Reality Has Kicked In - A Letter.

[Barbarez]

Shocked, dissapointed, lost for words, annoyed, and truly disgusted. These are the emotions that are running through my head after witnessing a humiliating loss to the Montreal Impact on Tuesday, July 22nd, 2008. Where do I start? Our players lacked heart, lacked passion, and acted like superstars prancing across the field. Refusing to run down balls and put in that extra effort that would gurantee the trophy doesn't leave Toronto grounds. Maybe the game didn't mean much to you, but it meant the world to us. A win last night symbolized a thank you to the fans, and you let each and every single one of us down. From the organized support shown by the Ultras, Usec, RPB and NEE, to the individualized support by the little kids spread across the stadium. I am not going to apologize for booing you because you do not deserve the type of love and support we have given you. You do not deserve the countless hours and dollars we have invested into making banners, planning tifo's, and making flags. Does that even mean anything to you? When you play like that against a historic rival for Toronto, we truly doubt it. You let them come onto our turf and raise the trophy above our heads mocking everything we stand for. Maybe you don't take this shit serious, but we do, and I refuse to support you until you begin to play with heart or are traded. Plain and simple.

The Front Office, the Ultras warned everybody against your Maple Leaf-like policies, and nobody believed us until now. I believe everybody sees that you are using us as marketing tools to profit and could care less about the talentless squad. You gave us a shitty stadium without a roof, gave the players a shitty playing surface, continously rob us blind with beer prices, and send piranaha's our way labelling us as hooligans. TFC has created a lot of exec-jobs for individuals who know shit all about football and it shows. You hassle us day in and day out but scalpers freely walk around, making sure non-supporters are in the supporter section telling us to shush down and letting us know what we can do and what we can't. Our friends were hit with criminal charges setting off harmless smoke bombs, meanwhile the Montreal Impact fans let a few off last night with police officers and BMO security starring at them refusing to do anything. They came into our stadium and disrespected us. You care about the buck - which shouldn't come as a surprise seeing the cold-money hungry capitalistic environment you have created in sport venues across Toronto. Fuck you and your shitty stadium, fuck you and your field turf, fuck you and the security hassling us, fuck you and your money hungry ways, fuck you using us as your marketing monkeys and fuck you for using my face on a poster. Take that shit down. Maybe it won't happen this year, but when BMO sees 8,000 people a game, maybe then you'll care to show love towards those who have been there from day one - at home and away.

To all the Ultras, U-Sectorites, NEE and RPB members who were there in the pouring rain standing our ground infront of the Impact bus protecting the honor and dignity of our team, all the respect in the world goes out for you. They closed us off with a fence and allowed Montreal players to provoke us with the trophy coming out of their shitty bus a couple of times, but we did the best we could do in the situation we were given.

In conclusion, maybe you don't take this seriously, no correction, we know you don't take this seriously, but we do. I refuse to attend any further games until change comes, and maybe that doesn't mean much to you seeing as how I am only one person (and the Ultras are a small group) but I will not invest any more time or money into a talentless team supporting a money-hungry Front Office that could give a flying fuck about us. That rolled out the red carpet for the Montreal players and their fans and did not say one word on how our boys were mistreated in Montreal. We prewarned everybody, now what's left is for the beer sippin' girlfriend wearing part-time supporters to enjoy the bland North American environment that has finally arrived at BMO.

Yours Truly,
Ultras 114.

[Barbarez]

oops REALITY, mod please :)

[Pyeddo]

I can't begin to say how happy I am you wrote this. I speak for several fans in saying THANK YOU and WE AGREE WITH WHAT YOU'VE WRITTEN 100%.

[trane]

I agree with you. I think that the time for blind support is over.

[raj100]

support is OVER? drama queens? you dont supports the club because the front office is shit? thats pathetic...bitch about mlse in it for the money, but not supporting the club because of this you no real supporter...

[ilikemusic]

You must have been kidding yourself all this time. Did you not know what MLS was when the team came around?

MLS' roster restrictions and salary caps are enforced parity. Parity=mediocrity.

It isnt going to change anytime soon so to now decide to stop going to games shows a bit of shortsightedness and a lack of foresight on your part.

Theyre an MLS team and MLS is shit. End of story really.

I dont mean to throw a wet blanket on the supporters who work hard to create atmosphere but you cant expect the hard work to be reciprocated. MLS is what it is. Alot of people got way too into it and thought it was something it isnt.

[Sab0tage]

I agree with pretty much everything you said. Are you sending this in to them?

[ecantona7]

Excuse me for my ignorance on this subject but could someone please expand on how badly our players and/or fans were treated in montreal. What with the euro's now finished and before that the PL and so on, I'm just starting to get into the mls in general and tfc specifically.

[Ladies Love Julius James]

Fuckin Class.....I feel the same way. Good on ya bro.

[DVS]

Also,

welcome to MLSE

[T.Reis]

good read!

[TFC Tifoso]

support is OVER? drama queens? you dont supports the club because the front office is shit? thats pathetic...bitch about mlse in it for the money, but not supporting the club because of this you no real supporter...

So what do you suggest we do then? Clap and sing like a bunch of trained monkeys? Dude, if you got to a resturaunt and the food is shit will you go back?!?!?! NO! Same thing here.....but we've been eating their shit for too long now.

[LucaGol]

Oh boy...this is going to be a heated thread.

[Oblio2]

A little bit over the top.

and I call BS about you not going to the games....

[DVS]

You wanna hear your voice. During a Nationally televised game you get 114 to leave BMO and have that section empty with a banner saying

FUCK MLSE


that may get things rolling

[raj100]

its been TWO SEASONS!!!!!!!!.....you understand the reason the field turf was put in was because tfc wasnt expected to be this big hence the reason for no roof...if this was expected that wuda been changed..buh not supporting the club because of the stuff that goes on upstairs? thats pathetic....part time supporters

[Barbarez]

You must have been kidding yourself all this time. Did you not know what MLS was when the team came around?

MLS' roster restrictions and salary caps are enforced parity. Parity=mediocrity.

It isnt going to change anytime soon so to now decide to stop going to games shows a bit of shortsightedness and a lack of foresight on your part.

Theyre an MLS team and MLS is shit. End of story really.

I dont mean to throw a wet blanket on the supporters who work hard to create atmosphere but you cant expect the hard work to be reciprocated. MLS is what it is. Alot of people got way too into it and thought it was something it isnt.

I really don't care about MLS. I care about our team getting better, which our FO seems to not give 2 shits about. Last night was a fucking disaster, Montreal is last place in the fucking USL and they come to our city and embarass us. Their fans embarass us. I dont know about you, but i cant just let this game roll off my shoulder.

[Sab0tage]

its been TWO SEASONS!!!!!!!!.....you understand the reason the field turf was put in was because tfc wasnt expected to be this big hence the reason for no roof...if this was expected that wuda been changed..buh not supporting the club because of the stuff that goes on upstairs? thats pathetic....part time supporters Lol, are you really going to call him a part time supporter?

[Pyeddo]

raj100, you just don't seem to get it

[DVS]

its been TWO SEASONS!!!!!!!!.....you understand the reason the field turf was put in was because tfc wasnt expected to be this big hence the reason for no roof...if this was expected that wuda been changed..buh not supporting the club because of the stuff that goes on upstairs? thats pathetic....part time supporters

Losing a tournament that involved two USL teams is whats pathetic

[king dave]

Couldn't agree more Mr. Barbarez.
Excellent post sir.
KD.

[Parkdale]

oops REALITY, mod please :)

oh... and I thought you were getting into real estate or something

[ensco]

If Cunny taps that ball in, would you have written this?

Not trying to start something, just want to understand.

[Tintin]

Thankyou Barbarez. I have been saying the same things in different posts. MLSE is regarding us like they regard Leaf fans. Who cares about the qulity, the fans will come anyway.

We need to make a statement. Your letter is a start. Maybe a petition? Maybe a protest at a game?



Suggestions?

[Ladies Love Julius James]

Thankyou Barbarez. I have been saying the same things in different posts. MLSE is regarding us like they regard Leaf fans. Who cares about the qulity, the fans will come anyway.

We need to make a statement. Your letter is a start. Maybe a petition? Maybe a protest at a game?



Suggestions?


Want to hit em hard...don't buy beer.

[MG42]

Hooorah for Barbarez!!!!

[Tintin]

Want to hit em hard...don't buy beer.


If I dont drink, the game will even look worse to me!

[Barbarez]

If Cunny taps that ball in, would you have written this?

Not trying to start something, just want to understand.

Even if we won 2-1 last night we honestly wouldn't deserve to go through. This tourney was made FOR TORONTO to win and represent Canada. We struggled from game 1, losing to Van at home, Tie away. Seriously, we're always expecting the world from our players but lets face it, THEY CAN'T DO ANY FUCKING BETTER FOLKS. That's it, thats all they got so stop fucking acting like they can.

[trane]

You must have been kidding yourself all this time. Did you not know what MLS was when the team came around?

MLS' roster restrictions and salary caps are enforced parity. Parity=mediocrity.

It isnt going to change anytime soon so to now decide to stop going to games shows a bit of shortsightedness and a lack of foresight on your part.

Theyre an MLS team and MLS is shit. End of story really.

I dont mean to throw a wet blanket on the supporters who work hard to create atmosphere but you cant expect the hard work to be reciprocated. MLS is what it is. Alot of people got way too into it and thought it was something it isnt.

This is the MLS, and I do think the MLS sucks, but we have an opportunity to be the class of the leaque, and to then move the league forward. This is what I want to see happen, and at some point if they keep on delivering a fucking Serie C2 level product we have to say no we will not support crap. I have to tell you I belive that while the cap is a problem, Montreal will be able to dominate within the system due to its organization.

