Let's Talk (as TFC fans and sports fans and soccer fans in particular)

[Still Kicking]

I have lived a life where the mental health issues of others (and my own struggles) have had an incredible impact. The Bell Let's Talk day honestly makes me feel uncomfortable, my feeling is that it is too much on the pr side and not enough on the understanding issues side. But forgive me, I might have earned some doubts in this area along the way.
The TFC website has an article - written by Devang Desai- I have no wish to quarrel with the article - glad he shed some light on the topic. I did respond to his article and share my comments here to see what the RPB folks have to say
1st comment on TFC article
Easily too big a topic to fully address in this format - kudos for at least having an article about it. I would say that two levels exist in this realm - mental health and mental disease. I think that we derive some comfort when talking about mental health, that with support, with medication, with awareness and concern that folks with mental health issues may be helped. However, as we learn more about CTE, which is what I mean when I use the term above mental disease, we might be dealing with people who are unable to act in their best interest and may be physically beyond help On a day where we are finding that NFL player Tyler Sash, who died last fall at age 27, has been found to have had CTE - I think that questions need to be asked and sports fans can't just ignore this aspect of the games we watch others play. A few spring to mind - when a Toronto FC player gets cut from the team what support do they continue to get from TFC? Recent example -Ahmed Kantari. I hope the TFC fans who were commenting online about good riddance and hooray to the news of his departure are reflecting today and making triple donations to Bell's Let Talk - because he is just one of hundreds of athletes that pro sports discards. We as fans can ask for better support of all players...long term heroes and short term faces, too easily forgotten.

2nd comment
Other questions spring to mind - what is MLS and TFC doing concerning head to head collisions in their sport. Who reviews the MLS concussion protocol? Pro athletes have issues with pressure and fame, job security and sometimes wealth - but soccer seems to have head to head collision issues. Never seems to be discussed or at least not enough. On Let's Talk day - concern about concussions and possible link to CTE should be a soccer discussion.

[C.Ronaldo]

Sometimes corporations have good intentions, but i agree that I wouldnt mind seeing less BELL ads and more just "lets talk"

When I gave wife's CPR after she had a card arrest infront of me and our 2 week old I thought i would be mentally broken forever. And i didnt even know I had an issue until a few days later; I drove 2 Kms from the hospital (and her) and my heart pounded through my chest, like my panic attacks had its own GPS. Every beep/ring would send me to tears. Every sound of drop would have me almost pass out.

I receicved counceling, learned techniques and now Im almost back to myself . (as much as someone gets after something like that)

But I'll never forget how many people told me that its really brave of me to seak help and talk about it openly. To me i figured everyone would get help, no diferent then breaking a leg and going to ER, but apparenltly thats not what everyone would do.

Too many people still see mental issues as a weakness.

We need events like Lets Talk day to get the message out. Step 1 is let's talk

[flamehawk]

Chiming in as a transitional youth mental health social worker ...

I think "Still Kicking" makes a very important point to ask what is being done for TFC players. It's very easy for companies to do PR campaigns and to speak to these issues without substantively addressing causes of emotional distress of which they might be participants in.


I am also very skeptical of Bell's intentions. It's important that as a society, we become more open to discussions of emotional well being, way beyond a 'psychiatric' 'diagnoses' lens (which has interestingly been found to be unhelpful at times in terms of recovery). In terms of the people I work with in my line of work, these youth are resilient having gone through so many challenges and obstacles - poverty, homelessness, unemployment. Unfortunately, society does very little to facilitate recovery - that they survive is in spite of this. While I won't suggest that hospitals are being properly funded, it is much worst in the community - where people dealing with mental health issues spend most of their time. There is barely any funding for psychotherapy (non-walk-in has over six months wait list), community case management (my area) suffers from crippling case loads (and also 1 year wait list), homelessness - one of the most significant stressors in mental health - is a major issue with waitlists in Toronto reaching 7 years for those with specific mental health diagnoses.

What I find most interesting is that recovery rates from many developing countries with less 'advanced' mental health systems seem to be so much higher. While some have suggested it may be related to the lack of psychiatrists to provide diagnoses, the focus on 'recovery rates' (this does not mean that symptoms go away, but that people have developed coping skills and are having a quality of life they find acceptable) seems to show there is more to this story. I do think there needs to be a rethink in the direction of our society if we are to substantively address the issue of mental health in Canada ... one more focused on addressing poverty, building strong community ties and fighting isolation. Another interesting model if people are interested is the mental health system in Lapland, Finland (where psychiatrists, social workers, and nurses have moved away from a strictly clinical model and achieved great results).

