Argos to BMO decision - Wednesday, May 20th

[TFC07]

You know there's an Argos thread under "All Sports Talk" section, right? Who cares how many of season tickets they have sold especially when you consider this is Grey Cup year where Argos SSH get a chance to buy Grey Cup tickets before anyone else.

[Fort York Redcoat]

You know there's an Argos thread under "All Sports Talk" section, right? Who cares how many of season tickets they have sold especially when you consider this is Grey Cup year where Argos SSH get a chance to buy Grey Cup tickets before anyone else.

Because people have been waxing how many tickets they've sold. These are the answers.

[GabrielHurl]

You know there's an Argos thread under "All Sports Talk" section, right? Who cares how many of season tickets they have sold especially when you consider this is Grey Cup year where Argos SSH get a chance to buy Grey Cup tickets before anyone else.

Thanks Mr. Forum Police Officer :rolleyes:

[eustacchio]

that doesn't really prove if they've been sold or held back

If you check out the map for the Argos, it says N/A. If you check the map for TFC it says Sold Out.

[OgtheDim]

Banter people...this is all banter.

[GabrielHurl]

If you check out the map for the Argos, it says N/A. If you check the map for TFC it says Sold Out.

So you mean to tell me is that every seat shown as red on the Argos virtual venue thing has been held back and not sold because it says N.A. and not sold out?

http://i.imgur.com/x0N5CEj.png

[OgtheDim]

I'm telling you that a whole load of seats that line up on one side of almost every single section means stuff is being held back.

You can't tell me you think those seats in red to the right are all sold, like that. Lining up all like that?

[GabrielHurl]

I take everything back - you are right and I am wrong

[Ivy]

Take a look at the pic I provided.

That's held back seats.

http://i.imgur.com/pDEwba4.png
There is NO way that Og is wrong on this.
How many sections are similar to this?

[OgtheDim]

I take everything back - you are right and I am wrong

Ur are wishful....I was like that for about 5 minutes until the MLSE cynicism kicked in. :)

Argo fans are in for a real eye opener as to how they can be fleeced and made to seem like heroes at the same time.

[eustacchio]

So you mean to tell me is that every seat shown as red on the Argos virtual venue thing has been held back and not sold because it says N.A. and not sold out?

http://i.imgur.com/x0N5CEj.png

I have a very, very strong suspicion (I could be wrong but I do work for a ticketing software company so it's more of an educated suspicion).

EDIT: I don't mean more educated than any one else - but in the context of an educated guess.

[Fort York Redcoat]

So while I was away in NY I got a call from "my" Argos ticket rep asking if I had any questions about the new season ticket packages and how I could get a hold of him. Anyone else had this happen?

While I understand the Argos are using MLSE info they may want to add a "comments" line if they (we) are existing STH's and if we've had convos with ticket reps whether we've, you know, said we have a problem the Argos groundshare.

just a note. Doesn't take much.

[Pint]

So while I was away in NY I got a call from "my" Argos ticket rep asking if I had any questions about the new season ticket packages and how I could get a hold of him. Anyone else had this happen?

While I understand the Argos are using MLSE info they may want to add a "comments" line if they (we) are existing STH's and if we've had convos with ticket reps whether we've, you know, said we have a problem the Argos groundshare.

just a note. Doesn't take much.

I could only image some of the hate that person has received when making calls.

I almost hope i get one

[ronzilla]

The leafs are now playing a game at bmo next year

http://www.torontosun.com/2016/03/09/maple-leafs-to-host-red-wings-in-2017-winter-classic-at-bmo-field

[CBTFC]

The leafs are now playing a game at bmo next year


That's been one of the worst kept secrets all along...that was one of the only reasons they did the renovations/roof, so they could host the Jan 1 2017 outdoor game which also coincides with their 100th anniversary.

They haven't won a cup in 50 years, but who cares they have a fancy new logo! Lol.

[Blizzard]

That's been one of the worst kept secrets all along...that was one of the only reasons they did the renovations/roof, so they could host the Jan 1 2017 outdoor game which also coincides with their 100th anniversary.

They haven't won a cup in 50 years, but who cares they have a fancy new logo! Lol.

BMO didn't need a roof for that. Was there a roof in Ann Arbour? No!

The expanded seating was all they really needed.

[OgtheDim]

So......they are playing the Red Wings.

And the seats are Red.


Going to be a long way to throw that Octopus.

[Adamo23]

So......they are playing the Red Wings.

And the seats are Red.


Going to be a long way to throw that Octopus.

That's gonna be really awkard for the leafs...unless they put blue seat covers... But that's the last thing we want blue seats

[Enterprise Captain]

That's gonna be really awkard for the leafs...unless they put blue seat covers... But that's the last thing we want blue seats
The place is going to be sold out. No need for seat covers with all the people in blue jerseys you won't notice the colour of the seats. Also, this won't effect TFC in any way. There's over two months after this event before our season starts.

[CBTFC]

Unbelievable!!! First the Argos, and now the Leafs moving in?!?

Their skates are really gonna chew up the grass guys...clearly this is all part of the MLSE conspiracy!!!!!

;)

[Fort York Redcoat]

That's been one of the worst kept secrets all along...that was one of the only reasons they did the renovations/roof, so they could host the Jan 1 2017 outdoor game which also coincides with their 100th anniversary.



BMO didn't need a roof for that. Was there a roof in Ann Arbour? No!

The expanded seating was all they really needed.

The roof wasn't necessary. The other renos and expansion were. With the new facilities they could attract people who care about events. It was never about making it better just for the people already there.

BMO field was decided 2 years ago to become an attraction vs a shrine. This one time event does less to intrude upon our season but it IS the carrot that lead the donkey to an all purpose stadium.

[Cashcleaner]

^ Well, with the Argos in for this season, I'd say we're already at the point of an all-purpose stadium. But you're right in the the outdoor hockey game is one-off. I can see the NHL allowing one game per season at BMO at the most, as well as throwing a bone to the Marlies, but not much beyond that. I have serious doubts we'd have outdoor Leaf matches multiple times over a season, though I wonder if Hockey Canada would consider it for a special tournament or exhibition game? Canada v USA outdoors might be cool.

[Blizzard]

Well, with the Argos in for this season, I'd say we're already at the point of an all-purpose stadium. But you're right in the the outdoor hockey game is one-off. I can see the NHL allowing one game per season at BMO at the most, as well as throwing a bone to the Marlies, but not much beyond that. I have serious doubts we'd have outdoor Leaf matches multiple times over a season, though I wonder if Hockey Canada would consider it for a special tournament or exhibition game? Canada v USA outdoors might be cool.

Maybe one but MLSE would be smarter to spread it out a bit. The novelty factor is important. If I were them I'd do one every three years.

Ya, a Canada v USA match, actually two matches ... men and women ... would be great but only once every two years as the USA should host every other year. Turn it into a tradition!

[greatwhitenorf]

^ Well, with the Argos in for this season, I'd say we're already at the point of an all-purpose stadium. But you're right in the the outdoor hockey game is one-off. I can see the NHL allowing one game per season at BMO at the most, as well as throwing a bone to the Marlies, but not much beyond that. I have serious doubts we'd have outdoor Leaf matches multiple times over a season, though I wonder if Hockey Canada would consider it for a special tournament or exhibition game? Canada v USA outdoors might be cool.

There should be an outdoor NHL game annually for years to come at BMO Field. There are many rivalries to still to serve - Montreal, Ottawa, Buffalo, other Original Six clubs, other Canadian clubs.

With each game, we will see an accompanying schedule over a 2-3 day span including Marlies AHL games, OHL games, alumni events. Anything up to and including the Leafs Ice Girls vs. The World Snowball Fight-Hot Tub Party.

The adjoining buildings will be full of displays (including Hall of Fame), merchandise concessions, interactive events, player appearances and bars and restaurants. Each outdoor game will make buckets of money yet offer the Leafs scores of affordable/free promotional opportunities to bring new Canadians into the game. They know how urgent it is to bring new people to the game.

[AdamAM]

https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/49vdmp/the_cfl_pays_its_entrylevel_workers_0hour_in_new/

Let's all give a warm welcome to our generous new co-hosts!

Seriously, disgusting scummy corporate BS like this make my blood boil. Would be good material for a TIFO imo

[OgtheDim]

Doing a TIFO about the other tenant?

Nah...they are not worth it.

[Cashcleaner]

There should be an outdoor NHL game annually for years to come at BMO Field. There are many rivalries to still to serve - Montreal, Ottawa, Buffalo, other Original Six clubs, other Canadian clubs.

Yeah that's what I mean. I think we'll see at most one outdoor game a year, but the league is dead set against multiple matches at BMO over the course of a season.


With each game, we will see an accompanying schedule over a 2-3 day span including Marlies AHL games, OHL games, alumni events. Anything up to and including the Leafs Ice Girls vs. The World Snowball Fight-Hot Tub Party.

The adjoining buildings will be full of displays (including Hall of Fame), merchandise concessions, interactive events, player appearances and bars and restaurants. Each outdoor game will make buckets of money yet offer the Leafs scores of affordable/free promotional opportunities to bring new Canadians into the game. They know how urgent it is to bring new people to the game.

There's no doubt in my mind that they'll try to have an AHL game within a week of the NHL match, and maybe other events as well. Simply because if MLSE is going to shell out that money for the stands, staff, and support facilities; they might as well squeeze in as much use as they can and generate more money.

And honestly, I have no problem with it. In fact, I hope they get as much use of out the place as they can - just as long as it's not immediately before or during the MLS season and post-season, of course. ;)

[Enterprise Captain]

https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/49vdmp/the_cfl_pays_its_entrylevel_workers_0hour_in_new/

Let's all give a warm welcome to our generous new co-hosts!

Seriously, disgusting scummy corporate BS like this make my blood boil. Would be good material for a TIFO imo
How is that related to the Argos at BMO Field? It's an issue, an issue that belongs in a different thread as it is a different topic.

[AdamAM]

The league that oversees the team (Argos) that is invading our home stadium (BMO) is doing things bordering on the illegal. Think it's perfectly fine to post that in here. Adds a bit to the general feeling of fuck you towards them, I would think

[GabrielHurl]

nevermind - not worth it

[Enterprise Captain]

The league that oversees the team (Argos) that is invading our home stadium (BMO) is doing things bordering on the illegal. Think it's perfectly fine to post that in here. Adds a bit to the general feeling of fuck you towards them, I would think
I didn't realize the purpose of this thread was to add "to the general feeling of fuck you towards them (Argos)." I thought it was to discus things that effect TFC fans by the Argos moving in to BMO Field and what you posted doesn't effect me at all as a TFC fan.

[SoccMan2]

Fuck the Argos if they were to fold I could not care less, ya I said it and if I can't say something like this on a soccer TFC forum without someone being offended than woopidee yoo!

[Adamo23]

All we are doing is hating on the Argos but that's going to get us nowhere. Face it they are going to stay for likely a long time because they can't afford a new stadium. As a loyal TFC supporter since 2007 the Argos moving in really hurt me and it took sometime to accept it. If there are any football lines or Argos logos on the field during tfc game day I'm more likely to not go.

[noimpactinmtl]

All we are doing is hating on the Argos but that's going to get us nowhere. Face it they are going to stay for likely a long time because they can't afford a new stadium. As a loyal TFC supporter since 2007 the Argos moving in really hurt me and it took sometime to accept it. If there are any football lines or Argos logos on the field during tfc game day I'm more likely to not go.

I'm willing to play the long game and wait out for the fanbase to die off and the the talent pool to shrink to irrelevance.

In true Canadian fashion, we'll keep this drenching corpse afloat to satisfy CANCON.

