Jozy

[Ossington Mental Youth]

The fuck is going on there. Doesn't bode well but also why re-sign for four years (on either side) if you knew this was an issue. What are possible scenarios to play out? Can't imagine that Manning will be leaving.

[Ultra & Proud]

If he doesn't get hamstring tightness then there is no issue and the training staff is fine. He tweaks it and he's frustrated and has to blame someone. I know nothing of this Italian therapist or whatever he is but it'd be hard to say he's done a bang up job of keeping Jozy healthy for the 3 years he was here. Jozy is Jozy and these things happen but if it's in his head then just hire the guy back.

[ManUtd4ever]

I find it hard to believe that the previous therapist is the only guy that is capable of managing his hamstring issue though.

[ensco]

I don’t think this is quite what it seems. He has his contract, this isn’t about his TFC situation.

But I immediately thought about Jozy’s USMNT spot when I saw that he pulled up lame.

Jozy has one more World Cup shot. The US has no one else at striker. But spots on national teams can evaporate, and of course he is still wearing Trinidad.

He is a proud, proud guy. He wants that last shot. Jozy needs to be the man at the Gold Cup to make sure they don’t start going another way in qualifying.

He probably knows this means now he won’t be in Gold Cup training, or even there at all. If someone else steps up, that may be it for him.

I think what’s pissing him off is he went along with a new training regime (maybe against his better judgment, this is analogous to what happened with Kawhi in San Antonio btw) and it failed, and he melted down and is lashing out.

I also think that if we think playing night games here in April is stupid and creates injury risk, imagine what the players think privately. Manning and the team are supposed to protect them on something like this, but we don’t see them doing that.

Hard to say who is right or wrong -we still don’t know with Kawhi two years after his version of this happened, but unlike Kawhi, Jozy wears his heart on his sleeve.

This is not obviously about Jozy’s love for the crest, and I hope nobody tries to paint it that way.

[Gringo Starr]

I find it hard to believe that the previous therapist is the only guy that is capable of managing his hamstring issue though.

I don't know sometimes the right person makes all the difference, Giggs at United had the same issue with hamstrings until he found his personal Yoga instructor

[shwade]

I don't know sometimes the right person makes all the difference, Giggs at United had the same issue with hamstrings until he found his personal Yoga instructor

If it means no WC qualifying and GC action for Jozy I'm fine with having him out for May..

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Question for me is how are his actions dealt with by FO

[notthesun]

It's not much but Jeff Carlisle's story (http://www.espn.com/soccer/major-league-soccer/story/3829853/jozy-altidore-blasts-toronto-fc-president-over-games-of-ego) on this included this note:


In a text message sent to ESPN FC's Jeff Carlisle, Manning said of Altidore that "he was frustrated" and added that he would talk privately to the U.S. international striker.

I would expect this to be addressed in private... hopefully Manning and Altidore can clear the air publicly after it's been resolved.

[ensco]

If it means no WC qualifying and GC action for Jozy I'm fine with having him out for May..

I'd ask you to reconsider.

If you have ever had people work for you... you will know that you have to support their extracurricular dreams. Even when they interfere with the work. It's how you get the best from them.

When I see the quality of Jozy's goals, I see someone who could become a legend at a World Cup. I hope he gets that shot.

[Hamilton_Red]

I'd ask you to reconsider.

If you have ever had people work for you... you will know that you have to support their extracurricular dreams. Even when they interfere with the work. It's how you get the best from them.

When I see the quality of Jozy's goals, I see someone who could become a legend at a World Cup. I hope he gets that shot.


Well said Ensco. Very well said.

[ensco]

It took me a while to find it... this article implied that Jozy and his agent were negotiating with Tanenbaum as well as “people” at TFC (didn’t name Manning). I thought it was a bit odd at the time.

https://torontosun.com/sports/soccer/mls/toronto-fc/tfcs-altidore-believes-he-still-has-years-to-go-at-top-of-his-game

Tanenbaum dealing directly with players created big messes with the Raptors years ago.

[Bobo]

I can understand Jozy's frustration to a point. He knows he's injury prone, so naturally, he'll want to have the best possible opportunity at staying healthy. And clearly, Jozy and this therapist were on friendly terms. Bit bizarre to call Manning out for being absent (be that as it may).

[Huyton]

Couldn't Jozy hire his own therapist? At 2.2 million US a year, you'd think that there might be a few bucks spare to spend on someone he thinks has made such a big difference.

