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View Full Version : Match Day 5 - The Night The Reds Drive Old Dixie Down - ATL @TFC Sat, April 8 7:30 PM



Red CB Toronto
03-31-2017, 11:41 PM
Let the conversation commence here.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jREUrbGGrgM

OgtheDim
04-01-2017, 06:36 AM
Atlanta drew last night. A few Atlanta journos were surprised at how poor Atlanta played but they havn't faced a decent team away before. Going to require a very disciplined defensive performance.

Eg. of how they operate. When defending a corner kick, they leave two forwards up back near the centre circle.

SoccMan2
04-01-2017, 07:51 AM
Watched a bit of their game versus Seattle last night, did not see the whole game but from what I saw they could have actually won the game late in the game, they had some great chances to win it. They were missing their top scorer who I don't think will be there Saturday either. However, this is a dangerous team and play a brand of soccer that I've never seen in the MLS. If the TFC team of the MLS CUP final and of last night's game shows up who can't finish their chances and who has trouble unlocking a defensive then we are in for our first loss I'm sorry to say, this Atlanta team plays a brand of soccer where goals are not usually tough to score.

jloome
04-02-2017, 02:07 PM
Watched a bit of their game versus Seattle last night, did not see the whole game but from what I saw they could have actually won the game late in the game, they had some great chances to win it. They were missing their top scorer who I don't think will be there Saturday either. However, this is a dangerous team and play a brand of soccer that I've never seen in the MLS. If the TFC team of the MLS CUP final and of last night's game shows up who can't finish their chances and who has trouble unlocking a defensive then we are in for our first loss I'm sorry to say, this Atlanta team plays a brand of soccer where goals are not usually tough to score.

On the strength of performances so far, Almiron is maybe the best player in the league. He looks on a different level in the way Seba did when he came in. So does Martinez, who knows how to beat a trap cold.

69Chevy396
04-02-2017, 02:32 PM
On the strength of performances so far, Almiron is maybe the best player in the league. He looks on a different level in the way Seba did when he came in. So does Martinez, who knows how to beat a trap cold.
Atlanta is good for the league, but it would be nice if Seba finally sinks a few much needed goals.

Richard
04-02-2017, 03:52 PM
With the latest injury to Irwin the club should move on. Alex Bono is the #1 goal keeper for this club.

PizzaEatingYeti
04-02-2017, 07:25 PM
This is a must win for TFC in my book, and the most difficult game so far this season.

I know 75% of all of you guys will say it's no problem at all if still just a draw.
But with another draw, for me the season start with 1 win and 4 draws, and with just 7 points from 15 possible will look even worst than mediocre...

Derko
04-03-2017, 05:54 AM
Atlanta drew last night. A few Atlanta journos were surprised at how poor Atlanta played but they havn't faced a decent team away before. Going to require a very disciplined defensive performance.

Eg. of how they operate. When defending a corner kick, they leave two forwards up back near the centre circle.

Always wondered why TFC does not do this more often

Derko
04-03-2017, 05:57 AM
This is a must win for TFC in my book, and the most difficult game so far this season.

I know 75% of all of you guys will say it's no problem at all if still just a draw.
But with another draw, for me the season start with 1 win and 4 draws, and with just 7 points from 15 possible will look even worst than mediocre...

I agree that it is a must win for confidence and cohesions sake, not for overall results in the table

burlington Red
04-03-2017, 10:49 AM
I'd like to see Moor up his game on the ball. His passing v KC was poor but also he was very reluctant to come out from the back with the ball, even when KC were dropping deep and giving him the space. It was set up for him to come with forward with the ball and give it to mid and work the ball but he too often he just lumped it aimlessly forward and it went out or straight back to KC. We shouldn't be bypassing our mid, we have the players like Bradley and Vasquez who have or should have the ability to make the passes and break down the other teams defence.

Cashcleaner
04-03-2017, 11:15 AM
I agree that TFC needs to pick up the full three points against Atlanta, but they are definitely not going to make it easy. We gotta disrupt their offense and dictate more of the pace then we did in the game against KC. I have faith in Bono, I just hope our Defence can pick up more slack for the guy.

Initial B
04-03-2017, 12:13 PM
I don't see Atlanta playing a bunkering style like SKC. I think they'll match attack for attack. Should be a barn-burner of a game this weekend.

Yohan
04-03-2017, 01:05 PM
I don't see Atlanta playing a bunkering style like SKC. I think they'll match attack for attack. Should be a barn-burner of a game this weekend.

And they will. Atl almost came away with a win at Seattle and they took it to Seattle. Make sense, because their defence can be suspect at times and their attack esp through their flanks is something dangerous with veterans Garza and Mears providing some excellent overlaps from fullback positions. And they will likely start Almiron and Carmona along with rest of their usuals minus Martinez who's out injured. Key is to test their GK Kann who is either a diamond in the rough playing his heart out to not to lose his spot when Guzan comes in the summer or an inexperienced guy who's just riding out a lucky streak.

Canary10
04-03-2017, 03:35 PM
We need to win because Atlanta needs a good spanking to knock them back down to earth.

mistercorporate
04-03-2017, 03:46 PM
We need to win because Atlanta needs a good spanking to knock them back down to earth.

Quoted for truth! :D

CBTFC
04-03-2017, 07:02 PM
Atlanta are the scariest expansion team MLS has ever seen, led by their core of young, skilled & creative south american players.

Should be an entertaining match, to say the least.

Derko
04-03-2017, 09:06 PM
Atlanta are the scariest expansion team MLS has ever seen, led by their core of young, skilled & creative south american players.

Should be an entertaining match, to say the least.

Good hard clean tackles in midfield, I am fed up with this boring recycling possession football Vanney is preaching, it's MLS go for the fucking net and strike the fucking ball.


Just my 2 cents

Fort York Redcoat
04-04-2017, 07:59 AM
Atlanta are the scariest expansion team MLS has ever seen, led by their core of young, skilled & creative south american players.

Should be an entertaining match, to say the least.

On form and on paper, sure, but until they win it all this year Chicago should hold that title for their first year double.

notthesun
04-04-2017, 12:33 PM
https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/849310191590010882

OgtheDim
04-04-2017, 04:06 PM
Get ready for some weirdnesss




Toronto FC v Atlanta United
BMO Field (7:30pm ET)
REF: DAVE GANTAR
AR1: Philippe Briere
AR2: Jason White
4TH: Geoff Gamble

Red I
04-04-2017, 04:41 PM
Get ready for some weirdnesss


Toronto FC v Atlanta United
BMO Field (7:30pm ET)
REF: DAVE GANTAR
AR1: Philippe Briere
AR2: Jason White
4TH: Geoff Gamble

(fart noise)

Hamilton_Red
04-04-2017, 10:37 PM
We need to win because Atlanta needs a good spanking to knock them back down to earth.


Good hard clean tackles in midfield, I am fed up with this boring recycling possession football Vanney is preaching, it's MLS go for the fucking net and strike the fucking ball.


Just my 2 cents Damn - I am missing Will Johnson already. It's time for Giovinco to get going again. We need to show that we were the better team than Seattle...no more excuses the season is on.

Section_105
04-05-2017, 11:21 AM
Get ready for some weirdnesss
Toronto FC v Atlanta United
BMO Field (7:30pm ET)
REF: DAVE GANTAR
AR1: Philippe Briere
AR2: Jason White
4TH: Geoff Gamble

damn. I was unhappy with Alan Kelly last game but now I'm wishing he was taking this one as well now.....$5 on a red card being issues to Toronto for something that wouldn't be a yellow in a timbit league.

noimpactinmtl
04-05-2017, 12:14 PM
Good hard clean tackles in midfield, I am fed up with this boring recycling possession football Vanney is preaching, it's MLS go for the fucking net and strike the fucking ball.


Just my 2 cents

Good positioning>good tackles

Otherwise Pep Guardiola would have never became the defensive mid he was despite having poor tackling skills. Though yes, possessive football is more defensive in nature because the more you have the ball, the less chances your opponents have to score.

ag futbol
04-05-2017, 01:58 PM
damn. I was unhappy with Alan Kelly last game but now I'm wishing he was taking this one as well now.....$5 on a red card being issues to Toronto for something that wouldn't be a yellow in a timbit league.
I hate Gantar but a tightly controlled game is usually in our favour. We tend to be on the receiving end more often than we dish it out.

molenshtain
04-05-2017, 02:03 PM
Was Gantar the one Bradley publicly humiliated a couple years ago? or was that Geiger? I get the two mixed up.

OgtheDim
04-05-2017, 02:51 PM
Gantar - after the Gilberto called back goal in Chicago, IIRC.

OgtheDim
04-06-2017, 06:00 AM
Weather

8 degrees and sunny at kickoff time. Light winds.