[Red4ever]

https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/49vdmp/the_cfl_pays_its_entrylevel_workers_0hour_in_new/

Let's all give a warm welcome to our generous new co-hosts!

Seriously, disgusting scummy corporate BS like this make my blood boil. Would be good material for a TIFO imo

Huh. Im think there is a lot of bullshit complaining around most unpaid intership "scandals" but that seems clear as day to be pretty shitty.

[Adamo23]

I'm willing to play the long game and wait out for the fanbase to die off and the the talent pool to shrink to irrelevance.

In true Canadian fashion, we'll keep this drenching corpse afloat to satisfy CANCON.

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

[TFC07]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

MLSE already got the message how much TFC fans don't support Argos move to BMO field, but unfortunately we can't do anything about it unless you stop buying tickets and support TFC.

This is why I hope all Canadian soccer league becomes a reality one day so soccer fans in this region will have an option to support non-MLSE soccer team.

[Enterprise Captain]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.
http://img.pandawhale.com/50246-soooo-youre-telling-me-theres-P7Ga.jpeg

Also, please speak for yourself. Not all of us hate the Argos. As far as I'm concerned MLSE has addressed the issues that I was concerned about with the Argos moving into BMO Field. The only unknown is the pitch but until I see an issue there I'm not going to start complaining.

[Fort York Redcoat]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

You don't think MLSE knows we don't want to share the stadium? They do.

A petition at this stage would do little but make you feel like you've done something. If it helps you go for it. I think you'd be disappointed by the amount of people who would sign it.

[ryan]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

If by extremely slim you meant 100% non existent, then you said something correct.

[Red4ever]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

I will pile on (pun intended) and say there is no way it ever happens ever.

http://data.whicdn.com/images/45919051/large.gif

[SoccMan2]

Where is the petition I will be the first to sign it! Get the fuckers out!

[Onyx]

Where is the petition I will be the first to sign it! Get the fuckers out!

why don't you not renew your season seats and tell them why, thats the only thing MLSE understands is $$$.
You can still support the club through games on TV.

petition isn't going to do shit.

[Fort York Redcoat]

why don't you not renew your season seats and tell them why, thats the only thing MLSE understands is $$$.
You can still support the club through games on TV.

petition isn't going to do shit.

Not renewing now will do little change as well. If one doesn't renew they are pretty much in the same boat - doing it for themselves and their piece of mind.

[Onyx]

Not renewing now will do little change as well. If one doesn't renew they are pretty much in the same boat - doing it for themselves and their piece of mind.

the different being is you still have your $$ and they don't .. and you can tell them directly what you think.

[zeelaw]

You don't think MLSE knows we don't want to share the stadium? They do.

A petition at this stage would do little but make you feel like you've done something. If it helps you go for it. I think you'd be disappointed by the amount of people who would sign it.

I don't even think they would bother with FREE BEER to stop the petition. Maybe OP could get 15% flex pack tickets!

[Fort York Redcoat]

the different being is you still have your $$ and they don't .. and you can tell them directly what you think.

That's just it. You have Your money - but they have someone else's. We're at an upswing of renewals right now with expansion and having an MVP year. Renew or don't but do it for yourself not to "vote" or hurt the clubs pocket book. The difference is as much as a petition.

[SoccMan2]

I was being sarcastic it's too late for a petition this company does not care and they are going to get the most use out of BMO as they possibly can and that's why the Argos are here and these bastards are not going anywhere, I don't like it and I never will, but I like soccer too much not to renew and not go so they got me and got me good the bastards!

[Pint]

Essentially how it went down (in my eyes):

Rogers screwed Bell out of content by going for the hockey rights alone (believe they thought it was going to be split). Bell therefore needs to protect all the content it can, especially if it is Canadian content. Nobody wanted to buy the argos so bell stepped up to protect the league from too much instability in a self protective manner. At the same time Rogers with no ties to the argos told them the sweetheart deal they were given would be expiring and they were homeless.

LT has tried to get in on an NFL team in the past and I'm sure he still wants one in Toronto, he plays nice with the city to make any future dealings easier.

The byproduct of all of this is we get screwed around and shoehorned into an unfortunate situation.

With the $$$ at play no petition was ever going to stop this, all i hope for (beyond minimal damage to the pitch) is LT getting that NFL team and the argos moving into that stadium.

[Red4ever]

Essentiall how it went down (in my eyes):

Rogers screwed Bell out of content by going for the hockey rights alone (believe they thought it was going to be split). Bell therefore needs to protect all the content it can, especially if it is Canadian content. Nobody wanted to buy the argos so bell stepped up to protect the league from too much instability in a self protective manner. At the same time Rogers with no ties to the argos told them the sweetheart deal they were given would be expiring and they were homeless.

LT has tried to get in on an NFL team in the past and i'm sure he still wants one in Toronto, he plays nice with the city to make any future dealings easier.

The byproduct of all of this is we get screwed around and shoehorned into an unfortunate situation.

With the $$$ at play no petition was ever going to stop this, all i hope for (beyond minimal damage to the pitch) is LT getting that NFL team and the argos moving into that stadium.
This is pretty much exactly right.

But ill sign the petetion if it gets us Free Beer.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Essentially how it went down (in my eyes):

Rogers screwed Bell out of content by going for the hockey rights alone (believe they thought it was going to be split). Bell therefore needs to protect all the content it can, especially if it is Canadian content. Nobody wanted to buy the argos so bell stepped up to protect the league from too much instability in a self protective manner. At the same time Rogers with no ties to the argos told them the sweetheart deal they were given would be expiring and they were homeless.

LT has tried to get in on an NFL team in the past and I'm sure he still wants one in Toronto, he plays nice with the city to make any future dealings easier.

The byproduct of all of this is we get screwed around and shoehorned into an unfortunate situation.

With the $$$ at play no petition was ever going to stop this, all i hope for (beyond minimal damage to the pitch) is LT getting that NFL team and the argos moving into that stadium.

Agreed but I hope even more that there is a partnership for a similar sized stadium for the Argos and a CPL team

but ya I'll take the other way they'd move, too,

[Pint]

Agreed but I hope even more that there is a partnership for a similar sized stadium for the Argos and a CPL team

but ya I'll take the other way they'd move, too,

That may be the kicker here... the exact contract that screwed bell and caused them to take such a protective stance on content may have lead them to invest (TV contract) in the CPL and give it the financial backing it needed to move ahead.

Maybe a CPL team comes to toronto and they share with the argos somewhere else (York/UofT)

[Beach_Red]

Essentially how it went down (in my eyes):

Rogers screwed Bell out of content by going for the hockey rights alone (believe they thought it was going to be split). Bell therefore needs to protect all the content it can, especially if it is Canadian content. Nobody wanted to buy the argos so bell stepped up to protect the league from too much instability in a self protective manner. At the same time Rogers with no ties to the argos told them the sweetheart deal they were given would be expiring and they were homeless.

LT has tried to get in on an NFL team in the past and I'm sure he still wants one in Toronto, he plays nice with the city to make any future dealings easier.

The byproduct of all of this is we get screwed around and shoehorned into an unfortunate situation.

With the $$$ at play no petition was ever going to stop this, all i hope for (beyond minimal damage to the pitch) is LT getting that NFL team and the argos moving into that stadium.

Why didn't he buy the Bills when they were for sale? Will there ever be a cheaper way to get a team in Toronto?

[Pint]

Why didn't he buy the Bills when they were for sale? Will there ever be a cheaper way to get a team in Toronto?

From what I recall the Buffalo area billionaire paid well above market value for the team and promised to keep them in Buffalo.

[Beach_Red]

From what I recall the Buffalo area billionaire paid well above market value for the team and promised to keep them in Buffalo.

What he paid sets the market price. And if e Bills were too expensive there will never be a cheaper way into the NFL.

We're with the Argos for at least ten years. The one promise I hope MLSE keeps is that on TFC games days we will not be able to tell it's a shared stadium.

[Blizzard]

TFC supporters should make a petition to send the Argos to lamport stadium. The chances of them moving are extremely slim but MLSE will get the message on how much we hate them.

The chances are not extremely slim, they are non-existent, zero, zilch, nada. Besides, if you know anything about Lamport, you would know that it holds only 10k and it's field is only 120 yards long. Could be a perfect home for the Canadian Premier League though.

[greatwhitenorf]

MLSE holds the operating rights for Lamport. Under no circumstances would a pro sports team of any repute play there with the stands in their current configuration or primitive condition. They would be demo'ed and a whole new facility built. The footprint of land there is more than adequate to build another stadium for the Argos. It would make sense in so many ways, as a showcase venue on several levels for the Canadian game, but it won't ever happen.

This whole hare-brained idea of a Canadian soccer league will never fly in our lifetimes. Sure, it might get tried, but it will fail. Not the least of reasons is that the CFL is involved, trying to use this as a competitive league to undermine the current MLS clubs in Canada and possibly find a way to milk back some of the economic thunder taken from them by MLS.

The gridiron teams have seen MLS trample past the mocking disbelief they and their media allies long held about the game to compete strongly in Canada's three major markets for fans, sponsor dollars and media play. It has steadily proven to be a detriment to future CFL success as there simply aren't enough deep pockets in the CFL to sustain losses for long.

MLS is far too strong a competitor for it and its current Canadian members all come from cities that have long participated in the standard, top-flight North American pro sports league model of having cross-border play. We wouldn't settle for a diminished soccer experience in Toronto. We just finished two great games in New York that earned us very positive international media coverage. No one - not here nor out there - is going to give a farthing's worth of Fuchs about how a Toronto CSL side do against Saskatoon. Until our national population climbs above 100 million, a Canadian-only soccer league will never have enough appeal or commercial clout to succeed at the level of MLS.

Who needs another CFL? Or CSL, for those who not-so-fondly remember Le Circuit de Thundering Dale Barnes.

[OgtheDim]

You know it is possible to support the CFL, TFC and the CPL all at the same time. Heck, its even possible to admire the effort and the idea of the CSL.


BTW, the CFL doesn't fear MLS at all. The CFL's issues in Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver predate MLS. The CFL's issues in those 3 towns are competition for the entertainment $ from the vast amount of stuff we all can do in those towns. MLS is a small small SMALL part of all that.

CFL teams want to set up the CPL to get more revenue out of their stadium leases. Fair enough. Now, I have SERIOUS issues with the people hoping to set up the local CPL efforts in the different cities as I don't think they have a clue how to develop soccer culture. (Listen to this blog if you want to get a deep look into that issue https://soundcloud.com/footy-soldiers/fs-canadianpremierleaguespecial )


But, doing this to get back at MLS? Do you really think the owners in Regina give a shit about MLS?!?! Nah, lets not flatter ourselves here.

[Fort York Redcoat]

This whole hare-brained idea of a Canadian soccer league will never fly in our lifetimes. Sure, it might get tried, but it will fail. Not the least of reasons is that the CFL is involved, trying to use this as a competitive league to undermine the current MLS clubs in Canada and possibly find a way to milk back some of the economic thunder taken from them by MLS.

The gridiron teams have seen MLS trample past the mocking disbelief they and their media allies long held about the game to compete strongly in Canada's three major markets for fans, sponsor dollars and media play. It has steadily proven to be a detriment to future CFL success as there simply aren't enough deep pockets in the CFL to sustain losses for long.

MLS is far too strong a competitor for it and its current Canadian members all come from cities that have long participated in the standard, top-flight North American pro sports league model of having cross-border play. We wouldn't settle for a diminished soccer experience in Toronto. We just finished two great games in New York that earned us very positive international media coverage. No one - not here nor out there - is going to give a farthing's worth of Fuchs about how a Toronto CSL side do against Saskatoon. Until our national population climbs above 100 million, a Canadian-only soccer league will never have enough appeal or commercial clout to succeed at the level of MLS.

