Defoe for Altidore plus undisclosed negotiation TBD

[donkeyTFC]

According to TSN this is a done deal.
http://www.tsn.ca/toronto-fc-completes-swap-deal-altidore-to-toronto-defoe-to-sunderland-1.181889

Thoughts?

[KGH]

Love it.

Jozy is 25, 6'1" and will be hungry to prove England was a blip in his career. Hopefully he works well with Goalberto
Curious to see what TFC is allowed to do with the cash (if it counts as Gerber $)

I hope this is the guy that shows up:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdvcYCBi0YU

[pdubs]

With us apprently getting cash i would seem the "10 teams interested in Defoe" could be true. Bez wheeling and dealing.

[Richard]

Love it.

Jozy is 25, 6'1" and will be hungry to prove England was a blip in his career. Hopefully he works well with Goalberto
Curious to see what TFC is allowed to do with the cash (if it counts as Gerber $)

I hope this is the guy that shows up:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdvcYCBi0YU

Im going to counter lol.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYUVAGBAwCM&feature=player_embedded

[scooter]

that sounds great but hope we dont trade gilberto next thing you know he will score 20 goals for the red bulls or even worse the fucking crew

[KGH]

Im going to counter lol.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYUVAGBAwCM&feature=player_embedded

Touche. Thats why I said I hope this one shows up.

[glaze]

The way I read that article was MLS is getting Altidore, and TFC is signing Giovinco.

It will be interesting how this plays out.

[BuSaPuNk]

Either way it's a great deal. We got back what we paid for Defoe. Amazing work by Bez.

So fucking pumped right now.

[pdubs]

I can't believe we made 1 million in actual profit. amazing.

[arsenal]

I can't believe we made 1 million in actual profit. amazing.

Any word on whether we are eating any of Defoe's salary or the transfer fee for Altidore?

[carnifex2005]

Any word on whether we are eating any of Defoe's salary or the transfer fee for Altidore?

From the TSN story, reports out of England indicate Defoe has signed a 3 and a half year deal worth £80,000 per week so I'm guessing not.

[pdubs]

Any word on whether we are eating any of Defoe's salary or the transfer fee for Altidore?

http://www.tsn.ca/toronto-fc-completes-swap-deal-altidore-to-toronto-defoe-to-sunderland-1.181889

Reports out of England indicate Defoe has signed a 3 and a half year deal worth £80,000 per week ($129,000) with Sunderland.

Similar or even a little more then what he was making with us! We eat none of it apparently

[Canary10]

With us apprently getting cash i would seem the "10 teams interested in Defoe" could be true. Bez wheeling and dealing.

Wasn't Bez.

[pdubs]

Wasn't Bez.

So Bez is attending the coffee maker?

[Defoe]

The way I read that article was MLS is getting Altidore, and TFC is signing Giovinco.

It will be interesting how this plays out.

Valeri + Johnson for Warner + Altidore


--------Gilberto------
Valeri - Bradley - ?????
------ - Johnson -

[Canary10]

So Bez is attending the coffee maker?

Maybe. Lieweke did the dealing.

[arsenal]

http://www.tsn.ca/toronto-fc-completes-swap-deal-altidore-to-toronto-defoe-to-sunderland-1.181889

Reports out of England indicate Defoe has signed a 3 and a half year deal worth £80,000 per week ($129,000) with Sunderland.

Similar or even a little more then what he was making with us! We eat none of it apparently



Thanks for the info. Hope that is the case as it would indeed be a big coup. Can't help but be skeptical though with Lieweke involved and his ego that we end up making some big deal with record transfer fee but somehow or another pass significant money back through some other mechanism (portion of wages, inflated Altidore transfer fee, crazy appearance fee for friendly). Regardless good to have the distraction over and looks like they have plan in place for other pieces.

[OgtheDim]

So Bez is attending the coffee maker?

Well, he is a proven judge of good coffee talent...... :)


The story will come out as to who did what in this, probably once its all done and dusted.

(I'm still waiting to see Defoe put on a Sunderland shirt and Altidore a TFC one).

[Canary10]

Well, he is a proven judge of good coffee talent...... :)


The story will come out as to who did what in this, probably once its all done and dusted.

(I'm still waiting to see Defoe put on a Sunderland shirt and Altidore a TFC one).

There was an article on TSN or Sportsnet last week saying Lieweke was in England selling Defoe.

[pdubs]

Maybe. Lieweke did the dealing.

It is obviously a team effort. Bez is the GM of this team and therefore involved. TL hasn't been seen or heard in a long while and he is leaving in a few months. This is Bez's team and granted it would make sense TL could have had a major role in this but until I read otherwise, In Bez we trust.

Edit- front office aha

[pdubs]

There was an article on TSN or Sportsnet last week saying Lieweke was in England selling Defoe.

I wonder if their is any meat to the fact MLSE can't find a replacement and want TL to stay?

[Canary10]

I wonder if their is any meat to the fact MLSE can't find a replacement and want TL to stay?

I remember they couldn't get a comment from him on that because he was off in England. Probably it's true. They seem to have overestimated the interest in the job.

[DoubleUp]

Love it.

Jozy is 25, 6'1" and will be hungry to prove England was a blip in his career. Hopefully he works well with Goalberto
Curious to see what TFC is allowed to do with the cash (if it counts as Gerber $)

I hope this is the guy that shows up:





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdvcYCBi0YU

If jozy plays like this then him and Gilberto will do well, thats the type of hold and link up we need to activate Gilbertos ability.

[andmat]

How much allocation do we get from a dealing defoe anyone know\/

[OgtheDim]

I remember they couldn't get a comment from him on that because he was off in England. Probably it's true. They seem to have overestimated the interest in the job.

If TL somehow managed to get Bogers to buy out Tannenbaum, that would be a good thing for everybody at MLSE - it would be the only way for TL to stay though.

[Blixa]

It's a bloody big deal!

[Defoe]

so

11 million for Defoe

and

Altidore MIGHT be a separate deal with MLS.

Unsure of final details, we should know soon

[reggie]

i may be wrong..something like..660k?

[andmat]

What i mean is how much Allocation Money can we get from the 11mill?

[Areathrasher]

so

11 million for Defoe

and

Altidore MIGHT be a separate deal with MLS.

Unsure of final details, we should know soon

"It's the league that is driving that process to get [Altidore] signed," he said.
http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/19/blog/post/2242353/mix-diskerud-the-right-player-for-jason-kreis-new-york-city-fc

From earlier today. May be on to something with that.

[notthesun]

Great move.

[reggie]

660k for the defoe 11mil..but it depends on the jozy transfer fee..if we get him

[Areathrasher]

What i mean is how much Allocation Money can we get from the 11mill?

650k

[molenshtain]

What i mean is how much Allocation Money can we get from the 11mill?

There's a maximum amount of allocation you can recieve on a transfer fee. 660k doesn't sound wrong.

[andmat]

So we should get about 660k from selling defoe? but we will never know cuz of Mls rules

[Defoe]

There's a maximum amount of allocation you can recieve on a transfer fee. 660k doesn't sound wrong.

and where does the rest of the money go?

[Fort York Redcoat]

I really expect the American fans to come out and support now. To join all the Brazilians coming out to see Gila, of course.

[Pint]

and where does the rest of the money go?

League takes some, and club takes the rest for "reinvestment".

Between Defoe, Henry, Laba we should have 1.5Mil in allocation...

[Pint]

I really expect the American fans to come out and support now. To join all the Brazilians coming out to see Gila, of course.

You joke but I know a few of the steel army (pittsburgh riverhounds supporters) are TFC fans now after the bradley signing.

[mowe]

League takes some, and club takes the rest for "reinvestment".

Between Defoe, Henry, Laba we should have 1.5Mil in allocation...

If the league doesn't add another DP slot, that might be enough to buy down Gilberto.

[AdamAM]

What formation would we play now? Seems like a logjam up front if we get Giovinco. Honestly I would much rather have a DP midfielder to complement Bradley or a DP CB (yes, I've heard that's a no-no but with the state our backline is in....) instead of Altidore. Gilberto and Giovinco would do fine on their own IMO.

[Fort York Redcoat]

You joke but I know a few of the steel army (pittsburgh riverhounds supporters) are TFC fans now after the bradley signing.

That's great. It's also the number of influx I'd expect. I'm just venting from over expecting last year potential support. Don't mind me...

[DoubleUp]

^ Depending on players to bring support is not what we want. We want support to come from the product on the field.


Their are lots of people that want to support a TFC that plays "good football".

[OgtheDim]

Rollins has this wrinkle on things.

" Technically a team in front of TFC could put a claim on him. However, CSN was also told that no MLS team was allowed to talk to Altidore other than TFC over the past week as this deal fell into place. "

[Yohan]

whoever thinks Portland will give up Valeri for Altidore, you're nuts lol

[molenshtain]

What formation would we play now? Seems like a logjam up front if we get Giovinco. Honestly I would much rather have a DP midfielder to complement Bradley or a DP CB (yes, I've heard that's a no-no but with the state our backline is in....) instead of Altidore. Gilberto and Giovinco would do fine on their own IMO.

4-1-2-1-2. We played it at the end of the year with Vanney and it puts each of our DP's in the best position to succeed. also means we don't have to add 2 wingers to our shopping list this off-season. Just a starting CDM, one and a half starting CB's and probably another MLS capable CM, along with whatever depth options they felt necessary.

[ManUtd4ever]

For what it's worth...


Duane Rollins ‏@24thminute 37m37 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/24thminute/status/555189505641422848) Was told that Altidore's people have only been allowed to talk to TFC. PDX and NYRB did not get access.

[MightyDM]

Is it possible that we do not get Altidore? That he goes to NY in the allocation? And if so, is that a bad thing, or would Tim L be a genius for getting our money back for Defoe and using it to buy a number 10?

[reggie]

im sure TFC talked to MLS about the transfer and all this allo stuff before they closed the deal...didnt they ..:drinking:

[OgtheDim]

Union beat reporter just chimed in with this:

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 5m 5 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200142174089216)

Just to reiterate, I'm told Jozy Altidore will NOT be subject to the allocation process, same way Bradley and Dempsey rejoined the league



https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 5m 5 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200392615952384)

And I think whatever team goes in for Kljestan, be it NY, or LA, or even Philly, they likely WILL have to go through allocation to get him.


https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 4m 4 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200787375456257)

So we can pretty safely say the mystery "threshold" is set around $2.5m for returning U.S. international players

[Detroit_TFC]

Have to admit, I'm stunned that Sunderland is willing to go �£80K/wk for Defoe's wages. But, it's a pittance if it helps keep them in the Premier League. The main thing is the Defoe situation is resolved well before the end of the window.

