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GabrielHurl
08-31-2014, 12:42 PM
Per Kristian Jack


Breaking - Toronto FC's Tim Bezbatchenko will address the media today at 4pm to make an announcement about the coaching staff. #tfc (https://twitter.com/hashtag/tfc?src=hash)

Greg
08-31-2014, 12:43 PM
Kurtis LarsonVerified account ‏@KurtLarSUN (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN) BREAKING: Ryan Nelsen out at Toronto FC.

dantdot
08-31-2014, 12:46 PM
Crazy. In the middle of a playoff run though, this can't be good for our chances.

Fort York Redcoat
08-31-2014, 12:47 PM
Breaking Future News- Replacement coach X gets credit for season or blames Nelsen and not enough time to turn it around.

Le Sigh

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 12:48 PM
@JohnMolinaro: Source close to situation confirmed to me that Nelsen is out as #TFC coach: http://t.co/eFLy25WSur

GabrielHurl
08-31-2014, 12:50 PM
wholesale clean out


Paul Attfield ‏@paulattfield (https://twitter.com/paulattfield) 3m
(https://twitter.com/paulattfield/status/506134027238400000)Update: entire TFC coaching staff fired, save for Jason Bent #TFC (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFC?src=hash)

portu
08-31-2014, 12:50 PM
i hope he has a replacement already lined up

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 12:51 PM
Surprised Mr. TFC Jimmy was not spared.

portu
08-31-2014, 12:51 PM
Gilberto tweeting out that canada continues to surprise him followed by a thumbs down.. obviously not happy with nelsen leaving

dantdot
08-31-2014, 12:53 PM
Gilberto tweeting out that canada continues to surprise him followed by a thumbs down.. obviously not happy with nelsen leaving

He tweeted earlier with a thumbs up and deleted it. lol?

Pookie
08-31-2014, 12:53 PM
#notsurprisingivenpostgamepresser

He backed Bez into a corner. Hats off to Bez for making a very defining call.

Super
08-31-2014, 12:54 PM
Please, please, please let's finally hire an experienced coach. No more experiments with rookies.

AlanO
08-31-2014, 12:55 PM
#notsurprisingivenpostgamepresser

He backed Bez into a corner. Hats off to Bez for making a very defining call.

Yeah, this. Bez had no choice after that press conference.

Doesn't matter if you're right or wrong - calling out your boss in the media will never end well.

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 12:56 PM
#notsurprisingivenpostgamepresser

He backed Bez into a corner. Hats off to Bez for making a very defining call.

Shows it's never good to air your dirty laundry in public, should have gone up to a room after the game and discussed his displeasure and issues with Bez straight up, man to man. Bez really had no choice at this point.

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 12:56 PM
Where is TR, still kicking around town?

SirBobSaget
08-31-2014, 12:57 PM
Praise Jebus. The press conference last night was infuriating, as we're all the previous ones. All Nelsen ever does is make excuses, refs, pitch, weather, travel, injuries, expectations of GM and fans, and just plain bad luck. Always externalizing issues. People that externalize don't improve because they have no control over their fate, its the unseen forces holding them back!

Contrast to Robinson's presser following an equally disappointing performance, he actually admits his team and his coaching staff!! was defeated. What a concept admitting you we're beaten and will fix the problems!!!

portu
08-31-2014, 12:57 PM
He tweeted earlier with a thumbs up and deleted it. lol?
probs a mistake the emojis are right next each other on the keyboard

Pookie
08-31-2014, 12:58 PM
Wonder if Tim L had any input into this….

portu
08-31-2014, 12:59 PM
the only issue i have with this is that it seems as if bez did this as a kneejerk reaction to establish authority

GabrielHurl
08-31-2014, 12:59 PM
interesting


Brian Sciaretta ‏@BrianSciaretta 2m
One source telling me Toronto coach will be Greg Vanney. Not sure whether or not it's on an interim basis

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 12:59 PM
Wonder if Tim L had any input into this….

I am sure Tim expressed his thoughts and gave an opinion but it ultimately lay with Bez with some consultation.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 01:00 PM
Contrast to Robinson's presser following an equally disappointing performance, he actually admits his team and his coaching staff!! was defeated. What a concept admitting you we're beaten and will fix the problems!!!

And instead of saying "… are you kidding me?", He also acknowledged the importance of the game:

"It is a massive game," Robinson said. "It's a rivalry game for us at home against a team that's competing the playoff spot. I could say it's just another normal game and I wouldn't be being honest, and that's one thing I am. It was a massive game for us. We lost, we take it on the chin and move on."