Who needs another CFL? Or CSL, for those who not-so-fondly remember Le Circuit de Thundering Dale Barnes.

Wow. Plenty tinfoil talk in this one. You seem pretty confident in your prediction. That's cool. But as for your bold "no one would care" theory that's just wrong. There is a market for it. The market just isn't the numbers that impress you. I don't see why CFL or MLS would be intimidated or undermined. CFL would look for partnership and the CPL would look to smaller markets to sustain rivalries with bigger market teams that would market to the same demo.

I can't see anyone feeling insecure about this prospect once its off the ground. And if it doesn't fly? So what. I don't see the harm in trying to grow the game here. Staying put or static doesn't make much sense if the upswell and growth is as strong you (and I) believe.

[Beach_Red]

^ Exactly right. And then there's the issue of TV ratings (or streaming, or whatever) and will there ever be any for MLS games outside of the three cities with teams? That leaves out a lot of potential viewers in the rest of the country.

[Phil]

Why didn't he buy the Bills when they were for sale? Will there ever be a cheaper way to get a team in Toronto?

Its actually simple - NFL doesn't allow for corporate ownership. LT didn't want (maybe not have) the amount needed to buy the Bills then enact MLSE as the contracted operators for the team.

Further to Pints points, TL was under immense political pressure to get this deal greased through. The MLSE board was in total disarray hence the spin off ownership materializing.

[greatwhitenorf]

The Bills bid put forth by Tanenbaum-BonJovi's group was used by the NFL as a stalking horse bid to force Terry Pegula to raise his purchase price to a level that was more in keeping with the NFL's average franchise value. NFL owners were quite happy to see it rise to $1.4 billion when initial bids were coming in not much above a paltry $800 million.


The bid from Toronto had no chance of succeeding once it hit seven figures and everyone knew it. But the upside for the Toronto group is that a lot of goodwill was generated. The game to bring NFL football here remains afoot.

[ryan]

You know it is possible to support the CFL, TFC and the CPL all at the same time. Heck, its even possible to admire the effort and the idea of the CSL.


BTW, the CFL doesn't fear MLS at all. The CFL's issues in Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver predate MLS. The CFL's issues in those 3 towns are competition for the entertainment $ from the vast amount of stuff we all can do in those towns. MLS is a small small SMALL part of all that.

CFL teams want to set up the CPL to get more revenue out of their stadium leases. Fair enough. Now, I have SERIOUS issues with the people hoping to set up the local CPL efforts in the different cities as I don't think they have a clue how to develop soccer culture. (Listen to this blog if you want to get a deep look into that issue https://soundcloud.com/footy-soldiers/fs-canadianpremierleaguespecial )


But, doing this to get back at MLS? Do you really think the owners in Regina give a shit about MLS?!?! Nah, lets not flatter ourselves here.

TFC did 96,000 viewers on our season opener. Yes, the CFL gives no fucks about what the MLS is doing.

[greatwhitenorf]

You know it is possible to support the CFL, TFC and the CPL all at the same time. Heck, its even possible to admire the effort and the idea of the CSL.


BTW, the CFL doesn't fear MLS at all. The CFL's issues in Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver predate MLS. The CFL's issues in those 3 towns are competition for the entertainment $ from the vast amount of stuff we all can do in those towns. MLS is a small small SMALL part of all that.

CFL teams want to set up the CPL to get more revenue out of their stadium leases. Fair enough. Now, I have SERIOUS issues with the people hoping to set up the local CPL efforts in the different cities as I don't think they have a clue how to develop soccer culture. (Listen to this blog if you want to get a deep look into that issue https://soundcloud.com/footy-soldiers/fs-canadianpremierleaguespecial )


But, doing this to get back at MLS? Do you really think the owners in Regina give a shit about MLS?!?! Nah, lets not flatter ourselves here.

The owners in Regina do not give a shit about MLS. Nor is soccer in general given much consideration out there. Which is why the idea that a Regina-Winnipeg soccer game would attract much of an audience - live or televised - is absurd under present circumstances.

In general, the CFL is very concerned about MLS. That concern is part of their broader worries about what the sport of soccer as a whole represents as a damaging alternative to football in years to come. An alternative to kids who have to make choices about which sports they will play and what choices they will make about what they will support as they grow up and become fans.

This whole notion of the CFL owners wanting to partner up with soccer isn't about doing some sort of benevolent missionary work in Canadian sports. It's about finding ways to tap into undeniably growing revenue streams to leverage commercial relationships and help prop up their struggling league, not to make the game of soccer better.

Granted, if the Canadian municipalities that charitably paid for the stadiums that house CFL teams want to find other revenue-generating uses, that's understandable. But that probably means playing soccer on a plastic pitch. The Canadian game will not grow anything worthwhile on that surface. Good players will not play on it and proper fans won't watch those that do for long. There's nuances that have yet to be grasped by those advancing this proposal.

In the three Canadian MLS markets, there are only so many sponsorship dollars to go around and only so much media space for coverage. If soccer draws the very respectable live audiences it presently earns, it gets the coverage it deserves. With that coverage comes greater awareness that appeals to sponsors.

Without the presence of soccer, a decent amount of ticket sales, media coverage and sponsorships would have likely found their way to the CFL clubs instead. Enough to make a difference in these three most crucial markets.

Now, the appeal of football is undergoing further corrosion from mounting controversies over head injuries. High schools have long been moving away from football. My old school in North York once had junior and senior football teams. No more. But they do have soccer at both levels and shifting demographics have made cricket popular.

There's nothing to stop the CFL teams from trying to start a league. I won't support it. Their motives come across as specious at best.

[greatwhitenorf]

Wow. Plenty tinfoil talk in this one. You seem pretty confident in your prediction. That's cool. But as for your bold "no one would care" theory that's just wrong. There is a market for it. The market just isn't the numbers that impress you. I don't see why CFL or MLS would be intimidated or undermined. CFL would look for partnership and the CPL would look to smaller markets to sustain rivalries with bigger market teams that would market to the same demo.

I can't see anyone feeling insecure about this prospect once its off the ground. And if it doesn't fly? So what. I don't see the harm in trying to grow the game here. Staying put or static doesn't make much sense if the upswell and growth is as strong you (and I) believe.


'Atta boy, Rex!

http://suburban-k9.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/small-dog-sydrome-300x300.jpg

[Fort York Redcoat]

huh.

[Beach_Red]

The Bills bid put forth by Tanenbaum-BonJovi's group was used by the NFL as a stalking horse bid to force Terry Pegula to raise his purchase price to a level that was more in keeping with the NFL's average franchise value. NFL owners were quite happy to see it rise to $1.4 billion when initial bids were coming in not much above a paltry $800 million.


The bid from Toronto had no chance of succeeding once it hit seven figures and everyone knew it. But the upside for the Toronto group is that a lot of goodwill was generated. The game to bring NFL football here remains afoot.

Goodwill counts for nothing. The NFL will always go to the highest bidder and that won't be in Toronto in my lifetime anyway. The NFL in Toronto is not an issue when it comes to keeping lines off the BMO pitch, which is really my only concern. If MLSE keep their promise that on game days we won't be able to tell it is a shared facility then nothing else matters to me.

[Red4ever]

I have to stop clicking on this one.

[Still Kicking]

The Bills bid put forth by Tanenbaum-BonJovi's group was used by the NFL as a stalking horse bid to force Terry Pegula to raise his purchase price to a level that was more in keeping with the NFL's average franchise value. NFL owners were quite happy to see it rise to $1.4 billion when initial bids were coming in not much above a paltry $800 million.


The bid from Toronto had no chance of succeeding once it hit seven figures and everyone knew it. But the upside for the Toronto group is that a lot of goodwill was generated. The game to bring NFL football here remains afoot.
Goodwill has nothing to do with it. Don't hold your breath.
Toronto and NFL will not happen until pay per view TV completely destroys network television and the great American (football and network tv) intertwine. Present NFL tv contracts nets billions and the return to LA is related to making those networks happy. Canadian viewership means nothing to US networks, NFL Canadian tv contract is nickel and dime stuff to the mighty NFL.

btw
And next Super Bowl the CRTC is promising American ads available to Canadian viewers?? A people pleaser, but an economic head scratcher. CTV(Bell) and the NFL are appealing that decision... I guess NFL cares enough to attempt to protect Bell's investment...

[Initial B]

This whole notion of the CFL owners wanting to partner up with soccer isn't about doing some sort of benevolent missionary work in Canadian sports. It's about finding ways to tap into undeniably growing revenue streams to leverage commercial relationships and help prop up their struggling league, not to make the game of soccer better.
I don't think it's the CFL owners driving this, but TSN and its owner Bell. The CSA has a vested interest in getting this league off the ground in order to put a bid on the 2026 World Cup. They must know this will be a money-losing venture for the first decade of existence, but are looking at the long-term implications for professional sports in Canada.

Granted, if the Canadian municipalities that charitably paid for the stadiums that house CFL teams want to find other revenue-generating uses, that's understandable. But that probably means playing soccer on a plastic pitch. The Canadian game will not grow anything worthwhile on that surface. Good players will not play on it and proper fans won't watch those that do for long. There's nuances that have yet to be grasped by those advancing this proposal.
In Ottawa, attendance increased over the inaugural season. Granted there were a number of free tickets passed on to kids under 14, but I went to most of the games and the 5000+ that usually came to watch and the supporters made it feel like an authentic experience, even if they did play on turf. I wouldn't be surprised if FIFA tried to stage a World Cup here to legitimize turf once and for all.

[Beach_Red]

Goodwill has nothing to do with it. Don't hold your breath.
Toronto and NFL will not happen until pay per view TV completely destroys network television and the great American (football and network tv) intertwine. Present NFL tv contracts nets billions and the return to LA is related to making those networks happy. Canadian viewership means nothing to US networks, NFL Canadian tv contract is nickel and dime stuff to the mighty NFL.

btw
And next Super Bowl the CRTC is promising American ads available to Canadian viewers?? A people pleaser, but an economic head scratcher. CTV(Bell) and the NFL are appealing that decision... I guess NFL cares enough to attempt to protect Bell's investment...

Well, sure. The Canadian TV contract is small compared to the USA, but Bell still pay quite a bit for Canadian rights. Which is another reason why they don't really need a team in Toronto, the TV ratings might be affected a little for the games a Toronto team was playing, but overall the effect on ratings would be negligible. It's going to complicate things when Facebook gets the rights (looks like they are bidding on Thursday night games to start) and other services like that.

Bell made a deal with the CRTC (not an official deal, of course), in exchange for losing that commercial revenue they don't have to make as much Canadian content.

[SoccMan2]

Look I breath, eat and sleep soccer but the fact that the CFL is behind this proposed league is one reason I'm very skeptical about it all, and who wants to go watch a game in a 25000 seat stadium on turf with if your lucky 5000 people in it ya that's going to get people excited to go back. Why not play and start in smaller venues than start in these big CFL turfed stadiums with 90 percent of the stadium empty?

[Adamo23]

The Argos have always shared a stadium with a team. It's kinda sad because they could never support themselves to own a stadium.

[Enterprise Captain]

The Argos have always shared a stadium with a team. It's kinda sad because they could never support themselves to own a stadium.
Who did the Argos share Exhibition Stadium with prior to the Blue Jays moving in 1977?

