PDA

View Full Version : Props to Altidore



trane
05-09-2016, 08:42 AM
I was looking for a thread to say this in, but could not find one. So I will start one.

He is not scoring. But fuck I think Altidore is playing great. Great hustle, great physicality, creates space, great feel and passing and great one two play with Giovinco and the rest of the team. I think he has done everything a CF should in this system and playing with a number 10 like Gio.

Yes, he could/should have finished a few of the changes, but overall I am very happy with his contribution. I trust that by the end of the season he will have 12-15 goals.

Red4ever
05-09-2016, 08:46 AM
Amen. He was dominant.

I dont often call out people's knowledge of the game as it's often subjective but if naysayers couldnt see that what Jozy did yesterday made a world of difference, I cant help you.

trane
05-09-2016, 08:54 AM
^ that is a problem I find, you can be knowledgeable and have a difference of opinion. But allot of opinions seem to be based on a lack of knowledge/understanding of the game.

You can tell me, listen he is a Center Forward and the bottom line is that he needs to score, but when you tell me he is useless and he does nothing, then I have to question if you understand what is going on on the pitch.

RealG-TFC
05-09-2016, 08:54 AM
He's like the anti-Kamara at the moment.

barticusz
05-09-2016, 08:55 AM
YES! Altidore has been fantastic for us so far this year... especially the last few games. Once the goals start coming in it'll be all the more exciting at BMO. Otherwise he's playing such a pivotal role to hold up play and create space for others.

shwade
05-09-2016, 08:59 AM
Yes he's been doing things other than scoring but the goals need to start because at this point it is plain ludicrous that him and seba are on virtually the same salary.

ryan
05-09-2016, 09:14 AM
Yes he's been doing things other than scoring but the goals need to start because at this point it is plain ludicrous that him and seba are on virtually the same salary.

No. Just no.

Rate their performance not their stat line. His last two games have been stellar.

CBTFC
05-09-2016, 09:18 AM
No. Just no.

Rate their performance not their stat line. His last two games have been stellar.

Count me as one of the converted, and even a couple days ago I posted about Altidore and stating "numbers don't lie".

Well,. I've learned that there are far more numbers to look at than goals and assists, and it's in those other ways that Jozy is contributing

KurtLarSUN
05-09-2016, 09:18 AM
I was looking for a thread to say this in, but could not find one. So I will start one.

He is not scoring. But fuck I think Altidore is playing great. Great hustle, great physicality, creates space, great feel and passing and great one two play with Giovinco and the rest of the team. I think he has done everything a CF should in this system and playing with a number 10 like Gio.

Yes, he could/should have finished a few of the changes, but overall I am very happy with his contribution. I trust that by the end of the season he will have 12-15 goals.

A shame the question he faced post-game. http://www.torontosun.com/2016/05/09/toronto-fcs-jozy-altidore-is-doing-everything-right

molenshtain
05-09-2016, 09:22 AM
Altidore is one of the many players on this team exceeding my expectations of them this season. This is the first time in his career he's really played as a true #9 and he's looked fantastic doing it. Keep up the good work, the goals will come.

KurtLarSUN
05-09-2016, 09:22 AM
^ that is a problem I find, you can be knowledgeable and have a difference of opinion. But allot of opinions seem to be based on a lack of knowledge/understanding of the game.

You can tell me, listen he is a Center Forward and the bottom line is that he needs to score, but when you tell me he is useless and he does nothing, then I have to question if you understand what is going on on the pitch.

I don't entirely agree with this. He needs to score in the games he needs to score in. For instance, in Portland.
He didn't need to score vs. Dallas. His other contributions were massive. The amount of time he took off the clock with his hold up play was immense. Truth is, Endoh is actually stealing his runs, which is fine, but kind of funny.
Forwards need to score in certain moments, but not in games like Saturday's.
Let's not forget, without Altidore, Giovinco wouldln't have scored in DC or New England. Also wouldn't have scored the PK in Montreal.

