Match Day 4 - Things to Do in Denver When You're Red- TFC @ Colorado Sat April 2 8 pm

[OgtheDim]

This game is on TSN.

Away games are never easy in this league but if there was a game in this stretch where we should have higher expectations, its this one.

[molenshtain]

Would expect us to take a bit more of an expansive approach to this game too. Means playing Gio on the left and Altidore top. Looking forward to this one.

[mistercorporate]

Hey Og, any recommendations for non-tfc mls games to watch from this season to increase my soccer intelligence? Also any pointers regarding what tactics etc. to watch out for in each game would be much appreciated!

[Yohan]

Hey Og, any recommendations for non-tfc mls games to watch from this season to increase my soccer intelligence? Also any pointers regarding what tactics etc. to watch out for in each game would be much appreciated!
just watch any MLS game if you are bored.

you can never tell which games will be most entertaining.

[Blindside16]

We should take 3 points this game. It will be another good test for our back line with Pappa and Doyle probing. Hopefully we can finally see the full team that we were expecting out there: Irwin, Morrow, Moor, Perquis, Beitashour, Bradley, Johnson, Osorio, Seba, Altidore, Endoh/Babouli

[OgtheDim]

What Yohan said for games.


Tactics? Well LAG is playing what amounts to a 2-4-4, NYCFC is playing a 3-6-1. Seattle is trying to figure itself out post Martens. Vancouver might have to adjust out of its 4-2-3-1. CBus, Chicago, DCU and Colorado were unwatchable against each other - worst games I've seen in over 5 years. Portland is always fun because they interact so well. SJE is trying to do what CBus did last season an DCU the season before - pass it to the guy and hope. Orlando is like watching us the last few years - can score but that defence has issues. NER was boringly competent until yesterday when their defence imploded.

[mistercorporate]

Wicked pointers, will make watching them more fun. Appreciated!

[Fort York Redcoat]

In last nights session at Joe's things became more clear to me.

1.This game is FAaaaaaar away and things could change for either team. Still looking forward to it.
2. There is a couple Canada matches on Fri and Tues respectively which is awesome.
3. That its Easter and Family expectations may arise. booooo. g:D BUT a Good Friday nap ensures that ridonk kickoff time in Vancouver means a good long, Good Friday night!:canada:

[notthesun]

Moor is training again:

https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/712678126233452545

[C.Ronaldo]

just watch any MLS game if you are bored.

you can never tell which games will be most entertaining.

i watched condensed matches on MLS live, makes even the crappier teams palatable.

And if your a TFC fan, you usually recognize at least one player from our history

[C.Ronaldo]

Moor is training again:

https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/712678126233452545

I had the same bug, kicked the crap out of me

[Ivy]

I had the same bug, kicked the crap out of me
The SAME bug?? Sounds romantic ;)

hard to predict these early season games. Colorado is playing well.
Hhhhhhhmmmmm I'll go 3-0 TFC.

[GhostKiller]

Healthy
---Seba----Jozy----Endo---
--WJ-----Bradley----Oso--
Morrow--Perquis--moor--Beit.
---------Irwin----------

Unhealthy
------------seba------------
Delgado---johnson----endoh
--Cheyrou---------Bradley-----
Morrow---Perquis--Moor---Biet
-----------Irwin----------------

[Red CB Toronto]

Healthy
---Seba----Jozy----Endo---
--WJ-----Bradley----Oso--
Morrow--Perquis--moor--Beit.
---------Irwin----------

Unhealthy
------------seba------------
Delgado---johnson----endoh
--Cheyrou---------Bradley-----
Morrow---Perquis--Moor---Biet
-----------Irwin----------------

With it being the bye week, thought I would share this random fact, The General's first cousin and son of TFC's Director of Communications Jeff Bradley, Tyler is a freshman catcher at Furman.

http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-basebl/2015-16/bios/bradley_tyler_2ep9

[Ivy]

With it being the bye week, thought I would share this random fact, The General's first cousin and son of TFC's Director of Communications Jeff Bradley, Tyler is a freshman catcher at Furman.

http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-basebl/2015-16/bios/bradley_tyler_2ep9
No way! Wow that's pretty awesome.
The GENERAL family!

[jloome]

With it being the bye week, thought I would share this random fact, The General's first cousin and son of TFC's Director of Communications Jeff Bradley, Tyler is a freshman catcher at Furman.

http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-basebl/2015-16/bios/bradley_tyler_2ep9

Jeff Bradley's a good writer, too. Wrote for Sports Illustrated if I recall correctly.

[Yohan]

i watched condensed matches on MLS live, makes even the crappier teams palatable.

And if your a TFC fan, you usually recognize at least one player from our history
MLS is producing a short highlight clip that'll get you caught up on all the games


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atfnICTdjdQ

[Red CB Toronto]

Jeff Bradley's a good writer, too. Wrote for Sports Illustrated if I recall correctly.

And ESPN, also coverd the Yankees beat for the Newark paper.

[Initial B]

Early season and at altitude? Irwin and Moor will be used to it, so I'm not worried about the defence, but I imagine the office will suffer and Colorado's defence isn't bad. I'll say 1-0 TFC.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Early season and at altitude? Irwin and Moor will be used to it, so I'm not worried about the defence, but I imagine the office will suffer and Colorado's defence isn't bad. I'll say 1-0 TFC.

I can't even about this game.

Will Johnson on fire from facing Mexico twice in one week makes it 1- nil for the good guys.:canada:

[Initial B]

Argh, I meant to say *Offense*. I don't imagine that Vanney will use Johnson, Bradley, or Altidore as starters, they'll be on the bench. Actually, forget that last, Jozy will be injured.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Argh, I meant to say *Offense*. I don't imagine that Vanney will use Johnson, Bradley, or Altidore as starters, they'll be on the bench. Actually, forget that last, Jozy will be injured.

Hahaha THATS our, B! Alright the "glass half empty" prediction is done for this one. Nothing to do but follow the International break. g:D

[KGH]

Healthy
---Seba----Jozy----Endo---
--WJ-----Bradley----Oso--
Morrow--Perquis--moor--Beit.
---------Irwin----------



I wonder if at this point Delgado takes Endo's spot.

[Red CB Toronto]

Before his takes on Colorado The General has a job to do for the USMNT, having arrived in Guatamla.

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpl1/t31.0-8/12719478_10154046178529122_829299972459537081_o.jp g

[OgtheDim]

On the day before Canada plays Mexico in front of 50K


I say I don't give a shit about the Yanks down there.



:canada::canada::canada::canada::canada::canada::c anada::canada::canada::canada:

[anto7]

Looks like Kevin Doyle will be missing after suffering a nasty gash to the shin playing for Ireland yesterday, required surgery.

[anto7]

Looks like Kevin Doyle will be missing after suffering a nasty gash to the shin playing for Ireland yesterday, required surgery.

If I could figure out how to post a picture on my iPad I would show the picture of the injury....it's pretty gross looking.

[OgtheDim]

Here's a link - picture is shown lower down in the article - probably better then copying the picture in here, which is kinda gross unless you are into ankle muscles and how they work.

If he's not out for a month, I'd be very surprised.

http://www.thesportbible.com/articles/kevin-doyle-shows-off-nasty-gash-after-ireland-match-260316




(http://www.thesportbible.com/articles/kevin-doyle-shows-off-nasty-gash-after-ireland-match-260316)

[Richard]

Now that's a gash, yikes.

[Auzzy]

Not even looking or opening that link, nope nope nope!

[OgtheDim]

Wait a second.....we got another TFC game in 4 days.


Where did those 2 weeks go?