[Petor]

Who did the Argos share Exhibition Stadium with prior to the Blue Jays moving in 1977?

http://www.canadianracer.com/cne/mods1.jpg

[Enterprise Captain]

http://www.canadianracer.com/cne/mods1.jpg
I know other events were held at Exhibition Stadium but I'm pretty sure the Argos were the only sports team tenant at the stadium prior to the Blue Jays moving in, in 1977. Do you consider Bon Jovi a tenant at the ACC?

[Petor]

I know other events were held at Exhibition Stadium but I'm pretty sure the Argos were the only sports team tenant at the stadium prior to the Blue Jays moving in, in 1977. Do you consider Bon Jovi a tenant at the ACC?

Bon Jovi is not a sport, auto racing is.

Here is a brief history of auto racing at CNE Stadium...

http://www.canadianracer.com/cne.asp

[OgtheDim]

The Ex was built for....the Ex.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exhibition_Stadium

[Fort York Redcoat]

Look I breath, eat and sleep soccer but the fact that the CFL is behind this proposed league is one reason I'm very skeptical about it all, and who wants to go watch a game in a 25000 seat stadium on turf with if your lucky 5000 people in it ya that's going to get people excited to go back. Why not play and start in smaller venues than start in these big CFL turfed stadiums with 90 percent of the stadium empty?

Which smaller stadiums? Then there would be no partnership. As for the surface and attendance at that level it's been done before and for other sports. The difference being that our game, the one you live and breathe, can benefit from having another tier full of more Canadians trying to make it to the next level.

Why worry about what smaller city fans think of a half or more empty stadium if it's attended and contributing to the Canada footy landscape. It's happening already in Edmonton and Ottawa and both those cities have supporter groups that are building something for the culture.

Why would you want to deny that to at least a dozen if not more smaller cities in the Country?

[Fort York Redcoat]

The Argos have always shared a stadium with a team. It's kinda sad because they could never support themselves to own a stadium.


Who did the Argos share Exhibition Stadium with prior to the Blue Jays moving in 1977?

https://static1.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/Here+you+go+_6ccee5e46571afd2a909e2dfb05149cb.jpg

Sounds like the Golden age for the team from '59 to '77. 12 Grey Cups, too. Wonder if BMO will hold that many. Never saw Argos there but I did see the Jays in the early '80's.

SO

The Argos have never had their own stadium but there WAS a time they didn't share with another TEAM.

[Enterprise Captain]

https://static1.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/Here+you+go+_6ccee5e46571afd2a909e2dfb05149cb.jpg
http://aggressivecomix.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/spock_smile.jpg

[SoccMan2]

The Toronto Blizzard of the old NASL played there from 1979 to 1983 they shared the the stadium with the Jays and Argos.

[Wagner]

Pretty hilarious.
the Argos just called me pitching season tix at BMO.
I bought an Argo Flex Pack in 2005, bought Grey Cup Tix.
I haven't paid for an argos ticket since TFC came into existence.

Anyways, i got the sense the sales guy was gripping.
I didn't let on that I do work for the RPB, so obviously a TFC guy.
I kind of played dumb.
I said stuff like I thought it was a bad move, that the Argos were the impetus for the construction of the SkyDome.

I said how the fall weather by the lake isn't ideal.
He countered with stuff about there will be some summer day games, which will be good for drinking beer.

I said i'm not that down with the CFL anymore.
He countered that if will be an event to be down there.

if they are using Season Ticket holder lists from 2005, things can't be going amazingly.

[eustacchio]

They are definitely gripping if they're using eleven-year-old legacy data to get people to buy tickets.

Reminds me of the time I got a call from Rogers trying to sell me a cable package. When I said I didn't want cable he asked, "So, what do you do, read books?"

I said yes, and then he followed it up with, "We have Book TV." I laughed so hard.

[Ivy]

They are definitely gripping if they're using eleven-year-old legacy data to get people to buy tickets.

Reminds me of the time I got a call from Rogers trying to sell me a cable package. When I said I didn't want cable he asked, "So, what do you do, read books?"

I said yes, and then he followed it up with, "We have Book TV." I laughed so hard.

Book TV LOL. That HAS to be the biggest waste of electricity, ever.

[OgtheDim]

http://i.imgur.com/pDEwba4.png


Does anybody think people buy into sections like this?


.


That was March 1st.

Today

Same Section


http://i.imgur.com/SiS5qHR.jpg


As far as I can figure, they've sold 25 seats in that section in 4 weeks. Better then I thought when I first looked at it but......hardly hot cakes.

[East York]

They are just over 13,000 as of yesterday.

[OgtheDim]

Not bad for a team doing less then 10K the last few seasons. But, far from the "we are going to sell out every game" talk of some of the gridiron only people.

Of note, when I went to look at Ti-Cat season tickets today (the impetus that got me thinking back to this), they said all of one side was unavailable. Not sure I trust that either.

[Wagner]

Not bad for a team doing less then 10K the last few seasons. But, far from the "we are going to sell out every game" talk of some of the gridiron only people.

Of note, when I went to look at Ti-Cat season tickets today (the impetus that got me thinking back to this), they said all of one side was unavailable. Not sure I trust that either.

it is true.
People love their Ti-cats.
Hamilton has a lot of civic pride.
also, really good tailgating at Scott Park.

[OgtheDim]

Oh, I believe they have sold a boat load of season tickets in Hamilton. I just don't trust a ticket map that says one whole side of the field is unavailable - that's not how life works.

[Onyx]

That was March 1st.

Today

Same Section





As far as I can figure, they've sold 25 seats in that section in 4 weeks. Better then I thought when I first looked at it but......hardly hot cakes.

looks like our usual attendance in the eastside upper deck.
Does it suck to sit up there? i guess sun in your eyes is a factor for many people. Roofs might help with that.

[Red CB Toronto]

looks like our usual attendance in the eastside upper deck.
Does it suck to sit up there? i guess sun in your eyes is a factor for many people. Roofs might help with that.

The new upper east stand it dam far up, when I went up to visit a buddy in town from NYC, a NYCFC supporter in the away section, it was quite the hike , a pretty steep walk up. I would not want to be up there on a regular basis.

[Eastend]

Not bad for a team doing less then 10K the last few seasons. But, far from the "we are going to sell out every game" talk of some of the gridiron only people.

Of note, when I went to look at Ti-Cat season tickets today (the impetus that got me thinking back to this), they said all of one side was unavailable. Not sure I trust that either.

Could be they sell the TV view side first. Make it appear full.

[eustacchio]

Could be they sell the TV view side first. Make it appear full.

They absolutely would do that = using best available does not pick the best available seats, it picks the seats that they want to sell next.

[bgnewf]

If you ARE a TFC season seat holder (me thinks you must be) my guess is that they are calling you from that list instead of from a decade old list of leads for the Argos.

If anyone from 'the Argos' calls me about tickets the rant they will get from me in return will make their telephone melt into their desk.

[deltox]

i think i looked at ticket prices for my seat for argos. they were double...and for half the games. did anybody else see anything like that ?

[Wagner]

If you ARE a TFC season seat holder (me thinks you must be) my guess is that they are calling you from that list instead of from a decade old list of leads for the Argos.

If anyone from 'the Argos' calls me about tickets the rant they will get from me in return will make their telephone melt into their desk.

When I was called, the salesman specifically referenced that I was a past SSH. And I only did that in 2005.

[OgtheDim]

i think i looked at ticket prices for my seat for argos. they were double...and for half the games. did anybody else see anything like that ?

My seat in 221 is $150 less for an Argo season ticket.

[boozilla]

As long as there are no lines on the turf and the field is playable , I see no problem. In reality, BMO field was always a venue and never built to be a soccer shrine.

[jazzy]

http://www.canadianracer.com/cne/mods1.jpg
Neat , I saw a few later races there and Pinecrest especially as a kid .....also several music acts of course , as well as the 'ahem' Argos . As an earlier Argos fan , I says all the old greats , I still hate that they are inevitably leaching our venue away from us .

[Fort York Redcoat]

As long as there are no lines on the turf and the field is playable , I see no problem. In reality, BMO field was always a venue and never built to be a soccer shrine.

And yet was on its way to being one before the present changes. Glad you have no problems with that reality.

[OgtheDim]

And yet was on its way to being one before the present changes. Glad you have no problems with that reality.

I agree it isn't going to be a soccer specific shrine. And after a look down around the place today, BMO is going to be something unique that we will call ours. There is something about that roof/canopy/umbrella that just will tell people "This is where Toronto plays" as against what it was before, "This is where we play - yes we know it looks like a high school stadium in Texas."

The place is developing character. I wish it didn't take all the other events to get MLSE to spend the money to make it so. But, its where my team plays and for now, that's good enough.

As ronzilla said, just don't ruin the pitch.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I agree it isn't going to be a soccer specific shrine. And after a look down around the place today, BMO is going to be something unique that we will call ours. There is something about that roof/canopy/umbrella that just will tell people "This is where Toronto plays" as against what it was before, "This is where we play - yes we know it looks like a high school stadium in Texas."

The place is developing character. I wish it didn't take all the other events to get MLSE to spend the money to make it so. But, its where my team plays and for now, that's good enough.

As ronzilla said, just don't ruin the pitch.

I had and have no issue with hoping the pitch isn't ruined. My hope doesn't go very far but a touch further than my trust that "they got this".

I'm not going to shit on people wanting to imprint on the new stadium. Go for it. Make it feel like home.

My problem is the use of the phrase never gunna be a soccer shrine. Unless one is the ultimate cynic when seeing the opposite actually happening I can't see why one wouldn't have hoped the next step was taken in SSS.

I enjoyed your pronoun usage in your post above: "Toronto" now, "We" before. Can't argue with that, Og.

[boozilla]

I said that it was never built to be a shrine (Brenabeu, Allianz Arena, San Siro, etc.). Not that that is was "never gunna be".
You may confuse my desire for football aesthetics for cynicism.
I just had hoped for an expansion vision that at least, architecturally referenced those arenas over an after-thought Franken-stadium.
At least it's not SkyDome-bad and should be fun and way louder.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I said that it was never built to be a shrine (Brenabeu, Allianz Arena, San Siro, etc.). Not that that is was "never gunna be".
You may confuse my desire for football aesthetics for cynicism.
I just had hoped for an expansion vision that at least, architecturally referenced those arenas over an after-thought Franken-stadium.
At least it's not SkyDome-bad and should be fun and way louder.

Understood and couldn't agree more. If this ownership could've known what the first years returns would be like we may've got a RB Arena or Rio Tinto. Visiting those stadia makes me green with envy.

[james]

Understood and couldn't agree more. If this ownership could've known what the first years returns would be like we may've got a RB Arena or Rio Tinto. Visiting those stadia makes me green with envy.

Red Bulls stadium looks awesome and best in the League by far, Rio Tinto?...I personally haven't been to it in person, looking at it on TV and pictures, it looks decent, one of the better MLS style specific model stadiums that a lot of teams built across MLS (example : Colorado, Chicago, FC Dallas, Philly, Columbus), but Id prefer the look of LA, Kansas City, Portland, Houston, even Montreal maybe and probably Toronto's once I see the roofs all completed!!

Toronto will be a bit funky looking with the odd stands and roofs, but in a way it makes it character like some England grounds that have odd and unique stadiums built at different time periods and phases. Toronto and Portland will have the most unique stadiums in MLS I would say!

[Fort York Redcoat]

Red Bulls stadium looks awesome and best in the League by far, Rio Tinto?...I personally haven't been to it in person, looking at it on TV and pictures, it looks decent, one of the better MLS style specific model stadiums that a lot of teams built across MLS (example : Colorado, Chicago, FC Dallas, Philly, Columbus), but Id prefer the look of LA, Kansas City, Portland, Houston, even Montreal maybe and probably Toronto's once I see the roofs all completed!!