Justin10000
05-09-2016, 09:31 AM
I really, REALLY don't want Jozy to go to the Copa America.

Deltron
05-09-2016, 09:46 AM
I feel a DP striker needs to score goals, Altidore is capable of doing this but so far this season I would not say he has been fantastic, not even close. There are tons of players that can come in and hold up the ball and do one-twos with Gio. So I would like to see more finishing out of him, before we can say that he is having a good season. Now he could also go out and score 4 goals in the next 3 games and that changes things completely. Fingers crossed that's what happens and he can take a bit of the weight off of his shoulders.

jabbronies
05-09-2016, 09:49 AM
I thought he played well. He brought the ball down with his back to goal a few times and muscled guys off to create some space for himself and others.
I think with Gio, Delgado, Endoh and Oso - the team has a lot of small players who can get into tight spaces very quickly. The good thing with Jozy is that he is the tall guy in that mix who can bring the ball down, draw a couple players to himself and then pass if off.

Fort York Redcoat
05-09-2016, 09:53 AM
I really, REALLY don't want Jozy to go to the Copa America.

Funny. This Copa is more like it's coming to him than him going to it. But agreed. Him and Bradley.

OgtheDim
05-09-2016, 09:55 AM
.... because at this point it is plain ludicrous that him and seba are on virtually the same salary.

Not even close unless you mean the cap hit.

Seba $7,115,555.67

Altidore $4,750,000.00


******


He's playing REALLY well.

OgtheDim
05-09-2016, 09:57 AM
There are tons of players that can come in and hold up the ball and do one-twos with Gio. .


Funny, but there is currently only 1 other player in the league playing that style and he plays for LAG, is a USMNT and is equally despised by some.

James17930
05-09-2016, 10:23 AM
I don't entirely agree with this. He needs to score in the games he needs to score in. For instance, in Portland.
He didn't need to score vs. Dallas. His other contributions were massive. The amount of time he took off the clock with his hold up play was immense. Truth is, Endoh is actually stealing his runs, which is fine, but kind of funny.
Forwards need to score in certain moments, but not in games like Saturday's.
Let's not forget, without Altidore, Giovinco wouldln't have scored in DC or New England. Also wouldn't have scored the PK in Montreal.

Yeah, I noticed that too. I think that's why Seba was so pissed off. Hopefully they get that sorted.

Although, for next game, with either Delgado hurt or Johnson suspended, Endoh will most likely be on the wing with Osorio at the tip of the diamond, so hopefully that problem won't surface.

C.Ronaldo
05-09-2016, 10:28 AM
he left it all out on the field, played his ass off.
was unlucky

he was tieing up so many players, im surprised OTHER players didn't score more

shwade
05-09-2016, 10:35 AM
No. Just no.

Rate their performance not their stat line. His last two games have been stellar.

...I am rating his performance, that's why I said he's been been doing things well other than scoring. But the goals do need to start coming no? He missed a few sitters the first few games but he seems like he's finally catching up with himself and is helping in other ways. But we can't just have Seba scoring so yes...Altidore does need to do more (like score).

shwade
05-09-2016, 10:38 AM
Not even close unless you mean the cap hit.

Seba $7,115,555.67

Altidore $4,750,000.00


******


He's playing REALLY well.


Hmm, thought Seba was on 6.5 and Jozy was on 5.5 - guess not. Even so, a DP forward has to do more than tangle defenders up and hopefully he's on his way there.

Jack
05-09-2016, 10:40 AM
I like this quote from Jozy's postgame interview:

"I'm here to win. It's one thing to come here and score goals and lose. Would you rather that?"

He's playing really well. He's missed a few chances, but he'll have a break out game and bang in a few, I'm sure of it.

Fort York Redcoat
05-09-2016, 10:47 AM
But we can't just have Seba scoring so yes...Altidore does need to do more (like score).

Endoh

Johnson

Jus sayin'

Afra
05-09-2016, 10:53 AM
The only thing I noticed is that he sometimes plays a little soft against a defender on bringing balls down from the air. He always plays the positioning so that, if the defender misses it, he is gone and I get that. But he is a big lad and looks like he could get that header in the air most times for that first touch onto another Red.