[ilikemusic]

I really don't care about MLS. I care about our team getting better, which our FO seems to not give 2 shits about. Last night was a fucking disaster, Montreal is last place in the fucking USL and they come to our city and embarass us. Their fans embarass us. I dont know about you, but i cant just let this game roll off my shoulder.

Its not rolling off my back I assure you that.

And I also dont give a fuck about MLS. I hate it and view it as nothing but an impediment to our squad; but the fact remains, we have to live by their rules, and their rules enforce mediocrity. Thats the main problem and the issue that will plague us until major changes arrive.

Not going to games isnt going to improve anything though. American MLS fans have been doing that for a decade now.

Though it is possible to pressure the city and MLSE into putting grass in. People will have to actually stop supporting though. The blind support and the holier than thou attitude amongst people with differing opinions is a hinderence to that though.

Some of us complained vociferously about the ticket price increase this past off-season and any and all suggestions of displaying our displeasure was met with 'I support TFC better than you' kind of tripe.

Its okay though. None of you and none of us will have to boycott. The casuals are going to be the first to turn their backs on the team.

Hopefully when we start averaging 14K MLSE will get the message.

[raj100]

i dont get it? ur not supportng the club because the front office supposedly treats you like shit? take it in and support the club if ur a true fan... do u support tfc or mlse?

[Barbarez]

P.S

The letter was written by TFCBrigade, not me.

[TFC Cityboy]

all valid points from Barbarez, but perhaps a heat of the moment reaction...
Honeymoon seems to be over for many and reality hits hard.
I've supported shit football teams since 1973 with shite owners so this is nothing new to me, tho' it does frustrate.

[VoxPopuliCosmicum]

Want to hit em hard...don't buy beer.

That's a realistic and serious suggestion (although it's also difficult).

[invictusTFC]

Wouldn't it be great if the entire south end were to turn their backs to the field in protest during the next home game or even the all star game? How embarrassing would it be for MLSE especially during the all star game when its being televised internationally

[jrober38]

The problem is that if its attendence that's going to get the team's attention, its going to have to wait till next season. Every game there are a couple thousand empty seats , but towards the end of each game the stadium annoucer always announces a near sell out when there's no way that there are that many people in the stands.

BMO Field sells out almost entirely through seasons ticket holders which means MLSE has your money before the season even starts. They don't care about who actually goes to the games because they make their money before the season starts.

[Barbarez]

Wouldn't it be great if the entire south end were to turn their backs to the field in protest during the next home game or even the all star game? How embarrassing would it be for MLSE especially during the all star game when its being televised internationally

You're living in a dream world. People are too preoccupied with themselves to do anything for the cause. Too busy chatting it up and enjoying their beverage. Seriously now, how many people in the whole of "supporter" section are actually their to support TFC. 40-50%? Maybe...

[trane]

^ I agree with you again, it would seem that too many are there for the party and "atmosphere".

[FluSH]

Very well said... to say I feel angry and sad is an understatement.

[RealG-TFC]

I agree with most. Except for ditching the team.

[Barbarez]

I agree with most. Except for ditching the team.

Nobody is ditching the team here, I've been there for TFC and I'll be here for TFC always but I'm not gonna stand for sub-par talent, players who don't wanna be here and poor managment.

[trane]

^ I do think that most will want to ditch the team, it just as some point you cannot cheer and support when there is no results or effort from the organizations. At some point you have to say, we love TFC and we will not sit here and support our team being humiliated.

[jabbronies]

I agree with most. Except for ditching the team.

I'm with you on this.

[RealG-TFC]

you should have mention (demanded) autonomy over the South End, or at least 112-116.

Although you did kind of implied it in the scalper part

[Barbarez]

^ I do think that most will want to ditch the team, it just as some point you cannot cheer and support when there is no results or effort from the organizations. At some point you have to say, we love TFC and we will not sit here and support our team being humiliated.


BINGO

[jrober38]

You're living in a dream world. People are too preoccupied with themselves to do anything for the cause. Too busy chatting it up and enjoying their beverage. Seriously now, how many people in the whole of "supporter" section are actually their to support TFC. 40-50%? Maybe...

I totally agree. Too many people in Toronto go to sporting events because its the thing to do. It doesn't matter what sport we're talking about, people will always go and a massive majority of those people will always be casual fans. Most people go for the wrong reasons, but unfortunately this is the sporting landscape that exists in Toronto.

[AL-MO]

Wouldn't it be great if the entire south end were to turn their backs to the field in protest during the next home game or even the all star game? How embarrassing would it be for MLSE especially during the all star game when its being televised internationally



We gotta stop with this 'entire south end' garbage. Rarely is the South End doing the same thing. So an protest or actions would be limited to 111/112/113 and the Ultras pocket of 114.

We should definitely do something, but what? We have some thinking to do...

[Barbarez]

We gotta stop with this 'entire south end' garbage. Rarely is the South End doing the same thing. So an protest or actions would be limited to 111/112/113 and the Ultras pocket of 114.

We should definitely do something, but what? We have some thinking to do...


No offense, but 112 has more casuals than RPBs just like 113 has more then U sector guys. That's the problem we keep thinking we're the majority in these sections when we're not. Even if you attempted a small protest between 112 and 113 alone, I bet you you wouldn't get half the sections involved.

[DVS]

We gotta stop with this 'entire south end' garbage. Rarely is the South End doing the same thing. So an protest or actions would be limited to 111/112/113 and the Ultras pocket of 114.

We should definitely do something, but what? We have some thinking to do...

If you get those 3 maybe 4 sections to get together you'll definately have more to follow.

IMHO, good luck achieving that

[NateDoGG]

a humiliating loss

we didnt lose, we just didnt get the win. which is what has been happening for awhile now, but in the end we lost everything, and will lose everything again (post season what?)

[GabrielHurl]

^ I agree with you again, it would seem that too many are there for the party and "atmosphere".

Like I said on another thread - "The TFC experience"

[RealG-TFC]

I wonder how many supporters there are in total..

[fetajr]

re: don't buy beer

That's a realistic and serious suggestion (although it's also difficult).


I agree...at least minimize the number of beers you buy. I start with buying 1 cup of beer, when finished, i pour more beer into it from the cans that I sneak into BMO. Sneak in the cans by wearing cargo pants and bring a backpack. When you arrive at security, you open your backpack and hold it in a way so that it blocks the persons view of your cargo pockets. works all the time for me.

i haven't (and won't) bought any TFC merchandise b/c of MLSE... the 'no streamers in non-supporter section' rule was the icing on the cake for me to realize this shit is gonna be no different than the leafs if we dont smarten up as fans.

[Barbarez]

Post from TFCBrigade

"Its good to see that the vast majority of people understand what we are trying to say. Since when does being frustrated and taking well-deserved shots at the FO and the team mean you are not a supporter? Is that to say that the Bosnian support who has been in constant war with the FO are not supporters? Or that the vast majority of supporter groups across the globe who protest against the talent of their team and the treatment they receive as fans, are not real supporters? If anything it means that you are a bigger supporter than anybody else. You just wish to see progress and will not agree with lackluster performances and mistreatment. If you are a man, you stand up and speak up. You don't blindly follow something just because its the right thing to do. In retrospect, it is the person who is dissapointed with TFC but continous to purchase the merchandise and beer at BMO that should be targeted, not anybody speaking up and saying the truth"

[Ladies Love Julius James]

re: don't buy beer



I agree...at least minimize the number of beers you buy. I start with buying 1 cup of beer, when finished, i pour more beer into it from the cans that I sneak into BMO. Sneak in the cans by wearing cargo pants and bring a backpack. When you arrive at security, you open your backpack and hold it in a way so that it blocks the persons view of your cargo pockets. works all the time for me.

.

Don't post that here lol. Tomorrow there will be a memo to look out for everyone with cargo pants.

[RedsYNWA]

We gotta stop with this 'entire south end' garbage. Rarely is the South End doing the same thing. So an protest or actions would be limited to 111/112/113 and the Ultras pocket of 114.

We should definitely do something, but what? We have some thinking to do...

I for one will not attend the Dallas game fuck em I'm off to the Cottage

[Barbarez]

I am not going to the next game either.

[coisty1966]

I can just picture Tom Anselmi and his suits in their executive suites, as it rains outside, laughing at us.

Still have to support the boys in Red, but I would love to hit MLSE where it hurts.

concessions is where it hurts......dont buy food, merchandise, and most of all beer...bottom line, thats where the money is and thats where they'd feel it most....until concession sales go in the tank, nothing will be done, and theres no use bitching about it because we'll all still wear out TFC shirt, eat a slice or 2 of pizza and load up on beer.....

[jwfm1985]

If Cunny taps that ball in, would you have written this?

Not trying to start something, just want to understand.

Agreed. This is way over the top. I hope you don't send it because it something that poorly written wont be taken seriously.

Also, 100% bluff on not showing up

[Parkdale]

No offense, but 112 has more casuals than RPBs just like 113 has more then U sector guys.

since when did you care about not being offensive? :D

agreed that there are lots of semi-casuals in all the sections, but 112 undeniably has the largest proportionate number of stand-up supporters in the entire stadium. There are pockets scattered everywhere it seems to me like the majority of 112 is doing the right thing. Probably just because it's a smaller section, and communication works easier.

[BC101]

TFC Brigade, Barbarez, Ultra's whoever...That letter is legend. Thank God for you guys saying it. Some people just dont' know.

[Shaughno]

since when did you care about not being offensive? :D

agreed that there are lots of semi-casuals in all the sections, but 112 undeniably has the largest proportionate number of stand-up supporters in the entire stadium. There are pockets scattered everywhere it seems to me like the majority of 112 is doing the right thing. Probably just because it's a smaller section, and communication works easier.

I don't know about that. I'd say 113 is proportionate to the numbers of 112.

112 is brutal lately with active participants... but, I'm not getting into that here.