[ensco]

Couldn't Jozy hire his own therapist? At 2.2 million US a year, you'd think that there might be a few bucks spare to spend on someone he thinks has made such a big difference.

I know the answer in the NBA. It got a lot of airtime there because of Kawhi.

In the NBA, you cannot do this. You have to use the team’s medical/training setup. There is a right to a second opinion, but it’s off an approved list of providers.

Masai’s whole pitch to Kawhi is that he is letting Kawhi’s people “run” the rehab and training.

[zorsofstesab]

I find it hard to believe that the previous therapist is the only guy that is capable of managing his hamstring issue though.

Spot on. MLSE is a multi-billion dollar entity. You cannot tell me they are not capable of finding the best of the best therapists in the world to protect there major investment, the PLAYERS. You telling me the Leafs and Raptors have therapists that are below average? Come on Jozy. This therapist was brought in to please Gio, not you and the others. Yes he may have helped you but by no means is he the only master of his trade. The therapist HAD TO GO, PERIOD!! The ties were too close and it would have created a TOXIC environment this year. Imagine the thought of clubhouse talk being overheard by this therapist and relayed to Gio?

Jozy, do the right thing and apologize to Manning and your teammates. Look long term and admit that frustration took over after the game and you spoke premature.

[shwade]

I'd ask you to reconsider.

If you have ever had people work for you... you will know that you have to support their extracurricular dreams. Even when they interfere with the work. It's how you get the best from them.

When I see the quality of Jozy's goals, I see someone who could become a legend at a World Cup. I hope he gets that shot.

I get it and it's selfish on my part but he's had his shot and his experiences with the US over the years so it's not like this would be his only rodeo. For a guy whos made of glass who just extended his contract and missed most of last year I don't want him tweaking or pulling anything for a "supporter" base that does nothing but abuse him.

[ensco]

I get it and it's selfish on my part but he's had his shot and his experiences with the US over the years so it's not like this would be his only rodeo. For a guy whos made of glass who just extended his contract and missed most of last year I don't want him tweaking or pulling anything for a "supporter" base that does nothing but abuse him.

This is not “wrong” - I just prefer to side with what the player wants, and think we all should (even if, as you say, those fans are ingrates!) Everybody who has a shot at it wants to be a star in a World Cup.

I bet he stayed in part because he would get the minutes he needs to keep/reclaim that USMNT spot (that would be a major cost of going to, say, Tigres).

I think it's weird that a player of his stature seemingly feels so excluded from decision making around training. I wonder if he was promised influence by Tanenbaum in his contract talks.... but Manning/Curtis aren’t inclined to give this up.

I think the Tanenbaum/Manning relationship bears watching. Manning running to Gareth Wheeler to explain how he had the sole authority to increase the bid for Pozo was out of character for him (and seemed unlikely to be true to me). What was that really about?

[shwade]

This is not “wrong” - I just prefer to side with what the player wants, and think we all should (even if, as you say, those fans are ingrates!) Everybody who has a shot at it wants to be a star in a World Cup.

I bet he stayed in part because he would get the minutes he needs to keep/reclaim that USMNT spot (that would be a major cost of going to, say, Tigres).

I think it's weird that a player of his stature seemingly feels so excluded from decision making around training. I wonder if he was promised influence by Tanenbaum in his contract talks.... but Manning/Curtis aren’t inclined to give this up.

I think the Tanenbaum/Manning relationship bears watching. Manning running to Gareth Wheeler to explain how he had the sole authority to increase the bid for Pozo was out of character for him (and seemed unlikely to be true to me). What was that really about?

Looks like Giuseppe is back now.

Jozy got what he wanted pretty fast lol.

[Bellzy]

Looks like Giuseppe treatments have restarted

[Carter]

Spot on. MLSE is a multi-billion dollar entity. You cannot tell me they are not capable of finding the best of the best therapists in the world to protect there major investment, the PLAYERS. You telling me the Leafs and Raptors have therapists that are below average? Come on Jozy. This therapist was brought in to please Gio, not you and the others. Yes he may have helped you but by no means is he the only master of his trade. The therapist HAD TO GO, PERIOD!! The ties were too close and it would have created a TOXIC environment this year. Imagine the thought of clubhouse talk being overheard by this therapist and relayed to Gio?

Jozy, do the right thing and apologize to Manning and your teammates. Look long term and admit that frustration took over after the game and you spoke premature.

When you are wrong, you are wrong...

Jozy and Gio are friends, you think they don’t talk about “clubhouse talk” already?

just because a player is transferred doesn’t end friends that were forged in fire and championship wins for the last few years. Try and think of it in a business world, you build a relationship with a co-worker, become friends, they leave for something else, do you stop talking to them?

