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Oldtimer
09-09-2014, 07:51 AM
8 games left, still in the mix but a long losing streak. How do you feel?

ryan
09-09-2014, 07:57 AM
I don't think we're going to recover from this tailspin so I've given up hope for it. Still going to come out and try to enjoy myself, but my expectations are nil.

Joe Kool
09-09-2014, 08:13 AM
I said 'No' because I haven't given up on it completely. Do I feel good about our chances? No but I haven't given up since we are still points away from a spot. If the gap starts to grow in the next few games I would like to update my answer.

Wagner
09-09-2014, 08:23 AM
what if we back into the 5th spot?
will people be satisfied?

Red4ever
09-09-2014, 08:50 AM
For me, it went from thinking, "we have to avoid the 4/5 if we want to be rested for a deep run" to "we will be lucky to get into the 4/5 and if by some miracle we get out, we won't win another game."

A least before I could suspend my disbelief. It's such an important part of sports.

bigredone
09-09-2014, 09:01 AM
The Canadian Championship title is enough to keep me cheering. Although this is an easier accomplishment, playing hard for this may result in a sneaky play-off entry. So, still seein' red...

inheavensince07
09-09-2014, 09:08 AM
The Canadian Championship title is enough to keep me cheering. Although this is an easier accomplishment, playing hard for this may result in a sneaky play-off entry. So, still seein' red...

Canadian Championship lol This team has done nothing since 2007 apart from a small run in champions league ..

Worst franchise in MLS history .. On field that is

Ossington Mental Youth
09-09-2014, 09:08 AM
I don't think we're going to recover from this tailspin so I've given up hope for it. Still going to come out and try to enjoy myself, but my expectations are nil.

pretty much this for me.

ryan
09-09-2014, 09:11 AM
what if we back into the 5th spot?
will people be satisfied?

If we sneak in or not, we're not going to make any noise. We'll very likely be one and done anyways. The team will still pat itself on the back for finishing 5th and achieving it's goal of being mid table with winning nothing.

ManUtd4ever
09-09-2014, 09:18 AM
I think our chances are slim.

I don't even know who to be upset with anymore. I certainly can't fault ownership or management, especially this season.

Maybe we are cursed.

brad
09-09-2014, 09:19 AM
Voted no. Don't think we will make it based on the performances we have put in so far, but no point in giving up on it yet. One good result (ideally very soon) could turn things around quickly.

bigredone
09-09-2014, 09:28 AM
Canadian Championship lol This team has done nothing since 2007 apart from a small run in champions league ..

Worst franchise in MLS history .. On field that is

Yeah, that was my # 1 moment. And still living it hahaha doh! Where is R.J. and D.K....

JayMolly
09-09-2014, 10:05 AM
We agree with Bradley -

"We’re not even close to giving up" . . .

neuf
09-09-2014, 10:09 AM
The Canadian Championship title is enough to keep me cheering. Although this is an easier accomplishment, playing hard for this may result in a sneaky play-off entry. So, still seein' red...

But we didn't win the Canadian Championship this year?

pdubs
09-09-2014, 10:13 AM
not out yet. we don't look good but the East is not strong.

Carts
09-09-2014, 10:13 AM
I put "Dunno" and that's honestly how I feel...

My heart says they can do it - with the effort & the guys we have on the roster...

My head says 'give up' after seeing the last 2-games / if that's how Vanney wants us to play...

I'm honestly really down in the dumps about this team right now... :(

Carts...

Jack
09-09-2014, 10:27 AM
I'm not looking that far ahead. If I raise my gaze up too high, then I get the shit down my throat, instead of on top of my head.

ag futbol
09-09-2014, 10:49 AM
I want to see how they look after having a week straight to prepare. Looked like a lot of things were slowly evolving out there on Saturday... Think 2 games in a week made it difficult to do the changeover.

Yohan
09-09-2014, 10:53 AM
not out yet. we don't look good but the East is not strong.
compared to the West, sure. but it feels like every team in the East is gaining form (except SKC for some reason) except us. even Montreal has been putting in more of a fight lately

if we don't get at least a point in Chicago and a win vs Chivas USA at home, we're toast

Ben - D.O.W.
09-09-2014, 11:35 AM
I want to be proven wrong, I really, really do, but I voted Yes. I just can't see us getting in.

As for stumbling our way to 5th, I might have been okay with that at the start of the season but after some of the promising moments earlier in the year I'd consider that a big let down (I mean not as big as not making it at all, but still pretty disappointing) - I just really wanted a home playoff game.

ryan
09-09-2014, 11:55 AM
I think a good discussion could actually be had about which is better, making it or not.

If we make it, there's the obvious...we made the playoffs. But this team probably isn't going to do all that much if they do. It might get some fans back on board, but if we're 1 and done with no home game, then probably won't do much at all. The worst part about it, would be management patting themselves on the back with a "we said we'd make the playoffs, and we did" speech. Gross. Ticket prices would likely rise.

If we don't make it, there's again the obvious....we missed the playoffs. Perhaps another shitkicking to the teeth would do this club some good? Not that the previous ones have, but this one would be the biggest IMO. Would probably see tickets remain the same price.


Overall, I think missing out might serve us best in the long run, but I'm really not sure.

Detroit_TFC
09-09-2014, 12:07 PM
Looking at each game left, there are some points to be had but not enough I'm afraid. Last shred of hope for achievement this season is somehow topping our previous pts record of 39 in 2009.

trane
09-09-2014, 12:08 PM
After year after year of futility not making it is not acceptable. There will be nothing good about it. This team knows how to lose, it needs to learn how to win. Now is the time to do it. It has a good squad and for it to make the play offs it just needs to win half its game. They need to do it.

Chevy
09-09-2014, 12:09 PM
Once and a while the sun shines on a dog's ass. Our ass is due for some sun.

Ultra & Proud
09-09-2014, 12:10 PM
Last shred of hope for achievement this season is somehow topping our previous pts record of 39 in 2009.
This is where I am now. I think we can just manage to beat this but I am not 100% sure of that either.

Ben - D.O.W.
09-09-2014, 12:30 PM
I think a good discussion could actually be had about which is better, making it or not.

If we make it, there's the obvious...we made the playoffs. But this team probably isn't going to do all that much if they do. It might get some fans back on board, but if we're 1 and done with no home game, then probably won't do much at all. The worst part about it, would be management patting themselves on the back with a "we said we'd make the playoffs, and we did" speech. Gross. Ticket prices would likely rise.

If we don't make it, there's again the obvious....we missed the playoffs. Perhaps another shitkicking to the teeth would do this club some good? Not that the previous ones have, but this one would be the biggest IMO. Would probably see tickets remain the same price.


Overall, I think missing out might serve us best in the long run, but I'm really not sure.

I think the worst thing we could do is pull a 2013-Montreal post season. Luckily I can't picture players like Bradley letting it get to that point, but if not making it vs imploding without a home game are the choices, I'd rather our season ends at NE.

Initial B
09-09-2014, 12:31 PM
Based on the schedule, the only game I don't think they can win is the LA game. I think it's still possible, though how likely I'm not sure.

TOBOR !
09-09-2014, 12:54 PM
what if we back into the 5th spot?
will people be satisfied?

s'funny.

A couple of years back I was taking calls from my ticket rep and exchanging emails w/ Tom Anselmi. I told them I was pissed off at what they were doing at the club and i wouldn't be renewing. I was of the mind that Anselmi, Mariner and Cochrane had to go.

Then they replaced 2/3 with Payne and Nelsen, with Anselmi getting the boot shortly thereafter. The phone rang again, but I still didn't want any of it.

In no time at all Lieweke comes in, gets rid of Payne, Brings in Bez, Defoe, Bradley, et al and announces he's fucking off. Then Bez fires Nelsen and Defoe looks for all like he's leaving.

All of this in I think about two seasons.

I understand the spirit of the question, and I'm not being snarky, but what am I supposed to be satisfied with ?

This club is jokes from day one. End to end futility, as far as the eye can see.

Suds
09-09-2014, 01:05 PM
Not based on recent performances.

My mind may change after the game this Saturday. We will see how this team responds to the changes once they have had a full week under the staff, time to plan for their opponent, and had some time to recover between games.

The team is a shambles right now. We look as bad as we ever have.

Wagner
09-09-2014, 01:28 PM
s'funny.

A couple of years back I was taking calls from my ticket rep and exchanging emails w/ Tom Anselmi. I told them I was pissed off at what they were doing at the club and i wouldn't be renewing. I was of the mind that Anselmi, Mariner and Cochrane had to go.

Then they replaced 2/3 with Payne and Nelsen, with Anselmi getting the boot shortly thereafter. The phone rang again, but I still didn't want any of it.

In no time at all Lieweke comes in, gets rid of Payne, Brings in Bez, Defoe, Bradley, et al and announces he's fucking off. Then Bez fires Nelsen and Defoe looks for all like he's leaving.

All of this in I think about two seasons.

I understand the spirit of the question, and I'm not being snarky, but what am I supposed to be satisfied with ?

This club is jokes from day one. End to end futility, as far as the eye can see.

that is what I'm wondering.
if the club clears the smallest hurdle and takes the 5th seed...only to get bounced...
will that have been enough?
maybe in year 1 or 2...
but with the expectations so high, and the solid start that we had...
I personally don't think it will be enough.
and I'll be pissed if the team touts a 5th seed playoff appearance as a reason to jack up ticket prices in 2015.

Fort York Redcoat
09-09-2014, 01:47 PM
s'funny.

A couple of years back I was taking calls from my ticket rep and exchanging emails w/ Tom Anselmi. I told them I was pissed off at what they were doing at the club and i wouldn't be renewing. I was of the mind that Anselmi, Mariner and Cochrane had to go.

Then they replaced 2/3 with Payne and Nelsen, with Anselmi getting the boot shortly thereafter. The phone rang again, but I still didn't want any of it.

In no time at all Lieweke comes in, gets rid of Payne, Brings in Bez, Defoe, Bradley, et al and announces he's fucking off. Then Bez fires Nelsen and Defoe looks for all like he's leaving.

All of this in I think about two seasons.

I understand the spirit of the question, and I'm not being snarky, but what am I supposed to be satisfied with ?

This club is jokes from day one. End to end futility, as far as the eye can see.

Satisfied with playoffs. That's what was promised.

trane
09-09-2014, 01:52 PM
^That's the point. It is not about hope, it is about demand, playoffs were promised, the team has the players. It has to be done.

jabbronies
09-09-2014, 02:07 PM
They have to make the playoffs. There is no try.

Nothing good comes from them missing the playoffs.

pdubs
09-09-2014, 02:17 PM
compared to the West, sure. but it feels like every team in the East is gaining form (except SKC for some reason) except us. even Montreal has been putting in more of a fight lately

if we don't get at least a point in Chicago and a win vs Chivas USA at home, we're toast

agreed. Tho New England was on that terrible run of form for a while and then went on that streak. We need to rack up the W's tho.

TOBOR !
09-09-2014, 02:21 PM
Satisfied with playoffs. That's what was promised.

Well, no then. I wouldn't be satisfied with the playoffs. Simply because if TFC gets there, it'll be in spite of everything they've done this year - and not because of it.

And what does playoffs this year even mean ? There are no guarantees ahead.

What I want is consistency and stability. Gimme some of that so I can identify with this club, and then move forward.

jloome
09-09-2014, 02:45 PM
I haven't given up on the post-season, or this roster. It will be tough and my realist side says the odds aren't great.

But I believe this roster is playoff-capable; there are enough games left and Vanney could rally them by making a relatively few small tactical changes. So the possibility is there.

My cynical side notes that there are things going on behind the scenes, quite evidently, that we aren't privy to, and these things are demoralizing the team. Maybe it's interactions between rich players and poor, or Canadians and Americans, or veterans and veterans, or maybe just players and management.

But we're not going to get the whole story, as usual.

I think they have the potential to do it. We have some really good players. They just need to think, focus, be hungry again.

TFC Tifoso
09-09-2014, 02:48 PM
They have to make the playoffs. There is no try.

Nothing good comes from them missing the playoffs.

I disagree......something good does come from it.......namely, free Raptors tickets with renewals g:D.....

In all seriousness, imo I would be satisfied with playoffs, FOR THIS YEAR......in the full scope of things, this team has never been there, so making the playoffs this year is notable......imo, Defoe has played his last game for TFC and is gone in January, so it is all about how he is replaced, which will form the next path this team goes on.......that is if he's replaced at all.....maybe the way to go for next season is with Gilberto leading the forwards and using Defoe's money to finally bring in a proper AM......add in a few MLS vet types to shore up the back line first, then other positions......

jloome
09-09-2014, 02:50 PM
I'll also add that there's a lesson to be learned from fucking with what's working; when we were winning earlier in the season, we got rid of guys whose "Personalities" didn't fit the room Nelsen wanted: Rey, and Nakajima-Farran were both quirky characters and had defensive liabilities a mile wide. But we were producing offensively and defensively at that point; we had balance between our players' characters and their production. And we threw that away in favor of getting allegedly better players who really haven't contributed much.

mowe
09-09-2014, 02:56 PM
If we lose against Chicago the margin for error to make the playoffs becomes extremely slim. If it comes to that we'll have also lost three straight under the new coach so it's unlikely the team will be able to turn it around at that point. That's when I give up hope and start looking to next year.