So, coolish but not wet

OgtheDim
04-06-2017, 09:22 AM
FWIW

Atlanta beat reporter's predicted lineup for AU

http://www.ajc.com/sports/predicting-atlanta-united-against-toronto/H2LAtEISWpzPz5r8aRfaNP/

C.Ronaldo
04-06-2017, 02:25 PM
Damn - I am missing Will Johnson already. It's time for Giovinco to get going again. We need to show that we were the better team than Seattle...no more excuses the season is on.

we
miss will b/c cooper hasnt been the guy that got him the contract. the extra competition hopefully lights a flame under his shorts

ensco
04-07-2017, 10:31 AM
Weather

8 degrees and sunny at kickoff time. Light winds.

So, coolish but not wet

Field will be soup, I think. We got a lot of rain.

ag futbol
04-07-2017, 12:09 PM
I think missing Will Johnson is overdone. We're a team that's keeping clean sheets but having issues scoring goals. He's the luxury version of Delgado - great ball winner and bulldog in midfield but at this stange in MLS he doesn't offer a whole ton going forward. He is not the quickest to move the ball through midfield and against teams that are bunkering to keep us contained that doesn't help. Good player, not what we need at this stage.

The issue is Cooper, Osorio, and Vasquez need to step up and play better. They are here to chip in with attacking onus from midfield but that's been mostly absent.

There's a real opportunity for Chapman here is he can get off the bench. These guys should start feeling some heat for their spots.

OgtheDim
04-07-2017, 12:42 PM
Field will be soup, I think. We got a lot of rain.

Well all that sand underneath should soak up something I suppose. :)

Rain and slop has pretty much stopped. With proper drainage it should be Ok. It won't be a good pitch but it should be better then last week.


*********

Morrow available for selection. About as strong a squad as we can provide.

We should win this game - not handily but we should be winning this.

Fort York Redcoat
04-07-2017, 12:46 PM
I think missing Will Johnson is overdone. We're a team that's keeping clean sheets but having issues scoring goals. He's the luxury version of Delgado - great ball winner and bulldog in midfield but at this stange in MLS he doesn't offer a whole ton going forward. He is not the quickest to move the ball through midfield and against teams that are bunkering to keep us contained that doesn't help. Good player, not what we need at this stage.

The issue is Cooper, Osorio, and Vasquez need to step up and play better. They are here to chip in with attacking onus from midfield but that's been mostly absent.

There's a real opportunity for Chapman here is he can get off the bench. These guys should start feeling some heat for their spots.

Agree and I miss Johnson but that chapter and team is done. Without him there should be a subtle new chemistry to the team and those you mention need to change it. I think they can.

Looking forward to seeing it as early as tomorrow.

ag futbol
04-07-2017, 12:55 PM
Regarding the rain: do they not tarp the field here on occasion?

MightyDM
04-07-2017, 01:05 PM
Field will be soup, I think. We got a lot of rain.

doesn't it have pipes that actually suck liquid out of the ground? I think it is resilient that way, as long as it stays dry for the rest of today

ensco
04-07-2017, 01:10 PM
This is the first real test of the field.

C.Ronaldo
04-07-2017, 01:13 PM
I think missing Will Johnson is overdone. We're a team that's keeping clean sheets but having issues scoring goals. He's the luxury version of Delgado - great ball winner and bulldog in midfield but at this stange in MLS he doesn't offer a whole ton going forward. He is not the quickest to move the ball through midfield and against teams that are bunkering to keep us contained that doesn't help. Good player, not what we need at this stage.

The issue is Cooper, Osorio, and Vasquez need to step up and play better. They are here to chip in with attacking onus from midfield but that's been mostly absent.

There's a real opportunity for Chapman here is he can get off the bench. These guys should start feeling some heat for their spots.

chapman has looked fantastic in TFC2. he will be here soon enough or traded for something decent

Areathrasher
04-07-2017, 01:25 PM
They got that big tarp thing to cover the pitch. I imagine it's been in use most of the week.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5rPsvhWQAAjezz.jpg

OgtheDim
04-07-2017, 01:41 PM
For those thinking of going to Downsview for parking and then TTCing it down...go to Finch.

https://twitter.com/TTChelps/status/850408171638317058

Auzzy
04-07-2017, 06:39 PM
doesn't it have pipes that actually suck liquid out of the ground? I think it is resilient that way, as long as it stays dry for the rest of today

Yes they have pipes ("SubAir System") that suck water down through the sand and away for drainage; or they can pump in air from below to help with drying & aeration once the rain is done. Plus they have a subsurface glycol/water heating coils to help; and new this year they have the grow lights from above. Add in sunny & windy conditions most of today & all day tomorrow, 8 degrees, which will help as well..

The pitch itself is only a few months old, so there's always the question how well it holds up in the first while. But they have all the environmental conditions to help.

The biggest problems were in the first 1-2 years of grass, when they used the wrong substrate below the grass, so the water wouldn't drain despite all the technology. (Remember the pitchfork at the rain-delayed VC game vs Vancouver?) That's why they had to redo the grass & subsurface a 2nd time in the early years. Also brutal cold winters about 3 - 4 years ago were a problem, before they had the thick winter tarp, permission to use chemicals against mold & mildew, and grow lights. That's all changed.

BTW the new tarp shown above was specifically for the winter. Does anyone know if they ever bother tarping just for rain? I haven't seen any tarps recently on the "BMO Grounds Crew" Twitter feed...

CBTFC
04-07-2017, 09:24 PM
I'm in Ottawa for work this weekend. Any TFC friendly bars in the area I could catch the game at?

OgtheDim
04-08-2017, 06:44 AM
Game Day :scarf:

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 08:32 AM
Johnson had 2 Goals and 5 Assists & Cup winning goal...our most productive mid-fielder despite breaking his leg for one of the goals. Was pissed off at not getting his spot back when healthy & that pressure I'm sure was felt by the guys getting the starts. Cooper got his deal and doesn't have Johnson breathing down his neck - he has been anonymous so far this season. So has Vasquez - who we can be a bit more patient with. Osorio cost us the three points last week. This group really has to step up and get going.

I do have to let go of my bitterness about letting Will Johnson go - I just wish this club would treat our best Canadian players better.

Joe Kool
04-08-2017, 08:39 AM
I usually always want TFC to win but tonight I REALLY want them to win. Someone needs to knock the cockiness out of Atlanta fans. If they win tonight they will be declaring themselves MLS Cup shoe ins. They haven't got a "welcome to MLS" beating that every expeansion team usually gets. Hope it is tonight and would be good for TFC to get a win at home.

ensco
04-08-2017, 08:53 AM
I don't think you can really discuss Johnson v Cooper until the salaries come out in May.

My fear is that Cooper makes a lot more than we think he does.

Areathrasher
04-08-2017, 10:00 AM
I don't think you can really discuss Johnson v Cooper until the salaries come out in May.

My fear is that Cooper makes a lot more than we think he does.

His transfer fee is going to be included in his salary so it's gonna skew things somewhat.

brucethemoose
04-08-2017, 12:53 PM
agreed.

GerMc
04-08-2017, 02:47 PM
Not sure that I would agree that Vazquez has been anonymous. In Vancouver he scored a goal and sent in a beautiful pass that let Osorio make a great play to Altidore for the other goal. That has been our only win so far, and yes we scored those goals against 10 men, but, Canadian pride aside, I would take Vazquez over Will Johnson in a heartbeat. I think he is still working his way up to match fitness and getting used to the team, but I suspect we are just seeing the tip of the iceberg...

CBTFC
04-08-2017, 03:50 PM
Jeebus give Vasquez some time. lol.

New city, culture, teammates/etc. Let him get a few proper warm weather games under his belt. He's just fine so far.

Our defence will have its first true test of the season tonight, IMO. ATL's crop of young south american's are a whole other beast.

James17930
04-08-2017, 05:43 PM
Am I correct that Martinez is injured and won't play today? If so, that's a lucky break.

Also, it may sound weird to say this early in the season, but this seems like a must-win game. If we don't pick up maximum points we're going to stuck around the middle of the conference, and with Chicago, Columbus and Atlanta all being better than expected, we're already going to start falling a bit behind. Draws on the road are fine, but we've gotta start maxmizing on home games.

notthesun
04-08-2017, 06:11 PM
TFC lineup: https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/850838164893605888

Atlanta lineup: https://twitter.com/ATLUTD/status/850841410697908229

Even Atlanta is putting out a bit more of a defensive lineup than usual. It is too unappreciative/snobby of me to complain that now that we're actually good, all we're gonna see at home is teams parking the bus against us? Probably. I guess the solution is to prove we can hurt teams when they do it.

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 06:29 PM
Guys, I will much appreciate if you post if you have good online streams, available from the US too.
Sometimes there are super quality streams are on Youtube, but those are never listed (probably because if listed, would be taken down fast), and are almost impossible to find.

0bl1vious
04-08-2017, 06:42 PM
The only stream I've tracked down so far

http://cricfree.sc/watch/live/toronto-fc-vs-atlanta-united-live-streaming

0bl1vious
04-08-2017, 06:44 PM
Youtube stream

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZ5209fzabA&feature=player_embedded

woolly
04-08-2017, 06:45 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZ5209fzabA

molenshtain
04-08-2017, 06:49 PM
seriously how hard is it for people to get to the game on time?