[C.Ronaldo]

Chiming in as a transitional youth mental health social worker ...

I think "Still Kicking" makes a very important point to ask what is being done for TFC players. It's very easy for companies to do PR campaigns and to speak to these issues without substantively addressing causes of emotional distress of which they might be participants in.


I am also very skeptical of Bell's intentions. It's important that as a society, we become more open to discussions of emotional well being, way beyond a 'psychiatric' 'diagnoses' lens (which has interestingly been found to be unhelpful at times in terms of recovery). In terms of the people I work with in my line of work, these youth are resilient having gone through so many challenges and obstacles - poverty, homelessness, unemployment. Unfortunately, society does very little to facilitate recovery - that they survive is in spite of this. While I won't suggest that hospitals are being properly funded, it is much worst in the community - where people dealing with mental health issues spend most of their time. There is barely any funding for psychotherapy (non-walk-in has over six months wait list), community case management (my area) suffers from crippling case loads (and also 1 year wait list), homelessness - one of the most significant stressors in mental health - is a major issue with waitlists in Toronto reaching 7 years for those with specific mental health diagnoses.

What I find most interesting is that recovery rates from many developing countries with less 'advanced' mental health systems seem to be so much higher. While some have suggested it may be related to the lack of psychiatrists to provide diagnoses, the focus on 'recovery rates' (this does not mean that symptoms go away, but that people have developed coping skills and are having a quality of life they find acceptable) seems to show there is more to this story. I do think there needs to be a rethink in the direction of our society if we are to substantively address the issue of mental health in Canada ... one more focused on addressing poverty, building strong community ties and fighting isolation. Another interesting model if people are interested is the mental health system in Lapland, Finland (where psychiatrists, social workers, and nurses have moved away from a strictly clinical model and achieved great results).

i.e mass shootings in the US

[Fort York Redcoat]

The Bell Let's Talk day honestly makes me feel uncomfortable, my feeling is that it is too much on the pr side and not enough on the understanding issues side. But forgive me, I might have earned some doubts in this area along the way.


Sometimes corporations have good intentions, but i agree that I wouldnt mind seeing less BELL ads and more just "lets talk"

We need events like Lets Talk day to get the message out. Step 1 is let's talk


It's very easy for companies to do PR campaigns and to speak to these issues without substantively addressing causes of emotional distress of which they might be participants in.

I am also very skeptical of Bell's intentions.

And yet without Bell we wouldn't have been talking about it.

I'm happy to see @C.Ronaldo (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=1479) give a balanced review of it.

I'm all for improving the way we take on the issue of mental health but what other campaigns are we holding this up to that have had comparable reach?

@flamehawk (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=1342) provides professional info on the subject but leaves nothing to say how this campaign could be improved but for his skepticism. Care to expand on that?

@Still Kicking (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=6143) It took me 5 clicks in 10 seconds to get to CMHA site to investigate further about mental health typing Let's Talk into google search. And that was to find more info than the many facts concerning mental health found on the Bell site.

I know everyone is and should be wary and think critical of corporate manipulation but I think it incredibly important to acknowledge the widespread exposure to opening discussion this is creating.

[bimmer]

Criticisms of Bell's intentions or methods are not without validity, but I am pretty sick and tired of seeing my fb feed swamped today with cynical keyboard activist types (mostly fellow students) who lambaste "letstalk" but do absolutely nothing themselves, whether it's raising awareness or contributing financially. At the end of the day, is Bell benefiting from this campaign as well? Of course they are, they likely wouldn't do it otherwise. Frankly though, if a person can't see past that and realize that the campaign does actually do the world some good, I really feel sorry for them because that's a level of cynicism and negativity that I can't fathom having. At the VERY LEAST letstalk raises a LOT of money for some critical institutions and is opening up many discussions about mental illness, whether positive or negative, including this one, as Fort York rightly pointed out.

Much kudos to the people here and elsewhere who live with mental illness or contribute to mental health awareness/aid day in and day out though.

[flamehawk]

@flamehawk provides professional info on the subject but leaves nothing to say how this campaign could be improved but for his skepticism. Care to expand on that?