I think once he pots one or two, his scoring will come back in spades.

Super
05-09-2016, 11:08 AM
I've been very happy with Altidore so far this season. Sure, he's not been banging in goals, but we're grabbing points like never before - and he's been integral in that effort.

Detroit_TFC
05-09-2016, 11:16 AM
Altidore has changed his approach to the game this season, likely on Vanney's request. He is taking a ding on his scoring stats for the greater good.

Jack
05-09-2016, 11:27 AM
The only thing I noticed is that he sometimes plays a little soft against a defender on bringing balls down from the air. He always plays the positioning so that, if the defender misses it, he is gone and I get that. But he is a big lad and looks like he could get that header in the air most times for that first touch onto another Red.

I think once he pots one or two, his scoring will come back in spades.
I've noticed that he's not that good with his head. He's got very good feet for a big guy, but he's not your typical target man who can make the little touches with his head.

OgtheDim
05-09-2016, 11:35 AM
Vanney said in the post game presser he told them at the half to play balls into Altidore's feet,

He also said they are going to do some finishing training this week now that they are home for a bit.

ensco
05-09-2016, 12:02 PM
Altidore certainly deserves a 7 or 8 out of 10.

I am not quite feeling the same level of love as others, as I remember Dichio doing all the other things Altidore is doing, and scoring

C.Ronaldo
05-09-2016, 12:14 PM
Altidore certainly deserves a 7 or 8 out of 10.

I am not quite feeling the same level of love as others, as I remember Dichio doing all the other things Altidore is doing, and scoring
but Dichio had a magnet on his head for the ball

ag futbol
05-09-2016, 12:48 PM
Altidore certainly deserves a 7 or 8 out of 10.

I am not quite feeling the same level of love as others, as I remember Dichio doing all the other things Altidore is doing, and scoring
I second this. Has to score, but holdup play was top notch last game.

Think the new fitness regiment has helped him in this regard.

shwade
05-09-2016, 12:59 PM
Endoh

Johnson

Jus sayin'

Lol...

Pint
05-09-2016, 01:00 PM
Has Jozy been good? Yes. Has Jozy been 5M good? No, at that point you are paid to score.

The thing with this conversation like with the stadium is it's okay to be critical of certain aspects while still enjoying others. Far too often it seams like any amount of criticism amount to someone hating on something while they were simply point one part out.

Jozy was good saturday even though he didn't score but it is very tough to call a DP striker good over a long period if they are not scoring not matter how well rounded a game they play.

For Jozy to earn his contract he needs to be scoring 12-15 goals but that doesn't mean he is a complete waste if he doesn't, it's just that is the expectation when you make that kind of money.

molenshtain
05-09-2016, 01:07 PM
Has Jozy been good? Yes. Has Jozy been 5M good? No, at that point you are paid to score.

The thing with this conversation like with the stadium is it's okay to be critical of certain aspects while still enjoying others. Far too often it seams like any amount of criticism amount to someone hating on something while they were simply point one part out.

Jozy was good saturday even though he didn't score but it is very tough to call a DP striker good over a long period if they are not scoring not matter how well rounded a game they play.

For Jozy to earn his contract he needs to be scoring 12-15 goals but that doesn't mean he is a complete waste if he doesn't, it's just that is the expectation when you make that kind of money.

he scored 13 last year and people still called him a waste.

It's a small sample size for Jozy right now. The key is that he's been great in build up play and getting in the right positions to score. He's always been a great finisher - the goals will start falling soon if he keeps playing the same way he has been.

brad
05-09-2016, 01:27 PM
Altidore certainly deserves a 7 or 8 out of 10.

I am not quite feeling the same level of love as others, as I remember Dichio doing all the other things Altidore is doing, and scoring

Well - Dichio scored 14 goals in 59 games, Altidore has 13 in 28.

Pint
05-09-2016, 01:45 PM
he scored 13 last year and people still called him a waste.

