigger till lineups come out at 6pm
if same crap lineup as last game no no not getting my money

PizzaEatingYeti
05-28-2022, 01:36 PM
TFC interest has hit rock bottom... :facepalm:
Game day, less than 5 hours til match start, and just 6 posts before this one, lol...

jabbronies
05-28-2022, 01:42 PM
TFC interest has hit rock bottom... :facepalm:
Game day, less than 5 hours til match start, and just 6 posts before this one, lol...

There is nothing to talk about. We know everything there is to know about this roster. We are all just waiting for the summer transfers at this point.

Kamp Berg
05-28-2022, 03:16 PM
On the good news front, it seems like Ayo is bouncing back.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 05:33 PM
Q starts a league game.

I am interested. Crowd size should be interesting.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 05:40 PM
Poz returns. Nelson benched. Looks like a very narrow formation.

https://twitter.com/TorontoFC/status/1530673031496060928?s=20&t=5mOlfAJzGg2AZvSo_2Yj3w

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 05:53 PM
Oh and can we please cut out the "there is no interest" idea?

There's thousands of people with me coming in, most with gear.

Bushmancan
05-28-2022, 05:54 PM
Westberg starting.

jloome
05-28-2022, 06:09 PM
Westberg starting.

It's possible Bradley accepts that he was a little screened on the Salter goal in Halifax, and may appreciate how vastly superior his distribution is.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:20 PM
Gonna say a 2-1 win. The best games are usually between bad teams. A late Jesus goal to send the crowd home happy.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:27 PM
The blue kit has me thrown off. I thought TFC were the Fire at that huddle.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:30 PM
Also, only 5 more games until Insigne.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 06:31 PM
Inebreatti protesting something or other....

Looks like about 18 k

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 06:38 PM
This lineup is not the right one. Just my gut feeling…

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:38 PM
Chicago has definitely noticed that Thompson is a weak link defensively.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:39 PM
Oso off? Season from hell thus far.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:40 PM
Kerr.

Gogon
05-28-2022, 06:42 PM
This lineup is not the right one. Just my gut feeling…

Interesting. I thought the lineup pretty much optimized what Bob has available to him. What would you have changed?

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 06:42 PM
Nice goal. Kerr is really coming through these last couple games.

Dare I say I agree with Caldwell? He’s better inside than in the flank

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:42 PM
Gaga being linked to Bayern and letting goals like that in is hilarious. Imagine Manuel Neuer allowing a goal like that.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 06:43 PM
Yeh, that was very saveable

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:51 PM
This Torres guy on Chicago must be their Jayden Nelson. Lots of tools, not yet able to read his teammates.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 06:51 PM
Interesting. I thought the lineup pretty much optimized what Bob has available to him. What would you have changed?
I agree. It’s tough to know what the alternative is given the options.

There’s just something about Osorio-Bradley-Poz midfield i don’t like.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 06:57 PM
Shaqiri creating chances for below average players just to have them flub them is what I fear will happen here with Insigne.

Gogon
05-28-2022, 06:57 PM
There’s just something about Osorio-Bradley-Poz midfield i don’t like.

Fair enough. And I think we can all agree on what attribute is missing from that trinity.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:00 PM
Weird to see our players actually playing the ball back to the keeper.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:05 PM
In the stadium, our shirts look purple

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:07 PM
In the stadium, our shirts look purple

Can you see the numbers on the Fire jerseys at all? They are basically invisible on TV.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:17 PM
Can you see the numbers on the Fire jerseys at all? They are basically invisible on TV.

Nope

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:18 PM
McNaughton doing a more vigorous warmup than the rest

noxx98
05-28-2022, 07:18 PM
I’m kinda digging the purple. I like teams having wild colours for their third jerseys.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:28 PM
I don’t know who needs to hear this but fire all our medical staff

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:28 PM
Damn. Really thought O'Neill and Salcedo were having a really good game together.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:34 PM
Going forward isn't all bad, but we have a serious problem in defensive midfield and defense. Chicago is not a great team, but they're able to walk through and put in crosses & passes with minimal resistance. With a bit of finishing (which other MLS teams have) it could easily be 4-1.

I mostly mention that because I believe we've heard zero rumours of new players coming in those positions. Ok I guess there have been some wingback rumours, which would help. But I've heard nothing about defensive midfielders or defenders, AFAIK.

notthesun
05-28-2022, 07:34 PM
Kerr is showing me a little something, I like that he uses his strength, he's able to barge through some challenges.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:35 PM
Someone needs to just sit on Shaqiri. Probably would of been a Delgado assignment if he was still here.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:35 PM
As expected.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:36 PM
What a shitty MLS 1.0 goal.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:37 PM
I don’t understand why Bradley abandoned his mark at the far post there to run and cut off the near post option. Someone else should have done that and it left us at a numerical disadvantage at the far post

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:37 PM
That all started with some really foolish play by Nelson

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:39 PM
The Shane O'Neill effect.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:41 PM
VARonto FC?

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:42 PM
Lucky as hell. Why the f**k were there 4 TFC players standing & watching, and not challenging for the rebound?

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:42 PM
Get Nelson off the field, now

SoccMan2
05-28-2022, 07:43 PM
Oh look Mavinga is hurt again lol , put this guy out of his misery and release this guy !