Toronto will be a bit funky looking with the odd stands and roofs, but in a way it makes it character like some England grounds that have odd and unique stadiums built at different time periods and phases. Toronto and Portland will have the most unique stadiums in MLS I would say!

I don't dispute any of those stadiums look but Chicago. While it was efficient the aesthetic wasn't all that original to inspire envy. Really I just took the 2 renos that were around our inception. Montreal has done so well with their reno.

[greatwhitenorf]

Boldly bringing in a professional rugby league operation to Lamport Stadium certainly makes one wonder if it's inevitable we'll see rugby games at BMO Field should the Wolfpack ever earn promotion to Super League.

Or will we see Lamport re-furbished to a sufficient level that the Argos can move there to a more suitable stadium sharing arrangement. MLSE stadium ops veep Bob Hunter is running the show at Lamport.

[Red CB Toronto]

Boldly bringing in a professional rugby league operation to Lamport Stadium certainly makes one wonder if it's inevitable we'll see rugby games at BMO Field should the Wolfpack ever earn promotion to Super League.

Or will we see Lamport re-furbished to a sufficient level that the Argos can move there to a more suitable stadium sharing arrangement. MLSE stadium ops veep Bob Hunter is running the show at Lamport.

While I do agree BMO Field will come into play for the Wolf Pack if they move up to the Super League eventually, there is nothing practical about it for an Argos move to Lamport, just not enough space there, with King Street just a few feet away. The footprint that would be required is just not there.

[OgtheDim]

Lamport can't be built up beyond its current footprint.


I actually like RL as a form of entertainment- its genetic what can I say - but I can't see it outgrowing Lamport. Far more likely to fail then flourish, unfortunately.

[Red CB Toronto]

Lamport can't be built up beyond its current footprint.


I actually like RL as a form of entertainment- its genetic what can I say - but I can't see it outgrowing Lamport. Far more likely to fail then flourish, unfortunately.

At the third division level they are starting at I agree, but if they build a team that eventually earns a promotion to the Super League, Lamport would be too limiting, and on the small side compared to other stadiums in the league.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I can't believe a team that will have so much travel cost will be playing out of Lamport. Hardly identifies with an international league. Whatever, if they stay at Lamport it's better for TFC but I don't see any other outcome but Multisport turf starting next year at BMO opening the door for every team to play there.

But let's wait and see...

[greatwhitenorf]

Lamport Stadium can most certainly be expanded and substantially re-furbished. The existing stands would have to come down and replaced with more modern and hospitable seating facilities. The footprint of land it sits on has plenty of room to build upon and there is a large parking area just south of it.

Bob Hunter of MLSE told a group of us at BMO Field last summer that they took on operational control of Lamport because it had 'some interesting possibilities'. There's already plans to expand parking near BMO Field on the south side of the Gardiner/train tracks. It wouldn't be building the Aswan Dam to add some expanded crossing points at the foot of Atlantic Ave., leaving fans with a comfortable stroll over to Lamport and maximizing revenue from the re-built parking areas.

Rugby is growing steadily in popularity in high schools, with it and lacrosse replacing football in many instances as the contact sports of choice. Given the fading fortunes of the CFL in Toronto, it could make great sense someday to put them and rugby in the same stadium and again give soccer priority at BMO, where the sport could plausibly provide more than 35 games each season. For now, we'll wait and see how rugby takes hold.

[OgtheDim]

Nobody plays Rugby League in school.

I like Rugby League - its all about gaining territory slowly but surely. But, its got no base in this city at all.

[Red CB Toronto]

Nobody plays Rugby League in school.

I like Rugby League - its all about gaining territory slowly but surely. But, its got no base in this city at all.

Rugby has drawn well at BMO in the past, the National team has an upcoming match in June at BMO Field. I have also noticed in the past Canada has played at Lamport, so it should be interesting to see how the sport grows in this city.

[Onyx]

Rugby has drawn well at BMO in the past, the National team has an upcoming match in June at BMO Field. I have also noticed in the past Canada has played at Lamport, so it should be interesting to see how the sport grows in this city.

Again, this is league style rugby (NRL) .. heal-backs and guys must get 10yds back. doubt it would ever get big enough outside Australia-polynesian countries to have BMO size crowd.

Union style rugby (traditional rugby with scrums and rucks) -- big props and tiny wingers this what has/is been played at BMO at national team level

[OgtheDim]

Again, this is league style rugby (NRL) .. heal-backs and guys must get 10yds back. doubt it would ever get big enough outside Australia-polynesian countries to have BMO size crowd.


League comes from the North. Mostly now its followed along the M62 but it did used to stretch up to God's own country in Furness and still has outposts up there.

Those Aussies borrowed it later. :)

[mook-life]

Nobody plays Rugby League in school.

I like Rugby League - its all about gaining territory slowly but surely. But, its got no base in this city at all.

Rugby was pretty big in highschool when I went 10 years ago...

[OgtheDim]

Rugby league is a VERY VERY different game.

No high school plays that format.

[Wagner]

Rugby league is a VERY VERY different game.

No high school plays that format.

this.

google...difference Rugby League Union

they are different games.

everything around here, is Union rugby.
High schools, universities, the local teams (oakville crusaders, toronto dragons, etc)

[nfitz]

What kind of attendance have the national team had for Rugby League at Lamport?

The chief difference I noticed in Toronto between League and Union, is that the national team for Union advertised in the newspaper, and League advertised on hydro poles near Lamport.

[T-boy]

The rugby league venture is bizarre in so many ways. The league they are entering have some teams with 5 men and a dog watching (your kids u-10 scrimmage games probably have more people watching). Flying whole teams to another continent where there is no guarantee of anybody watching is very odd. They are going to lose thousands on flying people to Toronto alone, without any other costs being factored in. So this is no more than a marketing ploy to try and expand the popularity of rugby league, there is no way this is a money making venture in any form.

[Red CB Toronto]

What kind of attendance have the national team had for Rugby League at Lamport?

The chief difference I noticed in Toronto between League and Union, is that the national team for Union advertised in the newspaper, and League advertised on hydro poles near Lamport.

They drawn in the area of 7K for a national team match.

[OgtheDim]

They drawn in the area of 7K for a national team match.

For Rugby League at Lamport? Paint me skeptical. I've been offered free tickets for that on a number of occasions.

[Areathrasher]

For Rugby League at Lamport? Paint me skeptical. I've been offered free tickets for that on a number of occasions.

Yep, those games were papered as hell. They would give out free tickets at the Canada Union games at BMO.

Friends that lived in Liberty Village at the time got free tickets from promo people on the streets.

[mr k]

I have seen highlights on Sportsnet for Canada playing rugby league at Lamport against teams such as Jamaica & US. It appears there is a regular summer series against countries in our region. And Lamport has looked about at 80% full.

Rugby league is closer to our Canadian football than rugby union. So, it can gain some following if people can figure out that it isn't the same as rugby union. But there is no grassroots following - everyone plays rugby union in Canada and now sevens since it is Olympics.

[burlington Red]

Part time div 2 rugby league players getting their airfares paid to come and play a game in Toronto. Good luck The Local bar staff trying to tell them they can't turn on TFC games on tv lol

[portu]

Nobody plays Rugby League in school.

I like Rugby League - its all about gaining territory slowly but surely. But, its got no base in this city at all.
As a high school student I'm telling you rugby is a popular sport to play once you get outta the city

[Red CB Toronto]

Checkers vs. Chess, League vs. Union, the difference between the two codes of Rugby.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRUHxGwv_VY

[OgtheDim]

As a high school student I'm telling you rugby is a popular sport to play once you get outta the city

And as others have pointed out, they are not playing rugby league.

[Onyx]

i assume in north america CFL and NFL somehow evolved from League rugby over here ... heel-back eventually replaced with a snap, scrimmage upon tackles, games probably looked very similar until introduction of one forward pass and helmets in 1930s.

Thats why we have Union rugby in school and league rugby eventually became CFL football here.

[james]

i assume in north america CFL and NFL somehow evolved from League rugby over here ... heel-back eventually replaced with a snap, scrimmage upon tackles, games probably looked very similar until introduction of one forward pass and helmets in 1930s.

Thats why we have Union rugby in school and league rugby eventually became CFL football here.


something along those lines...football was also called Rugby-Football before it eventually was just Football.

[zeelaw]

i assume in north america CFL and NFL somehow evolved from League rugby over here ... heel-back eventually replaced with a snap, scrimmage upon tackles, games probably looked very similar until introduction of one forward pass and helmets in 1930s.

Thats why we have Union rugby in school and league rugby eventually became CFL football here.
Inverting the Pyramid has a good chapter about the evolution of the two sports.

[BelfastBoy]

something along those lines...football was also called Rugby-Football before it eventually was just Football.

The Grey Cup still has rugby-football inscribed on the trophy..

[Fort York Redcoat]

As a high school student I'm telling you rugby is a popular sport to play once you get outta the city

But Union or League??? And how many high schoolers will make it down to Lamport for a game with different rules?

[Red CB Toronto]

But Union or League??? And how many high schoolers will make it down to Lamport for a game with different rules?

I heard from a guy down the street that Canadian soccer has larger nets ( :

[molenshtain]

As a high school student I'm telling you rugby is a popular sport to play once you get outta the city

It's pretty popular inside the city too, at least at some of the bigger predominantly white schools like Lawrence Park, North Toronto, Northern, Leaside etc. I'd say it's pretty similiar to football in terms of popularity at those schools.

[nfitz]

It's pretty popular inside the city too, at least at some of the bigger predominantly white schools like Lawrence Park, North Toronto, Northern, Leaside etc. I'd say it's pretty similiar to football in terms of popularity at those schools.Over 30 years ago in Montreal, the high schools played rubgy (not sure which flavour), and no football program. The equipment costs for football even then had eliminated the sport sometime in the 1970s - long belong the Allouettes folded.

[greatwhitenorf]

The Toronto Wolfpack will be playing at least one game per season at BMO Field. More if they work their way up to Super League. This being dished out in the Raptors suites with sushi and and an insouciant Sauvignon Blanc.

There's also a decent chance that MLSE, who have operational control over Lamport Stadium, will look to renovate that old dump if rugby looks to have long-term legs. If that happened, it would make so much sense to merge rugby and the Argonots into one stadium and let soccer have the other exclusively.

[Areathrasher]

The Toronto Wolfpack will be playing at least one game per season at BMO Field. More if they work their way up to Super League. This being dished out in the Raptors suites with sushi and and an insouciant Sauvignon Blanc.

There's also a decent chance that MLSE, who have operational control over Lamport Stadium, will look to renovate that old dump if rugby looks to have long-term legs. If that happened, it would make so much sense to merge rugby and the Argonots into one stadium and let soccer have the other exclusively.

The Wolfpack wouldn't disclose who makes up their ownership group to Neil Davidson of the Canadian Press. MLSE involved?

[Pint]

I would be surprised if MLSE or one of the ownership groups weren't involved.

[eustacchio]

But Union or League??? And how many high schoolers will make it down to Lamport for a game with different rules?

As many who attend CFL games. :hide:

[Fort York Redcoat]

As many who attend CFL games. :hide:

Wearing CFL gear...

[OgtheDim]

Wearing CFL gear...

Wearing NFL more like it....

[Fort York Redcoat]

Wearing NFL more like it....

Indeed. My point. The comparison can be made tomorrow but Messi and Ronaldo don't come from the same league...

[barticusz]

https://youtu.be/cH6aRQLghgs

Check this link out on your phones... This technology is awesome.

[greatwhitenorf]

https://youtu.be/cH6aRQLghgs

Check this link out on your phones... This technology is awesome.

