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jloome
02-05-2015, 03:23 PM
From Soccer By Ives today:
SAPUTO, IMPACT WORKING TO BOOST FAN INTEREST

Over the club’s three years in MLS, the Montreal Impact have quickly slid down the league’s attendance list. Entering 2015, team owner and president Joey Saputo worries they could slip even further.
Attendance in Montreal was down about 15 percent last year alone as the Impact struggled through a season that saw them finish at the bottom of the standings.

“If people are saying ‘Let’s see what kind of team we have before buying season tickets,’ I can say we did our part,” Saputo told the CBC (http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/joey-saputo-aims-to-bring-buzz-back-to-montreal-impact-1.2945435). “We changed the team.
“We saw what wasn’t working last year. We brought in 11 new players. The 12th player, our fans, is tougher to sign.”
With only about 5,000 season tickets sold, the Impact project that the club could place as low as 13th in MLS attendance this season. That’s a big departure 2012, when they broke into MLS and posted the third-highest attendance in the league.
“The disappointment is thinking we’d be more relevant in the city after three years,” Saputo said. “Either we missed the boat (in marketing) or we missed the boat totally in thinking this was a soccer market.”

Now, given that the team has been propped up for years -- well back into its A-league days -- by provincial support and mass ticket giveaways (I was told in the first few seasons as many as 6,000 per game), should he really be surprised?

It's Montreal. I lived in the eastern townships for several years and Montreal was our hangout; but the history of the Habs has meant that they demand winners and professionalism, and they won't go out of downtown to get it. Ask the Expos, the Concorde, the Manic, the Allouettes (the move changed their fortunes completely).

If he gets the same level of investment involved as Toronto and puts an SSS downtown, he'll sell the place out.

As long as they win games.

Milanista
02-05-2015, 03:27 PM
He can't spend like TFC....very few teams can, maybe 3-4 tops


From Soccer By Ives today:
SAPUTO, IMPACT WORKING TO BOOST FAN INTEREST

Over the club’s three years in MLS, the Montreal Impact have quickly slid down the league’s attendance list. Entering 2015, team owner and president Joey Saputo worries they could slip even further.
Attendance in Montreal was down about 15 percent last year alone as the Impact struggled through a season that saw them finish at the bottom of the standings.

“If people are saying ‘Let’s see what kind of team we have before buying season tickets,’ I can say we did our part,” Saputo told the CBC (http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/joey-saputo-aims-to-bring-buzz-back-to-montreal-impact-1.2945435). “We changed the team.
“We saw what wasn’t working last year. We brought in 11 new players. The 12th player, our fans, is tougher to sign.”
With only about 5,000 season tickets sold, the Impact project that the club could place as low as 13th in MLS attendance this season. That’s a big departure 2012, when they broke into MLS and posted the third-highest attendance in the league.
“The disappointment is thinking we’d be more relevant in the city after three years,” Saputo said. “Either we missed the boat (in marketing) or we missed the boat totally in thinking this was a soccer market.”

Now, given that the team has been propped up for years -- well back into its A-league days -- by provincial support and mass ticket giveaways (I was told in the first few seasons as many as 6,000 per game), should he really be surprised?

It's Montreal. I lived in the eastern townships for several years and Montreal was our hangout; but the history of the Habs has meant that they demand winners and professionalism, and they won't go out of downtown to get it. Ask the Expos, the Concorde, the Manic, the Allouettes (the move changed their fortunes completely).

If he gets the same level of investment involved as Toronto and puts an SSS downtown, he'll sell the place out.

As long as they win games.

OgtheDim
02-05-2015, 03:28 PM
He can.

He's chosen to spend it in Bologna.

jloome
02-05-2015, 03:29 PM
He can't spend like TFC....very few teams can, maybe 3-4 tops

Not on his own, no. But he can team up with a larger corporate partner. He's a co-owner at Bologna right now, which affords him good contacts elsewhere. Surely he could find another investor.

RealG-TFC
02-05-2015, 03:33 PM
They should be fine. I think he's just trying to scare people into buying into them more and he's bitter about losing out on Giovinco (and Gilardino) I think they are fine with the location of Saputo Stadium, it is rather easy to get to being on the subway line.

ag futbol
02-05-2015, 03:37 PM
Different culture in Quebec when it comes to sports and how fans purchase tickets.

One thing people aren't talking about that is absolutely pounding Canadian teams right now is the fx rate. Hedging will only take you so far, if they are doing it at all.

Beach_Red
02-05-2015, 03:40 PM
They should be fine. I think he's just trying to scare people into buying into them more and he's bitter about losing out on Giovinco (and Gilardino) I think they are fine with the location of Saputo Stadium, it is rather easy to get to being on the subway line.

This is what the Expos thought, too. But the whole west island is poorly served by the metro. No one but a government would have put that stadium where it is.

TFC07
02-05-2015, 03:40 PM
Saputo making excuses already? First with blaming TFC for lack of DP signings now this? What's next?

I hope Saputo get his shit together or just sell club to someone else who would invest into making Impact summer team to support in Montreal and Quebec.

Hate them or love them, but we need a good Impact team for sake of real rivalry and growing the game in this country.

jloome
02-05-2015, 03:53 PM
This is what the Expos thought, too. But the whole west island is poorly served by the metro. No one but a government would have put that stadium where it is.

LOL, Pie Neuf. What were they thinking? (It's Quebec, of course, so construction graft and the price of property on Nun's Island probably had more to do with it than anything).

ManUtd4ever
02-05-2015, 04:16 PM
No surprise. Montreal is well known for their fickle fan base for all professional sports. During their lean years, even the Habs saw a significant decline in attendance.

Fort York Redcoat
02-05-2015, 04:19 PM
No surprise. Montreal is well known for their fickle fan base for all professional sports. During their lean years, even the Habs saw a significant decline in attendance.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-zNNmYovRoJc/U7GqF7neifI/AAAAAAAARpo/IgcsQ0NJmTk/s1600/jeremiah+johnson+gif.gifhttp://imgur.com/In9skvb.gif

Strikers
02-05-2015, 05:13 PM
This all has to do with Saputo being with Bologna FC. Did they not tell him there is no salary cap in Seria A Seria B and the whole of European Leagues.

All his money will go to Bologna FC and the Impact will be in limbo.

Beach_Red
02-05-2015, 05:56 PM
Saputo making excuses already? First with blaming TFC for lack of DP signings now this? What's next?

I hope Saputo get his shit together or just sell club to someone else who would invest into making Impact summer team to support in Montreal and Quebec.

Hate them or love them, but we need a good Impact team for sake of real rivalry and growing the game in this country.

If anyone else ever steps up. Canadians just don't seem to be very interested in owning sports teams. Even the Habs were owned by an American for a while. Maybe an American will buy the Impact, too, if Saputo wants out.

PAOK17
02-05-2015, 06:02 PM
Now that I live in Montreal I can tell you that I no longer buy the stadium location argument for low attendance. It's on the Metro line, and it literally is at most a 20 minute ride from downtown. The city of Montreal is so small, that anything on the subway line should be enough to discredit the stadium location argument.

You can walk across downtown in less than an hour. The city is tiny. If someone wanted to, they could walk to Saputo Stadium from downtown in less time that it takes most fans in Toronto to get to BMO with transit or car.

It's the Montreal culture. The Habs are king.

Jack
02-05-2015, 06:04 PM
Boo-fucking-hoo.

Beach_Red
02-05-2015, 06:28 PM
Now that I live in Montreal I can tell you that I no longer buy the stadium location argument for low attendance. It's on the Metro line, and it literally is at most a 20 minute ride from downtown. The city of Montreal is so small, that anything on the subway line should be enough to discredit the stadium location argument.

You can walk across downtown in less than an hour. The city is tiny. If someone wanted to, they could walk to Saputo Stadium from downtown in less time that it takes most fans in Toronto to get to BMO with transit or car.

It's the Montreal culture. The Habs are king.

So you don't think they need any fans from the west island?

jimiv
02-05-2015, 06:37 PM
Not on his own, no. But he can team up with a larger corporate partner. He's a co-owner at Bologna right now, which affords him good contacts elsewhere. Surely he could find another investor.

He could ask his dad for a hand out, Lino Saputo's worth $5 Billion.

PAOK17
02-05-2015, 06:48 PM
So you don't think they need any fans from the west island?
I never said that. But if someone from the West Island is willing to watch them downtown, then the 20 extra minutes shouldn't be deal killer.

In Toronto I lived in North York. BMO Field isn't exactly in the heart of downtown either. It's a good 20 minute streetcar or bus ride from the nearest subways station. In other words, potentially 20 minutes longer to get to from where the ACC or Rogers Centre. How is that any different than the relative location of Saputo Stadium from the Bell Centre?

Maybe it's because I'm from Toronto and am just used to travelling farther distances.

RealG-TFC
02-05-2015, 07:12 PM
So you don't think they need any fans from the west island?

I will admit i'm never in West Island when I'm in mtl but is there not a highway that runs from dorval up to Anjou?

jloome
02-05-2015, 07:35 PM
I never said that. But if someone from the West Island is willing to watch them downtown, then the 20 extra minutes shouldn't be deal killer.

In Toronto I lived in North York. BMO Field isn't exactly in the heart of downtown either. It's a good 20 minute streetcar or bus ride from the nearest subways station. In other words, potentially 20 minutes longer to get to from where the ACC or Rogers Centre. How is that any different than the relative location of Saputo Stadium from the Bell Centre?

Maybe it's because I'm from Toronto and am just used to travelling farther distances.

That's basically it. Montrealers consider downtown the city; anything past Decarie is practically the burbs. In fact, many of the montrealers I knew wouldn't even go to the old town; that was considered too far.

Cashcleaner
02-05-2015, 07:38 PM
I have a hard time buying the argument that Stade Saputo is too remote for most Montrealers to get to. Sure, it's not centrally-located, but it's still relatively easy to access and is serviced by two nearby subway stations (Viau and Pie-IX). In many ways, I would wager that Stade Saputo is easier for more Impact fans to get to than BMO Field is for a lot of TFC supporters. I know getting from my house in Oshawa to Exhibition stadium on match day requires about an hour and a half of time both going there and coming back.

I don't know what the deal is with Saputo and the Impact. Even with the Canadiens being the King of Sport in that city, the MLS team has relatively little local competition for fan dollars given the nature of the MLS season. Sure, hockey playoffs can go into June and that can put a dent into the Impact's early season attendance numbers, but the Allouettes don't have amazing attendance - they're actually below the CFL's league average and I just don't see that team drawing a lot of fans away from the Impact.

Personally, think this recent bad news is primarily on the shoulders of the Impact marketing team and the various players and coaches who have yet to move the club past the knockout round for the MLS Cup playoffs. Most Montrealers simply aren't like most Torontonians. They will not accept a mediocre product on the pitch. If Joey Saputo wants more people watching the Impact play live, he's going to have to invest in quality coaches, managers, scouts, trainers, and players - and make sure they play to their full potential. Because Montrealers have demonstrated plenty of times in the past that they will not pay good money to watch a bad team play.

Defoe
02-05-2015, 08:11 PM
To add fuel to the fire Oyongo not reporting

Richard
02-05-2015, 08:15 PM
Isn't Montreal a dying city financially?

Beach_Red
02-05-2015, 08:21 PM
That's basically it. Montrealers consider downtown the city; anything past Decarie is practically the burbs. In fact, many of the montrealers I knew wouldn't even go to the old town; that was considered too far.

Drapeau used to brag he'd never been west of the Decarie. It's not the miles, it's the attitude. Maybe you have to live it to get it, but it's there. It has to be something special to get many west islanders to that stadium and right now it looks like MLS isn't doing it. Likely Saputo didn't care about the Anglo demographic at all.

TFC07
02-05-2015, 09:14 PM
Isn't Montreal a dying city financially?

Quebec in general is dying and aging (I believe they're one of oldest provinces in Canada now). This is why they're so bitter at GTA and Western Canada since all money and power (you don't need Quebec to win majority government anymore) is there now.

tfcleeds
02-05-2015, 09:21 PM
Eh, as far as growth of the sport in Canada is concerned, that's where I hope the Impact are somewhat successful. Otherwise, they and Joey can all suck an egg. Montreal always has been, and always will be, a Habs town. Any other sports franchise is really going to have their work cut out to be successful at the gate long-term.

