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jloome
08-06-2008, 01:33 PM
...cos I've got multiple topics to whine about or discuss and a few minutes free at work.

1) The salary cap cost us Dickov. I'm betting the reason Leicester were told two weeks ago he wouldn't go there is that he had firmly committed to TFC. His agent said as much to the Blackpool paper. But Mo also said around the same time he had cap issues. I imagine this is becuase getting rid of Cunny still wouldn't have freed enough space without using substantial allocation dollars, which Mo has planned for something else.

2) Carver will only stay a year if there isn't a talent upgrade. He's basically stated publicly he thinks he's getting what he can out of the current group; agree or not, that to me seems to be a demand for better, and when asked yesterday what the striker situation is, he just kept answering "Ask Mo."

3) MLSE is part of the problem; and I don't say that as some Leafs lover or hater that thinks they're evil; I'm hugely grateful they had the balls to give Canada an MLS team. But they have the dough to get us a DP striker from South America, or the J-League, or the South African league, or any number of second-tier national leagues. They haven't pulled the trigger, which means either Mo isn't giving them the names they want to see, or they aren't giving him the money. The fact that they spent more on Sundin than our entire roster is moot; the reality is it isn't getting done.

4) Simpson has crazy ball skills and there are a lot of undersized defenders in this league. I think moving him to Striker is ambitious but a smart move; it'll give him a chance to reclaim the glory spot he had as a kid, when he tied Michael Owens' youth tourney scoring record. If he can finish, at all, then a guy of his size and dribbling ability could cause some serious problems for defenses, even if Barrett or Guevara is ultimatley knocking the ball home. But this all is probably wishful thinking, given that what we really need is ....someone to knock the ball home.

5) There were several notable improvements in team play in the last game, including better fullback positioning (for the most part) and closing down (until Cooper's long shot). If we can just stop Guevara from punching people, we just might win one.

6) I've gone from being Darren Huckerby's booster to hating his guts; he has the skill we need, we have the passion he should want to play in front of Isntead, he has two goals and an assist in three games, in front of soccer moms who don't give a shit. I hate you, Fuckerby.

7) If we don't sign a (good) striker soon, I think I'm going to cry.

Roogsy
08-06-2008, 01:35 PM
QFFT!

ensco
08-06-2008, 01:41 PM
8) Still not sure what to think about Sutton. He looked great for 80 minutes, got schooled on the PK (he's still never stopped one), and that extra time goal he allowed was pretty much the worst goal allowed in TFC history

Ossington Mental Youth
08-06-2008, 01:43 PM
I hope youre right on 1. Wrong on 2 and I disagree on 3.
I do hope Simpson signs.

Outside of that some very interesting/viable perspectives (as per usual)

jloome
08-06-2008, 01:44 PM
He's like Lars Hisrchfeld: fantastic shot stopper, lousy at long balls/rebounds. Still, when we limit the chances (as in the long shutout streak at home) he's a good enough first team keeper in this league.

jloome
08-06-2008, 01:45 PM
I hope youre right on 1. Wrong on 2 and I disagree on 3.
I do hope Simpson signs.

Outside of that some very interesting/viable perspectives (as per usual)


OMY, what am I missing on 3?

Roogsy
08-06-2008, 01:46 PM
That is Sutt's worst part of his game. It's a guaranteed goal when it's a PK.

ACSertL
08-06-2008, 01:47 PM
8) Still not sure what to think about Sutton. He looked great for 80 minutes, got schooled on the PK (he's still never stopped one), and that extra time goal he allowed was pretty much the worst goal allowed in TFC history

While I will say that Greg Sutton is pretty lackluster on penalties...that one should have been re-taken. Cooper clearly stutter stepped before he took the shot sending Sutton the wrong way before he intended to kick the ball. As far as my knowledge of footy goes kicks are supposed to be taken in one fluid motion although from all of the games I have watched this 'rule' is very loosely enforced.

Ossington Mental Youth
08-06-2008, 01:50 PM
OMY, what am I missing on 3?

I, personally, from what ive seen with MLSE, am not convinced that they arent willing to spend the money on a quality player, especially after having put money into every other aspect.

I do think that Mo is perhaps (for lack of a better word, and i hesitate to say this) to blame for our lack of striker, along side of the fact that the MLS refuses to pay (for the most part) for transfer fees. I have backed Mo (feel free to check the threads) and only started to doubt him hesistantly near to the signings of our midfielders. I still have alotof faith in him but I do think sometimes his goals are a bit short sighted.

That of course is not to mention the fact that we are located in Toronto and in the MLS.
Once again, its all speculation and i hope we are both proven particularly wrong with a huge signing.