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:43 PM
I know he is only 19 and yadda yadda, but Nelson is hurting this team too much right now.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:43 PM
Get that dipshit Nelson off the field now. Pozuelo was all open in acres of space right in front of goal.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:45 PM
Get that dipshit Nelson off the field now. Pozuelo was all open in acres of space.

Such a selfish play. He had Akinola across the goal, Poz on the cutback, and he tries to shoot at the near post? Like what a ridiculous and stupid play

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:46 PM
We don't need no stinking midfield

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:47 PM
Such an ugly game outside of Xherdan Shaqiri.

Ultra & Proud
05-28-2022, 07:47 PM
I've been saying Nelson isn't MLS level and it's clear. He needs to sink into the formerly occupied by Zavaleta bench abyss.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:48 PM
Such a selfish play. He had Akinola across the goal, Poz on the cutback, and he tries to shoot at the near post? Like what a ridiculous and stupid play

And then after the turnover Nelson does the SLOW jog back.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:49 PM
And then after the turnover Nelson does the SLOW jog back.

If this were FIFA 22 Nelson would have High/low workrates.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:50 PM
I mean, I’m just going to say it: that goal is on Bob. The team’s getting shelled and he’s too slow to make the subs

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:50 PM
Yeah. They deserve that.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:51 PM
Can somebody please explain to me to me how Insigne is supposed to help our defensive shitshow?

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:53 PM
FUCK OFF Caldwell

That's not a fucking shoulder tackle. That's a hockey check.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:53 PM
Can't blame PRO tonight.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:54 PM
You know this poor schmuck is sitting there thinking “I called a soft foul and now this has to be a penalty”

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 07:57 PM
They are using their weight effectively. Needed Mavinga this game

Insigne will mean they can't send their full backs bombing up the field all the time.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 07:58 PM
We honestly don't deserve a point tonight. We are getting absolutely dominated by the goddamn Chicago Fire.

notthesun
05-28-2022, 07:59 PM
One of the cheapest penalties I've ever seen, hilarious we've scored like that

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 07:59 PM
Shaqiri on his yellow: “fuck that, man”

Lol

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 07:59 PM
I mean, I’m just going to say it: that goal is on Bob. The team’s getting shelled and he’s too slow to make the subs

I agree. And I don't understand how Shaffelburg for Jiminez is supposed to help our defensive problems. Why not Priso or Chung?

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 08:00 PM
Our only midfielder or attacker with defensive presence is Bradley.

Thompson is getting killed by no support around him

benito
05-28-2022, 08:02 PM
What a shot!

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 08:02 PM
What a fucking goal

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 08:02 PM
How the hell are we actually gonna win this?

jloome
05-28-2022, 08:03 PM
Well clearly the man is finished.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 08:04 PM
Our only midfielder or attacker with defensive presence is Bradley.

Thompson is getting killed by no support around him
The issue is,in addition to everything else you mentioned, Bradley is dropping deep all the f’n time to avoid being left dead for pace. So shaqiri or whoever else we play, shade him in the midfield third, turn and try to pick out the more advanced player. And our poor CB’s are left for dead cause it’s like a god damm training drill where the passer has no pressure on them.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 08:05 PM
Wow. Chicago with TFCesque defending, just watching Pozuelo line up that goal. Nice shot.

Chicago is probably gonna score three more goals, but it would be pretty funny if TFC wins this.

portu
05-28-2022, 08:06 PM
Not sure we deserve this one but I’ll take it. Westberg should start from now on.

portu
05-28-2022, 08:08 PM
I’m sorry if you say Nelson can’t pass the ball, then kindly shut up and watch the last 10 minutes.

Soccerpro
05-28-2022, 08:09 PM
It seems impossible to have such a terribly unorganized, defensively inept team every week. The Fire should have about 6 goals. This is just dumb luck for TFC at this point.

I don't understand how so many players on one team (TFC) run around with their heads cut off like chickens. They're just stupid players.

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 08:13 PM
Looks like Petrasso is now preferred as the LB over Shaff.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 08:13 PM
I’m sorry if you say Nelson can’t pass the ball, then kindly shut up and watch the last 10 minutes.

Who said that Nelson can't pass? The problem is that he often DOESN'T pass when he should pass. And that he slow jogs like some kind of seasoned superstar when his help is needed back. Plus other signs of him acting too big for his britches.

EDIT Also please don't ask board members to shut up.

portu
05-28-2022, 08:15 PM
Who said that Nelson can't pass? The problem is that he often DOESN'T pass when he should pass. And that he slow jogs like some kind of seasoned superstar when his help is needed back. Plus other signs of him acting too big for his britches.

I’m convinced Nelson haters just hate football that involves a sense of entertainment.

Soccerpro
05-28-2022, 08:15 PM
Insigne may well have as much effect on TFC and Shaqiri does for the Fire.

A CDM destroyer has been the main glaring weakness for TFC since game #1 vs FC Dallas this season. They've got to sign someone soon.

Soccerpro
05-28-2022, 08:16 PM
I’m convinced Nelson haters just hate football that involves a sense of entertainment.

Nelson isn't very good at soccer. That's my problem with him. He makes the same boneheaded decisions every week and doesn't seem to learn from them.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 08:17 PM
I’m convinced Nelson haters just hate football that involves a sense of entertainment.

I don't agree.

And again, please don't tell board members to shut up.

portu
05-28-2022, 08:18 PM
Nelson isn't very good at soccer. That's my problem with him. He makes the same boneheaded decisions every week and doesn't seem to learn from them.