Let's see how the next steps fall in place, getting Giovinco would be mighty fine.

[notthesun]

Altidore is coming here and that's done and dusted. As far as allocation is concerned it's simply a matter of whether MLS will actually let us sign a player, or if they'll insist we sacrifice some Garber bucks in order to get the right to sign him. Hopefully the former but not a big deal either if not.

[Detroit_TFC]

Union beat reporter just chimed in with this:

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 5m 5 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200142174089216)

Just to reiterate, I'm told Jozy Altidore will NOT be subject to the allocation process, same way Bradley and Dempsey rejoined the league



https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 5m 5 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200392615952384)

And I think whatever team goes in for Kljestan, be it NY, or LA, or even Philly, they likely WILL have to go through allocation to get him.


https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/542560181041635330/My7tFRRw_normal.png Kevin Kinkead @KevinKCBS3 (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3) · 4m 4 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/KevinKCBS3/status/555200787375456257)

So we can pretty safely say the mystery "threshold" is set around $2.5m for returning U.S. international players

Holy shit, right after all the "we're back to the allocation order" song and dance that the league did with the Mix Diskerud signing. People are going to throw a fit.

[Pookie]

I think this is one of those win wins. Defoe is a fantastic player and some of the personal shots he has taken are over the top.

At the same time, it was a bad contract for TFC. Given age, injury and MLS' structure that doesn't allow for replacements.

If Altidore comes, he's much younger and someone that you could include as part of a long term core.

I wish Defoe all the best and welcome Altidore enthusiastically.

[Defoe]

I think this is one of those win wins. Defoe is a fantastic player and some of the personal shots he has taken are over the top.

At the same time, it was a bad contract for TFC. Given age, injury and MLS' structure that doesn't allow for replacements.

If Altidore comes, he's much younger and someone that you could include as part of a long term core.

I wish Defoe all the best and welcome Altidore enthusiastically.

agreed, can't hate on Defoe to much, at least he was willing to come over. I hope he helps Sunderland maintain their place in the EPL

[Joe Kool]

So Vancouver called because they heard we had possibly 4 DP's.....

[DoubleUp]

4-1-2-1-2. We played it at the end of the year with Vanney and it puts each of our DP's in the best position to succeed. also means we don't have to add 2 wingers to our shopping list this off-season. Just a starting CDM, one and a half starting CB's and probably another MLS capable CM, along with whatever depth options they felt necessary.


Yes!.


jozy-Gilberto
---giovinco
Bradley--Osario/warner/upgrade
--------DM

Creativity is solved with Gilberto and Giovinco in attack. The real question is the DM.

[69Chevy396]

Don't hold your breath for Altidore in a TFC kit. He will likely be shipped away like so many before him, and we will plod on supporting the Mysterious Laughing Stock Enterprise, for years to come.

[molenshtain]

Yes!.


jozy-Gilberto
---giovinco
Bradley--Osario/warner/upgrade
--------DM

Creativity is solved with Gilberto and Giovinco in attack. The real question is the DM.

yup. I think it's very likely we see an older "water carrier" type come in from Mexico or south America, like the Farre guy from a month ago or like the Pineda signing for seattle last year. This draft is deep as hell at CDM and I think it's very likely we spend one of our picks on a guy we can groom behind a 200-300k cost type veteran.

[molenshtain]

Don't hold your breath for Altidore in a TFC kit. He will likely be shipped away like so many before him, and we will plod on supporting the Mysterious Laughing Stock Enterprise, for years to come.


ahahah I haven't seen you post in a while so I can't tell if this is self-satirization. When things are going good I can always count on coming here and having you to try to prove to everyone that it's actually worse than ever. still good to have you around either way, looking at things from others' perspectives and everything.

[DoubleUp]

yup. I think it's very likely we see an older "water carrier" type come in from Mexico or south America, like the Farre guy from a month ago or like the Pineda signing for seattle last year. This draft is deep as hell at CDM and I think it's very likely we spend one of our picks on a guy we can groom behind a 200-300k cost type veteran.



I woud like to see TFC offer a trial to out of contract DM Papa Diop.

[molenshtain]

well I didn't mean that​ old.

[DoubleUp]

well I didn't mean that​ old.

sorry wrong diop lol:D


The other one still seems to be under contract with Levante

[Alonso]

Bloody big mess averted!

Everyone saves face.

While I hope that we get Jozy because I think him and Bradley would link up well due to national team play, even if we don't get Altidore, this is a win win for everyone.

[ensco]

Waiting to see the details on the finances, but it looks like I was wrong about TFC's ability to move Defoe without taking a loss.

It is beyond bizarre that both Bradley and Altidore play for TFC. Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

[Shway]

I can't see why we would need to give up something to acquire Jozy. As it seems we are 1. The only team in the league that has something Sunderland want and 2. We are more than likely the only team willing to spend Sunderlands transfer value for Jozy. So to me, I see it as teams 1 through 5 (Montreal, Houston, Chicago, Colorado, San jose) passing on this opportunity.

Considering the fact that reports state that we are getting Jozy plus cash, according to MLS rules a percentage of the cash will be converted to garber bucks. Between the Defoe and Henry sales, we should have enough to buy/acquire a Diego valeri esque player with atleast 500k to spare. Or even bring home Atiba, and wait for the summer for the 4th dp

This is a bloody big deal.

[WestStandGeoff]

agreed, can't hate on Defoe to much, at least he was willing to come over. I hope he helps Sunderland maintain their place in the EPL

As a Newcastle supporter, I wholeheartedly hope that the various injuries that kept him out of the TFC squad for a better part of the season return and Scumbderland need to eat the contract while they languish in the lower leagues.

[molenshtain]

As a Newcastle supporter, I wholeheartedly hope that the various injuries that kept him out of the TFC squad for a better part of the season return and Scumbderland need to eat the contract while they languish in the lower leagues.


the sooner the fascist supporting pricks go down the better, am I right? I'd love to watch them get relegated and remain saddled by Defoe's awful contract.

[dutch]

Defoe's an unprofessional bum, Im so glad this is over. He was the biggest embarassment in our clubs history and right when everyone around the world was watchinh us. Worrying about his self interests while pretending to be part of a team. I just wish he tried this stunt at Napoli or Partizan. I hope Altidore isnt being paid a 3 or 4+ million salary yet. he dosent deserve it at this time. how big is his head? he was asking for like 5+ I believe. After his 1 goal... I dont think giovinco will come here, he is italian, playing in italy is his dream probably. He is too young and successful imo to leave italy to go to a much smaller market. Also I believe gilberto is going to be like night and day this year. over on the sunderland boards they think its christmas! no ones mentioned the groin at all yet. cant wait to see him miss most of the games...oh almost forgot, I hope they get relegated!! them and his groin

[Auzzy]

Just to clarify the allocation order business:

https://twitter.com/amobisays/status/555223830780596225/photo/1

[DOMIN8R]

..... Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

And then there was Mix Diskerud to NYFC earlier this week.
https://nearpostblog.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/jurgen-klinsmann-angry.jpg?w=620&h=349

:topic:

[Smokecell]

And then there was Mix Diskerud to NYFC earlier this week.
https://nearpostblog.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/jurgen-klinsmann-angry.jpg?w=620&h=349

:topic:

Apparently Klinsmann actually encouraged Mix to sign with NYCFC. There's a good read over at SI giving a bit of insight with the last number of returning USMNT players.

http://on.si.com/1ya7d4u

[Wagner]

So will the Tottenham Ads still be up around the stadium? is that deal done now too?

[Pookie]

Waiting to see the details on the finances, but it looks like I was wrong about TFC's ability to move Defoe without taking a loss.

It is beyond bizarre that both Bradley and Altidore play for TFC. Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

I wonder how long TFC can remain outside of the USSF? They may be the only MLS academy not to be in it, including Vancouver and Montreal.

Here is another fun question in this league of single entity. This was from ESPN:

"Sunderland will also send an unspecified amount of cash to Toronto and MLS as part of the deal. The money involved will be an amount between Altidore's perceived current value and the $10 million (US) that Sunderland paid to acquire him from Dutch club AZ Alkmaar in 2013, a source said."

With MLS getting a share of this cash, essentially as part of the Defoe sale, makes you wonder if they were financially vested in the original purchase. Otherwise, why do they factor into the finances at all?

[DOMIN8R]

Apparently Klinsmann actually encouraged Mix to sign with NYCFC. There's a good read over at SI giving a bit of insight with the last number of returning USMNT players.

http://on.si.com/1ya7d4u

Thank you. That was insightful.

[Alixir]

As a Newcastle supporter, I wholeheartedly hope that the various injuries that kept him out of the TFC squad for a better part of the season return and Scumbderland need to eat the contract while they languish in the lower leagues.
This!

[Initial B]

Waiting to see the details on the finances, but it looks like I was wrong about TFC's ability to move Defoe without taking a loss.

It is beyond bizarre that both Bradley and Altidore play for TFC. Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

I don't know about that. Klinsmann might be pleased that the two will be playing together and building chemistry that will hopefully transfer over to National Team play.

As for the finances, I doubt we'll see anything remotely transparent from the league. As for how the rest of the teams will take this, I dno't think they can argue too much. This is pretty much as close to a North American-sytle player-for-player trade as you can get in soccer. Speaking of, how normal is it in the soccer world outside MLS to do player swaps rather than purchasing and transfer fees? Is MLS/TFC breaking any new ground here?

[ensco]

I don't know about that. Klinsmann might be pleased that the two will be playing together and building chemistry that will hopefully transfer over to National Team play.

As for the finances, I doubt we'll see anything remotely transparent from the league. As for how the rest of the teams will take this, I dno't think they can argue too much. This is pretty much as close to a North American-sytle player-for-player trade as you can get in soccer. Speaking of, how normal is it in the soccer world outside MLS to do player swaps rather than purchasing and transfer fees? Is MLS/TFC breaking any new ground here?

Disagree with Klinsmann's happiness about this. Agree with the rest.

Only comparable I can think of was the Ibra for Etoo plus cash swap between Barca and Inter in 2009.