QBall
02-05-2015, 11:00 PM
Isn't Montreal a dying city financially?

From what it appears Montreal traded for a player that NYRB wasn't allowed to trade since he was on loan. Only in MLS can teams pull fast ones on each other.

greatwhitenorf
02-06-2015, 02:41 AM
The location of Stade Saputo certainly isn't an issue at present. The location is a peach to get to on the Metro and parking is decent all around there. Montreal on the whole certainly comes across as being only interested in supporting winning teams, but I thought the soccer crowd was different. I remember what good fun it was to go to Impact games when they were at the very unsophisticated Claude Robillard stadium. The crowd there certainly weren't seeing top flight sport but there was a lot of sporting bon homie towards the game itself.

But if baseball ever makes a return to Montreal, the Impact will have heavy sledding ahead of them.

Yohan
02-06-2015, 09:37 AM
To add fuel to the fire Oyongo not reporting http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/impact-battle-to-keep-defender-ambroise-oyongo/
lulz

pdogg
02-06-2015, 10:09 AM
Would the trade not be voided then and players returned to their respective teams? If they traded an asset that could not be traded, they did not fulfill their side of the agreement?

ryan
02-06-2015, 10:56 AM
while it would be unfortunate for Canadian soccer and MLS in Canada for them to fail....on the other hand...




HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

We would have to do everything possible to fill their stadium on our final match there should it actually come to this.

jloome
02-06-2015, 12:56 PM
Would the trade not be voided then and players returned to their respective teams? If they traded an asset that could not be traded, they did not fulfill their side of the agreement?

Nah, they'll get secondary compensation, i.e. allocation and picks. I think.

kodiakTFC
02-06-2015, 10:28 PM
Before I moved across the world, I was running events for PlayStation and one such gig saw me attend the final home game of the season in Montreal last season. I was happy to see Stade Saputo after the renovations for the first time but I couldn't help but notice how few people were there. For the record, it was chilly and pissing rain but it was still a poor turnout. Montreal's real issue seems to be midweek games, they really see a dip. However, one thing they have going for them this year is there are far more stars in the league to bring in people this year. That's a big draw in Montreal.

Hamilton_Red
02-07-2015, 12:30 AM
Well one bad season and Montreal gets that! They self destructed and embarrassed themselves at the end of season two. If they had a team as bad as TFC has been for seven seasons... They would be long gone. I don't buy the stadium accessibility issue at all it is fine - even for West Islanders. For me it's that outdoor sports in Montreal outwith June - September is barely viable - the place is freezing. I've watched the Expos in May in the Big O and it's intolerable for more than an hour. I've sat through some pretty miserable condition at BMO - but Montreal is an order of magnitude colder.

kodiakTFC
02-07-2015, 01:33 AM
Well one bad season and Montreal gets that! They self destructedand embarrassed themselves at the end of season two. If they had a team as bad as TFC for seven seasons... They would be long gone. I don't buy the accessibility issue at all - outdoor sports in Montreal outside June - September is barely viable - the place is freezing. I've watched the Expos in May the Big O and it's intolerable for more than an hour.

Having lived in the city for four years for school and having had visited many times since I think your right. There are certainly days here and there where you have your nice days but generally speaking its not ideal. Also, the stadium is not in a wonderful location but compared to many other teams in the league, its fantastic. Obviously, it would be much better if the team was downtown, perhaps around Mont Royal/Plateau would be best, but this area is suitable.

jazzy
02-07-2015, 09:41 AM
From Soccer By Ives today:
SAPUTO, IMPACT WORKING TO BOOST FAN INTEREST

Over the club’s three years in MLS, the Montreal Impact have quickly slid down the league’s attendance list. Entering 2015, team owner and president Joey Saputo worries they could slip even further.
Attendance in Montreal was down about 15 percent last year alone as the Impact struggled through a season that saw them finish at the bottom of the standings.

“If people are saying ‘Let’s see what kind of team we have before buying season tickets,’ I can say we did our part,” Saputo told the CBC (http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/joey-saputo-aims-to-bring-buzz-back-to-montreal-impact-1.2945435). “We changed the team.
“We saw what wasn’t working last year. We brought in 11 new players. The 12th player, our fans, is tougher to sign.”
With only about 5,000 season tickets sold, the Impact project that the club could place as low as 13th in MLS attendance this season. That’s a big departure 2012, when they broke into MLS and posted the third-highest attendance in the league.
“The disappointment is thinking we’d be more relevant in the city after three years,” Saputo said. “Either we missed the boat (in marketing) or we missed the boat totally in thinking this was a soccer market.”

Now, given that the team has been propped up for years -- well back into its A-league days -- by provincial support and mass ticket giveaways (I was told in the first few seasons as many as 6,000 per game), should he really be surprised?

It's Montreal. I lived in the eastern townships for several years and Montreal was our hangout; but the history of the Habs has meant that they demand winners and professionalism, and they won't go out of downtown to get it. Ask the Expos, the Concorde, the Manic, the Allouettes (the move changed their fortunes completely).

If he gets the same level of investment involved as Toronto and puts an SSS downtown, he'll sell the place out.

As long as they win games.

I think they've missed the boat with a French connection also .......we've beat them at that as well........but you're right Montreal had always demanded winners, byproduct of the Canadians.... I'm surprised also they're is a strong African and Latin contingent in Montreal that is ignored. Think Morrocan and Algierian especially. You'd think there would be some reasonably priced undiscovered talent there.

jazzy
02-07-2015, 09:58 AM
Well one bad season and Montreal gets that! They self destructed and embarrassed themselves at the end of season two. If they had a team as bad as TFC has been for seven seasons... They would be long gone. I don't buy the stadium accessibility issue at all it is fine - even for West Islanders. For me it's that outdoor sports in Montreal outwith June - September is barely viable - the place is freezing. I've watched the Expos in May in the Big O and it's intolerable for more than an hour. I've sat through some pretty miserable condition at BMO - but Montreal is an order of magnitude colder.

Accessibility is great, stadium is great, but maybe you're right with the extreme ends of the season and conditions......we'll find out in Oct......Be that as it may, I've withstood freezing rain a few times at BMO and you simply have to be a true fan, we are ! I Surprisingly , TO may simply have more in quantity and quality football supporters.....:)...Not sure if Montrealers are crazy with Mr. saputo as an owner also . He's definitely doesn't push his 'Quebec' connection . Good or bad that may be a necessity in LA belle province .

Cashcleaner
02-07-2015, 11:38 AM
^ It's funny you mention the "Quebec" connection. My friend the Impact fan absolutely thinks most of the Quebec-born players are garbage and would love for the team to get rid of them in exchange for some better talent coming from outside of the province. To be fair, there's only a handful of recognizable Quebecois players in the entire league, so I can't say I disagree with him.

Brooker
02-07-2015, 12:34 PM
Montreal Impact! I remember them!

jazzy
02-07-2015, 05:52 PM
^ It's funny you mention the "Quebec" connection. My friend the Impact fan absolutely thinks most of the Quebec-born players are garbage and would love for the team to get rid of them in exchange for some better talent coming from outside of the province. To be fair, there's only a handful of recognizable Quebecois players in the entire league, so I can't say I disagree with him.

I agree, I didn't actually mean players from Quebec, simply accessing the people , culture in some way . As for players, I was thinking at least some French speaking players . Mr. Saputo for me , is not a recognized Québécoise . And most in the province have a strong attachment for their province .

RealG-TFC
02-07-2015, 07:06 PM
I think that's the direction they are now going in more or less. Reporters are going gaga over the fact that Soumare, Ciman, Camara, and (in theory) Oyongo constitute an all french-speaking back-line.

I think this is why Joey is doubly jealous of us. Not only did we get Giovinco, but we also got Cheyrou and Perquis.

kshep
02-07-2015, 07:20 PM
Yeah, we certainly had the impact by the balls this off season. Makes me laugh that we beat Joey in his own backyards.


Side bar: Does anyone have any idea how well the impact try to access the anglophone market there? Is it an even balance or more francophone centric? Do take the same type of pro francophone stance as the rest of Quebec.

RealG-TFC
02-07-2015, 07:41 PM
I'd like to know that too since we have people saying they ignore the anglophones and some saying they ignore the francophones. If I had to guess I think they would appeal more to anglophone market. To my knowledge Lino Saputo lives as far West as you can get on West Island in a large estate and Joey lives in Westmount, an affluent anglophone neighbouhood just west of downtown (which itself is already west of the St. Laurent boundary). That and just listening to the likes of Adam Braz, Nick de Santis, and Joey himself in French you really get the impression that they feel much more comfortable communicating in English.

kshep
02-07-2015, 07:54 PM
Yeah, but you have to figure that part of impacts struggles at the turnstiles are a distinct lack of a solid marketing approach to one of either of those two markets. I mean, if you live in a province dominated by francophones you'd think they try and tap the French leagues more, non?
You'd also think they try and avoid having too many 'mericans on the squad. Because the gross of people I know from Quebec tend to hate 'mericans more than the average Canadian in my experience.

Beach_Red
02-07-2015, 08:10 PM
I'd like to know that too since we have people saying they ignore the anglophones and some saying they ignore the francophones. If I had to guess I think they would appeal more to anglophone market. To my knowledge Lino Saputo lives as far West as you can get on West Island in a large estate and Joey lives in Westmount, an affluent anglophone neighbouhood just west of downtown (which itself is already west of the St. Laurent boundary). That and just listening to the likes of Adam Braz, Nick de Santis, and Joey himself in French you really get the impression that they feel much more comfortable communicating in English.

Montreal is a tough market, for many things. Because it's part of North America there's always going to be a lot of English involved, as there is in the Impact from office. But that doesn't hurt the Als. It does affect the Canadiens, though, who will never have an Anglo coach or GM. That may be because football is seen as a North American sport and the people who like it accept that but hockey is such an intergral part of Quebec it needs to be Québécois.

So, where does soccer fit in? Right now it seems that Saputo is having trouble working that out.

TFC07
02-07-2015, 08:23 PM
Montreal is a tough market, for many things. Because it's part of North America there's always going to be a lot of English involved, as there is in the Impact from office. But that doesn't hurt the Als. It does affect the Canadiens, though, who will never have an Anglo coach or GM. That may be because football is seen as a North American sport and the people who like it accept that but hockey is such an intergral part of Quebec it needs to be Québécois.

So, where does soccer fit in? Right now it seems that Saputo is having trouble working that out.

Easy, it's immigrants and minorities in Montreal that will support soccer. That should be market Impact should be marketing towards not Quebecers who don't give a shit about other sports besides Hockey and other niche sports like diving.

Beach_Red
02-07-2015, 08:30 PM
Easy, it's immigrants and minorities in Montreal that will support soccer. That should be market Impact should be marketing towards not Quebecers who don't give a shit about other sports besides Hockey and other niche sports like diving.

Well, that would mean more North African connections, I guess, but is that really a big enough market to,support a team in a league with teams like LA? Immigration to Montreal has been quite different than immigration to Toronto or Vancouver since 1991 when Quebec took control of its own. Maybe there's a big enough of a market for a soccer team, but MLS? I guess we'll find out.

TFC07
02-07-2015, 08:34 PM
Well, that would mean more North African connections, I guess, but is that really a big enough market to,support a team in a league with teams like LA? Immigration to Montreal has been quite different than immigration to Toronto or Vancouver since 1991 when Quebec took control of its own. Maybe there's a big enough of a market for a soccer team, but MLS? I guess we'll find out.

Montreal is small market! Sooner they accept that role, the better they will be. There is only couple of markets that can compete with L.A. (Toronto being one of them). If you look at Vancouver (smaller market than Montreal), they seem to do well both on-field and off-field.

Beach_Red
02-07-2015, 08:45 PM
Montreal is small market! Sooner they accept that role, the better they will be. There is only couple of markets that can compete with L.A. (Toronto being one of them). If you look at Vancouver (smaller market than Montreal), they seem to do well both on-field and off-field.