Richard
08-31-2014, 01:00 PM
Well Mr.Bez. Did you step up and get better players this summer transfer window? Goes both ways you know.

TL leaving absolutely had an effect on this.

portu
08-31-2014, 01:01 PM
Gilberto definetly uspet now tweeting that there are things in life that "we just dont understand"

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 01:01 PM
Wonder if Danny is named to the first team staff as an assistant , would make sense on such a short time frame.

portu
08-31-2014, 01:02 PM
dont like vanney as next coach.. if we change coach we change coach that includes style of play etcetera - nobody changes coaches as a "like for like"

Alonso
08-31-2014, 01:05 PM
Totally shocked by this...

Might be for the best.

I hope the replacement has MLS experience and a decent track record.

TFC07
08-31-2014, 01:06 PM
dont like vanney as next coach.. if we change coach we change coach that includes style of play etcetera - nobody changes coaches as a "like for like"

I am sure it's for end of season only, then TFC will hire more "experience" and hopefully modern coach

Richard
08-31-2014, 01:07 PM
Please, please, please let's finally hire an experienced coach. No more experiments with rookies.

Maybe we shouldn't have a rookie GM either. Bez is a corporate yes man who now feels a bit of power because TL is exiting.

adam1001
08-31-2014, 01:07 PM
Wow I was not expecting this! I thought they would give Nelsen until the end of the season before pulling the cord.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 01:08 PM
If the entire staff is gone… save Jason Bent… what does that say?

An interim coach can easily jump in and take time to evaluate his inherited staff.

To clean house like that suggests one of two things to me. That whatever was festering was bigger than just Nelsen and Bez and/or the replacement has an entourage and we are getting an experienced staff.

Jeff s
08-31-2014, 01:10 PM
Man I really hope we take another shot at Adrian Heath. The man knows up to get a low quality team to play possesion / attacking football. Not sure if he's willing to leave though.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 01:10 PM
Maybe we shouldn't have a rookie GM either. Bez is a corporate yes man who now feels a bit of power because TL is exiting.

What in his history suggests he is a corporate "yes man"?

He has corporate experience yes. Kind of critical in this league. That said, where is the history of an inability to think and act on his own?

portu
08-31-2014, 01:13 PM
he's an ex lawyer he has an ego defintely not a yes man

if u read the beckham experiment you'll see from the involvement of leiweke in club operations he likes a guy whos confident in his own abilities and ideas

Jeff s
08-31-2014, 01:15 PM
Well Mr.Bez. Did you step up and get better players this summer transfer window? Goes both ways you know.

TL leaving absolutely had an effect on this.

What do you want him to do? He gave Nelsen one of the best squads in the league right now. nelsen hasn't taken advantage of it.

If all of this is true, Bez (or Tim) did something that should've been done before the season. The 2 Tim's did everything right but keep a manager who was clearly managing a team out of his league.

portu
08-31-2014, 01:17 PM
i really dont see this as a performance based firing.. remember when bez said that even if we dont make the playoffs that nelsen wouldnt necessarily be fired

Pookie
08-31-2014, 01:19 PM
What do you want him to do? He gave Nelsen one of the best squads in the league right now. nelsen hasn't taken advantage of it.

If all of this is true, Bez (or Tim) did something that should've been done before the season. The 2 Tim's did everything right but keep a manager who was clearly managing a team out of his league.

In fairness, Nelsen's contact list is what led to this offseason. Widely speculated that Nelsen had a significant hand in opening doors with Defoe, Cesar and others. Nelsen brought a lot to this team and club. It's unfortunate but I really don't see another choice in this situation… baring an apology from Nelsen… for Bez to make.

Today, we focus on coaching situation but the Defoe question is going to come up soon.

notthesun
08-31-2014, 01:19 PM
Dug his own grave with those comments about Bez yesterday. Bet he wishes he kept his mouth shut now.

We need the make the playoffs and it was looking like it won't happen under Nelsen. Credit Bez for having the stones to make this move.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 01:20 PM
This is very surprising. I'm kind of sad. I really wanted Nelsen to succeed here.


I'm not sure who we could hire right now that would have any significant pedigree in this league. Hiring Vanney on an interim basis would probably be our best option right now. A guy who knows how to organise a team, get young guys to play up.

Most of the time when you fire a guy midseason you get a a 5-10 game blip of good form, just because the guys aren't under such a toxic situation any more (see us going 4-2-4 in our first ten under Mariner). I see this as a desperate attempt to make sure we make the playoffs. It's do or die at this point with with the stadium expansion. If we don't make the playoffs we'll be playing in a white (or red) elephant next season.

