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Oldtimer
02-26-2022, 06:49 PM
TFC 2022

General roster discussion

Player in-season moves/speculation/rumours
Post your speculation/information/etc. here in this thread!

Confirmed (by traditional media or the club) signings can get a separate single thread. All other "inside" and other information goes here.

MikeForbes
02-26-2022, 08:02 PM
Wingers and depth, please!

SneijderOranje
02-26-2022, 08:04 PM
Wingers and depth, please!

insigne, crisito, ayo healthy, possibly destro with jimenez moving over seems to answer those asks.

OgtheDim
02-26-2022, 08:06 PM
I still think its Belotti they want.

SneijderOranje
02-26-2022, 08:08 PM
I still think its Belotti they want.

would be an absolute dream with salcedo TAM'd down and jimenez and ayo as depth.

OgtheDim
02-26-2022, 08:11 PM
I think in this dream Jimenez goes to the right side of the 4-3-3 & we do REALLY kick ass moving forward.

Yuushalinsky
02-27-2022, 07:00 PM
This the place to talk about Insigne doing well? 1G+1A today to pull Napoli level in the race for the Scudetto.

leedsandTFC
02-27-2022, 07:02 PM
This the place to talk about Insigne doing well? 1G+1A today to pull Napoli level in the race for the Scudetto.
he looked great today, incredibly excited for july

Red CB Toronto
02-27-2022, 09:03 PM
Already loving this guy already, has a very humble, team first approach, looking forward to more of it.

(2) Carlos Salcedo on Twitter: "Thanks for the words but if it wasn’t for my teammates this is hard to accomplish! Big shout out to the team because it wasn’t an easy field to play. I’m 100% sure we’ll give everything for our fans, our city and our club this year! #TFC ♥️料 #CS3 #ElTitan 轢" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/Csalcedojr/status/1498107551107399684)

Yuushalinsky
02-28-2022, 08:35 AM
So for Insigne, can he only come to TFC right on July 1st or can he train with the team before then?

Red CB Toronto
02-28-2022, 09:06 AM
So for Insigne, can he only come to TFC right on July 1st or can he train with the team before then?

Not exactly sure but based on Italy's busy June with 5 games from June 1 thru 14, he made need a bit of a rest regardless.



1 June 2022Finalissima (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Italy_v_Argentina_football_match)
Italy https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1a/Flag_of_Argentina.svg/23px-Flag_of_Argentina.svg.png Argentina (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentina_national_football_team)

showLondon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London), England





4 June 20222022–23 UEFA Nations League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%9323_UEFA_Nations_League_A#Group_3)
Italy https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/ba/Flag_of_Germany.svg/23px-Flag_of_Germany.svg.png Germany (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany_national_football_team)

showBologna (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna), Italy





7 June 20222022–23 UEFA Nations League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%9323_UEFA_Nations_League_A#Group_3)
Italy https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Flag_of_Hungary.svg/23px-Flag_of_Hungary.svg.png Hungary (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungary_national_football_team)

showCesena (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cesena), Italy





11 June 20222022–23 UEFA Nations League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%9323_UEFA_Nations_League_A#Group_3)
England (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/England_national_football_team) https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/be/Flag_of_England.svg/23px-Flag_of_England.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png Italy

showEngland





14 June 20222022–23 UEFA Nations League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%9323_UEFA_Nations_League_A#Group_3)
Germany (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany_national_football_team) https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/ba/Flag_of_Germany.svg/23px-Flag_of_Germany.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png Italy

showMönchengladbach (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%B6nchengladbach), Germany





23 September 20222022–23 UEFA Nations League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022%E2%80%9323_UEFA_Nations_League_A#Group_3)
Italy https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/03/Flag_of_Italy.svg/23px-Flag_of_Italy.svg.png
v
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/be/Flag_of_England.svg/23px-Flag_of_England.svg.png England (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/England_national_football_team)

showItaly

jabbronies
02-28-2022, 09:39 AM
So for Insigne, can he only come to TFC right on July 1st or can he train with the team before then?

July 1 is when he's allowed to train with the TFC unless Napoli give him permission otherwise.
I don't think the team would need much build up and training to integrate him. By then we should have a system in place and he would just be slotting in to a position. And aside from burnout, I don't think his fitness will be an issue. So it's really just time for him to get comfortable with what the team is doing. and if he's watching the games now, he should be able to pick that shit up real quick.

There's a game against CuntFuck MTL on the 16th - I could see him debuting then - maybe as a sub? That's a derby game though. Do you really want his first appearance in that situation away from home? I wouldn't want those fucks seeing him live before we do.

Charlotte at home on July 23rd seems more likely. Expansion team at home should make for a nice debut.

July 30 is at New England - no thanks. Not on that fucking turf, then Nashville on August 6th but that seems too late.

MikeForbes
02-28-2022, 09:49 AM
July 1 is when he's allowed to train with the TFC unless Napoli give him permission otherwise.
I don't think the team would need much build up and training to integrate him. By then we should have a system in place and he would just be slotting in to a position. And aside from burnout, I don't think his fitness will be an issue. So it's really just time for him to get comfortable with what the team is doing. and if he's watching the games now, he should be able to pick that shit up real quick.

There's a game against CuntFuck MTL on the 16th - I could see him debuting then - maybe as a sub? That's a derby game though. Do you really want his first appearance in that situation away from home? I wouldn't want those fucks seeing him live before we do.

Charlotte at home on July 23rd seems more likely. Expansion team at home should make for a nice debut.

July 30 is at New England - no thanks. Not on that fucking turf, then Nashville on August 6th but that seems too late.

I'd take Montreal fans seeing Insigne before us if he came on in the 65th minute and scored two goals to win the game. I think I am gonna try and get to that Charlotte game though. Not sure I wanna miss Insigne's home debut.

jabbronies
02-28-2022, 10:03 AM
I'd take Montreal fans seeing Insigne before us if he came on in the 65th minute and scored two goals to win the game. I think I am gonna try and get to that Charlotte game though. Not sure I wanna miss Insigne's home debut.

I mean that is why you get a player of this calibre. To come through in the big games.

OgtheDim
02-28-2022, 10:57 AM
Insigne is going to start on the the 9th against San Jose.

No way they hold off on him for longer then that.

Bobo
02-28-2022, 11:19 AM
I'm sure there's a precedent for MLS teams giving marquee players time off after the European season, but it's hard to justify paying big-time money to let a guy vacation before joining. Unless Insigne is genuinely tired, I think two or three substitute appearances in July is the way to go.

I wish Napoli had less to play for so Insigne could spend some extra time preparing for TFC and MLS.

leedsandTFC
02-28-2022, 11:32 AM
I'm sure there's a precedent for MLS teams giving marquee players time off after the European season, but it's hard to justify paying big-time money to let a guy vacation before joining. Unless Insigne is genuinely tired, I think two or three substitute appearances in July is the way to go.

I wish Napoli had less to play for so Insigne could spend some extra time preparing for TFC and MLS.

serie a ends in mid may, he'll be fine

Bobo
02-28-2022, 11:45 AM
serie a ends in mid may, he'll be fine

The issue is that Italy plays five times after the domestic season ends. I doubt he starts every game, but they're against some big competition.

jloome
02-28-2022, 02:48 PM
I wonder if we'll see Jimenez moved to right wing as an inverted forward, which is what Insigne basically plays on the left. Ayo will be back by then and it would give us a hell of a front line.

Interesting to see the hype continues unabated: https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/transfer-news/arsenal-key-advantage-over-liverpool-23236878

Initial B
02-28-2022, 02:55 PM
Just thinking, but could TFC run a 3-5-2 for the season, using the WB spots for the kids to develop? It would help them develop both their offensive and defensive skills and BB could just cycle through the youth while keeping a central, experienced spine. They could also cycle though one of the strikers for a youth as late-game subs.

jloome
02-28-2022, 02:56 PM
Report today says Criscito is signed and has been released to Toronto by Genoa, so could be playing for us early in March.

https://www.numero-diez.com/il-toronto-pesca-ancora-dalla-serie-a-ce-gia-la-firma/

Webdogg
02-28-2022, 03:48 PM
After watching Salcedo, I’m convinced Cristcito will be a huge signing. Can’t have enough higher end CB.

MikeForbes
02-28-2022, 03:51 PM
After watching Salcedo, I’m convinced Cristcito will be a huge signing. Can’t have enough higher end CB.

We would legitimately have the best passing CB duo in MLS.

jloome
02-28-2022, 04:20 PM
I suspect they'll play him wide a bit, too, to give Shaff more time to learn and adjust without always being in the deep end.

JMR made team of the week.

https://www.torontofc.ca/news/jahkeele-marshall-rutty-named-to-week-1-mls-team-of-the-week

Bobo
02-28-2022, 04:56 PM
Just thinking, but could TFC run a 3-5-2 for the season, using the WB spots for the kids to develop? It would help them develop both their offensive and defensive skills and BB could just cycle through the youth while keeping a central, experienced spine. They could also cycle though one of the strikers for a youth as late-game subs.


I definitely think it's a possibility, but Insigne at striker really isn't ideal. He's Serie A's biggest xG underperformer. Despite being known for his trademark curler, he's not a finisher. And he's lightweight.

nick.mastro
02-28-2022, 06:15 PM
I heard Criscito has been suffering from injuries all year, and won’t be fully healthy until earliest end of March

Webdogg
02-28-2022, 06:28 PM
I heard Criscito has been suffering from injuries all year, and won’t be fully healthy until earliest end of March

An 80% healthy Criscito could be better than a 100% healthy Mavinga. I’ve always been a fan of Mavinga due to his recovery speed but after Saturday, I’m afraid that asset is no longer something to count on.

Bobo
03-01-2022, 12:57 PM
Criscito was arguably Italy's best left-back once upon a time (albeit during the Azzurri's lowest point). He still could be a useful player, but this is a 35-year-old who's missed most of the season. The driving force behind this transfer is likely his friendship with Insigne. Becoming a defensive catalyst would almost be a bonus.

Here's an interview he did in 2018, where he stresses the importance of his family and his pride for how "international" his children are. Have to assume that played a big role in his decision to come to Canada. Clearly has genuine affection for Genoa, so terminating his contract would suggest he really wanted TFC, or at least a new experience.

(The Russia bits haven't aged well, but at least he should be fine during our colder months.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6uKrgTvjlg

Joe Kool
03-01-2022, 02:42 PM
How will the captain of Genoa and the captain of Napoli get along with the captain of TFC.....hopefully not all trying to lead in different directions :)

jloome
03-01-2022, 05:07 PM
How will the captain of Genoa and the captain of Napoli get along with the captain of TFC.....hopefully not all trying to lead in different directions :)

They know him from Chievo and Roma, and he speaks fluent Italian, so probably pretty well.

ag futbol
03-01-2022, 05:11 PM
An 80% healthy Criscito could be better than a 100% healthy Mavinga. I’ve always been a fan of Mavinga due to his recovery speed but after Saturday, I’m afraid that asset is no longer something to count on.
Yes, I do worry a bit. By all means Chris is a loyal guy and a good ambassador for the club. But, it looks like Bradley will not be tolerating the adventures of Chris Mavinga on the ball and unless he gets a bit more consistent positionally, his starting spot is at risk.

MikeForbes
03-01-2022, 09:52 PM
Mimmo Criscito should be announced soon.

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1498821459334074373?s=20&t=nAy30WF2vKI5Ny4CduCNoA

Yuushalinsky
03-01-2022, 10:18 PM
leadership will be in no short supply on this team, and as a bonus we'll have a great mentor for the two youngsters who might need it the most in new roles.

Welcome to Mimmo Criscito in a few hours or days.

Webdogg
03-01-2022, 11:06 PM
Our PK will be outstanding. Poz is like option 3 at best.

Yuushalinsky
03-01-2022, 11:09 PM
Our PK will be outstanding. Poz is like option 3 at best.

Only the Tiraggiro man is clearly better - I still think Poz is #2, Jimenez is pretty good but not great and I can't think of anyone else other than Criscito who would even be debatable.

MikeForbes
03-02-2022, 01:00 AM
I was just imagining the trio of Insigne, Poz and Criscito standing over a free kick just outside the box. Sean Johnson is already taking a shot of rum just thinking about it.

Mr. Inbetween
03-02-2022, 06:18 AM
leadership will be in no short supply on this team, and as a bonus we'll have a great mentor for the two youngsters who might need it the most in new roles.

Welcome to Mimmo Criscito in a few hours or days.


Our PK will be outstanding. Poz is like option 3 at best.


I was just imagining the trio of Insigne, Poz and Criscito standing over a free kick just outside the box. Sean Johnson is already taking a shot of rum just thinking about it.
:D :grouphug: :party::stogey::drunk:

Lil'John
03-02-2022, 10:57 PM
Only the Tiraggiro man is clearly better - I still think Poz is #2, Jimenez is pretty good but not great and I can't think of anyone else other than Criscito who would even be debatable.

This season almost all Insigne's goals have been PKs.