Add “and lack intelligence” to my last post

MikeForbes
05-28-2022, 08:19 PM
I’m convinced Nelson haters just hate football that involves a sense of entertainment.

He is very entertaining. He also needs to make better decisions and process the game faster.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 08:19 PM
I'll take it. On to further glory.

Soccerpro
05-28-2022, 08:19 PM
Add “and lack intelligence” to my last post

Personal attacks are great. You seem like a nice person. Enjoy the rest of your day.

notthesun
05-28-2022, 08:20 PM
We're the best.

ag futbol
05-28-2022, 08:26 PM
I'll take it. On to further glory.
They all count at the end of the day.

I don’t know how our current midfield setup persists. Without more pace and defensive rigours, we’re sitting ducks.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 08:35 PM
Big happy crowd leaving.
Again, anyone who says there is no interest in this crud team is just wrong.

Nelson tries to dribble past opponents too much. He also doesn't drive to the line enough for a guy with his speed and dribbling capabilities.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 09:06 PM
Start the car?

https://twitter.com/GameFlowxPG/status/1530726190486536192?t=Mxphzxbb20m9X2zGwaCTQQ&s=19

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 09:08 PM
They all count at the end of the day.

I don’t know how our current midfield setup persists. Without more pace and defensive rigours, we’re sitting ducks.

Hey I'm looking at the bright side: Westberg definitely had a chance to work on his game-fitness and alertness today, amiright?

It was interesting watching the two teams line up in their defensive shape, especially towards the end. Chicago (who aren't world or even league beaters) would assume a pretty defined shape, no big gaps, wings covered well enough, and always one player ready to burst forward to intercept passes.

TFC, on the other hand, if & when they got back in numbers, did not seem to have a clue how to line up. A couple of times they were in a straight line right across the back. That means every pass back outside the box was dangerous. Or they would leave Shaqiri or another dangerous player completely open at the far side of the box (again and again and again).

To me, it's beyond needing to swap a few chess pieces. I'm happy with the win, I can see that it would be entertaining especially in the stadium. I don't expect the young players to be perfect, especially if they're noticeably trying, and not acting like they're something much bigger than they are. I don't even expect the team to be very good overall.

But this total lack of organization goes beyond a couple of players. I think the few senior players available in defensive midfield and in central defence aren't good at organizing others (and often even themselves). And Bob Bradley hasn't been able to impart a organizational scheme that persists from practices into games. (Of course that's hard with so many young players, but does it have to be this hard?) Again I don't see how the rumoured players coming in will help with that. I really hope we're in for a surprise, and that there will be 1 or 2 new players coming in those positions that we totally didn't expect.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 09:13 PM
There were arguments about defensive shape pretty much all game long. Even a few discussions post game

glaze
05-28-2022, 09:28 PM
No capo? Are we dead?

PawTar711
05-28-2022, 09:29 PM
I thought that when we had the ball it was fast, just like each half, and that you can score at any time. Thats why, when they had the ball and were aggressive alot nothing really happened for them and we were already up. therefor, we need to make sure if we can coitnue good play and formations are right, we can climb the standings.

Auzzy
05-28-2022, 10:01 PM
There were arguments about defensive shape pretty much all game long. Even a few discussions post game

That's good to hear, thanks.

The GameFlow graph is pretty extreme.

OgtheDim
05-28-2022, 10:26 PM
Hmmm....you know, I get its a Saturday night & not many people are in here but why is it when we win, even an unconvincing win like that one, certain people never come in here to say something?

Ultra & Proud
05-28-2022, 10:39 PM
Hmmm....you know, I get its a Saturday night & not many people are in here but why is it when we win, even an unconvincing win like that one, certain people never come in here to say something?

This is a true statement. I thought we played okay. We were lucky at times and that PK flukily was a PK. Not the highest bar of victories but got to re-start somewhere.

stevep
05-29-2022, 12:13 AM
Gameflow analysis
chicago 3.3 goals
toronto 1 goal

Chicago / Toronto
Possession 62/38
Shots 33/5
Total passes 498/317
passing accuracy % 82/73
Corners 8/1
crosses 33/4

This game is quite possibly the biggest drubbing I have ever seen of one team putting on another team

Thomas
05-29-2022, 01:00 AM
Good point. I would add to this, why is it that certain individuals are consistently all over the team when we lose, but barely a peep when we win.


Hmmm....you know, I get its a Saturday night & not many people are in here but why is it when we win, even an unconvincing win like that one, certain people never come in here to say something?

Slick
05-29-2022, 01:57 AM
Good point. I would add to this, why is it that certain individuals are consistently all over the team when we lose, but barely a peep when we win.

They're closet Impact fans

James17930
05-29-2022, 02:00 AM
Just watched the highlights of this game. Have to say I was not expecting us to win, but glad we somehow pulled it off. Looked like a good crowd and Poz seemed committed, so good news on those fronts.

Let's hope it's the start of something ... but man, our defence.

Kamp Berg
05-29-2022, 05:52 AM
There was lots of great energy going forward last night. Kerr is a nice surprise, I don’t think I heard anyone even mention him at the start of the season.
What a difference with/without Osorio. Anyone know if his early exit was precautionary or injury?