Richard
08-31-2014, 01:20 PM
What in his history suggests he is a corporate "yes man"?

He has corporate experience yes. Kind of critical in this league. That said, where is the history of an inability to think and act on his own?


he's an ex lawyer he has an ego defintely not a yes man

if u read the beckham experiment you'll see from the involvement of leiweke in club operations he likes a guy whos confident in his own abilities and ideas

Ok I'm probably wrong about that. I'm not to familiar with TL's past operations. It just strikes me this way because he could have hired any experienced GM after Payne was gone. He choose to go this route, suggesting TL might want full control, with a young guy to groom.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 01:22 PM
wholesale clean out
Badly, badly, needed. You could fill an ocean with all the shortcomings of the current group.

I will say #1 on my list of grievances is the lack of a spanish speaker in either the head coach of first assistant spot. That's just totally unacceptable in MLS today.

BTW if there was an internal candidate who would take over, it's not Dichio or Brennan, it's Bent.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 01:25 PM
Yesterday's game did not help, it was disgraceful and the way Nelson handled it after. However a firing on this scale (essentially all coaches) doesn't happen overnight. Clearly this was building and maybe last night was the tipping point. If the powers at be determined Nelson and his staff were not suitable for the job then maybe they were attempting to wait out the season because being 3rd in the East with games in hand was a good place. However the trajectory over last handful of games has not been good. Last night maybe accelerated all this.

I have to mention again what a terrible, terrible showing last night and the response from Nelson was pitiful. To be fair most press conferences where we were defeated rarely end in "We weren't good enough. I could have done this, that ect, to better prepare the team. I will do x,x,x next time. Instead it generally was down to "bad luck" or "other misfortune" that we lost. In some situations it definitely was but idk maybe last night was enough for TL and Bez and others involved.

Good on Bez and co. for doing what is necessary. Playoffs are no guarantee especially with the recent form. Do fire essential everybody (2/3 way through season) is a massive statement. Will it hurt us in the short term? Idk, lots of teams get boosts when new managers come in mid-season. However, since all coaches seemed to be canned how this all plays out in the short term will be intriguing (and probably painful)

portu
08-31-2014, 01:26 PM
vanney is making more and more sense as iirc he is assistant gm so he is bezs guy

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 01:28 PM
Wow I was not expecting this! I thought they would give Nelsen until the end of the season before pulling the cord.
I was going to say the same, but the way the team played yesterday clearly they lost faith in him. Watch Michael Bradley and maybe Dero next game and I guarantee that will tell you everything you need to know.

I think the whole "I'm a players kind of coach" thing only goes so far. Guys are sharks, if you can't hold their confidence they'll eat you alive.

Jimmy The Saint
08-31-2014, 01:31 PM
After yesterday's loss, the cough ups by M.B., terrible back line performance, and 3 losses in a row (a draw at home is a freaking loss), being outscored in those matches 9 to 2... this was coming.

Alonso
08-31-2014, 01:33 PM
So does anyone know how we can watch this announcement?

I don't see it up on their website.

PopePouri
08-31-2014, 01:36 PM
Nelsen fell out with KP and now he fell out with Bez. Don't see Bez as the issue here.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 01:38 PM
Well Mr.Bez. Did you step up and get better players this summer transfer window? Goes both ways you know.

TL leaving absolutely had an effect on this.
I totally get this POV and I don't think Bez should be getting a free pass on anything.

However, I question who wanted to go out and get the likes of Oduro and company. That did not make the team better IMO, it just steered us more towards the direction of playing with athleticism and without much skill.

Yes, our team needed to get more pace and athletic but that shouldn't have been done at the expense of football IQ. Our ability to break down a set defence currently is basically nil, because we don't have enough guys who make smart runs into space or have the skill on the ball to hit passes into the right places. We rely entirely on the counter attack, which is flawed.

jabbronies
08-31-2014, 01:39 PM
I was a Nelsen fan and wanted to give him the chance to prove himself. Unfortunately since the All-star break we have seen this team plummet in their game.

Good move to sack him before the ship sank - but I will be interested to see who they bring in as his replacement. That will determine if this was the right move to make now.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 01:39 PM
After yesterday's loss, the cough ups by M.B., terrible back line performance, and 3 losses in a row (a draw at home is a freaking loss), being outscored in those matches 9 to 2... this was coming.
I think the team gave up on him. He can say he was protecting the players but the performance yesterday suggests they didn't have his back.