It's a small sample size for Jozy right now. The key is that he's been great in build up play and getting in the right positions to score. He's always been a great finisher - the goals will start falling soon if he keeps playing the same way he has been.

You will always have a small percentage that will no like him for one reason or another. He has done well but still room for improvement to truly be worth the salary.

trane
05-09-2016, 02:01 PM
I've noticed that he's not that good with his head. He's got very good feet for a big guy, but he's not your typical target man who can make the little touches with his head.

Like a certain Daniele Salvatore Dichio perhaps? I am not sure if you have eve seen that guy play?

ensco
05-09-2016, 02:10 PM
Well - Dichio scored 14 goals in 59 games, Altidore has 13 in 28.

I'd like to see that stat on a goals per 90 minutes played basis. I bet it is a lot closer than that. Dichio was a sub, and was subbed out, a lot.

Also Dichio's work as a target man, the flick ons, whether with his head or his foot, the little side foot passes in traffic, were truly sublime. I don't know if videos of that live on in some dark corner of youtube somewhere, but those who were there know what I mean.

Go Jozy, though - he will work through it I think/hope.

Yohan
05-09-2016, 02:11 PM
Frankly, I don't care what a player's stats end up being, if the team as whole is winning, and the player is playing his role.

Same criticism that Jozy is getting is also going to Bradley. You'd think Bradley should be getting like 10 goals, 10 assists every year the amount of money he's making.

I think tying stats into a player's production is ultimately counterproductive. In the end, what matters is if the team is winning or not.

Yohan
05-09-2016, 02:14 PM
I'd like to see that stat on a points per 90 minutes played basis. Dichio was a sub, and was subbed out, a lot.

Dichio: 1 goal every 241 mins

Altidore: 1 goal every 174 mins (in TFC uniform)

http://www.mlssoccer.com/players/danny-dichio
http://www.mlssoccer.com/players/jozy-altidore

ensco
05-09-2016, 02:17 PM
Like a certain Daniele Salvatore Dichio perhaps? I am not sure if you have eve seen that guy play?

Hey - I tried to troll this into a Dichio thread first! Off my cloud!

OgtheDim
05-09-2016, 02:25 PM
As if there won't be enough Dichio nostalgia this week with it being Dichio night on Saturday.

shwade
05-09-2016, 02:34 PM
Has Jozy been good? Yes. Has Jozy been 5M good? No, at that point you are paid to score.

The thing with this conversation like with the stadium is it's okay to be critical of certain aspects while still enjoying others. Far too often it seams like any amount of criticism amount to someone hating on something while they were simply point one part out.

Jozy was good saturday even though he didn't score but it is very tough to call a DP striker good over a long period if they are not scoring not matter how well rounded a game they play.

For Jozy to earn his contract he needs to be scoring 12-15 goals but that doesn't mean he is a complete waste if he doesn't, it's just that is the expectation when you make that kind of money.

Thanks you. Well said.

ensco
05-09-2016, 02:34 PM
Dichio: 1 goal every 241 mins

Altidore: 1 goal every 174 mins (in TFC uniform)

http://www.mlssoccer.com/players/danny-dichio
http://www.mlssoccer.com/players/jozy-altidore

Thanks. I thought Dichio was actually better than that overall - he slowed down a bit that last year.

Cashcleaner
05-09-2016, 02:42 PM
Like the OP and others here, Altidore's lack of goal-scoring hasn't really bothered me. Maybe it's because we're currently second in the East and...you know, WINING GAMES! I mean, I get the frustration and normally agree that when you bring in a DP striker, you expect him to bag more than his fair share of goals. Honestly, with the way we're playing now, I wouldn't want to change things up too much, so I'd say keep playing him as Vanney is right now and hope for a more productive game in the near future from him.

Jack
05-09-2016, 02:47 PM
Like a certain Daniele Salvatore Dichio perhaps? I am not sure if you have eve seen that guy play?
I was gonna say it, but I edited it out g:D


I'd like to see that stat on a goals per 90 minutes played basis. I bet it is a lot closer than that. Dichio was a sub, and was subbed out, a lot.