Gringo Starr
05-29-2022, 07:01 AM
Not a great game but really entertaining at the same time. What happened to O’Neill? We struggled more when he came off. Nelson is a project who is way to casual in our own end but his speed is something need. Shaqiri looks like he has definitely lost a step or two, still a great player but I get why he struggled with Lyon now. I prefer the purple kit to the black and white one. I wonder who gets the next start-I’m hoping Q

Section 223
05-29-2022, 07:16 AM
Gameflow analysis
chicago 3.3 goals
toronto 1 goal

Chicago / Toronto
Possession 62/38
Shots 33/5
Total passes 498/317
passing accuracy % 82/73
Corners 8/1
crosses 33/4

This game is quite possibly the biggest drubbing I have ever seen of one team putting on another team
No sport on earth more consistently rewards the undeserving team with a result more than soccer, watched two games yesterday Champions league and TFC both games were won by the team that looked inferior. Chicago who sits dead last in this league came to our house and took the game to us. Season is coming to the halfway mark and scratching my head at how Bob Bradley is turning this team around for the better, I don’t see it.

DavemTFC
05-29-2022, 08:49 AM
Start the car?

https://twitter.com/GameFlowxPG/status/1530726190486536192?t=Mxphzxbb20m9X2zGwaCTQQ&s=19
Looks about right, we were awful. Overrun in midfield and at fullback all game. We're lucky Chicago are notoriously bad finishers (and apparently cursed against us - they haven't beaten us in 7 years!) because any other team would have put more than two in, including Chicago most days. Our goals were lucky too - a goalkeeping error, a soft penalty, and a wonderstrike. None of this is sustainable

We got rid of our only defensive midfield stud in Delgado and replaced him with nobody so that Priso could develop into a starter, despite the fact we was coming off a long-term injury and has literally never played a full 90 minutes for the first team. Today with only MB4 as a defensive minded midfielder (and we all know what his shortcomings are) BB didn't put Priso in until the last 10 minutes. Is he injured again? Not rated (he's not been lights out or anything but we still look more defensively solid when he plays)? There's no other defensively adequate midfielder we can put in with Osorio and Okello injured and Thompson having to play RB.

We need to hit on all four of those summer signings and one of them absolutely has to be a DM/CM.

jloome
05-29-2022, 10:05 AM
This league is full of parity. We're a rebuilt team full of kids and we play like one. That doesn't mean we don't have enough individual skill to win a few games.

We're one game out of a playoff spot and we haven't had any mid-season reinforcements yet. Perhaps people need to stop whining and consider where this team would be if Curtis and Armas were still here.

"We won, but the way we won proves we SUCK."

What a Toronto fan entitled statement.

If we're winning at all right now, we're doing so typically with a team two-to-three years younger than the one we're playing. We're basically starting at least four guys in every game who would NEVER be starting, as they're just not ready, on a fully built team.

But we knew that coming in. So what are people whining about? A lot of armchair gm's who clearly have little to no understanding of the difficulty in quickly rebuilding a team.

We won, our top DP played without pain for the first time in four games and scored two goals, and Q played, almost certainly preserving the win with two late saves. Plus we had a goalie in who can distribute again.

But hey, if despite all that you're still bitching, I imagine nothing short of a treble is going to make you happy.

Kamp Berg
05-29-2022, 10:16 AM
This league is full of parity. We're a rebuilt team full of kids and we play like one. That doesn't mean we don't have enough individual skill to win a few games.

We're one game out of a playoff spot and we haven't had any mid-season reinforcements yet. Perhaps people need to stop whining and consider where this team would be if Curtis and Armas were still here.

"We won, but the way we won proves we SUCK."

What a Toronto fan entitled statement.

If we're winning at all right now, we're doing so typically with a team two-to-three years younger than the one we're playing. We're basically starting at least four guys in every game who would NEVER be starting, as they're just not ready, on a fully built team.

But we knew that coming in. So what are people whining about? A lot of armchair gm's who clearly have little to no understanding of the difficulty in quickly rebuilding a team.

We won, our top DP played without pain for the first time in four games and scored two goals, and Q played, almost certainly preserving the win with two late saves. Plus we had a goalie in who can distribute again.

But hey, if despite all that you're still bitching, I imagine nothing short of a treble is going to make you happy.

The fact that it’s Poz’s first game this year without pain is huge.

ag futbol
05-29-2022, 10:54 AM
This league is full of parity. We're a rebuilt team full of kids and we play like one. That doesn't mean we don't have enough individual skill to win a few games.

We're one game out of a playoff spot and we haven't had any mid-season reinforcements yet. Perhaps people need to stop whining and consider where this team would be if Curtis and Armas were still here.

"We won, but the way we won proves we SUCK."

What a Toronto fan entitled statement.

If we're winning at all right now, we're doing so typically with a team two-to-three years younger than the one we're playing. We're basically starting at least four guys in every game who would NEVER be starting, as they're just not ready, on a fully built team.

But we knew that coming in. So what are people whining about? A lot of armchair gm's who clearly have little to no understanding of the difficulty in quickly rebuilding a team.

We won, our top DP played without pain for the first time in four games and scored two goals, and Q played, almost certainly preserving the win with two late saves. Plus we had a goalie in who can distribute again.

But hey, if despite all that you're still bitching, I imagine nothing short of a treble is going to make you happy.
Haha, yes, all very fair.

This is the tough part at the moment. We’ve all wanted to see our youth players get a chance and shelve the mediocre, MLS-vet cores of the past. Tough to watch them learn and I admit I’ll complain in the moment but when it’s done it will likely be worthwhile.