A win, on the other hand, puts us right in the middle of the playoff race.

ensco
09-09-2014, 03:00 PM
If they paste Chivas 3-0 on Sunday, does anyone doubt that this thread would immediately go to 90% "no"?

Super
09-09-2014, 03:04 PM
We're still in the race, but the team will have to SERIOUSLY step up in Chicago, and also in the following games as well, otherwise we'll be consulting our calculators once again to see how it's possible for us to make the play-offs. I honestly can't even imagine us not making the play-offs. It would be a big disaster. Why would anyone in their right mind trust this club again after this season? Nah, I'm going to stick with my hope that we'll turn the tide this Saturday and find a way to make it into the play-offs. Honestly, I don't even CARE at this point what happens after we make the play-offs. Just do it! Gotta get that monkey off of our backs.

Canary10
09-09-2014, 03:10 PM
Getting a couple of starters back would make a massive difference. Is Morrow close? Caldwell sounded pretty close. Those two would add a lot this weekend.

jloome
09-09-2014, 03:22 PM
If they paste Chivas 3-0 on Sunday, does anyone doubt that this thread would immediately go to 90% "no"?

We do have that going for us. They're the two most vulnerable teams. Two straight wins might turn things around a bit. Mix in a week or two for Vanney to get them focused and moving off the ball again and maybe things pick up.

Man, my one fear is that Defoe blew up in the dressing room or something and precipitated all of this. I know your perspective is that Lieweke went first but it actually makes as much sense the other way. His entire sales package here goes down the drain if Defoe walks.

PLus, who knows how demoralizing any kind of blow up might have been to the other players? It's one thing to have a buttmunch like Darren Mattocks dress down his teammates; it's another when it's a player with the talent to back it up.

Just kind of fits the whole thing. If so, I wouldn't give us a snowflakes chance in hell.

But if it really was just that Nelsen had lost the room and was feuding internally with Bez, maybe Vanney had a shot. I like what he's said so far; he's talked straight up, tactically, honestly. A nice change. In the past, you always got the sense the manager was either a) a weasel or b) being directed by weasels.

Abou Sky
09-09-2014, 03:37 PM
But how fun would it be to have our last 2 games be the deciding factor and we make it?

Come on boys, chin up and let's kill it!

portu
09-09-2014, 05:45 PM
It'll take being more than 3 points out of a playoff spot for me to give up on playoffs

Pookie
09-09-2014, 09:41 PM
Perhaps a better question is whether we have belief that TFC can do anything in the playoffs if they happen to stumble in

Getting in 4/5 would result in a one game playoff. Success means home and home. I know "anything can happen" but what are the odds that anything good would happen?

ensco
09-09-2014, 09:54 PM
I will never forget that in 2009, going into the final weekend, RSL had a 3% chance of making the playoffs, and went on to win the MLS Cup.

It's a weird league with a lot of parity. Nobody knows nothing.

MartinUtd
09-09-2014, 10:48 PM
Going in with low expectations, voted no.

Sure I want them to make it, but there's no sense getting hopes up at TFC.

MightyDM
09-09-2014, 11:00 PM
After year after year of futility not making it is not acceptable. There will be nothing good about it. This team knows how to lose, it needs to learn how to win. Now is the time to do it. It has a good squad and for it to make the play offs it just needs to win half its game. They need to do it.

That is my feeling exactly. pre injuries, under Nelsen, they showed real potential.

MightyDM
09-09-2014, 11:05 PM
Not based on recent performances.

My mind may change after the game this Saturday. We will see how this team responds to the changes once they have had a full week under the staff, time to plan for their opponent, and had some time to recover between games.

The team is a shambles right now. We look as bad as we ever have.

sadly true

MightyDM
09-09-2014, 11:07 PM
I haven't given up on the post-season, or this roster. It will be tough and my realist side says the odds aren't great.

But I believe this roster is playoff-capable; there are enough games left and Vanney could rally them by making a relatively few small tactical changes. So the possibility is there.

My cynical side notes that there are things going on behind the scenes, quite evidently, that we aren't privy to, and these things are demoralizing the team. Maybe it's interactions between rich players and poor, or Canadians and Americans, or veterans and veterans, or maybe just players and management.

But we're not going to get the whole story, as usual.

I think they have the potential to do it. We have some really good players. They just need to think, focus, be hungry again.

Yes.

MightyDM
09-09-2014, 11:13 PM
I'll also add that there's a lesson to be learned from fucking with what's working; when we were winning earlier in the season, we got rid of guys whose "Personalities" didn't fit the room Nelsen wanted: Rey, and Nakajima-Farran were both quirky characters and had defensive liabilities a mile wide. But we were producing offensively and defensively at that point; we had balance between our players' characters and their production. And we threw that away in favor of getting allegedly better players who really haven't contributed much.

Don't agree here though. Warner filled a real need, particularly over the world cup break. It is weird that the team has deteriorated since then, and he and Bradley are not a fit, but when Bradley was away he was excellent. Also, I NMHO Oduro is heads and shoulders over Rey. Everything stopped with Rey.

Oddly, given the hoofball criticisms of Nelsen, I think our problems began when he tried to play too offensively - for example putting Oso on the wing where Jackson had been a lock, defensively. Add that to the defensive injuries and it is when we started shipping goals.

Cashcleaner
09-10-2014, 01:10 AM
They just gotta make the playoffs for me this year. That's it. I don't care if we squeak in by a single point - crossing that line is all that matters for me right now. Obviously I'd love us to advance past the first round, but I gotta be realistic.

tfcleeds
09-10-2014, 07:20 AM
I'm of the opinion that our season is slowly swirling down the toilet - but you gotta have hope right? Making the playoffs, even if we're one and done, would be a welcome change, no matter how short-lived it might be, in our dreary existence as a club to this point. And it would fulfill a promise at least.

Wince
09-10-2014, 08:14 AM
Stick a fork in us. We're Done. I want to be proven wring but I voted Yes. Looking forward to 2015 and the expected changes to DP rules and salary cap. Then we'll be the team we dreamed of being, because we will outspend everyone else.

On a positive note, I snagged a TFC ball cap in the discount bin at Shopper's Drug Mart for the low, low price of $3.25! Season saved!

Alonso
09-10-2014, 08:43 AM
s'funny.

A couple of years back I was taking calls from my ticket rep and exchanging emails w/ Tom Anselmi. I told them I was pissed off at what they were doing at the club and i wouldn't be renewing. I was of the mind that Anselmi, Mariner and Cochrane had to go.

Then they replaced 2/3 with Payne and Nelsen, with Anselmi getting the boot shortly thereafter. The phone rang again, but I still didn't want any of it.

In no time at all Lieweke comes in, gets rid of Payne, Brings in Bez, Defoe, Bradley, et al and announces he's fucking off. Then Bez fires Nelsen and Defoe looks for all like he's leaving.

All of this in I think about two seasons.

I understand the spirit of the question, and I'm not being snarky, but what am I supposed to be satisfied with ?

This club is jokes from day one. End to end futility, as far as the eye can see.


It's pretty embarrassing, not much to be proud of with the continuing circus which I had really thought was behind us.

Sweeper
09-10-2014, 09:06 AM
I see no evidence to indicate we will make the playoffs this year. The fact that teams walk all over us at home is a big reason. We had flashes of decent soccer this season, but not a playoff team in my opinion. Never really got the first team to gel, partly due to world cup and injuries.

Detroit_TFC
09-10-2014, 09:38 AM
I agree the Chicago game is pivotal but how many times has TFC won in Chicago?

Stress
09-10-2014, 10:58 AM
I agree the Chicago game is pivotal but how many times has TFC won in Chicago?

Based on what I see on Soccerway.com, we've lost 4 times, tied 4 times, and won 0.

Alonso
09-10-2014, 11:45 AM
Based on what I see on Soccerway.com, we've lost 4 times, tied 4 times, and won 0.


Looks like we are due for a win then.... g:D

Detroit_TFC
09-10-2014, 11:58 AM
Looks like we are due for a win then.... g:D

One would think so.

Given all the CF draws this season, I think either side would be surprised by a win.

TOBOR !
09-10-2014, 01:54 PM
Based on what I see on Soccerway.com, we've lost 4 times, tied 4 times, and won 0.

No doubt those results were under 7 different managers with 7 completely different squads.

I don't think you can read anything into it, other than expect status quo to prevail.

What's that the French always say ? plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose ?

Too f'n right.

Cashcleaner
09-10-2014, 07:46 PM
Stick a fork in us. We're Done. I want to be proven wring but I voted Yes. Looking forward to 2015 and the expected changes to DP rules and salary cap. Then we'll be the team we dreamed of being, because we will outspend everyone else.

On a positive note, I snagged a TFC ball cap in the discount bin at Shopper's Drug Mart for the low, low price of $3.25! Season saved!

Seriously? Sorry to go off-topic, but I've been looking for a cheap TFC cap all season that won't break the bank. I refuse to pay over 20 bucks for a hat. All I have at the moment is a straight-red cap I picked up at the dollar store for like 2 bucks. It's okay, but would like something with a logo on it.

tiberius
09-10-2014, 10:08 PM
I will never forget that in 2009, going into the final weekend, RSL had a 3% chance of making the playoffs, and went on to win the MLS Cup.

It's a weird league with a lot of parity. Nobody knows nothing.


Agreed... "any given Saturday" so to speak. It is all up to the players...

<RANT>
From here on in, it has got sweet eff all to do with Luck, Vanney, Bez, Liewicker or the fans and supporters or whether Defoe ever comes back. It ALL has to do with ALL of the boys in the locker room and if they give a shit. To a man, they ALL have got to give a shit AND PROVE IT or the season is down the toilet. They have to not only give a shit THEY HAVE TO EFFING WELL SHOW UP. Not a few of them - ALL OF THEM. I have have seen sweet eff all to suggest that these guys COLLECTIVELY give a shit for the team or each other. Bloom, Dero, Bradley, Osorio, Caldwell maybe Gilberto they got heart, balls and can play on a winning team. But these few guys cannot carry the rest of their team on their back. I have seen so much crap, lack of attentiveness, thoughtlessness, sloppiness - a "who gives a damn" from many of the rest that I just don't think they give a fuck (as a team) to get to the playoffs, without even thinking that they might do anything in the playoffs, once they get there.

Defoe has mailed a few in and then gone MIA, Bendik - continue to pay attention and sweet jesus continue to improve your goddamn distribution. Defence and mid - next back pass should send you to Wilmington. Dominic - Sweet Jesus, Mary and Joseph you are fine to watch but you need to make a nice cross into the box, to a teammate, or our season is lost. Henry - head some more into their net, mark your goddamn player and the next crap red card or PK, you are fired!!! I don't give a goddamn if you are young, have potential, are a princess or are a Canuck - YOU ARE FIRED!! I may be slightly unfair to a few of the others, but the point is YOU HAVE TO PLAY AS A FOCUSED, REAL TEAM AND WANT TO WIN. I have seen very little of this all year - even when Defoe has saved the team's butt with a few game winners. The most balls I have seen all season is when Gilberto took the goddamn football, told "golden boy" Defoe to fuck off and then put the ball in the goddamn net. That may not have been teamwork - but he goddamn wants to contribute to the team and WIN. You guys can make tons of mistakes - that's OK - just play and care as a team. One guy on the field who isn't there or doesn't care or doesn't perform... you are all done. Done like a dinner, as Tiger used to say...

If you guys get a playoff game at BMO - then "mission accomplished" and you obviously must have played as a team. Anything less - you guys mailed it in and you are just another bunch of losers on yet another losing TFC team, who just could not get your shit together as a team. You will be nothing, you will be forgotten. Don't blame anyone else - just look in the mirror, and around the locker room. This is not Nelson's fault - nobody is buying it... there is way too much talent and experience in that locker room...

As far as I am concerned, this rant should be printed out (on 24" X 36" paper) and POSTED in the GODDAMN Toronto FC LOCKER ROOM!

</RANT>

I, unfortunately have not given up complete hope... I am such a goddamn sucker - I have to see them actually lose this opportunity, before I can believe it. There is so much talent from every last guy in that locker room that I am just astounded that they can't suck it up, stand as a team and deliver. It is up to the players - all of them. No. One. Else. Let's see what you got boyos!


... I apologize in advance for any hyperbole that might be in this post - for those who give a shit about hyperbole ... I know most fans and supporters could give a rat's ass about hyperbole...

KGH
09-11-2014, 08:25 AM
I voted yes. The last few games the team on the field demonstrated that they're not a playoff caliber team. Maybe they'll turn it around but I doubt it.

On the bright side we currently sit with picks 2, 7, and 8 in the upcoming draft. The downside is that very little talent now comes from the draft. That being said if Cyle Larin signs a GA he might be the kid to grab...if Montreal doesn't grab him first.

Canary10
09-11-2014, 09:12 AM
Certainly doesn't help that New York got a last minute win last night. Looking bleaker and bleaker.

Super
09-11-2014, 09:29 AM
I voted yes. The last few games the team on the field demonstrated that they're not a playoff caliber team. Maybe they'll turn it around but I doubt it.