Well, this is the heart of the issue. Montreal is a small market if it's just the city - in that case the stadium is fine. But if you include the west island and the rest of the suburbs then only five MLS cities are bigger. But then the stadium is in a bad location.

It does seem that Saputo hoped the small city market would be enough and now he's complaining it isn't. So, it's not so much that Montreal is a small market, just a tough market. Probably too tough for Saputo and likely too tough for anyone else to buy the team from him.

This is is also why baseball isn't coming back to Montreal any time soon (unless Tampa relocate, but it won't last ;)).

PAOK17
02-07-2015, 08:52 PM
Easy, it's immigrants and minorities in Montreal that will support soccer. That should be market Impact should be marketing towards not Quebecers who don't give a shit about other sports besides Hockey and other niche sports like diving.
I will extend that to not just immigrants and minorities but just traditional soccer fans in general (which tend to already be immigrants). TFC had success doing just that. They went after knowledgeable and sophisticated fans who grew up watching the big leagues in Europe and CL. Sure some were too snobbish to consider MLS but others (like myself) got hooked.

The problem with Montreal is that no one talks about any other sport but hockey here. I have yet to meet a fan of the NBA. People at work aren't even aware that the Impact exist. People are borderline disgusted that I don't support the Habs. You don't get that in Toronto.

If I were Saputo, I'd find the soccer fans in Montreal and market from there.

brad
02-07-2015, 10:44 PM
Montreal Impact! I remember them!

Remember the days when folks around here were envying how the built there team and thinking we should emulate it?

jloome
02-07-2015, 10:49 PM
I will extend that to not just immigrants and minorities but just traditional soccer fans in general (which tend to already be immigrants). TFC had success doing just that. They went after knowledgeable and sophisticated fans who grew up watching the big leagues in Europe and CL. Sure some were too snobbish to consider MLS but others (like myself) got hooked.

The problem with Montreal is that no one talks about any other sport but hockey here. I have yet to meet a fan of the NBA. People at work aren't even aware that the Impact exist. People are borderline disgusted that I don't support the Habs. You don't get that in Toronto.

If I were Saputo, I'd find the soccer fans in Montreal and market from there.

needs to go to the burbs; dollar, outremont, get the greeks, italians and arabs on board. Passionate hard-working burbs in montreal. Give them a cheap subway+game+beer tickets for the pub after package and they'll go en masse, if the right players are signed.

Richard
02-07-2015, 10:57 PM
Its interesting that they haven't tried to sign more top French players as of yet. They don't need to go the Italian route just because the owners are, I think getting French nationals would be much easier and more cost effective for them, probably a lot more marketable too.

Ossington Mental Youth
02-08-2015, 12:15 AM
Remember the days when folks around here were envying how the built there team and thinking we should emulate it?
Lolololol wish I could favorite this. So true

Brooker
02-08-2015, 05:42 AM
Remember the days when folks around here were envying how the built there team and thinking we should emulate it?

Yup! lol

DOMIN8R
02-08-2015, 07:41 AM
Saputo has been known to be a shrewd business man. But he is also, at times, accused of being an elitist and condescending to his fan base.

I find it interesting that he would communicate that this franchise is in trouble because of a lack of ticket sales. On one hand, it puts Montreal on notice that if they don't make more of an effort to support this team bad things may happen to the franchise. Because he doesn't intend on breaking the bank. He also seems to imply that the market has an obligation to support the Impact, because of the Saputo investments to date. On the other hand, he's telegraphing to the market that there is some risk associated with this team. Perhaps guilt will trump the this-team-is-a-looser-both-on-the-field-and-in-boardroom-so-why-should-we-support-them crowd. We shall see.

Interesting to watch tough.

:lurk5:

Hamilton_Red
02-08-2015, 08:37 PM
Saputo is making a big mistake suggesting the franchise is at risk. Montreal has suffered through the Expos and Allouettes/Concordes fiascos - putting that seed into the team is a losing proposition. They should be looking at Vancouver's model & emulating it - that is how a good competitive franchise is built. Toronto is using the sugar daddy approach to being competitive - who knows maybe this year we will get lucky finally.

Fort York Redcoat
02-09-2015, 10:40 AM
Remember the days when folks around here were envying how the built there team and thinking we should emulate it?

http://groovesontheradio.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/anigif_enhanced-buzz-22046-1380209880-14.gif

Yohan
02-14-2015, 07:49 PM
lulz


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgDbZMGn23U#t=44

Ossington Mental Youth
02-14-2015, 09:36 PM
Bon chance avec ca Montreal

Cashcleaner
02-15-2015, 08:34 AM
Remember the days when folks around here were envying how the built there team and thinking we should emulate it?

Like, for example, how there is going to be virtually zero chance of a CFL team ever playing at their stadium? Yeah, to be honest, I kinda wish were totally like them in at least that regard.

Ivy
02-15-2015, 09:02 AM
lulz


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgDbZMGn23U#t=44
What in the f!%# did I just watch?

Fort York Redcoat
02-15-2015, 10:18 AM
Like, for example, how there is going to be virtualy zero chance of a CFL team ever playing at their stadium? Yeah, to be honest, I kinda wish were totally like them in at least that regard.

http://media1.giphy.com/media/fjGd6JawRWkxO/giphy.gif

Cashcleaner
02-15-2015, 10:33 AM
^ Love it. :D

PAOK17
02-15-2015, 10:33 AM
As much as I dislike the Impact, having them around and being competitive is not only good for Professional soccer in this country but also a good rivalry for TFC. The Columbus rivalry was more manufactured. This one feels authentic. No matter where I have lived, I circle the Montreal games on my calendar.

The rivalry would be just no fun if they didn't care. It would be even worse if they disappeared.

Ossington Mental Youth
02-15-2015, 11:23 AM
Hate the impact, hate Columbus. Only thing in my mind that was manufactured about the Columbus TFC rivalry was the cup. Went to two away games there and the rivalry seemed very real to me.

dutch
02-20-2015, 01:00 AM
Its Saputo himself. The whole time this team has been around its looked like his all Italian personal toy.
firing jesse marsch so he could bring in another italian, Inter uniforms, Old italian DP's, Its come off very cheesy.
The marketing and the vision never worked, nobody is interested in the team saputo envisions and now its showing.
A small market, finicky fans, bad marketing, bad weather, bad dp's, bad quebec representation, etc et al
There will be a team in Montreal moving forward but I dont see it getting better under saputo's reign.
I can see him selling it and playing with his new toy in Italy. Montreal market is valuable if managed right as a small market opportunity.
He's so pissed watching TFC make moves is what this is all about.
:flare::drum:Theyre not :scarf: and he cant compete:hump: with us.:drum::flare:

trane
02-20-2015, 03:16 AM
Whatever is going on in terms of fan support, is one thing, but in terms of stadium they have a good one, and in terms on on the field results they have done better then us in a shorter period.

I do not know enough about the Montreal market to comment on the season ticket issue, but from what I see from the Habs, even their number goes down after a losing season, like anywhere else in the world except here. So the combination of a smaller market, not just in terms of size but in terms of football interest, makes it tougher. I am sure they will do fine.

Fort York Redcoat
02-20-2015, 08:19 AM
Whatever is going on in terms of fan support, is one thing, but in terms of stadium they have a good one, and in terms on on the field results they have done better then us in a shorter period.

I do not know enough about the Montreal market to comment on the season ticket issue, but from what I see from the Habs, even their number goes down after a losing season, like anywhere else in the world except here. So the combination of a smaller market, not just in terms of size but in terms of football interest, makes it tougher. I am sure they will do fine.


While I agree that Toronto is far more patient than most places in the world the situation in Montreal is newsworthy not because some fans aren't showing up but because the owner is complaining about it. That doesn't happen everywhere else in the world.

jloome
02-20-2015, 02:45 PM
Hate the impact, hate Columbus. Only thing in my mind that was manufactured about the Columbus TFC rivalry was the cup. Went to two away games there and the rivalry seemed very real to me.

Hates me some Crew, Some Shite Bulls, some L'Impact and The Sounders, of course. Also hate their fans. Not really, just the jerks. But you know what I mean.

Ossington Mental Youth
02-20-2015, 04:33 PM
Hates me some Crew, Some Shite Bulls, some L'Impact and The Sounders, of course. Also hate their fans. Not really, just the jerks. But you know what I mean.

all too damn well

SoccMan2
02-20-2015, 09:05 PM
If your going to criticize someone make sure you get your facts right. Saputo fired Jesse Marsch to bring in an Italian coach, so tell me which Italian coach did he bring in after he fired Marsch? He brought old Italian DP's, well the old Italian DP did very well DiVaio and the others did a lot better than many of the past DP's that this organization brought in, where do you want me to start? Inter uniforms? really! While I think that Saputo's expectation for his team are a little overblown, thinking that his franchise deserves better support in the stands even after a disastrous 2014 season, I don't think attendance dipped because of Saputo's vision of his club, it has dipped because Montreal like in all it's sports team are very demanding you win they will come out you lose and attendance takes a hit that is just the way Montreal is. Saputo is not going anywhere, if it was not for the Saputos there would not be soccer in Montreal and no soccer specific stadium.

kshep
02-20-2015, 09:11 PM
If your going to criticize someone make sure you get your facts right. Saputo fired Jesse Marsch to bring in an Italian coach, so tell me which Italian coach did he bring in after he fired Marsch? He brought old Italian DP's, well the old Italian DP did very well DiVaio and the others did a lot better than many of the past DP's that this organization brought in, where do you want me to start? Inter uniforms? really! While I think that Saputo's expectation for his team are a little overblown, thinking that his franchise deserves better support in the stands even after a disastrous 2014 season, I don't think attendance dipped because of Saputo's vision of his club, it has dipped because Montreal like in all it's sports team are very demanding you win they will come out you lose and attendance takes a hit that is just the way Montreal is. Saputo is not going anywhere, if it was not for the Saputos there would not be soccer in Montreal and no soccer specific stadium.

Come on man, you can't be a Montreal apologist on a TFC forum! :facepalm:

Yohan
02-20-2015, 09:31 PM
If your going to criticize someone make sure you get your facts right. Saputo fired Jesse Marsch to bring in an Italian coach, so tell me which Italian coach did he bring in after he fired Marsch? He brought old Italian DP's, well the old Italian DP did very well DiVaio and the others did a lot better than many of the past DP's that this organization brought in, where do you want me to start? Inter uniforms? really! While I think that Saputo's expectation for his team are a little overblown, thinking that his franchise deserves better support in the stands even after a disastrous 2014 season, I don't think attendance dipped because of Saputo's vision of his club, it has dipped because Montreal like in all it's sports team are very demanding you win they will come out you lose and attendance takes a hit that is just the way Montreal is. Saputo is not going anywhere, if it was not for the Saputos there would not be soccer in Montreal and no soccer specific stadium.
Schallibaum is Swiss, not Italian

Shakes McQueen
02-20-2015, 10:29 PM
Schallibaum is Swiss, not Italian

Bahahahaha.

molenshtain
02-20-2015, 11:05 PM
ugh. All this talk of rivalries makes me virtually unable to wait for the season to start. How long do i have to wait to follow the boys to either Columbus or MTL?

boozilla
02-20-2015, 11:23 PM
In perspective, the Italian pet project in Montreal hasn't failed nearly as hard as TFC.

Hopefully, the Montreal Impact will provide a heated and quality rivalry.

Hamilton_Red
02-21-2015, 12:41 AM
The reality is in football terms - is that Montreal has been more successfull than Toronto in their three short years. Saputo's comments are business related - TFC has made more money and spent more money and is good at marketing. Him saying that after one bad season is shamefull. Toronto fans have endured a pathetic effort at building a sport franchise.. The fact that the franchise still goes is a minor miracle. Hopefully this season we see a turn-around. Too bad that Canadians couldn't do it - if TFC succeeds it will be Vanney - Bradley - Altidore - and Bezbetchenko that we have to thank. Time to step it up.

dutch
02-21-2015, 01:51 AM
I feel like theyres Montreal fans in here. To explain myself, My family is Swiss. There are 5 languages in Switzerland and 4 Ethnicities. There is a common myth that Swiss people all know 7 languages but its not like that, Italian isnt even fluent outside of the areas of Davos, St Moritz and Luganos. You can spot an Italian from a German in Switzerland as easily as you can in Italy or Canada. Schallibaum is distinctly Italian in linguistics and appaerance. I guess I read into that but I stand firm on it. He was hired for his european roots and that its Saputos vision not the fans.