Also Dichio's work as a target man, the flick ons, whether with his head or his foot, the little side foot passes in traffic, were truly sublime. I don't know if videos of that live on in some dark corner of youtube somewhere, but those who were there know what I mean.

Go Jozy, though - he will work through it I think/hope.
Dichio's target man play was great and the little flicks and touches were a joy to watch. Jozy brings a different set of skills to the table. He can do things with his dribbling and explosiveness that Danny couldn't.


Frankly, I don't care what a player's stats end up being, if the team as whole is winning, and the player is playing his role.

Same criticism that Jozy is getting is also going to Bradley. You'd think Bradley should be getting like 10 goals, 10 assists every year the amount of money he's making.

I think tying stats into a player's production is ultimately counterproductive. In the end, what matters is if the team is winning or not.
Bang on. If the team is winning and the guys making the big bucks are making large contributions to it, that's what matters. Goals and assists are only part of that picture.


As if there won't be enough Dichio nostalgia this week with it being Dichio night on Saturday.
I'm always up for some Dichio nostalgia g:D

trane
05-09-2016, 04:35 PM
^ There should be Dichio nostalgia as long as there is football played in Toronto.

dupont
05-09-2016, 04:53 PM
The chemistry is working well and we are winning games. I actually think Jozy is helping and I don't care to think about salary stuff as long as the team is doing great. He could score one goal the whole season for all I care as long as we win the cup! :)

I do think he will start scoring though. Last game was strange. I was happy for Endoh getting that goal but there seemed to be a couple other times when he got in the way of where Jozy was trying to be which caused us to miss a good chance. He is young though so I'm sure Vanney and leaders like Bradley can let him realize his role more. (whoops I just re-read the previous page and see I was beaten to this point twice already lol)

Jack
05-09-2016, 05:27 PM
You will always have a small percentage that will no like him for one reason or another. He has done well but still room for improvement to truly be worth the salary.
I want to see him start scoring, but where the big money players really should be different is when they are in a slump like this, they aren't completely useless. Altidore while not scoring is still making a huge contribution to our success. So while I don't like it and expect him to score, I can live with it thanks to everything else he's doing.

Brooker
05-09-2016, 07:48 PM
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Jozy Jozy

Jozy Jozy Jozy Altidore.

He's doing well. He's such a threat. Defenders don't know what to do with our attackers.

One wonders why other people are scoring..... Hmmmmmmm......

Red4ever
05-09-2016, 08:15 PM
I would prefer he creates space for others than scores. It's a more pure offence with a target man. A target man who is expected to score gets solved, quick.

Hes earning his money now.

C.Ronaldo
05-10-2016, 08:36 AM
Thanks. I thought Dichio was actually better than that overall - he slowed down a bit that last year.

do you remember what he was playing with?

Yohan
05-10-2016, 09:51 AM
do you remember what he was playing with?

The 09 team was pretty stacked in terms of offence. Too bad Dichio didn't get the mins to take full advantage

jloome
05-10-2016, 12:44 PM
The 09 team was pretty stacked in terms of offence. Too bad Dichio didn't get the mins to take full advantage

The first two seasons we were coached by Mo; no one got service. I don't think you can compare Altidore's lack of production in a team as good as the one we have now with that mess back then.

Look, I said it at the end of last season: Altidore is only role-playing as a target man. He's not active enough to be an effective striker; he doesn't get into the box enough, he doesn't demand the ball enough. Yes, his interplay right now is really good, but his interplay is always really good.

Last year, he had the fewest shots of any DP forward in the league, despite his 13 goals, and I said that if he repeated that with his typical career efficacy, we could as easily see a season where he scores five-to-seven as one where he scores 12-15. And right now I think that's what we're seeing. For a $4M-plus striker, that's ridiculous to me.

No, he's not playing well enough. Count me as the dissenting voice, but in this league, you need a DP striker who scores goals as well. He has to start trying to create some chances for himself rather than just being Seba's linchpin.