On the bright side we currently sit with picks 2, 7, and 8 in the upcoming draft. The downside is that very little talent now comes from the draft. That being said if Cyle Larin signs a GA he might be the kid to grab...if Montreal doesn't grab him first.

There's still a chance we might make it, but I think you are right that this is not a playoff caliber team - just based on performance in the last 3 games alone. A lot will be riding on Saturday. If we don't show up for that one, then my belief will be gone. We just went through 3 extremely important games, and the team looked uninterested. No fight. No personality or creativity. Just mailed it in. Most of the team looked like they're already thinking about their next club. I don't understand why players don't want to live here, but I guess they don't.

It's a shame, really. But let's see on Saturday if we have a team, or if it's just business as usual.

Areathrasher
09-11-2014, 09:53 AM
I voted yes. The last few games the team on the field demonstrated that they're not a playoff caliber team. Maybe they'll turn it around but I doubt it.

On the bright side we currently sit with picks 2, 7, and 8 in the upcoming draft. The downside is that very little talent now comes from the draft. That being said if Cyle Larin signs a GA he might be the kid to grab...if Montreal doesn't grab him first.


Isn't it 4,9 and 10? NYCFC and Orlando have picks 1 & 2, I thought?

Ossington Mental Youth
09-11-2014, 10:24 AM
Isn't it 4,9 and 10? NYCFC and Orlando have picks 1 & 2, I thought?

correct

KGH
09-11-2014, 10:38 AM
Isn't it 4,9 and 10? NYCFC and Orlando have picks 1 & 2, I thought?

Oh crap. Totally forgot about those

Ben - D.O.W.
09-11-2014, 12:39 PM
Also with the US camp coming up against Ecuador and Honduras we could be missing Bradley for Houston and New York (Oct 8 and 11) if he gets called up. Definitely not what we need for the run in.

Doug McIntyre ‏@DougMacESPN (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/DougMacESPN)8m (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/DougMacESPN/status/510115363581743105)
Klinsmann wants "strongest squad possible” next month but bet on Toronto FC, with games Oct. 8+11, begging hard to keep Bradley. #usmnt (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/hashtag/usmnt?src=hash)

Ultra & Proud
09-11-2014, 01:26 PM
Isn't it 4,9 and 10? NYCFC and Orlando have picks 1 & 2, I thought?
On the plus side maybe we can package all them up for a pile of allocation that we can let sit & never use and also grab some late round picks that we can release during pre-season.

ensco
09-11-2014, 06:26 PM
Just saw Leiweke's quotes.

I change my vote. It's over.

David_Oliveira
09-11-2014, 06:37 PM
I decided to take some time to way in on this. my opinion changed alot in that time but I came to the consensus of no. As long as we have a mathematical chance, I won't give up hope. Anything can happen in the MLS, especially if you play in the Eastern Conference.

jloome
09-11-2014, 08:39 PM
Just saw Leiweke's quotes.

I change my vote. It's over.

If I'm Bradley, I'm doing my best "right lads: fuck the lot of them, we win for us" speech at the next team meeting.

I still think we have the personnel. I like what I hear from Vanney so far. It's still in the realm.

ensco
09-11-2014, 08:52 PM
If I'm Bradley, I'm doing my best "right lads: fuck the lot of them, we win for us" speech at the next team meeting.

I still think we have the personnel. I like what I hear from Vanney so far. It's still in the realm.

If I'm Bradley, I am thinking "what the eff have i done with my life?" and I am on my third bottle of vodka by now, and it's not even 9pm in Chicago.

tiberius
09-11-2014, 09:48 PM
If I'm Bradley, I'm doing my best "right lads: fuck the lot of them, we win for us" speech at the next team meeting.

I still think we have the personnel. I like what I hear from Vanney so far. It's still in the realm.

It is possible... but it is all up to a few leaders in the room to get the rest of them to play... Given the TL stuff of today, I have to agree with ensco,,, this team is done. There is no miracle on ice for these boys. I think we are going to watch an implosion. At this point, who really cares? A few guys in the locker room - sure, but they know they can't turn around a bunch of loser mentality sad sacks... Anyone else? Perhaps Vanney - but realistically, what does he really think? He probably knew he was a 10 game coach, before he agreed to give it a go...

David_Oliveira
09-12-2014, 06:51 AM
Must have missed something important. What dod TL say?

Ben - D.O.W.
09-12-2014, 08:30 AM
Just saw Leiweke's quotes.

I change my vote. It's over.

Any chance you could expand on the TL quotes? I saw he said that he'd be shocked if Defoe was back but that's about it.

ryan
09-12-2014, 09:01 AM
It's all in the Nelson Out, Defoe Posssibly to follow thread (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?36520-Nelsen-Out-Defoe-Possibly-to-Follow/page30)

jimiv
09-12-2014, 06:11 PM
We agree with Bradley -

"We’re not even close to giving up" . . .



I think the "we" he was referring to was DeRo, Bendik and himself. The other 8 on the pitch last week sure looked like they did.

Alonso
09-12-2014, 07:22 PM
8 games left, still in the mix but a long losing streak. How do you feel?


Trying very hard to stay positive.

Just need the team to give me some hope with their play.

They're in a good position still, but were at the point were every game is so much more precious than before.

Qman
09-12-2014, 08:21 PM
This season has been terrible. i dont think i will renew my season tickets .. i can watch the games on TV in protest.

There is no STABILITY. No plan. No organization.

Look at vancouver, they are building a CLUB and have a club level strategy:
1. latin american scouting system - Manager is ex-Latin American scout; speaks spanish and portugese; played in EPL and MLS. Have a transfer target list for DP and below DP players, target latin american b/c far better value for $ than in europe transfer market.
2. Spent money on Residency/Academy from day one is already producing 1st team players. Heck, their academy team almost beat our 1st team.

ag futbol
09-12-2014, 08:38 PM
1. latin american scouting system - Manager is ex-Latin American scout; speaks spanish and portugese; played in EPL and MLS. Have a transfer target list for DP and below DP players, target latin american b/c far better value for $ than in europe transfer market.
This is something the team should address. At a minimum: have a spanish speaker on the coaching staff.

inheavensince07
09-13-2014, 10:09 AM
This season has been terrible. i dont think i will renew my season tickets .. i can watch the games on TV in protest.

There is no STABILITY. No plan. No organization.

Look at vancouver, they are building a CLUB and have a club level strategy:
1. latin american scouting system - Manager is ex-Latin American scout; speaks spanish and portugese; played in EPL and MLS. Have a transfer target list for DP and below DP players, target latin american b/c far better value for $ than in europe transfer market.
2. Spent money on Residency/Academy from day one is already producing 1st team players. Heck, their academy team almost beat our 1st team.


Great decision.. You can actually still support team and players from home .. Supporting MLSE pockets is the wrong message .. Leaf Nation is the example of what NOT to do .. Qman at least you have a plan

notthesun
09-13-2014, 01:18 PM
Ask me again after tonight's game.

inheavensince07
09-13-2014, 02:27 PM
Ask me again after tonight's game.


I have given up...

Point taken Jack the President .. Fair enough !! we all have opinions don't we ?

Jack
09-13-2014, 02:52 PM
I have given up...

Point taken Jack the President .. Fair enough !! we all have opinions don't we ?

:confused:

inheavensince07
09-13-2014, 03:21 PM
:confused:

Jack I have a tonne of respect for you even tho I don't know you .. Your posts and responses are well thought out and cover off all important points that you need to make .. There is a reason why you are the President I am guessing , you process things and then respond ..

I still hold the opinion that the RPB are the only ones with any really power to change things there .. I truly believe in many moving mountains , and I believe that if something drastic was done in the long terms the owners may have to rethink things or sell the team ..

I am sorry if I have hurt feelings over the internet in the forum I am not attacking anyone personally ..

Peace and Love

Jack
09-13-2014, 04:04 PM
Jack I have a tonne of respect for you even tho I don't know you .. Your posts and responses are well thought out and cover off all important points that you need to make .. There is a reason why you are the President I am guessing , you process things and then respond ..

I still hold the opinion that the RPB are the only ones with any really power to change things there .. I truly believe in many moving mountains , and I believe that if something drastic was done in the long terms the owners may have to rethink things or sell the team ..

I am sorry if I have hurt feelings over the internet in the forum I am not attacking anyone personally ..

Peace and Love
I appreciate the vote of confidence and I agree that collective effort can make a difference, but you are mistaken on one point. I'm not the president any longer and haven't been for several years. That honour/role/cross to bear now lies with Phil, although I do, of course, continue to offer my input and advice to RPB leadership, even when they don't necessarily want to hear it g:D

I also understand that you're passionate about TFC and feel strongly that protest or no-shows are the way to go, but remember that there are many who don't feel that way and, no matter how you may rail against them, you won't get them to do it. I've learned a great deal about that and seen the results of going down the road of angry protest. It can often be a lonely road, although it has had moments of effectiveness in the past. There is also a great deal that goes on behind the scenes that doesn't, and often cannot, get made public. But rest assured, supporters groups are not taking this situation lightly and are in constant and not-always-friendly (but usually respectful) communication with the TFC brass.

inheavensince07
09-13-2014, 04:40 PM
I appreciate the vote of confidence and I agree that collective effort can make a difference, but you are mistaken on one point. I'm not the president any longer and haven't been for several years. That honour/role/cross to bear now lies with Phil, although I do, of course, continue to offer my input and advice to RPB leadership, even when they don't necessarily want to hear it g:D

I also understand that you're passionate about TFC and feel strongly that protest or no-shows are the way to go, but remember that there are many who don't feel that way and, no matter how you may rail against them, you won't get them to do it. I've learned a great deal about that and seen the results of going down the road of angry protest. It can often be a lonely road, although it has had moments of effectiveness in the past. There is also a great deal that goes on behind the scenes that doesn't, and often cannot, get made public. But rest assured, supporters groups are not taking this situation lightly and are in constant and not-always-friendly (but usually respectful) communication with the TFC brass.

I cannot and will not argue with you ..

Respectfully put and I can see your perspective as a group..

Keep up the great work .. And congrats to someone named Phil .. booom he's the prez

TFC Cityboy
09-13-2014, 06:58 PM
This club sucks the life and hope out of me every bloody season. My only surprise is that it took til August this year instead of June.
You forgot to include a "I don't really give a shit any more" voting button
:)

Lose tonight (and I'm sure we will) and we're toast.Momentum (upwards or down) is everything come the home straight of any season and TFC is heading one way only. Bank on us and Montreal to be propping up the east.

bigredone
09-13-2014, 07:49 PM
thats why I keep cheering...

LFC8
09-13-2014, 10:51 PM
Just when I'm about to write this team off....DeRo scores. If we don't win the next one though, I'd say it's over.

Morlesio14
09-13-2014, 11:13 PM
Nah we can win every damn game we play. I'm still confident

notthesun
09-13-2014, 11:32 PM
Here's to hoping this last injustice lights a fire under every player's ass.

PopePouri
09-14-2014, 12:10 AM
Chivas next week. We win that then we write our own destiny.

BBLaw
09-14-2014, 07:50 AM
I have 100% Ownership is a joke. Management is a joke. The coaching staff is a joke. Anyone who thinks otherwise is just kidding themselves. Then again, people are still shelling out their hard earned dollars for season tickets for this gong show so I'm not surprised at the idiocy that is having faith in this club. I see and hear the same "faith" from blind Leafs and Blue Jays supporters year after year after the team starts well and then inevitably goes into the toilet. It's Toronto sports, and the average Toronto sports fan, nothing new to see here.

OgtheDim
09-14-2014, 07:56 AM
I have 100% Ownership is a joke. Management is a joke. The coaching staff is a joke. Anyone who thinks otherwise is just kidding themselves. Then again, people are still shelling out their hard earned dollars for season tickets for this gong show so I'm not surprised at the idiocy that is having faith in this club. I see and hear the same "faith" from blind Leafs and Blue Jays supporters year after year after the team starts well and then inevitably goes into the toilet. It's Toronto sports, and the average Toronto sports fan, nothing new to see here.


Actually, you will hear the same "faith" across the world for supporters of teams, across all sports. The idea this is a "Toronto" thing is false.

E.g. There are Detroit Lions fans.

Sorry for you if you've given up. Enjoy what ever you move onto next.

But blaming the desire to see this not well put together team still win on being a Toronto team is lazy thinking.

Pookie
09-14-2014, 08:01 AM
I want them to win.

But if they don't, I want them to have a high draft pick. This finishing in 6th stuff (or 9th for Leaf fans) is hard to take. :(

Yohan
09-14-2014, 09:34 AM
I want them to win.

But if they don't, I want them to have a high draft pick. This finishing in 6th stuff (or 9th for Leaf fans) is hard to take. :(
Chivas USA pick will be 3-5 overall pick.

jimiv
09-14-2014, 09:54 AM
Chivas USA pick will be 3-5 overall pick.

If Chivas take a year off, and that's the new rumour... what happens to their traded draft picks?