[portu]

i feel like US media tries to make Klinsmann's position on USMNT in MLS way more black and white than it is

He only really wants his star players like Bradley playing in Europe, in Altidore's case he wants him to be on the pitch

[Phil]

Waiting to see the details on the finances, but it looks like I was wrong about TFC's ability to move Defoe without taking a loss.

It is beyond bizarre that both Bradley and Altidore play for TFC. Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

I was starting to get all doom and gloom yesterday reading your posts. I was stuned when it dropped last night with the numbers, I hope they are true.

[Fort York Redcoat]

i feel like US media tries to make Klinsmann's position on USMNT in MLS way more black and white than it is

He only really wants his star players like Bradley playing in Europe, in Altidore's case he wants him to be on the pitch

:iagree:It doesn't take a Klinsmann to know a player getting time with a lower club is better for a National Squad than a player on a fantastic bench.

[Klinsmann]

Waiting to see the details on the finances, but it looks like I was wrong about TFC's ability to move Defoe without taking a loss.

It is beyond bizarre that both Bradley and Altidore play for TFC. Best part: Klinsmann must be having an aneurysm.

No, I'm happy with this so far...

[ensco]

I was starting to get all doom and gloom yesterday reading your posts. I was stuned when it dropped last night with the numbers, I hope they are true.

Looks like I was pretty much wrong. There are a bunch of people (at least 5) who disagreed and should now come on to take a bow!

But I suspect all is not quite what it seems - the deal as reported makes Sunderland look insane, even by the crazy January window standard.

[mowe]

i feel like US media tries to make Klinsmann's position on USMNT in MLS way more black and white than it is

He only really wants his star players like Bradley playing in Europe, in Altidore's case he wants him to be on the pitch

Klinsmann on Altidore, he wanted him to stay in Europe: http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/01/14/jurgen-klinsmann-talks-jozy-altidore-usmnt-transfer-advice

[Phil]

Looks like I was pretty much wrong. There are a bunch of people (at least 5) who disagreed and should now come on to take a bow!

But I suspect all is not quite what it seems - the deal as reported makes Sunderland look insane, even by the crazy January window standard.

I think you were right to be realistic and not eat up the tripe being pushed out. I also suspect that there is way more to this than what we see. It may take years for the detials to eek out of this and be fully understood, not only from the transfer fee over, but the Altidore swoop in.

[ag futbol]

Yeah, I'll admit I was wrong on the Defoe price as well. Happily surprised.

Think this will be good for the club. Altidore's combo of size-speed will give a lot of MLS cbs fits.

[Initial B]

What really surprising to me is that though this trade information is half-a-day old, there isn't a peep of it on the MLS website. That has alarm bells ringing in my head right now.

[OgtheDim]

What really surprising to me is that though this trade information is half-a-day old, there isn't a peep of it on the MLS website. That has alarm bells ringing in my head right now.


There was a few tweets by MLS staffers last night - saw one on Twellman's feed discussing the over/under on Altidore's goals with TFC. Its draft day - might be under orders not to upset the narrative.

[Areathrasher]

MLS aren't going to comment on anything until it's all signed sealed and delivered.

Defoe is in Sunderland for his medical and signing so I suspect after that things will start moving on the Altidore side.

Plus, Philly just announced signing Edu permanently.

[Canary10]

I was wrong on the price, but I will say that I said West Brom or Sunderland made the most sense to me if he was going anywhere.

" I would more see teams like Sunderland or West Brom being targets. They always seem to be on the cusp, but tend to hold on. For teams like that that have, historically, a little more certainty about staying up he might be worth that money."

[TFC Cityboy]

glad the whiny cockney tw@t is gone.Can't see him being appy in the North East-such a London Mummy's boy, tho maybe Mummy will hold his hand up there too.

Not convinced about Altidore tho his record in Holland and MLS was decent.If he gets his confiddence back early doors, he could be a beast for us.

Song for 2015
he paid for our roof, he paid for our r-o-o-f.
Jermaine Defoe, he paid for our roof

[Canary10]

glad the whiny cockney tw@t is gone.Can't see him being appy in the North East-such a London Mummy's boy, tho maybe Mummy will hold his hand up there too.

Not convinced about Altidore tho his record in Holland and MLS was decent.If he gets his confiddence back early doors, he could be a beast for us.

Song for 2015
he paid for our roof, he paid for our r-o-o-f.
Jermaine Defoe, he paid for our roof

I don't get the "mommy's boy," and disparaging comments about his mother. She fucking engineered a move he wanted and got him more cash to boot. How about respecting that JD has a strong family and his mom is kicking ass in a game that can be very hard for even seasoned agents to win at?

[Wagner]

I don't get the "mommy's boy," and disparaging comments about his mother. She fucking engineered a move he wanted and got him more cash to boot. How about respecting that JD has a strong family and his mom is kicking ass in a game that can be very hard for even seasoned agents to win at?

Are you JD's mum?

[Canary10]

Are you JD's mum?

Ha ha. This lady strikes fear in people. I have to respect that.

[TFC Cityboy]

I don't get the "mommy's boy," and disparaging comments about his mother. She fucking engineered a move he wanted and got him more cash to boot. How about respecting that JD has a strong family and his mom is kicking ass in a game that can be very hard for even seasoned agents to win at?

na I'll stick my own opinion, thanks. Never liked the lad. Glad he's gone

[Red4ever]

glad the whiny cockney tw@t is gone.Can't see him being appy in the North East-such a London Mummy's boy, tho maybe Mummy will hold his hand up there too.

Not convinced about Altidore tho his record in Holland and MLS was decent.If he gets his confiddence back early doors, he could be a beast for us.

Song for 2015
he paid for our roof, he paid for our r-o-o-f.
Jermaine Defoe, he paid for our roof

Good to see you swallowed the leaked story hook, line and sinker. You can keep the sinker, but Bez is going to need the hook and the line back for the next time he throws us some good tripe.

[Phil]

Good to see you swallowed the leaked story hook, line and sinker. You can keep the sinker, but Bez is going to need the hook and the line back for the next time he throws us some good tripe.

I can tell you that family was a big part of the distraction. Having met his mother and spent time in those circles it wasn't an engineered story.

[jabbronies]

Looks like I was pretty much wrong. There are a bunch of people (at least 5) who disagreed and should now come on to take a bow!

But I suspect all is not quite what it seems - the deal as reported makes Sunderland look insane, even by the crazy January window standard.

I mentioned it earlier but it's not that insane for a team seriously facing relegation in the EPL to take a chance on a player like Defoe.
The guy still has a scoring touch. he was putting balls in with ease in the MLS. He should still be able to convert a few in a higher league. And they only need him to play half a season right off the bat. Health wise - he could do it.

If Sunderland drop out of the top tier, they would be set to loose millions. It could sink the club for a long period of time. So we could be talking about millions over a number of years. dropping 10mil to win/tie 4-5 more games couple be all they need to stay up.

[Red4ever]

I can tell you that family was a big part of the distraction. Having met his mother and spent time in those circles it wasn't an engineered story.

I have little doubt where it came from and how big a story it was because of where it came from. Elements of truth or not. Some are glad to get rid of Defoe and that's fine, they are entitled. I don't think it's a surprise who I want out of town on a rail.

[Canary10]

I mentioned it earlier but it's not that insane for a team seriously facing relegation in the EPL to take a chance on a player like Defoe.
The guy still has a scoring touch. he was putting balls in with ease in the MLS. He should still be able to convert a few in a higher league. And they only need him to play half a season right off the bat. Health wise - he could do it.

If Sunderland drop out of the top tier, they would be set to loose millions. It could sink the club for a long period of time. So we could be talking about millions over a number of years. dropping 10mil to win/tie 4-5 more games couple be all they need to stay up.

Sunderland seem to have the ability to escape death. They were pretty much done last year and they made it, at the expense of my team who tanked big time at the end (helped on by a mistimed manager change near the end of the season, sound familiar?). I think it makes a bit more sense for them than say Leicester. But you're right. They are effing screwed if they don't stay up. And Defoe is not a guy they'll unload easily if they do drop.

[Phil]

I have little doubt where it came from and how big a story it was because of where it came from. Elements of truth or not. Some are glad to get rid of Defoe and that's fine, they are entitled. I don't think it's a surprise who I want out of town on a rail.

Its funny as I talk with him quite a bit (the guy you want out) and he has never once mentioned it. Others....well they were pretty frustrated about it all. I can say by others, it seemed to be outside the actual club but within the company overall.

[jabbronies]

I have little doubt where it came from and how big a story it was because of where it came from. Elements of truth or not. Some are glad to get rid of Defoe and that's fine, they are entitled. I don't think it's a surprise who I want out of town on a rail.


As the healthy motivated player we saw before the England squad was announced - I'm sad to see him go. The guy showed that when he cared, he could pot them in like nobody's business. That's the kind of player we need

As the person he turned out to be - Fuck him. Glad he's gone. He was a pouty little bitch in the end who coward behind his people. Had no balls to handle the Toronto media like Bradley does. Didn't have the professionalism to stick it out like Henry and Beckham did. He's not the kind of player Toronto needs.

[jabbronies]

Sunderland seem to have the ability to escape death. They were pretty much done last year and they made it, at the expense of my team who tanked big time at the end (helped on by a mistimed manager change near the end of the season, sound familiar?). I think it makes a bit more sense for them than say Leicester. But you're right. They are effing screwed if they don't stay up. And Defoe is not a guy they'll unload easily if they do drop.

I'm sure they could unload him if they drop. Defoe's people will make that happen. They've done it before.

[Red4ever]

Its funny as I talk with him quite a bit (the guy you want out) and he has never once mentioned it. Others....well they were pretty frustrated about it all. I can say by others, it seemed to be outside the actual club but within the company overall.

It's cause he's a lawyer and very good at what he does. I worry about the facade he puts on to supporters when comes to the bar, and what he actually does. He's smart enough to realize our role in all of this and smart enough to look like everything is water off a ducks back in the public eye. Anyway, I don't buy it. His mom was unhappy, sure. But the leak was a PR stunt executed flawlessly.

[Canary10]

I'm sure they could unload him if they drop. Defoe's people will make that happen. They've done it before.

I suspect they stay up anyway. Will have a to win a few home games though.

[shwade]

I have little doubt where it came from and how big a story it was because of where it came from. Elements of truth or not. Some are glad to get rid of Defoe and that's fine, they are entitled. I don't think it's a surprise who I want out of town on a rail.