Red CB Toronto
03-03-2022, 12:37 AM
Not surprising especially after an announced loan to Pacific fell through. Luke was unlikely going to any real playing time here and in my eyes was never seen in the same light in terms of their future like JMR, Nelson, Okello and Priso. Was really only signed last year out of necessity.

https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/1499094384658235393?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1499094384658235393%7Ctwgr% 5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fnortherntribune.ca%2Ffc-edmonton-luke-singh-loan%2F

Mr. Inbetween
03-03-2022, 01:40 AM
This was already mentioned yesterday, framed much better by, and discussed, with others.
I believe that banter was moderated and appropriately deleted because it occurred in the wrong thread.
The suggestion made was that Richie Laryea is not happy and may now want out of Nottingham Forest with a return to TFC/MLS.
Perhaps due to his lack of pitch time; often not even making their bench.

Story broke by OneSoccer - Andi Petrillo
https://onesoccer.ca/a/could-richie-laryea-return-on-loan-to-toronto-fc-from-nottingham-forest-2022-epl-mls
(https://onesoccer.ca/a/could-richie-laryea-return-on-loan-to-toronto-fc-from-nottingham-forest-2022-epl-mls)
Andi dropping The Knowledge.
Solid history of Work, Media and of course current Personal connects to TFC.
Very interesting; implications?
Should TFC still hold interest or have any will and the ability; budget/cap wise to engage, re:allocation cost?

With our luck, Richie gets picked up by TFCII, ahem, LAG!
I suspect they are among the few others ahead of us on the latest allocation list.

Mr. Inbetween
03-03-2022, 01:54 AM
This season almost all Insigne's goals have been PKs.

Yes, a detail to be highlighted and should be noted.
I suspect that is why Bobo among others may be suggesting Insigne at a Striker role may not be an ideal option.
Also, IIRC and for what it is worth, Criscito currently shares a similar goal situation.

Webdogg
03-03-2022, 10:00 AM
No interest on a Laryea return for me. He choose his path and just because the grass actually wasn’t greener at NF doesn’t mean TFC should divert from the current group. Run out the kids we have now at RB/LB and see where it goes.

Ultra & Proud
03-03-2022, 10:50 AM
Yes, a detail to be highlighted and should be noted.
I suspect that is why Bobo among others may be suggesting Insigne at a Striker role may not be an ideal option.
Also, IIRC and for what it is worth, Criscito currently shares a similar goal situation.

True but that's mostly expected from a player that is soley a winger and even moreso for a defender.

That being said, I wouldn't use Insigne as a striker. Maybe a supporting striker but why move him around? Use him where he works best and is most used to. We have time to sign a CF and even if we didn't JJ is probably good enough for 2022.

Joe Kool
03-03-2022, 11:04 AM
No interest on a Laryea return for me. He choose his path and just because the grass actually wasn’t greener at NF doesn’t mean TFC should divert from the current group. Run out the kids we have now at RB/LB and see where it goes.

If it is true that he wants to come back I really don't get where his head is at because why give up so easy. It takes time to work your way into a lineup and build the trust of the new coach and demonstrate your worth. Unless he thought his resume puts him in the starting lineup straight away. If so he is a little bit delusional about how things work. I would think he would have learned the whole work your way up thing with his experience in Orlando then coming here for a trial before making the starting lineup eventually.

JoeBackyard
03-03-2022, 11:10 AM
No interest on a Laryea return for me. He choose his path and just because the grass actually wasn’t greener at NF doesn’t mean TFC should divert from the current group. Run out the kids we have now at RB/LB and see where it goes.

Something is surely strange that he has no appearance on the field whatsoever and only sat on the bench on 2 occasions since his signing. Could be some buyer remorse here. Anyhow, lets see how the kids perform in the ensuing months.

Ultra & Proud
03-03-2022, 11:12 AM
If it is true that he wants to come back I really don't get where his head is at because why give up so easy. It takes time to work your way into a lineup and build the trust of the new coach and demonstrate your worth. Unless he thought his resume puts him in the starting lineup straight away. If so he is a little bit delusional about how things work. I would think he would have learned the whole work your way up thing with his experience in Orlando then coming here for a trial before making the starting lineup eventually.
Much like a lot of international players out there I suspect a lot of it is due to him wanting to be in solid form for Qatar.

Joe Kool
03-03-2022, 11:17 AM
Much like a lot of international players out there I suspect a lot of it is due to him wanting to be in solid form for Qatar.

True that is the added factor to consider. I am sure you are probably correct but was never going to be easy for him to have it all after just completing a transfer. Bad timing maybe. But he has only been there for a matter of weeks. Qatar is in Nov. Maybe Forest could have loaned him to a club that plays in the summer for extra game time. There must be options to be able to stay with his new team now and still get some game fitness.

Mr. Inbetween
03-03-2022, 11:29 AM
No interest on a Laryea return for me. He choose his path and just because the grass actually wasn’t greener at NF doesn’t mean TFC should divert from the current group. Run out the kids we have now at RB/LB and see where it goes.

:bigear:

For now, a dilemma for me.

Mr. Inbetween
03-03-2022, 12:07 PM
True but that's mostly expected from a player that is soley a winger and even moreso for a defender.

That being said, I wouldn't use Insigne as a striker. Maybe a supporting striker but why move him around? Use him where he works best and is most used to. We have time to sign a CF and even if we didn't JJ is probably good enough for 2022.

To clarify, I share and am in agreement with your and Bobo's assessments on Insigne and Criscito.

JJ is the de-facto go to striker for now until an MD or AB arrives.
He is the single striker in any such formation or can act as a duel striker or slot to RW(/LW) in others when Akinola is ready or they decide to play Perruzza.

rydermike
03-03-2022, 12:28 PM
Luke Singh officially loaned to FC Edmonton in the Canadian Premier League

Canary10
03-03-2022, 12:39 PM
True that is the added factor to consider. I am sure you are probably correct but was never going to be easy for him to have it all after just completing a transfer. Bad timing maybe. But he has only been there for a matter of weeks. Qatar is in Nov. Maybe Forest could have loaned him to a club that plays in the summer for extra game time. There must be options to be able to stay with his new team now and still get some game fitness.

I think if he's still not in the plans next season when Spence (who is the first choice wing back) will be gone, then something should be done to get him playing time somewhere (for Canada, not TFC's responsibility anymore). Of course by that time JMR might have won his spot, so maybe it won't matter anymore...

Richard
03-03-2022, 12:54 PM
Something is surely strange that he has no appearance on the field whatsoever and only sat on the bench on 2 occasions since his signing. Could be some buyer remorse here. Anyhow, lets see how the kids perform in the ensuing months.

He isn't match fit is my guess. English teams are just about peaking in terms of fitness and performance. He was already most likely a rotational player at best, then factor in him being in off season mode, and the general increased requirements to play in the championship.

He needs to stop looking for a way out get up to fitness. Then give a good go for next year's PL or Championship season.

jloome
03-03-2022, 12:57 PM
If it is true that he wants to come back I really don't get where his head is at because why give up so easy. It takes time to work your way into a lineup and build the trust of the new coach and demonstrate your worth. Unless he thought his resume puts him in the starting lineup straight away. If so he is a little bit delusional about how things work. I would think he would have learned the whole work your way up thing with his experience in Orlando then coming here for a trial before making the starting lineup eventually.

Forest is reporting today that Laryea has rubbished the claim, suggesting perhaps that an offhand comment has been blown into something it isn't.

https://www.nottinghamforest.news/2022/03/03/report-about-forest-man-richie-laryea-rubbished-by-bronze-medalist/

noxx98
03-03-2022, 01:06 PM
https://twitter.com/KaylynKyle/status/1499395350100021257
Kayln Kyle (who was on OneSoccer when they discussed the Richie news) is also saying it isn't true.

jloome
03-03-2022, 01:43 PM
https://twitter.com/KaylynKyle/status/1499395350100021257
Kayln Kyle (who was on OneSoccer when they discussed the Richie news) is also saying it isn't true.

This is Petrillo being a broadcaster, not a journalist, in all likelihood. Richie probably told someone at TFC that he misses playing week in and out and the people here, and that's gone through a couple of degrees of separation and a little homesickness becomes "return to TFC".

Joe Kool
03-03-2022, 02:03 PM
Forest is reporting today that Laryea has rubbished the claim, suggesting perhaps that an offhand comment has been blown into something it isn't.

https://www.nottinghamforest.news/2022/03/03/report-about-forest-man-richie-laryea-rubbished-by-bronze-medalist/

Cool. That is why I lead with "If it is true.." just for that very reason. I had a hard time believing the claim.

mowe
03-03-2022, 02:16 PM
Forest is reporting today that Laryea has rubbished the claim, suggesting perhaps that an offhand comment has been blown into something it isn't.

https://www.nottinghamforest.news/2022/03/03/report-about-forest-man-richie-laryea-rubbished-by-bronze-medalist/
That link has no new reporting. It’s just rehashing Kaylyn Kyle’s tweet and Petrillo’s comments into an article.

We need to be careful with attributing aggregation to original reporting.

So far it’s just Petrillo’s version against Kyle’s tweet.

Mr. Inbetween
03-03-2022, 02:49 PM
Forest is reporting today that Laryea has rubbished the claim, suggesting perhaps that an offhand comment has been blown into something it isn't.

https://www.nottinghamforest.news/2022/03/03/report-about-forest-man-richie-laryea-rubbished-by-bronze-medalist/


https://twitter.com/KaylynKyle/status/1499395350100021257
Kayln Kyle (who was on OneSoccer when they discussed the Richie news) is also saying it isn't true.


This is Petrillo being a broadcaster, not a journalist, in all likelihood. Richie probably told someone at TFC that he misses playing week in and out and the people here, and that's gone through a couple of degrees of separation and a little homesickness becomes "return to TFC".

jloome, this is in general of your sandbox, what is protocol? Am I missing something, what gives?
Did KK just call out a Tweeter for posting a narrative she herself discussed with other colleagues?
One of whom 'broke it', on the very podcast the Tweeter is referencing?
Am I wrong in my understanding?
Shouldn't KK as a journo/broadcaster/pundit be stating, my colleague- AP misspoke, was misinformed, we discussed something not factually correct, etc... ?
Not confirm in her own tweet 'this is a lie' referencing the original Tweet/Tweeter.
Maybe I am misreading the way it is being presented, but to me it is coming across with a kind of attitude implying 'why did you perpetuate this' towards the Tweeter.
She seems to be throwing the Tweeter under the bus and not her colleague Edit or herself!

noxx98
03-03-2022, 03:01 PM
Going back to listen to the OneSoccer Today episode, seems like Kaylyn said it is maybe just some rumblings/frustrations. She mentioned she has a good realtionship with Richie. I'm guessing she reached out to Richie, he said no it's not true and now Kaylyn is sharing that.

The loan move back to TFC was never going to happen anyways. We'd have to give up $600k in GAM for the allocation spot plus take on his salary.

Smokecell
03-03-2022, 03:07 PM
Inbetweener you have that right.

Not much to say other than the KK tweet is unprofessional.

I believe there could ultimately be something to the Laryea rumours, albeit not necessarily coming back here. Not being on the pitch for his club is not good for his CMNT standing.

jloome
03-03-2022, 03:30 PM
jloome, this is in general of your sandbox, what is protocol? Am I missing something, what gives?
Did KK just call out a Tweeter for posting a narrative she herself discussed with other colleagues?
One of whom 'broke it', on the very podcast the Tweeter is referencing?
Am I wrong in my understanding?
Shouldn't KK as a journo/broadcaster/pundit be stating, my colleague- AP misspoke, was misinformed, we discussed something not factually correct, etc... ?
Not confirm in her own tweet 'this is a lie' referencing the original Tweet/Tweeter.
Maybe I am misreading the way it is being presented, but to me it is coming across with a kind of attitude implying 'why did you perpetuate this' towards the Tweeter.
She seems to be throwing the Tweeter under the bus and not her colleague Edit or herself!

Shes chucking Petrillo under the bus but it may be inadvertent if she knows Andi’s source. She’s not considering the appearance of it because she knows Petrillo and knows Andi is aware to whom she referred.

So shes calling out the “tip” as bullshit but missing the implied insult to her coworker, would be
my guess.

JoeBackyard
03-03-2022, 04:36 PM
He isn't match fit is my guess. English teams are just about peaking in terms of fitness and performance. He was already most likely a rotational player at best, then factor in him being in off season mode, and the general increased requirements to play in the championship.

He needs to stop looking for a way out get up to fitness. Then give a good go for next year's PL or Championship season.

Looking at Nottingham's matches in the past month, Laryea last sat on the bench on Feb9th after returning from the National Team break and there's been 3 matches since then when he's not even on the bench. For all the denials, there's something rotten in the state of the Forest.

Webdogg
03-04-2022, 01:10 AM
He isn't match fit is my guess. English teams are just about peaking in terms of fitness and performance. He was already most likely a rotational player at best, then factor in him being in off season mode, and the general increased requirements to play in the championship.

He needs to stop looking for a way out get up to fitness. Then give a good go for next year's PL or Championship season.

Sorry but fitness isn’t the issue. He was perfectly fine fitness wise the week before he joined NF while playing heavy minutes for CMNT. The issue is he simply hasn’t been good enough at practice to have his number called.

PaceyWinger
03-04-2022, 08:17 AM
He's behind players who have the manager's backing at the moment. I don't know why we're looking for some scandal in this. Happens at every club in europe.

Ultra & Proud
03-04-2022, 09:30 AM
Sorry but fitness isn’t the issue. He was perfectly fine fitness wise the week before he joined NF while playing heavy minutes for CMNT. The issue is he simply hasn’t been good enough at practice to have his number called.
This is it and lots of us have TFC/CMNT blinders on again.