“We always said we wanted to get a European,” said Saputo. “Getting into MLS, we were told that it’s different, that you need to have American experience, so that’s what we went for"
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/soccer/new-coach-schallibaum-brings-language-skills-to-impact/article7074572/

"They started the campaign with a mostly North American line-up playing a heavy running game, but during the season management brought in a succession of veteran players from Italy and Switzerland that changed the chemistry on and off the pitch"
"Saputo said that is what he and the club's fans wanted, and now he hopes he has the coach to perfect that style"
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/new-coach-schallibaum-brings-european-style-to-montreal-impact-1.1370062

Many people are Italian even though theyre not born there, Danny Dichio from London for instance.

Look they bought Italian every chance they could, DP's were italian and they were old and yes they did better than TFC's DP's but thats not the point.
The point is they bought Italian every chance they could. and it wasnt the best vision for a new team in Montreal.

They did better than TFC in half the time, but thats not what we're talking about. Again..Theyre not TFC and cant be compared.

Why do you attack me like I insulted your Family? lol no need bro

dutch
02-21-2015, 01:56 AM
If your going to criticize someone make sure you get your facts right. Saputo fired Jesse Marsch to bring in an Italian coach, so tell me which Italian coach did he bring in after he fired Marsch? He brought old Italian DP's, well the old Italian DP did very well DiVaio and the others did a lot better than many of the past DP's that this organization brought in, where do you want me to start? Inter uniforms? really! While I think that Saputo's expectation for his team are a little overblown, thinking that his franchise deserves better support in the stands even after a disastrous 2014 season, I don't think attendance dipped because of Saputo's vision of his club, it has dipped because Montreal like in all it's sports team are very demanding you win they will come out you lose and attendance takes a hit that is just the way Montreal is. Saputo is not going anywhere, if it was not for the Saputos there would not be soccer in Montreal and no soccer specific stadium.

"DiVaio and the others did a lot better than many of the past DP's that this organization brought in"

"Inter uniforms? really!" -- TFC kits have never looked like L.F.C replicas. L'impact have used many of the same colors and stripe variations on Inter kits.

"Saputo is not going anywhere, if it was not for the Saputos there would not be soccer in Montreal"

You cannot tell me this guy is a Red blooded Toronto FC Supporter, For one second..

kodiakTFC
02-21-2015, 02:00 AM
One of the unfortunate, perhaps short term, issues I have with Montreal isn't their purchases but the lack of any playing time for young Canadians. Look at TFC's line up and you see a vision to help further this country's national team. I know its not a club's side responsibility to do this but I'm glad, and proud, that TFC has made it their prerogative. You potentially claim Vancouver is guilty of this as well but at least they have some youth but more importantly their residency is really producing talent. The issue becomes clearer when you see Canada release its u15 to u20 rosters and its stacked with Vancouver and Toronto products but nothing from Montreal, maybe a player or two at the younger level. That's awful.

Perhaps this will change as I know they do have an academy and FC Montreal is coming, but as of now, Mtl needs to pick it up.

SoccMan2
02-21-2015, 06:26 AM
Let me say this again if attendance is has slipped in Montreal it's due to the crap performance on the field not the "Italian experiment", furthermore, the attendance figures for Montreal were not that bad considering. Saputo like someone mentioned is an idiot for making the statements he did after just one terrible season, what did he expect? Let's all remember what pro soccer was for many years between the folding of the old NASL in 1984 and the start of the MLS in 1996, pro soccer was dead , leagues came and went between those years. Attendances of 3000 where considered great in the different leagues that existed between those years. If someone had said that there would be a league like the MLS in North America where the majority of teams where playing in soccer specific stadiums and where the league average in attendance was around 18000, people would think you were nuts. So a guy like Saputo and many others need to be careful with expectations and remember where pro soccer was not many years ago.

BuSaPuNk
02-21-2015, 08:10 AM
Inter uniforms? really!" -- TFC kits have never looked like L.F.C replicas. L'impact have used many of the same colors and stripe variations on Inter kits.

To be fair there is only so much you can do with a red jersey tbh. Look at last year's jersey there is no way LFC would ever had the intricate maple leaf design on there jersey or anything like that.

That's said please don't turn this into a who's a really supporter or fan. Judging people on there allegiances won't be tolerated.

dutch
02-21-2015, 01:38 PM
I get it and I understand.
Your allowed to follow multiple teams

molenshtain
02-21-2015, 02:44 PM
One of the unfortunate, perhaps short term, issues I have with Montreal isn't their purchases but the lack of any playing time for young Canadians. Look at TFC's line up and you see a vision to help further this country's national team. I know its not a club's side responsibility to do this but I'm glad, and proud, that TFC has made it their prerogative. You potentially claim Vancouver is guilty of this as well but at least they have some youth but more importantly their residency is really producing talent. The issue becomes clearer when you see Canada release its u15 to u20 rosters and its stacked with Vancouver and Toronto products but nothing from Montreal, maybe a player or two at the younger level. That's awful.

Perhaps this will change as I know they do have an academy and FC Montreal is coming, but as of now, Mtl needs to pick it up.

They have quite a few talented young canadians who got a lot of playing time last season. They have a smaller pool to draw from then us an Vancouver and are still doing a fair bit to contribute. They're getting there.

ag futbol
02-21-2015, 03:06 PM
I always take the idea of "deserved" support with a grain of salt. In many ways your market is your market. That means Montrealers typically buy game day tickets and draw to "event" type games more so than Toronto where our support is a little more sticky regardless of how the team does.

I'm not sure what saputo's attempting to accomplish. Berating your customers has never been a particularly effective strategy.

Yohan
02-24-2015, 09:12 PM
Mtl at pachuca 10PM. CCL knockout stage 1st leg

Soccerpro
02-24-2015, 10:06 PM
Montreal would be looked good if they had a DP striker. I just don't see Oduro and Jack Mac getting the job done up top.

ag futbol
02-24-2015, 10:18 PM
Montreal would be looked good if they had a DP striker. I just don't see Oduro and Jack Mac getting the job done up top.
I simply can't see them getting anywhere with Klopas. He's about as out-dated as you get in the league these days.

Shway
02-24-2015, 11:02 PM
MTL up 1-0 in Mexico, Frank Klopas has his team very organized.

TFC07
02-24-2015, 11:11 PM
MTL up 1-0 in Mexico, Frank Klopas has his team very organized.

Pachuca looks like they're not taking this game seriously at all. I wonder if they're even playing their top line up or is it made up with bunch of bench and youth players? Montreal looks okay, but their backline still looks unstable.

jloome
02-24-2015, 11:19 PM
Pachuca looks like they're not taking this game seriously at all. I wonder if they're even playing their top line up or is it made up with bunch of bench and youth players? Montreal looks okay, but their backline still looks unstable.

Half and half, older players and youth.

Doesn't matter; Montreal looks the shit this year; everyone in MLS is upping their game.

Smokecell
02-24-2015, 11:20 PM
2-0 now I'm shocked

jloome
02-24-2015, 11:22 PM
Oop. Pachuca's bringing in Sornoza.

Shway
02-24-2015, 11:22 PM
everyone in MLS is upping their game.

Reason why the players want and deserve more money, and more freedom

Smokecell
02-24-2015, 11:34 PM
Well that was short lived. 2-2.

Defoe
02-25-2015, 12:34 AM
Well that was short lived. 2-2.


Ciman and Dukka were incredible. Mapp was good as well. Good result overall for Montreal. They could still pull through

MKR
02-25-2015, 07:04 AM
Ciman and Dukka were incredible. Mapp was good as well. Good result overall for Montreal. They could still pull through

they SHOULD pull through with the next game being in montreal and with 2 away goals.


2-2 against a strong mexican team in Mexico is shocking. Good for the impact.

Yohan
02-25-2015, 07:36 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-8OEd-K1cc

Fort York Redcoat
02-25-2015, 09:13 AM
^Wow. This is so confusing. People following Montreal is raising bile but peeps paying attention to the tourney - can't knock that! I love it.

OgtheDim
02-25-2015, 09:19 AM
A team from Canada moving well into CCL is good for TFC and soccer in Canada. Would make a stronger argument for a #1 seed for the Canadian team in CCL.

Fort York Redcoat
02-25-2015, 09:21 AM
A team from Canada moving well into CCL is good for TFC and soccer in Canada. Would make a stronger argument for a #1 seed for the Canadian team in CCL.

I know this is the sentiment that divides many a club supporter around the world but damn I love the fact we even discuss it.

BuSaPuNk
02-25-2015, 10:15 AM
A team from Canada moving well into CCL is good for TFC and soccer in Canada. Would make a stronger argument for a #1 seed for the Canadian team in CCL.

How is Montreal winning good for Toronto?

Sure seeding is a bonus but does it really matter?

And how is it good for Canada? That's the big question. How many Canadians seen the pitch last night? Zero.

How is that good for Canadian soocer?

kshep
02-25-2015, 10:28 AM
Well its not like we're going to field an 11 full of Canadians either.

OgtheDim
02-25-2015, 10:51 AM
How is Montreal winning good for Toronto?

Sure seeding is a bonus but does it really matter?

And how is it good for Canada? That's the big question. How many Canadians seen the pitch last night? Zero.

How is that good for Canadian soocer?

Its complicated. A bit of a personal issue for me, and some long term thinking.

Seeding is a BIG thing. Right now all Canadian CCL teams have to play one of a US based MLS team or a Mexican team in the group stage. Avoiding the Mexicans in a group stage is important.
Any Canadian team going far in CCL gives more ammunition to the Canadian rep getting a better seed.

Long term future, CCL is important to the growth of the game in North America. That's why I'm glad Scotia has stepped up to sponsor this tourney.

I understand why others disagree.


And, on a personal note, the CCL is what pulled me into actively supporting this team and becoming a SSH. Although I watched and followed TFC since game 1 and went to a match in the first season, it was standng in the 131 seats in the North End for the CCL game vs. Santos that hooked me completely. The passion, the effort, the energy. Success in this tourney is important to me. And if the path to TFC success involves the Impact or VCWC doing well, so be it. Again, I get that others disagree.


I should add I'm a TiCat fan and, in as much as I follow the NHL very little, a Habs fan. My allegiance is not tied to geography. So its not Montreal vs. Toronto.


All that having been said, I wish Saputo would get out of town and a sugar daddy who can think outside of his own box take over that team.

jloome
02-25-2015, 12:24 PM
^Wow. This is so confusing. People following Montreal is raising bile but peeps paying attention to the tourney - can't knock that! I love it.

I told my wife it's a no-lose game. If Montreal wins, it's a Canadian/MLS win. If Montreal loses, it's great, because I fucking hate the Impact.

Schizo I know, but there you go.

Interesting note from KLarson at training camp yesterday.

"For those watching TFC in Florida, one thing is clear: The club is training at a much higher level than it did under previous regimes. The tempo is better. The communication — breaking down the little moments — is evident."

I'm probably sounding like a broken record here but the difference between Vanney and Nelsen was obvious after about five seconds. It doesn't mean he'll succeed -- motivation and team-building, judge of skill, these are all issues that could come in to play -- but it puts us in a better position to do so.

jloome
02-25-2015, 12:25 PM
How is Montreal winning good for Toronto?

Sure seeding is a bonus but does it really matter?

And how is it good for Canada? That's the big question. How many Canadians seen the pitch last night? Zero.

How is that good for Canadian soocer?

It gets covered, on an international level, and raises the profile of Canadian soccer. Don't ever underestimate the importance of exposure.

EDIT: See example above of why Og started following MLS every week.

BuSaPuNk
02-25-2015, 12:38 PM
It gets covered, on an international level, and raises the profile of Canadian soccer. Don't ever underestimate the importance of exposure.

EDIT: See example above of why Og started following MLS every week.

Does it reslly though?

Canadian clubs yes it raises the profile I agree. Just wondering how the profile of Canadian players is raised when none see the field.