Roogsy
08-06-2008, 01:50 PM
While I will say that Greg Sutton is pretty lackluster on penalties...that one should have been re-taken. Cooper clearly stutter stepped before he took the shot sending Sutton the wrong way before he intended to kick the ball. As far as my knowledge of footy goes kicks are supposed to be taken in one fluid motion although from all of the games I have watched this 'rule' is very loosely enforced.

I don't believe that is the case anymore. I think the stutter step is allowed.

ACSertL
08-06-2008, 01:52 PM
Oh I hope that isn't the case Roogsy...it gives the shooter an unfair advantage. Unless of course they allow the keeper to come off the line.

maninb
08-06-2008, 01:54 PM
While I will say that Greg Sutton is pretty lackluster on penalties...that one should have been re-taken. Cooper clearly stutter stepped before he took the shot sending Sutton the wrong way before he intended to kick the ball. As far as my knowledge of footy goes kicks are supposed to be taken in one fluid motion although from all of the games I have watched this 'rule' is very loosely enforced.

I've NEVER seen a PK taken back because of a stutter-step...Many Latin players do it every time. You should be ready for it if you're a decent keeper.

Roogsy
08-06-2008, 01:54 PM
Oh I hope that isn't the case Roogsy...it gives the shooter an unfair advantage. Unless of course they allow the keeper to come off the line.

Someone told me about this rule change so it is only hearsay...but as I understand it the stutter step was allowed and the keeper is also allowed more mobility...in what way I don't know.

Of course, this could all be BS and I dunno jack...which is a distinct possibility. ;)

sulfur
08-06-2008, 01:57 PM
A PK is now considered the same as any other free kick. You can even, legally, come to a full stop right before kicking.

GK movement hasn't changed in 5+ years. That's when they allowed you to move laterally along the line. Ha!

It's pretty stupid. Takes it from a 90% play to a 95% play.

mclaren
08-06-2008, 01:58 PM
I am absolutely shocked that we haven't signed a DP striker yet. If any club in MLS is set-up for a DP star, it's TFC. During the first season I thought maybe we should wait it out and get one in for season two, but not to have one near the end of season two is nothing short of criminal. And I don't believe there isn't a single player out there who would fit the bill. Now that Mo's main job is to scout players, surely he's had the time to find the right player for us now. Carver isn't the problem, Mo is.

ACSertL
08-06-2008, 02:01 PM
I've NEVER seen a PK taken back because of a stutter-step...Many Latin players do it every time. You should be ready for it if you're a decent keeper.

I don't see how you can prepare yourself for someone stopping right before the kick is taken. I know that there is a certain skill in reading the shooter but to stay rooted to the spot until the ball is kicked isn't going to allow the keeper to stop the shot unless it is remotely close to him.

Broadview
08-06-2008, 02:02 PM
It's pretty stupid. Takes it from a 90% play to a 95% play.

Oh fer Two, courtesy of the team I tend to watch.

ACSertL
08-06-2008, 02:03 PM
A PK is now considered the same as any other free kick. You can even, legally, come to a full stop right before kicking.

GK movement hasn't changed in 5+ years. That's when they allowed you to move laterally along the line. Ha!

It's pretty stupid. Takes it from a 90% play to a 95% play.

Wish our shooters got that memo :)

AL-MO
08-06-2008, 02:05 PM
While I will say that Greg Sutton is pretty lackluster on penalties...that one should have been re-taken. Cooper clearly stutter stepped before he took the shot sending Sutton the wrong way before he intended to kick the ball. As far as my knowledge of footy goes kicks are supposed to be taken in one fluid motion although from all of the games I have watched this 'rule' is very loosely enforced.

As long as he doesn't stop moving its okay. So that PK counted. Figo does this all the time (with a more exagerated stutter). it does piss me off though. Just run up there and crack it into the back of the net.

Nerepis
08-06-2008, 02:09 PM
Back when I was playing between the posts the keeper could not even move until the ball was struck. If you moved a hand or anything the Ref could make you retake a missed shot.

MadMike
08-06-2008, 02:15 PM
Mo was a shit coach ...... and proving to be a shit scout !!!!!