[Greatest Ripoff]

For anyone in England, this is live on sky sports 5.

[bgnewf]

Ismail Elfath is the Referee in charge of the Colorado game on Saturday. TFC has a decent 5-1-2 record all time when he officiates. However in those eight matches Elfath has handed out 16 yellow cards and a PK against the Reds versus 10 yellows to the opposition. The last time TFC saw Elfath officiate was last September when the Reds defeated Chicago 3-2 at BMO Field.

We have compiled a referee database for every TFC game ever played with complete referee data on every game. Feel free to check it out here:

http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/stats/referee-stats/ (http://viewfromthesouthstands.com/stats/referee-stats/)

[Cashcleaner]

While the game is still a few days off, the forecast in Commerce City at kick-off is mild and sunny with a high that day of 18 degrees Celsius, though that's expected to drop a couple of degrees at kick-off (6pm Mountain Time). Colorado has also been getting some rain for the past few days and are expecting wet, windy, and overcast conditions tomorrow as well, so players may be having to train under a dome for the first half of the week. The Rapids will be going into their second home game this season in the match against Toronto, with an identical Win, Draw, Loss record of 1-1-1. TFC however, has them beat on Goals Scored (4 for TFC, 2 for COL) and has a +1 Goal Differential, while Colorado has equal goals for and against. Still far to early in the season to glean anything substantial from previous results, but I think most would argue that with the exception of their match against Los Angeles, Toronto has been facing tougher opposition so far.

Another road win for TFC is well within our grasp on Saturday, but I don't expect a walk in the park. Well, I never really do to begin with, of course.

[Graeme]

Will we finally be able to see:

----------------------Irwin-----------------
--Beitashour---Perquis--Moor--Morrow--
---Johnson-------Bradley----Osorio----
--Endoh-----Altidore------Giovinco----

or will Bradley, Johnson & Altidore still be recovering?

[OgtheDim]

Interesting question on Johnson.

He's been in altitude since Sunday. Do you send him straight to Colorado?


I'm assuming TFC won't arrive out there until Friday. There was some talk I heard the last two seasons with our trip to RSL that unless you show up at altitude 6+ days before, you are better to show up the day before.

[QBall]

Colorado is one of those teams that fade into the background until it's time to play them. They don't really have any high profile names but then again they're not perennial basement dwellers, so something is going on over there it's just that no one bothers to pay attention. Still they have the same record as we do so I guess we can't dismiss them offhand. Elevation might be a factor (plus after playing 2 games in the NY/NJ area TFC's players might not be used to clean air) so I'll say 4-2 Reds.

[bgnewf]

its also the largest pitch in MLS - far wider than any other in the league.

[notthesun]

https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/715629237357518848

[Pint]

makes sense to keep him at altitude

[Hugh Jazz]

I'd love to see us coming out with more of an attack mindset for this one. I know its defence first for this road trip but Colorado is far less potent up front than the other 3 teams we've played so far, especially with Doyle out.

[Detroit_TFC]

Yeah, kinda would like to see the team hit the gas pedal on this one. A dominant, attack minded game would set the stage well for the more difficult games coming up.

[molenshtain]

When's the last time you guys saw any team go out and dominate someone on the road in an MLS game?

It's Colorado, but we still shouldn't expect too much.

[Graeme]

When's the last time you guys saw any team go out and dominate someone on the road in an MLS game?


Is this a trick question? The answer is 'Too many times to count at BMO field from 2007 to 2014...'

[OgtheDim]

When's the last time you guys saw any team go out and dominate someone on the road in an MLS game?



Dallas at DCU just 2 weeks ago.


I don't want domination. I do think a result is possible and this team should be trying to flex its offensive muscles. Of the 8 away games, this is the most winnable.

[Red CB Toronto]

That is exactly what they did, Will flew straight to Denver. Good call on the Reds.


Interesting question on Johnson.

He's been in altitude since Sunday. Do you send him straight to Colorado?


I'm assuming TFC won't arrive out there until Friday. There was some talk I heard the last two seasons with our trip to RSL that unless you show up at altitude 6+ days before, you are better to show up the day before.

[Areathrasher]

Team flew into Denver last night

[Cas87]

I wonder if the new alternate kits make their debut this week?

I don't recall if we have worn our Red kits in Colorado that much (odd time here or there).

[OgtheDim]

FWIW

http://toronto-mp7static.mlsdigital.net/elfinderimages/2016-StartingXI%20Rapids.png




BTW, to see the difference in this team, look at this projected 11 from just 2 years ago.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bkd5-uFCUAI07ga.jpg

[ag futbol]

Alvaro Rey! Totally forgot about him.

Now there's someone who would be useful in a FW role. That said, wasn't there some noise about him being home sick when he scurried back to Spain?

[Pint]

Alvaro Rey! Totally forgot about him.

Now there's someone who would be useful in a FW role. That said, wasn't there some noise about him being home sick when he scurried back to Spain?

I believe that was after he was sent to Columbus.

[Hugh Jazz]

BTW, to see the difference in this team, look at this projected 11 from just 2 years ago.


4 of those starters are still with the team at least which is kinda shocking for me considering all the turnover through the years.

[OgtheDim]

GAME DAY :scarf:

[DIEHARDTFC]

I'd expect Gio and Endo to be able to play more freely on the wings now that Altidore is back up top in the middle...should create more chances offensively

[ManUtd4ever]

Really looking forward to seeing our best lineup out there tonight.

[ChrisFizik]

Happy match day all (saturday!)

Og - I spent too much time watching clips of Things to do in Denver last night, hehe

Feels like it's gonna be a good one tonight

[anto7]

I wonder if the new alternate kits make their debut this week?

I don't recall if we have worn our Red kits in Colorado that much (odd time here or there).

Toronto FC to debut its controversial, but sharp-lookin' white kits tonight. As per Kurt Larson.

[khso11]

I'll say 2-0 for the good guys. 1 from Seba and 1 from Jozy.

[Joe Kool]

Funny how all Colorado fan comments I am reading has it as a should win for Colorado. Not sure why they are so confident that we will have no offensive abilities. Most if not all TFC fans are also predicting a should win tonight. I am on the TFC should win side too but I just find it interesting with the team we have that Rapids fans think we are not much of a threat.

[portu]

Altidore not starting.. Just pushing me further and further along the anti-Altidore path

[OgtheDim]

Lovitz and Babouli start beside Seba. This should be intriguing. A winger/defender on the one side and Wild Thing on the other.

[reggie]

another not to lose lineup?

[Oldtimer]

All 3 of Colorado's DPs are out. TFC should win this one.

[OgtheDim]

Colordado is playing a 4-2-3-1 it seems.

[Richard]

Why put Osorio and Endoh on the bench? :facepalm:

[notthesun]

Babouli's gonna score.

[molenshtain]

Why put Osorio and Endoh on the bench? :facepalm:

Because they're ahead of schedule in terms of expected points, and this is an easier opponent, so it seems like an ok idea to rotate the squad and see what some of the depth guys could show.

Admittedly, I'd rather see Chapman out there than Lovitz. But I'm happy Balbouli is getting meaningful minutes.

[Hugh Jazz]

Osorio only returned to training midweek. Unless Endoh's play is superb, he or any other rookie shouldn't be starting every week. This is a workable starting line-up. Big question is will Vanney make the appropriate changes if needed, plenty of options off the bench today.

[portu]

Am I right in seeing only 5 players on Colorado's bench??

[JavierMartini]

Funny how all Colorado fan comments I am reading has it as a should win for Colorado. Not sure why they are so confident that we will have no offensive abilities. Most if not all TFC fans are also predicting a should win tonight. I am on the TFC should win side too but I just find it interesting with the team we have that Rapids fans think we are not much of a threat.