[GabrielHurl]

but, I'm not getting into that here.

you know you want to

[Heathen]

I for one will not attend the Dallas game fuck em I'm off to the Cottage

Ah but are you going to sell/trade your tickets or just leave them unused

[Barbarez]

I don't know about that. I'd say 113 is proportionate to the numbers of 112.

112 is brutal lately with active participants... but, I'm not getting into that here.

It's inconsistent. Game to game, some games its packed with RPBs than the next its like they all went on vacation. It isnt going to work like that man, if we don't have solidarity and numbers in the stands than we're pissin into the wind.

[Shaughno]

you know you want to

Already did in the Song section, nobody is willing enough to respond so far.

[Shaughno]

It's inconsistent. Game to game, some games its packed with RPBs than the next its like they all went on vacation. It isnt going to work like that man, if we don't have solidarity and numbers in the stands than we're pissin into the wind.

I hear ya bro, I've been pissing in the wind trying to get chants going in 112.

[MrHawk]

Very well written and it's true. I was saying goodbye to my sister as she is leaving to Europe in 2 1/2 hours and was so upset I missed the game.

From what I have read, I realized I didn't miss much.

Total Record (including 2 friendlies)
1 Win
6 Losses
4 Ties

GF:10
GA:14

Home:
1W
3T
3L

GF:5
GA:5

Away:
0W
1T
3L

GF:5
GA:9

I'd say that's somewhat sad, considering 4 of those games were against USL teams.

[Oldtimer]

8,000 waiting list for seasons tickets - enough to fill another BMO Field.

[Shaughno]

^^ We have one win away against LA.

[ACSertL]

Agreed. This is way over the top. I hope you don't send it because it something that poorly written wont be taken seriously.

Also, 100% bluff on not showing up

Look, I don't know these guys personally, but I am pretty damn sure that this is no bluff.

[StandUpIfYouHateChelsea]

Even if we won 2-1 last night we honestly wouldn't deserve to go through. This tourney was made FOR TORONTO to win and represent Canada. We struggled from game 1, losing to Van at home, Tie away. Seriously, we're always expecting the world from our players but lets face it, THEY CAN'T DO ANY FUCKING BETTER FOLKS. That's it, thats all they got so stop fucking acting like they can.

the first game against vancouver ... if we all remember the ref played a big hand , vancouver played well and we didnt , but the ref helped vancouver bigtime........ no excuses for the other games thoo

[Barbarez]

8,000 waiting list for seasons tickets - enough to fill another BMO Field.

What are you trying to say? That thats one of the reasons our FO doesn't give a fuck?

[Shaughno]

^^ I'd say it's a pretty good reason.

[BC101]

I hear ya bro, I've been pissing in the wind trying to get chants going in 112.
Especially with people singing selective chants.. When I say selective i mean just one.

[Shaughno]

Again, see Songs section.

Edit: Sorry to hijack the thread Barbie, continue. :p

[Barbarez]

TFCBrigade:

"I think its time for all the supporter groups to put aside all differences and form an united front - a support army of sorts voicing our frustrations. Not attending games will not change anything because scalpers will make sure the seats are filled with beer-purchasing/food buying fans. We already put a stop to buying beer and food at BMO, so that's a good start. What are some things we can do? And please, let's not fool ourselves into believing we can get everyone in the south to turn their back to the field or do some European-like. Its not gonna work.

I personally believe we have to create banners that voice our frustration in a simple yet effective manner. A simple GET RID OF MO OR GET SOME TALENTED PLAYERS would do. Also, we (as supporter groups) could be completely quiet. Let the random claps come here and there, but we as supporters have to be quiet and get on the megaphones letting people know why we are quiet and that we are protesting. We gotta get at the media so they could also mention it. Without exposure, the movement is pointless. Get a huge ass tifo that stretched from 112 to 114 saying shit. Let's think of ideas. I'm not going out like that.

Its instances like these that truly show what we're made out of. We will never give up or give in, but will forever remain loyal and fight for what we believe in. We just refuse to support the talentless squad, and be made fools out of by the FO"

[Laurie79]

concessions is where it hurts......dont buy food, merchandise, and most of all beer...bottom line, thats where the money is and thats where they'd feel it most....until concession sales go in the tank, nothing will be done, and theres no use bitching about it because we'll all still wear out TFC shirt, eat a slice or 2 of pizza and load up on beer.....

I agree with this line of thinking... and yes it's a definite inconvenience to do without our lil over-priced luxuries but people who speak with their wallets are always loud and clear!

[MrHawk]

The reality unfortunately is, is that MLSE doesn't care about it's fans. It cares about money.

Let me pose a hypothetical situation:

Let's say we don't go to games. Let's say that we all give up our seasons. As mentioned earlier on, how large is the waiting list? You don't think MLSE would say "Thanks, goodbye" and happily allow us to walk out? Imagine if they could control the entire SouthEnd with a family owned section. This will not solve anything. This may get some management axed or some new "players".

[TicTacTabarnack]

Protest at a TFC game! Tape over our mouths! Sit! and waive signs that say ...
"My support is not for your Marketing department it's for a WINNING team!"
"Sub Par Team = Sub Par Support!"
"For the Love of GOD Sign a DP Striker already!"
"We have been bitching for months about it ... Release Cunny Already!"
"If you're going to use our support for marketing purposes at least give us something to support!"
"TFC Fan seeks DP Striker Desperately"

Only 6 home games left this season unfortunately. Thoughts?

[FluSH]

8,000 waiting list for seasons tickets - enough to fill another BMO Field.

8,000 fans or supporters on the waiting list

or

A cartel of 5,000 scalpers + 3,000 wishful thinkers

[Jay P]

wear black and don't sing/chant.

great letter, thnxs for posting it barbarez

[Barbarez]

The reality unfortunately is, is that MLSE doesn't care about it's fans. It cares about money.

Let me pose a hypothetical situation:

Let's say we don't go to games. Let's say that we all give up our seasons. As mentioned earlier on, how large is the waiting list? You don't think MLSE would say "Thanks, goodbye" and happily allow us to walk out? Imagine if they could control the entire SouthEnd with a family owned section. This will not solve anything. This may get some management axed or some new "players".

At least then we would know the truth, that this talk of "we love you guys and your support and we need it" was bullshit and that all they cared about this whole time was $$$ and putting asses into those red seats. I think it's worth it.

[TicTacTabarnack]

This will also hit them where it hurts (additional revenue). Instead of giving up our season tickets to someone that will fill it (i.e. 8000 waiting list).... Hold the spot, Sit, be silent, protest and (unfortunately) don't buy beer or concessions!

[Dave67]

I said it in the other thread and I say it again here. 'Only sing when you're winning' should never ever apply to us. I agree with the bulk of that letter but any negative message that is sent should be sent to the suits, not the boys on the field.

[Shaughno]

I said it in the other thread and I say it again here. 'Only sing when you're winning' should never ever apply to us. I agree with the bulk of that letter but any negative message that is sent should be sent to the suits, not the boys on the field.

I agree and disagree. The boys are the one playing like passionless bitches, for the most part. They need to know it as well.

[TicTacTabarnack]

The biggest slap in the face was last night at the end of the game when they played that god awful "this is our house" BMO commercial. "NOW IS NOT THE TIME!" I yelled.

We need to hit them where it hurts ...

[Barbarez]

I said it in the other thread and I say it again here. 'Only sing when you're winning' should never ever apply to us. I agree with the bulk of that letter but any negative message that is sent should be sent to the suits, not the boys on the field.

"The boys on the field"... thats the funniest thing since the George Carlin piece on Religion.

[MG42]

TFCBrigade:

"I think its time for all the supporter groups to put aside all differences and form an united front - a support army of sorts voicing our frustrations. Not attending games will not change anything because scalpers will make sure the seats are filled with beer-purchasing/food buying fans. We already put a stop to buying beer and food at BMO, so that's a good start. What are some things we can do? And please, let's not fool ourselves into believing we can get everyone in the south to turn their back to the field or do some European-like. Its not gonna work.

I personally believe we have to create banners that voice our frustration in a simple yet effective manner. A simple GET RID OF MO OR GET SOME TALENTED PLAYERS would do. Also, we (as supporter groups) could be completely quiet. Let the random claps come here and there, but we as supporters have to be quiet and get on the megaphones letting people know why we are quiet and that we are protesting. We gotta get at the media so they could also mention it. Without exposure, the movement is pointless. Get a huge ass tifo that stretched from 112 to 114 saying shit. Let's think of ideas. I'm not going out like that.

Its instances like these that truly show what we're made out of. We will never give up or give in, but will forever remain loyal and fight for what we believe in. We just refuse to support the talentless squad, and be made fools out of by the FO"


I say sit for the august 3rd game , and no singing.

If the team was really playing with passion and giving 100% effort I would never stop singing for them, but they are a lifeless team right now, they don't deserve what we gave them last night.

[MrHawk]

I agree 100%. I mean if you are going to shell out $20-$30 per game (plus Friendlies, Canada Cup), so let's say

19x30 = 570 on average just to see your team play. Plus all the extra money the hardcore fans spend on road trips, banners/tifo's, jerseys.

Then you factor in beer, food, transportation. It becomes expensive to support a team that won't show you any heart, and an FO that could honestly care less.

[Kickit09]

"The boys on the field"... thats the funniest thing since the George Carlin piece on Religion.

:smilielol5:

[BC101]

Let me pose a hypothetical situation:

Let's say we don't go to games. Let's say that we all give up our seasons. As mentioned earlier on, how large is the waiting list? You don't think MLSE would say "Thanks, goodbye" and happily allow us to walk out? Imagine if they could control the entire SouthEnd with a family owned section. This will not solve anything. This may get some management axed or some new "players".

Thing with this is.. Most of the people who go like families and shit come to check out the "SOUTH END and all its whacky supporters' we're like a side show tot he actual game. If we were gone the fam's would drop off for SURE I think.

[Barbarez]

Hey man, if "the boys on the field" played with heart, passion and hussle, fought for the ball and showed me that they are really trying I would support them win or lose. But that just isn't happening, and it hasn't been happening since the start of season.