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 06:50 PM
Youtube stream

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZ5209fzabA&feature=player_embedded

Great, thanks!!!

nonc
04-08-2017, 06:51 PM
If anyone does something for ATL I expect Almiron.

James17930
04-08-2017, 06:54 PM
The Youtube stream is good, but it's at least a min behind.

So beware of spoilers!

James17930
04-08-2017, 06:57 PM
The turf's looking pretty slippery.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:04 PM
Fuck, well at least playing it safe is out. Time to score some goals.

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:04 PM
Yeesh.....

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:05 PM
Jesus Bono that was pathetic!

Mavinga left for dead there as well

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:05 PM
Atrocious from Bono there. Not too great from Mavinga, either.

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:05 PM
Geez.

That was nuts.

This game is flying.

Redcoe15
04-08-2017, 07:06 PM
wtf tfc??!!!

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:06 PM
I think Bradley is sitting way too deep – he needs to step up and support further up the field.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:06 PM
Lol Gantar, what are you doing?

CBTFC
04-08-2017, 07:07 PM
a toad a so

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:08 PM
TFC losing, Jays can barely get a hit and the Leafs aren't winning either.....Toronto sports, catch the excitement!

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:08 PM
I think Bradley is sitting way too deep – he needs to step up and support further up the field.
I don't think that's wise. You see how fast Almiron springs the forwards when he is allowed space. We need to blanket him out.

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:09 PM
That was fast.....turns channel to the Jays game quickly.....ha ha ha....

Redcoe15
04-08-2017, 07:09 PM
GIO!!!!!

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:09 PM
Yeesss!! Seba's back!!

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:10 PM
I don't think that's wise. You see how fast Almiron springs the forwards when he is allowed space. We need to blanket him out.

But with him sitting that deep every time we need to cycle it in their end it ends up going back too far and he sends it back to the keeper.

But hey, Gio on the board!

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:13 PM
This is already more exiting than every game so far this season put together.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:14 PM
Vazquez has been terrible tonight. He can't trap the ball, can't pass, then that fresh air swipe... I hope he improves

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:14 PM
Vasquez is moving slowly. Is he hurt, or just that slow? The ball in to Altidore was great.

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:17 PM
Vazquez has been terrible tonight. He can't trap the ball, can't pass, then that fresh air swipe... I hope he improves
Apart from the sweet setup that lead to the goal, right?

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:18 PM
Oh Jozy.....

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:18 PM
Jozy Jozy Jozy... what was that?

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:19 PM
Vasquez is moving slowly. Is he hurt, or just that slow? The ball in to Altidore was great.

I think that's just his game. He wants to control and distribute. He doesn't run so much.

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:21 PM
I think that's just his game. He wants to control and distribute. He doesn't run so much.
Yeah, seems like it.

The pitch doesnt look very good this week. It must be tough to have winter, spring, winter and spring again all in one week.

SirBobSaget
04-08-2017, 07:22 PM
Bono' passing jeesh hasn't connected any

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:23 PM
Yeah, seems like it.

The pitch doesnt look very good this week. It must be tough to have winter, spring, winter and spring again all in one week.

Yeah. Hopefully it dries up during the game.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:24 PM
Apart from the sweet setup that lead to the goal, right?
Touché...

Arguably the only thing that's come off for him though

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:25 PM
Cooper has finally snapped out of it.

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:26 PM
Arggh! Waited too long.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:31 PM
Fuck do we not do finishing drills in practice? Arrrgggg

CBTFC
04-08-2017, 07:31 PM
Vasquez is lookin' wicked out there tonight

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 07:32 PM
Vasquez is Haveron hg a good game so far - much better. If we had shooting boots - it would be 5-1 by now.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:33 PM
Yeeessss!! A goal was coming down that flank. Great play from Beta and good finish from Morrow

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 07:34 PM
That was a cracker..

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:34 PM
Touché...

Arguably the only thing that's come off for him though
seems like he's getting better. And there's a fantastic play for Beitashour to set up Morrow. Vasquez is smart and has great vision. He seems to know how to wait. He's been very strong in the last 20-25 minutes.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:35 PM
Vasquez is lookin' wicked out there tonight
You can thank me. As soon as I criticize a player they start to turn it on. First twenty minutes he was failing over his own feet. He's played a few nice passes now, but still prone to flap at things, like his bicycle kick

Hes coming onto a game but started very fragile tonight

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:35 PM
Fucking A!

What a great game so far.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:36 PM
Great half. It's nice to see someone come in and not park the bus on us.

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:36 PM
TFC losing, Jays can barely get a hit and the Leafs aren't winning either.....Toronto sports, catch the excitement!

As I was saying..... ;)

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:37 PM
seems like he's getting better. And there's a fantastic play for Beitashour to set up Morrow. Vasquez is smart and has great vision. He seems to know how to wait. He's been very strong in the last 20-25 minutes.
Always seems to be the case when I criticize someone... :o

James17930
04-08-2017, 07:39 PM
So was that free kick thing – where Vasquez went to take it and Gio looked kinda pissed, then Vasquez chipped it to him – something they might have practiced? Make Atlanta think Gio is uninterested then try to stab them quickly?

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:40 PM
Always seems to be the case when I criticize someone... :o
LOL can you criticize Jozy and Seba?

But in seriousness, you can see that Barcelona academy midfield style in Vasquez. Head on a pivot and slowing it down to look for runs. He seems to read the play very well in terms of putting the ball in dangerous places.

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:41 PM
So was that free kick thing – where Vasquez went to take it and Gio looked kinda pissed, then Vasquez chipped it to him – something they might have practiced? Make Atlanta think Gio is uninterested then try to stab them quickly?
I think as Vasquez, Altidore and Giovinco develop some chemistry, it's going to be beautiful.

SirBobSaget
04-08-2017, 07:47 PM
Tfc dominating the midfield,so many interceptions. Atlantas attempts to play it out for a gk always ending in shambles. Seems every foreign coach comes in trying that.

Only time Atlanta looks dangerous is quick balls to the wing. Tfc needs to blow them away and make a statement . Should be at least 3-0 at half. Want to see this finish 4-1

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:47 PM
Nice to see Morrow back, as good as Edwards was, Justin is a step above. Cooper and Bradley doing well in midfield getting the attack going, although they need to stay wary of the counter. Séba and Jozy not quite at their sharpest, if they were this game would be out of sight already. The back three look solid enough although they can't afford to get into a foot race with the Atlanta front line as we saw with Mavinga at their goal

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 07:49 PM
Great first half, should be 3-1, at least.
We still miss exasperantly many chances, I really hope that won't bite FTC's ass by the end of the game.

PS: Welcome back Gio, after 4 months.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:50 PM
LOL can you criticize Jozy and Seba?

But in seriousness, you can see that Barcelona academy midfield style in Vasquez. Head on a pivot and slowing it down to look for runs. He seems to read the play very well in terms of putting the ball in dangerous places.
i must be honest m8, im not fully convinced by him yet. He often looks more like the guy who couldn't cut it at the Barca academy rather than a product of it. However I'll give him time, as there are glimpses in his play he has talent.

tfcfans
04-08-2017, 07:53 PM
This is just sad....

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:54 PM
Dude, how many times is Mavinga going to lose his man? He's just lucky he didn't go down and get red carded.

SirBobSaget
04-08-2017, 07:54 PM
Sub in hagglund mavinga is a disaster

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:54 PM
Dreadful goal to give up. Mavinga caught twice now. Can we have Hagglund back please?

Bono isn't looking too sharp tonight either...

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 07:55 PM
This is a fucking disgrace.
2 chances 2 goals.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 07:55 PM
Gantar is awful.

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:56 PM
i must be honest m8, im not fully convinced by him yet. He often looks more like the guy who couldn't cut it at the Barca academy rather than a product of it. However I'll give him time, as there are glimpses in his play he has talent.
He played 118 matches for Barça B, which is a pretty damn good team. Even if you aren't the best player at La Masia, you learn a lot. Look at how many La Masia products are scattered around top-level teams in the world.


On on another note...
Mavinga beaten for pace again and another goal right through Bono. What the fuck?

Ajax TFC
04-08-2017, 07:56 PM
I won't directly place blame on mavinga for the breakaway, but I can't figure out what he was trying to do by jumping around the back side of the attacker. Just get goalside

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 07:58 PM
Dreadful goal to give up. Mavinga caught twice now. Can we have Hagglund back please?

Bono isn't looking too sharp tonight either...
Thank you Mr Vanney. I think that was a message he needed to send

Jack
04-08-2017, 07:58 PM
Gantar is awful.
The officiating in this league ruins so many games.

nonc
04-08-2017, 08:00 PM
Very unlike Vanney to just hand over a position, Mavinga and him punished for no Hagglund.