Where are you reading that?

[JavierMartini]

Babouli - Gio - Lovitz starting up front for us.

[OgtheDim]

Game is on TSN2 and sky

Streams might be off on some places as some seem to be assuming it would be on TSN1.

http://cricfree.sx/watch/live/colorado-rapids-vs-toronto-fc-live-streaming

http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/401835_colorado_toronto/

http://firstrowca.eu/watch/424834/1/watch-colorado-rapids-vs-toronto-fc.html

[JavierMartini]

Lovitz and Babouli start beside Seba. This should be intriguing. A winger/defender on the one side and Wild Thing on the other.

Lovitz can serve a ball well on certain occasions.

[OgtheDim]

Blue shorts with the white tops apparently.

Time to cheer for


http://blackstonepubandeatery.com/bsto/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/red-stripe-300x205.png

[JavierMartini]

http://www.crichd.tv/sky-sports-5-live-stream-uk1.php no need to disable adblocker

[portu]

Where are you reading that?
BigSoccer is where I found that sentiment mostly, however some of it felt really bloody hopeful

[ronzilla]

Streams


http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/401835_colorado_toronto/#webplayer_ifr|402979|401835|402979|64|1|en

http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/401835_colorado_toronto/#webplayer_ifr|402952|401835|402952|64|1|en

http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/401835_colorado_toronto/#webplayer_ifr|401428|401835|401428|64|1|en

http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/401835_colorado_toronto/#webplayer_ifr|402952|401835|402952|64|1|en



http://firstsrowsports.eu/soccer/first-colorado-rapids-vs-toronto-fc-row68850b

http://sport.streams.tv/soccer/1607529

http://www.stream2watch.co/live-now/sports/soccer/colorado-rapids-vs-toronto-fc-live-stream-april-03

http://realstreamunited.tv/soccer/colorado-rapids-vs-toronto-fc-rsu2hddf5

[ag futbol]

I'll back Babouli for more minutes. The tools are there, he just needs to fit himself in with the rest of the lineup.

[Redcoe15]

Three points tonight for the Reds (and whites and blue from the looks of it).

LET'S DO IT!!!!!

[Yohan]

I really don't like the blue shorts

[Bobo]

I blame the shorts for that dismissal.

[JavierMartini]

this is fucking ridiculous. Pablomastroeni should fuck off and shut up. Holy fuck what a bad call.

[JavierMartini]

Another fucking apology from PRO? This is fucking absurd man.

[OgtheDim]

Knew it.

[habstfc]

what happened?

[Dub Narcotic]

How can you call the second yellow at this point in the game on that? Awful.

[Voodooman]

Not even a yellow -.-

I'm watching on the Colorado feed and even they agree that was harsh.

[CBTFC]

Fucking awesome, well done MLS

[habstfc]

let me guess tfc sent off for BS call?

[notthesun]

Who was it saying in the other thread that the harsh refereeing would play in our favour? lol

It's a roll of the dice every game with these refs... You just never know what they're going to do. I was convinced Cheyrou was going to be sent off with a straight red on the first one anyways.

[Hugh Jazz]

I could see the second foul being a yellow but not the first. Have to think TFC should be paying better attention to the way refs are calling things, Johnson just tried slide tackling Cronin from behind, lucky no contact made.

[General Woolfe]

Defence asleep :facepalm:

[JavierMartini]

and there is it. 3 games and 4* game deciding calls. I wish i had something to throw at mastroeni what a completle joke of a coach, jumping up and down yelling at the ref outside of his box, flying elbows an absolute joke.

That goal was offside.

[Ajax TFC]

Pretty fucking far offside

[smtavare]

Bradley ball watching there, plays great for Team USA, plays like a regular Joe for tfc

[General Woolfe]

A goal down, and a man down , with 70 minutes to play at this altitude is a big ask...


(Just thought id tempt fate)

[Bobo]

It is Cheyrou's responsibility to play smart after a soft first yellow so early on. Leading with an flailing arm in a midfield aerial duel is NOT smart.


Pretty fucking far offside

LOL, the homers are out again tonight.

[Redcoe15]

:facepalm: :banghead:

This isn't going to be our night!

[Oldtimer]

All 3 of Colorado's DPs are out. TFC should win this one. never mind, TFC will be extremely lucky to get even a point.

[OgtheDim]

Slowed it down on MLS Live. That goal was onside.

[Vendetta]

Same old same old.....

[jloome]

It is Cheyrou's responsibility to play smart after a soft first yellow so early on. Leading with an flailing arm in a midfield aerial duel is NOT smart.



LOL, the homers are out again tonight.

Even the Colorado announcers disagree with you. Being a contrarian for its own sake just looks stupid. He didn't throw his elbow, and the striker was half a yard offside. Get over the martyr complex; being gypped is being gypped.

[stevep]

Who was it saying in the other thread that the harsh refereeing would play in our favour? lol

It's a roll of the dice every game with these refs... You just never know what they're going to do. I was convinced Cheyrou was going to be sent off with a straight red on the first one anyways.


this is why this is a bush league, you cannot bet on mls games the referree's are not good. you need to be able to bet if you want to have a good sport.
you need good referee to bet on games
betting is pretty random as it is but when you put in totally random poor refereeing it is impossible to bet

[jloome]

Slowed it down on MLS Live. That goal was onside.

It was not only offside, it was offside twice, as he came back from an offside position and there was still a half-yard between him and drew moor.

[69Chevy396]

:facepalm: :banghead:

This isn't going to be our night!
Not our season either. Aside from a few minutes of Geovinco brilliance, this team is utterly horrible to watch. Booting the ball by the defenders is something this team has embraced for a decade. Nothing happens in the midfield. No passing, no playmaking, no strategy. If the team does not improve its tactics, they will be out of the playoffs by August

[General Woolfe]

Slowed it down on MLS Live. That goal was onside.

To be honest that was my initial thought. The defence was ballwatching. Totally static

[Vendetta]

Bye bye lovitz lol. You can thank benoit

[Dub Narcotic]

I thought the goal looked onside.

[Yohan]

Slowed it down on MLS Live. That goal was onside.
http://i.imgur.com/3ysESIO.jpg

[notthesun]

First yellow was deserved, second yellow was horrible game management from the ref. It was a borderline foul, certainly never a 13th minute 2nd yellow. Solignac was onside on his goal though.

The only way back from this is probably through the ref. Start going down like you've been shot on every tackle, look for penalties or free kicks outside the box...

[Vendetta]

Beitashour has been a dissapointed so far this season

[OgtheDim]

Not our season either.


Two posts after two goals scored against.

Nice record you got there.

[JavierMartini]

https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/716424847279017986

[MightyDM]

Not our season either. Aside from a few minutes of Geovinco brilliance, this team is utterly horrible to watch. Booting the ball by the defenders is something this team has embraced for a decade. Nothing happens in the midfield. No passing, no playmaking, no strategy. If the team does not improve its tactics, they will be out of the playoffs by August

Fuck off. They have played very well the first three games, and you didn't say a thing. You show up now when they are facing adversity? Give us a break

[DinamoTFC]

Bradley is utter garbage so far. More incomplete and dangerous passes than passes completed.

Altidore should be staring.

Vanney got this wrong. His pregame motivational speech must have been boring cause the boys are asleep.

I can't watch another shit game by tfc. Too much pain. It's so hard.

I hope this changes

[OgtheDim]

We are playing a high line without enough pressure on their mids.