[greatwhitenorf]

The stadium is about to be expanded with a second tier above the east side and another row of private suites in between. I recently got that information directly from David Miller and from his closest associates.

Anyone who thinks boycotting TFC is the way to put pressure on MLSE is seriously deluding themselves about their self importance. There's a lot of people ready to take your place. Four of them were with me last night enjoying their first-ever game and dying to buy season tickets.

Soccer needs all of its most ardent fans to stick with it and make things better. Especially nowadays with some critical decisions about to be made regarding the future of BMO Field.

Here's how the deal will work.

If support for TFC remains strong, we'll get grass and the stadium's core business will remain soccer. The emphasis will be on the pro game and international soccer, rather than the current business model of using recreational soccer rentals to inch up stadium revenues. A typical seven or eight month season would permit somewhere between 30 and 40 games, depending on the success of TFC, our national teams and the 'marketing monkeys' to attract high-profile international games or friendlies. There would be more than enough revenue to make the stadium a palace.

If support for TFC falls away, the plastic turf will remain and the stadium will be utilized as home field for the CFL's Toronto Argonauts as well as TFC. And as soccer takes a backseat at BMO Field, everyone in the media can say 'I told you so.' The plan to expand down the east side serves the Argos needs perfectly. Capacity would remain high, even when they are tearing down the south end stands to put in mobile seating that suits both sports.

Is that really what you want, Barbarez? Is that what any of us want?

I think not.

This team is less than two years old and as frustrating as last night was, the club really has done remarkably well. And we fans have been a massive part of it. But short-term frustrations are no reason for what Barbarez has done in his opening rant - chucked toys from his pram and widdled on the nannie.

How about taking our lumps with just a little grace and maturity and giving Montreal and Vancouver some credit? They've been around as clubs a lot longer that TFC have. They've learned a thing or two about competing and winning.

Real competition is a very healthy thing. It makes everyone involved have to be that much better. Why not assume that this will be a bitter experience for TFC, something that will sting for many days to come, something that they'll use as a motivational device to get better, to get real grass in so they don't have ANY issues about attracting the best talent available?

If you want to win, you don't run away from failure. You face up to it. You fight it. And someday, you defeat it.

You're right to be angry about the loss. You're wrong to run away from the team. It won't make anything better. On the pitch, in the stands or within the boardrooms of MLSE or the city, where important decisions about the stadium, the club and the game itself, will soon be made.

You'll make changes happen much more quickly by working from within. Hope you're back next game.

[Kickit09]

and its not the loosing thats so hard to take. its the heartless play, other than a very few select players they just dont look like they want it bad enough. montreal sucks hard donkey balls, but they just wanted this tournament more.

[Super]

All of this would be very different if we had a class striker. Trust me, you put a few balls in the net and the team will look, feel, and overall play much better because of it. TFC plays like a team with little confidence, and every player looks increasingly frustrated because of the poor results. Let's face it, a frustrated team never plays well. We need a bit of success. Then things will turn around.

[Dave67]

Hey man, if "the boys on the field" played with heart, passion and hussle, fought for the ball and showed me that they are really trying I would support them win or lose. But that just isn't happening, and it hasn't been happening since the start of season.

I don't disagree with the review of the team so far. I disagree with supporters being quiet in protest. Yep it's been done in many places, but I don't agree with it.

BMO field needs to be as un friendly a place to play as we can make. But not for Toronto FC. Protest to management not the boys on the field.

[Rawkus_420]

I'll be attending the rest of the games I have tickets for , as I have purchased my seat already for this year, and the guy I bought ti from isnt exactly going to retun my money, but unless I see change, I can admit it is very doubtful I get seasons seats in my name unless theyre in the supporters section and half the price of what I paid this year....dissapointing...they truly are owned by the maple leafs.....same shti happened to real salt lake, they were sold out the first few years and then it faded quickly.They will probably see an improvement with the new stadium, but thats besides the point.

[Shaughno]

I don't disagree with the review of the team so far. I disagree with supporters being quiet in protest. Yep it's been done in many places, but I don't agree with it.

BMO field needs to be as un friendly a place to play as we can make. But not for Toronto FC. Protest to management not the boys on the field.


Why not both? Obviouly they are playing uninspired, as quite visable in the past month. The boys are not free from criticism.

[Dave67]

Why not both? Obviouly they are playing uninspired, as quite visable in the past month. The boys are not free from criticism.


I disagree. Between the first and last whistle they are free from my criticism.

[jwfm1985]

:cheers:
The stadium is about to be expanded with a second tier above the east side and another row of private suites in between. I recently got that information directly from David Miller and from his closest associates.

Anyone who thinks boycotting TFC is the way to put pressure on MLSE is seriously deluding themselves about their self importance. There's a lot of people ready to take your place. Four of them were with me last night enjoying their first-ever game and dying to buy season tickets.

Soccer needs all of its most ardent fans to stick with it and make things better. Especially nowadays with some critical decisions about to be made regarding the future of BMO Field.

Here's how the deal will work.

If support for TFC remains strong, we'll get grass and the stadium's core business will remain soccer. The emphasis will be on the pro game and international soccer, rather than the current business model of using recreational soccer rentals to inch up stadium revenues. A typical seven or eight month season would permit somewhere between 30 and 40 games, depending on the success of TFC, our national teams and the 'marketing monkeys' to attract high-profile international games or friendlies. There would be more than enough revenue to make the stadium a palace.

If support for TFC falls away, the plastic turf will remain and the stadium will be utilized as home field for the CFL's Toronto Argonauts as well as TFC. And as soccer takes a backseat at BMO Field, everyone in the media can say 'I told you so.' The plan to expand down the east side serves the Argos needs perfectly. Capacity would remain high, even when they are tearing down the south end stands to put in mobile seating that suits both sports.

Is that really what you want, Barbarez? Is that what any of us want?

I think not.

This team is less than two years old and as frustrating as last night was, the club really has done remarkably well. And we fans have been a massive part of it. But short-term frustrations are no reason for what Barbarez has done in his opening rant - chucked toys from his pram and widdled on the nannie.

How about taking our lumps with just a little grace and maturity and giving Montreal and Vancouver some credit? They've been around as clubs a lot longer that TFC have. They've learned a thing or two about competing and winning.

Real competition is a very healthy thing. It makes everyone involved have to be that much better. Why not assume that this will be a bitter experience for TFC, something that will sting for many days to come, something that they'll use as a motivational device to get better, to get real grass in so they don't have ANY issues about attracting the best talent available?

If you want to win, you don't run away from failure. You face up to it. You fight it. And someday, you defeat it.

You're right to be angry about the loss. You're wrong to run away from the team. It won't make anything better. On the pitch, in the stands or within the boardrooms of MLSE or the city, where important decisions about the stadium, the club and the game itself, will soon be made.

You'll make changes happen much more quickly by working from within. Hope you're back next game.


Agreed:hump:

[jwfm1985]

Look, I don't know these guys personally, but I am pretty damn sure that this is no bluff.

we'll see

[Shaughno]

I disagree. Between the first and last whistle they are free from my criticism.


If they are playing like 12 year old girls, I will let them know. No sense in waiting until after the 90th to tell them when they can't change how they are playing.

[Phil]

If they are playing like 12 year old girls, I will let them know. No sense in waiting until after the 90th to tell them when they can't change how they are playing.


Don't be disrespectful of the 12 year old girls. TFC played worse than that. :p

[tfc88]

I'll still be at the games.. but let's take this beer/concession boycott seriously.. MLSE needs to know now that their antics wont be tolerated by true football fans.

look for the new thread

[MrHawk]

So if 200 people stop buying 1x$10 beer, compared to the 10,000 that buy beer think that will make a difference?

[Dave67]

If they are playing like 12 year old girls, I will let them know. No sense in waiting until after the 90th to tell them when they can't change how they are playing.

But that would be an emotional response based on the run of play. I see that as different from an organised effort to not get behind the team.

Anyway you do things whatever way works for you. For me I'm behind them when they are on the field.

[mclaren]

I boycotted buying beer at BMO about 6 games ago now because of the prices - best thing I ever did. It feels good not to feel ripped off.

[jloome]

Retarded overreaction, this entire thread. We need a striker, probably two. We need a right back who stays in position (it's been commented on every game for eight straight fucking weeks, and yet somehow a majority here seem to think Marvell knows how to play defence); we need two central defenders who can handle a pressure game, where the ball isn't in the other end all night. We need a goalie to be a little more brilliant, a little less stupid.

None of these things to me equals a franchise in dire peril. I'll shit blood and eat my own puke before I give up on my team, regardless of how fucking badly they do. Protest Mo's inability to fucking sign somebody if you want, or MLSE and the turf, or whatever particular point you feellike making responsible for the entire mess. But to give up on your team because they aren't playing well in their second season is a fucking disgrace.

Barbarez, I live in fucking Edmonton and show more support for this team than you do; try offering a constructive fucking position for once instead of just whining, because you've started sounding like a slightly more literate Giambac. Just because you've been an "Ultra" for years doesn't mean you should forget that, despite what people here seem to think, supporting the team is more important than just ensuring the fans are happy, fat, and watching a winning team.
I support and cheer this team, no matter what, during every game, even if it's hunched over my fucking desktop at work watching it on a grainy four-square inch screen; the least fans should be able to expext is for their own peers to show a modicum of realism, common sense, and respect for the ideal of being a supporter.

Fucking sad, the fucking lot of you whiners. They need two forums on this place: one for armchair generals, the other for actual supporters.

[giambac]

Fire the Fucking Coach.

That is the starting point.

We don't have a quality striker I agree ,however

Montreal doesn't have a quality striker
Montreal doesn't have a good midfield
Montreal doesn't have a good defence
Montreal didn't have the Home crowd.