...
Yeah, I guess defoe was run out of town unfairly by the media because the guy clearly gave his all and wanted to be here <---- I suppose that's the narrative for the pathetic and blind.

[HeyToronto]

I mentioned it earlier but it's not that insane for a team seriously facing relegation in the EPL to take a chance on a player like Defoe.
The guy still has a scoring touch. he was putting balls in with ease in the MLS. He should still be able to convert a few in a higher league. And they only need him to play half a season right off the bat. Health wise - he could do it.

If Sunderland drop out of the top tier, they would be set to loose millions. It could sink the club for a long period of time. So we could be talking about millions over a number of years. dropping 10mil to win/tie 4-5 more games couple be all they need to stay up.

I have respect for the quality Defoe brings on the field when in form, but he hasn't been match fit in a long time. Gambling that he will even bit fit enough to play at level that will help you win 4/5 games is just insane.

I can't believe Gus Poyet is signing off on this, but if he's trialed and the team doctors say he's good maybe it works, but I still think you could find a younger striker for half the cost that will atleast have the prospect of being healthy, and could develop into a player you sell in a couple years.

[Red4ever]

...
Yeah, I guess defoe was run out of town unfairly by the media because the guy clearly gave his all and wanted to be here <---- I suppose that's the narrative for the pathetic and blind.

You're still here? Are you gonna ever join the group or just troll the boards?

[Phil]

It's cause he's a lawyer and very good at what he does. I worry about the facade he puts on to supporters when comes to the bar, and what he actually does. He's smart enough to realize our role in all of this and smart enough to look like everything is water off a ducks back in the public eye. Anyway, I don't buy it. His mom was unhappy, sure. But the leak was a PR stunt executed flawlessly.

That stuff has always been done, lawyer or not. Its funny how it is still close to the truth, no doubt about it being a vehicle though.

I respect your opinion but I am just offering non specific information that I come across both directly and indirectly. Some stuff is told to me (which I never 100% turst) and some is learned or overheard. It paints a picture. I think your dislike of Tim B clouds things for you. If its not Tim there, its someone else doing the exact same job. Thats why I have no anger over the Defoe stuff, its a job - either the guy is effective or not.

[Red4ever]

That stuff has always been done, lawyer or not. Its funny how it is still close to the truth, no doubt about it being a vehicle though.

I respect your opinion but I am just offering non specific information that I come across both directly and indirectly. Some stuff is told to me (which I never 100% turst) and some is learned or overheard. It paints a picture. I think your dislike of Tim B clouds things for you. If its not Tim there, its someone else doing the exact same job. Thats why I have no anger over the Defoe stuff, its a job - either the guy is effective or not.

Yeah fair I suppose. But my dislike of Tim B started essentially when he did this, so that's hard to say. It just seems he upped the glad-handing of supporters when the club vs Defoe war was waged. Again, great PR guy and I could think either way about Defoe because there is good and bad, but if this is all Tim B does, that's not gonna be enough.

[TFC Cityboy]

whether the story was engineered or not, to have a sulky "superstar" /DP on 10x what many of the players were earning is lousy for team spirit. It's one thing to have a couple of players on 10x the salary of other players if he pulls his weight, wants to be here, and is a willing face of the club but as an MLS journeyman, bog standard MLS fodder, to see a guy who at least appeared to want out (for whatever reason) it's hardly a shocker that the season went tits up.
Hopefully Altidore has a better attitude. I stand by my opinion that Defoe can fuck off and rot in Sun'lun

[Inklink]

There is only one legitimate replacement for Defoe:

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/519232/alombardo.jpg

[jabbronies]

I have respect for the quality Defoe brings on the field when in form, but he hasn't been match fit in a long time. Gambling that he will even bit fit enough to play at level that will help you win 4/5 games is just insane.

I can't believe Gus Poyet is signing off on this, but if he's trialed and the team doctors say he's good maybe it works, but I still think you could find a younger striker for half the cost that will atleast have the prospect of being healthy, and could develop into a player you sell in a couple years.

Another reason I'm glad to see him go. He's always injured! You can't depend on him being there when you need him. With that being said - he's sat out a few months now - had surgery - recovered from it and has been training with Tottenham. I'm sure scouts have been out there to see how he's been progressing.

Also - he only needs to play less than a third of season (9games). He could be the guy who's goals turn a loss into a tie and tie into a win. Getting some extra points out of 4-5 matches is not that insane. Thier schedule is not that difficult for them to get points from most of those matches.

[Fort York Redcoat]

...
Yeah, I guess defoe was run out of town unfairly by the media because the guy clearly gave his all and wanted to be here <---- I suppose that's the narrative for the pathetic and blind.

No need for this.

And since when does the Toronto Media care whether or not players give their all/want to be here to slag them? That would be a blind spot.

[Kaz]

So this is a case of MLS wanting a US International that is underachieving and using Defoe to get him? Particularly if Atidore ends up in NJ.

[burlington Red]

Jeremy Hall spoke very highly of Defoe when he left us, he had a chance to stick the boot in big time but chose not to, I also see Wiedman has went out of his way to talk highly about his attitude in training. Nelsen and Poyet, who have both worked with him previously were very keen to work with him again. Spurs his old club were happy to let him train with them recently to keep fit.
The public perception of him here in TO is he's a sulky overpaid primadonna, but the spin doctors at TFC might have had more to do with that than reality. When people who have worked with you before are keen to do so again, it says a lot more about you than some "source" leaking info to a newspaper.
I don't know the lad, and probably most here on this board don't either, so none of us can really know the full story, the only thing we can do as fans is make sure we try and look at both sides of the coin. It seems like a lot on here aren't.
I defo don't think his heart was in it towards the end but until Defoe gives us his side of the story, we are kind of assuming without truly knowing.

[Hieberrr]

Jeremy Hall spoke very highly of Defoe when he left us, he had a chance to stick the boot in big time but chose not to, I also see Wiedman has went out of his way to talk highly about his attitude in training. Nelsen and Poyet, who have both worked with him previously were very keen to work with him again. Spurs his old club were happy to let him train with them recently to keep fit.
The public perception of him here in TO is he's a sulky overpaid primadonna, but the spin doctors at TFC might have had more to do with that than reality. When people who have worked with you before are keen to do so again, it says a lot more about you than some "source" leaking info to a newspaper.
I don't know the lad, and probably most here on this board don't either, so none of us can really know the full story, the only thing we can do as fans is make sure we try and look at both sides of the coin. It seems like a lot on here aren't.
I defo don't think his heart was in it towards the end but until Defoe gives us his side of the story, we are kind of assuming without truly knowing.
We're never going to hear his side of the story. It's one of those things that once the deal is done, people just stop speaking about it because it's not worth discussing. Clearly, both sides were not aligned, hence the sale.

[arsenal]

Re: TFC getting Altidore via allocation process ..... anything stopping TFC from getting an inflated transfer fee for Defoe in exchange for paying an inflated transfer fee for Jozy? Other teams ahead of TFC in the allocation order balk at the inflated transfer fee for Altidore ensuring TFC get their man?

[burlington Red]

We're never going to hear his side of the story. It's one of those things that once the deal is done, people just stop speaking about it because it's not worth discussing. Clearly, both sides were not aligned, hence the sale.

we'll hear his side allright, it will be a chapter in his next book, seems to be the way with modern footballers these days

[barticusz]

Is anyone else feeling over the moon that we got rid of Defoe, his contract, made $1M, potentially get a good player in return and if not we will get settlement dollars? I mean, TFC brass you've come out of a very difficult situation looking fantastic in my books.

The stakes are high when you sign a big name player, it doesn't always work out, but the positive side is that their value remains high. Well worth the risk. This is the lesson that Tim B./L. have just taught the MLSE board. This should allow TFC to continue down this path. I mean it already looks to be working becuase they have the approval from the board to spend an additional $7M on salary (Giovinco?).

Hate on the management and MLSE all you want but these guys are making a name for themselves and are joining the global (transfer) game moreso than any other MLS team.

[brad]

As a Newcastle supporter, I wholeheartedly hope that the various injuries that kept him out of the TFC squad for a better part of the season return and Scumbderland need to eat the contract while they languish in the lower leagues.

He will most likely have a relegation release clause/buyout clause. He won't play in the Championship if they go down.

[Areathrasher]

So looking at this from a financial standpoint

Sunderland are paying $11m dollars for him (Larson, Guardian). Is it going to be a case of TFC getting the 11m and MLS taking their cut and using the cut to fund the Altidore purchase. Or will TFC keep all the money and MLS are paying the Altidore fee themselves and then allocating him?

This from yesterday makes me think that MLS is funding the Altidore portion


Vanney added that in terms of Jozy Altidore, TFC is waiting on the league to complete the negotiations."It's the league that is driving that process to get [Altidore] signed," he said.
http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/19/blog/post/2242353/mix-diskerud-the-right-player-for-jason-kreis-new-york-city-fc

[Canary10]

So looking at this from a financial standpoint

Sunderland are paying $11m dollars for him (Larson, Guardian). Is it going to be a case of TFC getting the 11m and MLS taking their cut and using the cut to fund the Altidore purchase. Or will TFC keep all the money and MLS are paying the Altidore fee themselves and then allocating him?

This from yesterday makes me think that MLS is funding the Altidore portion


http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/19/blog/post/2242353/mix-diskerud-the-right-player-for-jason-kreis-new-york-city-fc

[/FONT][/COLOR]

We will, of course, never know the answer to those questions. I do think it's ridiculous that we are making this crazy complicated transfer of cash and players across leagues, and could have it scuttled if some team in the allocation order decides to make a move. None of those teams have any skin in the game, while we have everything to lose if something happened. It's a bizarre way of doing business.

[barticusz]

We will, of course, never know the answer to those questions. I do think it's ridiculous that we are making this crazy complicated transfer of cash and players across leagues, and could have it scuttled if some team in the allocation order decides to make a move. None of those teams have any skin in the game, while we have everything to lose if something happened. It's a bizarre way of doing business.

The deal doesn't get scuttled. Defoe is on the other side of the Atlantic and is doing his physical. Monies are likely paid or will be once that physical is done. The league is going to sign Altidore regardless and only TFC has had the ability to talk to him. If one of the 5 teams do what it takes to get Altiodore TFC get's a settlement.. and I'm positive that they'll get something worthwhile since they've done all the work. MLS is going to mess with one of the top dog's in the league.