Something to consider… Maybe none of Thomson, Petrasso, Kerr, or Nelson end up starting once we have our first choice team in place. But are any of them particularly out of place as backups? Everyone, with the exception of Nelson looks sturdy enough to do the job. And with Nelson, there’s enough upside where I think you continue to find him some minutes to develop.

jloome
05-29-2022, 11:25 AM
Haha, yes, all very fair.

This is the tough part at the moment. We’ve all wanted to see our youth players get a chance and shelve the mediocre, MLS-vet cores of the past. Tough to watch them learn and I admit I’ll complain in the moment but when it’s done it will likely be worthwhile.

Something to consider… Maybe none of Thomson, Petrasso, Kerr, or Nelson end up starting once we have our first choice team in place. But are any of them particularly out of place as backups? Everyone, with the exception of Nelson looks sturdy enough to do the job. And with Nelson, there’s enough upside where I think you continue to find him some minutes to develop.

Nelson has a very high upside. People who can't see past his poor decisions are missing the fact that he's a 19-year-old. His passing last night was, on occasion, pretty exceptional. He has a huge toolbag and he's already at the point where he could be a backup.

I'd say all of the new/young players are good enough for backup duty other than Chung and maybe Kosi Thompson, who has a huge toolbox but feels badly out of position as a fullback. He's just not good defensively at all. Chung's read of the game is just too slow. He's exposed constantly. Thompson is deputizing for him and looks lost as a fullback.

reggie
05-29-2022, 11:43 AM
Nelson has a very high upside. People who can't see past his poor decisions are missing the fact that he's a 19-year-old. His passing last night was, on occasion, pretty exceptional. He has a huge toolbag and he's already at the point where he could be a backup.

I'd say all of the new/young players are good enough for backup duty other than Chung and maybe Kosi Thompson, who has a huge toolbox but feels badly out of position as a fullback. He's just not good defensively at all. Chung's read of the game is just too slow. He's exposed constantly. Thompson is deputizing for him and looks lost as a fullback.
i agree....people seem to nitpick on him more than anybody

Red CB Toronto
05-29-2022, 12:42 PM
The big thing that jumped out at me was this match was the first time in about 2 months that there was not a short term signing from TFC II. For while there was 1-4 of them week in, week out. Hopefully that a sign things are getting better.

OgtheDim
05-29-2022, 01:12 PM
i agree....people seem to nitpick on him more than anybody


Cause he consistently makes the choices we know are an issue

- doesn't track back at pace
- stop & dribbles around a player rather then use his speed to get to an area & often then gets bumped off the ball
- does not use the overlapping runner
- attempts to dribble out of trouble in front of our own box


He's got a lot of potential but his downside cost us a goal in this game...

He's a work in progress, I get it. But his downside is infuriating because the choices being made look selfish (might be wrong) - he's trying to be Poz & Oso & he isn't there yet


*******

On another note, Kerr keeps getting better each game

reggie
05-29-2022, 01:20 PM
Cause he consistantly makes the choices we know are an issue

- doesn't track back
- stop & dribbles around a player rather then use his speed to get to an area
- does not use the overlapping runner
- attempts to dribble out of trouble in front of our own box

He's got a lot of potential but his downside cost us a goal tonight...
oh ok nobody else made mistakes .oh he got a assist on the winning goal but thats ok. chicago should of had 6 goals last night ,not too many guys played well last night

OgtheDim
05-29-2022, 01:27 PM
oh ok nobody else made mistakes .oh he got a assist on the winning goal but thats ok. chicago should of had 6 goals last night ,not too many guys played well last night

Fair enough

************


People should watch BB's presser afterwards.....he's really talking about learning a lot & "this is a big project" & about mentality

https://www.torontofc.ca/video/postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022#postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022

Also, talks about Poz not training much for a couple of weeks before this game.

Oso - they don't know what it is but are trying to find out. NT makes the call right now as to whether he goes to CANMNT camp.

O'Neill - was concerned about dizzyness.

Asked about "did you challenge Kerr" by Molinaro, "I challenge each of these guys each day".

Talks from there about "emptying the tank:

Right at the end, they left in the Singh question about Poz contract that BB refused to talk about.

REALLY good use of 9 minutes of your time, people.

reggie
05-29-2022, 01:38 PM
Fair enough

************


People should watch BB's presser afterwards.....he's really talking about learning a lot & "this is a big project" & about mentality

https://www.torontofc.ca/video/postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022#postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022

Also, talks about Poz not training much for a couple of weeks before this game.

Oso - they don't know what it is but are trying to find out. NT makes the call right now as to whether he goes to CANMNT camp. O'Neill - was concerned about dizzyness.
he has his warts for sure,they all do,my concern is the oso injuries and too many guys playing out of postion,take the win and run,i think priso should of replaced oso they were over runned in midfield all game

MikeForbes
05-29-2022, 02:26 PM
Hope O'Neill is alright. I thought him and Salcedo were stellar dealing with the barrage of crosses thrown into the box in the first half.

portu
05-29-2022, 03:46 PM
I will never understand complaints about Nelson tracking back. He’s an out-and-out winger, if you’re relying on him tracking back or marking runners then you’re misdirecting complaints to Nelson that should be on the midfield/fullback.