Montreal is 9th out of 10 teams in the USL

You didn't need a quality strike to beta Montreal

Carver has to be held responsible. The players aren't motivated, they don't show passion, it is his job to get 100% out of them. We're lucky if they are giving 50% on a given day.

Montreal started the season poorly.
What did they do? They fired their coach.......Monteal is now the CC Champions

England fired their coach when they didn't qualify for the 2008 Euro's - they fired their coach

Italy fired their coach after an early (Quarterfinal) exit from the 2008 Euro's

TFC hasn't won in 9 games. We just lost the CC. We can't beat an expansion team at home. we can't beat USl team s at home. Before we lose more ground in our playoff drive Fire Carver. Otherwise the whole season will have been a waste of time.

[Shaughno]

But that would be an emotional response based on the run of play. I see that as different from an organised effort to not get behind the team.

Anyway you do things whatever way works for you. For me I'm behind them when they are on the field.


So making a banner that says, "Where's the passion?" is organized effort to NOT get behind the team? ;)

[bgnewf]

I have had a chance to think and stew over last night's embarrassment and where we go from here:

Can Carver be questioned for some of the tactical moves he made last night and over this slump? Yes he can. Hoofing wide crosses into the box time after time after time made us look like the TFC from last year that did not score for 800+ minutes. Completely predictable. Carver was the man going with a 3-5-2 formation in Chicago that saw us again dig our graves on the road. He has been the coach for the road games where we have only picked up a single win and looked out coached by opposition coaches more often than not. Indeed he can be blamed for part of this, but only a part...

Players of questionable ability, effort and heart (Robert, Cunningham, Velez, Edu for example) also need to step up like men and take responsibility for a lot of the problems we now face. Professionals do not take nights off. Professionals run for every ball. Professionals find a way to compete night after night in the face of adversity. Professional players can lose, but it should never be due to lack of effort or intensity.

Carver has to play the cards dealt to him. and Mo is apparently a pretty shitty dealer. Carver had to play a 16 year old in the biggest game in club history to date as he had no other attacking options. Mo is the one that pretty well states that we do not need Canadians on the team to compete in MLS. Well look now Mo at the fact that we got smoked by two USL teams with plenty of Canucks on their squads and they showed a lot of heart and desire to their collective credit, which our lads apparently could or would not do.

As far as the rest of this season goes, who the hell knows. Playoffs are to me looking like something that might be hard to realistically pull off. We have 14 games remaining and of them only 6 are at home. We have 8 road games against some of the weaker MLS sides (including 2 against Red Bulls), so there is some opportunity there... At home we have matches with some of the stronger MLS sides (New England, Houston, Chicago for example) still to play, so dropping more home points is far from out of the question.

This is your team Mo, you put it together. And I hope that you are as sick to your stomach as many of us were and are. And for the sake of the team and their fans I really hope you have something in the works to upgrade the strike force. Too little too late most likely. You had a chance a month or so ago Mo to upgrade our talent level at striker in advance of a critical period in the history of the club and you have failed miserably in doing so. Anything you do now feels like a month too late.

Last year the pivotal game in our fortunes was the Aston Villa friendly. We saw our team decimated by injury go on to futility for most of the rest of the season. Last night feels a lot like that game after the fact. All I hope is that I am wrong in my assessment. Because I really want the playoffs. That is the only thing that will allow me to get over last night...

Gutted...

[Dave67]

So making a banner that says, "Where's the passion?" is organized effort to NOT get behind the team? ;)

Actually "Where's the passion?" is an ideal banner. You make it. Get a couple of people down at BMO from 11 - 12 to hold it up at the North end where the gates are. They could stand on the ledge in front of the food building so the players would see it when they practise. Pretty often they practise before lunch at BMO.

But hanging a where's the passion banner during a game AND sitting quietly at the same time? Surely the same would be asked back to us?

[OneLoveOneEric]

Anyone who thinks we're a striker away from being a good team is being as blind as when people thought we were Robert and Guevara away from being a good team.
A striker won't make these guys feel the need to work, and for me, that's what I'm so pissed off about. I can handle losing. I can't abide watching them jog around for 90 minutes and lose.
And for me, that's why they are certainly NOT immune to my anger during the games. We try, so they sure as shit had better try.

[jwfm1985]

Fire the Fucking Coach.

That is the starting point.

We don't have a quality striker I agree ,however

Montreal doesn't have a quality striker
Montreal doesn't have a good midfield
Montreal doesn't have a good defence
Montreal didn't have the Home crowd.

Montreal is 9th out of 10 teams in the USL

You didn't need a quality strike to beta Montreal

Carver has to be held responsible. The players aren't motivated, they don't show passion, it is his job to get 100% out of them. We're lucky if they are giving 50% on a given day.

Montreal started the season poorly.
What did they do? They fired their coach.......Monteal is now the CC Champions

England fired their coach when they didn't qualify for the 2008 Euro's - they fired their coach

Italy fired their coach after an early (Quarterfinal) exit from the 2008 Euro's

TFC hasn't won in 9 games. We just lost the CC. We can't beat an expansion team at home. we can't beat USl team s at home. Before we lose more ground in our playoff drive Fire Carver. Otherwise the whole season will have been a waste of time.

Besides the fact that he is clearly not literate, has anyone noticed he copies and pastes his posts in multiple threads? You sir, are a joke

[Shaughno]

^^ It's easier just to ignore. :D

[Smenge]

4 out of 6 points from Montreal. Tying Vancouver in a game TFC dominated, was the real problem. TFC does not have a striker. Yet, man for man, they are the better club than Montreal. Who would you pick off that team for a starting role with TFC?

Give it a break. It is only a soccer game. They are not a good mls team yet (tying San Jose proves something, doesn't it?).

Give them time. The extreme wing of the supporters in europe ruins soccer for everybody (Milan, Rome, Turin....)....if some, or all of you guys want to abandon your seats, good for you, go ahead, nobody really gives a shit.

[giambac]

Besides the fact that he is clearly not literate, has anyone noticed he copies and pastes his posts in multiple threads? You sir, are a joke


MY MISSION IS TO GET CARVER FIRED!

I won't stop until he is gone.

I started my rant 9 games ago. Everyon ethought Iwas crazy. Sincethen game after game the team has gone South. They have become a joke and the laughing stock of This city. Toronto is known for their inept hockey teams and now TFC is taken over after last night's performance. Not in a 100 years would I have thought TFC would overtake the LEAFS as laughing stock in the sports of this city.

I've noticed that more and more people are seeing the light and they are calling for Carver to be fired. Also MO or both of them. Eventually (when it's to late and our playoff chances are also gone) the rest of you will also realize that Carver is a loser and you simply can't win with a loser.

[Parkdale]

giambac (http://64.13.252.151/forums/member.php?u=253) --- there is one thread devoted to your argument already.

It's called 'Mo or John' and it would be great if you could keep this specific thread on topic by keeping your anti-carver posts in that thread.


http://64.13.252.151/forums/showthread.php?t=3656&page=2


^ that's the thread.

[brad]

If we were gone the fam's would drop off for SURE I think.

It would for sure. How many time do you hear a casual fan talk about the match vs. talking about the atmosphere? It's always about the atmosphere.

[Jack]

Anyone who thinks we're a striker away from being a good team is being as blind as when people thought we were Robert and Guevara away from being a good team.
A striker won't make these guys feel the need to work, and for me, that's what I'm so pissed off about. I can handle losing. I can't abide watching them jog around for 90 minutes and lose.
And for me, that's why they are certainly NOT immune to my anger during the games. We try, so they sure as shit had better try.
This is the point.

Urgency, passion, comittment. Garra, entrega (these two words are perfect descriptions in Spanish, especially garra.) Garra means "claw" literally, but it transmits that die for the shirt mentality and win for your fans by any means necessary mentality that we are sorely lacking right now.

Bleed Red, TFC players, bleed RED! I do.

[Parkdale]

Bleed Red, TFC players, bleed RED! I do.

I bleed gravy.

[blackandwhite]

P.S

The letter was written by TFCBrigade, not me.

explains why SSJ wasn't mentioned at all.. :) I thought Ultras didnt get along with snake Usec, RPB and NEE

[trane]

4 out of 6 points from Montreal. Tying Vancouver in a game TFC dominated, was the real problem. TFC does not have a striker. Yet, man for man, they are the better club than Montreal. Who would you pick off that team for a starting role with TFC?

Give it a break. It is only a soccer game. They are not a good mls team yet (tying San Jose proves something, doesn't it?).

Give them time. The extreme wing of the supporters in europe ruins soccer for everybody (Milan, Rome, Turin....)....if some, or all of you guys want to abandon your seats, good for you, go ahead, nobody really gives a shit.


From someone who has been and lived in Milan and Rome and often visited Turin, I have to tell you that it is not only the "extreme" supporters that would show there diplesure of a club that is performing like ours. Every interested support would, that is how you push you team toward greatness.

[trane]

I bleed gravy.


I though you bled gravy, beer and cheese curds?

[Ehsan]

The stadium is about to be expanded with a second ......

first off, I agree with you 100%, very well put!

I disagree with any sort of hasty "protest" which will have zero impact for reasons already pointed out in this thread (8,000 season ticket wait list is the biggest hurdle here for the ones who think giving up seats will send the message).

We are still in playoff contention and we need to be behind the team 150% right now... don't kid yourselves, taking on the MLSE will not do us any good in the near-term. If this dismal performance continues and we are out of the playoff race, then waste your time on dealing with the MLSE and hope to make a difference next season.

In case you haven't noticed, after a 10-game winless streak the morale in the locker room is at rock bottom... abondoning the team in the hopes that MLSE would give a fuck (they won't) and throwing a "supporters fit" would just aggrevate this downward shit spiral!