Jack
09-14-2014, 10:07 AM
I have 100% Ownership is a joke. Management is a joke. The coaching staff is a joke. Anyone who thinks otherwise is just kidding themselves. Then again, people are still shelling out their hard earned dollars for season tickets for this gong show so I'm not surprised at the idiocy that is having faith in this club. I see and hear the same "faith" from blind Leafs and Blue Jays supporters year after year after the team starts well and then inevitably goes into the toilet. It's Toronto sports, and the average Toronto sports fan, nothing new to see here.


You are so superior to every other sports fan in Toronto that I'm just honoured you grace us with your enlightened wisdom on our humble forum.

Yohan
09-14-2014, 10:07 AM
If Chivas take a year off, and that's the new rumour... what happens to their traded draft picks?
that's a good question. Chivas USA still has a roster. I suspect it'll be something like what NYCFC is doing right now. Chivas USA will still do deals, and all their current players will get traded or go on loan for the season.

Pookie
09-14-2014, 10:12 AM
that's a good question. Chivas USA still has a roster. I suspect it'll be something like what NYCFC is doing right now. Chivas USA will still do deals, and all their current players will get traded or go on loan for the season.

Traded picks would likely be honored. I don't see them being allowed to pick using their own picks though. That would be unfair to the drafted players.

Current players would be available through the league I imagine through some sort of allocation order.

Yohan
09-14-2014, 10:14 AM
Traded picks would likely be honored. I don't see them being allowed to pick using their own picks though. That would be unfair to the drafted players.

Current players would be available through the league I imagine through some sort of allocation order.
it's not a dispersal draft. Chivas USA will come back for 2016 season in one for or another

MartinUtd
09-14-2014, 02:38 PM
I voted no, but my actions speak otherwise and I just realized this now.

I missed the game last night and when faced with the option of watching the replay on MLS live this morning or just watching the game in six, I watched the game in six. It's a pretty lazy day for me today so it's not like I didn't have the 90 minutes to spare either. I am now worried that apathy has taken full control... but hey at least they looked like they had fight at the end. That's something I can cling to, right?

fiji_blue
09-15-2014, 07:32 AM
I have given up on MLSE. I really thought they were laying the foundation for a worldclass FOOTBALL/SOCCER organization.
Our love for football has been taken advantage of time to cut the ties.

Oldtimer
09-15-2014, 08:42 AM
I gave up on this season several games ago. Let's hope that Bob Bradley gets hired as coach/GM. We need an intelligently built and coached team, not just reckless spending.

trane
09-15-2014, 08:55 AM
We are to close to a play off spot for me to give up, and even on Saturday we should have won, but for a reffing call.

I have many issues with the team and how it performs, but the post season is still a must, and an some wins in a row will get us there.

kwhisperer
09-15-2014, 10:06 AM
I voted 'no' because, having season's tickets, I still go to the BMO games, watch 'em when they're away and hope they make the playoffs.

But having hope in no way suggests I like what I see - a Pres/CEO enamored of glitz and his own words, which he's used to lessen the likelihood his star DP will even suit up in our playoff bid ("get the hell out of the way...even though we didn't sell you because we have a playoff drive on") and to diss every player who isn't Michael Bradley ... a GM with no experience managing .... the wrong coach for rebuilding with star DPs, compounded by keeping him in second year and then compounded again by firing him at the wrong time ... a new, relatively inexperienced coach in a no-win situation (perhaps literally) ... a team that was more than comfortably playoff-bound with several games in hand, only to start sinking like a stone ... a talisman leader-type player who may not get to play the next game because of his words (knock the call but, for God's sake, don't call 'em corrupt) ... in other words, no reason to think the culture has been changed or we're in for anything but "we screwed up, you deserve better and we'll make the playoffs next year."

After holding tickets every year, playoffs are an absolute condition for subscribing again next season and I am heartened by the last five minutes of last game. I live in hope....

nascarguy
09-15-2014, 10:22 AM
The Canadian Championship title is enough to keep me cheering. Although this is an easier accomplishment, playing hard for this may result in a sneaky play-off entry. So, still seein' red...
so we beat 2 team to be called Canadian Champion what a joke

nascarguy
09-15-2014, 10:25 AM
I gave up on this season several games ago. Let's hope that Bob Bradley gets hired as coach/GM. We need an intelligently built and coached team, not just reckless spending.who is he

Yohan
09-15-2014, 10:28 AM
who is he
you don't know who Bob Bradley is?

basically another Bruce Arena, though that's a terrible comparison
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Bradley

kwhisperer
09-15-2014, 10:29 AM
so we beat 2 team to be called Canadian Champion what a joke

You're right, except that we didn't even do that.

nascarguy
09-15-2014, 10:47 AM
it's not over yet there is 7 more game left and we have 34 and in 7th place

nascarguy
09-15-2014, 10:52 AM
You're right, except that we didn't even do that.
we did do that 4 times in a row

kwhisperer
09-15-2014, 10:56 AM
we did do that 4 times in a row

Yes, in the not-even-as-good old days.

nascarguy
09-15-2014, 11:06 AM
But we didn't win the Canadian Championship this year?yeah who care about it when there is only 5 teams and we only had to play 2 team and we lost by one point . Canadian cup will mean more when there are 9 teams

QBall
09-15-2014, 12:01 PM
I think we're not in too bad a spot right now. Three points behind 6th place Philly and 5th place Crew. Chivas should be an easy win. Philly is playing Houston who hasn't been playing too badly lately. Crew is playing NE. Even New Jersey is playing Seattle. I can see this weekend working out really well for the Reds as I don't see the Crew beating NE or NJ beating Seattle.

Canary10
09-15-2014, 12:44 PM
Seven games to go. We likely need a minimum of 4 wins out the 7, and another result or two to make it. Tough ask at this point. But until it's mathematically impossible.....

Carts
09-15-2014, 12:56 PM
I think we're not in too bad a spot right now. Three points behind 6th place Philly and 5th place Crew. Chivas should be an easy win. Philly is playing Houston who hasn't been playing too badly lately. Crew is playing NE. Even New Jersey is playing Seattle. I can see this weekend working out really well for the Reds as I don't see the Crew beating NE or NJ beating Seattle.

There is no such thing as an easy win with TFC... g:D

But that being said - you're right, we do still have the chance to do it, and the schedule (other teams's schedules) to make it happen...

ensco
09-21-2014, 09:36 PM
If they paste Chivas 3-0 on Sunday, does anyone doubt that this thread would immediately go to 90% "no"?

Wish I had put a few dollars on this one!

Initial B
09-21-2014, 09:58 PM
Portland should be winnable as well since they'll be coming off a CCL match. But they're a lot deeper than Chivas and has a former TFC player whom I think will want to say "hello" by scoring some goals. If TFC can beat Portland, they have a chance in the playoffs. If not, TFC will probably not make it out of the play-in round, if at all.

ensco
09-27-2014, 09:32 PM
http://www.sportsclubstats.com/USA/TorontoFC.html

47 points (48 for sure) looks like the magic number.

Given that we should beat Montreal, the Houston game is massive. Take 3 points there, we only need one point on the road from 3 tough games (LA, NY, NE)

notthesun
09-27-2014, 09:50 PM
God dammit, Montreal is good for nothing. Columbus with a 2-0 win, would have been a perfect weekend if they had lost.

OgtheDim
09-28-2014, 07:43 AM
I still think its not going to happen. Our defence is just too porous. The 2 games at home are doable but those 3 away games are up against decent attacking teams who are all fighting for something.

Still, we are in with a shout, which is better then most seasons. Rather be in this position then Montreal's.

Red CB Toronto
09-28-2014, 07:54 AM
I Believe ...

Fort York Redcoat
09-28-2014, 08:44 AM
God dammit, Montreal is good for nothing. Columbus with a 2-0 win, would have been a perfect weekend if they had lost.

Woah. It would've been nice but I'll take the favourite DC over Philly to move us up. We can't expect too much done for us, no? It's close but still a game coming up to prove how serious we are.

ensco
09-28-2014, 08:52 AM
One thing that helps is that the Crew play the Union twice and NYRB once.

Need to see some draws in those games.

Red CB Toronto
09-28-2014, 09:08 AM
One thing that helps is that the Crew play the Union twice and NYRB once.

Need to see some draws in those games.

It will definitely be an interesting stretch run for the Reds, looking forward to being at Red Bull Arena in October, this could be one heck of a ride.

Initial B
09-28-2014, 12:30 PM
It will definitely be an interesting stretch run for the Reds, looking forward to being at Red Bull Arena in October, this could be one heck of a ride.
I just hope they don't pull a 2009...

anto7
09-28-2014, 12:30 PM
Would be great if Galaxy could hammer the Red Bulls tonight. And if Omar Gonzalas gets a yellow that would be awesome too since he will miss the game against us.

ag futbol
09-28-2014, 12:41 PM
http://www.sportsclubstats.com/USA/TorontoFC.html

47 points (48 for sure) looks like the magic number.

Given that we should beat Montreal, the Houston game is massive. Take 3 points there, we only need one point on the road from 3 tough games (LA, NY, NE)
Looking at it that way it still seems do-able.

But seeing how we've played so far, there are still a lot of things to sort out and very little margin for error.

Yohan
09-28-2014, 12:56 PM
Looking at it that way it still seems do-able.

But seeing how we've played so far, there are still a lot of things to sort out and very little margin for error.

esp since sneaking in 5th place and losing means still no home playoff game.

Fort York Redcoat
09-28-2014, 04:57 PM
Would be great if Galaxy could hammer the Red Bulls tonight. And if Omar Gonzalas gets a yellow that would be awesome too since he will miss the game against us.

I'm hoping they both get hammered since we play LA next. But I see where you're going with it.

Dunkers
09-28-2014, 06:16 PM
This thread was started right after the second loss to PUFC, and I thought we were done, having just lost back to back to philly and got crushed by NER. Funny how 2.99 wins in a row can change the tide. The team has shown a lot of resilliance over those last 3 games. It would be nice to pick up some points in LA, but seems highly unlikely, hopefully we can at least keep some of the confidence, if not a point from the LA game. Anyone else notice SKC slidding down the standings....

Red CB Toronto
09-28-2014, 07:12 PM
Just settling in to hopefully see the Galaxy defeat RBNY and keeping them just a point ahead of the Reds, great to see TSN pick up this game.

OgtheDim
09-28-2014, 08:11 PM
Goal of the week from Keane. Good news is those two old geezers Keane and Donovan shredded the NYRB defence.

Bad news is we play LAG first.

jazzy
09-28-2014, 09:28 PM
Almost over 3-0 LA........Another doozy of a match coming up :)

Red CB Toronto
09-28-2014, 11:02 PM
Almost over 3-0 LA........Another doozy of a match coming up :)

Next weekend in LA will be a real challenge for the Reds. No way they can have a repeat of the mistakes made against Portland and expect to come out unscathed. Coach Vanney has the full week ahead to get them ready and make sure the back line is in order. Getting out of their with at least a point is key.

Oldtimer
09-29-2014, 08:55 AM
Imagine if TFC had the two points that were stolen by poor refereeing.

ManUtd4ever
09-29-2014, 08:59 AM
Imagine if TFC had the two points that were stolen by poor refereeing.

You just know that those two points will be a factor at the end of the season. Sigh.

FRANKIE65
09-29-2014, 09:06 AM
Next weekend in LA will be a real challenge for the Reds. No way they can have a repeat of the mistakes made against Portland and expect to come out unscathed. Coach Vanney has the full week ahead to get them ready and make sure the back line is in order. Getting out of their with at least a point is key.

A point would be brilliant. Basically, puts their fate into their own hands. Fortunately, though, a loss won't be the end of the world after securing the six points in these last two matches. Let's hope Vanney can put together some magic. Also, should Defoe be in the line up, time to play with AND FOR the team!! Team chemistry is a strange thing, let's hope the Reds continue to gel!

sidney
09-29-2014, 09:06 AM
Time for a NEW POLL Asking the Same Question!

Oldtimer
09-29-2014, 10:37 AM
Time for a NEW POLL Asking the Same Question!

If you ask too close to the end, then the poll doesn't mean as much.

anto7
09-30-2014, 06:03 PM
http://www.sportsclubstats.com/USA/TorontoFC.html

47 points (48 for sure) looks like the magic number.

Given that we should beat Montreal, the Houston game is massive. Take 3 points there, we only need one point on the road from 3 tough games (LA, NY, NE)
Dynamo midfield duo Garcia and Garrido to join Honduras squad next week for game against Mexico on Fri Oct 10th. Should mean they miss the game against us on the 8th

greatwhitenorf
10-01-2014, 12:17 AM
Post. Season.

Not familiar with that term. Do we have to mail something in?

Cashcleaner
10-01-2014, 01:09 AM
Is there going to be a viewing at Shoeless Joe's this Saturday for the match in LA? It's becoming crunch time for TFC and our post-season hopes. A road win against LA (16-5-9) would be a phenomenal result for us.

GuelphStorm2007
10-01-2014, 02:06 AM
I am semi optimistic about post season this year. But I still think TFC is a year away from really being a playoff contender I did say at the beginning of the year we will see major improvement and we have but we still need more depth on our roster. I often wonder if we were not robbed in that game against Chicago, and at home v Sporting K.C. where we will be.