Presser is a good use of time as well btw

ag futbol
05-29-2022, 03:54 PM
Nelson has a very high upside. People who can't see past his poor decisions are missing the fact that he's a 19-year-old. His passing last night was, on occasion, pretty exceptional. He has a huge toolbag and he's already at the point where he could be a backup.

I'd say all of the new/young players are good enough for backup duty other than Chung and maybe Kosi Thompson, who has a huge toolbox but feels badly out of position as a fullback. He's just not good defensively at all. Chung's read of the game is just too slow. He's exposed constantly. Thompson is deputizing for him and looks lost as a fullback.
Maybe I under estimate the rigours of a true RB but I think Thomson isn’t so bad. For a 19 year old he looks closer to figuring out the defensive positioning side all the time. It has been an improvement over JMR who is just too young at the moment.

But Kosi is getting targeted every game, no doubt about that

Ultra & Proud
05-29-2022, 03:58 PM
I will never understand complaints about Nelson tracking back. He’s an out-and-out winger, if you’re relying on him tracking back or marking runners then you’re misdirecting complaints to Nelson that should be on the midfield/fullback.

This is true but a lot of the time it's him that turns it over by either making a poor decision or over dribbling into trouble. When a young player makes these types of mistakes over and over it isn't asking too much for him to try to help with the counter he created. It's not like he's Ronaldo out there where you can ignore that facet of his game because his offensive contributions are top tier.

stevep
05-29-2022, 06:52 PM
This league is full of parity. We're a rebuilt team full of kids and we play like one. That doesn't mean we don't have enough individual skill to win a few games.

We're one game out of a playoff spot and we haven't had any mid-season reinforcements yet. Perhaps people need to stop whining and consider where this team would be if Curtis and Armas were still here.

"We won, but the way we won proves we SUCK."

What a Toronto fan entitled statement.

If we're winning at all right now, we're doing so typically with a team two-to-three years younger than the one we're playing. We're basically starting at least four guys in every game who would NEVER be starting, as they're just not ready, on a fully built team.

But we knew that coming in. So what are people whining about? A lot of armchair gm's who clearly have little to no understanding of the difficulty in quickly rebuilding a team.

We won, our top DP played without pain for the first time in four games and scored two goals, and Q played, almost certainly preserving the win with two late saves. Plus we had a goalie in who can distribute again.

But hey, if despite all that you're still bitching, I imagine nothing short of a treble is going to make you happy.
tfc was absolutely pummelled last night. Those two teams did not belong on the same pitch last night
one team belonged on a mls next pitch.
rebuilding is a marketing construct. Do not be fooled by marketing constructs teams are always
rebuilding
happiness is a subjective statement. Some people can can be perfectly happy watching what amounts to a tfc2 team others cannot

Section 223
05-29-2022, 07:03 PM
tfc was absolutely pummelled last night. Those two teams did not belong on the same pitch last night
one team belonged on a mls next pitch.
rebuilding is a marketing construct. Do not be fooled by marketing constructs teams are always
rebuilding
happiness is a subjective statement. Some people can can be perfectly happy watching what amounts to a tfc2 team others cannot
Congratulations on this comment Stevep always enjoy your thoughts no bs and intelligent .

Auzzy
05-29-2022, 09:01 PM
Just watched snippets of the highlights. One thing I really liked about Pozuelo's second goal: it was a proper hard shot from outside they box. For so long he has almost always been chipping the ball instead of putting his foot through it, and hardly anyone on the team takes long shots which makes TFC very predictable. More goals and attempts like that please!

613reppingTFC
05-29-2022, 10:50 PM
I was watching sports center today and they showed the highlights and right before Oso went off it looked like he got his foot stomped on. Might have been the cause...?

jloome
05-30-2022, 08:29 AM
tfc was absolutely pummelled last night. Those two teams did not belong on the same pitch last night
one team belonged on a mls next pitch.
rebuilding is a marketing construct. Do not be fooled by marketing constructs teams are always
rebuilding
happiness is a subjective statement. Some people can can be perfectly happy watching what amounts to a tfc2 team others cannot

To say your team was absolutely pummeled when they won 3-2 is the height of delusional.

Bushmancan
05-30-2022, 08:40 AM
Just watched snippets of the highlights. One thing I really liked about Pozuelo's second goal: it was a proper hard shot from outside they box. For so long he has almost always been chipping the ball instead of putting his foot through it, and hardly anyone on the team takes long shots which makes TFC very predictable. More goals and attempts like that please!

I was saying the exact same thing to my friends. As important, he got involved 100% more once Shaff came on an he moved to the center. Poz is far more dangerous in the middle as an attacker and that was a beautiful shot so nice to see his laces go through it

Bushmancan
05-30-2022, 08:49 AM
To say your team was absolutely pummeled when they won 3-2 is the height of delusional.

Note quite, I now sit in the east stand 209, row 1 and have a perfect view of the field from a higher vantage (old hockey habit). It was a frustrating but entertaining day.

One thing I couldn’t figure out, who was the right mid-fielder, winger because Kosi was continually left alone on the right side. And I mean completely alone to face two and sometimes three players. (re-watch the 2nd half). I mean at times Kerr would appear to support and then occasionally it was Nelson (more importantly they were always running to support, they were not already there) and many times MB had to push over but they were overloading it and picking poor Kosi apart (seriously the only player on the right side).