That's what having a sponsor like Ricoh gets you. Shot on their cute 360 degree view Theta camera. Delightful way to dump $500.

The visual equivalent of liqueur-filled chocolates. One is interesting. A box full? Not so much.

[GBV]

sheesh

http://slam.canoe.com/Slam/Football/CFL/Toronto/2016/06/07/22640553.html (http://slam.canoe.com/Slam/Football/CFL/Toronto/2016/06/07/22640553.html)

[OgtheDim]

Meh...

pretentious basketball guy (like who calls themselves in their bio "Probably Toronto's most knowledgeable basketball columnist"?!?!!) who also covers CFL whines about existence of soccer.

[Justin10000]

Didn't even bother to read past the first paragraph. Pure clickbait.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Skipping it. Trolling the week of their first intrusion...

[DIEHARDTFC]

It’s not likely that one of those torrential downpours breaks out, which is too bad because it would have opened up such a can of worms among many in soccer, those entitled, selfish, insecure souls who remain livid at football, the North American version, occupying their playpen by the lake.

What a fucking douche

[gmacpheetfc]

Looking at the pre season tickets available on ticket master can we assume availability has been altered? otherwise they're pretty close to a sellout...?

[Fort York Redcoat]

What a fucking douche

So already he's hoping for damage to the shared "playpen". Not much sense.

[OgtheDim]

Looking at the pre season tickets available on ticket master can we assume availability has been altered? otherwise they're pretty close to a sellout...?

That's not close...and yes its been altered...and yes its a preseason so a bit of papering will be going on. I look at the second game, the one one vs Montreal to judge real sales - whole blocks supposedly sold and whole blocks in the same sections not.


Like everybody, including TFC, they are holding stuff back - its what event sellers do now.

[CowTipper]

Drove past BMO today going west on Lakeshore. What I think used to be the Wall Of Honour to south of the broadcast booth was cladded in blue and said "Argos Football" or something to that extent. RIP BMO

[OgtheDim]

Drove past BMO today going west on Lakeshore. What I think used to be the Wall Of Honour to south of the broadcast booth ...


The Wall of Honour which was always under the broadcast booth was moved months ago. Its coming back, "in a more appropriate way", we've been told.

If they leave up something like that in that spot which says Argos, I'd be surprised.

[Pint]

The wall of honour should really be at the back of the south concourse or outside the stadium the way legends row has been constructed.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

The wall of honour should really be at the back of the south concourse or outside the stadium the way legends row has been constructed.

Any idea what happened to the wall with all the fans names on it?

[glaze]

Noticed the blue walls up last night, I'm sure it's temporary, same as how the Giants and jets share an nfl stadium.
A permanent fixture, or huge argo banners in the concourse would be far more irritating.
The main concern of course is how the field holds up. And how the lines will be magically gone without a trace in time for our next game

[OgtheDim]

FYI

There will be no TV coverage of the Argo preseason game.

Weather tomorrow indicates rain in the morning until about 9 and then sunshine the rest of the day. The field is unlikely to be all that wet.

Fully expect joyous football media to ascend upon BMO and go on about how great this all is. (face it, for the Argo fans, this is heaven - we know how nice BMO is)

There will be pics floating around the internet for much of tomorrow evening about the grass and about lines.

[glaze]

Yeah, it helps that bell owns the team now, media have really been pushing argos more than previous years.
A slew of pics went out on twitter showing the field, they kept one promise so far, no logos on the field,

[Yohan]

Where will Argos hang up all their cup banners?

[OgtheDim]

Where will Argos hang up all their cup banners?

Not sure but they do replace the flags on the South with all Argo flags.


FWIW



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yle9s2z3ytg


The offset of the 55 not being at the centre of the seating is a little weird but that stadium is hard to make look bad.

[SoccMan2]

Give me a break BMO looks like your typical CFL stadium , look at Calgary's stadium , Winnepegs old stadium and Saskatchewan's old stadium and I can't remember what Edmonton's old stadium looked like before their present stadium Commonwealth stadium was built in the 1980's but I'm sure it looked line all the others, mainly two big two tiered grandstands with some kind of canopies or roofs and pretty open end zones , and now seeing BMO with it's football lines and football posts this is exactly what it looks like, your typical 1960's design CFL stadium lol ! Welcome home Argos we missed you, what the hell took you so long!

[OgtheDim]

Give me a break BMO looks like your typical CFL stadium , look at Calgary's stadium , Winnepegs old stadium and Saskatchewan's old stadium and I can't remember what Edmonton's old stadium looked like before their present stadium Commonwealth stadium was built in the 1980's ...

SERIOUSLY?!?!?!

Does this look like BMO?

http://media.winnipegfreepress.com/images/aerialspov25.jpg


That is one ugly assed stadium.

I could plug in pics of Calgary and Edmonton (built in the 70's and now around longer then Clarke stadium before it), both of which don't have a roof or canopy.

Or the old Empire stadium in BC, with a roof on one side, like the old Frank Clair in Ottawa.

Or the New TD Stadium in Ottawa with a roof on one side.

Or TMH, with no roof at all, which as much as I enjoy the atmosphere is one of the most boring stadiums in the league architecturally and looks NOTHING like BMO.


Come on, complain about the Argos being in BMO but BMO is a unique field within Canada. The closest thing to it is actually Winnipeg's newest stadium.

[OgtheDim]

http://i.cbc.ca/1.1555826.1379046929%21/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/16x9_620/hi-investors-group-field-04.jpg

[OgtheDim]

If you all want Canadian stadium porn, look at the new stadium potash built in Regina.


http://www.newmosaicstadium.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/10.jpg

[ensco]

BMO looks great.

Like looking at pics of your hot ex GF on her wedding day

[SoccMan2]

Winnepeg's and Sasketchewan's new stadiums are much more enclosed looking and they don't have any sides without stands like BMO's north end, and those two little temporary stands they now put during TFC games don't count. The very least BMO could have come out looking like those two but it doesn't sorry . An interesting fact about Sasketchewan's new stadium , I guess no soccer will be played there in terms of Canadian national teams or any kind of international club friendlies because the football lines are stitched into the turf lol, so they can't be removed, shows you how popular soccer is in those parts lol, I guess the stadium will still be profitable with other stuff besides CFL football , the other stuff will just not be any soccer lol.

[OgtheDim]

Hmm....crowd looks familiar.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CksjaXoVAAADleW.jpg

[Redcoe15]

Yuck! What an eyesore. :prrr:

[OgtheDim]

Oh the learning curve


https://twitter.com/BMOField/status/741739298031075329


&

https://twitter.com/paulosenra/status/741739849070333952

[OgtheDim]

And apparently "If you build it, they will come" still doesn't work


https://twitter.com/sportsnag/status/741739444848332800



Oh, and I like this point about why TSN didn't broadcasting this game on TV when they are covering others

https://twitter.com/TobiasVaughn/status/741739559399084032

[SoccMan2]

I know it's only a preseason game but from the pictures I'm seeing not a big crowd, however, you would think that it being the first CFL football game ever at BMO and with all the hype about the Argos at BMO that there would have been a a lot bigger crowd , and remember if your an Argo fan you are only going to get what 10 home games to see the Argos there this season , it's not like they play so many home games so even a preseason game should have a big crowd especially when it's a new stadium and it's the first game ever at the new stadium for the team, anyways I still think they will do better attendance wise at BMO but with so few home games in a CFL season and this being the first game at BMO you would think the place would have been jammed. On a side note , Duane Rolins posted a picture of the small crowd at BMO for the Argo game with the headline " they are clearly saved", sorry could not resist.

[Onyx]

Argo fans hate the eastside as well

whats with everyone --- i love the sun and putting on the shades

[Kaz]

Argo fans hate the eastside as well

whats with everyone --- i love the sun and putting on the shades

I love the East side the ticket prices are a touch expensive.

I will make at least game this season no matter what (it is a 6 hour round trip I'm not going if they are looking poor and the tickets are a touch expensive.. but I'll make one game no matter what..)

The East side has a fairly nice view.. and I like the upper concessions. It is a great time. Really want to see it with the roof.

[OgtheDim]

Argo fans hate the eastside as well
...

Where did you see that? The vast majority of tweets were along the lines of "OH MY GAWD THIS IS SO NICE!"


*********

Announced attendance - 16,168

Looked a tad less then that from the pics - I'd call it 12K.

[Globetrotter]

it's pre-season CFL... 12K is impressive.

[Onyx]

Where did you see that? The vast majority of tweets were along the lines of "OH MY GAWD THIS IS SO NICE!"


*********

Announced attendance - 16,168

Looked a tad less then that from the pics - I'd call it 12K.

just looking at the pictures - westside was full and eastside was empty, pretty similar to TFC games

I love the east side, especially post-reno
... its time to give the eaststand a hug ... and make it feel better

[BelfastBoy]

Was at the game today, don't think anyone has to worry about a CFL renaissance. Prolly a sellout for the opener with the Hammer but after that.. the Boatmen are on their last hope with BMO.

[Auzzy]

just looking at the pictures - westside was full and eastside was empty, pretty similar to TFC games


Umm, I disagree.

East side did not look like TFC games: https://t.co/49A1uVQ8eo
Or: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CksrZc3W0AA-CQJ.jpg
Or: http://3downnation.com/2016/06/11/good-bad-hamiltons-preseason-loss-argos/

West side not close to full either; south much less full than for TFC games: https://twitter.com/Berger_BYTES/status/741758711820132352/photo/1

Yes I know it's pre-season, but there was a big attempt at hype before the first-ever game at BMO Field. Tons of free tickets available to schools & others. 10 free tickets per SSH.

I'm sure their real home opener will be a very solid draw. After that, we will see, especially when the shiny newness has worn off, or when the fall weather gets crappy.

[Yagbod]

Was at the game today, don't think anyone has to worry about a CFL renaissance. Prolly a sellout for the opener with the Hammer but after that.. the Boatmen are on their last hope with BMO.

So, the pitch afterwards?

[BelfastBoy]

So, the pitch afterwards?
The CFL lines were not prominently painted on, easier to wash off. The grass appeared to hold up alright after one game. We have a rugby game coming up too -mid season will be a better indicator of how the pitch will be impacted.

[Kaz]

it's pre-season CFL... 12K is impressive.

Is it though?

Blue Bombers had 23k for their first preseaon game.

The Argos have always been hit or miss. in 2012 35k was announced, 2011,2010 12k was announced, 2009 18k and 2008 21k. The last 5 years the Argos had pre-season in Rogers Centre. It is actually kinda average

[Heart of Stone]

Move them to Downsview... or Barrie.

[OgtheDim]

The CFL lines were not prominently painted on, easier to wash off. The grass appeared to hold up alright after one game. We have a rugby game coming up too -mid season will be a better indicator of how the pitch will be impacted.

As that game wasn't broadcast (every CFL regular season game is), they didn't have to do any heavy painting. Lets see if the do any logos for their home opener.

[Alixir]

Move them to Downsview... or Barrie. or Nunavut

[Fort York Redcoat]

Welcome home Argos we missed you, what the hell took you so long!

They were waiting for others to solve their problems. Wonder what the turnout would be at Downsview in a double blue stadium.

[ensco]

I wouldn't rush to judgment here.

80% (90%?) of Toronto sports fans don't even know the Argos are at BMO yet.

If you had told me 5 years ago that we'd sign a significant Juventus Italian player in his prime, who would go on to set the league scoring record ... and that still, 90% of Italian Canadian soccer fans don't care and won't come, I'd have said that could not be...

Nobody knows nothing.

Sports and pop culture operate in bizarre territory, and I defy anyone to predict what can or will be "cool", or when that will happen.