I know everyone is and should be wary and think critical of corporate manipulation but I think it incredibly important to acknowledge the widespread exposure to opening discussion this is creating.


I guess my point was pretty muddled with my post. My main point was that these awareness campaigns can be helpful in terms of encouraging discussion; however, we need to be critical of what conversations emerge. I have provided workshops at schools and with other social service sectors (such as settlement workers) as a part of my job and also observed many done in various settings, but there seems to be an emphasis on presenting various diagnostic categories and suggesting people refer to psychiatric care. It would not be fair to make a blanket statement that this is unhelpful, but I do think there needs to be more of a push for people to feel confident in connecting with one another. It can add to the 'stigma' when people are encouraged simply to categorize. In one of the Bell ads, a character mentions how someone has been off for a month because of "Bipolar Disorder". Another worker dismisses this, thinking it was 'fake'. The first character assures the worker that he had looked it up and that it was a 'real diagnosis'. This may seem like semantics or being overly critical, but I do feel a trend towards an emphasis on 'professional help' versus understanding as a responsibility of all. Any mental health professional will admit that our actual roles are quite limited in the lives of those dealing with emotional toil, and that friends and family are far more important. I can see how some may say Bell encourages this, but seen in the context of other awareness campaigns, I am not sure it achieves this.


The other point is whether the campaign help substantively. This critique, just as the previous one, is not directed specifically at Bell but at our society, our governments etc. There is a money component to Bell's campaign, which is good (though would have been even better if Bell would just give the money and not insist on attaching names etc. .. though that wouldn't make sense for them), but what we have seen is cutbacks in government funding and a reliance on grant-based funding. This funding is almost never sustainable and has led to contract-based work, programs being set up one year and cut another etc. The Healthcare system needs to be properly funded - and these one off donations (even if done annually) are not the answer. This money also doesn't address the fact that the main stressors for mental health go far beyond the healthcare system - housing, policing, welfare etc. It's hypocritical when politicians piggy back on these campaigns while at the same time exacerbate the problem with their policies.


Lastly, the focus on stigma can also be limiting, as it focuses on 'internal reactions' versus discrimination. Yes, it's important that people feel comfortable to be open about their struggles, but are companies like Bell responsive and accomadating to these issues. Can someone take time off in the same way someone whom has fallen physical ill could. Is worklife balance encouraged? Are workers being paid a living wage so they are constantly stressed about their living situation? Just today, this article came out: http://canadalandshow.com/article/lets-talk-about-how-my-job-bell-gave-me-mental-health-issues-and-no-benefits criticizing Bell for its own mental health practices.


For me, it's frustrating on the frontlines as the situation is getting worst year by year. All those waitlists I mentioned have increased for one. We spend more time shuffling papers and sending referrals to non-existant services, than actually sitting down and providing counselling. The system is so very broken and yet every year, Bell and others can pat their backs and take in the praise. Some might say I am being unfair, since "at least Bell is doing something", but given the major standing of companies like Bell in society, we need to have higher standards.

[Kaz]

So I'm basically re-purposing the post I make on my social media for this thread. What Bell does is start, even if it is only a conversation but it isn't enough. My own story with mental health issues could have had a very dark outcome, most people in my situation would likely not have had the success I had (though I am still struggling). Donating to initiatives yourself is more effective as it can prevent suicides, homelessness, and substance abuse. It can save lives much faster than any thing else.


I have dealt with Social Anxiety Issues most of my life. That means I don't like going to Bars, public spaces, social events, and talking to Women (or anyone socially really).. Raj on the Big Bang Theory has better luck than I did. I can remember standing beside a girl texting her at 23 because I couldn't get words to come out of my mouth. Going to a TFC game involves making sure I arrive so I'm through the gate nearly first, I get simple food, I go to my seat and I don't leave my seat until the game is over, I don't leave right away and I do all I can to avoid crowds. Sometimes meaning I'll walk back to union or wait for an hour or more for the Go trains to get less busy. I haven't been able to go through the Go Tunnel since 2009. Of course this is only when I'm healthy enough to go, I only get to one or two games a season. The next week after I don't have the ability to deal with much of anything.


As time went on this became worse as people reinforced the triggers of my Anxiety. Eventually my Social Anxiety became General Anxiety, the General Anxiety developed Panic Attacks and by the time I was in my late 20s I wasn't functioning really well for months on end. By my 30s it had developed into full Agoraphobia.