[Ajax TFC]

Beitashour has been a dissapointed so far this season

Only if you expected him to be a star. He's a huge improvement over what we had there last season

[Dub Narcotic]

Cheyrou has to be smarter as well. Studs up challenges are being called very strongly this year and he should know about all of the reds being given out this year. Toronto's done alright since going down to ten I think. Nothing going forward, however.

[ag futbol]

Who was it saying in the other thread that the harsh refereeing would play in our favour? lol

I stand by my factually incorrect and completely wrong statement.

[Vendetta]

Lol Bradley has been braindead this game

[OgtheDim]

Hmm....that yellow for the Rapids was a dive by Johnson. Not happy with that.

[Ajax TFC]

Hmm....that yellow for the Rapids was a dive by Johnson. Not happy with that.

He got chopped in the gut by a flailing arm

[Hugh Jazz]

You have to play the ref as much as the game it seems.

[Oldtimer]

Not our season either. Aside from a few minutes of Geovinco brilliance, this team is utterly horrible to watch. Booting the ball by the defenders is something this team has embraced for a decade. Nothing happens in the midfield. No passing, no playmaking, no strategy. If the team does not improve its tactics, they will be out of the playoffs by August

Your trolling is ridiculous. You only post when the team is down, and actually they've been great to watch. The defense is much improved, and the goal tonight wasn't from open play.

[JavierMartini]

He got chopped in the gut by a flailing arm

Replaying the foul you can hear a distinct sound with the contact on the stream. Thought it was a dive to start. Though the sound was pretty loud and audible so... :iagree:

[ronzilla]

Soft red card but cheyrou should have fucking known better to go in with a yellow.

The goal was offside. This team needs to learn to play to the fucking whistle and stop being linesman.

[Oldtimer]

Colorado does a lot of long balls, defensive formation will continue to be important as TFC pushes for a goal. My bet is that they try for a point.

[notthesun]

I'm not a fan of the approach but Vanney should be telling the guys right now to embellish the hell out of every collision they can. If Elfath seems something he could call to even up the game he'll probably do it.

It's funny, the league is trying to crack down on the simulation with the suspensions and fines but it's only going to get worse if they keep letting these idiots call the game this way. You'd have to be stupid not to embellish every foul as much as you can, just look at how teams are being rewarded for it.

[General Woolfe]

First yellow was deserved, second yellow was horrible game management from the ref. It was a borderline foul, certainly never a 13th minute 2nd yellow. Solignac was onside on his goal though.

The only way back from this is probably through the ref. Start going down like you've been shot on every tackle, look for penalties or free kicks outside the box...

Surely he had to think it was deliberate to give a yellow, when it was clear as day it was accidental

[Bobo]

Even the Colorado announcers disagree with you. Being a contrarian for its own sake just looks stupid. He didn't throw his elbow, and the striker was half a yard offside. Get over the martyr complex; being gypped is being gypped.

Erm, well, Dasovic said it was sooo my announcer cancels out your announcer. Get over the persecutory delusion disorder.

If he "threw" his elbow, then it could be grounds for a straight red, but this obviously wasn't the case. Yellows are sometimes given when players lead with their arms. Players can help themselves by not putting officials in that position, regardless if the given decision is warranted or not.



Hopefully Vanney introduces Jozy and goes 3-4-1-1 at some point because they don't look like they have a goal in them right now, and fatigue hasn't even really set in yet.

[Auzzy]

Two posts after two goals scored against.

Nice record you got there.

I would just like to give a :thumbsup: to your post

Refereeing is garbage obviously. Let's see how many make-up calls TFC gets, and if they can take advantage.

I agree, I'm really unhappy with Bradley. Your team is down 1 player, your supposed to be the big man, you gotta step it up. Just one example, within the last 10 minutes of the half: Bradley screws up, can't control a short pass in midfield, coughs up the ball. Immediately it's a dangerous situation for Toronto, with lots of Colorado players in our half. A number of TFC players scramble back, except for the guy with the shiny dome: Bradley only takes a leisurely stroll back towards our goal.

[OgtheDim]

I'm not a fan of the approach but Vanney should be telling the guys right now to embellish the hell out of every collision they can. If Elfath seems something he could call to even up the game he'll probably do it.


.

That is exactly what is going to happen I think. I despise what these bad refs are making teams do. :taz:

[SirBobSaget]

Erm, well, Dasovic said it was sooo my announcer cancels out your announcer. Get over the persecutory delusion disorder.

If he "threw" his elbow, then it could be grounds for a straight red, but this obviously wasn't the case. Yellows are sometimes given when players lead with their arms. Players can help themselves by not putting officials in that position, regardless if the given decision is warranted or not.
Dasovic said it was harsh and didnt deserve a yellow but that cheyrou should have been more careful. Are you watching/listening to the same games as we are because your opinions are always the opposite of the rest if us.

[Auzzy]

Genius MLS & their refs will pick up on the embellishment, and will start randomly not calling some obvious brutal fouls.

[Hugh Jazz]

Whatever happened to Osorio's shooting ability? His rookie year was much better.

[Bobo]

Dasovic said it was harsh and didnt deserve a yellow but that cheyrou should have been more careful. Are you watching/listening to the same games as we are because your opinions are always the opposite of the rest if us.

If you can rewind live TV on your cable service, I'd recommend just going back to the HT analysis.

[Vendetta]

Bradley over chasing again. Leaves giant hole in midfield

[General Woolfe]

Remind me why were paying Altidore again?

He's being criminally underused by Vanney. We need to get him on and put him and Gio through the middle if we want to salvage anything here. Babouli's been anonymous tonight

[MightyDM]

Erm, well, Dasovic said it was sooo my announcer cancels out your announcer. Get over the persecutory delusion disorder.

If he "threw" his elbow, then it could be grounds for a straight red, but this obviously wasn't the case. Yellows are sometimes given when players lead with their arms. Players can help themselves by not putting officials in that position, regardless if the given decision is warranted or not.



Hopefully Vanney introduces Jozy and goes 3-4-1-1 at some point because they don't look like they have a goal in them right now, and fatigue hasn't even really set in yet.

It is impossible to jump in the air without using your arms. Cheyrou did nothing wrong whatsoever

[Hugh Jazz]

Giovinco working his magic...

[notthesun]

Get Giovinco back on corner kick duty please.

[jazzy]

It's all because of the horrible away uni's , esp the shorts .........I don't feel I'm even looking at my team . Unfortunately with refs like we have , the game is destroyed if only because now we almost have to drop on every contact . That is not what we pay for . The league leadership really doesn't get this . Vanney starting Lovitz was again , wishful thinking on his part . The players back from qualifiers aren't brain dead , but they are simply not ready to dominate this game . That is again the leagues fault , alas clueless . The team doesn't seem to listen to Vanney or he's simply not respected because why on earth can't we come out THINKING , calm , controlling the game with patient passes until our chances open up ? To many on our team simply don't respect a control game with , and patient effective passes . SIMPLY we' re bulls in a china shop game start . We hurt big time with wasted dollars and talent (Altidore) on the bench .....just someone to give and go with Geo and we're good , anyone ?

[Bobo]

Giovinco working his magic...

"You cannot leave Giovinco alone......even when you have to stand 10 yards away." Gold Nigel.

That turn into the box was nasty though. Credit to the CB cause I thought he was going to get undressed.

[MightyDM]

Babouli looks like he is running in sand. Not sure if it is a lack of pace, altitude, or fitness.

[General Woolfe]

At last! I dont know why we didnt start the big man (Altidore) tonight

[MightyDM]

L.O.L. When I typed "altitude" autocorrect made it " Altidore" and lo and behold there he was!