GuelphStorm2007
10-01-2014, 02:09 AM
Is there going to be a viewing at Shoeless Joe's this Saturday for the match in LA? It's becoming crunch time for TFC and our post-season hopes. A road win against LA (16-5-9) would be a phenomenal result for us.

Despite TFC 's many problems through the years our record v L.A Galaxy is not all that bad. I believe we have beaten them twice and have 2 or 3 draws over at Home Depot.

Cashcleaner
10-01-2014, 04:03 AM
^ They're not invincible, that's true. But it's probably gonna be a bit of a battle for us in LA, though. The Galaxy currently has a ridiculous Goal Differential (+32) and haven't been beaten in 9 games. Gonna be tough, but I'm still looking forward to it.

JuliquE
10-01-2014, 07:30 AM
Post. Season.

Not familiar with that term. Do we have to mail something in?
We usually do mail it in, yeh.

Perhaps, all these years, we thought that's what we were supposed to do, in order to take part in the post-season -- all a big misunderstanding, then. Should be a cinch, now that's all cleared up.

Fort York Redcoat
10-01-2014, 07:30 AM
Post. Season.

Not familiar with that term. Do we have to mail something in?


We usually do mail it in, yeh.

http://33.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxuyq4hERJ1r3k1m8o1_500.png

Ruffian
10-01-2014, 09:06 AM
Despite TFC 's many problems through the years our record v L.A Galaxy is not all that bad. I believe we have beaten them twice and have 2 or 3 draws over at Home Depot.

We beat them 2-1 in the second leg in the 2011-12 CCL Quarter-Final in LA.

Hamilton_Red
10-03-2014, 12:13 AM
We beat them 2-1 in the second leg in the 2011-12 CCL Quarter-Final in LA.

TFC's franchise highest moment. Shit did it collapse from that moment on...

Oldtimer
10-08-2014, 09:40 PM
Unless you are very optimistic, you must have given up by now.

Supporting
10-08-2014, 09:56 PM
Unless you are very optimistic, you must have given up by now.

I'm optimistic, because where's the fun in thinking it's over?

ManUtd4ever
10-08-2014, 09:57 PM
Barring a miraculous turn of events, I'm afraid the fat lady has sung.

Supporting
10-08-2014, 10:04 PM
Barring a miraculous turn of events, I'm afraid the fat lady has sung.

http://www.reddit.com/r/MLS/comments/2iq0xb/eastern_conference_scenarios_for_a_playoff_berth/

jazzy
10-08-2014, 10:35 PM
Thank you Mr. Defoe , we're done...........so sad Gilberto isn't playing instead of bye bye Defoe......this must be a upstairs decision of massive proportions , or why else play a man who doesn't want to be here and won't be here next year , instead of a player that is nothing but all heart . ( This is on the premise of GIlberto not even being on the bench...) He must be hurt , I haven't heard . Or it is strange especially since he said Defoe would have to play his way back on the team . I agree > or how about off the damn team , NOW !........Defoe lovers spare me , I'll take Gilberto and the likes of him any time . We're MLS , not the premier league and never will be . Close knit teams win , before rag tag individuals . Sorry to be pissed but I said a while back we'd never win with him after his shallowness prevailed and I'm sick being right . The league needs fodder and as usual TFC fits the bill .

TOBOR !
10-08-2014, 10:39 PM
it's a bloody big joke.

Yohan
10-08-2014, 10:53 PM
can't wait to see what sort of excuses will come out if TFC misses the playoffs this time. will anyone take responsibility and fall on their swords? probably not. no one is held accountable at MLSE

flamehawk
10-08-2014, 10:54 PM
I read somewhere that Gilberto was training fine before the match... I really wouldn't be surprised if Defoe took offence to Gilberto's comment and asked that he be off the team .... If this really was the case, the bigger villain here is TFC management who bend over backwards for Defoe while dumping the heart and soul of this team into the bin.

Richard
10-08-2014, 11:37 PM
Its all speculation at the moment. The FO should be fired if Gilberto was truly sat because of those comments. No matter how good Defoe is, Gilberto was in good form(had an average last game to be fair), but over the course of they year was as effective as Defoe if not more with his work rate.

This is from John Molinaro's article today



In a bit of a surprise, forward Gilberto wasn’t named to Toronto’s game-day roster—this despite the Brazilian telling reporters on Tuesday he was fully fit after missing last weekend’s 3-0 loss in Los Angeles with a hamstring injury. Gilberto was out on the BMO Field pitch hours before kickoff on Wednesday undergoing a late fitness test, but he wasn’t cleared to play. Vanney expects the Brazilian to be available to play on Saturday in New York

sidney
10-09-2014, 12:47 AM
We can still do it baby!....3 games left....Let's Go TFC!!!!

khso11
10-09-2014, 01:25 AM
According to the reddit post, our best case scenario is that we'll end up SECOND!!!! The team have to aim for that (although the reds didn't show that today), if they aim for the last playoff spot, then we'll end up outside the playoffs, it's that simple. It's not too late to get their shit together, as cheesy as it might sound, they just have to move on and believe. There will be TFC fans in NY, I think it will be the game that can bring us back together. COYR!!!!

Red CB Toronto
10-09-2014, 01:54 AM
Currently Sitting on an overnight bus to NYC, I definitely still believe in the post season. Looking forward to a Saturday night where the Reds will get back on track. Come On You Reds !!!!

Fort York Redcoat
10-09-2014, 05:46 AM
I'm optimistic...about the Montreal match.

denime
10-09-2014, 06:18 AM
Thank you Mr. Defoe , we're done...........so sad Gilberto isn't playing instead of bye bye Defoe......this must be a upstairs decision of massive proportions , or why else play a man who doesn't want to be here and won't be here next year , instead of a player that is nothing but all heart . ( This is on the premise of GIlberto not even being on the bench...) He must be hurt , I haven't heard . Or it is strange especially since he said Defoe would have to play his way back on the team . I agree > or how about off the damn team , NOW !........Defoe lovers spare me , I'll take Gilberto and the likes of him any time . We're MLS , not the premier league and never will be . Close knit teams win , before rag tag individuals . Sorry to be pissed but I said a while back we'd never win with him after his shallowness prevailed and I'm sick being right . The league needs fodder and as usual TFC fits the bill .

I wouldn't be surprised if this was a call from higher end,after all our new coach is their puppet.

Our weakest link since 2007 was always a head coach,it is interesting that we had only 2 coaches with previous head coaching experience,Johnson and Preki,all other coaches TFC hired were at best assistant coaches, some of them academy coaches and in case on Nelsen,no coaching experience at all. Keeping Gilberto out for tonights game is another prove that our coach has no integrity and he bent over for sake of making TL and Defoe happy.

We need a good experienced MLS coach,get out and find one,pay the fine for taking him from another club,who cares,Seattle did with Ziggy,we can do it too. Enough with experiments,we can't afford that shit,clubs that went to playoffs and won MLS Cup(RSL, DC, NER) can afford new young coach and give him 2-3 years to turn around ,we can't, it's time to get good coach and get rid of Defoe,ASAP.

As far this season goes,as much I would like to see TFC going into playoffs,realistically we don't stand a chance,with performance like last night we will lose next 3 games easy,there was no fire from a get go,we had to go down 1-0 in order to get our players pushing forward.

billyfly
10-09-2014, 06:59 AM
Done

trane
10-09-2014, 07:05 AM
Denime, I agree with the choaching issue.

I do not think we are done. But unless they show some real heart in the next three games, what is the point?

jloome
10-09-2014, 09:32 AM
Denime, I agree with the choaching issue.

I do not think we are done. But unless they show some real heart in the next three games, what is the point?

It's also time to admit we're missing some major roster pieces still. Because of Caldwell's age we now need not one but two experienced central defenders, guys who can start.

We need an AM; Osorio is a good player by Canadian Nat standards but in MLS now he doesn't have the skill or explosiveness to be our full-time AM. He just doesn't compare with the guys doing the same job on other teams, and it shows.

We need at least one experienced winger to challenge Jackson, Oduro and Lovitz. They all try hard and it's typical at his level for all players to have deficiencies in some areas, but our guys just aren't consistent enough.

And we need a keeper who will at least push for the starting role, as Bendik -- though generally very good -- has let in some howlers this year.

Mostly, we need the right locker room chemistry. This year, I'm starting to think, went very badly in that regard.

zeelaw
10-09-2014, 09:39 AM
I'm optimistic...about the Montreal match.
So eerily similar last year's home game, the difference might be MTL actually made the playoffs last year :(

trane
10-09-2014, 09:50 AM
It's also time to admit we're missing some major roster pieces still. Because of Caldwell's age we now need not one but two experienced central defenders, guys who can start.

We need an AM; Osorio is a good player by Canadian Nat standards but in MLS now he doesn't have the skill or explosiveness to be our full-time AM. He just doesn't compare with the guys doing the same job on other teams, and it shows.

We need at least one experienced winger to challenge Jackson, Oduro and Lovitz. They all try hard and it's typical at his level for all players to have deficiencies in some areas, but our guys just aren't consistent enough.

And we need a keeper who will at least push for the starting role, as Bendik -- though generally very good -- has let in some howlers this year.

Mostly, we need the right locker room chemistry. This year, I'm starting to think, went very badly in that regard.

I agree. As much as I have liked what Defoe has brought, if Gilberto and him are not getting along, then perhaps it is time to switch Defoe with an AM. I have liked what I have seen at times from both Haggland and Henry but we need more from them.

I agree about Osorio, I like him, but he is just not enough. Maybe time to move Defoe and bring Laba back to play with Bradley. ( we would still need an AM-but with those too the AM that comes in could roam freely forward)

Jack
10-09-2014, 09:51 AM
The Gilberto comments weren't out of line, based on what I've read. I mean, Defoe is coming off a long layoff and would have to work himself back into the lineup. His rust was on full display last night, as he missed a handful of chances that he normally would bury. I am going to choose to believe that Gilberto has a micro-tear in his hamstring, as Vanney said, and they are being extra careful not to aggravate the issue with a player who we hope to keep around long term.

Otherwise, fuck...

Yohan
10-09-2014, 09:58 AM
It's also time to admit we're missing some major roster pieces still. Because of Caldwell's age we now need not one but two experienced central defenders, guys who can start.

We need an AM; Osorio is a good player by Canadian Nat standards but in MLS now he doesn't have the skill or explosiveness to be our full-time AM. He just doesn't compare with the guys doing the same job on other teams, and it shows.

We need at least one experienced winger to challenge Jackson, Oduro and Lovitz. They all try hard and it's typical at his level for all players to have deficiencies in some areas, but our guys just aren't consistent enough.

And we need a keeper who will at least push for the starting role, as Bendik -- though generally very good -- has let in some howlers this year.

Mostly, we need the right locker room chemistry. This year, I'm starting to think, went very badly in that regard.
if Osorio had Bekker's technical skills... bah. Oso has the footy IQ, but lacks the polish. he'll be a decent MLS CM, but he won't be an AM due to that lack of playmaking ability. oh well.

Canary10
10-09-2014, 09:59 AM
The Gilberto comments weren't out of line, based on what I've read. I mean, Defoe is coming off a long layoff and would have to work himself back into the lineup. His rust was on full display last night, as he missed a handful of chances that he normally would bury. I am going to choose to believe that Gilberto has a micro-tear in his hamstring, as Vanney said, and they are being extra careful not to aggravate the issue with a player who we hope to keep around long term.

Otherwise, fuck...

You get micro tears in a muscle when you workout. To think that kept him out of a game? I don't know....

trane
10-09-2014, 10:02 AM
if Osorio had Bekker's technical skills... bah. Oso has the footy IQ, but lacks the polish. he'll be a decent MLS CM, but he won't be an AM due to that lack of playmaking ability. oh well.

I prefer him as a CM, but he could be more physical to be a real two way player.

Jack
10-09-2014, 10:14 AM
You get micro tears in a muscle when you workout. To think that kept him out of a game? I don't know....
I have to think the terminology isn't the same when you talk about an injury versus regular workout micro-tears. A tear in a hamstring is not something to mess around with for a footballer, especially one who plays like Gilberto. Even if it's a small tear.

That said, it could be a very convenient excuse. At some point, I hope we have a team where the manager gets to decide who to play, not the CEO/President/GM/Operations Guy/Beer Seller.

Canary10
10-09-2014, 10:30 AM
I have to think the terminology isn't the same when you talk about an injury versus regular workout micro-tears. A tear in a hamstring is not something to mess around with for a footballer, especially one who plays like Gilberto. Even if it's a small tear.

That said, it could be a very convenient excuse. At some point, I hope we have a team where the manager gets to decide who to play, not the CEO/President/GM/Operations Guy/Beer Seller.

Maybe, but micro tear is the terminology used for the normal process of soreness you get in a muscle after hard activity. That's different than a tear tear. Anyway, sounds sketchy to me.

jloome
10-09-2014, 10:31 AM
I prefer him as a CM, but he could be more physical to be a real two way player.

I just think his skill set, while good for what it is, is quite limited in comparison to the level the league is moving to. For every one Osorio in Canada's camp, there are about a hundred who don't get a look in the U.S. camp and who don't start on MLS teams, guys who can beat one or two guys to hold onto the ball, but don't have the next gear to move into the space between defensive lines, pull defences out of shape and thread pinpoint passes over more than ten yards.