I tried to get help many times, through the Mental Health Association to start because it seemed logical. The wait time to get therapy was basically infinity. Almost a year went by with nothing really, finally took myself off the waiting list because I was seeming to get better and I had moved hours away to North Bay.I had a another breakdown little more than a year later and again tried to get help.. I couldn't. There was none.. this time not even the Mental Health Association really had any support.. (why they exist in North Bay I don't know) Tried to see a Therapist.. but he was rude and wholly unhelpful.


When things got really bad in 2011 I once again turned to the Mental Health Association Waiting List. I also used work Insurance and discovered that the Peel Region had it's own system in place I even tried my family Doctor. The insurance company spent more time trying to prove I was faking it rather than providing support, my doctor repeatedly asked me to come to his Church, and the therapist I started seeing thought the root of my problem was I wanted to have sex with my male friend... (he's a chud I don't know what his wife sees in him omg he is ugly.. almost more than me (that and I'm straight)) Thankfully the Peel Regional system got me to see a mental health Nurse who tried a therapy that provided the first real improvement. It was only 4 sessions of a therapy program that would take anywhere between 10-20 sessions. A few months ago the Insurance Company finally stepped in and offered help. Set me up with a therapist who could build on the work peel region did (3 years after the fact) and may help get me healthy.

My journey was to look for help 4 times, take 4 different medications 2 of which made me much worse, went through 7 therapist, had a doctor try to convert me to his religion, and an insurance company that scared my employer so much that the word nervous or anxious was taken to mean violent or crazy. Making them scared to have me in the building. Needless to say having your employer think you are a violent psychopath because you have anxiety isn't really great for your anxiety. Had I got the support I had in the past 4 months I would have controlled my anxiety in 2007 been much more functional for the last 8 years. Had I received it in 2011/2012 I would have likely been successful in my return to work the first time, and avoid later attacks. Had the Insurance Company behaved responsibly other issues wouldn't have occurred at all.

The Talking is good.. but more needs to be done... donate if you can to initiatives in your area. Peel Region can only offer 4 sessions of therapy due to funding. So donating to programs that offer proper therapy to those that medications don't help. That alone is a big big step. Also talking with your MPs and MPP/MLA to help fix the insurance companies so that they do more than just deny deny deny. The Insurance Company Approved my claim in January of 2012, and then denied it in March 2012, and it look nearly 8 appeals and a really bad night before they finally approved it permanently in June of 2014.


So Talk is good, action is better. I'm a lucky case, if not for my family being there to help and support me during two years with no income while the insurance company tried their damnedest to twist everything there were give to try to say I wasn't sick... I could have ended up hospitalized, homeless or much much worse.

I truly think that the reason recovery rates are so low is Insurance Companies only care about Medication Treatments and Therapy Treatments are so hard to actually get. We live in a here take a pill society instead of what is causing it can we maybe find a way to deal with the cause. Sometimes medication is the only option, but it shouldn't be the first option in all cases. I should have recovered years ago, I should never have gotten as bad as I did... our system is the reason I have.. and my stubborn nature and my families ability to give me support when it was needed is the only reason I have a chance to get healthy.

[Still Kicking]

@Still Kicking (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=6143) It took me 5 clicks in 10 seconds to get to CMHA site to investigate further about mental health typing Let's Talk into google search. And that was to find more info than the many facts concerning mental health found on the Bell site.

I know everyone is and should be wary and think critical of corporate manipulation but I think it incredibly important to acknowledge the widespread exposure to opening discussion this is creating.

I don't know what kind of discussion I was intending to spark, but I have enjoyed reading the responses.

I too am guilty of muddling my message.

I guess I was less interested in slamming Bell - I do call them a candle in the darkness (but make it weaker by calling their candle tiny) - and more interested in CTE and the athletes we cheer and expect to put themselves in harm's way for our sense of glory. I also seek action and truly care that TFC players are supported. Many employees in the workplace can be offered counselling and severance, the pro athlete? Fort York Redcoat - I take your point regarding the information depth and breadth that are only clicks away. I guess in the back of my mind was the news earlier this week, news that is fairly local to me, that the Guelph Mercury is stopping the printing of their paper. A company such as Bell must be part of that discussion - does something like Let's Talk pave the way for others to follow? As companies cease advertising and readers stop reading the newspaper?