Plus I could never for the life of me understand how anyone who supports TFC would root for Montreal at any level.

David_Oliveira
02-25-2015, 01:02 PM
Does it reslly though?

Canadian clubs yes it raises the profile I agree. Just wondering how the profile of Canadian players is raised when none see the field.

Plus I could never for the life of me understand how anyone who supports TFC would root for Montreal at any level.

Agreed. If it meant that the further they went on in the CL we got another slot for a Canadian team, then I would hope they won but it doesn't so I could care less

WestStandGeoff
02-25-2015, 01:20 PM
Agreed. If it meant that the further they went on in the CL we got another slot for a Canadian team, then I would hope they won but it doesn't so I could care less

But Canadian teams consistently going deep in the CCL playoffs is exactly the rationale we need to argue for more spots. No, it's not going to happen for next year, but should over time.

CONCACAF doesn't work the same as UEFA (they allocate spots based on national coefficients), but here's a tangible example - A few years ago, Italy had 4 Champions League spots and Germany had 3. German teams were, and generally still are, staying in both Champions and Europa leagues into late stages which brought up the coefficient to give Germany 4 and reduce Italy to 3.

BuSaPuNk
02-25-2015, 01:23 PM
But Canadian teams consistently going deep in the CCL playoffs is exactly the rationale we need to argue for more spots. No, it's not going to happen for next year, but should over time.

CONCACAF doesn't work the same as UEFA (they allocate spots based on national coefficients), but here's a tangible example - A few years ago, Italy had 4 Champions League spots and Germany had 3. German teams were, and generally still are, staying in both Champions and Europa leagues into late stages which brought up the coefficient to give Germany 4 and reduce Italy to 3.

There not going to give us more spots when there's only 5 teams looking for the spot.

Kaz
02-25-2015, 01:26 PM
And, on a personal note, the CCL is what pulled me into actively supporting this team and becoming a SSH. Although I watched and followed TFC since game 1 and went to a match in the first season, it was standng in the 131 seats in the North End for the CCL game vs. Santos that hooked me completely. The passion, the effort, the energy. Success in this tourney is important to me. And if the path to TFC success involves the Impact or VCWC doing well, so be it. Again, I get that others disagree.


I kinda get it, when Montreal went to the Quarter Final against Santos and it came down to the wire, that was really exciting. Since then Canadian sides have been to the Quarter finals two more times (including this year) and a Semi Final.

Guatamala a Pot A nation has been to the Quarter Finals only twice in the CCL and never to the Semi Finals. If Montreal makes it to the Semi Finals this year (I hope they do) how can Concacaf say Guatamala deserves a Pot A seed and Canada doesn't? Even after they changed the competition to try to give American MLS teams an advantage and slightly handicap Canadian Teams.

At the very least it is a bit brag was can have. Only 3 US teams have made it to the Semi Finals. If Montreal does it, that means that 2 Canadians teams will have done so. I kinda hope Montreal beats them on the 3rd.

gmacpheetfc
02-25-2015, 01:30 PM
I'm cheering for montreal just as most other countries cheer for the national club teams in international competition.

WestStandGeoff
02-25-2015, 02:01 PM
There not going to give us more spots when there's only 5 teams looking for the spot.

Scotland were able to hold on to 2 Champions league spots for years when really only 2 teams were ever in contention for them...

I hear what you're saying, but I still think that ongoing success by Canadian teams forces CONCACAF to reevaluate who qualifies for the tournament - even if that means allowing more teams in from the limited Canadian pool.

C.Ronaldo
02-25-2015, 02:07 PM
MTL doing well makes beating them all the more important.

it raises the importance of the Candian Cup

and lets not be shortsight, It also raises awareness of soccer, MLS and its cdn teams. In the long run, it is good for canadian development. (mo money mo soccer)

WestStandGeoff
02-25-2015, 02:20 PM
^^ Agreed C.Ronaldo,

It will take time, but this really should be a good thing in the long run.

Phil
02-25-2015, 02:29 PM
In my selfish mean mood I want them to crash and burn (Impact).

Having sat through the away loss that eliminated TFC from the competition I have a hard time rooting for the blue buggers.

MartinUtd
02-25-2015, 02:37 PM
The way I see it is I'll cheer against them when they're playing in the CCL, but if they win games I can an least take away from it that our league's profile has been raised a little.

TFC07
02-25-2015, 02:42 PM
The way I see it is I'll cheer against them when they're playing in the CCL, but if they win games I can an least take away from it that our league's profile has been raised a little.

Funny you said that since MLS don't consider Canadian success in CCL as their own success (just look when TFC beat Galaxy in CCL and how down MLS was with defeat).

So really, it should be Canadian soccer profile that will benefit from Canadian clubs doing well in CCL.

MartinUtd
02-25-2015, 06:03 PM
Sure technically speaking it means nothing to MLS if a Canadian team advances, but there's no denying if TFC, VWC or Limpact were to advance it would be a high water mark for soccer north of the Rio Grande. Either way we're splitting hairs; until we're on par with Mexican teams we'll be using each others success to motivate ourselves.

Also FWIW it seems more people are on board with taking the CCL seriously since we beat the Galaxy 3 years ago.

PAOK17
02-25-2015, 06:53 PM
But Canadian teams consistently going deep in the CCL playoffs is exactly the rationale we need to argue for more spots. No, it's not going to happen for next year, but should over time.

CONCACAF doesn't work the same as UEFA (they allocate spots based on national coefficients), but here's a tangible example - A few years ago, Italy had 4 Champions League spots and Germany had 3. German teams were, and generally still are, staying in both Champions and Europa leagues into late stages which brought up the coefficient to give Germany 4 and reduce Italy to 3.
Furthermore, UEFA decides which teams get seeded using that same coefficient system. Each team has a coefficient based on that individual team's past record in the UEFA tournaments.

Meanwhile CONCACrap gives seedings out based on perceived national successes. So in theory, Orlando, could win the US Open Cup and automatically get seeded for the group stages. Meanwhile if TFC wins the Canadian Championship, they will be given a harder group because it's a Canadian team, despite making it to the semi finals.

If QPR were to win the EPL, they would still be seeded lower than the other English teams due to QPR's lack of recent European experiences.

Defoe
03-02-2015, 09:09 PM
Montreal at 32 k seats sold for tomorrow's CCL match per twitter

Not bad for a Tuesday night in - weather

TFC07
03-02-2015, 09:50 PM
Montreal at 32 k seats sold for tomorrow's CCL match per twitter

Not bad for a Tuesday night in - weather

So I guess Saptuo's whining actually worked?

Redpunkfiddle
03-02-2015, 10:14 PM
So I guess Saptuo's whining actually worked?

It's no 55,000 though. Had all winter to sell it too .

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 09:48 PM
Anybody else watching this? Montreal down 0-1 on a penalty kick.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 09:51 PM
Looks like Montreal will be going through..... Nevermind they got scored on late.... LOL

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 09:53 PM
Looks like Montreal will be going through..... Nevermind they got scored on late.... LOL

Nope, 1-0 for Pachuca will see Montreal eliminated, unless something happens very quickly.

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 09:54 PM
Time wasting getting ridiculous now.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 09:54 PM
Anybody else watching this? Montreal down 0-1 on a penalty kick.


Just tuned in... missed the goal.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 09:55 PM
Time wasting getting ridiculous now.


Yeah total bs

Alonso
03-03-2015, 09:56 PM
Decent turnout, whats the official attendance?

TFC07
03-03-2015, 09:57 PM
I got to admit one thing:

I miss CCL espeically with all drama and atmosphere that comes with it! TFC needs to win next V-Cup and play CCL.

TFC07
03-03-2015, 09:57 PM
Decent turnout, whats the official attendance?

Just over 38K

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 09:59 PM
Wow, that should have been a goal on that header by Montreal.

TFC07
03-03-2015, 09:59 PM
Montreal tied it up in extra time!

tfcleeds
03-03-2015, 10:00 PM
Wow...nice goal at the death.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 10:00 PM
WOW Montreal tied it up in the 93rd!!!!

TFC07
03-03-2015, 10:01 PM
Game over! Montreal advance to semi-final game!

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 10:01 PM
I'm glad I tuned in for the 2nd half! High drama at the end.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 10:03 PM
I got to admit one thing:

I miss CCL espeically with all drama and atmosphere that comes with it! TFC needs to win next V-Cup and play CCL.



Personally, its the most important tournament in North America.

I put more value in it then the league.

Yohan
03-03-2015, 10:03 PM
I hate the fact that Mtl is doing well in CCL.
but I want MLS teams to do well in CCL. ugh. the dilemma

flamehawk
03-03-2015, 10:04 PM
Personally, its the most important tournament in North America.

I put more value in it then the league.

Agreed.



And fuck, I don't care if this ruins my TFC cred. What a game, I actually celebrated that goal.

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 10:05 PM
So what happens if an MLS team is on strike at the scheduled time for a CCL game?

tfcleeds
03-03-2015, 10:05 PM
Gotta say it feels weird - cheering for the Limpact when I should hate them.

TFC07
03-03-2015, 10:05 PM
Personally, its the most important tournament in North America.

I put more value in it then the league.

Yup, unfortunately majority of TFC fans don't feel the same way.

MLS playoffs doesn't mean as much as winning CCL for me.

TFC07
03-03-2015, 10:06 PM
Gotta say it feels weird - cheering for the Limpact when I should hate them.

Hopefully CONCACAF upgrade Canada's CCL spot or give out more spots.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 10:08 PM
So what happens if an MLS team is on strike at the scheduled time for a CCL game?


Good question.

It's not an MLS game so maybe they go ahead and play it?

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 10:08 PM
Sometimes the long ball works! Who the heck is this Porter kid, that was a nice goal.

jloome
03-03-2015, 10:09 PM
Gotta say it feels weird - cheering for the Limpact when I should hate them.

I know, right? I just went "wwoooooo!" when Porter scored, then immediately thought "shit, he looks like a find. And he's playing for the fucking Limpacts."

Hell of a finish though. That kid may have just saved Joey's hide.

ManUtd4ever
03-03-2015, 10:09 PM
What an epic finish. Montreal is the first MLS team to oust a Mexican club in the CCL? Unbelievable.

I actually cheered a bit for them, which is a first for me. I would have hated to see such an important game decided by a PK.

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 10:10 PM
Good question.

It's not an MLS game so maybe they go ahead and play it?

I heard somewhere that they won't I believe, it was mentioned about one of the US teams having to decide if they're going to travel to an away CCL game. Not sure though. But if they do miss a game, I wonder if it's a forfeit, or if there's any room for a re-schedule.

Defoe
03-03-2015, 10:12 PM
that was actually FUCKED up

what a game , i love soccer man

Lennon
03-03-2015, 10:15 PM
Hating life atm.
Pretty gross how many TFC fans are cheering for our biggest rival to top our Champions League achievements.

SirBobSaget
03-03-2015, 10:17 PM
Wow amazing finish. That Ciman guy was a mistake machine after his major screw up.

Alonso
03-03-2015, 10:20 PM
Hating life atm.
Pretty gross how many TFC fans are cheering for our biggest rival to top our Champions League achievements.



An MLS team putting out a Mexican club in the CCL is a big deal.

That's a big achievement.

I get where you're coming from, but this is a big step forward for the league.

tfcleeds
03-03-2015, 10:21 PM
An MLS team putting out a Mexican club in the CCL is a big deal.

That's a big achievement.

I get where you're coming from, but this is a big step forward for the league.

Yeah, I doubt I would have been cheering for them if they hadn't been playing a Mexican team. Now that they play Alajualense in the next round, I can go back to cheering against them. Go Alajualense!

TFC07
03-03-2015, 10:22 PM
Hating life atm.
Pretty gross how many TFC fans are cheering for our biggest rival to top our Champions League achievements.

Most of TFC fans who are rooting for Montreal are rooting them because they're Canada's representative in this tournament. So Canadian club doing well in CCL can possibly lead to more spots for Canada to send their teams to play in CCL.

Also don't forget that a lot of Canadian soccer fans in TFC fanbase are CMNT fans before TFC was born. So there's that support to see Canadian soccer doing well internationally in this fanbase that you probably wouldn't see somewhere else.