[Canary10]

The deal doesn't get scuttled. Defoe is on the other side of the Atlantic and is doing his physical. Monies are likely paid or will be once that physical is done. The league is going to sign Altidore regardless and only TFC has had the ability to talk to him. If one of the 5 teams do what it takes to get Altiodore TFC get's a settlement.. and I'm positive that they'll get something worthwhile since they've done all the work. MLS is going to mess with one of the top dog's in the league.

I hope that's true. Should be, but you never know with this damn league.

[barticusz]

According to the Gaurdian, Defoe is training with Sunderland and is just awiating the paperwork from TFC which may allow him to play against Tottenham this weekend.

Additional they state that Altidore has agreed to terms with Toronto, so now we just wait.

[Phil]

According to the Gaurdian, Defoe is training with Sunderland and is just awiating the paperwork from TFC which may allow him to play against Tottenham this weekend.

Additional they state that Altidore has agreed to terms with Toronto, so now we just wait.

That means the paperwork is in New York MLS head office if true.

[barticusz]

I hope that's true. Should be, but you never know with this damn league.

Even if someone takes him.. TFC will get settlement that has been reported by league-wide sources. That still leaves us with Gilberto and room to make additional signings. There's no lose in this scenario.

[Canary10]

Even if someone takes him.. TFC will get settlement that has been reported by league-wide sources. That still leaves us with Gilberto and room to make additional signings. There's no lose in this scenario.

I actually wouldn't mind if they didn't get him, but even that scenario is a bit ridiculous. For the amount of work it takes to pull off a player swap there shouldn't be anyone else even in the conversation.

[barticusz]

I actually wouldn't mind if they didn't get him, but even that scenario is a bit ridiculous. For the amount of work it takes to pull off a player swap there shouldn't be anyone else even in the conversation.

Seattle is rumoured to have approached Montreal for the first in the allocation order.

The interesting part is that they could make a play for Kljestan instead. (a Big :hand: to NYRB).

[Hieberrr]

Is anyone else feeling over the moon that we got rid of Defoe, his contract, made $1M, potentially get a good player in return and if not we will get settlement dollars? I mean, TFC brass you've come out of a very difficult situation looking fantastic in my books.

The stakes are high when you sign a big name player, it doesn't always work out, but the positive side is that their value remains high. Well worth the risk. This is the lesson that Tim B./L. have just taught the MLSE board. This should allow TFC to continue down this path. I mean it already looks to be working becuase they have the approval from the board to spend an additional $7M on salary (Giovinco?).

Hate on the management and MLSE all you want but these guys are making a name for themselves and are joining the global (transfer) game moreso than any other MLS team.
Absolutely. It's a great feeling to get rid of a player that doesn't want to be here. Especially when it's a player that is making as much money as he is. It's gets even better -- we shipped him off to a team outside of the league and not to a competitor.

[kwhisperer]

I actually wouldn't mind if they didn't get him, but even that scenario is a bit ridiculous. For the amount of work it takes to pull off a player swap there shouldn't be anyone else even in the conversation.

Exactly. It's a stupid league if teams can't run their own shops without fear of being vetoed by the arbitrary application of various rules.

[barticusz]

Exactly. It's a stupid league if teams can't run their own shops without fear of being vetoed by the arbitrary application of various rules.

Agreed. Here's hoping the CBA talks lead to changes to that system that everyone agrees is completely bogus.

[kwhisperer]

Agreed. Here's hoping the CBA talks lead to changes to that system that everyone agrees is completely bogus.

I suppose it makes it more interesting as we ponder possible moves for the clubs, but I don't think one should have to do fairly extensive research just to understand how the league works.

[Canary10]

The funny thing is it's being spun by comments on MLSsoccer.com and elsewhere as the league playing favourites for TFC, against other teams. Portand in particular is being screwed, although last I saw they didn't have a player Sunderland was willing to take in a cash and player swap.

[kwhisperer]

The funny thing is it's being spun by comments on MLSsoccer.com and elsewhere as the league playing favourites for TFC, against other teams. Portand in particular is being screwed, although last I saw they didn't have a player Sunderland was willing to take in a cash and player swap.

This is the problem with inconsistently applied rules - perceptions about the league suffer. I agree with the point you're making; WE are the ones who made the freaking trade so WE should get the player. End of story.

[ManUtd4ever]

As far as I'm concerned, it is only fair that Altidore is exempt from the allocation process, because he was under contract to Sunderland, and TFC provided compensation to acquire him. This isn't a case whereby a former MLS player that is out of contract has decided to return to the league.

Altidore should be our property without question.

[Richard]

The allocation order should be scrapped.

At the end of the day its the player who decides which team they want to play for. Creating an artifical equalizer to help crap markets is dumb, if the market isnt desirable then either fix it through taking accountabilty or fold the franchise.

[sidvan]

So everything i have seen is that Defoe's transfer fee of 11 million will be reduced by the current "market value" of Altidore. How do they factor the difference in Garber bucks?

[jloome]

So everything i have seen is that Defoe's transfer fee of 11 million will be reduced by the current "market value" of Altidore. How do they factor the difference in Garber bucks?

My understanding is that they're getting 11 million POUNDS for Defoe, and paying 4 Million pounds back. $11 million Can. dollars is the difference between the two (about 7 mil pounds). So the deal CLEARS $11 million, of which we'll receive max allocation (about$660,000) and a split of the fee with the league.

[Initial B]

Doesn't anybody else find it weird that there is abolutely no mention of the Defoe trade on the MLS website? Even if just to say he's been sold to Sunderland for cash and future considerations. It's all over the media everywhere else, but I can't even find anything in teh comments sections of the MLS articles about it. Something's fishy..

[Walms]

Song for 2015
he paid for our roof, he paid for our r-o-o-f.
Jermaine Defoe, he paid for our roof

^ Can this happen at every game please

on a side not: anyone think the Gionvico deal is a fall back in case Altidore gets stolen from our back pocket. & if not who's DP head goes on the chopping block, obvious option would be Gilly, yes?

[Canary10]

Doesn't anybody else find it weird that there is abolutely no mention of the Defoe trade on the MLS website? Even if just to say he's been sold to Sunderland for cash and future considerations. It's all over the media everywhere else, but I can't even find anything in teh comments sections of the MLS articles about it. Something's fishy..

It's in the Kick-Off daily feature and tons of comments about it. I guess they can't say much on the site until it's official.

[ag futbol]

There was a few tweets by MLS staffers last night - saw one on Twellman's feed discussing the over/under on Altidore's goals with TFC. Its draft day - might be under orders not to upset the narrative.
So what was the over / under exactly?

[Areathrasher]

So what was the over / under exactly?

12.5

[gdg_9]

Sky Sports News HQ‏@SkySportsNewsHQ 1m1 minute ago (https://twitter.com/SkySportsNewsHQ/status/555429266788458496) BREAKING NEWS: Sky Sources - Jermain Defoe passes medical ahead of move to Sunderland. More on #SSNHQ (https://twitter.com/hashtag/SSNHQ?src=hash)


One of the last hurdles cleared!

Now just need to sort out that Altidore Allocation MLS bullshit....





Kristian Jack ‏@KristianJack 1m1 minute ago (https://twitter.com/KristianJack/status/555429793911832576) Jermain Defoe has passed his medical at Sunderland. The move is now complete.

https://twitter.com/skysportsnewshq/status/555429266788458496 … (https://t.co/6VJKQOgej4)

[gdg_9]

Kurtis Larson ‏@KurtLarSUN 1m1 minute ago (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/555429985692184576) Sky Sports reports Defoe has passed his medical at Sunderland -- something he could have done at TFC had he listened to team docs.

Larson with a dig at Defoe on the way out...

[Oldtimer]

One of the last hurdles cleared!

Now just need to sort out that Altidore Allocation MLS bullshit....

I suspect the MLS side was sorted out by a deal long in advance.

[jloome]

Maybe we'll trade Jozy to Orlando for the number one pick.

[Areathrasher]

Larson with a dig at Defoe on the way out...

That tweet makes zero sense.

[Canary10]

Maybe we'll trade Jozy to Orlando for the number one pick.

Ha! Now that would be interesting.

[Canary10]

That tweet makes zero sense.

Ha ha. I was thinking the exact same thing. All teams have their own medicals done.

[gdg_9]

Kurtis Larson‏@KurtLarSUN 1m1 minute ago (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/555429985692184576) Sky Sports reports Defoe has passed his medical at Sunderland -- something he could have done at TFC had he listened to team docs.


That tweet makes zero sense.

Rumour was TFC doctors were recommending surgery to Defoe to fix his injuries.
He didn't listen to them, which is when he then went back to England to get a second opinion and rehab.

When he came back, he clearly wasn't the same player, re-injured himself, and ended up having the surgery in the off-season that the TFC doctors had recommended right from the beginning.


Larson's not talking about the actual process of passing a medical, more just about actually being fit to play.

[TFC07]

Maybe we'll trade Jozy to Orlando for the number one pick.

Not going to happen since TFC/Bradley really want Jozy and Orlando haven't shown any interest of getting Jozy.

[jloome]

Not going to happen since TFC/Bradley really want Jozy and Orlando haven't shown any interest of getting Jozy.

Yeah, just thinking about the weird way MLS head office thinks. Jozy grew up there; he's a nat player etc etc. We'd be getting Cyle Larin back in return, he's Canadian etc etc

They love fairytales at the head office.

[Canary10]

Rumour was TFC doctors were recommending surgery to Defoe to fix his injuries.
He didn't listen to them, which is when he then went back to England to get a second opinion and rehab.

When he came back, he clearly wasn't the same player, re-injured himself, and ended up having the surgery in the off-season that the TFC doctors had recommended right from the beginning.


Larson's not talking about the actual process of passing a medical, more just about actually being fit to play.

Even with that background, the tweet doesn't really make sense.

[Areathrasher]

Rumour was TFC doctors were recommending surgery to Defoe to fix his injuries.
He didn't listen to them, which is when he then went back to England to get a second opinion and rehab.

When he came back, he clearly wasn't the same player, re-injured himself, and ended up having the surgery in the off-season that the TFC doctors had recommended right from the beginning.


Larson's not talking about the actual process of passing a medical, more just about actually being fit to play.

I know that. The way it's worded doesn't make sense. He wouldn't have done his medical for Sunderland at TFC.