OgtheDim
05-10-2016, 01:32 PM
Altidore is only role-playing as a target man. He's not active enough to be an effective striker....

If you thought he was inactive last Saturday, well...I got no answer to that because its so profoundly wrong.

trane
05-10-2016, 01:43 PM
^ I respect Jloome's opinion, but yeah, he was anything but inactive on Saturday.

I do believe, from what I am seeing that he will score 12-15 this year.

jloome
05-10-2016, 02:24 PM
If you thought he was inactive last Saturday, well...I got no answer to that because its so profoundly wrong.

Inactive as a striker. Very active as a target man. But he's always very active as a target man. We need two forwards who score regularly. If he only gets 25-30 shots off a season, we can't rely on him being productive as the number two. Jozy Altidore being 18 yards from goal most of the time and getting maybe one shot a game isn't active enough. He needs to be involved in goal scoring more often.

In fact, this was basically his entire problem at Sunderland (that and a shit team.)

EDIT: In fact, I invite you all to look at his opta stats. They were not impressive.

Some highlights:

Aerial duels, 1 for 6

Tackles 2 of 3

Passes 23 of 36 (63%)

Shots: 1 of 2 on target

Chances created: 0

Five fouls committed, four suffered.

Statistically, he had a pretty shit game for a DP striker.

http://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/statszone/98-2016/matches/842733/player-stats/41574/OVERALL_02#tabs-wrapper-anchor

Red I
05-10-2016, 02:54 PM
Inactive as a striker. Very active as a target man. But he's always very active as a target man. We need two forwards who score regularly. If he only gets 25-30 shots off a season, we can't rely on him being productive as the number two. Jozy Altidore being 18 yards from goal most of the time and getting maybe one shot a game isn't active enough. He needs to be involved in goal scoring more often.

In fact, this was basically his entire problem at Sunderland (that and a shit team.)

EDIT: In fact, I invite you all to look at his opta stats. They were not impressive.

Some highlights:

Aerial duels, 1 for 6

Tackles 2 of 3

Passes 23 of 36 (63%)

Shots: 1 of 2 on target

Chances created: 0

Five fouls committed, four suffered.

Statistically, he had a pretty shit game for a DP striker.

http://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/statszone/98-2016/matches/842733/player-stats/41574/OVERALL_02#tabs-wrapper-anchor

quickly I can point out some fault with the data...The ball he slipped to Giovinco was not a chance because Giovinco was not assessed a shot because he missed his chip... gotta scrub the data against an eye test too. Four fouls suffered is pretty good for a striker - pass completion is never going to be high if you are receiving balls so high in the opposing end - tackle ratio is pretty good for a striker - aerial duals is the only stat that jumps out as poor, especially for a target striker, but he's never been as beastly in the air as he should be - he's much better at holding up with feet

The missed shot on the cross was bad, should have hit the net there - I will agree that his finishing is not as sharp as it should be. Overall, there are not many chances created, so he needs to convert what few he gets. He did it before, not sure why it's not happening now.

OgtheDim
05-10-2016, 03:14 PM
Inactive as a striker. Very active as a target man....

There is no such position as a pure striker. He's either active or not. He was all over the pitch which is what a #2 striker playing with Giovinco is going to be like playing in our system where the strikers NEED to get around defensively.

He's as active as David Villa, who is the poster boy for active strikers in this league.

jloome
05-10-2016, 03:30 PM
There is no such position as a pure striker. He's either active or not. He was all over the pitch which is what a #2 striker playing with Giovinco is going to be like playing in our system where the strikers NEED to get around defensively.

He's as active as David Villa, who is the poster boy for active strikers in this league.

There is such thing as a striker role, and there is such a thing as a target man role. Right now, he's only fulfilling one. Try to term it any way you want, the stats speak for themselves. Even conceding when they miss things like close chances that aren't on target, he's not creating much of a threat for us, and we need more than one key goalscorer.