Greatest Ripoff
08-31-2014, 01:41 PM
Will be really interested to see how they set up under a new coach. If any new players are given starting spots, change if formation and positions, ect.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 01:41 PM
ugggh.... Davidson just dropped this nugget:

#torontofc (https://twitter.com/hashtag/torontofc?src=hash) fires Ryan Nelsen and entire coaching staff. Jermain Defoe could be next to go -- to QPR -- in fallout of Leiweke departure.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 01:46 PM
I was a Nelsen fan and wanted to give him the chance to prove himself. Unfortunately since the All-star break we have seen this team plummet in their game.

Good move to sack him before the ship sank - but I will be interested to see who they bring in as his replacement. That will determine if this was the right move to make now.

I hope it is an interm manager until they can get who they want. Mid season like this (start of seasons across Europe) is not a good time. Hopefully they take their time, do what you can to make the playoffs, but getting the right person and system is crucial.

portu
08-31-2014, 01:46 PM
call me crazy but id like to see de vos' name thrown in to the ring for the job

he has his badges and from his analysis has good understanding of the mls game as well. could also repair broken relationship with grassroots

Pookie
08-31-2014, 01:48 PM
ugggh.... Davidson just dropped this nugget:

#torontofc (https://twitter.com/hashtag/torontofc?src=hash) fires Ryan Nelsen and entire coaching staff. Jermain Defoe could be next to go -- to QPR -- in fallout of Leiweke departure.


If that happens, the wheels were already well in motion.

It wouldn't be the worst thing for this team. Massive number of draft picks and a replacement DP for Defoe… ideally a younger one.

Makes you wonder though if the wheels are in motion… how quickly would Defoe rush back to help TFC in the playoff (hunt)?

pdubs
08-31-2014, 01:50 PM
ugggh.... Davidson just dropped this nugget:

#torontofc (https://twitter.com/hashtag/torontofc?src=hash) fires Ryan Nelsen and entire coaching staff. Jermain Defoe could be next to go -- to QPR -- in fallout of Leiweke departure.

If it means getting a younger DP with a lot of talent this could be beneficial. We all knew the risks of getting an older player with reoccurring injuries. I'm okay with Defoe and that he will not play every game. However on the wrong side of 30, better to cut the chord quicker in this case then say someone like Gilberto because a lack in form. We know what Defoe is capable of. Maybe now would be the opportune time to part idk. Press wise, this of course would be a disaster unless another DP of the same name recognition was lined up immediately.

Certainly makes you think and wonder what exactly is going on behind the scenes lol.

reggie
08-31-2014, 01:51 PM
Bob Bradley next season..

portu
08-31-2014, 01:51 PM
holy if defoe leaves as well we're screwed

he can leave in jan but right now we can't replace him

portu
08-31-2014, 01:52 PM
this all goes to show how little we truly know about the goings on at the club

cdnorman
08-31-2014, 01:53 PM
I totally get this POV and I don't think Bez should be getting a free pass on anything.

This is very mixed for me. I certainly think we are not playing well, but keep in mind that Nelson came into a totally dysfunctional organization and, given the in-and-out with TL, one can say that MLSE is a larger, dysfunctional organization. Nelson wasn't just putting a team on the pitch, he had to effectively build something from almost nothing. His connections and contacts did more to improve the team than any other single thing when it came to acquisitions.

That said, the funk that we hit post All-Star break is on him and is shared with Bez, who did virtually nothing. Nelson's frustration yesterday wasn't professional, but then it seems that he was trying to defend his players. (And / or make excuses as he's known to do).

I'm torn with what to think. TFC should not be given the benefit of any doubt when it comes to our faith that they'll do the right thing, a smart thing, and a good thing. Let's hope that Bez proves that thinking to be faulty otherwise we are going to be living GroundHog Day again this season with "Maybe Next Year" come Halloween.

And we won't have TL to count on for coming up with a big (hope) save.

mowe
08-31-2014, 01:56 PM
Please, please, please let's finally hire an experienced coach. No more experiments with rookies.

This x 1000!

I've always thought Nelson was a terrible coach so this is great news for me. But please for the love of God let's hire someone who's actually coached and had success with first team football before. Someone whose right hand man isn't a NCAA Div 3 coach.

I've been a fan of Bez's personnel moves over the last year. And good on him for getting rid of Nelson who's been continually outcoached and looked at a loss for ideas all year. But it's crucial to get the next hire right.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 01:58 PM
I totally get this POV and I don't think Bez should be getting a free pass on anything.