The post-game reaction from JC and the boys is encouraging, you see disbelief, you see a reality check, you see a couple light bulbs coming on (hopefully!)...

believe you me, I hate the MLSE just as much as any of you. They're raking in cash (apparently they had a 20% ROI in the first season alone!! which is unreal) and not giving a fuck about the sport/fans/players/etc.

BUT realistically, for this season, we have to work with what we've got at the moment, including MO and his amazing managerial/scouting skills and potential DPs he is working on... the guy was an MLS coach for ~3yrs and is then immediately promoted to the GM position... did anybody take a fucking glance at his CV before handing out the promotion??!!

[olegunnar]

Besides the fact that he is clearly not literate, has anyone noticed he copies and pastes his posts in multiple threads? You sir, are a joke

Do you work for TFC or MLSE?

No offense, but it seems like most of your posts are replies to criticisms of the team.

It's also pretty obvious that they register and post here en masse, so I thought I'd just ask straight out.

Eventually it'd be nice to have a list, so we could ascertain their motives when they post.
You know like..."hey is it just me or have streamers jumped the shark?" or "hey what do we think about Blizzard uniforms on Canada Day?" or "hey everybody there's new blocks of tickets available for the all star party" or "hey there's a staff game on the tfc video player, lets check it out!" now the "I heard a rumour we'll get exspansion and grass, so lets not get all angry and have a rash protest"

[Nodoubtguy]

Honestly, I got home yesterday....didn't want to even come on the boards or anything. I just wanted to go home and relax, not think about the game. Today, it's really setting in. I literally feel sick about it. I have never put so much into a team like I have with TFC. I'm not giving up, I'm just disappointed.

[ecantona7]

and its not the loosing thats so hard to take. its the heartless play, other than a very few select players they just dont look like they want it bad enough. montreal sucks hard donkey balls, but they just wanted this tournament more.
I agree with this. Yesterday was first ever tfc game and I was shocked at the amount of players not giving two shits about their teammates or the supporters that were singing their hearts out (me included:cool:). As soon as the ball was giving away they just stopped running and just stood around like fukwits. Either trackback and do something or be on your horse.

[ecantona7]

TFCBrigade:

"I think its time for all the supporter groups to put aside all differences and form an united front - a support army of sorts voicing our frustrations. Not attending games will not change anything because scalpers will make sure the seats are filled with beer-purchasing/food buying fans. We already put a stop to buying beer and food at BMO, so that's a good start. What are some things we can do? And please, let's not fool ourselves into believing we can get everyone in the south to turn their back to the field or do some European-like. Its not gonna work.

I personally believe we have to create banners that voice our frustration in a simple yet effective manner. A simple GET RID OF MO OR GET SOME TALENTED PLAYERS would do. Also, we (as supporter groups) could be completely quiet. Let the random claps come here and there, but we as supporters have to be quiet and get on the megaphones letting people know why we are quiet and that we are protesting. We gotta get at the media so they could also mention it. Without exposure, the movement is pointless. Get a huge ass tifo that stretched from 112 to 114 saying shit. Let's think of ideas. I'm not going out like that.

Its instances like these that truly show what we're made out of. We will never give up or give in, but will forever remain loyal and fight for what we believe in. We just refuse to support the talentless squad, and be made fools out of by the FO"
Schalke did that two years I believe. They were frustrated with the way the team was playing and they sat quiet until the 30th minute (as they had planned before). And then in the 30th minute they started clapping and two minutes later schalke scored.

[RedsYNWA]

Ah but are you going to sell/trade your tickets or just leave them unused

They will be put away in my collection as the protest tickets that went unused

[Razor]

Hey man, if "the boys on the field" played with heart, passion and hussle, fought for the ball and showed me that they are really trying I would support them win or lose. But that just isn't happening, and it hasn't been happening since the start of season.

Hey Barbarez,

Why the fuck were the cops questioning you last night after the game?

[giambac]

giambac (http://64.13.252.151/forums/member.php?u=253) --- there is one thread devoted to your argument already.

It's called 'Mo or John' and it would be great if you could keep this specific thread on topic by keeping your anti-carver posts in that thread.


http://64.13.252.151/forums/showthread.php?t=3656&page=2


^ that's the thread.


I hear where your coming from but man I'm so piseed about last night. I'm so pissed about Saturday's game, I'm so pissed about the last 9 games. I'm so pisssed that a season that began with so much hope is quickly going down the drain.

WE are fans and we deserve more. I paid good $ for my 6 season tickets. I ahve a right to express my opinion and displeasures and right now I'm so displeased with our product. I never thought TFC would overatlke the Leafs as a laughing stock in our city. The commentators on the radio (iknow they aren't soccer fans) are laughing at the team and the supporters.

Last night was a sellout over 20k fans. at an average price of $40-$50MLSE made $1million profit yesterday. (the players don't get paid extra for CC/friendly matches). That's not including outrageous berr, food, merchandise costs. MLSE is taking all fans for a ride

You get morons who work for TFC management who come on this site and call me an idiot for posting my comments. Well not everyone will agree however I'm not the one who will sit still and watch the boat sink. My opinions may not be right but they will be made vocal.

Here are my Beefs

MLSE Are Money grbbing pigs who care fuck all about the team and the fans.

1) Why did they force fans to purchase 12 Marlie tickets to be guaranteed a LA Galaxy ticket
2) Why did MLSE force TFC fans to purchase both CC games as a package. Why couldn't we just buy 1 game if we wanted
3) Why did MLSE charge us regular prices to watch USL teams....Money from the Vancouver game and Montreal game are pure profit.


AND FIRE CARVER ALREADY...........PLEASE

[MrHawk]

The 2 statements you mentioned up there, are nothing new in sports world.

In QMJHL anyone who wanted to watch Rimouski play (Sidney Crosbey), had to buy a 5 pack to get to see him for 1 game.

[fetajr]

fire Carver, and fire MO, and fire MO's boss and start building this thing correctly right from the top. Soccer people hiring soccer people

[THA BUTCHA]

Shocked, dissapointed, lost for words, annoyed, and truly disgusted. These are the emotions that are running through my head after witnessing a humiliating loss to the Montreal Impact on Tuesday, July 22nd, 2008. Where do I start? Our players lacked heart, lacked passion, and acted like superstars prancing across the field. Refusing to run down balls and put in that extra effort that would gurantee the trophy doesn't leave Toronto grounds. Maybe the game didn't mean much to you, but it meant the world to us. A win last night symbolized a thank you to the fans, and you let each and every single one of us down. From the organized support shown by the Ultras, Usec, RPB and NEE, to the individualized support by the little kids spread across the stadium. I am not going to apologize for booing you because you do not deserve the type of love and support we have given you. You do not deserve the countless hours and dollars we have invested into making banners, planning tifo's, and making flags. Does that even mean anything to you? When you play like that against a historic rival for Toronto, we truly doubt it. You let them come onto our turf and raise the trophy above our heads mocking everything we stand for. Maybe you don't take this shit serious, but we do, and I refuse to support you until you begin to play with heart or are traded. Plain and simple.

The Front Office, the Ultras warned everybody against your Maple Leaf-like policies, and nobody believed us until now. I believe everybody sees that you are using us as marketing tools to profit and could care less about the talentless squad. You gave us a shitty stadium without a roof, gave the players a shitty playing surface, continously rob us blind with beer prices, and send piranaha's our way labelling us as hooligans. TFC has created a lot of exec-jobs for individuals who know shit all about football and it shows. You hassle us day in and day out but scalpers freely walk around, making sure non-supporters are in the supporter section telling us to shush down and letting us know what we can do and what we can't. Our friends were hit with criminal charges setting off harmless smoke bombs, meanwhile the Montreal Impact fans let a few off last night with police officers and BMO security starring at them refusing to do anything. They came into our stadium and disrespected us. You care about the buck - which shouldn't come as a surprise seeing the cold-money hungry capitalistic environment you have created in sport venues across Toronto. Fuck you and your shitty stadium, fuck you and your field turf, fuck you and the security hassling us, fuck you and your money hungry ways, fuck you using us as your marketing monkeys and fuck you for using my face on a poster. Take that shit down. Maybe it won't happen this year, but when BMO sees 8,000 people a game, maybe then you'll care to show love towards those who have been there from day one - at home and away.

To all the Ultras, U-Sectorites, NEE and RPB members who were there in the pouring rain standing our ground infront of the Impact bus protecting the honor and dignity of our team, all the respect in the world goes out for you. They closed us off with a fence and allowed Montreal players to provoke us with the trophy coming out of their shitty bus a couple of times, but we did the best we could do in the situation we were given.

In conclusion, maybe you don't take this seriously, no correction, we know you don't take this seriously, but we do. I refuse to attend any further games until change comes, and maybe that doesn't mean much to you seeing as how I am only one person (and the Ultras are a small group) but I will not invest any more time or money into a talentless team supporting a money-hungry Front Office that could give a flying fuck about us. That rolled out the red carpet for the Montreal players and their fans and did not say one word on how our boys were mistreated in Montreal. We prewarned everybody, now what's left is for the beer sippin' girlfriend wearing part-time supporters to enjoy the bland North American environment that has finally arrived at BMO.

Yours Truly,
Ultras 114.

Thank-you for writing this.
I feel the exact same way.

I own 16 season tickets for me and my friends. I have noticed that for the last month and a half we've been having a hard time getting everyone out to the games. It's been harder for me to give away the extra tickets that I seem to get stuck with EVERY game for the past month.

I maybe what you call a "HardCore Fan" but most in my crew are casual fans just like most people in my section.


And regardless of the type of fan they are, one thing they ARE NOT IS "SUCKERS". So i have a feeling the team is gonna see some backlash.

unless:

THEY FIRE CARVER and RELEASE CUNINGHAM immediately.

SIGN a Player that will start putting some balls in the net

Announce that they will be laying down REAL grass for TFC matches starting next season.

If they don't do at least one of these things soon you are gonna see a real change with the crowds @ BMO real soon

[Captain Croatia]

MLSE doesnt know how to run a real footy team. Plain and simple.