SirBobSaget
04-08-2017, 08:00 PM
Whoever keeps bringing in garbage euro defenders like kantari perquis and mavinga needs to be fired out of a cannon

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:01 PM
Cooper on fire tonight.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:21 PM
How the fuck is that not a card? Gantas was right there.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 08:21 PM
That was a sneaky elbow. Any officials see it?

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:22 PM
LOL Gantar strikes again.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 08:22 PM
So did he call that or was it the replay centre?

daner90
04-08-2017, 08:22 PM
red!

Ajax TFC
04-08-2017, 08:23 PM
Lol did Gantar see a replay and then give a red?

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:23 PM
Wow. Harsh red.

CBTFC
04-08-2017, 08:23 PM
There we go. Finally we're on the right end of getting Gantar'd

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 08:23 PM
Yes they did! Stupid boy, there was no need for that. We need to take advantage of this and put them to the sword now...

pdubs
04-08-2017, 08:23 PM
don't know how hard he hit him but the intent is clear

CBTFC
04-08-2017, 08:24 PM
Their assistant coach getting tossed! woooo

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:24 PM
Gantar is such a bad ref. But yeah, upon watching it again, I guess it's a red. Can't throw elbows to the head.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 08:26 PM
Why are we bringing in Ricketts against a team that's going to sit back being a man down?

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:27 PM
Hagglund had to stop that.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:27 PM
Why are we bringing in Ricketts against a team that's going to sit back being a man down?
We don't really have too many other options.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 08:27 PM
Gantar is such a bad ref. But yeah, upon watching it again, I guess it's a red. Can't throw elbows to the head.
It was a cheap shot and really no need for it. Asad got what he deserved imho

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 08:28 PM
We don't really have too many other options.
True... I don't think this does much though.

Morrow hasn't gotten forward much in the second half. I'd swap for Edwards.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:28 PM
It was a cheap shot and really no need for it. Asad got what he deserved imho
Yup. No question after replay. Dirty play.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:29 PM
True... I don't think this does much though.

Morrow hasn't gotten forward much in the second half. I'd swap for Edwards.
Hmmm. He took off Beitashour.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 08:30 PM
Why are we bringing in Ricketts against a team that's going to sit back being a man down?


We don't really have too many other options.

To be honest I think we got the last sub wrong, I'd rather have seen Chapman or Delgado get a run out ahead of Oso

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:32 PM
To be honest I think we got the last sub wrong, I'd rather have seen Chapman or Delgado get a run out ahead of Oso
I think Oso does well pressing tired legs and offers more going forward than Delgado.

I like trying Cooper on the right.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:35 PM
Holy shit, Jones is huge.

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 08:38 PM
Why is Vanney not screaming at his back 3 to step up. We're up a man and there's no noticeable difference because we sandbag 3 defenders who never step into space or get forward.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:40 PM
Dammit Giovinco, play on ffs.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:41 PM
Fuck Gantar.

James17930
04-08-2017, 08:42 PM
Argh.

Entertaining game, but that really needed to be a win.

notthesun
04-08-2017, 08:43 PM
Gantar is fucking horrible, this shit is unwatchable.

2 points from two home games is not good enough. Offense seems to click finally and then we're flimsy at the back, sigh. Probably should've left Hagglund in.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 08:45 PM
Another draw, another two points thrown away. Our wastefulness is starting to cause alarm bells, that game should have been done and dusted by half time. At what point do we start worrying about Seba's form? Yes he got on the scoresheet but spent most of the game running into defenders. I hope I'm wrong but there is an air of disinterest about his play.

An entertaining game, but a deeply frustrating result. Aside from our wastefulness some absolutely shocking defending particularly from Mavinga and Bono also contributed to the result. We need to get our act together soon. We could have gone second in the East tonight, instead we are languishing below the red line in 8th place

nonc
04-08-2017, 08:45 PM
Vanney micromanaging by starting Mavinga, yet has no idea what he wants to do up a man year after year.

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 08:48 PM
Great first half, should be 3-1, at least.
We still miss exasperantly many chances, I really hope that won't bite FTC's ass by the end of the game.

PS: Welcome back Gio, after 4 months.

How bad it feels I need to quote myself now?
Exactly this happened.

2 words to characterize TFC's first 5 games of the season?
Dreadful finishing.
In fact this begun with last season's final game.

Until FTC will have a lot better finishing, has zero chances to be among the 8 best MLS teams this season. They can be a solid 9-15 th place team.
I"m talking just about the regular season.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:48 PM
Vanney micromanaging by starting Mavinga, yet has no idea what he wants to do up a man year after year.
It seems like he knew what he wanted tonight. He threw out Ricketts, put Cooper wide and went with an attacking lineup. Honestly, Bono has to stop that first goal. That was shocking.

Brandino88
04-08-2017, 08:49 PM
Bad finishing from the boys, Bono should have had firsst goal, but mavinga got burned for pace

ag futbol
04-08-2017, 08:50 PM
Honestly, Mavinga's willingness to step into space vs. The other three was refreshing... but the defensive bomb scares were too much.

Ditto guy who said "why do we sign these awful euro defenders?"

Caldwell hit the nail on the head with his pregame analysis.

nonc
04-08-2017, 08:54 PM
It seems like he knew what he wanted tonight. He threw out Ricketts, put Cooper wide and went with an attacking lineup. Honestly, Bono has to stop that first goal. That was shocking.

He also withdrew Vasquez who was a linking menace and replaced with Osorio, where TFC attack goes to die. You could see how detached it was they were less threatening up a man.

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 08:54 PM
Terrible second half. Bono had a shocker. I wouldn't be too harsh on Mavinga. Moor shouldn't have let him be the last man back. The first goal was an incredible pass..and Bono yikes. We should have been 3 or 4-1 by the half.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:55 PM
He also withdrew Vasquez who was a linking menace and replaced with Osorio, where TFC attack goes to die.
Vasquez was running out of steam. I was ok with that sub. Osorio wasn't the reason we lost.

nonc
04-08-2017, 08:56 PM
Maybe Bono has some depth perception problems he's let a few in during his short career where he doesn't even look like he knows where the ball is on meh shots.

mistercorporate
04-08-2017, 08:57 PM
I'm fine with our offence, our defence isn't keeping pace though. Entertaining game but with Vasquez now starting above Osorio, the only parts that seem weak are our defenders (except Moor).

nonc
04-08-2017, 08:58 PM
Vasquez was running out of steam. I was ok with that sub. Osorio wasn't the reason we lost.

Sure, Ricketts did set it on a plate though at the top of the box for him, but Oso being Oso he has to dwell and put a meaningless touch on every ball.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:58 PM
Maybe Bono has some depth perception problems he's let a few in during his short career where he doesn't even look like he knows where the ball is on meh shots.
I couldn't believe how that first goal went right through him.

Jack
04-08-2017, 08:59 PM
Sure, Ricketts did set it on a plate though at the top of the box for him, but Oso being Oso he has to dwell and put a meaningless touch on every ball.
Yeah. Oso always takes an extra touch. Drives me fucking nuts.

SirBobSaget
04-08-2017, 09:00 PM
Atlanta was only going to do 1 thing launch the ball down the wing. Terrible start to the season.

PizzaEatingYeti
04-08-2017, 09:02 PM
I do not care who we play next game, but if it's another draw or loss the sky is falling.
#lookforanewcoach

We cannot beat a team which is bunkering the whole game.
We cannot beat a team which is playing an open game.

Who the hell can we beat?
The ones like Minnesota?

Detroit_TFC
04-08-2017, 09:06 PM
How bad it feels I need to quote myself now?
Exactly this happened.

2 words to characterize TFC's first 5 games of the season?
Dreadful finishing.
In fact this begun with last season's final game.

Until FTC will have a lot better finishing, has zero chances to be among the 8 best MLS teams this season. They can be a solid 9-15 th place team.
I"m talking just about the regular season.

It's a big concern for me. Year after year, TFC starts ok, has a terrible patch during the summer and revives a bit in the final couple months. Difficult to see how to catch up after dropping so many early points, if the pattern holds.

General Woolfe
04-08-2017, 09:14 PM
I don't know who listens to Come on you Reds, but this week Wheeler spent five minutes talking over Terry Dunfield, insisting this was the perfect time to give Mavinga a run in the side. (I don't know if Vanney had told him something) He ignored Dunfield's warning that this Atlanta attack were the real deal and this wasn't the time to take chances, yet still Wheeler kept insisting he was right. I know hindsight is a great thing but I think a lot of us agreed with Dunfield and as it transpired, he was right

Leedsoronto
04-08-2017, 09:14 PM
Very entertaining exiting open game.

OgtheDim
04-08-2017, 09:16 PM
Two good teams. Atlanta South American guys are going to get into trouble for all that play acting. Some Journos and Atlanta fans claiming that wasn't a red. Don't raise your elbow like that

Not sold on Mavinga. But rest of defence played well. Bono made up for that non move with a great second half save.

Bradley played possessed. Vasquez ran all over. Cooper Concacafed them.

Lots of positives. First iffy defense game but best offence game. Should have won 5-2.