[TFC07]

Yeah, just thinking about the weird way MLS head office thinks. Jozy grew up there; he's a nat player etc etc. We'd be getting Cyle Larin back in return, he's Canadian etc etc

They love fairytales at the head office.

I personally believe there's better chance that Orlando is more interested in Gilberto and willing to trade their first pick for him.

[gdg_9]

Even with that background, the tweet doesn't really make sense.


I know that. The way it's worded doesn't make sense. He wouldn't have done his medical for Sunderland at TFC.

You're right... it wasn't Larson's best work! haha.

But I still find it interested that he decided to try and take that shot at Defoe over not listening to TFC's medical team.

[ag futbol]

Nothing wrong with keeping things in the family, but 32 year old professional relying on his mother for advise when she has no expertise? Ridiculous.

Clubs are only putting up with that because he's talented. Otherwise, it's a complete joke. She should be nowhere near the club or his contract negotiation.

[ensco]

There's too much focus on his "mother", as though that is somehow different and especially evil.

Most athletes have parents, siblings, friends overly involved in their lives. Watch the ESPN documentary "Broke", it's an eye-opener about how many athletes lives get wrecked, financially and otherwise by this.

If this guy has a personal reason why he'd rather live in England (Sunderland!) than Toronto, whatever it is, so be it.

[ManUtd4ever]

The mother narrative reminds me of the Vince Carter era, LOL.

[TFC07]

We all should be happy that Defoe is no longer with us and we got ton of cash and player. Time to move on and hope Jozy lives up his potential while TFC manage to sign DP AM and couple of starters (CB being big one) before season starts.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Maybe we'll trade Jozy to Orlando for the number one pick.

really hope not

[Wagner]

There's all sorts of stories of parents and spouses involved in athletes' lives...

Colby Rasmus
Wince Carter
Eric Lindros
Chris Pronger

this list is nothing...there are hundreds, maybe thousands of examples.

[Fort York Redcoat]

What's interesting to me is we are a team that have to consider this deal

1. From a money perspective. It shouldn't be the priority but with the record breaking aspect of the first aquisition I'm glad we aren't hog tied after this deal that could've been a fire sale.
2. From the perspective of a downgrade. Such high hopes for Defoe but are we concerned Altidore can't at least match 12 goals? I think it's a pretty easy sell. Factor in Gilberto doubling his output and that could make the difference right there. That's before any Italians enter the mix.

Not a bad save to the offseason so far.

[burlington Red]

the mother role being overplayed on here, Defoe has a very saavy agent in Struan Marshall, don't underestimate his role in anything. Defoe has now made 2 moves in 2 seasons and progressively got more money for each move when in reality considering his age and injury record should realistically be looking at pay decreases.

[TOBOR !]

Jozy is a girl's name - la la la la.

[ag futbol]

There's all sorts of stories of parents and spouses involved in athletes' lives...

Colby Rasmus
Wince Carter
Eric Lindros
Chris Pronger

this list is nothing...there are hundreds, maybe thousands of examples.
Difference between a healthy relationship and a dysfunctional one. The presence of someone's family in their career isn't necessarily negative. But in this case... I fail to see how it was anything but a distraction.

[anto7]

This from my cousin in the UK who is a Sunderland supporter



https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-1/c11.0.64.64/p64x64/1900107_874775609200436_8234186853872450092_n.jpg? oh=89992511a418ca95bc9b306f721e0956&oe=5522A5AB&__gda__=1429530517_d85ea37f5ca9f93ca8ba536fd611545 1 (https://www.facebook.com/richard.g.smith.9?fref=ufi)

Richard Gerry Smith (https://www.facebook.com/richard.g.smith.9?fref=ufi) Hope jozy finds his form for you's, he was much liked on wearside and worked his butt off, he just couldn't hit a barn door.
The Change hopefully will be good for him.
15 mins (https://www.facebook.com/anthony.marsh.902/posts/10153605686872814?comment_id=10153606577562814&offset=0&total_comments=4) · Unlike (https://www.facebook.com/?sk=h_chr#) · 1 (https://www.facebook.com/browse/likes?id=10153606577562814)

[Kaz]

I like Gilberto, I don't want Jozy if it means we have to lose Gilberto to get a CAM. Jozy to me is just Cunningham V2.0

[Ruffian]

I like Gilberto, I don't want Jozy if it means we have to lose Gilberto to get a CAM. Jozy to me is just Cunningham V2.0

Cunningham is the second all time leading scorer in MLS

[Ossington Mental Youth]

I like Gilberto, I don't want Jozy if it means we have to lose Gilberto to get a CAM. Jozy to me is just Cunningham V2.0

wait and see how the cba works out.
I dont want to lose Gilberto either but we might get another DP

[EastYork]

If Altidore ever gets to put on a TFC jersey, I believe he will be a monster for us.

[brad]

Cunningham is the second all time leading scorer in MLS

The league has changed a lot since those days though. Cunningham had bilstering pace which was enough in those days. He'd be average at best in today's league.

[brad]

I think Jozy will do okay here to be honest, he seems like the type of player that will do well in the MLS. Plenty of highly effective MLS strikers came with less than stellar CV's to the MLS (BWP for example)

[Kaz]

Cunningham is the second all time leading scorer in MLS
And scored 6 for us.

[Davenport]

If Altidore ever gets to put on a TFC jersey, I believe he will be a monster for us.

A desperate move by Sunderland and the only good thing about Altidore is he's got a pulse. One goal in 2 seasons. Joke.

[shwade]

You're still here? Are you gonna ever join the group or just troll the boards?

LOL the 'you're not a real member' argument. Wouldn't expect anything more from someone so desperately blind.

[barticusz]

A desperate move by Sunderland and the only good thing about Altidore is he's got a pulse. One goal in 2 seasons. Joke.

Could it be that he is just not a Premiere league striker? Scored 31 in 41 apps while with AZ in 2012/13. I'd say the dutch league is much more comparable to MLS than the EPL so that would make one think that he'd do ok in this league.

Also.. is Sunderland a team that can actually compete in the EPL??? I mean they were 17th in 12/13; 14th in 13/14; and are 14th in 14/15.

Jozy's scoring at the NT level in 2013 was 8 in 14 apps and 4 in 10 apps in 2014. I think whatever team gets him in the MLS will be quite happy actually.

[Richard]

Hopefully this is the Altidore that shows up for us. The Dutch league is still better than MLS and he's got some good finishing skills.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6bfGp84h0I&amp;feature=player_embedded

[ensco]

^I dunno if that makes me feel better, the defending in the Eredivisie on exhibit there looks worse than MLS.

[Richard]

^I dunno if that makes me feel better, the defending in the Eredivisie on exhibit there looks worse than MLS.

I think physically it is a lower standard than the MLS, there's also a lot of youth in the Dutch league, a lot of young great up and coming talent but not quite ready to handle someone like Altidore.

I still think Altidore can outmuscle anybody in MLS, he has a good finish with good technique which I think could dominate MLS.

[Red CB Toronto]

^I dunno if that makes me feel better, the defending in the Eredivisie on exhibit there looks worse than MLS.

It's not a very physical league at all, very free flowing, a goal scores dream of sorts. Another USMNT member Aron Johannsson who stepped in for AZ after Jozy transferred to Sunderland. He had 26 goals in his first full season.

On another, Michael Bradley had a 16 goal season in the Dutch League, a total he never even got close to before or since.

[notthesun]

New article from Gareth Wheeler/TSN claims MLS wanted Altidore to join the Red Bulls, we stood our ground and rejected a $7.5 million cash settlement from NYRB to keep him.

http://www.tsn.ca/sources-altidore-will-join-toronto-fc-latest-on-tfc-s-pursuit-of-giovinco-1.182800

As the report claims NYRB would have had to also trade with Montreal for the top allocation spot I imagine we'll be announcing a trade with MTL quite soon.

[Richard]

New article from Gareth Wheeler/TSN claims MLS wanted Altidore to join the Red Bulls, we stood our ground and rejected a $7.5 million cash settlement from NYRB to keep him.

http://www.tsn.ca/sources-altidore-will-join-toronto-fc-latest-on-tfc-s-pursuit-of-giovinco-1.182800



The Red Bulls wanted Altidore and MLS wanted him in New York.... Toronto FC has been denied players they've wanted by MLS before.


Anyone else still feel very uncomfortable about this? If FIFA wasn't such a mess and actually cared about anything going on this side of the pond I could see this league getting fines and sanctions.

I don't like the "Fixing" that MLS continues to try to do, its not match fixing, but favouring certain markets to get top players is as close are you are going to get to that in North American sports.

Glad we held our ground.

[TFC07]

New article from Gareth Wheeler/TSN claims MLS wanted Altidore to join the Red Bulls, we stood our ground and rejected a $7.5 million cash settlement from NYRB to keep him.

http://www.tsn.ca/sources-altidore-will-join-toronto-fc-latest-on-tfc-s-pursuit-of-giovinco-1.182800

Wow, just wow.

Biggest news from that article is that we will lose Gilberto if we sign another DP. So pretty much, Gilberto is gone since TFC is going to get their DP AM and want to keep Jozy despite being offered $7.5 million! So we lose another South American prospect (Gilberto) for USMNT player.

[Richard]

Wow, just wow.

Biggest news from that article is that we will lose Gilberto if we sign another DP. So pretty much, Gilberto is gone since TFC is going to get their DP AM and want to keep Jozy despite being offered $7.5 million! So we lose another South American prospect (Gilberto) for USMNT player.

You can have as many designated players on your roster as you want. As long as you don't have more than the maximum before roster compliance date MLS doesn't care.

The new CBA will be in effect before the roster compliance date. Everyone and their mother knows a 4th DP slot is coming. Wheelers fails to mention anything about the new CBA.

[Areathrasher]

Toronto FC sat sixth in the allocation order and no team ahead of Toronto in the allocation rankings wanted Altidore.

Is he saying that all the other teams passed and no trade has to be made? Confusing.

In theory, Montreal may get a better return for their top pick from one of the 4 teams after Kljestan so passed on Altidore to hold on to it for that?

[ensco]

New article from Gareth Wheeler/TSN claims MLS wanted Altidore to join the Red Bulls, we stood our ground and rejected a $7.5 million cash settlement from NYRB to keep him.

http://www.tsn.ca/sources-altidore-will-join-toronto-fc-latest-on-tfc-s-pursuit-of-giovinco-1.182800

As the report claims NYRB would have had to also trade with Montreal for the top allocation spot I imagine we'll be announcing a trade with MTL quite soon.