[GabrielHurl]

The last 5 years the Argos had pre-season in Rogers Centre. It is actually kinda average

2013, 2014 and 2015 pre-season games have all been at Varsity Stadium - not Rogers Centre

[C.Ronaldo]

I wouldn't rush to judgment here.

80% (90%?) of Toronto sports fans don't even know the Argos are at BMO yet.

If you had told me 5 years ago that we'd sign a significant Juventus Italian player in his prime, who would go on to set the league scoring record ... and that still, 90% of Italian Canadian soccer fans don't care and won't come, I'd have said that could not be...

Nobody knows nothing.

Sports and pop culture operate in bizarre territory, and I defy anyone to predict what can or will be "cool", or when that will happen.

My mom says I'm cool.

[ManUtd4ever]

The Argos will never recapture their glory days in this city, but they don't have to attract 45,000 fans anymore either.

I think they have a decent chance at averaging 20,000 fans a game playing at BMO Field, which should be enough for the franchise to stay afloat.

[Kaz]

2013, 2014 and 2015 pre-season games have all been at Varsity Stadium - not Rogers Centre

I meant those were the last 5 years that the Argos played in Rogers. (2012, 2011, 2010, 2009, 2008 5 years)

[james]

The Argos will never recapture their glory days in this city, but they don't have to attract 45,000 fans anymore either.

I think they have a decent chance at averaging 20,000 fans a game playing at BMO Field, which should be enough for the franchise to stay afloat.

to be honest they only need to 30k for what 8 games a year? i think Argos will do well at BMO field. Don't under estimate there ticket sales. TFC have to sell 30k for about 17 home games, more games you have often mean harder to fill all the seats.

[OgtheDim]

Just an FYI - Argo capacity is 25K.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Just an FYI - Argo capacity is 25K.

Perfect for a weaker attended CFL team. Not ideal but enough to float. They've done it with so much less.

[OgtheDim]

Interesting bit of lack of news:

BMO Field Ops was all over making sure people saw them taking off the soccer lines right after the last TFC game in prep for the Argo game.


No pics only this tweet after Argo game

https://twitter.com/TFC_GroundsDept/status/742093123854209029

Anybody got a drone? :)

[Pint]

Interesting bit of lack of news:

BMO Field Ops was all over making sure people saw them taking off the soccer lines right after the last TFC game in prep for the Argo game.


No pics only this tweet after Argo game

https://twitter.com/TFC_GroundsDept/status/742093123854209029

Anybody got a drone? :)

I'm sure someone will be taking a stroll around BMO at some point in the next day or two.

[Red CB Toronto]

The BMO Pitch will be getting a real workout begining on Saturday. Will be interesting to see how it holds up.

June 18th Galaxy at TFC
June 21st - Whitecaps at TFC
June 23rd - Tiger-Cats at Argos
June 26th - Italy at Canada Rugby

[Onyx]

The BMO Pitch will be getting a real workout begining on Saturday. Will be interesting to see how it holds up.

June 18th Galaxy at TFC
June 21st - Whitecaps at TFC
June 23rd - Tiger-Cats at Argos
June 26th - Italy at Canada Rugby

doesn't really matter this time of year. The grass is very healthy, field is very dry and can withstand alot.
Its this volume in october/november that would be a concern.

[OgtheDim]

And...we have some info from the ground crew

https://twitter.com/TFC_GroundsDept/status/742852744906579969

[Pint]

From a first hand look the field looks good.

[Blizzard]

From a first hand look the field looks good.

After one game in dry weather, ya, it's probably fine but we'd know more if we could see the condition of the grass between the hash marks.

[Pint]

After one game in dry weather, ya, it's probably fine but we'd know more if we could see the condition of the grass between the hash marks.

Was in the building for a meeting yesterday from about 15 rows up on the west side it had no visible wear.

[Fort York Redcoat]

This thread is going to get pretty awesome..

Grass checks after every game but ours.

The Argos/etc. Grass Check Thread.

[Pint]

My mid week grass checking days are few and far between lol

As I was leaving BMO yesterday i did happen to see a couple people on roller blades, maybe we can assemble a mid week roller blade grass checking team?

[Yagbod]

Grass looked fine. The lines on the field, not so much.

There's a pic on my Twitter feed. I'd post it here but I keep forgetting how from my phone.

[Areathrasher]

Grass looked fine. The lines on the field, not so much.

There's a pic on my Twitter feed. I'd post it here but I keep forgetting how from my phone.

https://twitter.com/Yagbod/status/742919809403396098

Also, is the metal detector and no re-entry stuff 100% for next year or something they are considering?

[Kaz]

https://twitter.com/Yagbod/status/742919809403396098

Also, is the metal detector and no re-entry stuff 100% for next year or something they are considering?


It is possible that is from the spraying of them off leaving a grass mark. Once the pitch is preped for the game on saturday I would suspect it wouldn't be there.

[Red4ever]

enh, that's well inside the margin for error.

If the field gets wrecked or paint gets left on, that's when we should get angry.

[Yagbod]

https://twitter.com/Yagbod/status/742919809403396098

Also, is the metal detector and no re-entry stuff 100% for next year or something they are considering?

My impression was 100%, but you never know. Apparently the league gives them a years lead time on security measures. TFC knew about wanding and such a year in advance as well.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Grass looked fine. The lines on the field, not so much.

There's a pic on my Twitter feed. I'd post it here but I keep forgetting how from my phone.

Thanks for sharing (with Area's help of course ;))

This will be "good enough" for many.

I still stand on the side of "it never had to be less than it was".

[Canuck82]

I had a question about the revised capacity of BMO now that the north stands are gone. What is the official capacity for soccer now? I thought around 30k. I am curious as I am seeing various articles that state the Argos capacity is between 25k and 27k. How do they lose between 3 and 5k seats? The North end patio can't be that many? Are they tarping over sections?

[Pint]

I had a question about the revised capacity of BMO now that the north stands are gone. What is the official capacity for soccer now? I thought around 30k. I am curious as I am seeing various articles that state the Argos capacity is between 25k and 27k. How do they lose between 3 and 5k seats? The North end patio can't be that many? Are they tarping over sections?

i think its 28,122? and then you lose a few hundred across the front of the south as well for the blue guys.

[Kaz]

I had a question about the revised capacity of BMO now that the north stands are gone. What is the official capacity for soccer now? I thought around 30k. I am curious as I am seeing various articles that state the Argos capacity is between 25k and 27k. How do they lose between 3 and 5k seats? The North end patio can't be that many? Are they tarping over sections?


The patio apparently has tickets being sold for it too so they can officially claim a higher capacity. Argos have an official capacity of 26-27k TFC has 30k.

[Cas87]

I had a question about the revised capacity of BMO now that the north stands are gone. What is the official capacity for soccer now? I thought around 30k. I am curious as I am seeing various articles that state the Argos capacity is between 25k and 27k. How do they lose between 3 and 5k seats? The North end patio can't be that many? Are they tarping over sections?

First 5-6 rows of the south end are removed (7 sections = 750-1250 seats approx.)

North end Premium seats (250-500) plus patio (500-1000)

Gets pretty close to the change from TFC to Argos.

[OgtheDim]

FWIW

TFC MLS game Attendance so far (wiki)

30,025

24,748

30,262

26,252


Cup


22,143

[Cas87]

^^^

That's not bad for the league games considering there was a re-scheduled kick-off in there, a mid-week game and a game on a Saturday of a long weekend.

[Justin10000]

Honestly, I really had to look at the picture to see the lines. It's fine, IMO.

[Areathrasher]

It is possible that is from the spraying of them off leaving a grass mark. Once the pitch is preped for the game on saturday I would suspect it wouldn't be there.

Yea, let the grass grow a bit then mow it and it removes the residue? Something like that I think.

[Onyx]

I had a question about the revised capacity of BMO now that the north stands are gone. What is the official capacity for soccer now? I thought around 30k. I am curious as I am seeing various articles that state the Argos capacity is between 25k and 27k. How do they lose between 3 and 5k seats? The North end patio can't be that many? Are they tarping over sections?

Lets work this from two angles:

from seats lost:
They lost 2000-3000 in north side seats off 30,991 = lets say 2000 = 28991

from football capacity:
Argos have said capacity is 26500

These are the additional "soccer" seats






112
32


113
137


114
180


115
90


116
180


117
137


118
32














128
24


129
72


130
24


101
24


102
72


103
24







1028






26500 + 1028 = 27578


So, true capacity is somewhere between 27600 and 28900 seats.
30,226 is some number TL pulled out of his ass before he left.

[OgtheDim]

FWIW, Field seats on the West side are approximately 200.

[Onyx]

yeah, your right 192 of those.

27770 plus patio spots

[Fort York Redcoat]

Yea, let the grass grow a bit then mow it and it removes the residue? Something like that I think.

Even in the article with the groundskeep he freely mentions they have to trim it shorter than the standard for footy/"what he'd like". It won't be enough to hurt play but for anyone counting degrades in quality...

[GabrielHurl]

Looks like they are getting something similar to the King Club Patio http://www.argonauts.ca/2016/06/17/191169/



The SiriusXM Kickoff Show will be held in “The Shipyard,” the Argos’ new pre-game fan festival space located at the foot of Hotel X and in front of the Stanley Barracks at Exhibition Place. The outdoor festival area will serve BBQ food and drinks, including $4 beers, prior to every game at BMO Field this season. Spread across acres of licensed patio, The Shipyard will be a place for Argos fans to meet up before the game to eat, drink and socialize before heading into the stadium.
http://i.imgur.com/R4db0lQ.png

[OgtheDim]

Hmm....a bar around where the TSN crew will do their pregame show. What could go wrong?

[Still Kicking]

This ticks me off big time. It does not surprise me, but it ticks me off.

I used to smile at those on the RPB forum who railed against MLSE, but now I am railing too.

Face it, after 10 years TFC continues to be a crap product on television. You would never know that TFC are owned by two media conglomerates if you watched a broadcast. If soccer thrives in Canada, MLSE's two media owners see it as a happy accident, not something they want to foster.
Rogers/Sportnet wants Blue Jays as the summer sport, at the ball park and on tv at home.
Bell/TSN wants CFL football as the summer sport, at the ball park (now that they own the Argos) and especially on tv at home.


Is there enough CFL football fan demand for both this Shipyard area AND the Ontario Place parking lot tailgate? Just a little cute that they announced the tailgate area weeks before the Shipyard. Seems to me that the Shipyard is meant to be a broadcast backdrop for TSN pregame and postgame shows. Wow, looks like one big TSN promo for CFL to me.

Has something of this ilk EVER been done for TFC? Why do I miss Tim L. so much?

TFC needs an owner - I will be sending out linked-in messages to all of my billionaire friends. Except the Donald....

[mistercorporate]

This ticks me off big time. It does not surprise me, but it ticks me off.

I used to smile at those on the RPB forum who railed against MLSE, but now I am railing too.

Face it, after 10 years TFC continues to be a crap product on television. You would never know that TFC are owned by two media conglomerates if you watched a broadcast. If soccer thrives in Canada, MLSE's two media owners see it as a happy accident, not something they want to foster.
Rogers/Sportnet wants Blue Jays as the summer sport, at the ball park and on tv at home.
Bell/TSN wants CFL football as the summer sport, at the ball park (now that they own the Argos) and especially on tv at home.


Is there enough CFL football fan demand for both this Shipyard area AND the Ontario Place parking lot tailgate? Just a little cute that they announced the tailgate area weeks before the Shipyard. Seems to me that the Shipyard is meant to be a broadcast backdrop for TSN pregame and postgame shows. Wow, looks like one big TSN promo for CFL to me.