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Havent read any comments in this thread but as a mental health worker i have mixed emotions about this campaign.
Obviously its great that theres increased awareness and fundraising towards any and all mental health, no debating that.
Unfortunately i still fail to see where these funds go, definitely dont see it on the front line, lord knows we could use more workers and more jobs, never ever see any of those since this campaign started, if anything ive seen jobs cut back. Also fail to see this general message spread as far as some people claim it does, still massive issue of mental health in schools (i work predominantly with kids) and within the system. Guess ill go back and read what everyone else has said now.

[Still Kicking]

And Kaz - thanks for the bravery it took to write your post. I know that online discussions can have intent go astray in one's words. Your obstacles (and caring for those who stood by you) came through loud and clear. Sorry to hear of your struggle. I have just a little insight regarding mental health and insurance companies. A ptsd sufferer myself, a story involving being attacked at work, endless rounds of accommodation issues, full support from one superb union rep, followed by the full botching of the situation by the union rep from hell, then the insurance wall - finally opted for early retirement.
But somebody once told me that the least helpful response one can give in any situation is the autobiographical echo......

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Wuddup Flamehawk, sounds like you and I are in similar occupations and more or less have similar opinions on the matter.

[molenshtain]

I'm saying this but I have a feeling others feel the same way; don't take people not posting as meaning they don't care. I'm very interested in this thread and respect, appreciate and admire those in this thread who are sharing their stories and bringing their perspective to the issue. I think everyone has their own story about either their own issues with mental health or someone close to them. Mental health issues have taken a stranglehold on both myself and my family over the last 6 months or so, and it's an incredibly difficult thing to come to terms with. I think a lot of people, myself included, haven't fully formulated their thoughts on the issue and don't know how to contribute to the discussion even if they want to or feel like they should.

anyway. Just saying don't take people not posting as people not caring. It's an important topic that a lot of people don't know how to talk about. Those who put themselves out there are appreciated.

[MightyDM]

I guess my point was pretty muddled with my post. My main point was that these awareness campaigns can be helpful in terms of encouraging discussion; however, we need to be critical of what conversations emerge. I have provided workshops at schools and with other social service sectors (such as settlement workers) as a part of my job and also observed many done in various settings, but there seems to be an emphasis on presenting various diagnostic categories and suggesting people refer to psychiatric care. It would not be fair to make a blanket statement that this is unhelpful, but I do think there needs to be more of a push for people to feel confident in connecting with one another. It can add to the 'stigma' when people are encouraged simply to categorize. In one of the Bell ads, a character mentions how someone has been off for a month because of "Bipolar Disorder". Another worker dismisses this, thinking it was 'fake'. The first character assures the worker that he had looked it up and that it was a 'real diagnosis'. This may seem like semantics or being overly critical, but I do feel a trend towards an emphasis on 'professional help' versus understanding as a responsibility of all. Any mental health professional will admit that our actual roles are quite limited in the lives of those dealing with emotional toil, and that friends and family are far more important. I can see how some may say Bell encourages this, but seen in the context of other awareness campaigns, I am not sure it achieves this.


The other point is whether the campaign help substantively. This critique, just as the previous one, is not directed specifically at Bell but at our society, our governments etc. There is a money component to Bell's campaign, which is good (though would have been even better if Bell would just give the money and not insist on attaching names etc. .. though that wouldn't make sense for them), but what we have seen is cutbacks in government funding and a reliance on grant-based funding. This funding is almost never sustainable and has led to contract-based work, programs being set up one year and cut another etc. The Healthcare system needs to be properly funded - and these one off donations (even if done annually) are not the answer. This money also doesn't address the fact that the main stressors for mental health go far beyond the healthcare system - housing, policing, welfare etc. It's hypocritical when politicians piggy back on these campaigns while at the same time exacerbate the problem with their policies.


Lastly, the focus on stigma can also be limiting, as it focuses on 'internal reactions' versus discrimination. Yes, it's important that people feel comfortable to be open about their struggles, but are companies like Bell responsive and accomadating to these issues. Can someone take time off in the same way someone whom has fallen physical ill could. Is worklife balance encouraged? Are workers being paid a living wage so they are constantly stressed about their living situation? Just today, this article came out: http://canadalandshow.com/article/lets-talk-about-how-my-job-bell-gave-me-mental-health-issues-and-no-benefits criticizing Bell for its own mental health practices.