Canary10
04-08-2017, 09:18 PM
He also withdrew Vasquez who was a linking menace and replaced with Osorio, where TFC attack goes to die. You could see how detached it was they were less threatening up a man.

Really? Vazquez is mediocre. Certainly no better than Osorio.

GerMc
04-08-2017, 09:19 PM
I thought the last 15 minutes were embarrassing. We were up a man and Atlanta was dictating the play. I am not a #VanneyOut person but his substitutions were not good tonight. Altidore was off his game and needed to come off for Ricketts earlier.

OgtheDim
04-08-2017, 09:57 PM
Vazquez made the pass that opened up Jozy for the flick to Seba on the goal. He was a handful tonight BUT much of that was because Atlanta doesn't have a decent DM.

stevep
04-08-2017, 10:24 PM
What I learnt tonight; I was at the game

1) the Chris Mavinga experiment is officially over
2) the Osorio/Cooper debate is officially over sorry Jonathan
3) TFC is very very good, they will finish give em time be patient
4) I hate that Atlanta team
5) MLS refereeing sucks

GerMc
04-08-2017, 10:30 PM
While it is still early in the season, it is hard not to get concerned about the fact that we are 8th out of 12 teams in the Eastern conference. I think it is time for the team to recognize that there is something wrong and they need to shake things up a bit.

DinamoTFC
04-08-2017, 10:35 PM
I like bono and his potential but today was one of his worst games. Couldn't kick a ball and that first goal was atrocious. That was an easy saveable ball.

I was very surprised to see Mavinga start today. This was definitely not the game to be starting. Poor decision by
Vanney. I believe Mavinga has potential and good qualities
But today's opponent was not the right day to start and Bono didn't help him on first goal. Didn't see the second goal well so can't comment.

Seba pulled an osorio with a wasted perfect chance within the box in first half. Still can't score from a free kick.

Vazquez looks like a smart player but very slow and doesn't contribute to pressing or any defense. Don't know what to make of him yet.

Haggling and zavaleta surprising me with how well they are developing.

I love Cooper i don't care what anyone says. What he brings to the team is invaluable.

Oh and also I want some more URGENCY. They aren't playing like they want to win. It's depressing. Sick of these draws. Equivalent to 2 to 3 losses. You're playing at home win the fuckin game.

OgtheDim
04-08-2017, 10:36 PM
Oh...and that was very much a CONCACAF vs. CONMEBOL style game. We probably play the most CONCACAF of any MLS team. People whine about CONCACAF diving but CONMEBOL diving is like from another universe.

Funniest moment that showed that was the free kick quick take that was supposed to get Cooper a yellow and ended up in a turnover.

DinamoTFC
04-08-2017, 10:43 PM
Oh...and that was very much a CONCACAF vs. CONMEBOL style game. We probably play the most CONCACAF of any MLS team. People whine about CONCACAF diving but CONMEBOL diving is like from another universe.

Funniest moment that showed that was the free kick quick take that was supposed to get Cooper a yellow and ended up in a turnover.

And also when Villalba challenged cooper hard while Cooper shielded the ball out for a goal kick. And then villalba turns starts walking and drops to the ground clutching his back (yet he was raping cooper''s back). Embarrasing.

Thomas
04-08-2017, 10:50 PM
Great points. Cooper was very strong, and much better than Oso. No debate there. The sky is not falling yet. We should have won the match, but it was exciting and entertaining to watch. Next game please.


What I learnt tonight; I was at the game

1) the Chris Mavinga experiment is officially over
2) the Osorio/Cooper debate is officially over sorry Jonathan
3) TFC is very very good, they will finish give em time be patient
4) I hate that Atlanta team
5) MLS refereeing sucks

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 11:11 PM
I don't think Mavinga was the biggest problem tonight. The first goal was a combination of an excellent pass and a mistake by Bono. The Second goal... where was Moor? where was the rest of the team...and Bono?

We should have been 3 or 4 up by half time. Our big problem is the strikers... Gio is getting a bit better each game... but a long way off top form. Altidore... a good setup man...but where are the goals. Rickett's a shadow of the man from last season. we have no threat from midfield. I am not panicking yet...a few wins and everything will be alright.

But watching this good expansion team with a first time MLS coach reminded me how bad our first 9 years were...absolutely hopeless shambles of a club.

stevep
04-08-2017, 11:14 PM
tfc man of the match: Chris Mavinga
tfc best aquisition in the offseaon : Chris Mavinga
best coaching decision tonight: starting Chris Mavinga over Hagglund
my favourite tfc player: Chris Mavinga

Alex Bono looking very like Clint Irwin tonight on breakaways

reggie
04-08-2017, 11:27 PM
tfc man of the match: Chris Mavinga
tfc best aquisition in the offseaon : Chris Mavinga
best coaching decision tonight: starting Chris Mavinga over Hagglund
my favourite tfc player: Chris Mavinga
relax...maybe if our strikers could hit the side of a barn we may win the odd game.i blame this loss totally on vanney,he is so stubborn with his 3-5-2.change it up man,teams have figured it out.where is delgado or chapman,oso jus slows the movement with that extra touch.

Hamilton_Red
04-08-2017, 11:58 PM
While it is still early in the season, it is hard not to get concerned about the fact that we are 8th out of 12 teams in the Eastern conference. I think it is time for the team to recognize that there is something wrong and they need to shake things up a bit.

We aren't 8th really...there are 5 teams with 7 points. We are one win out of first place. We are un-beaten with our strikers not on form. Not too worried at this point. My biggest worry is the centre of mid-field...Bradley is solid..and Vasquez is showing signs of progressing... we need to see Cooper and Osorio step up... or Delgado and Chapman start to make an impact.

Jack
04-09-2017, 12:05 AM
Both of their goals were off mistakes on the counter, while both of ours were beautiful passing plays. I'm not happy with the result, but the sky isn't falling.

jazzy
04-09-2017, 12:06 AM
Rewatching game on fox and Dan Gargantuan is the colour guy , good for him ..he's praising us , said it always gave him goosebumps , ..rewatching because as I expected TFC would have their had their hands with their increasing dull predictable approach . Hats off to Atlanta to bring exciting soccer to mls . We've peaked . Our team is too easily outmanoeuvred ,and forced into errors . Osario. Is our main sub? , guess we'll eventually kill Edwards true attack approach as well . Hopefully more teams take Atlanta's approach . Otherwise more null/null finals , which Vanney calls success .

General Woolfe
04-09-2017, 12:30 AM
I confess like many I had taken a liking to Atlanta for the way they exploded onto the league like a breath of fresh air. They have a high octane offence and are one of the best expansion sides in recent memory. However my feelings towards them went 360 degrees tonight. From that sly elbow from Asad on Zavaletta, to Martino refusing to shake hands with Vanney at the end, their mask slipped tonight. Throw in the diving theatrics trying to con Gantar and you have a thoroughly dislikeable outfit

As for the Reds it's clear the goal scoring malaise that cost us the MLS cup has not been addressed. I'm still not convinced by Vazquez although I'll confess there are flashes that suggest there is a player there. Ricketts however has been a disappointment. The pace that saw him carve open sides in the playoffs is nowhere to be seen this season, and as we already knew his ball control and finishing leave a lot to be desired. Even this early I think we should be looking around for a back up striker in support of Séba and Jozy come the transfer window. I have faith in both players but it's clear when they have an off day they couldn't hit a barn door with a howitzer. I think it might be necessary for us to trade a little of our depth to secure a striker with a proven record in this league capable of acting back up to our main two strikers. Perhaps someone in their early thirties who's done it before and able to accept a secondary role.

We have time to be to be patient with Vazquez and to see if he produces, however we should also be keeping our eye open for an attacking midfielder just in case the Spaniard fails to produce. This is a critical season for us imho. I don't know if we can hold this group of players together beyond this year, and given how close we came last season, now is the time to push out the boat for those one or two final pieces that will make us winners. He is no doubt outside our budget but someone like Kljestan would be ideal in filling both spots

reggie
04-09-2017, 12:37 AM
Everybody is singing the praises of ATL tonight.but if we had any finish tonight we could have had 5 or 6 goals.this loss is on vanney.

Redcoe15
04-09-2017, 12:56 AM
So when is it that we push the panic button? How many points does our side keep shitting away before it's too late?

Our side should have smacked Atlanta around! Instead, we let them look like our equal, or better! That's not something a team with MLS Cup aspirations should be doing!

notthesun
04-09-2017, 01:37 AM
Honestly, Mavinga's willingness to step into space vs. The other three was refreshing... but the defensive bomb scares were too much.

Hopefully Mavinga just needs more time to settle in and get in rhythm defensively, because I did specifically notice that his comfort on the ball and the sureness of his passes helped us retain possession when it cycled around to him, vs. us sometimes losing it when Hagglund has to play a tricky left footed pass or dribble. Obviously things are more solid defensively with Hagglund in there for now.

And yeah, Bono has to do better on that first goal, he flat out just positioned himself incorrectly. Shame, 3 points were really on the table for us here.