I like Richie. I think he is great and definitely offers a lot going forward but he does get caught out a lot and isn't the most defensively responsible FB. I am sure they realize this and are working his defending & defensive awareness up to the level of Championship promotion battle level football.

Canary10
03-04-2022, 10:04 AM
He's behind players who have the manager's backing at the moment. I don't know why we're looking for some scandal in this. Happens at every club in europe.

I think this is it. Djed Spence has been linked to Bayern, Spurs and Arsenal amongst others this summer. He will be a Premier League wingback next year for sure. Richie isn't taking that spot. Begs the question why he went though as he wasn't ever breaking into the first team. Hopefully has the foresight to know it's really about next season for him if he works hard.

Nottingham Forest plays Sheffield United today btw. They're just above them in the table, so this game will be a good sign if Nottingham Forest is for real or a pretender for the playoffs. Also is on Dazn.

notthesun
03-04-2022, 10:51 AM
Good thread here I stumbled across on Laryea and why he's not playing from a Canadian Forrest fan: https://twitter.com/TomasWalker/status/1498874254405910533

I hope things work out for him but this does seem like poor homework done by his agent. 0 appearances this long after a transfer is not normal and not a great sign.

Canary10
03-04-2022, 10:59 AM
Good thread here I stumbled across on Laryea and why he's not playing from a Canadian Forrest fan: https://twitter.com/TomasWalker/status/1498874254405910533

I hope things work out for him but this does seem like poor homework done by his agent. 0 appearances this long after a transfer is not normal and not a great sign.

Yeah I agree with everything he's saying. Lowe has been really solid too. I think this game today will be a real bellweather of whether they have a shot at the playoffs or not. Things may open up for Richie in the last five games or so if they're not realistically in it.

JonO
03-04-2022, 11:15 AM
Yeah I agree with everything he's saying. Lowe has been really solid too. I think this game today will be a real bellweather of whether they have a shot at the playoffs or not. Things may open up for Richie in the last five games or so if they're not realistically in it.
I agree - but it's crazy how tight the race is right now. 5 points separate 5th to 10th and there are still 12 or 13 games left. Lots of points available. Poor timing for Richie. If they were further out, maybe he gets a chance to show what he can do. Would be nice to get him some games, so I don't see a loan for a few months being out of the question, but it's probably better for him to be training over there for the time being...

JoeBackyard
03-04-2022, 11:20 AM
This is it and lots of us have TFC/CMNT blinders on again.

I like Richie. I think he is great and definitely offers a lot going forward but he does get caught out a lot and isn't the most defensively responsible FB. I am sure they realize this and are working his defending & defensive awareness up to the level of Championship promotion battle level football.

This is the most likely explanation at the moment. You being the Nottingham coach will be lionized as the one who elevates this historic team back into the PL. You find out your new purchase cannot remotely contribute nor do you even want to placate the situation as your fan base is focused on the excitement of promotion ... so, this is really nothing to do about nothing.

Canary10
03-04-2022, 11:45 AM
I agree - but it's crazy how tight the race is right now. 5 points separate 5th to 10th and there are still 12 or 13 games left. Lots of points available. Poor timing for Richie. If they were further out, maybe he gets a chance to show what he can do. Would be nice to get him some games, so I don't see a loan for a few months being out of the question, but it's probably better for him to be training over there for the time being...

It's always that tight. People underrate the Championship but it's a serious pressure cooker if you're in and around any of the promotion/playoff spots. You can't drop points or take a game off. At least being in that atmosphere will be good for him.

jloome
03-04-2022, 12:05 PM
Good thread here I stumbled across on Laryea and why he's not playing from a Canadian Forrest fan: https://twitter.com/TomasWalker/status/1498874254405910533

I hope things work out for him but this does seem like poor homework done by his agent. 0 appearances this long after a transfer is not normal and not a great sign.

This guy makes a lot of sense. The other fact to consider is that Forest thought they might lose Spence to a bid in the January window, as he's Middlesbrough's player to sell. When that didn't happen, his chance to impress sort of went out the window.

rydermike
03-04-2022, 12:46 PM
LA Galaxy II signed TFC2 player Dante Campbell. He was in the first team pre-season camp earlier this year. Mike Munoz, TFC2's coach last year, joined LAG so could see the TFC to LAG pipeline continue

https://twitter.com/LatestTFCII/status/1499592769928454157

Canary10
03-04-2022, 02:41 PM
Richie not in the team again. And Lowe isn't starting at left WB either (ineligible to face his parent club). The are playing a midfielder there instead.

jloome
03-04-2022, 03:12 PM
Richie not in the team again. And Lowe isn't starting at left WB either (ineligible to face his parent club). The are playing a midfielder there instead.

Colback has already played there effectively this season so I imagine this falls into the “don’t change what’s working” school of management. But not even on the bench is a worry.

Canary10
03-04-2022, 03:15 PM
Colback has already played there effectively this season so I imagine this falls into the “don’t change what’s working” school of management. But not even on the bench is a worry.

Different midfielder, but yeah. He's clearly not top 2 on either side.

MightyDM
03-04-2022, 06:17 PM
It’s a worry for Richie for sure, that he isn’t even making the bench. He looked game fit for Canada. The most obvious explanation is that the coach doesn’t rate him. The second is that he has a minor injury. The third is they all knew he would not get a look in this year and was a replacement for Spence. That’s a bit odd though. Why wouldn’t he go in the summer of that were the case? Murky and wishing him the best.

James17930
03-04-2022, 06:42 PM
It’s a worry for Richie for sure, that he isn’t even making the bench. He looked game fit for Canada. The most obvious explanation is that the coach doesn’t rate him. The second is that he has a minor injury. The third is they all knew he would not get a look in this year and was a replacement for Spence. That’s a bit odd though. Why wouldn’t he go in the summer of that were the case? Murky and wishing him the best.

If he's healthy you'd think, as a new signing, they'd want to at least get him some minutes somewhere to check him out. But to sign a player for that money and then not even play him is pretty strange.

Graeme
03-04-2022, 09:49 PM
The Canada games are all he's played in 2022, though. Did he attend any preseason with TFC prior to the trade? There was talk during the Canada games that the MLS players were all out of season. I think that's the simplest solution.

jloome
03-05-2022, 02:01 AM
Different midfielder, but yeah. He's clearly not top 2 on either side.

Spence wasn't in doubt; local press were saying Richie might fill in on the left, but noted that Colback had played there before so might be preferred.

Maybe he's just not fit enough; sporadic playing time since November, a high-tempo league where guys go full-out for 90 min. But he can't exactly be wowing them.

portu
03-06-2022, 08:10 AM
I’m not convinced Criscito solves the problems on our backline. Realistically you need a new keeper plus an actual pair of fullbacks.

NotoriousGoonie
03-06-2022, 08:25 AM
I’m not convinced Criscito solves the problems on our backline. Realistically you need a new keeper plus an actual pair of fullbacks.

This💯

JoesphNdo
03-06-2022, 09:32 AM
I honestly think we need a defensive midfielder even more than someone in the backline. Don't get me wrong there's problems back there, too, but they're completely exposed right now

Lil'John
03-06-2022, 10:11 AM
I honestly think we need a defensive midfielder even more than someone in the backline. Don't get me wrong there's problems back there, too, but they're completely exposed right now

Missing Delgado...

Lil'John
03-06-2022, 10:12 AM
This

Criscito is a full back.
I'd take any full back at this stage!

MikeForbes
03-06-2022, 10:21 AM
I bet we get some leaks on some transfer targets this week after that loss yesterday.

Bobo
03-06-2022, 10:27 AM
Well, Porto recently released a right-back, Saravia, who has sniffed the Argentina NT setup.

On the left, I believe Toia, ex RSL and Montreal player, is still without a club.

:idea:

Something has to be done, surely.

Gringo Starr
03-06-2022, 12:00 PM
Bono is on $450k Q on $275k and neither look like a starter for a championship quality team. Mavinga is close to 900k and looks a shadow of what he once was. I don’t see where we shed these salaries anytime soon that allows us to bring in help in areas we need help in.

Amir.
03-06-2022, 12:09 PM
championship quality team...lol this was a bottom team last year and now rebuilding

jloome
03-06-2022, 12:13 PM
Bono is on $450k Q on $275k and neither look like a starter for a championship quality team. Mavinga is close to 900k and looks a shadow of what he once was. I don’t see where we shed these salaries anytime soon that allows us to bring in help in areas we need help in.

Mavinga played left back for much of his career. He's really good with the ball upfield.

I think we obviously need more bodies; but we also need the new manager to be less stubborn.

Pozuelo offers nothing defensively, most of the time. Move him to the wing, where he played much of his career prior to here, and which in a 433 is an outside-in forward. That's what Insigne's going to be playing, so it makes sense to mirror him on the other wing.

That gives us more going forward and opens up midfield space for a wrecker. Put Priso in as a number six, (as NYRB did with Frankie Amaya, who had EIGHT tackles in that game, double our best output, from Osorio).

Our number two tackler in that game was ... .Ralph Priso, who had three in 11 minutes.

On corners, don't allow two sleight (relatively) wingbacks as our central cover. Even if it was a foul (I think it was), Klymala shoved JMR off the ball and created that break with minimal effort, then Shaff couldn't hold him off long enough for anyone else to recover.

The only value Bradley has right now is as a playmaker, a passer. And Poz's defense is suspect. So we'd be better playing them higher up the pitch where their defensive output is minimized (and I realize one-way players are a luxury these days, but I'm trying to be pragmatic before they sign reinforcements).

-----------Bono/Westburg----------
ChungJMR--O'Neill--Salcedo--MavingaShaff
----------Priso-----Osorio----------
------------BradOkello---------------
Pozuelo-------------------Petrasso
--------------Jimenez

It's not ideal but at least it puts people where they'll be most effective. Half the teams in the league trap now; to have a guy like Pozuelo wide who can beat double teams and allow for overlaps would be helpful. To have a guy with enough speed to cover the backline in Priso would be helpful. Bradley's inability to track back fast enough would be less issue with two guys behind him.

Amir.
03-06-2022, 12:26 PM
osorio who gives away balls left and right leading to chances and goals conceded should now play dm and lose even more dangerous balls...

jloome
03-06-2022, 01:44 PM
osorio who gives away balls left and right leading to chances and goals conceded should now play dm and lose even more dangerous balls...

Osorio had four tackles last night, leading the team and second overall on the pitch after New York's Frankie Amaya.

And although I agree he's got a different skillset from a DM, you'd think that playing as a number 8 pivot is far more dangerous in terms of losing a ball than as a number six, where he's trying to outlet it as quickly as possible.

He lost six balls yesterday because he was overwhelmed in midfield, pressed by two players constantly. If he were playing deeper all the time, he would be outletting it relatively quickly and the chance of being caught flat in possession would be lower, not higher.

Having said that, he'd still effectively be a number eight if we played two back. He'd be the one of the two who goes forward, rather than pivoting that responsibility based on where the ball is, as we tried in vain to do yesterday.

Against a central press, one of them two central mids has to stay back. That would be Priso, in this case, not Osorio.

Red CB Toronto
03-06-2022, 04:02 PM
Looks like July now, wonder if he had second thoughts after seeing yesterdays game? I can respect the fact he wants to stick around and help his mates in their relegation battle.

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1500570132145397763

Bobo
03-06-2022, 04:03 PM
EDIT - Red CB Toronto beat me to it. :redface:

---

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1500570132145397763 (https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1500570132145397763)

Criscito much have watched TFC's performance on that joke of a pitch and said, "Uhhh, maybe later."

Fab says the deal will now be discussed for the summer. At this point, forget it, give that money to someone who can help now. TFC is in all sorts of trouble on the wings.

MikeForbes
03-06-2022, 04:07 PM
Lol.

MikeForbes
03-06-2022, 04:10 PM
This has been a genuinely depressing weekend. Time to get to work on something else for Manning and Bradley.

portu
03-06-2022, 04:21 PM
Another deal fumbled. Surprise surprise

Gringo Starr
03-06-2022, 04:38 PM
championship quality team...lol this was a bottom team last year and now rebuilding

That is the goal though a championship, this is MLS the turn around time in a rebuild is not long, Lorenzo is already aging the window will be short with him we need to sort other things out. It is obvious that Bono is what he is and IMO he is not someone you are going to ride to a cup. As much as I like Q he is 35. We should have a better keeper option or looking for one. That was the point I was making

reggie
03-06-2022, 04:41 PM
Another deal fumbled. Surprise surprise
maybe we got lucky,do we really need a 35 old injury phone coffee buddy for LI

Bobo
03-06-2022, 04:44 PM
maybe we got lucky,do we really need a 35 old injury phone coffee buddy for LI

We sorta do, unfortunately.

JoeBackyard
03-06-2022, 04:48 PM
Missing Delgado...
No we don't... No one misses his season long frown, bad body language and overall poor play.

reggie
03-06-2022, 04:57 PM
We sorta do, unfortunately.
we deff could use him has a drew moor type to settle the back for now,but no point waiting for july,spend the million on something else so many holes right now.bring lawrence in since it looks like shaff is injured

Gringo Starr
03-06-2022, 05:03 PM
Mavinga played left back for much of his career. He's really good with the ball upfield.

I think we obviously need more bodies; but we also need the new manager to be less stubborn.