OgtheDim
03-03-2015, 10:22 PM
WOW.

That is big. Very very big.

Lennon
03-03-2015, 10:29 PM
An MLS team putting out a Mexican club in the CCL is a big deal.

That's a big achievement.

I get where you're coming from, but this is a big step forward for the league.

It's weird that people have more love for MLS than hate for Montreal. Makes our rivalry look weak.


Most of TFC fans who are rooting for Montreal are rooting them because they're Canada's representative in this tournament. So Canadian club doing well in CCL can possibly lead to more spots for Canada to send their teams to play in CCL.

'Possibly'. Probably not.
I'd kinda get rooting for them if they were representing a Canadian league with Canadian players and coefficient points were at stake .. but there isn't any of that.

OgtheDim
03-03-2015, 10:34 PM
The better any Canadian team does in CCL, the better it is for Canadian teams. If Canada could score a #1 slot, TFC would likely avoid Mexican teams in the group stage. That is a HUGE bonus for us.

Cause, we are going back into this thing again in a few years.


And, to be honest, the Mexican fans treat our league, and have treated TFC, like shit. Anytime we can get a bit of payback, I'm cool with that.

Yohan
03-03-2015, 10:42 PM
What an epic finish. Montreal is the first MLS team to oust a Mexican club in the CCL? Unbelievable.

I actually cheered a bit for them, which is a first for me. I would have hated to see such an important game decided by a PK.
Seattle beat Tigres in a knockout stage in 2012-2013 edition. Montreal is the 2nd MLS team to beat a Mexican team in a knockout stage

Lennon
03-03-2015, 10:43 PM
Being thrown in Pot A instead of B really wouldn't make much of a difference. There are still 2 Mexican teams in Pot B .. CONCACAF would have to make a special 'Canadian teams can't draw Mexican teams in the group stage' rule, and I can't see that happening.

OgtheDim
03-03-2015, 10:53 PM
Being thrown in Pot A instead of B really wouldn't make much of a difference. There are still 2 Mexican teams in Pot B .. CONCACAF would have to make a special 'Canadian teams can't draw Mexican teams in the group stage' rule, and I can't see that happening.

They actually do that with US and Mexican teams.

Auzzy
03-03-2015, 11:01 PM
Anyway, we're never going to get everyone to agree about the "cheering" issue. I felt somewhat conflicted myself, and was purposely low-key on here, to also avoid upsetting any sensibilities.

But it is really hard for me to get upset about a Mexican team losing...

Lennon
03-03-2015, 11:07 PM
They actually do that with US and Mexican teams.

Yea I know, but CONCACAF doesn't care about Canadian teams advancing far in this competition.

Yohan
03-03-2015, 11:23 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_XFoLwsWBY

Ossington Mental Youth
03-03-2015, 11:35 PM
Hating life atm.
Pretty gross how many TFC fans are cheering for our biggest rival to top our Champions League achievements.

Yeah I can't ever see their fans doing the same. Mixed emotions great for league but fuck Impact hard. Basically I don't care. They're hardl the best reps for this league, but if they continue to win...

Yohan
03-03-2015, 11:38 PM
Yeah I can't ever see their fans doing the same. Mixed emotions great for league but fuck Impact hard. Basically I don't care. They're hardl the best reps for this league, but if they continue to win...if you want MLS to do well, you basically have no choice b/c DC has to win by 3 to advance

jazzy
03-04-2015, 12:24 AM
An MLS team putting out a Mexican club in the CCL is a big deal.

Absolutely!...... It's great for the league and our rivalry. And you know those fickle fans may just show up now, which makes our games great fun. We've had what 7 years to get our shit together. They also are a Canadian team, a little respect from the USA head honchos is timely needed.

Ossington Mental Youth
03-04-2015, 12:30 AM
if you want MLS to do well, you basically have no choice b/c DC has to win by 3 to advance

technically i do have a choice, just not one i want to make.
Hoping DC surprises everyone

pdogg
03-04-2015, 09:03 AM
It's our own fault that Montreal is our VC champion and Canada's representation. I'm cheering for Canada to do well in the tournament.

That may not sit will with others, but I can make that seperation. MLS - hate Montreal & Vancouver. Voyageur Cup - Hate Montreal, VW, Fury and the Eddies. CCL - Go Canadian Team Go.

Cashcleaner
03-04-2015, 09:08 AM
Personally, its the most important tournament in North America.

I put more value in it then the league.

Yep, I'm of the same mind on that. And obviously I want TFC to make it, but I'm okay with seeing any Canadian team get that sort of exposure to competitions outside of MLS. Even if it's *sigh* fucking Montreal. Seriously, though, the CCL is a great competition and seems to be getting better with each passing year. Hope we can mount a good campaign for it in 2015.

Look, I hate the Impact. FUCKING HATE THEM. But it is good to see a Canadian club make it against some of the best clubs in the confederation.

zeelaw
03-04-2015, 09:15 AM
Hating life atm.
Pretty gross how many TFC fans are cheering for our biggest rival to top our Champions League achievements.
Matching our achievements.

zeelaw
03-04-2015, 09:15 AM
Also don't forget that a lot of Canadian soccer fans in TFC fanbase are CMNT fans before TFC was born. So there's that support to see Canadian soccer doing well internationally in this fanbase that you probably wouldn't see somewhere else.
Bingo

Fort York Redcoat
03-04-2015, 09:16 AM
I love seeing so much CCL priority in here. Still can't get with the "For Canada" or "For MLS".

"cheering" and "rooting" are great in principle. I see Montreal supporters every year in the flesh. It doesn't ever inspire me to cheer or root for their team.

Again - To each his own...

Fort York Redcoat
03-04-2015, 09:19 AM
Most of TFC fans who are rooting for Montreal are rooting them because they're Canada's representative in this tournament. So Canadian club doing well in CCL can possibly lead to more spots for Canada to send their teams to play in CCL.

Also don't forget that a lot of Canadian soccer fans in TFC fanbase are CMNT fans before TFC was born. So there's that support to see Canadian soccer doing well internationally in this fanbase that you probably wouldn't see somewhere else.


Bingo

There's "a lot" of us? Cool. The more the merrier but it sure don't feel that way most days. Don't worry, I'll carry on.:canada:

pdogg
03-04-2015, 09:30 AM
Again - To each his own...

This is what it's all about. I cheer 'For Canada'. You don't see it that way. And that's cool.

As long as we all cheer for TFC.

Cashcleaner
03-04-2015, 09:35 AM
I love seeing so much CCL priority in here. Still can't get with the "For Canada" or "For MLS".

"cheering" and "rooting" are great in principle. I see Montreal supporters every year in the flesh. It doesn't ever inspire me to cheer or root for their team.

Again - To each his own...

I look at it this way: When I lived in Edinburgh my local team was Hibernian. I watched Hibs play Rangers and Celtic and all the other Scottish clubs all the time, and I never wanted to see anyone but my Hibs do well in the league. But when it came time for Champions League and UEFA Cup (now Europa League) and all the other international club competitions, I'd cheer for any Scottish club that made it. Why? Because at the end of the day it was for the betterment of all Scottish soccer. I think the same applies here as well. Canadian soccer, in general, benefits when out clubs can take on other teams in CONCACAF beyond who we play in our league.

mr k
03-04-2015, 09:50 AM
Yea I know, but CONCACAF doesn't care about Canadian teams advancing far in this competition.


With Scotiabank as a lead sponsor of CONCACAF, they might start caring if BNS starts caring about their home base.

ManUtd4ever
03-04-2015, 09:58 AM
Seattle beat Tigres in a knockout stage in 2012-2013 edition. Montreal is the 2nd MLS team to beat a Mexican team in a knockout stage

Ah, I stand corrected. Still an impressive feat though considering Montreal's lineup was basically cobbled together in the off season.

MartinUtd
03-04-2015, 10:04 AM
Can somebody explain to me point by point how Montreal winning the CCL is good for TFC? And don't tell me it motivates the players because I sincerely doubt that.

shwade
03-04-2015, 10:16 AM
More exposure
League taken more seriously
High tempo experience for players
Fans take it up a notch

Fort York Redcoat
03-04-2015, 10:20 AM
I look at it this way: When I lived in Edinburgh my local team was Hibernian. I watched Hibs play Rangers and Celtic and all the other Scottish clubs all the time, and I never wanted to see anyone but my Hibs do well in the league. But when it came time for Champions League and UEFA Cup (now Europa League) and all the other international club competitions, I'd cheer for any Scottish club that made it. Why? Because at the end of the day it was for the betterment of all Scottish soccer. I think the same applies here as well. Canadian soccer, in general, benefits when out clubs can take on other teams in CONCACAF beyond who we play in our league.

Yes I've listened to enough BBC sports Scotland SportSound over the years to get the healthy dose of UEFA or FIFA quotient talks to make anyone mad. g:D While I see the logic in it the comparison isn't exact since we have to share a league with another nation. But supporters logic has winding roads in it doesn't it?

I'd hope everyone knows where I stand on Country vs Club but I have no problem separating the two. Maybe I feel like supporting Canada as much as I can I don't care to take the hit of watching club rivals.

Richard
03-04-2015, 11:39 AM
I don't think the feelings are mutual. I cant really see an Impact fan hoping TFC or Van do well in the CCL, you know with the whole separatism thing going on in that province.

I do think its really good for Canada though, it raises the international awareness which MLS cant do. Being the best club on the continent is much better than doing well in MLS, its not like Liga MX is some joke league, its still far better overall than MLS and has produced many great players over the years.

__wowza
03-04-2015, 02:14 PM
i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

does it raise the profile of the league if they win? of course it will.
does it raise the profile of canadian soccer if they win? of course it will.
but do i want ANY other team than the impact to win this thing? you'd better fucking believe it.

i cannot, for any reason "root" for a team who'll only turn around and throw any CCL success back in our faces at the first possible opportunity. do you think they care about raising the leagues profile? do you think they care about making soccer in this country look good? no. everyone else does, but i doubt they give a fuck and nothing i've read from their supporters seems to suggest that. after all.. this is the same group of supporters who, given the role reversal, find it funny that our team has yet to make the playoffs. where was the talk about raising the canadian profile when we first entered the league? or when we made our CCL run? it was nowhere to be found because they don't give a fuck. they want to see their team succeed, they want to see their team win trophies.



fuck the impact.

Cashcleaner
03-04-2015, 02:18 PM
Can somebody explain to me point by point how Montreal winning the CCL is good for TFC? And don't tell me it motivates the players because I sincerely doubt that.


More exposure
League taken more seriously
High tempo experience for players
Fans take it up a notch

Swade mentions 4 good points right there, but let me add another.

Motivation - but no so much for the players as you mention.

The success of our rivals should fuel our own motivation as a club to do even better. This is partly why we watch videos of other groups doing tifos, or read up on the transactions of players and coaches to other teams, or look at the news of other MLS clubs who are building or planning to build new stadia. Believe it or not, it can be a pretty persuasive argument to say: "Hey, if this team can do this or that team can, why can't we?!"

Here's a great example: "If the *sigh* fucking Montreal Impact can make their way into the CCL semi-finals with all their shitty players and shitty fans in their shitty city, then there's no good reason why Toronto can't! with it's SUPERIOR players and supporters."

Jack
03-04-2015, 02:38 PM
i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

does it raise the profile of the league if they win? of course it will.
does it raise the profile of canadian soccer if they win? of course it will.
but do i want ANY other team than the impact to win this thing? you'd better fucking believe it.

i cannot, for any reason "root" for a team who'll only turn around and throw any CCL success back in our faces at the first possible opportunity. do you think they care about raising the leagues profile? do you think they care about making soccer in this country look good? no. everyone else does, but i doubt they give a fuck and nothing i've read from their supporters seems to suggest that. after all.. this is the same group of supporters who, given the role reversal, find it funny that our team has yet to make the playoffs. where was the talk about raising the canadian profile when we first entered the league? or when we made our CCL run? it was nowhere to be found because they don't give a fuck. they want to see their team succeed, they want to see their team win trophies.



fuck the impact.
Celine Dion?