Transfer window closes on the 15th!!! we have nothing to show for it but some garbage rumors. He seems to be too caught up on image lately ... that interview last week on TFC TV was rubbish. He has signed a deal with the devil (MLSE) No dought he has travelled but without the go-ahead his hands are tied. I love Carver's comments as of late, he has streched this team as far as he can, and we have all seen the results. Our team does not have the capability to complete a play consistantly. All you guy guys who think Robinson is a god need to check yourselves, this guy gets a pass and then immediatly passes it righyt back to the guy who pased it to him or put it on the opposite side of the attacking forward. I really wanted to like Robert, but he gases out after running half the pitch !! Edu is complete rubbish ... trade this guy now while there is still some hype around him (not even going to comment on him being on the cover of FIFA 09) We need Wynne for his speed but someone has to teach this guy about his position ..... it';s not all about speed. Barrett will no dought get some goals for us but we need to make plays first. As an Arsenal supporter I would like to see Dickov here , but if he is holding out for a big paycheck .... F%$K him. there are others that can get goals for less $$$$.

Nobody seems to reply when I post a responce, so I will leave it at that and hope we do something against Colorado .... even though it's an away game.

DigzTFC!
08-06-2008, 02:20 PM
Here's my reply:hump:

1) Salary cap will always play a problem as TFC will have to pay a premium for players to convince them to play on turf and come to Canada. We don't have the lure that sunny california does to european players. As for hispanic players, when the US has 40 million latins in the country, most will feel right at home there.

2) Carver will be here next year no matter what. Unless Mo is stupid to fire him, which is very unlikely.

3) I don't think MLSE has anything to do with Mo's shortcomings. The problem is Mo and Carver's connections are in Europe and the style they play is british. Causing them to source from the most expensive player pool. From Mo's track history, his player selection is more than a cap system will allow: the Kiki Musampa saga is prime example of a guy who had salary demands and Mo still thought he could change that scenario. Much like Pinto....

4) I really think guys like Simpson will add a huge spark to this team. Much like an Adrian Serioux would. We need toughness with talent...not Marco Velez or Harmse.

5) I think a lot of the position stuff improves at home because its a smaller field. Our slow D isn't exposed as much as the formation are more compact due to the nature of the width of BMO. I could be very wrong on this one though.

6&7) We're not going to get a striker that everyones happy with....and I'd rather let some kids develop and plan for next season. Than pace the team for now and future mediocrity.

NateDoGG
08-06-2008, 02:22 PM
id like to say. we all have had enough of john carver, and he wont be here next season if we dont make the playoffs (which we wont make if carver does not shut his mouth and get our team goin again, dont blame it on the refs and players john, we all know its u, what player would have confidence in playin under john anyways with his terrible attitude??)

theres m,y rant, i had to get it out

MadMike
08-06-2008, 02:22 PM
I agree get rid of Velez and Harmes immediatly !!!!

MadMike
08-06-2008, 02:24 PM
Nate Dogg ... are u crazy or something...... do want a coach who sits down and stays quiet ??? if anything he should say more even if he gets fired !!!

jloome
08-06-2008, 02:33 PM
Good points, Digz.

1) We should be able to get past this by drawing from the third world. There are quality, quality players in some of the African and Asian leagues who are being paid squat, relatively, and would jump at a chance here. If two Gambian youth players making the starting lineup of a team as strong as New England doesn't convince the head office that the third world is the way to go, then maybe nothing will. It may also be the case that, to an extent, the team has written this option off this season because the front office knows it hasn't built up the scouting system it wants and doesn't want stop-gaps.

2) As the Star noted today, he only has a one-year deal. We're half-way through the season with no public comment on any renewal or extension yet. So I don't see this quite as positively.

3) Good points, all. I really think there's a lack of outside knowledge, although you'd think they'd have hired some freelance scouts/consultants to help with this until there's an established scouting system. We know so little about the inner workings of the team (due to poor reporting, for the most part) that we don't even know if they're establishing a scouting system.

4) We need energy, big time. The way the schedule is spaced and the massive increase in travel distance, compared to what British Isles players are accustomed too, must be knackering everyone. I'm inclined to agree that Velez should be a bench backup. He has great tenacity and energy, sometimes, but just not enough talent.

5) This is probably true. Our field seems to be just about the minimum allowed. But strategicallly that seems strange for a team playing the long ball against a league full of teams playing the short buildup.

6) Who? Ibee's too small and could be wrecked for the future if we push him. Smith is a target forward who isn't developed enough yet to play alone, the only target forward-based system we've used. We need a hot streak from barrett (unlikely; we all seem to have high hopes for him, but his movement off the ball looked poor even when he was fit last week, and he missed a glorious chance to at least force a save. Plus, he has something like 20 goals in his entire four years of play); either that, and/or a proven goal scorer, end of story.

giambac
08-06-2008, 02:36 PM
I don't believe that is the case anymore. I think the stutter step is allowed.

It is allowed.

Ask C. Ronaldo.........