I feel eel like you have an inner hate for Jozy, and someone speaking their mind, but it’s moot.. The therapist is back and hopefully can manage Jozy’s Hamstring before next weekend.

[stegosaurus]

Looks like Giuseppe treatments have restarted

Hooked on those Italian horse placenta drips.

[paul-collins]

Looks like Giuseppe treatments have restarted
Big if true

source?

[Voodooman]

Jozy's Instagram. He just posted a photo.

https://twitter.com/joshuakloke/status/1120117752549666816

[OgtheDim]

And now back to your regularly scheduled program.

[DinamoTFC]

Props to Bill Manning for working this out amicably. Both sides happy will mean a better team and that's all that matters.

[ensco]

I don’t have an opinion on this until we hear from someone at TFC and we learn how badly Jozy was hurt

[James17930]

Props to Bill Manning for working this out amicably. Both sides happy will mean a better team and that's all that matters.

Yes, but Jozy still needs to be fined.

I mean, you just can't do what he did and have no consequences.

[69Chevy396]

Yes, but Jozy still needs to be fined.

I mean, you just can't do what he did and have no consequences.
Fined? This isn’t high school intramurals, and a pro athletes of Altidore’s stature should be respected.

[Auzzy]

If he doesn't get hamstring tightness then there is no issue and the training staff is fine. He tweaks it and he's frustrated and has to blame someone. I know nothing of this Italian therapist or whatever he is but it'd be hard to say he's done a bang up job of keeping Jozy healthy for the 3 years he was here. Jozy is Jozy and these things happen but if it's in his head then just hire the guy back.


Spot on. MLSE is a multi-billion dollar entity. You cannot tell me they are not capable of finding the best of the best therapists in the world to protect there major investment, the PLAYERS. You telling me the Leafs and Raptors have therapists that are below average? Come on Jozy. This therapist was brought in to please Gio, not you and the others. Yes he may have helped you but by no means is he the only master of his trade. The therapist HAD TO GO, PERIOD!! The ties were too close and it would have created a TOXIC environment this year. Imagine the thought of clubhouse talk being overheard by this therapist and relayed to Gio?

Jozy, do the right thing and apologize to Manning and your teammates. Look long term and admit that frustration took over after the game and you spoke premature.

Altidore hasn't had hamstring or other muscular problems since 2016. Latest problems were a torn ligament; and bone fragments that had to be cleaned out via surgery. Not things that training or therapy can do much about (but carefully managing the recovery from surgery is crucial). It seems his training & therapy regime were helping for the things he can control, up to now.

Plus TFC had a huge amount of muscular & other health/fitness issues last year (and other years), amongst players that weren't with this Italian guy. So yes the "multi-million dollar entity" seems to have trouble keeping its players healthy. There were other reasons in 2018, like the short off-season before that, double load of CCL + MLS, etc., but TFC (outside of the Italian guy) certainly wasn't doing a "bang-up" job of keeping its roster healthy, via therapy, training, rotation, having adequate cover for players, etc.

Anyway, the guy's back, he obviously didn't have to go. I'm very thankful to Manning & Altidore for working this out quickly, and I doubt they'll be a fine because the quick resolution tells me they thought that Altidore had a point.

[Auzzy]

Good point here on Twitter, the way this gets resolved in the end... :D


BigCountryFooty ���� ⚽️ @BigCountryFooty2 hours ago
Replying to @TSG_Toronto @joshuakloke
You are right. His penance for this sin will be to score 3 game winning goals in the next 3 games he plays and then 2 game winning assists. Kinda of like rosary beads of footy.

https://twitter.com/BigCountryFooty/status/1120122218418036736

[James17930]

Fined? This isn’t high school intramurals, and a pro athletes of Altidore’s stature should be respected.

Yeah, it isn't high school, it's professional sports, where players are held to a professional standard.

Players get fined by clubs all the time for things as 'small' as being late to practice; I can't imagine how publically insulting the club president isn't way worse than that.

Don't get me wrong – I do love and respect Jozy; but not having him face any repercussions here sets a bad precedent.

[barticusz]

Altidore With Giuseppe Gueli on IG. “Back to Work”. Guess this is all resolved now?

[Bushmancan]

Yeah, it isn't high school, it's professional sports, where players are held to a professional standard.

Players get fined by clubs all the time for things as 'small' as being late to practice; I can't imagine how publically insulting the club president isn't way worse than that.