[MightyDM]

What are they doing with the marking on corners? Bradley's man was wide open.

[Auzzy]

At last! I dont know why we didnt start the big man (Altidore) tonight

Probably Altidore isn't that fit to run for a long time. Let Babouli do some running, Altidore can probably do more damage now that the Colorado defense isn't that fresh.

However this garbage in Toronto's defense is going to be the bigger problem.

[CBTFC]

Jozy Altitude

[Chevy]

On a brighter note, the Colorado commentators are fantastic.

[Vendetta]

Jozy altitude has been a joy to watch since coming on.

[Onyx]

are there more than 3000 people at this game?
Is colorado the next chivas and will go under and we can forget about another embarrassing franchise?

[MightyDM]

On the positive side, we aren't bad with ten men.

[Auzzy]

Fucking yellow card slide by Colorado, referee doesn't even call a foul.

[notthesun]

Pretty sure that close-up on Vanney showed him telling the team to switch to a 3-4-2 formation.

[Chevy]

Jozy altitude has been a joy to watch since coming on.

Altidore Attitude at Altitude.

[Vendetta]

Can't believe we are losing to Aston Villa lol

[OgtheDim]

This team is gassed.

[MightyDM]

Pretty sure that close-up on Vanney showed him telling the team to switch to a 3-4-2 formation.


Slow clap. Well played, Sir.

[notthesun]

Respect to Vanney for going for it here. 2nd half has been a lot better.

[CBTFC]

On the positive side, we aren't bad with ten men.

I've been saying this to the friend beside me, or maybe Colorado is that bad.

[MightyDM]

Altidore Attitude at Altitude.

"Clap , clap , clap"

[OgtheDim]

Morgan as left wing. Makes some sense. We've had no width.

[Hugh Jazz]

2nd time the ref gives Cronin the 'that's the last time' warning.

[Auzzy]

I can understand Toronto being tired, doing well with 10 men at altitude.

However there's no reason for their defending on corner kicks etc. to be so bad.

[MightyDM]

Morgan as left wing. Makes some sense. We've had no width.

i like Morgan on the wing. Nielsen did it once or twice too. I think it's his future if he can work at it.

[jloome]

I can understand Toronto being tired, doing well with 10 men at altitude.

However there's no reason for their defending on corner kicks etc. to be so bad.

We have just five fouls in the whole game, which is some sort of crazy record, and yet we're going to lose on bad calls. Unbelievable. MLS officiating is just... unbelievable.

[MightyDM]

Saw that too.

[JavierMartini]

altidore is just trying for the highlight reel flick, has failed 3 times now. please just settle it, turn and get something on net.

[MightyDM]

We have just five fouls in the whole game, which is some sort of crazy record, and yet we're going to lose on bad calls. Unbelievable. MLS officiating is just... unbelievable.
yup. If we lose, it's four points in four games poor refereeing has cost us. That's a point a game. Outrageous.

[Hugh Jazz]

Find our 2nd wind

[MightyDM]

I am really glad Ashtone Morgan is getting minutes. His joy when we made the playoffs last year was so genuine, a true Red.

[JavierMartini]

Can we offload bradley and altidore for cash. ty lol

[OgtheDim]

This



https://twitter.com/lauraarmy/status/716443780413427712





Rapids are crap.

[jazzy]

Shame , we came alive in 2nd half , but one never knows which way a foul(dive) will go .....bullshit no call on Gio ffs

[JavierMartini]

that should be a second yellow.

[Vendetta]

Lol allstars when you play on usmnt and beer league level when playing for tfc

[MartinUtd]

Pure shambles

[portu]

Both Cheyrou fouls were cardable imo, but that goal was offside as dasovic Pointed out

Overall I'm extremely happy with the performance today all things considered. Irwin was man of the match despite the fact that we lost and should find himself on the team of the week.

Edit: and oh refs have now taken 5 points from us just saying

[Auzzy]

Fucking bullshit by the ref.

Not bad for Toronto with 10 men at altitude.

[Dub Narcotic]

Well, Toronto kept fighting, the game was actually fun to watch in the second half. Ashtone Morgan is not an offensive sub, I would have got Chapman on there instead. A moral victory but points are needed in the next game.

[OgtheDim]

Lol allstars when you play on usmnt and beer league level when playing for tfc


Any positives?

None?

OK.

[PopePouri]

Fuck that game.

[JavierMartini]

the officiating in this league is absolute drivel. Week in and out. The quality of the play has gone up tenfold. The quality of the officiating is still trash. How the hell can we get pro to strike again. I miss the imported decent refs.

[General Woolfe]

Whilst it was always going to be difficult after going a man down so early, there was a real lack of inventiveness about our play tonight. Even during our best spell in the last 15-20 minutes we were reduced to hopeful punts into the box with no rhyme or reason. Teams have no doubt sussed out how dangerous Gio is and are crowding him on every play, but were not making use of the extra space this creates. No positives to take from tonight i'm afraid...

[JavierMartini]

Any positives?

None?

OK.

Not when jozy is only looking for fancy flicks on the end of balls and infront of the net. He needs to hold it up and get something on target.

[Yohan]

Whilst it was always going to be difficult after going a man down so early, there was a real lack of inventiveness about our play tonight. Even during our best spell in the last 15-20 minutes we were reduced to hopeful punts into the box with no rhyme or reason. Teams have no doubt sussed out how dangerous Gio is and are crowding him on every play, but were not making use of the extra space this creates. No positives to take from tonight i'm afraid...
I'll keep saying again. Giovinco needs to be partnered with a striker who can hold up and provide him the bit of space. 4-3-3 isn't giving him the space or the touches on the ball

[Oldtimer]

I was proud of my team's character as they continued to push on. Vanney's strategy was good, switching to 3 in the back in response to Colorado bunkering. * sigh* it was not to be this time.

[notthesun]

2nd half performance was good. Colorado are crap, but still, forcing a home team with a man advantage to bunker is something. It's just so god damn hard to create legitimate scoring chances in that scenario.

Also, I'm throwing this out there now just to try to mentally prepare myself in advance when the DisCo, with Cheyrou already suspended having received a red, suspends him an additional game because they think the original one was worth a red in the first place. Just you wait...

[reggie]

ok bez....go out and give ricketts 3 yrs at 400 k a year.and then cut him in june...im sick of this shit.

[portu]

Definetly noticed an improvement on Vanney's end this year

[OgtheDim]

Pure shambles


Nah, I remember shambles. It was last October in Montreal. Now THERE was a shambles.

This was just a shame. Cheyrou should know better then to give any MLS ref a chance to provide a second yellow. Colorado are poor - like TFC 2013 poor. We would have - but you can't play that game.

We had chances in the second half and didn't put them on net. The fight was great to see. As for the players


Irwin - spilled a couple but in the right place every time. He is saving us goals that Bendik would have lost

Moor - an uncharacteristically less then good game

Perquis - steady, did the job, passed well, survived the altitude

Beitashour - steady, not perfect, he's defensive first

Morrow - reminds me of early last season, I'm wondering if he's carrying something that just has his game off a little bit

Bradley - wasn't nailed to the back line after Cheyrou went out so we saw the make 2 good passes, make 1 bad pass Bradley, staid back a lot still

Johnson - loved it when he went after Cronin, hard as nails, glad he's on our side

Osorio - did OK, one bad miss but some decent moves, linked well

Babouli - after the red, wasn't really in the game, didn't adjust well, didn't get time on the ball

Lovitz - nothing good nothing bad - did show some width before the red

Seba - Colorado will claim they kept him off the score sheet and that is enough, but its a lot easier to do that when you are up a man

Alitdore - held up the ball well made himself a nuisance, made some mistakes (Seba makes them too people), he's not at pace yet - I want to see him run at NER next week

Morgan - left wing when Colorado had given that side up - useful sub

[Bobo]

The results have been a mixed bag thus far but I'm really liking the defensive unit that this team has become. If they can keep it up once we have our more attacking first XI available, I think we're going to start seeing the results coming with regularity.