In MLS now, to be a key player, they need a complete package for their position. Not for other positions, or flexibility. But to start in their position. If you're a winger, you have to have speed, dribbling skills, decent crossing abilities. If you're an AM, you have to have acceleration, pinpoint passing control, a cannon for a long shot.

Consider that Andrew Driver is an across-the-board stronger technical player than any winger we have, and in fact is stronger than any midfielder we have other than Bradley. And he doesn't usually start in Houston. He's a bench player because he's behind a DP.

We made some major steps this year, but the roster was far from done, and is still far from done. Is Vanney the guy? He's doing a lot right, but he's had some tactical stumpers, too, like trying to use Oduro to add urgency to a game where the other team is bunkered in, and he can't get behind them with his speed. And his faith in Bekker is stupefying; maybe he's just giving him a chance to prove he has something before next season.

Yohan
10-09-2014, 10:34 AM
We made some major steps this year, but the roster was far from done, and is still far from done. Is Vanney the guy? He's doing a lot right, but he's had some tactical stumpers, too, like trying to use Oduro to add urgency to a game where the other team is bunkered in, and he can't get behind them with his speed. And his faith in Bekker is stupefying; maybe he's just giving him a chance to prove he has something before next season.
worst time to experiment with Bekker. though it is tempting to put as much technical players in midfield than just kick and chase wingers. Bekker spraying passes all over the pitch during practice must really mesmerized Vanney to Bekker's other faults

JuliquE
10-09-2014, 10:44 AM
It's also time to admit we're missing some major roster pieces still. Because of Caldwell's age we now need not one but two experienced central defenders, guys who can start.

We need an AM; Osorio is a good player by Canadian Nat standards but in MLS now he doesn't have the skill or explosiveness to be our full-time AM. He just doesn't compare with the guys doing the same job on other teams, and it shows.

We need at least one experienced winger to challenge Jackson, Oduro and Lovitz. They all try hard and it's typical at his level for all players to have deficiencies in some areas, but our guys just aren't consistent enough.

And we need a keeper who will at least push for the starting role, as Bendik -- though generally very good -- has let in some howlers this year.

Mostly, we need the right locker room chemistry. This year, I'm starting to think, went very badly in that regard.


I agree. As much as I have liked what Defoe has brought, if Gilberto and him are not getting along, then perhaps it is time to switch Defoe with an AM. I have liked what I have seen at times from both Haggland and Henry but we need more from them.

I agree about Osorio, I like him, but he is just not enough. Maybe time to move Defoe and bring Laba back to play with Bradley. ( we would still need an AM-but with those too the AM that comes in could roam freely forward)


if Osorio had Bekker's technical skills... bah. Oso has the footy IQ, but lacks the polish. he'll be a decent MLS CM, but he won't be an AM due to that lack of playmaking ability. oh well.
I just wonder how well Oso would perform in a 4-2-3-1 formation (central, in line of 3), with Bradley and Laba in the line of 2 DM's. There was a stat. of our results whenever Oso has started centrally, and it was surprisingly lop-sided, in our favour. That's why I think we can be a bit harsh on him, as I don't think we're making the most of his qualities.

For me, if we can get Laba back (FUCK!), this has GOT to be the way forward -- Bradley's already finding himself playing deep, no matter where he starts.. so, might as well start him there. Laba, Bradley and a central Oso, combined with the likes of Gilberto and others in support, is more than enough vision/creativity, for me; will also serve the CMNT well, for us to bring Oso along, and, imo, he's not quite as far off being a bona fide starter, as some might suggest.

TFC 2015 (hopefully):

------------------Bendik*-----------------

--Bloom*---Caldwell*---NewCB---Morrow--

-------Bradley--------------Laba----------

-----Moore-------Osorio-------Jackson----

-----------------Gilberto------------------

* denotes players good enough, if we improve in other areas (CB & Laba)

Jackson and Oduro will push each other, as I think I agree with their games being a bit similar.. although I give Jackson the edge, as I like him cutting in, when played on the left (don't think Oduro has that in his locker). The new CB would slot in for Caldwell, at times, given his age/injury risk, giving a chance to one of Henry or Hagglund; they will have more consistent minutes in 2016 to look forward to, as well as any appearances for Canada, in the case of Henry. The likes of Dike, DeRo and Wieds can keep Gilberto honest (though, it'd be nice to have a Kenny Cooper/Alan Gordon level talent to come off the bench).

This thinking would best facilitate us maintaining some semblance of stability, from year to year, seeing the least possible changes to the roster.. but, for me, still VERY dangerous looking.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 10:47 AM
What I would like to see in 2015:

------------------New GK-----------------

--Bloom---Caldwell/New CB---New CB---Morrow--

------------------Bradley------------------

---New Wide Mid----New AM-------Jackson----

--------Gilberto-------New FW-----------


Bench: Hagglund, Henry, Osorio, Bekker, Bendik, Hamilton.


-Fairly clear down the stretch that our center of defense is poor. Better with Caldwell but still not good enough.
-Bendik is a back up keeper at best. You can win with him if the team in front of him is good enough but you won't win because of him.
-AM is sorely missed and even though he's a hometown boy, Osorio isn't good enough either if we want to be a very good team.
-Need an upgrade out wide. No point in having Oduro and Jackson on the same squad. Pick one and ditch the other. I've seen more with Jackson even with the pre-requisite Jackson attitude problems than Oduro. Plus he can speak with Gilberto.
-Defoe will be gone so we need a forward that's better than Moore. I would be okay with Moore as a bench option but nothing more.

And Laba of course I would spot in there and switch to a diamond but I highly, highly doubt he will come back.

Red4ever
10-09-2014, 10:54 AM
I'm shocked at how many people rate Bloom. I thought he and Jackson were just terrible last night.

JuliquE
10-09-2014, 11:05 AM
What I would like to see in 2015:

------------------New GK-----------------

--Bloom---Caldwell/New CB---New CB---Morrow--

------------------Bradley------------------

---New Wide Mid----New AM-------Jackson----

--------Gilberto-------New FW-----------


Hm; interesting.

For me, Bendik is admittedly inconsistent, but just good enough, at this level.

I remember a time when everyone was incessantly crying out for CB's, until we ended up with something like 8. The one new, quality CB should be enough; managing Caldwell's minutes would be key, but then we have some decent options in Henry & Hagglund, even if they're not QUITE ready for the big time. Don't forget that we've one or two others that can slot into the role, in a pinch (Bradley, Morrow, etcetera).

I would love a new AM, but I worry about where that would leave Oso; I know that we should be thinking of the club's best interests, first.. but, it's hard to completely separate your affinity for the CMNT. I think, though, that it wouldn't be the end of the world if we picked up an EXCEPTIONAL AM, as the line of 3, in a 4-2(1)-3-1(2) formation, is known to interchange a fair bit.. so, Oso would be able to dabble in a central role, and from a bit more advanced a position as if he were the wide player, in a 4-4-2. Actually, upon reflection, I think we SHOULD replace Defoe with a DP (level) AM.

JuliquE
10-09-2014, 11:06 AM
I'm shocked at how many people rate Bloom. I thought he and Jackson were just terrible last night.
He had a stinker, to be sure.. but, he's shown that, with better organization, which I would expect in a quality, new CB, he could be JUST good enough (budget player).

Phil
10-09-2014, 11:18 AM
What I would like to see in 2015:

------------------New GK-----------------

--Bloom---Caldwell/New CB---New CB---Morrow--

------------------Bradley------------------

---New Wide Mid----New AM-------Jackson----

--------Gilberto-------New FW-----------


Bench: Hagglund, Henry, Osorio, Bekker, Bendik, Hamilton.


-Fairly clear down the stretch that our center of defense is poor. Better with Caldwell but still not good enough.
-Bendik is a back up keeper at best. You can win with him if the team in front of him is good enough but you won't win because of him.
-AM is sorely missed and even though he's a hometown boy, Osorio isn't good enough either if we want to be a very good team.
-Need an upgrade out wide. No point in having Oduro and Jackson on the same squad. Pick one and ditch the other. I've seen more with Jackson even with the pre-requisite Jackson attitude problems than Oduro. Plus he can speak with Gilberto.
-Defoe will be gone so we need a forward that's better than Moore. I would be okay with Moore as a bench option but nothing more.



I don't disagree. I would loan out or send down: Bekker, Hagglund and Henry just for developmental reasons. We should be looking at a new CB with expeirence to pair with Caldwell. Bloom hasn't been rating well with me (he did have a really good run of form but its fizzled). I would be looking to Crevalle to settle in there or shop for a new RB. For GK, Bendik has regressed this season. His command of the box is lacking and his distribution always has been poor - an upgrade is needed there.

Moving into mid, this injury pleaged season for Osorio has been terrible on him. We need some new blood there to teach and provide consistancy. Not sold on Jackson at all, his temper is too much without really matching it with the talent I hoped for. His distribution is virtually non existant and his big skill is in posession and control - first touch is pretty brutal and final touch too...

A DP attacking mid would be amazing. A target man for a striker would be good, I do think Moore tries at this but its clear we need an Alan Gordon type to pair with Gilberto and or Defoe / new striker.

If we could cash in on sending Bloom to Orlando and make some tweaks to positions while using development routes to strengthen some others....it could be good.

Lets remember the cap increases (barring a strike or disaster) and possibly the DP slot allotment. Might be something worth perserving and building on.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 11:29 AM
I'm not sold on Bloom either. After his injury he has been crap. I think he will go to Orlando for his wife and child but I penciled him in as he is cheap and is in a spot where cheapness matters. If Hagglund had more pace I would put him there too but he's slow.

Yohan
10-09-2014, 11:39 AM
I'm not sold on Bloom either. After his injury he has been crap. I think he will go to Orlando for his wife and child but I penciled him in as he is cheap and is in a spot where cheapness matters. If Hagglund had more pace I would put him there too but he's slow.
Hagglund is not slow. I believe he was one of top in athletic test during the Combine

Red4ever
10-09-2014, 11:43 AM
I kinda get the impression Bloom and Haglund are like the old adage:

Two guys run to first base in exactly the same time. One with lousy form, one with great form. Which one do you take?

I don't see Bloom getting better. Haglund on the other hand could be around for a long time.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 12:07 PM
Hagglund is not slow. I believe he was one of top in athletic test during the Combine
In that case they should send him to the track coach that Valanciunas got sent to in the off season. He doesn't beat defenders on his runs and clearly has trouble tracking back. If he did finish tops in the combine then it might be mechanics.

jloome
10-09-2014, 12:10 PM
In that case they should send him to the track coach that Valanciunas got sent to in the off season. He doesn't beat defenders on his runs and clearly has trouble tracking back. If he did finish tops in the combine then it might be mechanics.

Why are we trying to turn a natural central player into a wide player? Again, only TFC is this dumb.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 12:20 PM
Why are we trying to turn a natural central player into a wide player? Again, only TFC is this dumb.
Played both in college.

Phil
10-09-2014, 12:24 PM
I kinda get the impression Bloom and Haglund are like the old adage:

Two guys run to first base in exactly the same time. One with lousy form, one with great form. Which one do you take?

I don't see Bloom getting better. Haglund on the other hand could be around for a long time.

I think Caldwell and Morrow make anyone they play with look better. The cat was let out of the bag with the injuries.

Haglund to me just needs proper development. Bloom I think could be moved for a good return to Orlando.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 12:26 PM
Also we should probably fire Vanney. He called these last 4 matches, including yesterdays, must wins. Putting that much pressure on the players is unacceptable and broke their fragile spirits. Second time this season someone had the audacity to call for results from the squad and for the second time in a few months we blew it badly. Led to a firing last time so why not this time too.

TFC : Participation medals for all. And a smiley face sticker for trying real hard.

burlington Red
10-09-2014, 12:26 PM
Hagglund and Caldwell both play 2nd ball syndrome, ie they launch it long and hope we latch onto the 2nd ball, neither is comfortable with the ball at their feet. Bradley has to go deep to get the ball from Bendik at times as neither of our centre backs can do that. Bloom made some decent runs, but his last ball was poor. Caldwell is 34, he's had injuries thsi season, could well be his last. I'd assume Hagglund is here for the long run, as he gets older he will get better with possession, but he's never going to natural in that regard. We need to get a partner for him who is comfortable with the ball, some one who can take the ball from Bendik and bring it out of defence.I appreciate ball playing centre backs are a rare commodity, maybe we need to broaden our search, look for a DM we can play there instead something similiar in the way Barca use Marscherano in that role.

jloome
10-09-2014, 01:12 PM
Played both in college.

For a few months as a freshman. He was a four-year player, three years at center back and Big East defender of the year.

Also not the point; look at the guy's movement, his stature, how much stronger he is vertically than with the ball at his feet. He has potential to be a very good ball-playing center half, but he's no full back.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 01:55 PM
For a few months as a freshman. He was a four-year player, three years at center back and Big East defender of the year.

Also not the point; look at the guy's movement, his stature, how much stronger he is vertically than with the ball at his feet. He has potential to be a very good ball-playing center half, but he's no full back.
This is true and I wouldn't want to put him there unless we had to but who knows what happen next year? We may have no good options again.