This lead to the the young guys scrambling and chasing the ball instead of holding a line, we were definitely outplayed and if Chicago knew how to finish the result would not have been as flattering. I do think they are working harder and will get better and maybe the soccer gods gave us one back, considering they robbed us of two others. We have some time now, work on collective defense.

OgtheDim
05-30-2022, 09:05 AM
Note quite, I now sit in the east stand 209, row 1 and have a perfect view of the field from a higher vantage (old hockey habit). It was a frustrating but entertaining day.

One thing I couldn’t figure out, who was the right mid-fielder, winger because Kosi was continually left alone on the right side. And I mean completely alone to face two and sometimes three players. (re-watch the 2nd half). I mean at times Kerr would appear to support and then occasionally it was Nelson (more importantly they were always running to support, they were not already there) and many times MB had to push over but they were overloading it and picking poor Kosi apart (seriously the only player on the right side).

This lead to the the young guys scrambling and chasing the ball instead of holding a line, we were definitely outplayed and if Chicago knew how to finish the result would not have been as flattering.......


Pretty much my view from 116 as well - although this wasn't going on as much in the first half. We were not pummelled but it was dire there.

This has happened before wether its Kosi or Chung - teams after awhile can see the weakness. NYC did it, Philly did it, Cinci did it.

There is a problem out there on the right in defensive positioning.

jloome
05-30-2022, 09:13 AM
Pretty much my view from 116 as well - although this wasn't going on as much in the first half. We were not pummelled but it was dire there.

This has happened before wether its Kosi or Chung - teams after awhile can see the weakness. NYC did it, Philly did it, Cinci did it.

There is a problem out there on the right in defensive positioning.

Yep. We need a proper right fullback if they're going to tilt the field tactically to stress
the left side.

People get too caught up in statistics. We were outshot 9-4 on target, so Q earned those points, along with Poz. But
most of Chicago's possession and shots were wasted and largely
meaningless.

The most important number in their favor is that they blocked 13 of our shots and we blocked ZERO of theirs. We're just not closing quickly enough, on crosses or shots.

OgtheDim
05-30-2022, 09:29 AM
....The most important number in their favor is that they blocked 13 of our shots and we blocked ZERO of theirs. We're just not closing quickly enough, on crosses or shots.

Or maybe we are emulating Liverpool & letting our league class shot stoppers see everything in order to get the counter started quicker.... :)


It was so nice to watch Westberg distribute the ball & hear him communicate with the defenders - helps that Akinola bangs up hard for every header. His after game shot for social media said it all - he's happy to be back in front of that crowd.

Auzzy
05-30-2022, 09:39 AM
The most important number in their favor is that they blocked 13 of our shots and we blocked ZERO of theirs. We're just not closing quickly enough, on crosses or shots.

I actually noticed that almost all over the field. Chicago would high press and actually engage, to try to win the ball. And they were very intent on intercepting passes, often stopping dangerous TFC opportunities. Those interceptions also create their own dangerous attacks as TFC was unbalanced, not expecting a turnover at the time.

Meanwhile, when TFC high-pressed, they most often approached and tried to contain, but often do not try to win the ball, except if very close to our goal. (Then it's last-ditch and risky.) That leaves tons of opportunities for Chicago to complete passes, advance, and put passes or crosses into the box.

Is that type of "pressing" a tactical decision by BB? Or is due to fears of the players themselves, not wanting to over-commit, for example if they know they and their teammates don't have the speed or positioning to recover? Also I felt TFC had far fewer attempts to anticipate and intercept passes; they usually reacted to Chicago passes after the fact. (But I haven't looked at the stats to confirm successful interceptions.)

Ultra & Proud
05-30-2022, 10:31 AM
Or is due to fears of the players themselves, not wanting to over-commit, for example if they know they and their teammates don't have the speed or positioning to recover? Also I felt TFC had far fewer attempts to anticipate and intercept passes; they usually reacted to Chicago passes after the fact. (But I haven't looked at the stats to confirm successful interceptions.)
I think this is it. I think this was in part what Bob was referencing in his post match presser about our football not being up to snuff.

ag futbol
05-30-2022, 10:56 AM
Yep. We need a proper right fullback if they're going to tilt the field tactically to stress
the left side.

People get too caught up in statistics. We were outshot 9-4 on target, so Q earned those points, along with Poz. But
most of Chicago's possession and shots were wasted and largely
meaningless.

The most important number in their favor is that they blocked 13 of our shots and we blocked ZERO of theirs. We're just not closing quickly enough, on crosses or shots.
To me it looked like shaqiri was delivering balls on a platter all game and their supporting cast did a terrible job being in position or converting the chances.

I wouldn’t say they wasted their possession as much as some golden opportunities.

MightyDM
05-30-2022, 11:31 AM
Fair enough

************


People should watch BB's presser afterwards.....he's really talking about learning a lot & "this is a big project" & about mentality

https://www.torontofc.ca/video/postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022#postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022

Also, talks about Poz not training much for a couple of weeks before this game.

Oso - they don't know what it is but are trying to find out. NT makes the call right now as to whether he goes to CANMNT camp.

O'Neill - was concerned about dizzyness.

Asked about "did you challenge Kerr" by Molinaro, "I challenge each of these guys each day".

Talks from there about "emptying the tank:

Right at the end, they left in the Singh question about Poz contract that BB refused to talk about.

REALLY good use of 9 minutes of your time, people.