'As active as David Villa'; This is silly. He plays an entirely different role. Villa is a goal scorer of the first order. I don't care if Jozy ever becomes that, but he has to present a threat by being more active in the box, or he's not worth what the team is paying him.

And he didn't "get around defensively". He lost more challenges than he won and had two tackles.

OgtheDim
05-10-2016, 03:39 PM
There is such thing as a striker role, and there is such a thing as a target man role.

Disagree and thus this goes nowhere. You think he should be playing a certain way. He's not going to be.


Sorry, I like what you write normally, but when it comes to defensive input by a striker, I trust Justin Morrow a bit more. Team as a whole thinks he's doing more then fine. That's good enough for me.

notthesun
05-10-2016, 04:36 PM
Altidore not scoring is only a problem if we aren't winning. We've been getting results lately and he's clearly played a role in getting them, so I'm happy with him. But sooner or later you do figure he needs to start scoring in order for us to keep getting the results.

I posted at the end of last year about how Altidore simply didn't take enough shots. Altidore only took 37 shots last year - it's such a small amount that every shot essentially becomes more important, because if you miss a big chance, at that rate of shooting you might have to wait a whole other game or two to get another opportunity. 13 goals was a great haul for him last year on that number of shots. The xG model says he finished with over 5 more goals than you would've expected (sort by G-xG) (http://www.americansocceranalysis.com/new-page-3/), good for what you could say made him the 3rd best finisher in the league last year. The issue is if he takes a similar number of shots this year, but his finishing is even just slightly worse, he'll end up on the wrong side of 10 goals. Whereas if he takes double the shots, even with worse finishing he'll be passing 15 goals.

I also mentioned that Altidore finished the year with 0 assists and that we should expect him to pick up a few this year. Well, he's got 2 already. I attribute that to his improved hold up play and mobility (credit to him for improving his fitness over the off-season). So it's good to see him being even more involved in our general play.

Still, he needs to be a bigger threat around the goal by shooting more. 50 shots would be a respectable number. 50 shots should be enough that he has a reasonable year, and if he can finish near the same level that he did last year, it'll be a lot more than reasonable. Factoring in games remaining and that Altidore will be missing at least a few, he needs to average somewhere around 2 shots a game, maybe slightly more, to hit 50. That's not so much - remember, all these numbers are shot attempts, not shots on target. It's actually incredible that Altidore scored 13 last year - of those 37 shots he took, 18 of them were on target. When he shot on target, he scored 72% of the time. Crazy.

Ultra & Proud
05-10-2016, 04:54 PM
He would probably manage a few more shots on goal if Seba passed more to the open man. I know he is the best the league has but sometimes he shoots from some low percentage areas when there are other options open. That and also because I have seen Endoh, Delgado, and Osorio pass up open men, Jozy included, to hunt for Seba. I know he can make something of nothing but when he shatters the league record in shots on goal then the other forward(s) will be missing out on scoring opportunities. That never seems to be factored in on why Jozy and Osorio are having less scoring chances.

notthesun
05-10-2016, 05:46 PM
He would probably manage a few more shots on goal if Seba passed more to the open man. I know he is the best the league has but sometimes he shoots from some low percentage areas when there are other options open. That and also because I have seen Endoh, Delgado, and Osorio pass up open men, Jozy included, to hunt for Seba. I know he can make something of nothing but when he shatters the league record in shots on goal then the other forward(s) will be missing out on scoring opportunities. That never seems to be factored in on why Jozy and Osorio are having less scoring chances.

For sure. Giovinco is our first option by a mile and he's incredibly shot-happy, so that eats into how many chances Altidore can get for himself. But that's also why I targeted 50 shots instead of something higher. Some comparables last year with similar minutes played or less: Aristeguieta (50 shots), Agudelo (54), Saborio (54), Igboananike (66). None of those guys were primary chance creators, nor were they guys that the offense is designed around feeding (hence why you can't really compare Altidore to Kamara's shot totals for example). So while I factor in that Altidore plays with a playmaker that takes way more shots than any of those guys played with, I'd also like Altidore to be more of a consistent threat than all those guys too.