Condom on?

zeelaw
03-04-2015, 02:39 PM
There's "a lot" of us? Cool. The more the merrier but it sure don't feel that way most days. Don't worry, I'll carry on.:canada:

I wouldn't say I'm cheering for MTL at all. I would say that I'm not extremely disappointed they made it through.

TorontoGooner
03-04-2015, 02:53 PM
i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

does it raise the profile of the league if they win? of course it will.
does it raise the profile of canadian soccer if they win? of course it will.
but do i want ANY other team than the impact to win this thing? you'd better fucking believe it.

i cannot, for any reason "root" for a team who'll only turn around and throw any CCL success back in our faces at the first possible opportunity. do you think they care about raising the leagues profile? do you think they care about making soccer in this country look good? no. everyone else does, but i doubt they give a fuck and nothing i've read from their supporters seems to suggest that. after all.. this is the same group of supporters who, given the role reversal, find it funny that our team has yet to make the playoffs. where was the talk about raising the canadian profile when we first entered the league? or when we made our CCL run? it was nowhere to be found because they don't give a fuck. they want to see their team succeed, they want to see their team win trophies.



fuck the impact.

This is my exact feeling. If it was Vancouver, I wouldn't wish them any ill in the CCL.

But Impact fans are a nasty bunch who you only hear when they're winning

Jack
03-04-2015, 02:56 PM
Do you eat Saputo cheese?

Saputo cheese on your knees?

WestStandGeoff
03-04-2015, 03:03 PM
I don't think the feelings are mutual. I cant really see an Impact fan hoping TFC or Van do well in the CCL, you know with the whole separatism thing going on in that province.


i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

So what if the feelings aren't mutual? So what if Limpact fans didn't support us when were were in a similar position?

Personally, I think most Limpact fans are petty little whinny bitches, so I'm not going to benchmark what I do or think based on anything they do.

Ossington Mental Youth
03-04-2015, 03:03 PM
i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

does it raise the profile of the league if they win? of course it will.
does it raise the profile of canadian soccer if they win? of course it will.
but do i want ANY other team than the impact to win this thing? you'd better fucking believe it.

i cannot, for any reason "root" for a team who'll only turn around and throw any CCL success back in our faces at the first possible opportunity. do you think they care about raising the leagues profile? do you think they care about making soccer in this country look good? no. everyone else does, but i doubt they give a fuck and nothing i've read from their supporters seems to suggest that. after all.. this is the same group of supporters who, given the role reversal, find it funny that our team has yet to make the playoffs. where was the talk about raising the canadian profile when we first entered the league? or when we made our CCL run? it was nowhere to be found because they don't give a fuck. they want to see their team succeed, they want to see their team win trophies.



fuck the impact.

yep, this

pdogg
03-04-2015, 03:08 PM
So what if the feelings aren't mutual? So what if Limpact fans didn't support us when were were in a similar position?

Personally, I think most Limpact fans are petty little whinny bitches, so I'm not going to benchmark what I do or think based on anything they do.

Yup.

MartinUtd
03-04-2015, 04:04 PM
Swade mentions 4 good points right there, but let me add another.

Motivation - but no so much for the players as you mention.

The success of our rivals should fuel our own motivation as a club to do even better. This is partly why we watch videos of other groups doing tifos, or read up on the transactions of players and coaches to other teams, or look at the news of other MLS clubs who are building or planning to build new stadia. Believe it or not, it can be a pretty persuasive argument to say: "Hey, if this team can do this or that team can, why can't we?!"

Here's a great example: "If the *sigh* fucking Montreal Impact can make their way into the CCL semi-finals with all their shitty players and shitty fans in their shitty city, then there's no good reason why Toronto can't! with it's SUPERIOR players and supporters."

But we have gone this far. In 2012 we went to the CCL semi finals against Santos Laguna.

I suppose yes, it could motivate the organization to strive for continental greatness, but in in the end that comes down to whether or not the current manager values it over the domestic league (see:Nelsen). Either way it's a bit convoluted to suggest Montreal's success would influence such a decision.

Regarding the fans, I don't see how Montreal winning helps there either. BMO can barely get 12k for CCL group stage games, that could change with TFC success in the CCL but Montreal's will have little if any effect on our ability to hype up fans.

Oldtimer
03-04-2015, 04:10 PM
Regarding the fans, I don't see how Montreal winning helps there either. BMO can barely get 12k for CCL group stage games, that could change with TFC success in the CCL but Montreal's will have little if any effect on our ability to hype up fans.

If MTL made it to the Club World Cup and played some big names, it would raise the profile of continental competition immensely.

I don't think that they will, but some day some MLS club will win the CCL and then we'll see.

TFC07
03-04-2015, 04:23 PM
If MTL made it to the Club World Cup and played some big names, it would raise the profile of continental competition immensely.

I don't think that they will, but some day some MLS club will win the CCL and then we'll see.

If TFC wants to become a global brand, then playing in Club World Cup could help them a lot more than winning MLS Cup (don't get me wrong, I want TFC playing in every competition such Supporters Sheild, MLS Cup, CCL and even CWC one day).

__wowza
03-04-2015, 04:29 PM
So what if the feelings aren't mutual? So what if Limpact fans didn't support us when were were in a similar position?

Personally, I think most Limpact fans are petty little whinny bitches, so I'm not going to benchmark what I do or think based on anything they do.

i understand the bigger man argument. i really do, but you can only be the bigger man if the other party resolves to put aside their resentment as well. that won't happen anytime soon. it'll be a wholly one sided affair. it's the equivalent of being happy for an ex finding a new parter after they've treated you like shit for 8 years. call it bitterness, whatever, it still won't change the fact that it:

- won't stop them from ripping up our seats.
- won't stop them from challenging random TFC fans to fights.
- won't stop them from hurling batteries, coins, drinks and spit at families and fans trying to leave BMO.
- won't stop them from stealing a banners joe paid for so they could lay it down at their bar and walk all over it.
- won't stop them from vandalizing our bar, our stadium or the route there.

we've already proved we're classier than they are for not doing any of this, but where does that leave us after the fact? cheering them on in the CCL? what if they make a run at the supporters shield, or cup? are we going to hope that they do well under the pretence of "canadian soccer" or an "MLS profile"? is a slight increase in the canadian soccer/MLS profile worth them holding a cup over our/the rest of the leagues heads until we win one? especially knowing that they'll keep doing the same stupid shit they always do? not to me.

i'm not trying to play to extremes, i'm only trying to present the argument i subscribe to.

BuSaPuNk
03-04-2015, 04:42 PM
i understand the bigger man argument. i really do, but you can only be the bigger man if the other party resolves to put aside their resentment as well. that won't happen anytime soon. it'll be a wholly one sided affair. it's the equivalent of being happy for an ex finding a new parter after they've treated you like shit for 8 years. call it bitterness, whatever, it still won't change the fact that it:

- that won't stop them from ripping up our seats.
- that won't stop them from challenging random TFC fans to fights.
- that won't stop them from hurling batteries, coins, drinks and spit at families and fans trying to leave BMO.
- that won't stop them from stealing a banners joe paid for so they could lay it down at their bar and walk all over it.
- that won't stop them from vandalizing our bar, our stadium or the route there.

we've already proved we're classier than they are for not doing any of this, but where does that leave us after the fact? cheering them on in the CCL? what if they make a run at the supporters shield, or cup? are we going to hope that they do well under the pretence of "canadian soccer" or an "MLS profile"? is a slight increase in the canadian soccer/MLS profile worth them holding a cup over our/the rest of the leagues heads until we win one? especially knowing that they'll keep doing the same stupid shit they always do? not to me.

i'm not trying to play to extremes, i'm only trying to present the argument i subscribe to.

And a lot of us subscribe too! preach brother wowza...... Testify!

Fuck Montreal period. Could care less about raising this and raising that. If it was Edmonton, Ottawa, Hell even Vancouver (which I hope it won't be so they never get a hold of the Voyageurs Cup) then I wouldn't mind the hey wish ya the best.

Montreal fuck them. I hope they crash out just like they did in the playoffs and show what kind of team they are. Just like there supporters classless shit heads.

Kaz
03-04-2015, 04:50 PM
Here is the deal.... I support a Canadian Team representing the Canadian slot in an international football competition.

I give a rates ass about limpact players... they got 38k for quarter final match they didn't paper. The first time they went to Quarters it was a big deal.

This is the second time a Canadian team has gone to the Semis... and there is a half way decent chance they may go to the finals. (don't think they will beat Atlante)

This means that 2 Canadian Clubs and 3 American Clubs have seen the semi finals since 2008.

Yet Guatamala is a Pot A country and Canada is a Pot B country... why?

Why does Costa Rica with a 12 team top division have 3 spots but Canada with 5 regularly making it to the late stages only have 1?



Edit (originally I called out Honduras who have had 4 Quarter Final Appearances.. I meant Guatamala who have had 2.. I got the flags confused for some reason)

Richard
03-04-2015, 05:23 PM
Guatemala and Costa Rica have a top division while Canada does not. They discriminate against Canada because we are in the MLS, when its comes to soccer we're like a third world country.

In addition we play a cup tourney of 4 clubs, that's nothing compared to a full season, even a division with 12 teams is better than nothing at all.

It kind of is shameful that we don't have a Div. 1 league throughout Canada, but unfortunately their isn't enough revenue in the game to cover the costs it would take to run a nation wide league.

The NA/CA combined sports leagues doesn't really happen anywhere else, it doesn't favour us at all since we only have 3 relevant clubs in all of Canada playing in MLS.

Its always going to be an uphill fight when you don't even have a league, were just piggybacking off MLS. Three Canadian clubs cant make a league, we don't even have enough support like the CFL does out in western Canada.

Dan the man
03-04-2015, 05:38 PM
Hello TFC fans,


first of all, i'm an impact fan and a french speaker québécois. My english is pretty bad to. That's a bad start for me !!!


just want to tell you that we are a lot of fans around here that are not TFC haters. And, yes, we supported TFC against Santos Laguna in CCL ! Yesterday we were 38 000 at the olympic stadium. How many of these fans are TFC haters ? Maybe 300. And how many of them are writing some shit about your team on montreal forums ? Maybe 50 !!!


I'm a little bit tired to hear that we are some kind of angry, unclass separatists who are cheering each time that TFC loose a game. A lot of fans around here have canadian soccer at heart. You know, we can find some bad fans in Montreal, in Toronto, in Vancouver, even in barcelona ! But there is some respectual fans everywhere to.


i wish TFC fans a great season ! Let's make a classy rivality with are teams !


sorry again for my poor english !

Auzzy
03-04-2015, 06:13 PM
Hello TFC fans,

first of all, i'm an impact fan and a french speaker québécois. My english is pretty bad to. That's a bad start for me !!!

just want to tell you that we are a lot of fans around here that are not TFC haters. And, yes, we supported TFC against Santos Laguna in CCL ! Yesterday we were 38 000 at the olympic stadium. How many of these fans are TFC haters ? Maybe 300. And how many of them are writing some shit about your team on montreal forums ? Maybe 50 !!!

I'm a little bit tired to hear that we are some kind of angry, unclass separatists who are cheering each time that TFC loose a game. A lot of fans around here have canadian soccer at heart. You know, we can find some bad fans in Montreal, in Toronto, in Vancouver, even in barcelona ! But there is some respectual fans everywhere to.

i wish TFC fans a great season ! Let's make a classy rivality with are teams !

sorry again for my poor english !

Cheers Dan!

As I said above, I don't think everyone on this board can ever come to agreement on cheering/quietly supporting/at least not hating/or absolutely hating that the Impact made it through to the next round. Let's just agree to disagree! I don't think anyone is going to get convinced either way, even if this thread goes to 100 pages. I think everyone realizes it's a very touchy subject, and people will make up their mind the way that fits them best.

Let's also be kind to "Dan the man" here. I know about the problems that have happened during some of the Impact games, both here & in Montreal. But my family & I had an awesome time whenever we were in Montreal -- either for a TFC game, or just to visit. We were always treated well, at the stadium & elsewhere, even (or especially) when walking around wearing TFC gear.