Pozuelo offers nothing defensively, most of the time. Move him to the wing, where he played much of his career prior to here, and which in a 433 is an outside-in forward. That's what Insigne's going to be playing, so it makes sense to mirror him on the other wing.

That gives us more going forward and opens up midfield space for a wrecker. Put Priso in as a number six, (as NYRB did with Frankie Amaya, who had EIGHT tackles in that game, double our best output, from Osorio).

Our number two tackler in that game was ... .Ralph Priso, who had three in 11 minutes.

On corners, don't allow two sleight (relatively) wingbacks as our central cover. Even if it was a foul (I think it was), Klymala shoved JMR off the ball and created that break with minimal effort, then Shaff couldn't hold him off long enough for anyone else to recover.

The only value Bradley has right now is as a playmaker, a passer. And Poz's defense is suspect. So we'd be better playing them higher up the pitch where their defensive output is minimized (and I realize one-way players are a luxury these days, but I'm trying to be pragmatic before they sign reinforcements).

-----------Bono/Westburg----------
ChungJMR--O'Neill--Salcedo--MavingaShaff
----------Priso-----Osorio----------
------------BradOkello---------------
Pozuelo-------------------Petrasso
--------------Jimenez

It's not ideal but at least it puts people where they'll be most effective. Half the teams in the league trap now; to have a guy like Pozuelo wide who can beat double teams and allow for overlaps would be helpful. To have a guy with enough speed to cover the backline in Priso would be helpful. Bradley's inability to track back fast enough would be less issue with two guys behind him.

I like it. We need to do something to get more out of Mavinga, LB makes sense. Would give Shaff more time to grow into/learn the position as well. I could see Priso being a big help to JMR as he is already sound defensively and looks like he can handle the physical stuff. The one thing I have noticed with JMR this year is how often he gets pushed around and shoved to the ground, he will improve just by getting more strength and weight on his frame

BB seems pretty high on Nelson so I could see him going with Nelson over Petrasso

Canary10
03-06-2022, 05:15 PM
I’d love to know where the heck Kemar Lawrence is. He’d be helpful right now. I wish they’d update that situation.

ag futbol
03-06-2022, 05:16 PM
Crazy idea: encourage Lawrence to rejoin the team and play him on the left side of a back three. He was the best “centre back” we had on our team last year and he plays the same spot for Jamaica.

Realize it’s probably not going to happen but I can dream I guess.

leedsandTFC
03-06-2022, 05:23 PM
genuinely believe criscito watched the game yesterday, saw the state of both the squad, the weather and the pitch and changed his mind.

gracos
03-06-2022, 05:36 PM
dont know if we should go after Criscito anymore than, if he isnt dedicated now what makes me think he will be in 4-6 months

MikeForbes
03-06-2022, 05:41 PM
I'd welcome Lawrence back with open arms.

TFC/Everton
03-06-2022, 07:52 PM
This has been a terrible weekend for the club. First we suffer one of the worst home defeats in club history, then one of our biggest offseason targets bails at the last minute.

Can somebody explain to me why Jamaican International Kemar Lawrence isn't even getting a look? I Declare Shenanigans! Unacceptable to keep a player of his quality out while our defenders are getting destroyed on the wings.

I also hate to say this because he is an absolute club legend, but Michael Bradley looked a bit past it this weekend.

Is Bill Manning good at this or has he been lucky to have Garth, Bez, and Vanney to over the years?

los sonadores
03-06-2022, 07:52 PM
Crazy idea: encourage Lawrence to rejoin the team and play him on the left side of a back three. He was the best “centre back” we had on our team last year and he plays the same spot for Jamaica.

Realize it’s probably not going to happen but I can dream I guess.

It seems a bit crazy that Lawrence is not playing either there or at left back for us. (I get that BB wants very forward thinking full backs though.)

I’d love to see Mavinga at left back or left wing back but when he was signed he said he came here because he wanted to play centre half. Otherwise, he might still be in Russia or France. Don’t see him doing it willingly.

los sonadores
03-06-2022, 08:03 PM
This has been a terrible weekend for the club. First we suffer one of the worst home defeats in club history, then one of our biggest offseason targets bails at the last minute.

Can somebody explain to me why Jamaican International Kemar Lawrence isn't even getting a look? I Declare Shenanigans! Unacceptable to keep a player of his quality out while our defenders are getting destroyed on the wings.

I also hate to say this because he is an absolute club legend, but Michael Bradley looked a bit past it this weekend.

Is Bill Manning good at this or has he been lucky to have Garth, Bez, and Vanney to over the years?

Bradley is our Sporting Director. Isn’t it the first time he’s held this role? Gotta be different than being ‘only’ the manger and consulting with a GM on signings. Also quite different than the recruiting role of a manager on a national team. He’s probably overwhelmed at the moment. Manager and Sporting Director is a huge thing to step into, late, in a bottom of the table club rebuilding in a big way. Not only rebuilding but a different philosophy as well. We’ve never relied on our academy guys this much. Probably need to be patient both with the kids and with Bradley.

Mr. Inbetween
03-06-2022, 08:51 PM
genuinely believe criscito watched the game yesterday, saw the state of both the squad, the weather and the pitch and changed his mind.

Oh I don't know. IIRC wasn't he originally and always supposed to come in July until very recently? I guess Manning's visit to Italy to try the personal press and change Criscito's mind about timeline failed. I think Fabrizio Romano, who some others consider football's transfer pope, simply got the latest with Criscito apparently wrong. No different than Andi Petrillo with Laryea. Only Romano walked it back respectfully, in a savvy social media frame and position to his benefit while Kaylan Kyle threw everyone under the bus to do it.

Smokecell
03-06-2022, 08:51 PM
Realistically Criscito is doing to TFC what TFC allegedly did to Giovinco, ironically both falling on Manning.

At this point forget Criscito - the team has been clear they want guys who are all in.

PizzaEatingYeti
03-07-2022, 04:09 AM
dont know if we should go after Criscito anymore than, if he isnt dedicated now what makes me think he will be in 4-6 months


Realistically Criscito is doing to TFC what TFC allegedly did to Giovinco, ironically both falling on Manning.

At this point forget Criscito - the team has been clear they want guys who are all in.

These, x 100 times!

Mr. Inbetween
03-07-2022, 04:49 AM
Realistically Criscito is doing to TFC what TFC allegedly did to Giovinco, ironically both falling on Manning.

At this point forget Criscito - the team has been clear they want guys who are all in.

Unable to disagree with the take of your first assertion; Manning likely again at the fulcrum.
In respect to your second statement, not sure it is a question of being all in; not sure if that thought is fair.
Wouldn't you sort of have to then apply that principle to Insigne as well?
Neither are playing for a middling team; for which I could share such sentiment.
Each are at the opposite ends of the league spectrum and committed to one's own club; Relegation and Championship Title.
I do not know if I would want a player to cut and run in such a comparable manner and situation; if their even is one in MLS.
Genoa might still stave off doom; unlikely, yet possible.
They have the luck or misfortune of drawing a lot of their recent matches.
There is still some hope, albeit a very slim chance and the window is certainly closing fast.
I cannot fault Criscito for that decision.

Section 223
03-07-2022, 05:02 AM
Unable to disagree with the take of your first assertion; Manning likely again at the fulcrum.
In respect to your second statement, not sure it is a question of being all in; not sure if that thought is fair.
Wouldn't you sort of have to then apply that principle to Insigne as well?
Neither are playing for a middling team; for which I could share such sentiment.
Each are at the opposite ends of the league spectrum and committed to one's own club; Relegation and Championship Title.
I do not know if I would want a player to cut and run in such a comparable manner and situation; if their even is one in MLS.
Genoa might still stave off doom; unlikely, yet possible.
They have the luck or misfortune of drawing a lot of their recent matches.
There is still some hope, albeit a very slim chance and the window is certainly closing fast.
I cannot fault Criscito for that decision.
Very much agree with you Mr in between Criscito’s not running away from a relegation battle in Italy to join a team where coach Bradley is managing this squad like we are still in preseason.

Smokecell
03-07-2022, 07:46 AM
Unable to disagree with the take of your first assertion; Manning likely again at the fulcrum.
In respect to your second statement, not sure it is a question of being all in; not sure if that thought is fair.
Wouldn't you sort of have to then apply that principle to Insigne as well?
Neither are playing for a middling team; for which I could share such sentiment.
Each are at the opposite ends of the league spectrum and committed to one's own club; Relegation and Championship Title.
I do not know if I would want a player to cut and run in such a comparable manner and situation; if their even is one in MLS.
Genoa might still stave off doom; unlikely, yet possible.
They have the luck or misfortune of drawing a lot of their recent matches.
There is still some hope, albeit a very slim chance and the window is certainly closing fast.
I cannot fault Criscito for that decision.

Not saying that I disagree with any of this, but the key difference between Insigne and Criscito is having an (alleged) agreement to join ASAP.

portu
03-07-2022, 07:54 AM
I think there’s a little bit of an over-correction going on with the forum in trying not to get inflammatory with criticism. Nobody, including me, expected this club to title contend this year, but being competitive is more than reasonable. With that, it is not crazy to suggest that the club’s inability to get deals over the line and organise the roster to be competitive by now is completely unacceptable.

ag futbol
03-07-2022, 10:53 AM
I think there’s a little bit of an over-correction going on with the forum in trying not to get inflammatory with criticism. Nobody, including me, expected this club to title contend this year, but being competitive is more than reasonable. With that, it is not crazy to suggest that the club’s inability to get deals over the line and organise the roster to be competitive by now is completely unacceptable.
Well, I think this is a function of who is doing the moves and what they have to deal with.

Last year, we had a manager and GM both with dubious track records. The coach had hair-brained ideas that were poorly articulated and executed. The GM sat on his ass until forever and when he did sign people, they were awful.

This year, someone came in and picked up a club in shambles. They had to jettison people because of personalities, bad contracts, and in some cases, I would assume, no desire to play here any longer. They shed pretty much all the deadweight and ran out of time to relaoad. But we still signed a marquee DP, a very serviceable striker, a starting CB and a more reliable backup option.

I am not overly offended because we appear to be planning for the long run. The fact we’re potentially destined to underperform until the summer window, is just the price we’ll pay to (hopefully) get it right.

Initial B
03-07-2022, 11:14 AM
I'm fine seeing BB working with what he has through mid-May, then having a better idea of where the gaps are and getting Manning to purchase players in the summer transfer window. We didn't seriously think this team was going to be in any sort of contention before Insigne got here, did we?

Canary10
03-07-2022, 11:54 AM
We could be out there trying to plug holes with Dom Dwyer type signings. I'm glad we haven't hemmed ourselves in financially to get what we really need when it's available (summer transfer window is always better than the winter). If the team was run like the past few years, we'd have Dwyer, Mullins and Kei Kamara up front, a midfield anchored by Warren Creavalle and Collen Warner and Dan Gargan at both left and right fullback, with no financially flexibility to change it until 2024.

jabbronies
03-07-2022, 11:57 AM
I'm fine seeing BB working with what he has through mid-May, then having a better idea of where the gaps are and getting Manning to purchase players in the summer transfer window. We didn't seriously think this team was going to be in any sort of contention before Insigne got here, did we?

This is what I expected. We give the kids a few months to prove they are worthy to continue in the position. If not we have a window in July to address major concerns.

It's hard to say what will happen because the sample size is just too small to really say anything.

One thing I can see happening in July is JMR and Petrasso fighting for one of the WB spots and Shaffelberg playing second fiddle to someone we bring in to fill the other WB spot. I just don't think Shaf can make this transition. He just looks completely out of his element on defence. Something I'm only able to see live at BMO was Salcedo being forced to over manage him all game in every scenario possible on Saturday.

When/If JMR gets sold at the end of the year, hopefully Petrasso would have solidified a spot for 2023. Shaff would end up dropping in depth chart.

Red CB Toronto
03-07-2022, 01:16 PM
Wonder if there is any short term help the Reds could pick up out of Russia now that FIFA is letting players suspend their contracts until June.

https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/football-news/forest-russia-ukraine-fifa-appeal-6767428

Gogon
03-07-2022, 01:31 PM
One thing I can see happening in July is JMR and Petrasso fighting for one of the WB spots and Shaffelberg playing second fiddle to someone we bring in to fill the other WB spot.

I do wonder about this. I have noticed a few comments seeming to suggest wingbacks are interchangeable from left to right. But this isn’t really true. You can’t play an effective wingback role on your off foot. Sure, further up the pitch inverted wingers can be effective, but on the back line it doesn’t work. In the past we played Richie and Auro at left back a little. But that was out of both a lack of options, and a way to get them both on the pitch. Neither were very effective on the left. We need fullbacks who are fit for purpose. Petrasso looked promising (arguably better than Shaff based on a tiny sample). But I can’t really see Petrasso and JMR competing for the same minutes.

For me, this further points to portu's comments about roster construction.

ag futbol
03-07-2022, 01:36 PM
While I’m broadly behind the idea of playing the kids, I would say the following needs to be adjusted:

Too many left side players, we’re never going to be able to develop them all, especially with LI arriving in the summer. One of Shaff, Nelson, or Petrasso is probably better developing in a different team.

Priso should be getting more time and Okello needs to play with more of a point (a defined role and a clear measuring stick for performances).