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 06:46 AM
Panic?

Nope

Been the better team in each game we played. Long season. Results will show up. Vasquez, Giovinco & Altidore took steps forward in their combining. Cooper did Cooper things to great affect (lost track of how many times he and Bradley circled around players). For all Atlantas prowess, we were the superior ball handling team...by far.

Seba got off the schneid. We were moving the ball quicker without passing around the back all the time - Hagglund in particular pushed the ball forward and so did Zavaleta.


NOW.....Bono didn't react on the first goal and Mavinga couldn't handle the pace and Osorio is no Vasquez and went back to thinking too much.

But, in this league, we are one of the best and for now, that's good enough.

ensco
04-09-2017, 08:09 AM
Undefeated.

Jack
04-09-2017, 08:39 AM
Everybody is singing the praises of ATL tonight.but if we had any finish tonight we could have had 5 or 6 goals.this loss is on vanney.
Vanney didn't finish his chances again! And then he let the ball go right through him on both of our goals after being beaten for pace by the forward. Dammit, Vanney!

InDa_110
04-09-2017, 09:12 AM
Really? Vazquez is mediocre. Certainly no better than Osorio.

Are you serious?
We're you still a little drunk when you posted this or do you really believe Vazquez is no better than Osorio?

Areathrasher
04-09-2017, 09:19 AM
\
Oh and also I want some more URGENCY. .

This.

We are very dull to watch.

reggie
04-09-2017, 09:44 AM
Vanney didn't finish his chances again! And then he let the ball go right through him on both of our goals after being beaten for pace by the forward. Dammit, Vanney!
no reason to start mavinga tonight v a team like atl,im sick of oso coming in and slowing the game down with that extra touch of his.

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 11:04 AM
They put in Mavinga in order to rotate players through - like any decent team does. The original plan, from what Neil Davidson indicated, was to put him in versus SKC.

Brain trust thought Mavinga could do the job. Vanney was very clear in his presser afterwards that Mavinga is not getting back in again until he learns how to keep everybody in front of him. Mavinga relied upon his speed and got caught.

Actually, people who think Vanney is clueless really should watch the full 12 minutes of his presser.

http://www.torontofc.ca/post/2017/04/08/i-our-front-three-jozy-seba-and-vazquez-movement-was-there-we-just-lacked-precision?autoplay=true

Hamilton_Red
04-09-2017, 11:16 AM
Og - it was a good interview but I'd have added this. The 2nd ATL goal... we are 2-1 up against a free scoring team...do you really play 3 at the back with a high press and the last man back is the debutant? This was as much a coaching error as it was Mavinga's failure to read the play. I saw enough positive from his ball playing that he could turn out to be a good signing.

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 11:24 AM
Yeah, its funny how we play now. Very different then what we saw with Caldwell as the anchor CD. I didn't really figure it out until earlier this season.

We have a system that relies upon defensive reads and that any of the back 3 can cover any player heading our way because they are all aware of the potential before it happens. If Mavinga can't do that cover awareness, frankly he shouldn't be playing at this level. I agree though, he is good enough - just needs to get the whole reliance upon his speed thing out of his head. Cause that's what I saw - a guy used to using his speed when he wasn't ready getting beaten by strength and pace.


Moor is supposed to call out the necessary coverage for what could be happening - either he didn't on that play or Mavinga didn't hear him. Regardless, in our system, Mavinga should not have let these two get behind him. Our system relies upon the back 3 to be ready for the likely before those things happen. Good defenders these days don't react but call out the possible BEFORE it happens.

jloome
04-09-2017, 11:32 AM
Both of their goals were off mistakes on the counter, while both of ours were beautiful passing plays. I'm not happy with the result, but the sky isn't falling.

Tonight is on Seba and Jozy. We should have put this away in the first 30 minutes. Atlanta was utterly reliant on Almiron's movement and Villalaba's speed.

We played well as a team, for the most part. I find the people who think Mavinga is an experiment amusing. The guy has seventy games in ligue un, for fuck's sake, he's not some prospect; the guy is easily MLS quality. He's not exactly an unknown commodity, and that pass was really good. There's no way Zavaleta or Moor would have looked any better (and where was Moor?).

Seba and Jozy each missed at least three gilt-edged chances. Bury two of those and this is over early.

Jozy makes arrogant decisions because his technical ability is far higher than his detractors realize; the flick back to Seba was great, the attempted chip was embarrassing. He had a clear lane and could've just taken one more touch and put it in the bottom corner, or, if that drew the central defender his way, knocked it over to Seba who would've been wide open.

Cooper is simply a better player than Osorio. I like Oso, but he's sort of limited to holding up the ball. His movement is great, but he has no killer instinct for the final pass or shot.

Bono has been overrated by some and looked like the sloppy youngster he occasionally is. He has brain cramps and his angle on that shot was atrociously narrow. You never give the guy the far top corner, that's goalie 101 of cutting off your angles. Make him work for it.

Bradley was excellent defensively but his passing and distribution was once again shockingly sloppy. Aside from the occasional long diagonal ball, it's hard to believe this is the same guy who signed for us, sometimes.

ag futbol
04-09-2017, 12:24 PM
I thought the difference in the second half was Morrow and Beitashour stopped getting forward as much. For a team that's very reliant on those players to get up-and-down the field in a 3-5-2 they log too many minutes. They need to be rotated for the sake of wear-and-tear at the very least.

I'll say it again: Ricketts as a sub in this situation was stupid. If we're not springing him in behind he has no purpose in the game. They should have inserted Edwards as the most natural sub. Their fullbacks didn't exactly look sturdy, we should have pressed the issue more.



Cooper is simply a better player than Osorio. I like Oso, but he's sort of limited to holding up the ball. His movement is great, but he has no killer instinct for the final pass or shot.

Agreed, it was a good game for Cooper. With our defenders rarely completing any sort of line splitting passes his ability to lose his mark in midfield is what took a lot of our attacks into the final third.

However, I would like to see some of these guys given better service and get the ball in more advanced positions. I rarely remember moments where Cooper gets the ball in anything but the middle third of the field.

Ajax TFC
04-09-2017, 01:00 PM
I don't think it's a given that those breakaways wouldn't have happened with Hagglund instead of Mavinga. Hagglund has had his own share of problems with fast attackers, including some real sloppy play after coming on for Mavinga this game. On the first goal, Mavinga did a decent enough job keeping the attacker wide, and Bono should be able to stop the shot from there every time. On the second goal, the attacker came from the center-right side of the field. Was more Moor/Zav's man that got through, though Mavinga's attempted challenge when he caught up was pretty pathetic.

Canary10
04-09-2017, 01:20 PM
Are you serious?
We're you still a little drunk when you posted this or do you really believe Vazquez is no better than Osorio?

Vazquez is the AM of a team who has no cap space and can't afford anything better. I don't think we lose anything at all having Oso in instead of him.

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 01:42 PM
Vazquez is the AM of a team who has no cap space and can't afford anything better. I don't think we lose anything at all having Oso in instead of him.

Well if you want to make a passing comparison, Oso doesn't attempt many passes into the box. This is last night. Two of those passes near or into the box by Vazquez resulted in goals. (No I'm not counting the corners Vasquez took). Osorio doesn't make the attempts Vazquez attempts.

http://i.imgur.com/QKpb5xh.png


http://i.imgur.com/ba5Zzts.png

notthesun
04-09-2017, 01:43 PM
Vazquez is the AM of a team who has no cap space and can't afford anything better. I don't think we lose anything at all having Oso in instead of him.

He's been directly involved in 4 goals this year compared to one for Osorio... His vision and passing ability isn't otherworldly but it's honestly really clearly above Osorio's man.

SirBobSaget
04-09-2017, 02:00 PM
Moor stepped in front to cover the shorter pass towards the sideline. Mavinga job was to cover the overhead ball. He stood at half watching it sail over his head.

Derko
04-09-2017, 02:09 PM
Really? Vazquez is mediocre. Certainly no better than Osorio.

I will disagree, why did Osorio not start, because of his bumbling in the last game, he was invisible when he came on last night.
I am beginning to get very tired of Vanney's European continental style of play, This is the MLS stop pretending to be a Barcelona or Real Madrid.

jloome
04-09-2017, 03:21 PM
I will disagree, why did Osorio not start, because of his bumbling in the last game, he was invisible when he came on last night.
I am beginning to get very tired of Vanney's European continental style of play, This is the MLS stop pretending to be a Barcelona or Real Madrid.

The Belgian league is not exactly chopped liver and the dude was the player of the year. He had one bad season in Mexico, but he's clearly a step above in vision and skill. He should be starting every game with Bradley and Cooper behind him to defend.

MightyDM
04-09-2017, 04:24 PM
I'm still for Oso over Cooper and not yet entirely sold on Vasquez, despite his passing vision. He did impress with his hustle a couple of times to get back when no one was covering, but still, when he is on, we are really playing with three attackers who do not defend. Oso works his socks off and has had some good games this year. He brings something different than Vaquez and his hustle on both sides of the ball is needed. Cooper soured me earlier on this year when he was rolling around on the floor feigning injury and the other team ran up and scored.