Don't get me wrong – I do love and respect Jozy; but not having him face any repercussions here sets a bad precedent.

I would normally agree with you but I have seen very few athletes who put in everything for the team, at the expense of themselves (those other guys are callled Nylanders and skate big circles (ooops wrong thread). Jozy and Michael are why I love TFC! I don't disagree that he was over the top but if I had to choose a player like that and one who would be content with sitting and being injured because they have a 4 or 6 year contract, I would chose a Jozy every time. I sincerely believe he was more injured than we realize in the cup run but kept playing. I do hope Jozy gets better and they reconcile because if you look at the stats, he is so ridiculously valuable to this team.

I also think you saw a great deal of leadership in Bradley who took to defending the team and Jozy. These are the guys sweaters that you hang from the rafters one day, not because they were great but because they give everything for the club. TFC Til I Die.

[ensco]

I don’t have an opinion on this until we hear from someone at TFC and we learn how badly Jozy was hurt

This is bizarre. Jozy's weird tweet last night (was that treatment authorized by the team?) but nothing else from anyone? 3 days later?

Hey TFC beat reporters, can you guys, um, ask Manning and Jozy a couple of obvious questions? Or at least tell us you tried?

[Areathrasher]

This is bizarre. Jozy's weird tweet last night (was that treatment authorized by the team?) but nothing else from anyone? 3 days later?

Hey TFC beat reporters, can you guys, um, ask Manning and Jozy a couple of obvious questions? Or at least tell us you tried?



https://twitter.com/KristianJack/status/1120357408474324994

https://twitter.com/joshuakloke/status/1120358506693922820

He's out for 2-3 weeks. More quotes on twitter

[Section_105]

<ALL THE GOOD INFO>
props, thanks mate

[ensco]

https://twitter.com/KristianJack/status/1120357408474324994

https://twitter.com/joshuakloke/status/1120358506693922820

He's out for 2-3 weeks. More quotes on twitter

OK it's all good.
Jozy USMNT role not obviously threatened.
Case closed.
Thanks

[Areathrasher]

Article from Molinaro https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/altidore-tfc-president-resolve-issues-trainer/

[OgtheDim]

Jozy apology

https://twitter.com/JozyAltidore/status/1120382305871237121

[portu]

If Jozy's out for 3 weeks that's another 4 games without him. That'd be 7 games out of 13 matches injured, which is gracious considering he played a third of the match against New England.

[ManUtd4ever]

Well that's a relief on many fronts. The prognosis could have been much worse.

[paul-collins]

Article from Molinaro https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/altidore-tfc-president-resolve-issues-trainer/
Manning comparing Jozy to a tantrum-throwing child? Hmm

[DinamoTFC]

They both embarrassed each other a little no big deal. They can move on now. Jozy apologizes publicly after Manning's comments. The rest will be handled internally if there is more to it. But it's done. Move on we are fine.

[JuliquE]

They both embarrassed each other a little no big deal. They can move on now. Jozy apologizes publicly after Manning's comments. The rest will be handled internally if there is more to it. But it's done. Move on we are fine.
Tend to agree; didn't read the tantrum quotes until after I heard about them, here… but, having read them, I think it's much ado about nothing.

Found his comparison apt, and served as the perfect segue into him speaking to his love for, and, now, strengthened relationship with, Jozy.

[ensco]

Post game interviews are just stupid. The whole culture around these needs to change.

They are 98% insipid mindless bromides combined with 2% incendiary stupidity (usually gotcha exercises, or heat of the moment things like Jozy's)

I cannot remember that last time I learned a single useful thing from one of these interviews in any sport. We get 1000x the level of insight on this board, than anyone has ever gotten out of an interview with a player postgame.

If I have to watch Michael Bradley fence with a reporter postgame ever again, I will stab myself in the eye.

This isn’t 1967 anymore. With social media and the 24/7 culture, there has to be a different way. Leave the players alone after the game.

[OgtheDim]

I get a lot out of Bradley after a game - Moor is not bad too - they give you an insight into how they think, which given those are the two most cerebral players on the squad, is useful. Less so the rest of the current squad. Seba was kinda fun in an incendiary way - it allowed us to see why he was so pissed off. Poz has been pretty much bromides.

The post match interview with Vanney is a necessity if you want to understand why things were done in a certain way - don't always agree but there is a reasoning.

[Section_105]

I want to ride my bicycle.....

https://twitter.com/TorontoFC/status/1144076518701899776

jozy with a wicked finish to get the US the win