DigzTFC!
08-06-2008, 02:37 PM
Sorry NateDoGG, I think "we all" is fewer than you think. I like Carver we just have severe personelle problems:

Jarrod Smith is from USL-2, Velez-USL-1, Harmse released by Galaxy and given a pay raise?, Cunningham shipped out of 4 teams in 5 years, and a host of players on international duty or hurt.

Jloome

by kids I mean Barrett, Ibbe and hopefully Simpson. I don't see a point in running after names like Pauleta and Dickov right now.

Ossington Mental Youth
08-06-2008, 02:37 PM
Dont forget Mo had had his eyes on one of the gambians but it fell through because of Canadian Govermental bureaucracy... that is something we have to deal with as well...

CanuckPete
08-06-2008, 02:39 PM
I'm not a huge MLSE fan or anything. (Hell, I'm a Sens fan.)

But, until I at least read something about them scuppering a deal for a DP, I have no reason to think that MoJo has approached them and been turned down.

jloome
08-06-2008, 02:42 PM
Dont forget Mo had had his eyes on one of the gambians but it fell through because of Canadian Govermental bureaucracy... that is something we have to deal with as well...

This will be an ongoing issue with African and Asian players, because it's harder to get work visas for players from "lesser" leagues. But the reality is that it's still worth the effort; I remember a similar quote to your point from Mo right after that and he basically seemed to be saying African players aren't worth the bother. I respectfully disagree,and so apparently do most pro teams in France, Germany, Spain and Sweden. While it's easier to work in those nations, that doesn't mean we should just "give up" on that route -- if that's the case.

giambac
08-06-2008, 02:43 PM
I, personally, from what ive seen with MLSE, am not convinced that they arent willing to spend the money on a quality player, especially after having put money into every other aspect.

I do think that Mo is perhaps (for lack of a better word, and i hesitate to say this) to blame for our lack of striker, along side of the fact that the MLS refuses to pay (for the most part) for transfer fees. I have backed Mo (feel free to check the threads) and only started to doubt him hesistantly near to the signings of our midfielders. I still have alotof faith in him but I do think sometimes his goals are a bit short sighted.

That of course is not to mention the fact that we are located in Toronto and in the MLS.
Once again, its all speculation and i hope we are both proven particularly wrong with a huge signing.

I thought the DP money came out of the MLS pool.
who pays for the DP salary? The team or the league?

giambac
08-06-2008, 02:45 PM
id like to say. we all have had enough of john carver, and he wont be here next season if we dont make the playoffs (which we wont make if carver does not shut his mouth and get our team goin again, dont blame it on the refs and players john, we all know its u, what player would have confidence in playin under john anyways with his terrible attitude??)

theres m,y rant, i had to get it out

Easy now!!!!
That's a little harsh:)

RealG-TFC
08-06-2008, 02:46 PM
Dont forget Mo had had his eyes on one of the gambians but it fell through because of Canadian Govermental bureaucracy... that is something we have to deal with as well...

Yes! Remember the other Ibrahim, the Togolese fellow.

DigzTFC!
08-06-2008, 02:54 PM
Their is a visa issue that Paul eluded too and I think some Africans would have to apply for asylum....much like our Sylla boys that are in the Canadian system. Alot of the europeans countries have an advantage with that regard because a lot of the countries are former "colonies" (not sure thats the right word). Holland and France come to mind. I think the main element TFC is missing is an established scouting network in South America. The only issue I have with SOME of these players is that MLS is sometimes proves too physical for them. But their are some Argentines, Brazilians, Colombians and Chileans I would love to have.

jaahuuu
08-06-2008, 03:02 PM
The fact that they spent more on Sundin than our entire roster is moot; the reality is it isn't getting done.

Sundin?!? They've spend more on Jeff Finger than the entire TFC roster.


I thought the DP money came out of the MLS pool.
who pays for the DP salary? The team or the league?
I believe the first $400k comes out, the balance is covered by the owners and doesn't count against the cap.

Shakes McQueen
08-06-2008, 03:03 PM
While I will say that Greg Sutton is pretty lackluster on penalties...that one should have been re-taken. Cooper clearly stutter stepped before he took the shot sending Sutton the wrong way before he intended to kick the ball. As far as my knowledge of footy goes kicks are supposed to be taken in one fluid motion although from all of the games I have watched this 'rule' is very loosely enforced.

In the UEFA Champions League final, C. Ronaldo did a stutter step on his PK. He actually basically stopped half way for a second, and then started again.

- Scott

tlear
08-06-2008, 03:26 PM
Could look at eastern europe as well, better price wise and probably easier to get visas then African countries. Being biased I would love to see a player from Ukraine play for TFC, Canada has a huge Ukrainian community as well.. I actually looked through Dynamo's farm team rosters, maybe we could get someone on loan from them /dream. As much as I hate the teams from Moscow all of them huge development programs so lots of players to look at in Russia as well.