[OgtheDim]

Not when jozy is only looking for fancy flicks on the end of balls and infront of the net. He needs to hold it up and get something on target.

Sorry, I just went back through his posts and its all complaints about Altidore and Bradley. That's what I meant. I agree on the flicks thing - Altidore needs to be more direct.

[General Woolfe]

I'll keep saying again. Giovinco needs to be partnered with a striker who can hold up and provide him the bit of space. 4-3-3 isn't giving him the space or the touches on the ball

I hear you. He's certainly not a lone central striker and he's wasted out wide. He's best playing just off Alitidore imo

[reggie]

yah vanney is doing great one win on the road since last june..playing better d..maybe,highest payroll in the league and we play not to lose.bullcrap..fire his ass.

[Auzzy]

yah vanney is doing great one win on the road since last june..playing better d..maybe,highest payroll in the league and we play not to lose.bullcrap..fire his ass.

LOLwut.

[jazzy]

Both Cheyrou fouls were cardable imo, but that goal was offside as dasovic Pointed out

Overall I'm extremely happy with the performance today all things considered. Irwin was man of the match despite the fact that we lost and should find himself on the team of the week.

Edit: and oh refs have now taken 5 points from us just saying

Cheyrou was really out of control , or trying too hard BUT in any league any quality ref on the second yellow , gives only a warning . No ref with any knowledge of flow or the game comes first, give two yellows with no warning on over aggressiveness in the first few minutes . It's his MO . It's two men playing hard . Ubfortunately any game this guy refs will now always be the same .

[stevep]

thats it no more watching away games, this league is garbage away from toronto
yankee stadium-matchbox
kc -poor referreeing
colorado-poor refereeing, playing way above sea level
new england- that garbage astroturf
montreal- htat garbage astroturf
portlaned- garbage astroturf, travel 3000miles to play a game


just win in dc united, they stink and you will be close to 1 point per away game which is what they were projected to get
away games are a total waste of time
just entertain me at the exhibition guys and i will be happy

could care less what happens in away games in this cheesy league

[SoccMan2]

Every point loss will affect this team in the end, I thought this was the game we were suppose to 3 easy points, what happened to that eh? Don't worry people we have all these home games eventuallyl when we get home we will win win all of our home games lol, Ya right lol. But hey will have a nice CFL stadium ready for the Argos when they get back in early May lol ,go TFC lol.

[MightyDM]

Both Cheyrou fouls were cardable imo, but that goal was offside as dasovic Pointed out

Overall I'm extremely happy with the performance today all things considered. Irwin was man of the match despite the fact that we lost and should find himself on the team of the week.

Edit: and oh refs have now taken 5 points from us just saying

Agreed, but virtually every foul is "Cardable" Cronin should have seen red on that basis. The first Cheyrou one was an unintentional stomp, ok yellow but not necessary, the second, yes if all raised arms, pull backs, all studs up, all dissent, all standing in front of the ball on free kicks, etc etc etc are yellow. But they aren't called that way, not just in MLS. Watch Andy Carroll, every time he jumps for a header his arms are up.

so I am with you. Refs have cost us but I think it's FOUR points. Missed the hand ball so tie not win v NYCFC, Toledo misses the clear foul so lose not tie - that's three points, plus today.

[reggie]

LOLwut.
tired of all the excuses for this club.they are a 500 club at best this year..they would of been in last place last year if not for GIO,if you would of told me at the end of last season that lovitz and mo would be our starting wingers i would of had a crap.no balance on this team.

[MightyDM]

Cheyrou was really out of control , or trying too hard BUT in any league any quality ref on the second yellow , gives only a warning . No ref with any knowledge of flow or the game comes first, give two yellows with no warning on over aggressiveness in the first few minutes . It's his MO . It's two men playing hard . Ubfortunately any game this guy refs will now always be the same .

cannot agree with that. The first one was a screw up and the second one is never a foul, let alone a yellow.

[ronzilla]

This loss is all on vanney. Its a fucking waste to start Lovitz up topp. Notice how they played better in the 2nd half ? Thats because the red card forced them into a better formation.

[MightyDM]

Laba just got red carded on a BS call too. Referees are deciding this league. Very poor.

Devos is going ballistic. More reds to come I figure.

[stegosaurus]

tired of all the excuses for this club.they are a 500 club at best this year..they would of been in last place last year if not for GIO,if you would of told me at the end of last season that lovitz and mo would be our starting wingers i would of had a crap.no balance on this team.

NYCFC, SKC and now Colorado were all ref-gifted.

[portu]

Agreed, but virtually every foul is "Cardable" Cronin should have seen red on that basis. The first Cheyrou one was an unintentional stomp, ok yellow but not necessary, the second, yes if all raised arms, pull backs, all studs up, all dissent, all standing in front of the ball on free kicks, etc etc etc are yellow. But they aren't called that way, not just in MLS. Watch Andy Carroll, every time he jumps for a header his arms are up.

so I am with you. Refs have cost us but I think it's FOUR points. Missed the hand ball so tie not win v NYCFC, Toledo misses the clear foul so lose not tie - that's three points, plus today.

True I got my calculations wrong it is 4 points

[General Woolfe]

Just noticed in the Vancouver game, Laba was given a straight red for a rather innocuous (https://www.google.ca/search?q=innocuous&spell=1&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjB3PrtufHLAhVCVxoKHei2DpQQvwUIGSgA) challenge. Seems to me that officiating in MLS has gotten worse this season (if such a thing is possible) with refs overreacting to plays that are very much part of the game. Unless something is done here we are fast approaching the point where soccer becomes a non contact sport and any form of tackling at all is outlawed. I think refs are feeling pressure because so many decisions have been second guessed publicly in the media after the fact by their supervisors and are now erring on the side of punishment lest they be disciplined themselves for failing to act

[noimpactinmtl]

Placing an emphasis on calling studs up tackling at the expense of common sense points to MLS as an organization.

[notthesun]

Vanney post-game, tweeted by Larson:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CfFgE5ZUYAESYBM.jpg:large

Cheyrou's second yellow reminds me of the 2nd yellow Morgan got, if anyone remembers, away to Philadelphia 3 years ago. I remember it because it was one of the craziest reds I'd ever seen. He went up for a header against another player, they both came down, the most routine looking play ever and the Philly guy holds his face and Morgan gets sent off. For winning a header. Basically the same thing today. Both guys go for the ball, nothing out of line occurs, their guy goes down and the ref gets conned.

edit: Found video of that Morgan card: https://youtu.be/Yz70jbzBEEU?t=283

[OgtheDim]

Laba just got red carded on a BS call too. Referees are deciding this league. Very poor.

Devos is going ballistic. More reds to come I figure.

Of course he's going ballistic.

The red is to one of his favourite players. :)

[Dub Narcotic]

tired of all the excuses for this club.they are a 500 club at best this year..they would of been in last place last year if not for GIO,if you would of told me at the end of last season that lovitz and mo would be our starting wingers i would of had a crap.no balance on this team.

I agree with this, the winger rotation right now is not great, unless you think Babouli or Chapman are going to become impact players in a hurry. No one besides Gio or Altidore ever seem like threats to score.

[OgtheDim]

I agree with this, the winger rotation right now is not great, unless you think Babouli or Chapman are going to become impact players in a hurry. No one besides Gio or Altidore ever seem like threats to score.