BB sees clearly the weaknesses of this team and i am sure the players. he is masterful in the presser.

reggie
05-30-2022, 11:52 AM
i get that nelson has his issues,tracking back hogging the ball,but kerr and poz are not exactly defensive stalwarts,MB is running around putting out fires all over the pitch,its jus not a good balance in the mid right now

MightyDM
05-30-2022, 12:36 PM
i get that nelson has his issues,tracking back hogging the ball,but kerr and poz are not exactly defensive stalwarts,MB is running around putting out fires all over the pitch,its jus not a good balance in the mid right now


Thats fair. The Priso of last year is what we need to balance MB. I am also in the "Nelson is going to come good " camp and have been impressed by Kerr's growing physicality. I also think Kosi has it in him to be a quality player - where is the real question

Bushmancan
05-30-2022, 01:45 PM
^^Agree with both the above, I was just saying it was so clear Kosi was on his own (good way to learn). It really looked like both Kerr and Nelson had no clue on what their defensive responsibilities were and perhaps that's fair to say they are attackers by nature but a quality team does us real harm with that alignment.

Auzzy
05-30-2022, 04:55 PM
People should watch BB's presser afterwards.....he's really talking about learning a lot & "this is a big project" & about mentality

https://www.torontofc.ca/video/postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022#postgame-sound-bob-bradley-may-28-2022

Also, talks about Poz not training much for a couple of weeks before this game.

Oso - they don't know what it is but are trying to find out. NT makes the call right now as to whether he goes to CANMNT camp.

O'Neill - was concerned about dizzyness.

Asked about "did you challenge Kerr" by Molinaro, "I challenge each of these guys each day".

Talks from there about "emptying the tank:

Right at the end, they left in the Singh question about Poz contract that BB refused to talk about.

REALLY good use of 9 minutes of your time, people.

Thanks for the tip, that's the first presser I've listened to in a while!

It was interesting to hear that the National Team decides about Osorio being called up. TFC only sends the medical report. For example, I thought it was pretty clear that Bayern decided that Davies wouldn't be available to Canada in the previous international windows. I guess it depends on what the club team writes in the medical report.

I do find it weird that a club that can find millions of $ to sign certain players, can't mic the questions of the journalists in a press conference.

portu
05-30-2022, 06:48 PM
What's the power-ranking for the kids right now? They can't all stay on the team at the end of the season, so going to be really relevant later.

I've got something like this, I'm sure others have totally different:
1. Priso
2. Nelson
3. Kosi
4. Petrasso
5. JMR
6. Kerr
7. Shaff
8. Perruzza
9. Okello
10. Themi

Shaff should be higher but I'm not sure he fits the BB team at all and I rate Okello, but where has he been?

Lennon
05-30-2022, 07:21 PM
You guys think we see Westberg start until he screws up? Thought I heard the commentator say that Bradley's going to give him a run of games. No flip flopping with the GK's like last year.

MightyDM
05-31-2022, 11:11 AM
Interesting ranking. Shaff is at the top for me but otherwise about right, except for OKello - he is further advanced than most.

Oldtimer
05-31-2022, 01:42 PM
You guys think we see Westberg start until he screws up? Thought I heard the commentator say that Bradley's going to give him a run of games. No flip flopping with the GK's like last year.

I don't think the future is with either of our keepers, but Westberg is better at positioning the defense and in distribution so he's the better option for now given our current weak areas. I expect though that Bradley will use both keepers for the rest of our year.

MightyDM
06-01-2022, 12:17 AM
Just a reminder that our lineup at the end of the game was

Peruzza - Nelson

Shaff - Bradley - Priso - Kerr

Peruzza - Salcedo - McNaughton - Kosi

Q

That's pretty incredible even if we were playing the last place team. Shaff is the third most experienced outfield player on the pitch.

FootBallAZ
06-03-2022, 10:44 AM
I took some to reflect before sharing my thoughs.

Happy for the win, happy that westberg got second start and second win.

It was westberg's fault on the first goal as he should have caught that ball clean which led to the corner i believe.

TFC did not deserve to win that game- sometimes championship teams learn to win games when playing like shit-- hoping this is the foundation for winning games we shouldnt have going forward.

MLS helped TFC big time, their goal looked good the one where Q saved it and all players stopped and ball watched - i though it was on side.

Chicago should have had at least three clean shots on target that most likely would have been goals.

The penalty was a joke for sure.

this was gifted game maybe for the non goal earlier that should have counted.


I dis like that everyone defers to bradley it is very annoying.
Q took time but was able to make connecting passes which is such a pet peeve of mine im so happy we have a capable passer.

Ayo is hugely missed as his big frame allows for hold up and for the rest of the team to get open.

Issue ive noticed is no one every gives support to the player with the ball and this normally leads to backwards passing.


Set piece defending is terrible, set piece offense just as bad.

1st league win in how many games?

Poz probably wouldnt have scored if the damn stadium didnt say shoot- glad he did.

Been a consistent issue for the past three seasons, no one can shoot outside the 18 yard box, its like they try to pass their way into the net.


Nelson is very difficult to watch, such low IQ, all the good he does he undoes in the final third of the pitch- most important part as it opens up counter attacks for terrible decision making shooting when other players are in the box, he needs to understand to use his teammates in the final third and he could get the ball back for a shot.

has speed and has nice moves but the IQ needs to be improved.


still not happy with the performance relative to the expected pricing TFC set.