Oldtimer
04-09-2017, 05:37 PM
Lol, we get to the MLS Cup final, start the new season undefeated, and some people want to fire Vanney and go back to rotating head coaches, as if 9 years of that didn't teach the lesson that stability wins.

sn0re
04-09-2017, 06:03 PM
Lol, we get to the MLS Cup final, start the new season undefeated, and some people want to fire Vanney and go back to rotating head coaches, as if 9 years of that didn't teach the lesson that stability wins.

Totally agree. We are in a same position as last year's beginning of the season but point ahead so we'll start to see results within the following weeks. Personally, I won't start judging this team until late May or mid June.

RealG-TFC
04-09-2017, 06:58 PM
We are a championship-winning level team. Sure we are 3 points back from first in the east but the way I see it we should be at the top with 11 points, the last two games should have really been wins.

It needs to change next week.

stevep
04-09-2017, 07:07 PM
We are a championship-winning level team. Sure we are 3 points back from first in the east but the way I see it we should be at the top with 11 points, the last two games should have really been wins.

It needs to change next week.

it is my opinion based on results so far, everyone in the east excluding tfc is average to mediocre to poor, we are above average, so no worries

Derko
04-09-2017, 07:12 PM
Lol, we get to the MLS Cup final, start the new season undefeated, and some people want to fire Vanney and go back to rotating head coaches, as if 9 years of that didn't teach the lesson that stability wins.

Who said that? Not me!!

Canary10
04-09-2017, 07:54 PM
I think Jloome was right a while back when he said Jozy and Seba should have had the game finished at the half. Certainly not time to panic. Wins will come. I still haven't seen anything to convince me Vazquez is creating more than we'd have had anyway without him on the pitch. Oso played 15 minutes so comparing to what Vazquez did in 3/4 of a game is disingenuous. I still think he's the kind of player a salary cap challenged gets and tries to convince themselves they've improved.

C.Ronaldo
04-09-2017, 08:42 PM
I'm still for Oso over Cooper and not yet entirely sold on Vasquez, despite his passing vision. He did impress with his hustle a couple of times to get back when no one was covering, but still, when he is on, we are really playing with three attackers who do not defend. Oso works his socks off and has had some good games this year. He brings something different than Vaquez and his hustle on both sides of the ball is needed. Cooper soured me earlier on this year when he was rolling around on the floor feigning injury and the other team ran up and scored.

Agreed, cooper loses the ball too often and is caught out of position trying to do too much sometimes.

I feel chapman needs his shot though

Vasquez has a lot to prove but u can see him clicking already. Ways to go though

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 08:48 PM
Lol, we get to the MLS Cup final, start the new season undefeated, and some people want to fire Vanney and go back to rotating head coaches, as if 9 years of that didn't teach the lesson that stability wins.

I heard that from a couple of guys in my section for the last 40 minutes of the game.

"Vanny your systems sucks"
"Put in Ricketts" (I don't get this fascination with forward subs - nobody shouts "Put in Cheyrou!")
"Fire Vanney"

I said something about "Hey, I remember Ryan Nelson & Aaron Winter".

Thankfully I won't be around them for the next couple of home games.

I don't expect everybody to support the team all game long but geezus some people need to freaking calm down.

reggie
04-09-2017, 09:02 PM
I heard that from a couple of guys in my section for the last 40 minutes of the game.

"Vanny your systems sucks"
"Put in Ricketts" (I don't get this fascination with forward subs - nobody shouts "Put in Cheyrou!")
"Fire Vanney"

I said something about "Hey, I remember Ryan Nelson & Aaron Winter".

Thankfully I won't be around them for the next couple of home games.

I don't expect everybody to support the team all game long but geezus some people need to freaking calm down.
what row in 221 are you on?

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 09:10 PM
8

If that's you....we need to talk. :)


I'm the guy who was shouting "YUR NOT IN ATLANTA ANYMORE!"

reggie
04-09-2017, 09:16 PM
8

If that's you....we need to talk. :)


I'm the guy who was shouting "YUR NOT IN ATLANTA ANYMORE!"
im in 5 jus below those atl fans.
and i never yell to put ricketts in

OgtheDim
04-09-2017, 09:32 PM
Gosh that whole family? When they started doing ATL I had to laugh.

reggie
04-09-2017, 09:36 PM
yes lol i kept on saying falcons after the atl chant

Thomas
04-09-2017, 09:45 PM
Are you serious?


I'm still for Oso over Cooper and not yet entirely sold on Vasquez, despite his passing vision. He did impress with his hustle a couple of times to get back when no one was covering, but still, when he is on, we are really playing with three attackers who do not defend. Oso works his socks off and has had some good games this year. He brings something different than Vaquez and his hustle on both sides of the ball is needed. Cooper soured me earlier on this year when he was rolling around on the floor feigning injury and the other team ran up and scored.

TMAN80
04-09-2017, 11:38 PM
Tonight is on Seba and Jozy. We should have put this away in the first 30 minutes. Atlanta was utterly reliant on Almiron's movement and Villalaba's speed.

We played well as a team, for the most part. I find the people who think Mavinga is an experiment amusing. The guy has seventy games in ligue un, for fuck's sake, he's not some prospect; the guy is easily MLS quality. He's not exactly an unknown commodity, and that pass was really good. There's no way Zavaleta or Moor would have looked any better (and where was Moor?).

Seba and Jozy each missed at least three gilt-edged chances. Bury two of those and this is over early.

Jozy makes arrogant decisions because his technical ability is far higher than his detractors realize; the flick back to Seba was great, the attempted chip was embarrassing. He had a clear lane and could've just taken one more touch and put it in the bottom corner, or, if that drew the central defender his way, knocked it over to Seba who would've been wide open.

Cooper is simply a better player than Osorio. I like Oso, but he's sort of limited to holding up the ball. His movement is great, but he has no killer instinct for the final pass or shot.

Bono has been overrated by some and looked like the sloppy youngster he occasionally is. He has brain cramps and his angle on that shot was atrociously narrow. You never give the guy the far top corner, that's goalie 101 of cutting off your angles. Make him work for it.

Bradley was excellent defensively but his passing and distribution was once again shockingly sloppy. Aside from the occasional long diagonal ball, it's hard to believe this is the same guy who signed for us, sometimes.

Yeah I would pretty much agree with all of this, especially Mavinga. I thought it was pretty clear he has much more ability and skill than Hagglund or Zavaletta, despite Atlanta getting a guy in behind him(and the others). He may have underestimated the quality of Atlanta(and MLS?) and their ability to play such a great pass. I think he will become an important piece once given a few more opportunities.

SirBobSaget
04-10-2017, 12:14 AM
Lol, we get to the MLS Cup final, start the new season undefeated, and some people want to fire Vanney and go back to rotating head coaches, as if 9 years of that didn't teach the lesson that stability wins.

No
one has suggested firing Vanney. This roster should be challenging for Supporters Shield. Dropping easy points at home is not the path to #1. Thats where we are frustrated. The Atlanta game was in the bag just had to watch the counter which they didn't. That's inexcusable. Then they go up an extra man for 15 mins and just like last year are completely inept. Vaney has some obvious issues to address. He needs to set the team up to win at home and score when a man up.

MightyDM
04-10-2017, 06:01 AM
Are you serious?

yes, that's what I see. Vasquez has great potential going forward but makes us more vulnerable defensively, and Cooper drives me crazy with his writhing on the floor. Osorio brings a lot of quality and hustle on both sides of the ball. Yes, he missed some chances. So did Gio and Vasquez. People can be very hard on Oso in ways that are a little unfair.

Kamp Berg
04-10-2017, 08:16 AM
I know my opinion is controversial, but, am I the only one who is starting to lose his mind every time I see Bradley make a lazy pass that gets intercepted? He's obviously an exceptional player who should and could do better in this regard, but he still keeps doing it?!? Does he just not care, is he that arrogant, or is he misreading things that badly? I know they are all under a lot of pressure but most other players don't do it. At this I'm starting to wonder if his time is coming to an end. If so that's pretty disappointing, especially considering how much of an impact he makes when he is sharp and intense. Worse still, it seems to have spread to others on the team. Could the coaching staff possibly be missing this? I don't see how that is possible. Good for thought, but in the mean time, I'm going to pull all my hair out!!! LOL

Sorry Jloome, didn't look and see that you already made this point. Good thing to know I'm not alone in this!

C.Ronaldo
04-10-2017, 09:02 AM
yes, that's what I see. Vasquez has great potential going forward but makes us more vulnerable defensively, and Cooper drives me crazy with his writhing on the floor. Osorio brings a lot of quality and hustle on both sides of the ball. Yes, he missed some chances. So did Gio and Vasquez. People can be very hard on Oso in ways that are a little unfair.


cooper's
dribbling into walls is as annoying as osorios finish. I dont mind osorios extra touch, often it gets him out of tight situations

C.Ronaldo
04-10-2017, 09:04 AM
Another draw, another two points thrown away. Our wastefulness is starting to cause alarm bells, that game should have been done and dusted by half time. At what point do we start worrying about Seba's form? Yes he got on the scoresheet but spent most of the game running into defenders. I hope I'm wrong but there is an air of disinterest about his play.