Chapman has played about 20 minutes but in this league, you need to develop youth or you won't succeed long term - and youth can't get better if they don't play. Every team but TFC before this season brings in youth along with veterans. We are just not used to it.

[ronzilla]

The referee knew he screwed up with the red although he showered tfc in the 2nd half with gifted calls. Too bad they couldn't take advantage.

I would really like to know why Perquis was subbed off.

[notthesun]

The referee knew he screwed up with the red although he showered tfc in the 2nd half with gifted calls. Too bad they couldn't take advantage.

I would really like to know why Perquis was subbed off.

We switched to a 3-4-2, had to sacrifice a CB to get another player on up the pitch.

[MightyDM]

The referee knew he screwed up with the red although he showered tfc in the 2nd half with gifted calls. Too bad they couldn't take advantage.

I would really like to know why Perquis was subbed off.

he was on a yellow, in addition to the tactical change. One frenchman being sent off was enough. Too much actually.

[OgtheDim]

My biggest problem with the red card regime that seems to have been insituted is that it makes for crappy soccer.

I go and watch games because I enjoy the cut and thrust of two teams trying to beat each other.

I am not interested in the mishmash that happens when one team suddenly has to adapt to having more space and the other team has to adapt to having less players. It is almost never good football.


I get the laws of the game have to be maintained and that red cards and second yellows will happen. I am deeply troubled though by a league that has gotten to the point where a red is expected. The players are not playing significantly differently. The refs have made an adjustment that these players are finding difficult to adjust too.

I do not want to talk about refs after games. And, if this continues into the summer, the league will become a joke and fans will leave.

[notthesun]

I get the laws of the game have to be maintained and that red cards and second yellows will happen. I am deeply troubled though by a league that has gotten to the point where a red is expected. The players are not playing significantly differently. The refs have made an adjustment that these players are finding difficult to adjust too.

I do not want to talk about refs after games. And, if this continues into the summer, the league will become a joke and fans will leave.

What bugs me is there's zero indication that PRO or MLS have informed clubs of this new standard of refereeing. I think it's garbage, but if this is how they're going to ref the game, why are all these cards coming as a surprise to every manager and player? When the NHL cracked down on clutching and grabbing after the lockout, there was no surprise, everyone was made aware of the changes. You'd think someone would have informed the teams of a fundamental shift in how tackles are going to be judged.

[jloome]

What bugs me is there's zero indication that PRO or MLS have informed clubs of this new standard of refereeing. I think it's garbage, but if this is how they're going to ref the game, why are all these cards coming as a surprise to every manager and player? When the NHL cracked down on clutching and grabbing after the lockout, there was no surprise, everyone was made aware of the changes. You'd think someone would have informed the teams of a fundamental shift in how tackles are going to be judged.

14 red cards through 34 games so far, or something like that. It's ridiculous.

[ronzilla]

he was on a yellow, in addition to the tactical change. One frenchmanbeing sent off was enough. Too much actually.

It would have made more sense to sub off Morrow. Perquis was having a great game whereas Morrow was doing very little.

[stegosaurus]

It would have made more sense to sub off Morrow. Perquis was having a great game whereas Morrow was doing very little.

Could have been because of when he went down due to the head collision.

[MightyDM]

It would have made more sense to sub off Morrow. Perquis was having a great game whereas Morrow was doing very little.
Agreed that Morrow was not doing much, in fact he has had a poor season so far. But Perquis was on a yellow, the refereeing is unpredictable to say the least, and he has a history of a temper. Plus in going to three at the back in a situation where you neede a goal normally you would keep the outside defenders. Can't really criticise Vanney for this one.

[Vendetta]

I think vanney did fine today. The lovitz start maybe can be questioned cause he has yet to show any consistency in his crosses but other than that, some good subs and tactical changes. Just a shame about the red ruining the game

[Yohan]

What bugs me is there's zero indication that PRO or MLS have informed clubs of this new standard of refereeing. I think it's garbage, but if this is how they're going to ref the game, why are all these cards coming as a surprise to every manager and player? When the NHL cracked down on clutching and grabbing after the lockout, there was no surprise, everyone was made aware of the changes. You'd think someone would have informed the teams of a fundamental shift in how tackles are going to be judged.
the teams were told at the beginning of the season

[notthesun]

Will Johnson coming in hot

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716472073841823744

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716478851187023872

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716483330498113536

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716484425735806976

[Hamilton_Red]

I agree that the number of reds seems to be having a negative effect on the quality of the matches. It's not clear to me that the refs are the problem though. Tonight - both of Cheroux's fouls were bookable.. and Laba's for Vanc was a studs up tack that could have easily been an ankle breaker. It's frustrating to watch - but it would be worse to see a pile of injuries take place.

Overall - I think TFC have the strongest team that they have ever put together. We are lacking depth in the striking positions and wingers - but that is about the only complaints from me.

[ryan]

tired of all the excuses for this club.they are a 500 club at best this year..they would of been in last place last year if not for GIO,if you would of told me at the end of last season that lovitz and mo would be our starting wingers i would of had a crap.no balance on this team.

4 games in and not even the home opener.

Calm down

[Yohan]

I agree that the number of reds seems to be having a negative effect on the quality of the matches. It's not clear to me that the refs are the problem though. Tonight - both of Cheroux's fouls were bookable.. and Laba's for Vanc was a studs up tack that could have easily been an ankle breaker. It's frustrating to watch - but it would be worse to see a pile of injuries take place.

Best defenders rarely have to use desperate slide tackle to win the ball. They rely on footy IQ. Positioning. Anticipation. Reading of the game.

MLS defenders have gotten away with athleticism, IE slide tackling, to make up for their short falls otherwise. And the refs for the long time has let them get away with some gruesome tackles that has caused some serious injuries.

Now PRO is trying to put a stop to these tackles. Hence so many reds right now. Either the players wise up and stop it with the studs up challenges, or keep getting ejected from the game. If the players can't figure out that any lunging tackles with any hint of studs up is going to get you a red card, then they aren't very smart.

[OgtheDim]

Now PRO is trying to put a stop to these tackles. Hence so many reds right now. Either the players wise up and stop it with the studs up challenges, or keep getting ejected from the game. If the players can't figure out that any lunging tackles with any hint of studs up is going to get you a red card, then they aren't very smart.

I see tackles like that around the world called as fouls but not cards. I think Johnson has it right. Players are not being injured by these tackles. This is not excessive force.

Players in all leagues with any amount of speed lunge into tackles with a hint of studs up. This league decided this year to give cards for those infractions by labelling them excessive force. The interpretation of the rule is based on the words "excessive force", not lunging.


The other issue here is we have now seen at least 2 instances where refs have changed their minds from a foul to a yellow or a yellow to a straight red based on interactions with players and coaches.

And, I think this tweet applies as well

https://twitter.com/findingtoronto/status/716572265199050752

[ensco]

I only saw the highlights of this game, but looking at those tweets, our players have to stop fixating on the refs.

I did watch the Clasico yesterday, and Real Madrid won the game down a man, having just been royally screwed on a call that denied them an obvious goal. That call was worse than anything done to anyone in MLS yesterday.

You have to just keep going.

[MightyDM]

I only saw the highlights of this game, but looking at those tweets, our players have to stop fixating on the refs.

I did watch the Clasico yesterday, and Real Madrid won the game down a man, having just been royally screwed on a call that denied them an obvious goal. That call was worse than anything done to anyone in MLS yesterday.

You have to just keep going.