Bring back Usanov!

KRO
10-09-2014, 02:08 PM
The fat lady has sung.

We lost 3-0 at the weekend and lost last night at home to a team below us in the table who had 10 men for the last half hour.

The chance of us getting 6+ points from the last 3 games is zero IMHO. I'm usually a glass half full guy but I know a dysfunctional team when I see one.

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 02:10 PM
Back when we had 33 points and Nelsen just got sacked I predicted us to finish with 41 points. I am sticking to that number with the draw against Montreal and getting our asses handed to us in both away fixtures. I am thinking we'll fold like a wet newspaper this weekend and be on our usual end of a 4-1 defeat (and I am being nice with the 1 goal for).

jloome
10-09-2014, 02:38 PM
Back when we had 33 points and Nelsen just got sacked I predicted us to finish with 41 points. I am sticking to that number with the draw against Montreal and getting our asses handed to us in both away fixtures. I am thinking we'll fold like a wet newspaper this weekend and be on our usual end of a 4-1 defeat (and I am being nice with the 1 goal for).

Compared to how the battled against Portland, it was a different team. I have to wonder if Defoe isn't a demoralizing factor.

JuliquE
10-09-2014, 02:49 PM
Compared to how the battled against Portland, it was a different team. I have to wonder if Defoe isn't a demoralizing factor.
The likes of which it would be human nature, if you've a single ball in your sack, to stand up to? =)

jloome
10-09-2014, 03:36 PM
The likes of which it would be human nature, if you've a single ball in your sack, to stand up to? =)

Of course! I didn't say it wasn't human nature, dude, just that it was impolitic, and you don't really want your DP doing that. But it's certainly forgiveable if you think the offensive upside is great enough, because he's only 24. If I had to lose a DP, it wouldn't be Gilberto.

If someone offered us $1.7M plus for him, I'd probably take it as I think we can get more consistent production for the money. But I'll also say it might be a mistake to do so, because he showed a lot later in the season.

East York
10-09-2014, 03:39 PM
Not only will we make the post season, we are going to win the WHole Dam thing........... i have also had a lot to drink today

TFC07
10-09-2014, 03:47 PM
Hagglund runs look awkward when moving forward. Also, Hagglund doesn't look a soccer player to me and he's actually hurting us more than helping us. I can't believe Henry lost his starting job over Hagglund. Henry is a lot stronger, faster and better defender (as long he doesn't play too aggressive) who based on stats is our best player this year.

Another poor choice by Vanney to not start Henry who could have match speed and physical play from Houston players yesterday.

jazzy
10-09-2014, 05:56 PM
can't wait to see what sort of excuses will come out if TFC misses the playoffs this time. will anyone take responsibility and fall on their swords? probably not. no one is held accountable at MLSE

I'm so weary that not sure if anyone falls on their swords exactly where will that get us ? I am glad I'm not running this organization . How many directions can one team take . I genuinely feel for Baz . I think he is sincere and his learning curve just hit a snag . Hate to bring it up because I was as excited as anyone last year but if we progressed slower with Laba et all , would we have been at this same point ? Wish we did but that was simply to easy and not available , I guess? Would we be atrocious without Bradley ? Is he a detriment to our success ? Or do we need BIG names to attract the TO market . Lost and not found I am.

BuSaPuNk
10-09-2014, 05:59 PM
Until its proven that were mathematically eliminated ill never give up.

jazzy
10-09-2014, 06:00 PM
I read somewhere that Gilberto was training fine before the match... I really wouldn't be surprised if Defoe took offence to Gilberto's comment and asked that he be off the team .... If this really was the case, the bigger villain here is TFC management who bend over backwards for Defoe while dumping the heart and soul of this team into the bin.

I am so worried this is the case > And if true I will definitely have a hate on for the whole system . Surely they can't be this dumb again . If true team really is done .

jazzy
10-09-2014, 06:09 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if this was a call from higher end,after all our new coach is their puppet.

Our weakest link since 2007 was always a head coach,it is interesting that we had only 2 coaches with previous head coaching experience,Johnson and Preki,all other coaches TFC hired were at best assistant coaches, some of them academy coaches and in case on Nelsen,no coaching experience at all. Keeping Gilberto out for tonights game is another prove that our coach has no integrity and he bent over for sake of making TL and Defoe happy.

We need a good experienced MLS coach,get out and find one,pay the fine for taking him from another club,who cares,Seattle did with Ziggy,we can do it too. Enough with experiments,we can't afford that shit,clubs that went to playoffs and won MLS Cup(RSL, DC, NER) can afford new young coach and give him 2-3 years to turn around ,we can't, it's time to get good coach and get rid of Defoe,ASAP.

As far this season goes,as much I would like to see TFC going into playoffs,realistically we don't stand a chance,with performance like last night we will lose next 3 games easy,there was no fire from a get go,we had to go down 1-0 in order to get our players pushing forward.

Well put , sadly, I'll have to agree 100% , the only real answer left for us I guess and it seems many on this board have had this opinion for a while . But the only coach that will work is one that tells mgmt to butt out . Is there anyone crazy enough to want to live in Canada with huge media criticism, cold winters, AND of course MLSE to deal with.

JuliquE
10-09-2014, 06:51 PM
Not only will we make the post season, we are going to win the WHole Dam thing........... i have also had a lot to drink today
How can you NOT love this guy.

Shout out to East York, man; used to live in Greektown, myself.

Shakes McQueen
10-09-2014, 06:59 PM
Not giving up on this season, until it's over. Of course, it's not like I'm delusional about the odds, either.

Pookie
10-09-2014, 08:14 PM
Well put , sadly, I'll have to agree 100% , the only real answer left for us I guess and it seems many on this board have had this opinion for a while . But the only coach that will work is one that tells mgmt to butt out . Is there anyone crazy enough to want to live in Canada with huge media criticism, cold winters, AND of course MLSE to deal with.

We have media criticism of TFC in Toronto?

Ultra & Proud
10-09-2014, 09:52 PM
We have media criticism of TFC in Toronto?
No it's usually just media indifference and irrelevance but every now and then, like when we're close to something notable like the playoffs or another of our otherworldly failures, the media's questions generally border on embarrassing ignorance.

Pookie
10-09-2014, 10:10 PM
True. And the commentary on game telecasts by some not named Nigel are difficult to listen too.

You know, TFC is only 3 back of Vancouver in the race for the 2015 CCL birth.

I personally don't care about MLS playoffs anymore. Being in the 50% isn't an achievement and as others have suggested this team is far from being a top club (or Superclub) as some referred to it. I wouldn't expect the playoffs to last long if they do happen to squeak in.

Consider the irony though if they do manage to overtake Vancouver in the final picture. A team that basically quit on earning a CCL birth this year to focus on the MLS Playoffs might miss that but end up getting in the CCL?

I wonder if that would be the ironic spin on the season?

Yohan
10-09-2014, 11:38 PM
I'm so weary that not sure if anyone falls on their swords exactly where will that get us ? I am glad I'm not running this organization . How many directions can one team take . I genuinely feel for Baz . I think he is sincere and his learning curve just hit a snag . Hate to bring it up because I was as excited as anyone last year but if we progressed slower with Laba et all , would we have been at this same point ? Wish we did but that was simply to easy and not available , I guess? Would we be atrocious without Bradley ? Is he a detriment to our success ? Or do we need BIG names to attract the TO market . Lost and not found I am.
I want stability as much as the next guy.

But with Bez, he's part of the crew that promised playoffs. If he doesn't deliver, there is no confidence in him. You just can't let someone that has no credibility with anyone in charge of anything.

reggie
10-09-2014, 11:49 PM
I consider him more of bean counter then find a player gm..the fact that he did not bring in any help at the deadline was a big fail for me and the fact that we were 3 players under the imports limit for most of the season was a huge fail.

kwhisperer
10-10-2014, 10:16 AM
I consider him more of bean counter then find a player gm..the fact that he did not bring in any help at the deadline was a big fail for me and the fact that we were 3 players under the imports limit for most of the season was a huge fail.

I wonder if instability in the organization blinded Bez to the on-field needs of the team.

I don't get why we need a "capologist" - or whatever Leiweke called him - as a GM. Why not have a guy like that in your bean-counting department and have a really knowledgeable soccer guy in the GM position?

OgtheDim
10-10-2014, 10:52 AM
I consider him more of bean counter then find a player gm..the fact that he did not bring in any help at the deadline was a big fail for me and the fact that we were 3 players under the imports limit for most of the season was a huge fail.

Larson indicated they tried to get a CD in. Vanney also indicated that bringing in a player at that position this late would be difficult for all.

The failure was in not getting a better second CD last January. This seems to have been a calculated bet that Henry would continue his upward curve in quality and become an MLS quality starting CD, which has not occurred. If we hadn't drafted Hagglund (who is not bad for a rookie CD), we'd be even worse at the back.

Bez had a good draft and got in some decent enough attacking players who are far more threatening then what we had before.

Morrow is the best player acquisition this year IMHO.

i.e. If we are going to judge Bez, it needs to be on his whole body of work.

Phil
10-10-2014, 11:32 AM
I wonder if instability in the organization blinded Bez to the on-field needs of the team.

I don't get why we need a "capologist" - or whatever Leiweke called him - as a GM. Why not have a guy like that in your bean-counting department and have a really knowledgeable soccer guy in the GM position?

Obviously we are all forgetting about the massive hole the previous GMs (excluding Payne) put us in. Bez has such intimate knowlege of all the contracts in the MLS, huge asset to have a guy like that fitting things together. There are a lot of coaches who were working on getting player ideas and contacts made, it is up to Bez to make them fit. TFC switched to a collectively run team on player aquisition, decisions are made by committee now. Someone to oversee and ensure we can fit the players into the team is essential.

If we change that structure then a capologist might not be needed. I do think that the MLS is overly complex with its hidden funds and contract complications though.

trane
10-11-2014, 04:11 AM
I just think his skill set, while good for what it is, is quite limited in comparison to the level the league is moving to. For every one Osorio in Canada's camp, there are about a hundred who don't get a look in the U.S. camp and who don't start on MLS teams, guys who can beat one or two guys to hold onto the ball, but don't have the next gear to move into the space between defensive lines, pull defences out of shape and thread pinpoint passes over more than ten yards.

In MLS now, to be a key player, they need a complete package for their position. Not for other positions, or flexibility. But to start in their position. If you're a winger, you have to have speed, dribbling skills, decent crossing abilities. If you're an AM, you have to have acceleration, pinpoint passing control, a cannon for a long shot.

Consider that Andrew Driver is an across-the-board stronger technical player than any winger we have, and in fact is stronger than any midfielder we have other than Bradley. And he doesn't usually start in Houston. He's a bench player because he's behind a DP.

We made some major steps this year, but the roster was far from done, and is still far from done. Is Vanney the guy? He's doing a lot right, but he's had some tactical stumpers, too, like trying to use Oduro to add urgency to a game where the other team is bunkered in, and he can't get behind them with his speed. And his faith in Bekker is stupefying; maybe he's just giving him a chance to prove he has something before next season.

I agree with you. To clarify, when I say CM I mean as a two way, box to box mid, not an AM or a DM. I agree with you that he does not have enough to me an effective AM. He is not good enough defensively or physical enough to be a DM, and even to be a better two way player he needs more in terms of physicality. As an AM he has some vision and passing but not enough of anything else ( pace, attacking aggressiveness, inventiveness, shot, dribbling skills)) to be an effective as an AM. When he is on the pitch he is a very neutral, he is not so ineffective to be a liability but he does not rely influence the game either, which to me means he should be a bench player at best. He is someone you can bring on when you need a midfield body because he will not fuck up. Bekker I see in a similar fashion but a step bellow.

trane
10-11-2014, 04:14 AM
Henry can be overaggressive but other then that he has the makings of a great cb. In some ways if we had someone who could mentor them and protect them I would like to see Hagland and him be allowed to play and become and effective pairing.

Lumpy
10-11-2014, 06:00 AM
The season was lost when we fired Nelson. Immediately after the firing we were shutout twice by Philadelphia. Those losses against a weak team may ultimately be the deciding factors in why we missed the playoffs. Vanney and management promised attacking football but we have been shutout in 4 of Vanney's first 7 games. Nelson was shutout in only 4 of his 21 games. Do the math. The attacking football line was bought by some of us because it sounded exciting versus the rather boring plodding football under Nelson. Crank up the time machine and let us go back to the day of the firing and have Bez swallow his pride and we would now be in a playoff position.

OgtheDim
10-11-2014, 06:38 AM
The season was lost when we fired Nelson.


You do remember that 3-0 loss to NER and how clueless the team was, right?

Was going nowhere.

Had been found out tactically.

If he hadn't been fired then, he would have been fired after we lost twice to Philly.

ensco
10-11-2014, 08:08 AM
The season was lost before it started. None of our non-DPs would be a starter on a playoff team. Not one.

Really, no team wins the wooden spoon by ten points, and then makes the playoffs. Even by spending $100M. It's only Leiweke with his stupid guarantee that expects otherwise. I was hopeful, it was fun to cheer for a winning team midseason, but in the end, no dice. Face it, in lots of those wins we were lucky, many of us knew it, it caught up to us.