An entertaining game, but a deeply frustrating result. Aside from our wastefulness some absolutely shocking defending particularly from Mavinga and Bono also contributed to the result. We need to get our act together soon. We could have gone second in the East tonight, instead we are languishing below the red line in 8th place



how
many times did bono kick the balls out of bounds or give it to the other team.
THIS is when you notice how valuable Irwin is

OgtheDim
04-10-2017, 09:05 AM
I thought Cooper was better at getting the pass off on Saturday but...yeah...that dribbling for the sake of dribbling thing is annoying. I'll accept it from Seba because he gets past players most of the time and is in a dangerous position- Cooper seems to do one too many dribbles and still be out on the wing near midfield.

Canary10
04-10-2017, 09:06 AM
cooper's
dribbling into walls is as annoying as osorios finish. I dont mind osorios extra touch, often it gets him out of tight situations

He always makes one more move than he should. If he could get his head up and lay it off earlier he would be so much better. That said, I appreciate Cooper.

C.Ronaldo
04-10-2017, 10:31 AM
I guess if cooper and osorio could do it all, we wouldnt afford them.

TFC1154ever
04-10-2017, 10:48 AM
Cooper had his best game as a red on Saturday. He was dangerous all night but, I do agree with you. He most of the time tries one to many moves. Saturday, he didn't and was dancing around their midfield.

Oldtimer
04-10-2017, 12:42 PM
No
one has suggested firing Vanney. This roster should be challenging for Supporters Shield. Dropping easy points at home is not the path to #1. Thats where we are frustrated. The Atlanta game was in the bag just had to watch the counter which they didn't. That's inexcusable. Then they go up an extra man for 15 mins and just like last year are completely inept. Vaney has some obvious issues to address. He needs to set the team up to win at home and score when a man up.

Sometimes the players just don't perform. So far no coach has managed the art of mind control. Vanney should address some issues, but do you know what? I believe he's already working with them on those things because in his news conferences he seems very aware of where the deficiencies are. The first goal (which lost us the game) was an easy shot that Bono should have been able to catch, or at least punch out (which shows why Bono is our #2). That was not on Vanney.

Thomas
04-10-2017, 01:29 PM
Yeah, that is my read on this too. There was a lot less flopping on Saturday. I thought he really made a meaningful difference that night.


Cooper had his best game as a red on Saturday. He was dangerous all night but, I do agree with you. He most of the time tries one to many moves. Saturday, he didn't and was dancing around their midfield.

ag futbol
04-10-2017, 01:59 PM
I don't care if he flops, I care if he's effective. Let's not like Seba hasn't taken a swan dive or two as well.

These guys do what they can to get free of defenders. Sometimes that means getting in the refs head and lessening the physical liberties some opponents take to slow us down.

fergiejr
04-10-2017, 02:55 PM
I know my opinion is controversial, but, am I the only one who is starting to lose his mind every time I see Bradley make a lazy pass that gets intercepted? He's obviously an exceptional player who should and could do better in this regard, but he still keeps doing it?!? Does he just not care, is he that arrogant, or is he misreading things that badly? I know they are all under a lot of pressure but most other players don't do it. At this I'm starting to wonder if his time is coming to an end. If so that's pretty disappointing, especially considering how much of an impact he makes when he is sharp and intense. Worse still, it seems to have spread to others on the team. Could the coaching staff possibly be missing this? I don't see how that is possible. Good for thought, but in the mean time, I'm going to pull all my hair out!!! !

I noticed he is doing it less often than he has. I think it's a bit of misreading and also not realizing where his guys are. That being said, he did have an extra spring in his step on Saturday. Seemed to go that little extra at times, while at times still flubbing the ball. And the way he runs over to our defenders to pick up the ball to start the play, why can't he take a pass and start it there too?

Yohan
04-10-2017, 03:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3p73g8pv4c

Bobo
04-10-2017, 08:30 PM
yes, that's what I see. Vasquez has great potential going forward but makes us more vulnerable defensively, and Cooper drives me crazy with his writhing on the floor. Osorio brings a lot of quality and hustle on both sides of the ball. Yes, he missed some chances. So did Gio and Vasquez. People can be very hard on Oso in ways that are a little unfair.

I agree. There were many points Saturday when Vazquez was strolling higher up the field than the FWs. This system will not work with Vazquez in it unless he decides he's going to change his game. Two guys in front of me were hating on the substitution that saw Oso come in, but I thought it was quite simple. The mid was being left way too exposed. Oso worked well to fill the gaps that Vazquez had been leaving.

Thought Cooper had a decent game though. He likes to express himself in a certain way, not all that concerned as long as he isn't costing the team or contributing absolutely nothing else.

ensco
04-10-2017, 08:34 PM
When you are playing like crap and have 7 points in 5 games...

C'est la vie.

Auzzy
04-10-2017, 10:27 PM
Folks watch the 20-minute highlights that Yohan posted above. Note that vid was created by the league. The high percentage of TFC plays within the highlights, tells you how well they did for long stretches of the game (vs. "formidable" Atlanta). Yes you can see the problems before the goals against. But there is also lots of great soccer to see. Just relax and enjoy a bit. Some great passes, tackles, loop-di-loop dribbles, and other nice plays by Vasquez and Cooper for example. When we're creating so many quality changes (also in last week's game), I don't get worried. I think Vanney is capable of tightening up the defence, he did well with that last year. I think more goals will come, we will do fine.

MightyDM
04-10-2017, 10:48 PM
I agree. There were many points Saturday when Vazquez was strolling higher up the field than the FWs. This system will not work with Vazquez in it unless he decides he's going to change his game. Two guys in front of me were hating on the substitution that saw Oso come in, but I thought it was quite simple. The mid was being left way too exposed. Oso worked well to fill the gaps that Vazquez had been leaving.

Thought Cooper had a decent game though. He likes to express himself in a certain way, not all that concerned as long as he isn't costing the team or contributing absolutely nothing else.

Agreed. Cooper was at his best Saturday.

Section_105
04-11-2017, 11:49 AM
Really? Vazquez is mediocre. Certainly no better than Osorio.

I disagree....watch the game again. Vazquez is slower than Osorio but far more effective. He fluffed a left footed shot but with his right set up both goals. We lose this game without him imho.

Section_105
04-11-2017, 12:11 PM
Folks watch the 20-minute highlights that Yohan posted above. Note that vid was created by the league. The high percentage of TFC plays within the highlights, tells you how well they did for long stretches of the game (vs. "formidable" Atlanta). Yes you can see the problems before the goals against. But there is also lots of great soccer to see. Just relax and enjoy a bit. Some great passes, tackles, loop-di-loop dribbles, and other nice plays by Vasquez and Cooper for example. When we're creating so many quality changes (also in last week's game), I don't get worried. I think Vanney is capable of tightening up the defence, he did well with that last year. I think more goals will come, we will do fine.

:iagree:

I was frustrated with the missed chances. but two balls behind the defenders and one wicked shot well saved were the only chances we allowed. In past years I would be cursing up a storm, this year trying to take a more measured approach for my own sanity

C.Ronaldo
04-12-2017, 08:56 AM
I disagree....watch the game again. Vazquez is slower than Osorio but far more effective. He fluffed a left footed shot but with his right set up both goals. We lose this game without him imho.

vasquez
can float pin point passes from really close ranger which is much harder than it looks

Derko
04-12-2017, 01:15 PM
I guess if cooper and osorio could do it all, we wouldnt afford them.

I think the frustrating part here is for both Jonathan and Armando to be a bit more consistent, they both have their qualities but seem to be far less consistent, they both have more 'off' games than 'on' games, in my opinion.

todortonchev
04-13-2017, 01:55 PM
I am sure someone already mentioned before me but why would the coach put a brand new defender to the team, playing his first game with this goalkeeper and defense against one of the best offences in the league? Not trying to defend Mavinga but to be honest it was kinda unfair to him.
At least our offense start looking more like the offense from the playoffs. We should have scored at least 2 more goals.

molenshtain
04-13-2017, 02:32 PM
I am sure someone already mentioned before me but why would the coach put a brand new defender to the team, playing his first game with this goalkeeper and defense against one of the best offences in the league? Not trying to defend Mavinga but to be honest it was kinda unfair to him.
At least our offense start looking more like the offense from the playoffs. We should have scored at least 2 more goals.

the first 15 games of the season really don't matter much. If Mavinga is going to be an elite defender in this league there's no point shielding him from the best offences. Hopefully he's the type to learn from his mistakes.

todortonchev
04-16-2017, 08:40 PM
True but by throwing him not prepared enouth, we lost 2 points. Let's see if he can have better games in the future.