To be fair to the team, they did just get on with it and were on the front foot for much of the game. There other criticisms: back four was a bit static, Morrow was poor, Bradley looked a bit off the pace - but the team didn't hang around and sulk, they got on with it and played. A US based reporter commented on Twitter how odd it was to see Colorado delaying the game when they were up a man. That must mean we were doing something right.

[ensco]

^In that case, I withdraw the comment. That is what you want to see.

The reffing is the only thing being discussed postgame, that is for sure!

[MightyDM]

As for the refereeing, Cheyrous second yellow isn't even a foul, although they sometimes get given. Happens all the time as its a natural motion to have you arms out when you jump up. In the case of Laba, if that is a card, let alone a red, then really the rule is no slide tackles. He pulled up, his foot was on the ground, not several inches above it ( which is the true ankle breaker) and the two of them arrived at the same time contesting a fifty fifty ball. Plus the LA guy faked injury.

[MightyDM]

^In that case, I withdraw the comment. That is what you want to see.

The reffing is the only thing being discussed postgame, that is for sure!

yet again....

some of us stayed up and watched Vancouver and Labas sending off added fuel to an already hot fire

[stevep]

4 games in and not even the home opener.

Calm down

so far:
mls east division 24 away games played 23 points gotten from away team 1ppg average
mls west division 17 away games played 16 points gotten from away team 1 ppg average

tfc 4 away games 4 points they're doing as expected, nothing to panic about
they actually could have more points if not for refereeing

basically it works out to this: if you are a slightly above average team you will average 1 point every away game and 2 points every home game

[MightyDM]

so far:
mls east division 24 away games played 23 points gotten from away team 1ppg average
mls west division 17 away games played 16 points gotten from away team 1 ppg average

tfc 4 away games 4 points they're doing as expected, nothing to panic about
they actually could have more points if not for refereeing

basically it works out to this: if you are a slightly above average team you will average 1 point every away game and 2 points every home game

And if you add the point a game the referees have cost us.......

[Prof]

On a positive note, Will Johnson ran his ass off. Very impressive considering it was his 3rd game this week and 2nd at high altitude.

[Hugh Jazz]

In the case of Laba, if that is a card, let alone a red, then really the rule is no slide tackles. He pulled up, his foot was on the ground, not several inches above it ( which is the true ankle breaker) and the two of them arrived at the same time contesting a fifty fifty ball. Plus the LA guy faked injury.

This is why I don't like the direction the officiating is going in. On the Laba play, he had the ball and it slipped away from him on the dribble so he went down almost as if to clear it. It wasn't like he was even going in for a tackle. Last season and in most other leagues this wouldn't warrant a card at all. Meanwhile both LA CBs picked up yellows for cheap 'professional' fouls in the same half as the red that were not contested whatsoever and they'll continue all season.

[Yohan]

I see tackles like that around the world called as fouls but not cards. I think Johnson has it right. Players are not being injured by these tackles. This is not excessive force.

Players in all leagues with any amount of speed lunge into tackles with a hint of studs up. This league decided this year to give cards for those infractions by labelling them excessive force. The interpretation of the rule is based on the words "excessive force", not lunging.


The other issue here is we have now seen at least 2 instances where refs have changed their minds from a foul to a yellow or a yellow to a straight red based on interactions with players and coaches.

And, I think this tweet applies as well

https://twitter.com/findingtoronto/status/716572265199050752
so it's an excessive force tackle only if a player gets injured? just because a player didn't get injured, it doesn't mean it wasn't an excessive force tackle. only takes one bad tackle like Brian Mullan on Steve Zakuani to end a career

[MightyDM]

so it's an excessive force tackle only if a player gets injured? just because a player didn't get injured, it doesn't mean it wasn't an excessive force tackle. only takes one bad tackle like Brian Mullan on Steve Zakuani to end a career

no one has said that at all. What people have said were things like, Laba's tackle was not a foul, certainly not a red card because his foot was on the ground, it was a fifty fifty ball, and he started to pull out of it when he saw that the collision was about to happen. The fact that the LA player faked an injury to fool the referee supports the point that it wasn't a foul. Conversley, if he was hurt, it doesn't mean it was a foul.

[ag futbol]

I agree with this, the winger rotation right now is not great, unless you think Babouli or Chapman are going to become impact players in a hurry. No one besides Gio or Altidore ever seem like threats to score.
I'm not quite as dooms day as Reggie but there's an element of this I agree with. Lovitz as a starter in this league is a joke - we have to get better players than that if this 4-3-3 is going to work.

Someone else needs to threaten goal besides giovinco and Altidore for the portion of games he'll be around for.

[ag futbol]

I feel like I post this every 2-3 weeks but whatever...

As much as the officials aren't great MLS is compounding its own problems by skimping on salaries and training. It is a system that's designed to fail.

I don't have a problem with tightening the game up, but it needs to be cleanly administered, something they are not able to execute with the capabilities and resources of the current crop of officials.

[reggie]

Dont worry AG ,im sure we will sign Ricketts and our winger probs will be fine.not:facepalm:

[notthesun]

Watched Leicester vs. Southampton and Man U vs. Everton this morning. Saw about 6 or 7 MLS red card tackles in all between the two games. No players sent off, no players injured, everyone goes home talking about the game instead of the ref. Imagine that.

[Red4ever]

I cant care about this team yet.


It feels like the season hasnt started.

Road games are soooooo boring.

[OgtheDim]

I feel like I post this every 2-3 weeks but whatever...

As much as the officials aren't great MLS is compounding its own problems by skimping on salaries and training. It is a system that's designed to fail.

I don't have a problem with tightening the game up, but it needs to be cleanly administered, something they are not able to execute with the capabilities and resources of the current crop of officials.


Agreed.

Too many of the head office think officials should be like in the NFL - oil executives and stock brokers and orthodontists who do reffing as side fun thing. IIRC, in the last official negotiations they wanted to cut the travel allowance for the AR's so they would have only covered games, not meetings.

[notthesun]

Johnson put out more tweets, just posting a few:

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716522879018340353

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716526648972017664

https://twitter.com/WillJohnson04/status/716527846949138432

I'll retract my previous statement about teams not being informed. I guess nobody expected the refs to really go full nuclear mode on this. It's dumb to have an objective "contact with studs is a red" rule since it's easy to catch someone with your studs without the tackle actually being anywhere near endangering their safety. Your studs are going to be exposed to a certain degree with every tackle - not like players are going to start dragging their feet across the grass to make challenges - there needs to be room for incidental and safe contact. The Felipe red especially illustrates this - there was absolutely no force in that tackle and in no way was it dangerous, at all. But because he made slight contact with his studs, it's a red.

With this in mind, Cheyrou's 2nd yellow was obviously Elfath correcting his "mistake" earlier. He realized Cheyrou caught the defender with his studs, and knew he was supposed to have sent him off for it.

[ronzilla]

This is the same conversation as last season when the reds got screwed 2-3 games on the road.

[cdnorman]

Johnson's posts are enormously helpful, but horrid for us fans. It's showing that the refs are following the rules, their rules, and that we're not really on point to complain about their use of cards given that they are following them. What we should be complaining - livid about - is that this type of rule exists in the form it does in the first place. Johnson's reaction that it's ruining the game is spot on. Here's a player -- one who is at risk of getting on the receiving end of a stud -- complaining about the rule that is designed to protect him. It says something. The game has to account for safety, but how many serious injuries have taken place because of a studs-related tackle or contact that couldn't be covered by the former rules? I can't think of any.

[OgtheDim]

Larson also made the point that when you count the retroactive discipline by the DISCO, 54% of the games have ended up with a player red carded or suspended.

That's not a good way to run a league.