However, I question who wanted to go out and get the likes of Oduro and company. That did not make the team better IMO, it just steered us more towards the direction of playing with athleticism and without much skill.

Yes, our team needed to get more pace and athletic but that shouldn't have been done at the expense of football IQ. Our ability to break down a set defence currently is basically nil, because we don't have enough guys who make smart runs into space or have the skill on the ball to hit passes into the right places. We rely entirely on the counter attack, which is flawed.


Oduro is a massive upgrade over Rey.

I don't think you should but the ability to break down teams on the players. Tons of players have had difficulty doing so before they've gone to teams with good coaching in this league. Kamara at SKC, Neagle at Seattle. both were just sort of aimless athletes until they went to teams who new how to work off the ball. I'm sure the same thing could happen to Oduro if he was in the right hands.

TFC07
08-31-2014, 01:59 PM
Is this press conference going to be on TV?

Canary10
08-31-2014, 02:01 PM
Bez is an idiot. He's a 30 year old lawyer who decided all of a sudden he is a sports psychologist and that he can motivate better than the coach who has played in high pressure before. Complete BS what he did. And now to show he has some balls he's firing Nelsen. BS. He's an amateur and he's gotten us in a mess. Firing a manager at this stage never works. Typical TFC.

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 02:03 PM
I'll be the asshole and say this.

I'm glad he's fired.

I hope Defoe leaves

I don't care about where we finish in the standings cause it has nothing to do with our future.

I wish we had stayed with the Total football idea that we brought it and never let it get backstabbed. I wonder where we'd be right now.

This club is a mess…just like its been since day 1.

Every single person….from top Executive at MLSE right down to the supporters (myself included) should take some of the blame. We get what we pay for and demand.

mcolvy
08-31-2014, 02:04 PM
Bez is an idiot. He's a 30 year old lawyer who decided all of a sudden he is a sports psychologist and that he can motivate better than the coach who has played in high pressure before. Complete BS what he did. And now to show he has some balls he's firing Nelsen. BS. He's an amateur and he's gotten us in a mess. Firing a manager at this stage never works. Typical TFC.

Canary- I agree that this never works and brings us back to square one. Nelsen wasn't great but we could win with him as the manager...

pdubs
08-31-2014, 02:05 PM
Bez is an idiot. He's a 30 year old lawyer who decided all of a sudden he is a sports psychologist and that he can motivate better than the coach who has played in high pressure before. Complete BS what he did. And now to show he has some balls he's firing Nelsen. BS. He's an amateur and he's gotten us in a mess. Firing a manager at this stage never works. Typical TFC.

we don't really know that the progression of events was that linear do we? Without context and more back story it may certainly seem that way. Currently I am leaning to this was building up and yesterday's game could have been the tipping point to accelerate the process. However I don't think bez alone fired his head coach and all assistants in a gut reaction type of thing. Idk tho. Multiple angles as always.

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:05 PM
This x 1000!

I've always thought Nelson was a terrible coach so this is great news for me. But please for the love of God let's hire someone who's actually coached and had success with first team football before. Someone whose right hand man isn't a NCAA Div 3 coach.

I've been a fan of Bez's personnel moves over the last year. And good on him for getting rid of Nelson who's been continually outcoached and looked at a loss for ideas all year. But it's crucial to get the next hire right.
Agreed. The early season victories were often the result of opposition failing to mark Defoe, much like we failed yesterday with Nguyen. In those games, Nelsen favoured tactics which allowed the other team to control the game. We were lucky to have the Brazilian in goal, and were lucky Defoe was brilliant. Now, Defoe is either sitting, or not effective (defenders arent fooled anymore by those long passes), Our keeper is average, and Nelsen's team formation and tactics are costing us wins. We need a leader not a student at the helm.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 02:05 PM
Armen Bedakian ‏@ArmenBedakian (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian) 21s (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian/status/506153136105721857)
Pictures of entire coachiny staff removed from Kia Training ground. #TFC (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFC?src=hash) #MLS (https://twitter.com/hashtag/MLS?src=hash)

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 02:05 PM
Bez is an idiot. He's a 30 year old lawyer who decided all of a sudden he is a sports psychologist and that he can motivate better than the coach who has played in high pressure before. Complete BS what he did. And now to show he has some balls he's firing Nelsen. BS. He's an amateur and he's gotten us in a mess. Firing a manager at this stage never works. Typical TFC.

That's fine to have as an opinion but it carries little weight to me because the guy you're defending was never a coach. We hired a player.