For me, it's frustrating on the frontlines as the situation is getting worst year by year. All those waitlists I mentioned have increased for one. We spend more time shuffling papers and sending referrals to non-existant services, than actually sitting down and providing counselling. The system is so very broken and yet every year, Bell and others can pat their backs and take in the praise. Some might say I am being unfair, since "at least Bell is doing something", but given the major standing of companies like Bell in society, we need to have higher standards.

i believe that the people at Bell who have pushed this are sincerely well intentioned and likely to have had relatives who have had serious mental illness. That said, no matter how successful, charity isn't and can never be a substitute for proper government funding and programmes. By openly discussing an illness about which there remains great stigma, Bell helps create the possibility that more people will support more collective action to address mental health, and that's a good thing.

[MightyDM]

So I'm basically re-purposing the post I make on my social media for this thread. What Bell does is start, even if it is only a conversation but it isn't enough. My own story with mental health issues could have had a very dark outcome, most people in my situation would likely not have had the success I had (though I am still struggling). Donating to initiatives yourself is more effective as it can prevent suicides, homelessness, and substance abuse. It can save lives much faster than any thing else.


I have dealt with Social Anxiety Issues most of my life. That means I don't like going to Bars, public spaces, social events, and talking to Women (or anyone socially really).. Raj on the Big Bang Theory has better luck than I did. I can remember standing beside a girl texting her at 23 because I couldn't get words to come out of my mouth. Going to a TFC game involves making sure I arrive so I'm through the gate nearly first, I get simple food, I go to my seat and I don't leave my seat until the game is over, I don't leave right away and I do all I can to avoid crowds. Sometimes meaning I'll walk back to union or wait for an hour or more for the Go trains to get less busy. I haven't been able to go through the Go Tunnel since 2009. Of course this is only when I'm healthy enough to go, I only get to one or two games a season. The next week after I don't have the ability to deal with much of anything.


As time went on this became worse as people reinforced the triggers of my Anxiety. Eventually my Social Anxiety became General Anxiety, the General Anxiety developed Panic Attacks and by the time I was in my late 20s I wasn't functioning really well for months on end. By my 30s it had developed into full Agoraphobia.


I tried to get help many times, through the Mental Health Association to start because it seemed logical. The wait time to get therapy was basically infinity. Almost a year went by with nothing really, finally took myself off the waiting list because I was seeming to get better and I had moved hours away to North Bay.I had a another breakdown little more than a year later and again tried to get help.. I couldn't. There was none.. this time not even the Mental Health Association really had any support.. (why they exist in North Bay I don't know) Tried to see a Therapist.. but he was rude and wholly unhelpful.


When things got really bad in 2011 I once again turned to the Mental Health Association Waiting List. I also used work Insurance and discovered that the Peel Region had it's own system in place I even tried my family Doctor. The insurance company spent more time trying to prove I was faking it rather than providing support, my doctor repeatedly asked me to come to his Church, and the therapist I started seeing thought the root of my problem was I wanted to have sex with my male friend... (he's a chud I don't know what his wife sees in him omg he is ugly.. almost more than me (that and I'm straight)) Thankfully the Peel Regional system got me to see a mental health Nurse who tried a therapy that provided the first real improvement. It was only 4 sessions of a therapy program that would take anywhere between 10-20 sessions. A few months ago the Insurance Company finally stepped in and offered help. Set me up with a therapist who could build on the work peel region did (3 years after the fact) and may help get me healthy.

My journey was to look for help 4 times, take 4 different medications 2 of which made me much worse, went through 7 therapist, had a doctor try to convert me to his religion, and an insurance company that scared my employer so much that the word nervous or anxious was taken to mean violent or crazy. Making them scared to have me in the building. Needless to say having your employer think you are a violent psychopath because you have anxiety isn't really great for your anxiety. Had I got the support I had in the past 4 months I would have controlled my anxiety in 2007 been much more functional for the last 8 years. Had I received it in 2011/2012 I would have likely been successful in my return to work the first time, and avoid later attacks. Had the Insurance Company behaved responsibly other issues wouldn't have occurred at all.

The Talking is good.. but more needs to be done... donate if you can to initiatives in your area. Peel Region can only offer 4 sessions of therapy due to funding. So donating to programs that offer proper therapy to those that medications don't help. That alone is a big big step. Also talking with your MPs and MPP/MLA to help fix the insurance companies so that they do more than just deny deny deny. The Insurance Company Approved my claim in January of 2012, and then denied it in March 2012, and it look nearly 8 appeals and a really bad night before they finally approved it permanently in June of 2014.