We almost certain need 1-2 acquisitions on the right side. JMR likely to get sold, Kerr still of an unknown quality (maybe better off playing MLS next Pro), Achara not overly convincing.

jabbronies
03-07-2022, 01:37 PM
I do wonder about this. I have noticed a few comments seeming to suggest wingbacks are interchangeable from left to right. But this isn’t really true. You can’t play an effective wingback role on your off foot. Sure, further up the pitch inverted wingers can be effective, but on the back line it doesn’t work. In the past we played Richie and Auro at left back a little. But that was out of both a lack of options, and a way to get them both on the pitch. Neither were very effective on the left. We need fullbacks who are fit for purpose. Petrasso looked promising (arguably better than Shaff based on a tiny sample). But I can’t really see Petrasso and JMR competing for the same minutes.

For me, this further points to portu's comments about roster construction.


At one point towards the end of the first half I noticed Petrasso switched sides. TBH I can't say if anything differed in his play because it caught me off guard. As I said, sample size is too small, but maybe Petrasso is the one that can easily make that switch of sides? So TFC go get a prime LWB and the fight is on the right?

Gogon
03-07-2022, 02:03 PM
At one point towards the end of the first half I noticed Petrasso switched sides. TBH I can't say if anything differed in his play because it caught me off guard. As I said, sample size is too small, but maybe Petrasso is the one that can easily make that switch of sides? So TFC go get a prime LWB and the fight is on the right?

Yes he did for sure. I noticed that too. But keep in mind, he was playing up the pitch as a winger at that time. Shaff was still on. And so yes, wingers can do that because they can cut in (a la Insigne, Vela, etc). You’ll notice sometimes for the CMNT Phonzie switches to the right too. But only as a winger up the pitch, never as a right wingback. I will say, I noticed Petrasso made a few nice touches with his right, but he’s still clearly a left-footed player and if his future is at wingback, then he’s destined for the left side of the pitch. (Wingbacks need to be able to slide tackle with their outside foot because you’re defending against a guy who is trying to go around you on the outside and hit in a cross. It’s really difficult to slide tackle with your off foot. The brain just doesn’t want to do it. I don’t believe there is a top fullback in world football playing on their off foot, and I can’t think of one ever actually.)

Again based on the tiny sample, but Petrasso certainly seems to be a versatile player. If he can offer something on the right wing, that is actually a pretty big deal. As many have pointed out on here, we're a bit thin on the right. No one seems content with Achara and Kerr. So Petrasso's cameo out there might have been one of the more encouraging things we saw on the weekend.

jabbronies
03-07-2022, 02:16 PM
Yes he did for sure. I noticed that too. But keep in mind, he was playing up the pitch as a winger at that time. Shaff was still on. And so yes, wingers can do that because they can cut in (a la Insigne, Vela, etc). You’ll notice sometimes for the CMNT Phonzie switches to the right too. But only as a winger up the pitch, never as a right wingback. I will say, I noticed Petrasso made a few nice touches with his right, but he’s still clearly a left-footed player and if his future is at wingback, then he’s destined for the left side of the pitch. (Wingbacks need to be able to slide tackle with their outside foot because you’re defending against a guy who is trying to go around you on the outside and hit in a cross. It’s really difficult to slide tackle with your off foot. The brain just doesn’t want to do it. I don’t believe there is a top fullback in world football playing on their off foot, and I can’t think of one ever actually.)

I've played as a right footer on the left and it's do-able. This post sums up my experience on this:
https://runningtheshowblog.wordpress.com/2021/04/18/tactical-analysis-inverted-full-backs-wrong-footed-tactics/

But it's true, you need a good midfield partner in the middle to work with you on this. Also - my experience isn't at a top level so there was a lot more errors in positioning for me to take advantage of. With that being said, neither is MLS if you are comparing it to world football. I think it could work for Petrasso in the short term and hopefully when we build out the roster a bit more, he is good enough to stick around and maybe inherit that left side again.

too many moving parts to consider though - Criscito actually being signed, if he's not, maybe they do look at buying someone on the right, but only after JMR gets sold. that gives Petrasso the left.

Anyways, all just hypothetical chatter and very early to say anything is for certain.

MikeForbes
03-07-2022, 03:49 PM
Could lead to some opportunities to get some good players in.

https://twitter.com/goal/status/1500931345400451073?s=20&t=5bOSrjdRQlRyZ_YUAt_AZg

Bobo
03-07-2022, 04:11 PM
I'm fine seeing BB working with what he has through mid-May, then having a better idea of where the gaps are and getting Manning to purchase players in the summer transfer window. We didn't seriously think this team was going to be in any sort of contention before Insigne got here, did we?

Perhaps I'm expecting too much of a professional club to employ a full-back or two. Even if the stars align and Shaff and JMR instantly figure out a brand new position, where's the depth?

jloome
03-07-2022, 04:56 PM
Our need for a DM has never been more clear. Mlssoccer.com's analysis is pretty much bang on.

https://www.mlssoccer.com/news/here-s-to-the-4-4-2-quakes-comeback-defies-logic-lots-to-like-about-the-galaxy-e

ag futbol
03-08-2022, 12:32 PM
^ I thought watching the Montreal game provided an interesting contras of midfields. They are flawed too but in different ways (although we both play a slow central mid who sometimes gets exposed). That said, Nancy has fingered out some things with his roster we could learn from.

- For a team that wants to play out of the back having a ball paying keeper is a must. Add it to the list of reasons why Bono is no-go.

- Kone does a job for Montreal nobody on TFC is doing currently. Drop deep, provide an passing option and then move forward with pace. Nothing fancy offensively but he does cover ground and make late runs into the box. Maybe this is a good model for Okello who badly needs a purpose.

- Mihailovic plays a key role in moving the attack forward. The pace and the willingness to be direct are sorely missed on TFC. Sadly my secondary conclusion is that Pozuelo is a serious under performer.

Ultra & Proud
03-08-2022, 12:39 PM
^ I thought watching the Montreal game provided an interesting contras of midfields. They are flawed too but in different ways. That said, Nancy has fingered out some things with his roster we could learn from.

- For a team that wants to play out of the back having a ball paying keeper is a must. Add it to the list of reasons why Bono is no-go.

- Kone does a job for Montreal nobody on TFC is doing currently. Drop deep, provide an passing option and then move forward with pace. Nothing fancy offensively but he does cover ground and make late runs into the box. Maybe this is a good model for Okello who badly needs a purpose.

- Mihailovic plays a key role in moving the attack forward. The pace and the willingness to be direct are sorely missed on TFC. Sadly my secondary conclusion is that Pozuelo is a serious under performer.
These are all good observations. Only thing is that Okello doesn't look to me like a player to move forward with pace and dribble. He is usually a hold it for 2 seconds and sideways pass it player. I would say use Priso as this but really that's what JMR should be doing. Minus us grooming him for sale as a FB, this is exactly the role he should be learning and doing.

Okello might be able to be groomed into a DM but his passing range and vision need to be extended.

ag futbol
03-08-2022, 01:07 PM
These are all good observations. Only thing is that Okello doesn't look to me like a player to move forward with pace and dribble. He is usually a hold it for 2 seconds and sideways pass it player. I would say use Priso as this but really that's what JMR should be doing. Minus us grooming him for sale as a FB, this is exactly the role he should be learning and doing.

Okello might be able to be groomed into a DM but his passing range and vision need to be extended.
I agree with you. Okello is not going to do anything fancy taking guys 1v1 or provide killer final balls. However, I think those long strides and ability to cover ground could do wonders.

He just has to pickup the ball cover ground and then lay it off. Think Delgado but much faster. That’s basically what Kone is doing for Montreal.

Amir.
03-08-2022, 01:37 PM
Montreal is not an example to go by...they have been garbage and Nancy is making a lot of bad moves...Kone is not all that either...people just like to hype a 19yo who scored in his first game but in every game hes had really bad periods

R.O.
03-08-2022, 02:24 PM
https://twitter.com/Total_TFC/status/1501273310306385930?s=20&t=P0jO1A5-e1eI4XXbcUdupA

MikeForbes
03-08-2022, 02:31 PM
Is signing an old Italian center back from Genoa that big of a priority?

OgtheDim
03-08-2022, 02:37 PM
The word cheat is not exactly something I'm sure I want to hear come from opposing fans.....

Gogon
03-08-2022, 02:49 PM
Is signing an old Italian center back from Genoa that big of a priority?

OMG. This guys was banned 26 months for match-fixing. Plus he's a 36 yr old centre back deemed expendable by the worst team in the league. Um, yeah. I thought we dodged a bullet there with Criscito's change of heart. But this? Who is running this team? D'Amico? Oh wait...

MikeForbes
03-08-2022, 03:16 PM
The guy with the match fixing history coming to a country where you can't turn right without having a sports betting ad shoved down your throat sounds ideal.

Smokecell
03-08-2022, 03:22 PM
This is another terrible idea.

Unacceptable that we are 2 games in and the roster is in the state it is. Yet again caught pants down after Criscito jumped ship. How does this keep happening?

The season may be young, but come playoff time and you need the 4/5 points to squeak in, these dropped points matter!

ag futbol
03-08-2022, 03:32 PM
Let’s pump the breaks here. Could just as easily be a lazy floated rumour with no actual interest from TFC

Ultra & Proud
03-08-2022, 03:35 PM
I was pretty happy that we fell out of the Criscito sweepstakes that included only us because nobody else would want a 35 year old FB but Masiello is even worse.

It is what it is, we got our one Italian player to appeal to a desired demographic. If we really, really need another then just toss max TAM at Destro. At least he's alright and be done with it. Trotting out the youth movement now only to switch it all over to their parents in July makes no sense if there's a real serious interest in squad building. I'd rather ride the youth and take my 4-1 drubbings than revert to MLS 2.0 roster building.

Ultra & Proud
03-08-2022, 03:36 PM
Let’s pump the breaks here. Could just as easily be a lazy floated rumour with no actual interest from TFC
Could be another agent pumping tires knowing his ancient client will be out work when Genoa goes down.

Joe Kool
03-08-2022, 03:48 PM
Since Bill went to Italy and we have Insigne that announced as coming and since the whole Criscito thing was legit but fell through, TFC will probably be linked with non stop rumours with every Italian player not in favour with their team or coming out of contract.

Gogon
03-08-2022, 05:45 PM
Could be another agent pumping tires knowing his ancient client will be out work when Genoa goes down.

Well, not just "another agent", his agent is Andrea D'Amico, Manning's consigliere.

leedsandTFC
03-08-2022, 05:45 PM
this latest rumour absolutely smacks of BS.

MikeForbes
03-08-2022, 06:23 PM
Meanwhile, #BelottiWatch is still somewhat on.

https://twitter.com/RudyGaletti/status/1501162505573478403?s=20&t=PffWbMrC4WfI8a3L2E712Q

Phil744
03-08-2022, 07:44 PM
https://twitter.com/Total_TFC

🇬🇭➡️ Toronto FC is reportedly one of several MLS teams interested in signing Afriyie Acquah. The 30 year old central midfielder is a free agent after leaving Al-Batin. He has 42 caps for Ghana, and previously played for multiple Serie A clubs.

#TFCLive

https://t.co/yJ0GsrxjsL

MikeForbes
03-08-2022, 07:44 PM
Hopefully this guy is somewhat mobile if true. Looks like a defensive minded midfielder.

https://twitter.com/Total_TFC/status/1501345146255945731?s=20&t=CpIHKoPJZKRdbdKXyQGKNQ

Bobo
03-08-2022, 10:08 PM
All I remember Acquah for during his Torino years was being a high-energy guy. That alone would be useful, but would Papa Bradley sit his boy enough to make this worthwhile? Priso needs minutes too, though I wouldn't be opposed to trading Okello.

gracos
03-08-2022, 10:26 PM
I know im hoping for more signings by now but it might be good and suffer a little early and get the right signings then to rush and have to redo everything over, so i just need to learn to be patient

TylerValdal
03-09-2022, 07:56 AM
I know im hoping for more signings by now but it might be good and suffer a little early and get the right signings then to rush and have to redo everything over, so i just need to learn to be patient

I disagree. We need somebody now. The further we slip before Insigne comes, the more points well have to recoop. The team clearly lacks something else. Anything else. Fresh blood is needed

Initial B
03-09-2022, 08:52 AM
I think we all need to temper our expectations. My expectation is to grow the players and TFC won't be making the playoffs this year. If they do, that's just gravy. But I *do* expect that they will win the Canadian Championship and be poised to contend in the 2023 CCL. For me, that's what will make a successful season.

Canary10
03-09-2022, 09:55 AM
I think we all need to temper our expectations. My expectation is to grow the players and TFC won't be making the playoffs this year. If they do, that's just gravy. But I *do* expect that they will win the Canadian Championship and be poised to contend in the 2023 CCL. For me, that's what will make a successful season.

Yup, I agree.

ag futbol
03-09-2022, 10:38 AM
Loss of points and setbacks are hopefully temporary. Getting hamstrung with bad contracts and making the wrong moves lasts much longer. We are in a salary capped league with restrictions on buyouts and spending. Our ability to spend out of our problems is not the same as a big club in Europe. We also have no threat of relegation.

I am in favour of immediate small tweaks / cheap vets on short term deals to shore up competitiveness slightly and help the kids develop. But any concept of “do it all right away otherwise the club is offending us as fans” doesn’t feel right to me.

Give it enough time to be thought out and be done correctly.