Other then that.. we just need some luck right now, we are not great but we don't suck bad enough to have a winless streak like that.

arbogast
08-06-2008, 03:30 PM
This will be an ongoing issue with African and Asian players, because it's harder to get work visas for players from "lesser" leagues. But the reality is that it's still worth the effort; I remember a similar quote to your point from Mo right after that and he basically seemed to be saying African players aren't worth the bother. I respectfully disagree,and so apparently do most pro teams in France, Germany, Spain and Sweden. While it's easier to work in those nations, that doesn't mean we should just "give up" on that route -- if that's the case.

But those countries probably have very different immigration rules re: African work permits than we do, and we all know our immigration laws are kinda inefficient.

Ossington Mental Youth
08-06-2008, 04:10 PM
I respectfully disagree,and so apparently do most pro teams in France, Germany, Spain and Sweden. While it's easier to work in those nations, that doesn't mean we should just "give up" on that route -- if that's the case.

You and me both

jloome
08-06-2008, 04:11 PM
Our immigration laws are fine, it's a court ruling in 1986 that allows anyone here illegally to stay until they get a hearing that is the problem.

But I get where you're coming from; I just can't believe that if the Ottawa Wizards, or whatever they were called, could get a guy from Botswana in and TFC can't or think it's not worth the time.

Mo would probably engender a lot of fresh confidence if he gave supporters some idea that they're trying these things, of course.

Ossington Mental Youth
08-06-2008, 04:21 PM
yeah, im not surprised seeing as it is Canada, i know plenty of people that have had problems with Canadian immigration (took my bestfriend almost 12 or so years to get his citizenship), but it boggles my mind that hockeyplayers have no issues whatsoever.
It shouldnt differ with footie players as work is guaranteed.

arbogast
08-06-2008, 06:23 PM
yeah, im not surprised seeing as it is Canada, i know plenty of people that have had problems with Canadian immigration (took my bestfriend almost 12 or so years to get his citizenship), but it boggles my mind that hockeyplayers have no issues whatsoever.
It shouldnt differ with footie players as work is guaranteed.


It's because they're mostly from the US and Europe. I know for a fact (I have realtives at Citizenship & Immigration) that it's much harder to get a CDN work permit for an African or South American national.

RPB_RED_NATION_RPB
08-06-2008, 06:40 PM
I thought the DP money came out of the MLS pool.
who pays for the DP salary? The team or the league?


i thought MLS covers up to the 360g's max before your considerd DP.....saying that anything after that MAX you get into DP money wich is coverd by the team!



for example....TFC offer TERRY HENRY :) 3 360 000 a season!

MLS covers the 360 000 wich is under that cap!

and TFC covers the 3mils...skys the limit!!

Anyone confirm that...or know! ? :)

jloome
08-06-2008, 07:07 PM
My understanding is that any team can also match a portion of the MLS-paid capped salary with allocation cash, so that you could offer an $799,000 player a contract without it having to be DP status by using $400,000, the max under the cap, plus $399,000 in allocation.

For DPs my understanding is that the $400,000 is simply how much fits under the cap; the league owns the contract but the teams still pay their own way across the board. There is no limit, as far as I know, on how much you can pay a DP above the $400,000.

James17930
08-06-2008, 09:16 PM
I, personally, from what ive seen with MLSE, am not convinced that they arent willing to spend the money on a quality player, especially after having put money into every other aspect.

I do think that Mo is perhaps (for lack of a better word, and i hesitate to say this) to blame for our lack of striker, along side of the fact that the MLS refuses to pay (for the most part) for transfer fees. I have backed Mo (feel free to check the threads) and only started to doubt him hesistantly near to the signings of our midfielders. I still have alotof faith in him but I do think sometimes his goals are a bit short sighted.

That of course is not to mention the fact that we are located in Toronto and in the MLS.
Once again, its all speculation and i hope we are both proven particularly wrong with a huge signing.

To me that 's one of the biggest problems. The only time MLS are willing to bring a player in is when they can get him for free -- and in a competitive market, that puts the whole league at a huge disadvantage.

Who knows if we could have brought in guys like Hutch or JDG by now, but instead we have to wait until their contracts have expired? In something like this, it has nothing to do with MLSE -- they could be quite willing to pay a guy millions a year in salary, but if MLS balks at paying millions in a transfer fee, than that's the end of it.

Now, is it possible for the F/O of a club to give MLS the transfer fee money back? I don't know about that.