He's not even an amateur coach (someone who retired and coached much lower levels like Dichio)

So if you don't like Bez as an "amateur" that's totally justified. But maybe you should apply that level of expectation and evaluation to the central defender we named as a "coach".

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:06 PM
Bez is an idiot. He's a 30 year old lawyer who decided all of a sudden he is a sports psychologist and that he can motivate better than the coach who has played in high pressure before. Complete BS what he did. And now to show he has some balls he's firing Nelsen. BS. He's an amateur and he's gotten us in a mess. Firing a manager at this stage never works. Typical TFC.

So put yourself in Bez' shoes. Assume that there wasn't a rift leading into this.

What exactly do you do when your coach makes front page headlines with his comments?

mcolvy
08-31-2014, 02:08 PM
I'll be the asshole and say this.

I'm glad he's fired.

I hope Defoe leaves

I don't care about where we finish in the standings cause it has nothing to do with our future.

I wish we had stayed with the Total football idea that we brought it and never let it get backstabbed. I wonder where we'd be right now.

This club is a mess…just like its been since day 1.

Every single person….from top Executive at MLSE right down to the supporters (myself included) should take some of the blame. We get what we pay for and demand.

THANK YOU.
I agree.... 100%

Scotiarae
08-31-2014, 02:08 PM
Bit of rumour that Defoe is being loaned to QPR???

portu
08-31-2014, 02:08 PM
in regards to bez being somewhat responsible i dont know what to think

i defintely side with nelsen in that bez shouldnt have stuck his nose in the first teams business so publicly, he is a gm when a move needs to be made or contracts need to be reorganized hes our guy but what does he know about "must-win games" from playing 15 odd matches in uslpro???

this is why i hate the two tier management system with a coach and a gm because a certain amount of cohesion is lost between management and coaching staffs

bottom line is we dont know if nelsen has asked for personnel upgrades so we dont know if bezs inactivity is a lack of ability or nelsen not wanting to disturb the dressing room

mcolvy
08-31-2014, 02:09 PM
If we could overpay and steal current MLS coaches right now, who would you want?

I want Porter or Vermes or Heaps.

Who would you want?

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:11 PM
Bit of rumour that Defoe is being loaned to QPR???
Yes, and its more than rumour. Defoe hates MLS, wants out.

portu
08-31-2014, 02:11 PM
dont like vermes or porter..

pareja or robinson

arena would be the penultimate imo

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:12 PM
So put yourself in Bez' shoes. Assume that there wasn't a rift leading into this.

What exactly do you do when your coach makes front page headlines with his comments?
Hey Pookie, how was the game yesterday?

mcolvy
08-31-2014, 02:13 PM
Yes, and its more than rumour. Defoe hates MLS, wants out.

Thanks for the concrete statement, but do you have any source.. where does this info come from that he just hates it? Like the lack of quality? playing times? media? Pretty general statement.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:14 PM
Why is the concept of a GM asking more from his team and players so foreign?

It happens ALL the time in sport.

Nelsen didn't get upset at Bez when he said that making the playoffs wasn't necessarily going to cost Nelsen his job. He didn't get upset when Tim L promised the playoffs. Here are some other fun Ryan Nelsen quotes:

On the pressure of playing in Toronto and the expectations of playoffs:

“I don’t have to tell them anything, they love it,” said Nelsen said Tuesday. “They thrive under it. This is what professional football is all about.” - Feb '14

“You want to push the limits,” added Nelsen. “You want to try and win every game. You want everybody to go after you and that’s how it’s going to be.” - Feb '14

"It doesn't matter who you put out on the field, the club's got to learn how to win ... we know we've got a long way to go…. I say that with one side of my face. The other side says if there's a group of guys that can live up to any expectations, I feel like these guys will really enjoy it and will enjoy the pressure."


"It will be different for them because we will have a target on our back. Everybody will want to beat us. Everybody wanted to play us because they knew they could beat us in the past. Now they'll want to play us because they will want to try to prove a point to beat us.

"It's a different mentality and it's going to be difficult. But it's a lovely challenge to be in." - Jan '14

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:15 PM
Hey Pookie, how was the game yesterday?

I watched it from my couch. Beer was good. you?

Canary10
08-31-2014, 02:16 PM
So put yourself in Bez' shoes. Assume that there wasn't a rift leading into this.

What exactly do you do when your coach makes front page headlines with his comments?

Bez did that by thinking his Toronto Sport and Social Club playing qualifies him to be an expertly motivator.