I appreciate that the team gave us some hope this year, that was great. I really like quite a few of our players, we have some great depth guys.

I expect that the team will get killed tonight by NY, and it' s OK.

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 10:09 AM
Hagglund runs look awkward when moving forward. Also, Hagglund doesn't look a soccer player to me and he's actually hurting us more than helping us. I can't believe Henry lost his starting job over Hagglund. Henry is a lot stronger, faster and better defender (as long he doesn't play too aggressive) who based on stats is our best player this year.

Another poor choice by Vanney to not start Henry who could have match speed and physical play from Houston players yesterday.
Agreed. Surprising he has vanished. I like Hagglund, he has great potential, but Henry is further ahead IMHO

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 10:13 AM
Well put , sadly, I'll have to agree 100% , the only real answer left for us I guess and it seems many on this board have had this opinion for a while . But the only coach that will work is one that tells mgmt to butt out . Is there anyone crazy enough to want to live in Canada with huge media criticism, cold winters, AND of course MLSE to deal with.

Nelsen was fired for telling Bez to butt out. That's what "lost a power struggle" means. Like his coaching skill or not, he clearly knows the game and felt he should have the final call on who should play, acquisitions, etc.

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 10:17 AM
The season was lost when we fired Nelson. Immediately after the firing we were shutout twice by Philadelphia. Those losses against a weak team may ultimately be the deciding factors in why we missed the playoffs. Vanney and management promised attacking football but we have been shutout in 4 of Vanney's first 7 games. Nelson was shutout in only 4 of his 21 games. Do the math. The attacking football line was bought by some of us because it sounded exciting versus the rather boring plodding football under Nelson. Crank up the time machine and let us go back to the day of the firing and have Bez swallow his pride and we would now be in a playoff position.

Bingo bingo bingo bingo

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 10:21 AM
The season was lost before it started. None of our non-DPs would be a starter on a playoff team. Not one.
K.

I dunno Ensco, Morrow for one, and to be fair even playoff teams have players with limited skill sets - they hide them. It's why LA has always been beatable if you attack them - they are hiding some weaknesses at the back.

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 10:30 AM
I think the big issue is that we haven't been able to figure out how to use Bradley. As skilled as he is (and I love his toughness) we played our best team football in some ways when he was away at the World Cup. Certainly, we have struggled afterwards, and haven't been able to find the right players to play with him or the right role for him either. And he was culpable on all three goals against New England. I actually think Bradley Orr might have been the best player on the roster to sit deep in front of the back four and play with MB. Certainly would not have to worry about him getting caught up the field....

JuliquE
10-11-2014, 11:03 AM
Henry can be overaggressive but other then that he has the makings of a great cb. In some ways if we had someone who could mentor them and protect them I would like to see Hagland and him be allowed to play and become and effective pairing.
Funny you should say that, as I always felt the same way; seems like the two balance each other out, even: Henry being a bit of a loose cannon (mind, he's mellowed out/matured a fair bit) & Hagglund, the happy-go-lucky beast.



The season was lost when we fired Nelson. Immediately after the firing we were shutout twice by Philadelphia. Those losses against a weak team may ultimately be the deciding factors in why we missed the playoffs. Vanney and management promised attacking football but we have been shutout in 4 of Vanney's first 7 games. Nelson was shutout in only 4 of his 21 games. Do the math. The attacking football line was bought by some of us because it sounded exciting versus the rather boring plodding football under Nelson. Crank up the time machine and let us go back to the day of the firing and have Bez swallow his pride and we would now be in a playoff position.
I disagree, here; as ensco has said, we were quite lucky to escape with wins, on a fair many occasions.. and, whilst I think it's still worth noting that we got the result, it's always a risk that sort of play get's found out and catches us up. Further to this point, I think it's worth highlighting that you can have a high-scoring game that's not played in an attacking fashion, versus a nil-nil game that's end to end. Those being the two extremes, I think you can look at our attempted shots for a good read on this; just because we were clinical and nicked our 1/2 of relatively few chances in a game, doesn't mean we play an attacking brand of football.

I'm not all the way sold on Vanney, either, and I keep saying that I desperately wanted Nelsen to make a name for himself, here.. but, I think that the former has a bit more about his approach to suggest he's got a higher ceiling. I don't think Nelsen should have been fired when he was, to be clear; it was either at the end of last season, when we decided to commit to a $$$ approach, or once we were mathematically out of the playoffs. Having said that, Nelsen doesn't cover himself in glory, with all his excuses (the GM saying it needs to be better, after a couple poor performances, should not be a problem).



The season was lost before it started. None of our non-DPs would be a starter on a playoff team. Not one.

Really, no team wins the wooden spoon by ten points, and then makes the playoffs. Even by spending $100M. It's only Leiweke with his stupid guarantee that expects otherwise. I was hopeful, it was fun to cheer for a winning team midseason, but in the end, no dice. Face it, in lots of those wins we were lucky, many of us knew it, it caught up to us.

I appreciate that the team gave us some hope this year, that was great. I really like quite a few of our players, we have some great depth guys.

I expect that the team will get killed tonight by NY, and it' s OK.
I agree with the post, except for where you say none of our non-DP players would start for a playoff side. When more than half the teams make playoffs, surely some of them will have a few weaker players. Perhaps on a side like LA or Seattle, but even they have one or two limited players.



Bingo bingo bingo bingo
LAUL



I think the big issue is that we haven't been able to figure out how to use Bradley. As skilled as he is (and I love his toughness) we played our best team football in some ways when he was away at the World Cup. Certainly, we have struggled afterwards, and haven't been able to find the right players to play with him or the right role for him either. And he was culpable on all three goals against New England. I actually think Bradley Orr might have been the best player on the roster to sit deep in front of the back four and play with MB. Certainly would not have to worry about him getting caught up the field....
bingo bingo bingo bingo

Yohan
10-11-2014, 11:23 AM
The season was lost when we fired Nelson. Immediately after the firing we were shutout twice by Philadelphia. Those losses against a weak team may ultimately be the deciding factors in why we missed the playoffs. Vanney and management promised attacking football but we have been shutout in 4 of Vanney's first 7 games. Nelson was shutout in only 4 of his 21 games. Do the math. The attacking football line was bought by some of us because it sounded exciting versus the rather boring plodding football under Nelson. Crank up the time machine and let us go back to the day of the firing and have Bez swallow his pride and we would now be in a playoff position.
Nelsen squandered all the games in hand and was tactically found out, but he didn't adjust. Just kept rolling out the same lineup and hope his players win through individual skill pretty much. TFC was the most predictable team to play against. And it's not like TFC is so stacked that we can overrun every team with sheer player talent. If insanity is keep doing the same thing but expect to get different results everytime...

Nelsen might have been fired when TFC was 3rd in the East, but TFC was just 3 points above the 6th place team at the time.

Fort York Redcoat
10-11-2014, 11:31 AM
I have given up on time machines. Mighty hand Lumpy please be careful when time travelling. I've seen that meeting oneself in the past can cause rifts and its one kind of blowup we don't need ever.g:D

MightyDM
10-11-2014, 02:08 PM
I have given up on time machines. Mighty hand Lumpy please be careful when time travelling. I've seen that meeting oneself in the past can cause rifts and its one kind of blowup we don't need ever.g:D

LOL. We like it back here.....

Dave67
10-11-2014, 03:01 PM
Obviously we are all forgetting about the massive hole the previous GMs (excluding Payne) put us in. Bez has such intimate knowlege of all the contracts in the MLS, huge asset to have a guy like that fitting things together. There are a lot of coaches who were working on getting player ideas and contacts made, it is up to Bez to make them fit. TFC switched to a collectively run team on player aquisition, decisions are made by committee now. Someone to oversee and ensure we can fit the players into the team is essential.

If we change that structure then a capologist might not be needed. I do think that the MLS is overly complex with its hidden funds and contract complications though.

I wonder what the expiry date is on that contract knowledge? It's gotta be good for a few years but I wonder if it goes beyond that.

OgtheDim
10-11-2014, 03:10 PM
The season was lost before it started. None of our non-DPs would be a starter on a playoff team. Not one.

....

Hyperbole.

Morrow and Osorio would for sure. Jackson, Bloom, Caldwell, and Oduro probably. Bekker would start on half the teams in this league.

ensco
10-11-2014, 03:41 PM
Hyperbole.

Morrow and Osorio would for sure. Jackson, Bloom, Caldwell, and Oduro probably. Bekker would start on half the teams in this league.

Disagree about every name on that list ex Morrow. Pretty violently in some cases.

I think Creavalle and Morrow are maybe starters for good teams. Maybe Warner too. But they're all maybes.

Yohan
10-11-2014, 03:45 PM
Morrow is a starter on most MLS teams. I can't think of many who are significantly better than Morrow. he's just as good as most starting LBs in MLS, if not better

TFC1154ever
10-11-2014, 03:51 PM
Predicting it now. We tie the Red Bull, beat Montreal and lose to New England. That loss to Houston was the season. Maybe we pull a tie out in new england, but only if they are resting players for the playoffs. For me, them and DC are the best in the east by a bit.

ensco
10-11-2014, 03:53 PM
You guys are probably right about Morrow, I was just looking at the list, it's a weak position in MLS.

I stand by the rest, though. They are all generally (in some cases vastly) overrated here. Although there is good depth there, we do not have more than one bonafide non DP starter.

Initial B
10-11-2014, 04:14 PM
Predicting it now. We tie the Red Bull, beat Montreal and lose to New England. That loss to Houston was the season. Maybe we pull a tie out in new england, but only if they are resting players for the playoffs. For me, them and DC are the best in the east by a bit.
If Montreal beats New England, there is absolutely no way we should lose to either of those teams in our last two games. Otherwise, that would suggest we are worse than Montreal. To lose to Montreal would be my nightmare end to the season.

jazzy
10-11-2014, 07:42 PM
Agreed. Surprising he has vanished. I like Hagglund, he has great potential, but Henry is further ahead IMHO

Henry has great soccer instincts as well, yes he's a bull in a china shop at times , but how many times has he slid to stop a good goal scoring opportunity . For his size he's quick .

jazzy
10-11-2014, 07:43 PM
If Montreal beats New England, there is absolutely no way we should lose to either of those teams in our last two games. Otherwise, that would suggest we are worse than Montreal. To lose to Montreal would be my nightmare end to the season.

watch out , we are Toronto and now like the Leafs teams relish visiting and taking over . Sad

JuliquE
10-11-2014, 09:02 PM
Still hopeful we can sneak in; you have to think that Red Bull will be playing like a shark to blood in water, and looking to finish as high as possible, making a statement, in so doing (against The Crew). Philly, whilst maybe out of the running for that final playoff spot, will have ALL the motivation they need to play spoiler in Columbus, after giving up three goals in four minutes, to lose 2-3 on their own patch.

It's no longer entirely in our hands, but remember a very mediocre RSL side, back in 2009, and the heights they've reached, since.

Keep hope alive, lads.

Pookie
10-11-2014, 10:04 PM
Have you given up hope?

Looks like Vanney has...

"Our playoff drive is over," Greg Vanney said, an acknowledgment that his team was essentially eliminated from the playoffs after their third loss in a row. "They're frustrated. They're coming to grips."

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/toronto-fc-playoff-hopes-take-another-hit-after-loss-to-red-bulls-1.2796345

notthesun
10-11-2014, 10:14 PM
Well at this point anyone who thinks we have a chance should probably be hospitalized. The chances of Columbus not getting at least a draw over their next two games are already incredibly slim... and we have to win both of ours.

Blixa
10-11-2014, 10:38 PM
We're done. As simple as that.

OgtheDim
10-11-2014, 10:59 PM
Leiwike made it sound like getting into the playoffs was easy.

I thought we could do it with the team we had.

I was wrong. Our defence wasn't good enough and, it turns out, those flashy wing type players didn't do the job on offence either.

From where we started last season, to get into the playoffs would require a monumental turn of fortune that is rare in MLS. Yes, DCU is doing it this season, but that doesn't make that sort of turn around easy.

To get into the playoffs in 2015 from where we are today is very doable. Next season, I will take getting into the playoffs as a probable. Until we get over that line, I won't believe again that this team will do it. Can? Yes. Will get into the playoffs? Won't believe we will do it till its done.

Joe Kool
10-12-2014, 12:40 AM
Have you given up hope?

Looks like Vanney has...

"Our playoff drive is over," Greg Vanney said, an acknowledgment that his team was essentially eliminated from the playoffs after their third loss in a row. "They're frustrated. They're coming to grips."

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/toronto-fc-playoff-hopes-take-another-hit-after-loss-to-red-bulls-1.2796345


Hopefully they can at least beat Montreal in the last home game and give us something to cheer about even though they are admitting it is over this year. Maybe play for their jobs and the fans at least. I will still show up to pick up my toque. I think most of us knew at least a few games ago it was pretty much over. New England they can play all of our backups...whatever. Hello price freeze :) Mr. Lewieke said TFC will make the playoffs when asked about ticket price increases for next year and if TFC do they deserve a raise....if they don't then we will talk....let's see what TL has to say.