[Pyeddo]

And yet they sought inroads to acquire an EPL team..... what a bunch of jokers

Is it time to build more condo's yet Richard????

[noochie]

If they don't do at least one of these things soon you are gonna see a real change with the crowds @ BMO real soon

The waiting list has grown from 5000 - 8000 this season despite crappy TV numbers, I am not as sure as you are that crowds will start to dwindle anytime soon.

[noochie]

MLSE doesnt know how to run a real footy team. Plain and simple.

Pretty impressive assessment after 18 months.

[THA BUTCHA]

The waiting list has grown from 5000 - 8000 this season despite crappy TV numbers, I am not as sure as you are that crowds will start to dwindle anytime soon.


Thats true. But every season ticket holder knows this already. Nobody is gonna cancel their seasons they just won't come to the games. With the hope that TFC will make some changes they feel to be improving the team and then start attending matches again.

Remember MLSE makes more PROFIT from food and concessions then from season ticket sales..

[Barbarez]

explains why SSJ wasn't mentioned at all.. :) I thought Ultras didnt get along with snake Usec, RPB and NEE

This is bigger than our little grudges man, fucking relax.

[Smenge]

Hope you guys are wrong about mlse. Sundin played a decade without a winger who could score, will TFC suffer the same fate?????

[Barbarez]

Hey Barbarez,

Why the fuck were the cops questioning you last night after the game?

It was my buddy, not me. We get questioned every match, its no biggy.

[blackandwhite]

This is bigger than our little grudges man, fucking relax.

you know i love you man :)

[Barbarez]

you know i love you man :)

Yeah? Than who went and told Pedro that we came to the Pachuca game with Pachuca jerseys...It doesn't matter man, this isnt about the ultras, nee, rpb u sector or you guys, its about our team playing like shit.

[blackandwhite]

Yeah? Than who went and told Pedro that we came to the Pachuca game with Pachuca jerseys...It doesn't matter man, this isnt about the ultras, nee, rpb u sector or you guys, its about our team playing like shit.

I did what?? dude unless you have proof don't make accusations. I still love you :)

[boomcha]

I own 16 season tickets for me and my friends.


16?? Jeesus!! I would gladly take one of those 16 Season Tickets off one of your friends! Share the wealth!

[Bloor West FC]

Barbarez!!!!! Good post mate. I never met you but I hear your a cool guy. Drop by 111 row 1 any time. I say we hit them hard and don't by beer, just like King Dave said. We got our bar's a couple blocks away.

[Dave67]

Yeah? Than who went and told Pedro that we came to the Pachuca game with Pachuca jerseys...It doesn't matter man, this isnt about the ultras, nee, rpb u sector or you guys, its about our team playing like shit.

QFT
QFT

[Corcai]

Frustrated with how sloppy the play has been for what seems like months now. I stopped buying pints at BMO first game in this season.

However, just like a leaf fan I cannot seem to get so pissed that I don't snap up available tickets, or not watch the match on TV (which has been very fucking painful lately).

Between a rock and a hard place but still happier than I was in 06 when we didn't have a squad. Also starting to feel like a Leaf fan again though when I am attending/watching matche.

Last night was the toughest, in a seemingly long line of recent matches that somehow I knew 20 minutes in would end in disappointment. What makes it even tougher is knowing the amount of energy the supporters on this board and in other sections dedicate to this squad.

Having said that.....We will win the rest of our matches this season.

[H Bomb]

Frustrated with how sloppy the play has been for what seems like months now. I stopped buying pints at BMO first game in this season.

However, just like a leaf fan I cannot seem to get so pissed that I don't snap up available tickets, or not watch the match on TV (which has been very fucking painful lately).

Between a rock and a hard place but still happier than I was in 06 when we didn't have a squad. Also starting to feel like a Leaf fan again though when I am attending/watching matche.

Last night was the toughest, in a seemingly long line of recent matches that somehow I knew 20 minutes in would end in disappointment. What makes it even tougher is knowing the amount of energy the supporters on this board and in other sections dedicate to this squad.

Having said that.....We will win the rest of our matches this season.

I like this post. It shows the madness of our current situation and how it makes our brains go on little roller coasters. Although i really think we need to get this leafs fan concept out of our heads. It's overused and doesn't represent the situation well at all.

[Jimmy The Saint]

Last I checked Leafs fans sit in bars and watch their games. The people at Leafs games are there to do business, mostly.

I also hate being lumped in with them Leafs fans, becasue I'm not one. Hate the Leafs.

Love TFC.

[Baggio2TFC]

I agree with this post 100%! What people are failing to understand is that, we still support TFC all the way, it is the FO we don't support. In europe, they do this all the time! if they feel the team under performs, or managment is not backing them, they protest by not showing up. i am of Italian decent, and watch alot of Serie A games and could not tiell you how many games I have watched with 10,000 fans or less in 40-50, 000 seat stadiums. Lets be honest people, TFC did not perform, and the FO is still not giving us what we need, plain and simple!!! I would comply 100% if there was some kind of boycott, but it would have to be in #'s!! TFC...TFC!!

[H Bomb]

Last I checked Leafs fans sit in bars and watch their games. The people at Leafs games are there to do business, mostly.

I also hate being lumped in with them Leafs fans, becasue I'm not one. Hate the Leafs.

Love TFC.

First part is true, most leafs fans are in the bars. But it's nothing to do with being one or not. We don't sit and mockingly call ourselves Newcastle fans, or Cubs fans. Instead those fan bases are known as being near the best in their respective sports. The idea that leafs fans blindly follow is inept. They support their team, we should look highly of them. A real leafs fan doesn't care about the mocking they receive (sound familiar footy fans?) They support their team regardless of crappy ownership (twice) because the team represents them, and their city/region, and because of that their support never wavers. This is something we should learn from. I'm not happy and some of the protest concepts seem reasonable but without support the team is literally nothing so I will support the team always, and that will always include showing up and cheering them on in my book.

[marquis]

You must have been kidding yourself all this time. Did you not know what MLS was when the team came around?

MLS' roster restrictions and salary caps are enforced parity. Parity=mediocrity.

It isnt going to change anytime soon so to now decide to stop going to games shows a bit of shortsightedness and a lack of foresight on your part.

Theyre an MLS team and MLS is shit. End of story really.

I dont mean to throw a wet blanket on the supporters who work hard to create atmosphere but you cant expect the hard work to be reciprocated. MLS is what it is. Alot of people got way too into it and thought it was something it isnt.

MLS is not shit - we are. DC, NE or Houston would've embarassed Mtl and Vancouver in the same manner they did us (many times).

[mclaren]

Giambac, I appreciate and respect your opinions and passion about firing Carver. I felt the same way about Mo last season and started a thread on it on this forum and received the same kind of criticism you are facing now. While I don't think it's time to fire Carver, I do respect your opinion and your thoughts are valuable - fight for what you believe in - it adds to the debate.

[Alarius]

Hmm MLSE theme song..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sei-eEjy4g

All I wanna do is (BANG BANG BANG BANG!)
And (KKKAAAA CHING!)
And take your money



--------------------------------

But at the same time, I want to add.. we wouldn't be here if it weren't for them...

[james]

Ultras dont stop supporting the club because of lossing. Ultras go with the team no matter what.

I am disgusted by TFC right now, i know how you feel. However i think you shouldnt make that stop you from attending TFC games. But i am all for showing are disgust in what happened last night. Anyone have any suggestions?

[Mrs. Workie]

Shocked, dissapointed, lost for words, annoyed, and truly disgusted. These are the emotions that are running through my head after witnessing a humiliating loss to the Montreal Impact on Tuesday, July 22nd, 2008. Where do I start? Our players lacked heart, lacked passion, and acted like superstars prancing across the field. Refusing to run down balls and put in that extra effort that would gurantee the trophy doesn't leave Toronto grounds. Maybe the game didn't mean much to you, but it meant the world to us. A win last night symbolized a thank you to the fans, and you let each and every single one of us down. From the organized support shown by the Ultras, Usec, RPB and NEE, to the individualized support by the little kids spread across the stadium. I am not going to apologize for booing you because you do not deserve the type of love and support we have given you. You do not deserve the countless hours and dollars we have invested into making banners, planning tifo's, and making flags. Does that even mean anything to you? When you play like that against a historic rival for Toronto, we truly doubt it. You let them come onto our turf and raise the trophy above our heads mocking everything we stand for. Maybe you don't take this shit serious, but we do, and I refuse to support you until you begin to play with heart or are traded. Plain and simple.


I agree with this 100%. As for the rest of it, well I'm a supporter of the 11 guys on the pitch- not their front office or the MLSE- I don't go to games to chant for them, I got to cheer for our lads. At the end of the day, it's the guys on the pitch that win the game, and if they can't get the job done, I'm going to let them know how I feel.

[mclaren]

I think a concessions boycott is an excellent idea should our form continue to slide. We still support the players on the field but pressure the decision makers into action. Just not sure if the fairweather fans will do it (and there are a lot of them unfortunately).

[james]

I think a concessions boycott is an excellent idea should our form continue to slide. We still support the players on the field but pressure the decision makers into action. Just not sure if the fairweather fans will do it (and there are a lot of them unfortunately).

i dont think that would acomplish much. Alot of other fans would still buy beer and they still would make a killing with $10 beers!

I think making a banner or standing in silence for 1 half or even a whole game would work much better.

[juki]

I'm coming late to the party, I agree with this 100%!!! but if we don't lose sight with what Barbarez wrote, then these idiots from mlse should start paying attention.

Sticky his letter on all the boards of every supporters groups!!!

I just wish a few more "thank yous" to the cops should have been said for their outstanding job of policing the area looking for all those criminals that we have been complaining about all year.

It seems someone is trying to make a name for themselves.

[ExiledRed]

I just wish a few more "thank yous" to the cops should have been said for their outstanding job of policing the area looking for all those criminals that we have been complaining about all year.