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:17 PM
It was one of the tickets I sold you Pookie.

cdnorman
08-31-2014, 02:18 PM
Canary- I agree that this never works and brings us back to square one. Nelsen wasn't great but we could win with him as the manager...

Agreed as well. This could deep six the entire season and it also gives the impression (which might be true) that the GM is thin-skinned and if you don't haul the party line, you're deep sixed. Doesn't bode well.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:18 PM
Bez did that by thinking his Toronto Sport and Social Club playing qualifies him to be an expertly motivator.

Well, hopefully the new guy doesn't come in and agitate anyone by suggesting that they need to try and win a few games.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:20 PM
It was one of the tickets I sold you Pookie.

Sorry dude. Whoever you sold it to wasn't me. I was no where near the game

pdubs
08-31-2014, 02:20 PM
Yes, and its more than rumour. Defoe hates MLS, wants out.

isn't this all based off this tweet?

Neil Davidson (https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson)
Verified account‏@NeilMDavidson
#torontofc (https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson) fires Ryan Nelsen and entire coaching staff. Jermain Defoe could be next to go -- to QPR -- in fallout of Leiweke departure.


And that tweet is pure speculation. "Could" doesn't sound concrete.
If this is not where you are getting your evidence from, then where is the evidence that it is more than a rumour as you say?

bman27
08-31-2014, 02:22 PM
Bez did that by thinking his Toronto Sport and Social Club playing qualifies him to be an expertly motivator.

It's not his job to motivate the players, but it is his job to set a standard for this team to be at. Can you honestly say that this team has been playing to it's full potential since the world cup? IMO we got found out tactically. If Bez as GM doesn't think we are where we need to be right now then all power to him.

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:22 PM
Sorry dude. Whoever you sold it to wasn't me. I was no where near the game
Wrong Pooky, sorry.

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:26 PM
isn't this all based off this tweet?

Neil Davidson (https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson)
Verified account‏@NeilMDavidson
(https://twitter.com/NeilMDavidson)#torontofc (https://twitter.com/hashtag/torontofc?src=hash) fires Ryan Nelsen and entire coaching staff. Jermain Defoe could be next to go -- to QPR -- in fallout of Leiweke departure.


And that tweet is pure speculation. "Could" doesn't sound concrete.
If this is not where you are getting your evidence from, then where is the evidence that it is more than a rumour as you say? Agreed, just rumour, let it go, where I heard this is not verifiable. Wait until 4pm.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 02:28 PM
Agreed, just rumour, let it go, where I heard this is not verifiable. Wait until 4pm.

If it does happen tho... and we don't have anyone of the same caliber lined up to replace Defoe... eep. Can't really justify that to the fans.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 02:30 PM
Nelsen was Payne's guy, never TL or Bez's.

My gut feeling is that Nelsen felt his feet to the fire and tried to shift the blame. The idea that the GM lost them the game by asking for the players to step us is garbage.

It was surprising that when TL remade the team he left the coaching staff in place, instead of bringing in a world class coach. Maybe he didn't have someone better available. Maybe he wanted to give Nelsen a chance (especially given Nelsen's contacts).

You can be sure that by now there is a plan, regardless of what "interim" happens. Bez has contacts throughout the league and internationally. I expect that he can get someone good.

notthesun
08-31-2014, 02:30 PM
https://twitter.com/callitfootball/status/506156395491000320

"Just two days ago was being told of rif between Nelsen and Bez. Big Tim was a fan. Little Tim thought he was not competent"

69Chevy396
08-31-2014, 02:36 PM
If it does happen tho... and we don't have anyone of the same caliber lined up to replace Defoe... eep. Can't really justify that to the fans.
Don't be so sure. Today is the close of the transfer window. Many options still available.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 02:47 PM
What's interesting to me is that if RN was a TL guy, this shows that TL is really here in name only. This 2015 is really just until a replacement is found. Bez is now in charge… fully.

Alonso
08-31-2014, 02:50 PM
So does anyone know how we can watch this announcement?

I don't see it up on their website.


bump

MightyDM
08-31-2014, 02:53 PM
This is very surprising. I'm kind of sad. I really wanted Nelsen to succeed here.



I agree.

notthesun
08-31-2014, 02:54 PM
What's interesting to me is that if RN was a TL guy, this shows that TL is really here in name only. This 2015 is really just until a replacement is found. Bez is now in charge… fully.

That was part of the announcement of his leaving, MLSE said until 2015 or a replacement is found. The latter is more accurate but the former is easier to report.