TylerValdal
03-09-2022, 12:49 PM
I think we all need to temper our expectations. My expectation is to grow the players and TFC won't be making the playoffs this year. If they do, that's just gravy. But I *do* expect that they will win the Canadian Championship and be poised to contend in the 2023 CCL. For me, that's what will make a successful season.

I am sorry missing the playoffs would be a bad season in my eyes. A new coach, new star player aside! We at least need to challenge for the playoffs. If we dont with 3 DPs, 2-3 TAM players and possily 1-3 U22 Players then what do you really think is going to change next year? Well know what this team is by game 8-9 I reckon!

TylerValdal
03-09-2022, 12:50 PM
Loss of points and setbacks are hopefully temporary. Getting hamstrung with bad contracts and making the wrong moves lasts much longer. We are in a salary capped league with restrictions on buyouts and spending. Our ability to spend out of our problems is not the same as a big club in Europe. We also have no threat of relegation.

I am in favour of immediate small tweaks / cheap vets on short term deals to shore up competitiveness slightly and help the kids develop. But any concept of “do it all right away otherwise the club is offending us as fans” doesn’t feel right to me.

Give it enough time to be thought out and be done correctly.

Agreed! Bringing in 29-31 year old Vets seems the way to go now to inundate the young guns. My only fear is as the year goes on, the under 23 home grown players may show there cracks that some or most arent MLS ready and we wasted another year trying to figure it out

Initial B
03-09-2022, 01:12 PM
Agreed! Bringing in 29-31 year old Vets seems the way to go now to inundate the young guns. My only fear is as the year goes on, the under 23 home grown players may show there cracks that some or most arent MLS ready and we wasted another year trying to figure it out
I'd rather find out now which young players aren't good enough for MLS or need more seasoning. (mid-season CPL/MLS loans maybe?)

Oh, and btw - welcome to the forums! Things may get a bit heated sometimes, but pretty much everyone on this board is understanding and tolerant of differences of opinion, even when those opinions are wrong. g:D

TylerValdal
03-09-2022, 01:17 PM
I'd rather find out now which young players aren't good enough for MLS or need more seasoning. (mid-season CPL/MLS loans maybe?)

Oh, and btw - welcome to the forums! Things may get a bit heated sometimes, but pretty much everyone on this board is understanding and tolerant of differences of opinion, even when those opinions are wrong. g:D

Thanks man! I have or had an account on here when it was launched, but sadly cant seem to access it. So had to create a new one sadly enough! Long time lurker since then.. Appreciate it brother

Valdal
03-09-2022, 01:19 PM
I'd rather find out now which young players aren't good enough for MLS or need more seasoning. (mid-season CPL/MLS loans maybe?)

Oh, and btw - welcome to the forums! Things may get a bit heated sometimes, but pretty much everyone on this board is understanding and tolerant of differences of opinion, even when those opinions are wrong. g:D

And Speaking of I have access to it again!!!

jabbronies
03-09-2022, 01:38 PM
I am sorry missing the playoffs would be a bad season in my eyes. A new coach, new star player aside! We at least need to challenge for the playoffs. If we dont with 3 DPs, 2-3 TAM players and possily 1-3 U22 Players then what do you really think is going to change next year? Well know what this team is by game 8-9 I reckon!

Playoffs or at least legitimately challenging for a playoff spot is a minimum for me. Anything less than that is a failure IMO.

Bob Bradley should have ways to get results with the players he has. He is setting up a system that should only get better with time and when mid-season hits, he will get reinforcements to really be able to execute his plan properly.

Valdal
03-09-2022, 01:46 PM
Playoffs or at least legitimately challenging for a playoff spot is a minimum for me. Anything less than that is a failure IMO.

Bob Bradley should have ways to get results with the players he has. He is setting up a system that should only get better with time and when mid-season hits, he will get reinforcements to really be able to execute his plan properly.

Yes Exactly this

los sonadores
03-09-2022, 09:03 PM
I read Beezer’s article today about the kids and he observes that coach Bradley has no choice to play them because that is what management has provided. But isn’t that a touch ingenuous? Isn’t Bradley also management? Isn’t that what a sporting director is? I understand if manager Bradley has to take off the management cap in order to get on with the season but I’d like to know if this is a philosophy or just running out of time to sign more experienced players who might play in their usual/natural positions?

Maybe there is no difference here, but it’s very new for this club and I’m not sure that it’s been articulated as a philosophy. Have we simply fallen in to it? We’ll play them for a few months and see sounds a bit haphazard to me. Maybe that’s all that’s possible when most of the roster has been let go or ousted.

Ultra & Proud
03-09-2022, 09:14 PM
I don't think it's haphazard. I think it was an opportunity to try something different. We needed to turn over a chunk of the roster and it's unrealistic to expect to replace all the positions open with reasonable, short term contracts in the winter window so it set up perfectly to try out the youth. Also it won't be lost on them that that's something the supporters have been complaining about for years and also could lead to some sales abroad. Plus as it's a transition year we really shouldn't be at the point of questioning FO motives or Bradley's roster building after matchday #2.

barticusz
03-09-2022, 09:36 PM
We were always coming to this point with this roster and it should’ve happened last year.

The expectation that we’re going to be a winning side is quite lofty considering all the changes we’ve made this off season. We are going to have many more games like the one last week but I’m all for it. We have the chance right now to allow the kids an opportunity to learn and fail. This is when we as supporters need to be supportive through this learning phase rather than jumping all over 17 and 19 year olds for their poor performances.

I’m trying to take the positive out of this and we will see how the kids can adapt with more regular minutes. If we can get into the playoffs that would be fantastic but for the most part I want to see this team be competitive in every match. The effort has to be there and I think it will be.

MikeForbes
03-14-2022, 08:31 AM
The fact that this thread is dead and the club is so thin is kind of concerning.

Ultra & Proud
03-14-2022, 08:45 AM
The fact that this thread is dead and the club is so thin is kind of concerning.

We're thin for sure but I understand what Bob is doing. This is a full rebuilding year but the first half of the season will be a real trial by fire but it's the right way to go. If you go back and listen to his interview about the 2022 season he said we would be in a good place by July when reinforcements come in. At first I read into that as we'd be okay in the standings but now I think he meant that we would have a good base of players that knew how to play his system so when the new pieces arrive they can slot right in.

A few people posted that this season isn't about 2022 but rather 2023 and I agree but it will be even more broken down into an ugly, hard learning first half 2022 and then growing into a peoper team in the latter half of 2022. Only been three weeks but I am noticing some improvements in the youths and if that trend continues then we should have a good, domestic, cap exempt base heading into 2023.

Phil744
03-16-2022, 09:23 AM
https://twitter.com/tombogert

BREAKING: Minnesota United are finalizing the acquisition of Jamaican int'l left back Kemar Lawrence from Toronto FC in a trade, per sources.

Lawrence, 29, won two Supporters' Shields with RBNY, was a finalist for Defender of the Year in 2018 and moved to Anderlecht in 2020.

MikeForbes
03-16-2022, 09:27 AM
Going ham and acquiring GAM.

noxx98
03-16-2022, 09:32 AM
Gimme Dayne St Clair

MikeForbes
03-16-2022, 09:38 AM
Gimme Dayne St Clair

Alex Bono is incredible though. Just check with the guys who cover the team.

Bobo
03-16-2022, 09:43 AM
Trade Shaff and JMR next. I wanna make history.

ag futbol
03-16-2022, 09:49 AM
Trade Shaff and JMR next. I wanna make history.
All joking aside, we have far too many left sided options and not enough right sided ones.

Nelson, Shaff, Petrasso all fighting for time, plus we have LA coming in who is going to get first priority on the left wing.

I think at least one should be traded. Good for their own development and the team’s balance. I’d see if Mtl would accept someone in return for Brault-Guillard who is only sometimes starting this year.

noxx98
03-16-2022, 10:09 AM
Some news sources in Minnesota are saying Kemar is being acquired at a "bargain" price. So we shouldn't expect much here I think.

https://www.twincities.com/2022/03/16/loons-add-former-all-mls-fullback-kemar-lawrence/

JonO
03-16-2022, 10:17 AM
Some news sources in Minnesota are saying Kemar is being acquired at a "bargain" price. So we shouldn't expect much here I think.

https://www.twincities.com/2022/03/16/loons-add-former-all-mls-fullback-kemar-lawrence/

"Minnesota is only paying a portion of his salary, which was $340,000 last season, per MLS Players Association figures, and Toronto FC has to pay the remainder of his transfer fee, the source said." Yikes! Does anyone understand what is going on with him or did I miss something...

ag futbol
03-16-2022, 10:25 AM
"Minnesota is only paying a portion of his salary, which was $340,000 last season, per MLS Players Association figures, and Toronto FC has to pay the remainder of his transfer fee, the source said." Yikes! Does anyone understand what is going on with him or did I miss something...
My god, how many bad deals can we have in such a short period of time? I’m not sure what it is that requires us to send him off and not have him even train with the team.

Can’t be helping our salary cap situation…

Canary10
03-16-2022, 10:29 AM
Gimme Dayne St Clair

Yeah this would be great.

reggie
03-16-2022, 10:34 AM
Gimme Dayne St Clair

a week too late,after the game he had on sunday,could have drafted him or tajon but we drafted dorsey.

reggie
03-16-2022, 10:40 AM
My god, how many bad deals can we have in such a short period of time? I’m not sure what it is that requires us to send him off and not have him even train with the team.

Can’t be helping our salary cap situation…
what the hell did lawrence do for us to give him away and pay some of his some of his salary and transfer fee which is was like 600k
it would be nice if the bloggers that cover this team would ask these questions

leedsandTFC
03-16-2022, 10:47 AM
where do we stand in terms of budget now after this?

portu
03-16-2022, 10:49 AM
God I want St Clair off Minnesota so bad. Even if we have to eat salary for Bono whatever

noxx98
03-16-2022, 10:51 AM
where do we stand in terms of budget now after this?
We still have plenty of room, particularly with all the GAM we've acquired this year.

noxx98
03-16-2022, 10:52 AM
a week too late,after the game he had on sunday,could have drafted him or tajon but we drafted dorsey.
I would totally prefer Tajon or Dayne over Dorsey, but he's actually been a decent rotation player for Houston since we let him go. He could have been reasonable depth for us at RB this season.

Auzzy
03-16-2022, 10:56 AM
This hypothesis is completely my own doing. Shoot me if you want. But after hearing repeatedly about culture, and stuff like this: "I immediately got a sense when I got here that there were guys in different places. Guys that weren't as committed to the club as they might have been earlier. Guys that at different moments just hadn't been committed to all the things you do to be part of a winning team."

Then we lose some guys who seemed to play well; who seemed to be committed in the past. We lose them in deals that aren't great, or that require some serious trade gymnastics -- and may leave us short on cap space. Meanwhile many of those positions are not adequately filled, and/or not in a timely fashion.

I have no idea if this is the case, but I really hope it's not related to Michael Bradley or other veterans having some axes to grind.

reggie
03-16-2022, 10:58 AM
I would totally prefer Tajon or Dayne over Dorsey, but he's actually been a decent rotation player for Houston since we let him go. He could have been reasonable depth for us at RB this season.
a triple header of mistakes by curtis among all the other ones

portu
03-16-2022, 11:04 AM
This hypothesis is completely my own doing. Shoot me if you want. But after hearing repeatedly about culture, and stuff like this: "I immediately got a sense when I got here that there were guys in different places. Guys that weren't as committed to the club as they might have been earlier. Guys that at different moments just hadn't been committed to all the things you do to be part of a winning team."

Then we lose some guys who seemed to play well; who seemed to be committed in the past. We lose them in deals that aren't great, or that require some serious trade gymnastics -- and may leave us short on cap space. Meanwhile many of those positions are not adequately filled, and/or not in a timely fashion.

I have no idea if this is the case, but I really hope it's not related to Michael Bradley or other veterans having some axes to grind.
Sometimes I have strong suspicions that any player that falls on the wrong side of Michael Bradley and doesn’t figure it out with him is a gonner

reggie
03-16-2022, 11:08 AM
Sometimes I have strong suspicions that any player that falls on the wrong side of Michael Bradley and doesn’t figure it out with him is a gonner

im sure BB and MB had some long family dinners regarding this.

Smokecell
03-16-2022, 11:42 AM
Someone needs to be fired for overseeing all of these atrocious contracts were being forced to eat. Cough cough Manning

noxx98
03-16-2022, 11:47 AM
I'm going to wait and see what the return is before judging it. Perhaps we're paying some of the salary in cash, but Minnesota is giving us additional GAM to cover the salary budget hit for it. Could be a way of TFC using MLSE cash to extract more value in trades from teams who are more budget conscious.

JoesphNdo
03-16-2022, 12:16 PM
You don't trade a very good MLS level player with a manageable salary and eat some of the cost. There is no context that could make this anything other than a batshit insane thing to do in a salary cap league like MLS

You especially don't do it in a position where we are thin as hell

MikeForbes
03-16-2022, 12:30 PM
The only thing we know for sure is that St. Clair is not coming back in return for Lawrence.

Ultra & Proud
03-16-2022, 12:37 PM
The only thing we know for sure is that St. Clair is not coming back in return for Lawrence.
Unless it's something like Lawrence + $800K in GAM.

MikeForbes
03-16-2022, 12:45 PM
Unless it's something like Lawrence + $800K in GAM.