So Talk is good, action is better. I'm a lucky case, if not for my family being there to help and support me during two years with no income while the insurance company tried their damnedest to twist everything there were give to try to say I wasn't sick... I could have ended up hospitalized, homeless or much much worse.

I truly think that the reason recovery rates are so low is Insurance Companies only care about Medication Treatments and Therapy Treatments are so hard to actually get. We live in a here take a pill society instead of what is causing it can we maybe find a way to deal with the cause. Sometimes medication is the only option, but it shouldn't be the first option in all cases. I should have recovered years ago, I should never have gotten as bad as I did... our system is the reason I have.. and my stubborn nature and my families ability to give me support when it was needed is the only reason I have a chance to get healthy.

Thanks for being brave enough to say all this. Shows we need systemic change so that the right programmes are available when needed, not five years later.

hope you make it to May 7, even if it means getting there hours ahead.

[Kingvikingstad]

I read a lot on this board yet don't post alot, but this thread touches my heart as Ive had experience with mental health at a personal level, with friends and family; everything ranging from depression to bipolar.

Much like flamehawk and ossington I've also worked in the field of mental health, though more in the form of advocating to different levels of government and conducting community research in poverty reduction. I agree with everything you both have written. From my experience, often the thread that ties untreated mental health is poverty.

Im going to get a bit political because I think it may be the only way to truly address mental health. Stigma is still an issue, definitely, but people have to realize we are collectively making a choice to allow people to live untreated, simply because we're afraid to either: tax corporations, tax the wealthy, or spend another $100/year each so that mental health services can be adequately provided and staffed. As flamehawk alluded to, the stagnant wages and increasing precarity of employment (especially in Toronto) doesn't help. A prof I work with is working on a study that suggests over 50% of all employment in Toronto is now precarious! You can bet the bank this will have a residual effect on the demand for mental health services. Spending on mental health makes us better off, both societally and individually.

Finally and not to be forgotten, thanks Kaz for sharing. It's not easy to do and I think what I've realized as I've gotten older is that the people who would think poorly of an issue like mental health are people I have no time for anyways. So please continue to speak out!

[flamehawk]

@Ossignton - Great to see others in the field here. I don't think this is the first time we have agreed on things. Will send a PM soon.

@MightyDM - The intentions of individuals involved might be good, but I do sometimes wonder if 'Bell' has done much talking with mental health workers and people who have gone through the system. Bell also hasn't done much at addressing their own policies around these issues - which ends up coming off as superficial. But I do agree, that this has triggered a pretty critical and nuanced conversation, which I do applaud (and I applaud Kicking It for getting the ball rolling here on RPB)

@Kingvokingstad - Absolutely agree that mental health is very much a political issue and that the framing of mental health as 'personal' and 'medical' contributes to stigma and discrimination.


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I would echo what others have said. It's tremendously difficult to share stories of struggle and the process of sharing can be very helpful for others experiencing emotional distress.

I also want to say that for those unwilling to share - that is perfectly fine too. I've had conversations with people who have felt shamed by campaigns like let's talk for not wanting to come out about their mental health issues especially in the context of discrimination. Many people are still justifiably afraid about repercussions at work and in the community.

[greatwhitenorf]

It's a great cause, but it's hard not to be cynical about the intentions of Bell and TSN when Argos cheerleaders and players stand alongside cheque presentations to support the Let's Talk initiatives. The Argos personnel had absolutely nothing to do with the money or the event I attended west of Toronto a week or two back. Didn't have a word to say to onlookers.

Just pieces of marketing parsley standing alongside for the peripheral publicity. It was depressing.

[Fort York Redcoat]

It's a great cause, but it's hard not to be cynical about the intentions of Bell and TSN when Argos cheerleaders and players stand alongside cheque presentations to support the Let's Talk initiatives. The Argos personnel had absolutely nothing to do with the money or the event I attended west of Toronto a week or two back. Didn't have a word to say to onlookers.

Just pieces of marketing parsley standing alongside for the peripheral publicity. It was depressing.

What were your expectations?

I don't know what event you're referencing so I can't comment decidedly but a charitable presentation to raise exposure I suppose could be done more somberly if necessary.

I'm confused from what you say you were at an event and wanted those involved with the presentation to spend some time with those in attendance or "onlookers" passing by?