I think it's best to reserve judgment until more of the deal details come out. But this Gareth Wheeler story makes no sense.

If Altidore wanted RBNY, and they were willing to pay him what he wanted, he would have insisted on going there, and he would have gone there. The idea that the league "forced" Altidore to TFC is absurd. All of the league, RBNY and TFC have a vested interest in this version of the story. The league has a PR problem with what is going on right now in NY, and they need it to look like they're not totally giving up to their fans. Bez has his own reasons to look heroic.

[mcolvy]

Wow, just wow.

Biggest news from that article is that we will lose Gilberto if we sign another DP. So pretty much, Gilberto is gone since TFC is going to get their DP AM and want to keep Jozy despite being offered $7.5 million! So we lose another South American prospect (Gilberto) for USMNT player.

Sell altidore and make away like villains. Literally the perfect crime. Could you imagine the Defoe deal turning into almost 19 MIL get for TFC?

[Areathrasher]

I think it's best to reserve judgment until more of the deal details come out. But this Gareth Wheeler story makes no sense.

If Altidore wanted RBNY, and they were willing to pay him what he wanted, he would have insisted on going there, and he would have gone there. The idea that the league "forced" Altidore to TFC is absurd. All of the league, RBNY and TFC have a vested interest in this version of the story. The league has a PR problem with what is going on right now in NY, and they need it to look like they're not totally giving up to their fans. Bez has his own reasons to look heroic.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B7WVylVCAAEGSAp.jpg

Was it not a case of MLS trying to get Altidore to New York?

Regardless, that article leaves me with more questions than answers. Bloody MLS.

[TFC07]

Sell altidore and make away like villains. Literally the perfect crime. Could you imagine the Defoe deal turning into almost 19 MIL get for TFC?

Exactly. Someone offers you $7.5 million for Jozy, then take it and don't look back. TFC FO is crazy for not taking RBNY offer but then again, it's obvious they have sort of USMNT bias.

I am sure MLS FO isn't happy to have two of bigger USMNT players playing for a Canadian club instead of American clubs like New York.

[notthesun]

I think it's best to reserve judgment until more of the deal details come out. But this Gareth Wheeler story makes no sense.

If Altidore wanted RBNY, and they were willing to pay him what he wanted, he would have insisted on going there, and he would have gone there. The idea that the league "forced" Altidore to TFC is absurd. All of the league, RBNY and TFC have a vested interest in this version of the story. The league has a PR problem with what is going on right now in NY, and they need it to look like they're not totally giving up to their fans. Bez has his own reasons to look heroic.

The article is claiming head office was trying to force Altidore to NYRB, not to TFC.

Wheeler was also the very first to break the story about the Defoe-Altidore swap. He may have an in here, I would hold off on the scepticism.

[arsenal]

Sell altidore and make away like villains. Literally the perfect crime. Could you imagine the Defoe deal turning into almost 19 MIL get for TFC?

Just speculating but guess is that the $7.5M or thereabouts is what Jozy was valued at in deal with Sunderland. Ie we got $11M for Defoe we paid $7.5 for Altidore .... netted $3.5M

[OgtheDim]

Garber's losing his grip on the league it seems.

[ManUtd4ever]

Why do I have the feeling that if Leiweke wasn't spearheading this transaction, we would have been bullied by the league into handing Altidore over to NYRB?

Typical MLS bullshit, but I'm content with the end result in this case.

[notthesun]

Larson backing up Wheeler's report as well, Altidore could be unveiled as a TFC player within the week.

Pretty ridiculous this is even at all in doubt. In what world can you complete a player swap deal and potentially not end up with the player you traded for? lol

[ManUtd4ever]

Larson backing up Wheeler's report as well, Altidore could be unveiled as a TFC player within the week.

Pretty ridiculous this is even at all in doubt. In what world can you complete a player swap deal and potentially not end up with the player you traded for? lol

It's beyond ridiculous.

[Richard]

Honestly if there isn't any forward push for transparency with the new CBA arriving I'm going to take a step back from this league, I cant help but feel this league is being run like the WWE.

[reggie]

mls rules are a joke....but if NYRB really wanted him,why didnt they offer the 7.5 mil to SUND...when the window opened..

[brad]

Larson backing up Wheeler's report as well, Altidore could be unveiled as a TFC player within the week.

Pretty ridiculous this is even at all in doubt. In what world can you complete a player swap deal and potentially not end up with the player you traded for? lol

A league in which the teams are actually franchises and don't won or control the player contracts.

It is ridiculous - but that is what our league is.

[pdubs]

If this all checks out I am glad we are throwing our weight around. This continues to reinforce we are a big club that is willing to spend and not just some little team north of the border. This will certainly hold true if we land Giovinco.

But this also further demonstrates MLS is all messed up. Some rules apply some of the time, in some markets and situations but not in others. What I love is everyone in the media openly complains about this but nothing really seems to be changing on the MLS front office side. Not sure if any of this is being addressed in the CBA negotiations. I hope it is but doubt it. I wish Garber would stop talking about more transparency when the complete opposite is true. As Kristian Jack would say, it is a farce. Lol.

[pdubs]

Honestly if there isn't any forward push for transparency with the new CBA arriving I'm going to take a step back from this league, I cant help but feel this league is being run like the WWE.

The unfortunate part is the it completely detracts from growing the hardcore fan base. It also frustrates the media and this is reinforced when heard on sports programs throughout North America which alerts the more casual fan of MLS incompetence. I hope change comes quick because I agree it is hard to really invest in the league when there is no transparency despite what Garber babbles on half-time shows.

[Defoe]

Just speculating but guess is that the $7.5M or thereabouts is what Jozy was valued at in deal with Sunderland. Ie we got $11M for Defoe we paid $7.5 for Altidore .... netted $3.5M

This makes the most sense. Selling Defoe for 19 million would be insanity, Lewieike would get a statue if that were true lol.

[ensco]

The article is claiming head office was trying to force Altidore to NYRB, not to TFC.

Wheeler was also the very first to break the story about the Defoe-Altidore swap. He may have an in here, I would hold off on the scepticism.


I believe Wheeler has sources and is not making this up.

I believe that Head Office is painting yarns because they are quite rightly worried about what is going in on NY, RBNY are for sale, ownership has cut off the spend and the team is in disarray. Suddenly they want to spend millions on Altidore? Not everyone just fell off the turnip truck. Garber and Abbott are getting worried about fan reaction/backlash there.

I also think SKC never seriously played for Bradley. I think these stories are rolled out to placate pissed supporters in markets whose teams aren't playing the DP game.

[OgtheDim]

Neil Davidson ‏@NeilMDavidson (https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson) 14m14 minutes ago (https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson/status/555530208715866112) Sources confirm Jozy Altidore to become #TorontoFC (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TorontoFC?src=hash) player. Medical Thursday with contract signing to follow.

[notthesun]

We apparently netted $11 million clean from the swap deal. All the beat writers have repeated that figure and Rollins broke down the values on a CSN article. I think it was £10 million for Defoe minus Altidore valued at £4 million, netting us £6 million or about $11 million in canadian dollars.

Davidson also confirming Altidore to TFC, having his medical tomorrow. Press conference Friday?

[69Chevy396]

If signing Altidore means the departure of Gilberto, than this will come back to haunt us (yet again, particularlyif Gilberto remains in MLS and scores buckets of goals). I think Gilberto is a better fit than Altidore on this team.

[flamehawk]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4Rh5JRM5Sk&feature=youtu.be

Strange, a local Italian-Canadian journalist claims that the agent representing Giovinco had told them that TFC has yet to contact him..

[Yohan]

best part of Altidore to TFC deal is Old Man Bill losing his shit. it's absolutely hilarious

[69Chevy396]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4Rh5JRM5Sk&feature=youtu.be

Strange, a local Italian-Canadian journalist claims that the agent representing Giovinco had told them that TFC has yet to contact him..
This is just blather, he will never come here.

[Yohan]

I believe Wheeler has sources and is not making this up.

I believe that Head Office is painting yarns because they are quite rightly worried about what is going in on NY, RBNY are for sale, ownership has cut off the spend and the team is in disarray. Suddenly they want to spend millions on Altidore? Not everyone just fell off the turnip truck. Garber and Abbott are getting worried about fan reaction/backlash there.

I also think SKC never seriously played for Bradley. I think these stories are rolled out to placate pissed supporters in markets whose teams aren't playing the DP game.

If Robb heineman says skc made a pitch for Bradley, I believe him. That guy doesn't say stuff for giggled

[Auzzy]

New CP article: http://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/source-tfc-complete-defoe-swap-with-altidore/



And two sources with knowledge of the deal said Black Cats striker Jozy Altidore will become a Toronto FC player.

The U.S. international, who has agreed to terms, is due in Toronto on Thursday for a medical with a contract signing to follow if all goes well.



Polish those rollerblades, ready, set...

[Blixa]

MLS is a funny league with really goofy rules. It's extremely jarring given how this sport operates outside this continent.

[anto7]

@SoccerByIves: The year was 2007. Altidore was pretty dominant as a 17-year-old playing next to Juan Pablo Angel. Think he’ll score 15+ for TFC in 2015

[Detroit_TFC]

$7.5M valuation for Altidore. I have nothing against him, but that shows the world, especially the transfer market, is in the grips of madness.

[molenshtain]

I'm not really bothered by this stuff so much compares to what goes on in Europe where agents run everything. it's fucked up either way, but it actually scares me I live in a world where an agent has enough influence to get someone to pay 50 million for David Luiz AND get him on the world team of the year.

[ensco]

If Robb heineman says skc made a pitch for Bradley, I believe him. That guy doesn't say stuff for giggled

Really? I don't pay that much attention, but he seems to go on like this about how his team is the greatest in history, and KC is the greatest, a lot, for a guy whose team won one title.

http://www.mlssoccer.com/ccl/news/article/2014/07/23/wiebe-sporting-kc-want-be-greatest-team-mls-win-concacaf-champions-league

[Yohan]

Really? I don't pay that much attention, but he seems to go on like this about how his team is the greatest in history, and KC is the greatest, a lot, for a guy whose team won one title.

http://www.mlssoccer.com/ccl/news/article/2014/07/23/wiebe-sporting-kc-want-be-greatest-team-mls-win-concacaf-champions-league
so far, he's done everything he said he'd do with SKC *shrug*
might be a bit of loudmouth, but can't recall much he said he'd do, but haven't done for SKC

[reggie]

any spies at the ACC tonight?