That was shot down. I can see Minnesota dealing Tyler Miller long before St. Clair.

https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson/status/1504113334303535108?s=20&t=gn2b9k9MDrDy3PwTFQ04jQ

Canary10
03-16-2022, 01:11 PM
a week too late,after the game he had on sunday,could have drafted him or tajon but we drafted dorsey.

Lol. Eff

DavemTFC
03-16-2022, 01:49 PM
Didn't Lawrence have some legal issues in Florida or something? That's the only reason I can think of that makes this even make a little bit of sense.

Am I being hyperbolic in saying this is Mo-tier bad?

noxx98
03-16-2022, 01:52 PM
Michael Singh has some details. Apparently Lawrence was viewed as not committed to the team and was frequently absent from training last year. Hard to know if any of that had to do with the family challenges he had over the past few years.

https://www.theparleh.com/post/why-kemar-lawrence-is-ultimately-being-traded-by-toronto-fc

jloome
03-16-2022, 02:14 PM
Michael Singh has some details. Apparently Lawrence was viewed as not committed to the team and was frequently absent from training last year. Hard to know if any of that had to do with the family challenges he had over the past few years.

https://www.theparleh.com/post/why-kemar-lawrence-is-ultimately-being-traded-by-toronto-fc

Lawrence has started multiple small companies that require his time and attention. He describes himself as a “serial entrepreneur”, which may be why he’s dealing with civil suits in NY and Florida. He’s the plaintiff in an injury accident case that led to a legal debt since assumed by a collections company, which is suing him to recover. He has also started a “legal will kit” company in Jamaica.

I dunno, that might’ve all contributed to his absences.

portu
03-16-2022, 03:39 PM
Some of these dealings could have been handled way better to prevent us getting fleeced on and off the pitch. Lawrence’s departure was leaked a month(!) ago. Auro likewise is moving for shit. Both players demonstrably serviceable. Both players holding potential value. If you want to move them, then fair of course. But does the club seriously not have the tact to reach professional agreements with their players to train with the club prior to departure and considerately negotiate their departures?

This stuff just screams old-school male ego management. The club would rather “trade” and “loan” on/off-pitch assets to their serious detriment. “Not a cultural fit”. That terminology is used only when employers want to professionally mask gross misconduct or are searching for a reason why they no longer like an employee. Given Singh’s obvious puff-piece, we know which of the two it is.

I’ve been saying for a long time (and I know I am shouting into the void) that management is not on the ball and likely arrogant in their approach to roster management.

Smokecell
03-16-2022, 04:40 PM
Apparently Minnesotas starting LB just checked into the substance abuse program. Maybe we’re not gonna get fleeced that bad if they are a tad desperate themselves? Hell who am I kidding

MightyDM
03-16-2022, 05:14 PM
I see it a bit differently. If you are Bob Bradley, you get one chance to clean house and have it be someone else’s fault. Better to be certain of who you are keeping.

MightyDM
03-16-2022, 05:16 PM
Also, Lawrence did a good professional job for us on the field. I have no problems with him. And it was in the middle of a shit show.

jloome
03-16-2022, 05:44 PM
Some of these dealings could have been handled way better to prevent us getting fleeced on and off the pitch. Lawrence’s departure was leaked a month(!) ago. Auro likewise is moving for shit. Both players demonstrably serviceable. Both players holding potential value. If you want to move them, then fair of course. But does the club seriously not have the tact to reach professional agreements with their players to train with the club prior to departure and considerately negotiate their departures?

This stuff just screams old-school male ego management. The club would rather “trade” and “loan” on/off-pitch assets to their serious detriment. “Not a cultural fit”. That terminology is used only when employers want to professionally mask gross misconduct or are searching for a reason why they no longer like an employee. Given Singh’s obvious puff-piece, we know which of the two it is.

I’ve been saying for a long time (and I know I am shouting into the void) that management is not on the ball and likely arrogant in their approach to roster management.

It's not uncommon in football for older, successful players to become resistant to coaching. If they've been around so long, and been revered enough, that they feel they have a right to input on every decision and every approach, it makes improving a team very difficult.

I'm not saying that's the case here, but it may be, or at the very least it may be how some of these guys were perceived. Guy coming in wants a clean slate to build something new, old guys want to stick with what they think works, something has to give. It's never going to be the guy coming in.

portu
03-16-2022, 05:54 PM
It's not uncommon in football for older, successful players to become resistant to coaching. If they've been around so long, and been revered enough, that they feel they have a right to input on every decision and every approach, it makes improving a team very difficult.

I'm not saying that's the case here, but it may be, or at the very least it may be how some of these guys were perceived. Guy coming in wants a clean slate to build something new, old guys want to stick with what they think works, something has to give. It's never going to be the guy coming in.
I think I’m just saying some of these moves could have happened without hurting itself as much as it has so far. I’d largely agree with the departures, but the manner of those departures and the plans to fill the gaps left by them have been objectively shit.

jloome
03-16-2022, 06:12 PM
I think I’m just saying some of these moves could have happened without hurting itself as much as it has so far. I’d largely agree with the departures, but the manner of those departures and the plans to fill the gaps left by them have been objectively shit.

There seems to be a lack of concern for value, for sure. This is about "I don't care how, just shed 'em," when it should be "we have tradeable assets." But it was all left too late, until after they'd already hired BB. They may have wanted to defer to whomever was coming in, and may have felt locking them out was the only way, or they're in camp, potentially fucking up what he's building.

They extended contracts on guys they shouldn't, they brought in players they later perceived to be lacking the hunger to win. Just bad general managing, basically. Curtis may have been pulling the strings, but Manning should wear it for letting him and abrogating his own responsibilities.

Luanda
03-16-2022, 06:19 PM
so we are getting "the rights to 2021 second-round pick Sean O'Hearn"

https://www.startribune.com/minnesota-united-kemar-lawrence-trade-toronto-fc-chase-gasper/600156541/

Smokecell
03-16-2022, 06:31 PM
^this is a joke right

MikeForbes
03-16-2022, 07:01 PM
Not even 50k GAM? Yikes.

Ultra & Proud
03-16-2022, 07:06 PM
so we are getting "the rights to 2021 second-round pick Sean O'Hearn"

https://www.startribune.com/minnesota-united-kemar-lawrence-trade-toronto-fc-chase-gasper/600156541/

So it's essentially a buyout.

DavemTFC
03-16-2022, 09:57 PM
We need an actual GM. This is appalling

OgtheDim
03-17-2022, 06:49 AM
We need an actual GM. This is appalling


This is the all on Curtis & Manning. Bradley ain't the issue here.

los sonadores
03-17-2022, 07:13 AM
This is the all on Curtis & Manning. Bradley ain't the issue here.

How so? It’s not difficult to see how incompetent Curtis was (that might be said even before he arrived here) but I find the locking out of training what have been quite good players for us and unloading them at any cost strange. Lawrence is a Jamaican international who came from Anderlecht and we’re paying him to play for Minnesota and still also paying his transfer fee while Shaffelberg attempts to figure out how to play fullback on a roster of 18 or so players?

MLS is certainly a weird league (and I’ve been watching it since our first match).

Ultra & Proud
03-17-2022, 07:23 AM
How so? It’s not difficult to see how incompetent Curtis was (that might be said even before he arrived here) but I find the locking out of training what have been quite good players for us and unloading them at any cost strange. Lawrence is a Jamaican international who came from Anderlecht and we’re paying him to play for Minnesota and still also paying his transfer fee while Shaffelberg attempts to figure out how to play fullback on a roster of 18 or so players?

It's because you can't have floaters, absentees, or attitude issues in training every day while learning a new system while you hope to properly develop and add youth players into the first team. Bigger picture > win now at the cost of later. We already did the latter last season and that's why we're paying for it now.

TFC/Everton
03-17-2022, 08:39 AM
A couple things have become clear to me over the last few weeks.

1. Bob and Bill aren't going to rush any moves if they aren't the right players. They want to build a team that will win in 2023, 2024, etc. This year is a total rebuild (obviously)

2. Our new head coach cares a lot about attitude and commitment. I respect that.

3. We have the best crops of young talent this club has ever seen. Nelson and JMR will get a lot better this year.

4. We probably won't make the playoffs this year.

Ultra & Proud
03-17-2022, 09:53 AM
Nelson and JMR will get a lot better this year.

Some people were critical of him last match but I see a lot of improvement. I think people are comparing his performances to what they think the end product should be but compared to what he was last year, I think he was night and day better. It looked like he knew what he was doing and where to go rather than run around like my dog at the dog park. Obviously he made some bad decisions and tried to take too many guys on 1v1 but that's kids for you.

ag futbol
03-17-2022, 10:04 AM
^ It’s was a little better. I noticed he was trying a lot harder to track back. Offensively he was disjointed and trying to do too much. I agree it feels more like he’s working on things as opposed to simply being thrown on the field for experience, as it was last year.

I’d like to slap his youth coaches, if I ever had the chance.

OgtheDim
03-17-2022, 10:42 AM
4. We probably won't make the playoffs this year.


I think MLSE knows this & is prepping for a BIG 2023.

Areathrasher
03-17-2022, 12:51 PM
We are going from "two weeks" to "5 year plan"

Ultra & Proud
03-17-2022, 01:26 PM
We are going from "two weeks" to "5 year plan"
At least the plan is 5 years of good to great instead of 2 weeks to becoming even shittier.

Oldtimer
03-17-2022, 02:02 PM
At least the plan is 5 years of good to great instead of 2 weeks to becoming even shittier.

:lol: Plus nobody actually knew how long "two weeks" actually, was. :facepalm:

jabbronies
03-17-2022, 02:13 PM
:lol: Plus nobody actually knew how long "two weeks" actually, was. :facepalm:

I think we are technically still in that 2 week period that started during the 2021 offseason, I just can't remember who we are still waiting on

rydermike
03-17-2022, 02:37 PM
:lol: Plus nobody actually knew how long "two weeks" actually, was. :facepalm:
Turns out it was two weeks on Mercury, where one day is 58 earth days

rydermike
03-17-2022, 03:45 PM
Officially official. We got an unsigned draft pick who is playing for New England II. How long do MLS draft rights even last? Would New England need to trade us something for him if they want him? Plus the minimum GAM, but even that's a maybe

https://twitter.com/TorontoFC/status/1504548129114361857

reggie
03-17-2022, 03:49 PM
Officially official. We got an unsigned draft pick who is playing for New England II. How long do MLS draft rights even last? Would New England need to trade us something for him if they want him? Plus the minimum GAM, but even that's a maybe

https://twitter.com/TorontoFC/status/1504548129114361857
no mention that we are paying half his salary and the rest of his transfer fee.a great bit of charity work done here by tfc

jabbronies
03-17-2022, 03:56 PM
no mention that we are paying half his salary and the rest of his transfer fee.a great bit of charity work done here by tfc

Does anyone know how much we pay players not to play for us?

I know there is Jozy and now Kemar. anyone else?

reggie
03-17-2022, 04:02 PM
Does anyone know how much we pay players not to play for us?

I know there is Jozy and now Kemar. anyone else?
we sort of paid dallas to take dwyer off our hands

rydermike
03-17-2022, 04:22 PM
Does anyone know how much we pay players not to play for us?

I know there is Jozy and now Kemar. anyone else?
We got Soteldo from Santos because they couldn't pay him. Wouldn't be surprised if we're paying Auro's salary on his loan to Santos.

We're also definitely paying Luke Singh at FC Edmonton considering that team doesn't even have an owner anymore and the other CanPL teams are paying all of FCE's players already.

rydermike
03-17-2022, 04:34 PM
Officially official. We got an unsigned draft pick who is playing for New England II. How long do MLS draft rights even last? Would New England need to trade us something for him if they want him?
To answer my own question, courtesy of Neil Davidson.

"His “college protected period priority rights” belong to Toronto until the end of 2022."
https://www.thestar.com/sports/tfc/2022/03/17/toronto-fc-trades-jamaican-defender-kemar-lawrence-to-minnesota-united.html

Unless we sign him now, we literally got nothing. His rights expire this year.

MikeForbes
03-17-2022, 06:20 PM
Don't expect much activity until July according to Bob.

https://twitter.com/MichaelSingh94/status/1504590338417176580?s=20&t=H5vICzN6gsA8qvmvWOF0tA

portu
03-17-2022, 07:00 PM
I don't think Insigne lasts more than a year at the club. He doesn't need the money and he doesn't need to deal with the idiocy either.

Auzzy
03-17-2022, 08:57 PM
Michael Singh has some details. Apparently Lawrence was viewed as not committed to the team and was frequently absent from training last year. Hard to know if any of that had to do with the family challenges he had over the past few years.

https://www.theparleh.com/post/why-kemar-lawrence-is-ultimately-being-traded-by-toronto-fc

After reading that article, and also in response to other posts since then: I can understand that there might have been several issues and distractions with Lawrence, even though he looked good and committed on the field last year. I can even understand there might have been issues with multiple players -- although the total number gone, and the poor return on the transactions plus lack of coverage in those positions really gets me scratching my head. (At what point is it more likely that the problem is at least partly with the people staying -- players or staff -- rather than those going?)