.

yes, i was such a danger to society they let me attend the match anyway. Thanks for that , Porky.

[Mrs. Workie]

yes, i was such a danger to society they let me attend the match anyway. Thanks for that , Porky.

Don't worry Ian, I was a bigger threat standing on my chair than people throwing cups of beer, or lighting off smoke bombs :rolleyes:

Yes, I'm still bitter!

[noochie]

Sorry, to me boycotting concessoins seems a little backwards. The organization is turning the wheels and every day we hear about players that they are going after. Yet the same team that got us off to a 6-3-2 start at the beginning of season shits the bed and we will continue to support them while screwing over their bosses.

How does this logic make sense? Did everyone else get better around us? This is the same team. I am gonna direct the criticism where it is due... at the players involved. While enjoying a nice cold beverage.

[james]

Sorry, to me boycotting concessoins seems a little backwards. The organization is turning the wheels and every day we hear about players that they are going after. Yet the same team that got us off to a 6-3-2 start at the beginning of season shits the bed and we will continue to support them while screwing over their bosses.

How does this logic make sense? Did everyone else get better around us? This is the same team. I am gonna direct the criticism where it is due... at the players involved. While enjoying a nice cold beverage.

boycotting the concessions wont do nothing because many people are still gonna buy stuff and they will still making a killing. Banners or or standing in silence will show are displeasure much more effectively.

[noochie]

boycotting the concessions wont do nothing because many people are still gonna buy stuff and they will still making a killing. Banners or or standing in silence will show are displeasure much more effectively.

Agreed. Make the players understand who they are playing for. Or at least reciprocate their on-field effort ;)

[CenturySam]

Sorry, to me boycotting concessoins seems a little backwards. The organization is turning the wheels and every day we hear about players that they are going after. Yet the same team that got us off to a 6-3-2 start at the beginning of season shits the bed and we will continue to support them while screwing over their bosses.

How does this logic make sense? Did everyone else get better around us? This is the same team. I am gonna direct the criticism where it is due... at the players involved. While enjoying a nice cold beverage.



well, for all the draws we've gotten, and Cunny's fuk'n drought, 2 or 3 goals would be another 3 or 4 wins




but as for boycotting, instead of seeing a sea of red stadium wide, what if there was a big green patch in the south end. everyone wearing green shirts should do. just like the plan is to wear black at the all star game. A big green patch in the stands might get us a nice green patch as a pitch.

also, if 1000 people stopped buying beer, that would be a significant dent in their 'projected revenue' for concessions. If what is being said is correct, and TFC INC. is out for the money, then there has to be ways to attack a business, since they are always looking at the bottom line.

[adampz]

Somebody please send this letter to mlse:)

[twistedchinaman]

I agree with most. Except for ditching the team.

+1 for me.

[James Oliphant]

I love that the example people are citing as proof that "MLSE doesn't give a shit" and that "all they care about is money" is the draw against Montreal.

Have any of you who are saying this actually thought about those statements?

How does MLSE make money off TFC? By filling the stands on matchdays and selling merchandise/concessions/alcohol.

Winning against Montreal would have meant at least one more matchday. Extra matchdays mean extra money, remember.

Does it seem a logical argument, given this enlightenment I've just provided you all with, that MLSE doesn't give a fuck about winning?

In the business of sports, there's a pretty simple equation in play: win more = earn more. The argument "as long as the seats are full they won't care" really makes zero sense, because they know as well as I do that the more games you win, the more games you play, and the more money you make.

So what is MLSE? Are the people behind it masters of corporate greed and nonchalance the "bums-in-seats" crowd would have us believe, or are they the complete buffoons my revelations here would make them out to be?

They sure as hell can't be both at the same time.

[CoachGT]

also, if 1000 people stopped buying beer, that would be a significant dent in their 'projected revenue' for concessions. If what is being said is correct, and TFC INC. is out for the money, then there has to be ways to attack a business, since they are always looking at the bottom line.

Considering that (a) they've already bought the beer and (b) sales have already exceeded their expectations, so a small blip may not even factor in the equation and (c) 1000 people creates just that, a blip, I'm not sure that it would create enough of a dent to make any difference. They'd just have a little more beer left over in the inventory for next game.

Remember, all that they would be out is the net of the price of beer less the cost of the beer and the cost of serving it.

Missing a full game's worth, as mentioned above by not going through to the Champsions League, hurts them a lot more.

But I like the green shirts idea.

[KdotOdot]

Honestly.

I stopped drinking at BMO since May. I will NEVER buy another beer in that shithole and I sneak in my water. I agree with the booze and concession boycott.

Furthermore, it's about time all these so called "supporters Groups" United. We have ONLY ONE TEAM!! We should have only 1 supporters group. Sure having little splinter cells is required but there should be one main body.

[koryo]

I've had one beer at BMO this year -- and that was because a friend was with me and paid for it.

Won't waste the money on it.

[Oldtimer]

I love that the example people are citing as proof that "MLSE doesn't give a shit" and that "all they care about is money" is the draw against Montreal.

Have any of you who are saying this actually thought about those statements?



What's more depressing than losing, is having to put up with stupid comments afterward. Sheesh, I now know why BBTB bailed out on this board. No intelligent discussion (James Oliphant is an exception), just constant whining.

People who try to argue that Carver shouldn't be coach have no idea of the level of coaching in this league. it's not like Capello is going to land in Toronto. Carver is actually an above-average coach for this league, so he is not holding us back. Period.

It's come out that 4 players have turned down TFC because of the plastic pitch. Any one of those players would have turned us into a winning side. So we need to see where the real problem is instead of scapegoating the coach, like Leafs fans do.

[Pyeddo]

Anyone notice (and sorry if its been said before) the no beer sales from 112-118 during the All Star game? Way to try and keep us from drinking FO geniuses.... lol

[Jimmy The Saint]

Not that I agree with it, but "Scapegoating the Coach" is a Toronto tradition across the WHOLE professional sporting scene in this city!

The pitch is a problem. The lack of strikers is a problem. The boys are playing a very agrressive game, prone to counterattacks, because they have no choice but to attack as hard as they can and hope they scor off a lucky bounce, because we have no talent up front.

It's not Mo's fault we have a plastic pitch, because the city owns the facility. It's not Carver's fault he has no strikers, because Mo is the Manager, and again, not his fault he has to deal with a plastic pitch.

We should be targeting the City of Toronto; if this is supposed to be a world class city with world class facilities, then we need to convince the city that BMO field is getting heat globally as being a 2nd rate facility, and that professional footballers are turning away opportunities to play here because of this.

This will hurt any World Cup 2018 bid the country has, because FIFA will field complaints from internationals about the "turf".

Could you imagine the uproar if the ACC was owned by Toronto and the Leafs played on that summer-ice plastic shit instead of the real deal?

[maninb]

Not that I agree with it, but "Scapegoating the Coach" is a Toronto tradition across the WHOLE professional sporting scene in this city!

The pitch is a problem. The lack of strikers is a problem. The boys are playing a very agrressive game, prone to counterattacks, because they have no choice but to attack as hard as they can and hope they scor off a lucky bounce, because we have no talent up front.

It's not Mo's fault we have a plastic pitch, because the city owns the facility. It's not Carver's fault he has no strikers, because Mo is the Manager, and again, not his fault he has to deal with a plastic pitch.

We should be targeting the City of Toronto; if this is supposed to be a world class city with world class facilities, then we need to convince the city that BMO field is getting heat globally as being a 2nd rate facility, and that professional footballers are turning away opportunities to play here because of this.

This will hurt any World Cup 2018 bid the country has, because FIFA will field complaints from internationals about the "turf".

Could you imagine the uproar if the ACC was owned by Toronto and the Leafs played on that summer-ice plastic shit instead of the real deal?

LOL! Absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for a 80th ranked crap team like Canada to even BID on hosting the Worldf Cup? And even if they did, just where are the 3 or 4 55,000 seat stadiums gonna be built(which is the minimum necessary)?

[H Bomb]

Not that I agree with it, but "Scapegoating the Coach" is a Toronto tradition across the WHOLE professional sporting scene in this city!

The pitch is a problem. The lack of strikers is a problem. The boys are playing a very agrressive game, prone to counterattacks, because they have no choice but to attack as hard as they can and hope they scor off a lucky bounce, because we have no talent up front.

It's not Mo's fault we have a plastic pitch, because the city owns the facility. It's not Carver's fault he has no strikers, because Mo is the Manager, and again, not his fault he has to deal with a plastic pitch.

We should be targeting the City of Toronto; if this is supposed to be a world class city with world class facilities, then we need to convince the city that BMO field is getting heat globally as being a 2nd rate facility, and that professional footballers are turning away opportunities to play here because of this.



Thank you. I've been waiting too long to hear some reason on the subject

[colman1860]

Shocked, dissapointed, lost for words, annoyed, and truly disgusted. These are the emotions that are running through my head after witnessing a humiliating loss to the Montreal Impact on Tuesday, July 22nd, 2008.

And theres me thinking we tied.

[Barbarez]

And theres me thinking we tied.

Tied what exactly? Is TFC going through to play in Nicaragua? Stop sugarcoating it, we lost, to a shit team who plays in a shit league, whos last place in that shit league who couldn't beat Rochester in their last game.

[FluSH]

And theres me thinking we tied.


that was a huge loss...

[Maple Leaf Red]

LOL! Absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for a 80th ranked crap team like Canada to even BID on hosting the Worldf Cup? And even if they did, just where are the 3 or 4 55,000 seat stadiums gonna be built(which is the minimum necessary)?

Not on its own but I have heard talk that a US bid for 2018 would include some games in Canada which would then make Vancouver, Montreal, and Toronto easy candidates to get big new stadiums (in theory because a lot would depend on the other two making the MLS and probably some partnerships with CFL teams).