I know that others have had different experiences. But realize that Dan & other classy Impact fans can't control the goons, just like we can't control the folks that show up late and leave early en mass at BMO Field; we can't control the few real idiot TFC fans I saw in Montreal; and some of the other annoyances we have seen from TFC fans.

Anyway, let's hope we even have an MLS season, and lets hope that goons everywhere are kept in check!

Auzzy
03-04-2015, 06:24 PM
^ Hmm, I wonder why I can't edit my message. In both IE & Chrome, when I try to edit, it shows up as a completely blank message...

OgtheDim
03-04-2015, 06:30 PM
^ Hmm, I wonder why I can't edit my message. In both IE & Chrome, when I try to edit, it shows up as a completely blank message...

Good to know....its happening to me in Firefox too.

themodelcitizen
03-04-2015, 07:55 PM
i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

Considering you're remembering the wrong Mexican team (it was Santos Laguna in the semis) I'm not sure I'll rely on your account of that one. Anyways who cares what they think in that small-time French outpost, honestly? You can want to see the team do well without worrying about that.

UltraSuperMegaMo
03-04-2015, 08:51 PM
People talk about and MLS team winning the Club World Cup raising the profile of the league, and I get what they're saying / where they're coming from, BUT I'm a huge football fan (I knew players on Maribor before the played in the UCL), yet I've never watched a single match of the Club World Cup, barely even see the highlights.

jloome
03-04-2015, 09:29 PM
People talk about and MLS team winning the Club World Cup raising the profile of the league, and I get what they're saying / where they're coming from, BUT I'm a huge football fan (I knew players on Maribor before the played in the UCL), yet I've never watched a single match of the Club World Cup, barely even see the highlights.

This is a form of logical fallacy, extending one's own circumstances and assuming they're the norm. I've watched it several times over the years. Always interesting to see how a team from Brazil or Argentina will do against a European power.

tfcleeds
03-04-2015, 09:50 PM
Let's also be kind to "Dan the man" here. I know about the problems that have happened during some of the Impact games, both here & in Montreal. But my family & I had an awesome time whenever we were in Montreal -- either for a TFC game, or just to visit. We were always treated well, at the stadium & elsewhere, even (or especially) when walking around wearing TFC gear.

I know that others have had different experiences. But realize that Dan & other classy Impact fans can't control the goons, just like we can't control the folks that show up late and leave early en mass at BMO Field; we can't control the few real idiot TFC fans I saw in Montreal; and some of the other annoyances we have seen from TFC fans.

Anyway, let's hope we even have an MLS season, and lets hope that goons everywhere are kept in check!

Heck, I had a chunk of concrete thrown at my head, unprovoked, as I was leaving BMO one time after a Limpact game, from the visitors section, and even I cheered for them last night. (now, I was under the mistaken impression that no MLS team had ever knocked out a Mexican team in CCL - had I known that at the time, I may well have cheered for Pachuca - forgot all about Seattle beating Tigres a couple years back). But no matter, it was an exciting game, and the Impact won. Cheers to them. I won't be cheering for them going forward, however. If a MLS team ever wins the freaking thing, I want it to be TFC.

UltraSuperMegaMo
03-04-2015, 09:51 PM
^ Well, it's not a highly viewed event. Even you're phrasing, "several times over the years" is fairly indicative of the indifference it's viewed even by huge football fans. My understanding is the only place it's popular in South America.

I've often wondered why a Mexican team can never sneak into the final? Mexican teams defeat South American in club competition now and again, so you'd think they'd break through in the CWC. This year's Club America team looks very impressive attacking at times, so maybe?

Auzzy
03-04-2015, 09:55 PM
Heck, I had a chunk of concrete thrown at my head, unprovoked, as I was leaving BMO one time after a Limpact game, from the visitors section, and even I cheered for them last night. (now, I was under the mistaken impression that no MLS team had ever knocked out a Mexican team in CCL - had I known that at the time, I may well have cheered for Pachuca - forgot all about Seattle beating Tigres a couple years back). But no matter, it was an exciting game, and the Impact won. Cheers to them. I won't be cheering for them going forward, however. If a MLS team ever wins the freaking thing, I want it to be TFC.

Wow that sucks about the concrete!

Jack
03-04-2015, 10:11 PM
i understand the bigger man argument. i really do, but you can only be the bigger man if the other party resolves to put aside their resentment as well. that won't happen anytime soon. it'll be a wholly one sided affair. it's the equivalent of being happy for an ex finding a new parter after they've treated you like shit for 8 years. call it bitterness, whatever, it still won't change the fact that it:

- won't stop them from ripping up our seats.
- won't stop them from challenging random TFC fans to fights.
- won't stop them from hurling batteries, coins, drinks and spit at families and fans trying to leave BMO.
- won't stop them from stealing a banners joe paid for so they could lay it down at their bar and walk all over it.
- won't stop them from vandalizing our bar, our stadium or the route there.

we've already proved we're classier than they are for not doing any of this, but where does that leave us after the fact? cheering them on in the CCL? what if they make a run at the supporters shield, or cup? are we going to hope that they do well under the pretence of "canadian soccer" or an "MLS profile"? is a slight increase in the canadian soccer/MLS profile worth them holding a cup over our/the rest of the leagues heads until we win one? especially knowing that they'll keep doing the same stupid shit they always do? not to me.

i'm not trying to play to extremes, i'm only trying to present the argument i subscribe to.
Did you know Pierre Laporte?

Pierre Laporte? A la morte?

Lennon
03-04-2015, 10:33 PM
I look at it this way: When I lived in Edinburgh my local team was Hibernian. I watched Hibs play Rangers and Celtic and all the other Scottish clubs all the time, and I never wanted to see anyone but my Hibs do well in the league. But when it came time for Champions League and UEFA Cup (now Europa League) and all the other international club competitions, I'd cheer for any Scottish club that made it. Why? Because at the end of the day it was for the betterment of all Scottish soccer. I think the same applies here as well. Canadian soccer, in general, benefits when out clubs can take on other teams in CONCACAF beyond who we play in our league.

I get that, but the situation in your example is not quite the same as TFC/Montreal.
1. Rangers/Celtic aren't Hibs biggest rivals (I don't believe)
2. Those teams were full of Scottish players representing a Scottish league. Not a single minute was played by a Canadian player in this tie, MLS isn't a Canadian league, and MLS hasn't shown that they really care about the development of Canadian players.
3. Coefficient points. Nothing like this in CONCACAF.


Matching our achievements.

Well yea, but I'm assuming that most people that cheered for them vs. Pachuca will be rooting for them to advance to the final.


i didn't read any support on impact forums during our CCL matches against cruz azul. none.
it was all "fuck TFC" this and "i hope they fall on their faces" that.

does it raise the profile of the league if they win? of course it will.
does it raise the profile of canadian soccer if they win? of course it will.
but do i want ANY other team than the impact to win this thing? you'd better fucking believe it.

i cannot, for any reason "root" for a team who'll only turn around and throw any CCL success back in our faces at the first possible opportunity. do you think they care about raising the leagues profile? do you think they care about making soccer in this country look good? no. everyone else does, but i doubt they give a fuck and nothing i've read from their supporters seems to suggest that. after all.. this is the same group of supporters who, given the role reversal, find it funny that our team has yet to make the playoffs. where was the talk about raising the canadian profile when we first entered the league? or when we made our CCL run? it was nowhere to be found because they don't give a fuck. they want to see their team succeed, they want to see their team win trophies.



fuck the impact.

+1
If they get past 'La Liga' they'll be playing a Champions League final in a packed Azteca. It doesn't get much better then that. Makes me sick that those douchebags from Montreal would get to experience something like that before us.

Alonso
03-04-2015, 11:25 PM
Hello TFC fans,


first of all, i'm an impact fan and a french speaker québécois. My english is pretty bad to. That's a bad start for me !!!


just want to tell you that we are a lot of fans around here that are not TFC haters. And, yes, we supported TFC against Santos Laguna in CCL ! Yesterday we were 38 000 at the olympic stadium. How many of these fans are TFC haters ? Maybe 300. And how many of them are writing some shit about your team on montreal forums ? Maybe 50 !!!


I'm a little bit tired to hear that we are some kind of angry, unclass separatists who are cheering each time that TFC loose a game. A lot of fans around here have canadian soccer at heart. You know, we can find some bad fans in Montreal, in Toronto, in Vancouver, even in barcelona ! But there is some respectual fans everywhere to.


i wish TFC fans a great season ! Let's make a classy rivality with are teams !


sorry again for my poor english !


Great to hear Dan, thanks for contributing to the discussion.

It's good to hear that some of our interest for a fellow MLS and Canadian club competing internationally are reciprocated by some Limpact fans as well.

MartinUtd
03-05-2015, 12:17 AM
Classy words from Dan.

It just goes to show there's all different kinds of people supporting each team. You'll find everything thing from neutral enthusiasts of the game to self styled "ultra" sociopaths (not all ultras, just the types that throw concrete at people).

Having said that, sometimes it's nice to indulge and let tribalism get the better of you. So fuck the Impact.

PAOK17
03-05-2015, 12:30 AM
The only reason I would Montreal to do decent (i.e. not go too far) is to keep their fans interested enough that they don't lose their team. This is the same city that was averaging 6000 fans per game for the Expos before losing them. In order to have a strong rivalry, you need a half-decent opponent.

Yes, the profile of the league improves. But it would just the same if any MLS club won.

Until someone here can prove to me how CONCACAF determines the number of entries per country in the CCL, then there is no reason to expect Canada to ever have either a Pot A team or multiple entries. Right now it's completely arbitrary with no coefficient system. TFC could win CCL 10 years in a row and they would still be seeded lower than a debutant Mexican team.

Then again, this is the same Confederation that has hosted all of it's continental championships in the same country :facepalm:.

kodiakTFC
03-05-2015, 12:48 AM
Having lived in Montreal for school during their USL days, I have stood in their supporters section many times. They are great supporters and whilst we have a rivalry, there is still a great level of respect that exists between both sides. Also, many of their supporters are Voyageurs like many of we are. I was there in Montreal when we played Honduras two cycles ago. That game felt like an away game, and many of us bonded with MTL supporters before/during/after the game.

In a competition like this I cant help but support Montreal, or any other MLS side, and once we're all eliminated.. any team that isn't Mexican! I desperately want to see this sport succeed in Canada, a healthy and successful (against everyone but TFC) MTL is a necessary. We don't need to 'hate' our rivals. Everton and Liverpool don't hate each other. No one denies that this friendly rivalry isn't also quite intense. Maybe I just have a soft spot for the city though.

__wowza
03-05-2015, 02:28 PM
Considering you're remembering the wrong Mexican team (it was Santos Laguna in the semis) I'm not sure I'll rely on your account of that one. Anyways who cares what they think in that small-time French outpost, honestly? You can want to see the team do well without worrying about that.

you're right, i got my years mixed up, but claiming an argument from fallacy doesn't really make it any less true.
like i said though.. i really can't cheer for them. most of the thread has been people split down the middle about this, and that's fine. i was just explaining my reasoning and mentioning that, above all else, people are openly advocating cheering on our rivals.



Hello TFC fans,


first of all, i'm an impact fan and a french speaker québécois. My english is pretty bad to. That's a bad start for me !!!


just want to tell you that we are a lot of fans around here that are not TFC haters. And, yes, we supported TFC against Santos Laguna in CCL ! Yesterday we were 38 000 at the olympic stadium. How many of these fans are TFC haters ? Maybe 300. And how many of them are writing some shit about your team on montreal forums ? Maybe 50 !!!


I'm a little bit tired to hear that we are some kind of angry, unclass separatists who are cheering each time that TFC loose a game. A lot of fans around here have canadian soccer at heart. You know, we can find some bad fans in Montreal, in Toronto, in Vancouver, even in barcelona ! But there is some respectual fans everywhere to.


i wish TFC fans a great season ! Let's make a classy rivality with are teams !


sorry again for my poor english !

vous remercier pour la contribution dan!
je ne ai aucune mauvaise volonté envers les fans. comme vous le dites vous-même, il arrive partout.. toutefois, l'impact " ultras " causer de nombreux problèmes entre les équipes .

désolé pour mon horribles français , je sais un peu seulement.