[OgtheDim]

C
best part of Altidore to TFC deal is Old Man Bill losing his shit. it's absolutely hilarious

You got a link for that or do I have to find him on Twitter?

[Pookie]

Am I missing something or is it weird that this isn't yet part of the "news" on MLSSoccer ?

[ManUtd4ever]

Am I missing something or is it weird that this isn't yet part of the "news" on MLSSoccer ?

Perhaps the league is waiting for Altidore to pass his physical tomorrow before making an official announcement.

[DOMIN8R]

Report: New York Red Bulls lose out on Jozy Altidore; Toronto FC wins the race (http://www.onceametro.com/2015/1/14/7549209/report-new-york-red-bulls-lose-out-on-jozy-altidore-toronto-fc-wins)

:stogey::dita::cheers: (sorry - no sour grapes emoticon)


So this is where I look big for twelve.

I liked Ives view on the Jozy acquisition. I can live with 15 goals from JA .

It's not a good day to be an Red Bulls fan, I guess.

Oh....the Red Bulls are......

[MightyDM]

Jeremy Hall spoke very highly of Defoe when he left us, he had a chance to stick the boot in big time but chose not to, I also see Wiedman has went out of his way to talk highly about his attitude in training. Nelsen and Poyet, who have both worked with him previously were very keen to work with him again. Spurs his old club were happy to let him train with them recently to keep fit.
The public perception of him here in TO is he's a sulky overpaid primadonna, but the spin doctors at TFC might have had more to do with that than reality. When people who have worked with you before are keen to do so again, it says a lot more about you than some "source" leaking info to a newspaper.
I don't know the lad, and probably most here on this board don't either, so none of us can really know the full story, the only thing we can do as fans is make sure we try and look at both sides of the coin. It seems like a lot on here aren't.
I defo don't think his heart was in it towards the end but until Defoe gives us his side of the story, we are kind of assuming without truly knowing.

Hear hear.

[Areathrasher]

C

You got a link for that or do I have to find him on Twitter?

Think hes referring to Bill Archer on Big Soccer

[MightyDM]

Rumour was TFC doctors were recommending surgery to Defoe to fix his injuries.
He didn't listen to them, which is when he then went back to England to get a second opinion and rehab.

When he came back, he clearly wasn't the same player, re-injured himself, and ended up having the surgery in the off-season that the TFC doctors had recommended right from the beginning.


Larson's not talking about the actual process of passing a medical, more just about actually being fit to play.

so Defoe was hurt enough to require surgery, turned it down, tried to play through it, and is criticized on the boards for a lack of commitment? People should give their heads a shake.

[MightyDM]

What's interesting to me is we are a team that have to consider this deal

1. From a money perspective. It shouldn't be the priority but with the record breaking aspect of the first aquisition I'm glad we aren't hog tied after this deal that could've been a fire sale.
2. From the perspective of a downgrade. Such high hopes for Defoe but are we concerned Altidore can't at least match 12 goals? I think it's a pretty easy sell. Factor in Gilberto doubling his output and that could make the difference right there. That's before any Italians enter the mix.

Not a bad save to the offseason so far.

we need 25 goals from Altidore. That's the return (at least) from a healthy Defoe.

[flambe]

Think hes referring to Bill Archer on Big Soccer

http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-other-mls-teams-paraphernalia-thread-now-legal-in-two-states.1999462/page-76#post-31636978

[molenshtain]

we need 25 goals from Altidore. That's the return (at least) from a healthy Defoe.

that's a very simplistic view of it. A) defoe would never give given us us 25 goals in a season because he wouldn't have been healthy enough to do so. He broke down in his first year. B) Altidore provides a lot more in terms of build up play than Defoe does, enhancing the ability of those around him, which Defoe was entirely incapable of.

[molenshtain]

http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-other-mls-teams-paraphernalia-thread-now-legal-in-two-states.1999462/page-76#post-31636978

Syrup sucking cunts is a new one. I like it.

[MightyDM]

http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/the-other-mls-teams-paraphernalia-thread-now-legal-in-two-states.1999462/page-76#post-31636978

Oh that's rich. Brilliant.

Started from the bottom, now we here.

[OgtheDim]

The internet is full of name callers. Has always been true. Archer is neither relevant nor effective in his bile.

I found some of the discussion points in that thread interesting - seeing stuff from the perspective of a fly over team in a small market is helpful.

We are creating a stir. Nice to be doing that.

[Areathrasher]

No cash involved according to this http://www.sunderlandecho.com/sport/sunderland-afc/sunderland-poised-to-confirm-defoe-deal-in-straight-swap-for-altidore-1-7051198
A near record MLS fee according to Larson

Guess the truth is in the middle?

[MightyDM]

that's a very simplistic view of it. A) defoe would never give given us us 25 goals in a season because he wouldn't have been healthy enough to do so. He broke down in his first year. B) Altidore provides a lot more in terms of build up play than Defoe does, enhancing the ability of those around him, which Defoe was entirely incapable of.

I should have made my point in more detail. If we are going to succeed we need goals from our strikers and a DP striker should deliver in that range or they aren't worth the money, particularly if he is replacing someone who had that potential. If we only replace Defoe's actual goals, we will be about the same - likely to miss the playoffs. But if we have a player who can score at the rate that a healthy Defoe would, we have a real chance to be a very good team. And that I hope is our goal.

[Phil]

$7.5M valuation for Altidore. I have nothing against him, but that shows the world, especially the transfer market, is in the grips of madness.

I was sitting around last night thinking the same thing.

Then I thought back to how the last generation felt about inflating prices on the market. While 7.5 is a crazy number, its just a number and those numbers are never going to go down. Just like groceries dont get cheaper. It a fact of life now.

[brad]

we need 25 goals from Altidore. That's the return (at least) from a healthy Defoe.

For sure their is a difference in class between the two players, but over the season I could see it being a wash.

The odds of actually having a health Defoe over the course of the season are very low - based on his past injury history. 10-15 over the course of a season would be a reasonable expectation from JD, with an outside shot at 20-25 if he stayed fit (he'd likely score that many if fit - but it's an outside shot that he stays fit for a season).

Applying that to Altidore who doesn't have injury problems - I would say 10-15 would be a decent and quite possible return from him - with an outside shot at 20+.

I think the bigger difference is how the team around Atlidore looks. Defoe was an unreal finisher and could score a goal out of nothing. I don't see Atlidore doing that. If we actually manager to build a team that can provide service up front for the first time in the history of our club, he'll do okay.

[Fort York Redcoat]

so Defoe was hurt enough to require surgery, turned it down, tried to play through it, and is criticized on the boards for a lack of commitment? People should give their heads a shake.

And yet he didn't come back for the last games when it was said he was cleared to. Guess he didn't want to play through that. People need to keep perspective on what is a rumour and what is fact. We don't know how hurt or committed he really was. He's last seasons news at this point anyway.


we need 25 goals from Altidore. That's the return (at least) from a healthy Defoe.

Way to put the failed expectations on another player.

Not that I disagree with that possible output. In my ideal scenario I'd rather see both Jozy and Gila just under 20 and share the wealth.

[brad]

Regarding Jozy - the times I saw him play in the EPL, he looked like a lost little school boy. He had no idea how to move off the ball or run channels or any of the things that a striker needs to do at that level to create spaces to score. He won't be facing that same level of organization in the MLS.

It sort of reminds me of Eddie Johnson. Decent scoring record in the MLS. Went to the EPL and totally flopped. Went on loan to the Championship a couple of times and totally flopped. 2 goals in 71 appearances in England. did a bit better Greece but still flopped - 5 goals in 19 appearances. Then came back to the MLS with Seattle and scored 17 goals in 38 games and then 12 goals in 27 games.

[notthesun]

Larson saying Altidore is due to arrive at Pearson today at 2:45. Anyone strapping on the blades?

[Red CB Toronto]

Larson saying Altidore is due to arrive at Pearson today at 2:45. Anyone strapping on the blades?

Jozy will have a quiet day with the brain trust in Philly for the draft.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Jozy will have a quiet day with the brain trust in Philly for the draft.

So..wait...aren't you in Philly? As far as I'm concerned you should be putting hats on heads.:)

Man we should have a Rollerblade Gang Shirts.

Welcome Wagon Rollerblade Gang sleeveless shirts. Ooooooo this could be awesome. There will be wristbands for sure.

[Chevy]

Oh that's rich. Brilliant.

Started from the bottom, now we here.

I haven't given that douche the time of day for a few years, and now I remember now why. I love how he states that Canada gets the returning USMNT players "every f**king time", then in the next sentence refers to Dempsey, who is a pretty glaring exception.

[Red CB Toronto]

So..wait...aren't you in Philly? As far as I'm concerned you should be putting hats on heads.:)

Man we should have a Rollerblade Gang Shirts.

Welcome Wagon Rollerblade Gang sleeveless shirts. Ooooooo this could be awesome. There will be wristbands for sure.

Consideration to going crossed my mind for sure, but after evaluating the weather mucking around Philly in this cold just was not attractive even with an all supporters booze fest this morning. Bars start serving at 6 am in the fine state of PA.

[Red CB Toronto]

He's fast, he's quick, he's got a massive dick ... altidore, altidore !!

[FRANKIE65]

He's fast, he's quick, he's got a massive dick ... altidore, altidore !!

LMAO....when chants go wrong

[Red4ever]

He's fast, he's quick, he's got a massive dick ... altidore, altidore !!

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/15/1578f4d9989d8c9448ec0a10560dc455e193b95b5ec6b8f64f e4ea83548a0b9c.jpg

[BuSaPuNk]

He's fast, he's quick, he's got a massive dick ... altidore, altidore !!

Ummmmm no.

[Fort York Redcoat]

He's fast, he's quick, he's got a massive dick ... altidore, altidore !!


http://www.quickmeme.com/img/15/1578f4d9989d8c9448ec0a10560dc455e193b95b5ec6b8f64f e4ea83548a0b9c.jpg

I thought I was finished laughing uncontrollably this morning and then...


CB I think there is a certain demographic for that chant. I'm not sure you'll find them en masse here.