But when I read stuff like "I think we’ve lost this amazing culture that we’ve built up over the years here at BMO Training Ground and it was reflected on the field,” said Manning. “The introduction of some of the players into the club and some of the guys that were here, it wasn’t seamless. Culture is a buzz word, but it’s also real. It comes down to togetherness, it comes down to alignment. … teams that win have fun.”
- I just want to gag. I mean what "amazing culture" is he talking about? The team was an utter gong show last year (and was very fragile for a couple of years before that). It's obvious that the problems started at the top, with major problems both in management and coaching. There are really too few old players left to talk about a "seamless" fit of players. It just gets me worried that Manning hasn't really lived up to the fact that Curtis and Armas were an utter disaster. It gets me worried that this might not be a real reset, that parts of the old management and structure and thinking still remain.

I mean, I would feel more confident if Manning just said "Sorry it was a gong show from the top to the bottom and we just had to blow it up."

Oldtimer
03-17-2022, 09:03 PM
Some information on Osorio contract negotiations:

https://www.theparleh.com/post/exclusive-pending-free-agent-jonathan-osorio-on-his-contract-negotiations-with-toronto-fc

reggie
03-17-2022, 09:17 PM
After reading that article, and also in response to other posts since then: I can understand that there might have been several issues and distractions with Lawrence, even though he looked good and committed on the field last year. I can even understand there might have been issues with multiple players -- although the total number gone, and the poor return on the transactions plus lack of coverage in those positions really gets me scratching my head. (At what point is it more likely that the problem is at least partly with the people staying -- players or staff -- rather than those going?)

But when I read stuff like "I think we’ve lost this amazing culture that we’ve built up over the years here at BMO Training Ground and it was reflected on the field,” said Manning. “The introduction of some of the players into the club and some of the guys that were here, it wasn’t seamless. Culture is a buzz word, but it’s also real. It comes down to togetherness, it comes down to alignment. … teams that win have fun.”
- I just want to gag. I mean what "amazing culture" is he talking about? The team was an utter gong show last year (and was very fragile for a couple of years before that). It's obvious that the problems started at the top, with major problems both in management and coaching. There are really too few old players left to talk about a "seamless" fit of players. It just gets me worried that Manning hasn't really lived up to the fact that Curtis and Armas were an utter disaster. It gets me worried that this might not be a real reset, that parts of the old management and structure and thinking still remain.

I mean, I would feel more confident if Manning just said "Sorry it was a gong show from the top to the bottom and we just had to blow it up."
lets see how great this new culture is if we lose 9 out of 10

DavemTFC
03-17-2022, 10:44 PM
I have no idea how bad Lawrence's behind the scenes legal issues are, and the details there could change everything, but given what we know on the surface this looks like a horrendous deal. This isn't even about Curtis any more, I think even he could have probably gotten more from the team suddenly in desparate need of a LB than 50k and a second round draft pick for a still in his prime Jamaican international team-of-the-year quality player. I'm definitely blaming both Bradley and Manning for this since I don't know who's job it is to make these intraleague trades anymore, though more so Manning since he should have hired a GM in the first place and just let BB coach.

los sonadores
03-18-2022, 12:49 AM
Hopefully we don’t run into more injury problems because the roster is looking very thin. I guess the heavy building plus tinkering is something that can be done in MLS (and certainly not with Swansea and in the Premier League). We do need to win some games, however. It’s possible to bring along the kids well but lose the involvement of the veterans (the players still on the roster, I mean). Pozuelo and Osorio need to be at their best otherwise it might be a very long season and a half. And not difficult to imagine that both will not be here next season.

OgtheDim
03-18-2022, 08:23 AM
Some information on Osorio contract negotiations:

https://www.theparleh.com/post/exclusive-pending-free-agent-jonathan-osorio-on-his-contract-negotiations-with-toronto-fc

Dude turns 30 in June


:eek:

MightyDM
03-18-2022, 08:33 AM
After reading that article, and also in response to other posts since then: I can understand that there might have been several issues and distractions with Lawrence, even though he looked good and committed on the field last year. I can even understand there might have been issues with multiple players -- although the total number gone, and the poor return on the transactions plus lack of coverage in those positions really gets me scratching my head. (At what point is it more likely that the problem is at least partly with the people staying -- players or staff -- rather than those going?)

But when I read stuff like "I think we’ve lost this amazing culture that we’ve built up over the years here at BMO Training Ground and it was reflected on the field,” said Manning. “The introduction of some of the players into the club and some of the guys that were here, it wasn’t seamless. Culture is a buzz word, but it’s also real. It comes down to togetherness, it comes down to alignment. … teams that win have fun.”
- I just want to gag. I mean what "amazing culture" is he talking about? The team was an utter gong show last year (and was very fragile for a couple of years before that). It's obvious that the problems started at the top, with major problems both in management and coaching. There are really too few old players left to talk about a "seamless" fit of players. It just gets me worried that Manning hasn't really lived up to the fact that Curtis and Armas were an utter disaster. It gets me worried that this might not be a real reset, that parts of the old management and structure and thinking still remain.

I mean, I would feel more confident if Manning just said "Sorry it was a gong show from the top to the bottom and we just had to blow it up."

They have done that though, haven’t they? Blown it up. Whatever he says. It’s like BB said “time to clean house”

And it very much looks to me like this is a transitional year for MB. Whatever people here think, they need his presence, his work ethic, and skill if they are in a complete rebuild mode.

MightyDM
03-18-2022, 08:36 AM
Dude turns 30 in June




:eek:


Not much on the article that’s new. But if I were the club, Oso gets a new one. But not a raise, unless MB is retiring and he takes that role.

jabbronies
03-18-2022, 08:53 AM
Not much on the article that’s new. But if I were the club, Oso gets a new one. But not a raise, unless MB is retiring and he takes that role.

I think MB can take another pay cut. Get the highest MLS salary without TAM.

Ultra & Proud
03-18-2022, 09:03 AM
I think MB can take another pay cut. Get the highest MLS salary without TAM.
He should just become the ne Chryrou. Accept a situational sub role and get a contract similar to what Lawrence had. Unless they radically change the cap rules with the new TV deal that is.

ag futbol
03-18-2022, 09:09 AM
I have no idea how bad Lawrence's behind the scenes legal issues are, and the details there could change everything, but given what we know on the surface this looks like a horrendous deal.
I agree, there is no way to know the merits of this trade (or Auro’s) without inside info. What’s frustrating is, our press corp is useless. You have guys who will print things the club doesn’t like but have no access or you have guys with access who are either corporate lap dogs or too busy to chase.

Not much depth of experience as a fan when nothing has context.

jabbronies
03-18-2022, 09:42 AM
He should just become the ne Chryrou. Accept a situational sub role and get a contract similar to what Lawrence had. Unless they radically change the cap rules with the new TV deal that is.

i think if we had someone who could replace him, he'd accept that role. But he knows as well as we do, there is no one right now.
Priso may be that guy, but we'll see how he does as the season progresses.

noxx98
03-18-2022, 10:32 AM
The return on the Kemar deal is obviously disappointing, given the transfer fee we paid to acquire him. However given how public his availability is, I have to imagine this was close to the best return we could get from another MLS team. Maybe another team was offering a player, but TFC valued the open roster spot and salary cap space instead. A lack of due diligence completed by Curtis and Manning previously. Along with that, I'm curious what Kemar's 2022 full season salary comes in at - that may have something to do with why the return was so lack lustre.

rydermike
03-18-2022, 11:35 AM
TFC2 announced their initial signings. All players from last year. Kobe Franklin included

jabbronies
03-18-2022, 11:37 AM
The return on the Kemar deal is obviously disappointing, given the transfer fee we paid to acquire him. However given how public his availability is, I have to imagine this was close to the best return we could get from another MLS team. Maybe another team was offering a player, but TFC valued the open roster spot and salary cap space instead. A lack of due diligence completed by Curtis and Manning previously. Along with that, I'm curious what Kemar's 2022 full season salary comes in at - that may have something to do with why the return was so lack lustre.

BB and Manning have both mentioned numerous times this off-season that the summer transfer window is when a lot of things are going to happen. I can only assume that they are lining up international players to join the team so the open roster spot would be more valuable to them. I feel like we'll end up with 2-3 long term players in this Summer window.

Thinking ahead, I'm curious to see what happens in the winter transfer window as that's when they will target MLS players to hopefully fill out the roster. That winter transfer window will also give us a final verdict on which youngsters were good enough to stick around and which ones forced us to look within MLS to fill spots.

Gogon
03-18-2022, 12:38 PM
The return on the Kemar deal is obviously disappointing, given the transfer fee we paid to acquire him. However given how public his availability is, I have to imagine this was close to the best return we could get from another MLS team. Maybe another team was offering a player, but TFC valued the open roster spot and salary cap space instead. A lack of due diligence completed by Curtis and Manning previously. Along with that, I'm curious what Kemar's 2022 full season salary comes in at - that may have something to do with why the return was so lack lustre.

None of us know whether it's physical decline, attitudinal decline, off-field impairments, or some combination of the above that made Lawrence no longer a viable option for us. However, I agree with noxx98, we got full value for him. Obviously we way overpaid on the way in, but we got full value on the way out. We need to keep in mind, all players are contracted to the league. The teams pay the salaries, but the league owns the contracts. The MLS league office will have been shopping Lawrence for months to every team in the league, and simply, there were no takers, until MUFC found themselves in a pickle. Even then, they took him, but not his salary. I suspect the issue in getting this or anything done was a negotiation between TFC and the league over salary cap rules. Someone on here earlier described this transaction as “another buyout”. I imagine that is how it has gone down in the end. It has been reported that TFC is picking up the salary and any remaining payments on the transfer fee. But, I’ll bet TFC only eventually agreed to this when the league office agreed to not have Lawrence’s salary and pro rata transfer fee count against the TFC salary cap. Candidly, I consider this a big win for TFC. The actual money involved is a rounding error for MLSE. But avoiding the cap allocation is really important for TFC’s alleged summer roster building. This could have worked out worse if no team was willing to take the seemingly impaired Lawrence. As it has transpired, I think we got full value and then some.

On another note, this might set an important precedent. If an MLS team can transfer a player, pick up the salary, and get cap relief, it gives deep pocketed owners like MLSE effectively an unlimited number of buyouts each year (providing there are teams willing to take our cast-offs for free). This could be big.

noxx98
03-18-2022, 01:26 PM
None of us know whether it's physical decline, attitudinal decline, off-field impairments, or some combination of the above that made Lawrence no longer a viable option for us. However, I agree with noxx98, we got full value for him. Obviously we way overpaid on the way in, but we got full value on the way out. We need to keep in mind, all players are contracted to the league. The teams pay the salaries, but the league owns the contracts. The MLS league office will have been shopping Lawrence for months to every team in the league, and simply, there were no takers, until MUFC found themselves in a pickle. Even then, they took him, but not his salary. I suspect the issue in getting this or anything done was a negotiation between TFC and the league over salary cap rules. Someone on here earlier described this transaction as “another buyout”. I imagine that is how it has gone down in the end. It has been reported that TFC is picking up the salary and any remaining payments on the transfer fee. But, I’ll bet TFC only eventually agreed to this when the league office agreed to not have Lawrence’s salary and pro rata transfer fee count against the TFC salary cap. Candidly, I consider this a big win for TFC. The actual money involved is a rounding error for MLSE. But avoiding the cap allocation is really important for TFC’s alleged summer roster building. This could have worked out worse if no team was willing to take the seemingly impaired Lawrence. As it has transpired, I think we got full value and then some.

On another note, this might set an important precedent. If an MLS team can transfer a player, pick up the salary, and get cap relief, it gives deep pocketed owners like MLSE effectively an unlimited number of buyouts each year (providing there are teams willing to take our cast-offs for free). This could be big.

The cap relief is the big thing here for me too. If TFC is truly out of his cap hit, even though we are still paying a portion of his salary and transfer fee, that’s big. We’ve seen MLSE use it’s financial strength to great impact on the leafs. For example, they include significant signing bonuses on the first day of each season. MLSE pays that amount and then they can trade that player to a smaller market team who only pays the season salary.

As long as TFC/MLSE doesn’t care about money, it’s a great way for us to get out of contracts when players are past their prime.

613reppingTFC
03-18-2022, 01:27 PM
On another note, this might set an important precedent. If an MLS team can transfer a player, pick up the salary, and get cap relief, it gives deep pocketed owners like MLSE effectively an unlimited number of buyouts each year (providing there are teams willing to take our cast-offs for free). This could be big.

That's an interesting thought for sure. However I cannot imagine the league allowing this to happen

reggie
03-18-2022, 02:25 PM
The cap relief is the big thing here for me too. If TFC is truly out of his cap hit, even though we are still paying a portion of his salary and transfer fee, that’s big. We’ve seen MLSE use it’s financial strength to great impact on the leafs. For example, they include significant signing bonuses on the first day of each season. MLSE pays that amount and then they can trade that player to a smaller market team who only pays the season salary.

As long as TFC/MLSE doesn’t care about money, it’s a great way for us to get out of contracts when players are past their prime.

a minnesota writer mentioned that tfc are playing some of his salary and the rest of his transfer fee,if true tfc are paying 150-200 k in salary and 400k -500k in transfer fee so i guess that is 500k to 600 k against the cap this year,but who knows we never get the truth on these type of deals

Ultra & Proud
03-18-2022, 02:26 PM
That's an interesting thought for sure. However I cannot imagine the league allowing this to happen
Since most MLS rules are thought up and changed on the fly to suit whatever team they're currently pushing as advertising darlings, they do leave themselves open for short term loopholes.