Has something of this ilk EVER been done for TFC? Why do I miss Tim L. so much?

TFC needs an owner - I will be sending out linked-in messages to all of my billionaire friends. Except the Donald....

What a weird over reaction, TFC is well supported and successful. We will average 27.5k per match this year and 30k next year. The Argos aren't even going to sellout their home opener at BMO Field on the 23rd even with half of the stands filled with Tigercats fans, their ticket sales are atrocious even if they get papered as hell.

[OgtheDim]

This ticks me off big time. It does not surprise me, but it ticks me off.

I used to smile at those on the RPB forum who railed against MLSE, but now I am railing too.

Face it, after 10 years TFC continues to be a crap product on television. You would never know that TFC are owned by two media conglomerates if you watched a broadcast. If soccer thrives in Canada, MLSE's two media owners see it as a happy accident, not something they want to foster.
Rogers/Sportnet wants Blue Jays as the summer sport, at the ball park and on tv at home.
Bell/TSN wants CFL football as the summer sport, at the ball park (now that they own the Argos) and especially on tv at home.


Is there enough CFL football fan demand for both this Shipyard area AND the Ontario Place parking lot tailgate? Just a little cute that they announced the tailgate area weeks before the Shipyard. Seems to me that the Shipyard is meant to be a broadcast backdrop for TSN pregame and postgame shows. Wow, looks like one big TSN promo for CFL to me.

.


TSN / Bell makes money off of the CFL. And as Bell owns the Argos, its in their subsidiary's best interest to make out like the Argos are the best/hottest/sweetest thing in town.

Thus the backdrop.

I note that they have to bribe people with cheap beer (like TFC does with its patio too).

I also note that both events are way over on the other side of the parking lot that they expect people to use. I'm still wondering what Argo fans are going to do the Wednesday night before the Indy when these things can't happen at all.

Then there are the two Ex dates when there will be NO parking around for the tailgate and the Shipyard is going to be hell to do security for.


This is hype.

[Ultra & Proud]

What a weird over reaction, TFC is well supported and successful. We will average 27.5k per match this year and 30k next year. The Argos aren't even going to sellout their home opener at BMO Field on the 23rd even with half of the stands filled with Tigercats fans, their ticket sales are atrocious even if they get papered as hell.
I agree with this. All will be told after this season. BMO will not be the revitalizing lifeline all the 'whoo whoo Argos CFL 4 Life' folks think it will be and then they will reassess everything to do with Argos at BMO.

I am sticking to my prediction that after the Leafs buy the tile system this winter that the Argos will roll out over field turf next year and it'll be just absolutely riddled with every and any advertising sponsors they can get. Save $$$ on field maintenance & gain advertising bucks.

[Still Kicking]

I agree that it is hype.
I do hope to flip the channel some night and see seagulls in their shipyard...
I agree that the Argos are not going to be cured by the BMO shift.
I understand that Bell/TSN make money off of their CFL coverage - does not mean that I have to like it when the hype hits...
I can paint the Canadian tv love for Jays and CFL as obstacles to TFC progress.

I can dream of new TFC ownership...in my lifetime

[Fort York Redcoat]

I agree with this. All will be told after this season. BMO will not be the revitalizing lifeline all the 'whoo whoo Argos CFL 4 Life' folks think it will be and then they will reassess everything to do with Argos at BMO.

I am sticking to my prediction that after the Leafs buy the tile system this winter that the Argos will roll out over field turf next year and it'll be just absolutely riddled with every and any advertising sponsors they can get. Save $$$ on field maintenance & gain advertising bucks.

That will cost more than just getting rid of the grass and it's never been done full time before.

Getting rid of the grass after its proven to have taken too much of a beating is easier than buying those tiles to possibly have to do the same thing the following year.

I agree that the Argos hype machine is already doing its best to lipstick the pig.

[Canary10]

Have the Argos made any announcement of their season ticket totals? I remember when TFC was selling tickets for season 1, they were announcing milestones for season tickets sold all time. Because, you know, they were actually selling a lot of them. I suspect the lack of announcements means Argo season tix sales aren't great.

[eustacchio]

TSN / Bell makes money off of the CFL. And as Bell owns the Argos, its in their subsidiary's best interest to make out like the Argos are the best/hottest/sweetest thing in town.

Thus the backdrop.

I note that they have to bribe people with cheap beer (like TFC does with its patio too).

I also note that both events are way over on the other side of the parking lot that they expect people to use. I'm still wondering what Argo fans are going to do the Wednesday night before the Indy when these things can't happen at all.

Then there are the two Ex dates when there will be NO parking around for the tailgate and the Shipyard is going to be hell to do security for.


This is hype.

I completely forgot about the Indy and Ex - so already the number of tailgates they can hold is down 30%

[Red CB Toronto]

I completely forgot about the Indy and Ex - so already the number of tailgates they can hold is down 30%

There tailgates are at Ontario Place so it really does not effect them.

[eustacchio]

There tailgates are at Ontario Place so it really does not effect them.

Probably not so much for the Ex days, but I doubt it would be successful with the entire place fenced off.

[OgtheDim]

There tailgates are at Ontario Place so it really does not effect them.

Ontario Place is going to cordon off extremely valuable Ex parking space for hours on end for an Argo tailgate that doesn't maximise that revenue? Paint me skeptical.

Regardless, why tailgate when you got free access to wander over to the Food building and eat some weird heart attack enducing creation?

[Onyx]

This ticks me off big time. It does not surprise me, but it ticks me off.

I used to smile at those on the RPB forum who railed against MLSE, but now I am railing too.

Face it, after 10 years TFC continues to be a crap product on television. You would never know that TFC are owned by two media conglomerates if you watched a broadcast. If soccer thrives in Canada, MLSE's two media owners see it as a happy accident, not something they want to foster.
Rogers/Sportnet wants Blue Jays as the summer sport, at the ball park and on tv at home.
Bell/TSN wants CFL football as the summer sport, at the ball park (now that they own the Argos) and especially on tv at home.


Is there enough CFL football fan demand for both this Shipyard area AND the Ontario Place parking lot tailgate? Just a little cute that they announced the tailgate area weeks before the Shipyard. Seems to me that the Shipyard is meant to be a broadcast backdrop for TSN pregame and postgame shows. Wow, looks like one big TSN promo for CFL to me.

Has something of this ilk EVER been done for TFC? Why do I miss Tim L. so much?

TFC needs an owner - I will be sending out linked-in messages to all of my billionaire friends. Except the Donald....

nothing is going to change until TFC stops drawing flies on TV. Only reason the games are on TV is we're owned by SN/TSN, otherwise they wouldn't be. Be happy with what you have and enjoy it. I assume MLSE will take from whatever works for Argos and bring it over to TFC game day production since its basically the same MLSE back office people working on these things.

[Onyx]

Ontario Place is going to cordon off extremely valuable Ex parking space for hours on end for an Argo tailgate that doesn't maximise that revenue? Paint me skeptical.

Regardless, why tailgate when you got free access to wander over to the Food building and eat some weird heart attack enducing creation?

agree during Ex, otherwise aren't these guys paying $30-$50 for 6 hours of parking.

[Enterprise Captain]

agree during Ex, otherwise aren't these guys paying $30-$50 for 6 hours of parking.
They are selling $30 tailgate passes for every Argos home game including during the Ex (http://www.argonauts.ca/tailgate-parking-passes/).

[Shakes McQueen]

https://twitter.com/Yagbod/status/742919809403396098

Also, is the metal detector and no re-entry stuff 100% for next year or something they are considering?

If THAT is what we have to live with, then I am fine with it. I had to really, really look at that picture to even see them. And that's before maintenance and prep for soccer.

The real question is whether it remains like that after the 10th time this year that it's been removed, of course. My concern has always been more focused on what condition the grass itself will be in, once the weather starts to turn.

[Berns]

Another factor driving season seat sales this year that hasn't been mentioned yet...the Grey Cup. For every 1 season seat you are guaranteed 2 Grey Cup tickets. Season seat price worth not paying secondary market price for Grey Cup.

[Auzzy]

nothing is going to change until TFC stops drawing flies on TV. Only reason the games are on TV is we're owned by SN/TSN, otherwise they wouldn't be. Be happy with what you have and enjoy it. I assume MLSE will take from whatever works for Argos and bring it over to TFC game day production since its basically the same MLSE back office people working on these things.

I agree overall, but it's also a bit of a chicken & egg situation. The TV stations do almost nothing to promote TFC viewership. No pre-game show; minimal exposure; hardly ever show up on the nightly highlights.

I haven't watched much CFL myself, but I've heard that the CFL broadcasts were pretty dour, with much less viewership, before TSN took over in a big way.

Not saying that they could easily make TFC a ratings winner, but they could definitely do more to promote viewership, considering MLSE/TFC is owned by two media conglomerates.

[Auzzy]

Even in the article with the groundskeep he freely mentions they have to trim it shorter than the standard for footy/"what he'd like". It won't be enough to hurt play but for anyone counting degrades in quality...

Are you sure about that? I'm definitely no fan of Argos at BMO, but what I remember reading: CFL likes the grass a bit longer; footy likes it a bit shorter. So when they cut off the extra bit after a CFL game, before a footy game, that also helps with the paint removal.

No?!

[eustacchio]

At this point, I'm fairly confident that the lines will not be a huge problem - particularly when it's been sunny and warm and dry. At the least, they will not be visible on TV - nobody likes to watch a game being played on the wrong field. I'd like to think that CFL fans wouldn't want a big circle in the middle of the CFL field either (though they have gaudy advertisements on their fields, don't they?).

I'm more curious what's going to happen to the field, including the lines, after it's rained during games and/or the time between.

[Prof]

What a weird over reaction, TFC is well supported and successful. We will average 27.5k per match this year and 30k next year. The Argos aren't even going to sellout their home opener at BMO Field on the 23rd even with half of the stands filled with Tigercats fans, their ticket sales are atrocious even if they get papered as hell.
Yes we are well supported by fooy fans, but as Still Kicking says in spite of TFC getting very little coverage on TV and often negative coverage by our local media. I would love to see pre and post game analysis of TFC and all MLS games on TSN just as they are dong for the Euros. This is the only way Tv ratings are going to improve. The amount of coverage for the Argos, Jays, leafs and Raptors compared to TFC is embarrassing.

[ag futbol]

I agree overall, but it's also a bit of a chicken & egg situation. The TV stations do almost nothing to promote TFC viewership. No pre-game show; minimal exposure; hardly ever show up on the nightly highlights.

I haven't watched much CFL myself, but I've heard that the CFL broadcasts were pretty dour, with much less viewership, before TSN took over in a big way.

Not saying that they could easily make TFC a ratings winner, but they could definitely do more to promote viewership, considering MLSE/TFC is owned by two media conglomerates.
I think VWFC has proven that there is a case for a modest TV audience for MLS games. That said their viewership is supported by: 1) consistent time slots 2) a more respectable product on the field over the years than TFC has managed. Heck, they've also been pretty progressive with SSH's, people really take to the club. I think TFC still suffers from Anselmi's prior mismanagement and their willingness to so quickly stick their hands as far down everyone's pockets as they could while the team was hot. Short term decision making at its worst.

[OgtheDim]

https://twitter.com/TFC_GroundsDept/status/744209673503465472

Looking OK but still can't tell.

[Fort York Redcoat]

https://twitter.com/TFC_GroundsDept/status/744209673503465472

Looking OK but still can't tell.

It will look worst from the zoomed out camera angle if their were faint lines. Which I doubt but yeah, first game, good weather, lots of healing time. Today isn't the test.