I think Altidore just needs to be a tad more selfish around the box, really. I saw him try so many first-time flicks and lay-offs near the goal last year. Sometimes the right play really is to just turn and shoot. It feels like he only shoots when he knows he can score, but I'd like to see him shoot when he thinks he might score too.

Ultra & Proud
05-10-2016, 07:46 PM
For the folks who always say Jozy doesn't live up to his price tag and who are obsessed with what players get paid and seem only to care about goal production to judge a forwards worth, how about this:

Going by last year:
Seba made $7M and Jozy $4M. So he makes roughly 57% of Seba's salary.
Seba scored 22 goals and Jose got 13. So roughly 59% of his goal totals.

Going by what I've read a lot of people say about Jozy this year and last, I think this should solve the question of his worth for them. Is it right? No, but neither is judging a player solely by goals scored.

StokeciTFC
05-10-2016, 09:31 PM
In the spirit of the thread, props to the man. Nice work. Nothing else to say.

ordrummerboi
05-11-2016, 10:45 AM
I think everyone needs to wait. He hasnt had a healthy run of games yet in toronto where he is 100%. He really blew up in his 2nd season at alkmaar. I personally think Copa America will boost his confidence if he can grab some goals and stay healthy. He looked ready to light up the league before the hammy. Also he isnt the main guy here, Gio is. Jozy will get his goals but wont be scoring 25+ because gio is the main scorer.
An example is what benzema is to ronaldo.
15/16 season:
Benzema-28 goals
Ronaldo-49 goals
15/16 season:
Giovinco-22 goals
Altidore-13 goals

trane
05-11-2016, 01:51 PM
I love what I am seeing from Altidore. That is why I started the thread.

However, I have to agree, that he could/should take a couple of more shots per game. Not go crazy, with the shots alla Giovinco, but a shot a game is two low. Despite that I still think that we are getting a top level CF, and he is worth the money.

Oldtimer
11-25-2016, 04:08 PM
Interesting re-reading this thread.

Altidore has come up big in the playoffs, and now that the club is managing to keep him healthy he has turned into a huge asset. I love how he links up with Giovinco and he has the power to muscle more physical teams.

TFC Tifoso
11-25-2016, 04:33 PM
Interesting re-reading this thread.

Altidore has come up big in the playoffs, and now that the club is managing to keep him healthy he has turned into a huge asset. I love how he links up with Giovinco and he has the power to muscle more physical teams.

ya definitely! I was critical of the big man when he was not scoring earlier this year, but I'm very happy to hold my hands up now.....Jozy has been in pure beast mode the past couple of months....the way he tossed Cabrera aside on the 2nd gosl was beautiful.....did it again a coupe of minutes later near midfield.....he's been great down the stretch!

Auzzy
11-25-2016, 04:39 PM
the way he tossed Cabrera aside on the 2nd gosl was beautiful.....did it again a coupe of minutes later near midfield.....he's been great down the stretch!

Remember, it's called a "love tap," not tossing somebody aside. Altidore said so himself. :D

ensco
11-25-2016, 05:41 PM
I do believe, from what I am seeing that he will score 12-15 this year.

This was from May, pretty much bang on. He got 10 in 23 games, plus has 4 in 4 playoff games.

Red4ever
11-25-2016, 09:04 PM
That's 14 total ;)

tiberius
11-25-2016, 10:10 PM
Interesting re-reading this thread.

Altidore has come up big in the playoffs, and now that the club is managing to keep him healthy he has turned into a huge asset. I love how he links up with Giovinco and he has the power to muscle more physical teams.

What a turn around - thinking back to that low point in May when he missed the PK, I thought he was done - shattered confidence. What a beautiful turnaround - you just have to love it!

Hamilton_Red
11-26-2016, 01:12 PM
That's 14 total ;)
When he scores 2 on Wednesday and a couple more on the 10th of December and ends with 18goals Trane is going to look foolish!