Alonso
08-31-2014, 02:55 PM
Maybe MLSE should have kept Lieweke happy instead of pushing him out the door.

Nelsen out.

Now rumblings that Defoe wants back to EPL.

Also rumblings that Bradely wants back to the US. Probably because what he was sold here is all leaving.

WTF?!?

Is TFC about to have the biggest laughing stock implosion ever or what?

Nuvinho
08-31-2014, 02:56 PM
Toronto FC ‏@torontofc now (https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/506166857909698560) Tune in to @CP24 (https://twitter.com/CP24) to catch the Press Conference starting at 4pm ET. #TFClive (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFClive?src=hash)

notthesun
08-31-2014, 02:56 PM
bump

TFC just tweeted it will be live on CP24

edit: ^Beat me to it.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 02:56 PM
If we could overpay and steal current MLS coaches right now, who would you want?

I want Porter or Vermes or Heaps.

Who would you want?
No thanks to Porter.

Heaps is very, very, impressive IMO. He runs a great squad for a terrible owner. Pareja would be top of my list (great scout, good with youth academy, plays attractive football) but he's not going anywhere.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 02:57 PM
Toronto FC ‏@torontofc (https://twitter.com/torontofc) 1m (https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/506166857909698560)
Tune in to @CP24 (https://twitter.com/CP24) to catch the Press Conference starting at 4pm ET. #TFClive (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFClive?src=hash)

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 02:57 PM
TFC just tweeted it will be live on CP24
Anywhere else picking this up? I'm outside of the area and I don't get CP24

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 02:58 PM
What's interesting to me is that if RN was a TL guy, this shows that TL is really here in name only. This 2015 is really just until a replacement is found. Bez is now in charge… fully.

RN was never a TL guy, he was a Payne guy. Duane doesn't have much information these days, he's on the outs with TFC since his own man, Mr. Shorty-Pants was fired.

Kaz
08-31-2014, 02:59 PM
I'll be interested in seeing how much of the staff stays.. like for example Jimmy B and Stewart Kerr.

RealG-TFC
08-31-2014, 03:00 PM
I think so. Not only Nelsen but the entire coaching staff. We're done, at least for the rest of the year.

sully
08-31-2014, 03:00 PM
Any online link to the 4pm press conference?

boozilla
08-31-2014, 03:01 PM
Anywhere else picking this up? I'm outside of the area and I don't get CP24
Don't worry, you've seen that movie several times already.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:01 PM
nevermind...

notthesun
08-31-2014, 03:01 PM
RN was never a TL guy, he was a Payne guy. Duane doesn't have much information these days, he's on the outs with TFC since his own man, Mr. Shorty-Pants was fired.

Ben Rycroft has also said he's heard Leiweke was a big fan of Nelsen, but Bez wasn't. Given Leiweke's bullishness when he came on board about keeping Nelsen I don't doubt it.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:01 PM
need to at least wait out for the press conference see where we stand. probably on one leg.

RealG-TFC
08-31-2014, 03:03 PM
EDIT: Nevermind, happened earlier in season

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:03 PM
Let's remember that the guys playing for us are professionals, and many very talented professionals at that. A wake up call and a fresh start could be exactly what many on this team need.

speckles
08-31-2014, 03:06 PM
Canary- I agree that this never works and brings us back to square one. Nelsen wasn't great but we could win with him as the manager...

Actually he is the best coach we have had todate, the players have sucked. They way they have played in the last month suggest a lot of BS behind the scenes...we were improving up to that time. Us as supporters will pay the price. Pathetic management..there are many ways to assert your authority rather than this. They will have to pay over the top to get a decent manager if one is prepared to come here at all.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 03:07 PM
Actually he is the best coach we have had todate, the players have sucked. They way they have played in the last month suggest a lot of BS behind the scenes...we were improving up to that time. Us as supporters will pay the price. Pathetic management..there are many ways to assert your authority rather than this. They will have to pay over the top to get a decent manager if one is prepared to come here at all.

Chris Cummins is the best coach we had but Mo didn't like him. The record does not lie.

Super
08-31-2014, 03:08 PM
So I guess they are not live streaming the press conference?

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 03:08 PM
http://www.thestar.com/sports/tfc/2014/08/31/toronto_fc_fires_coach_ryan_nelsen_staff.html

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:09 PM
also

Toronto FC ‏@torontofc (https://twitter.com/torontofc) 55s (https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/506169849643823104)
RT @TSN_Sports (https://twitter.com/TSN_Sports): TSN.ca will have the presser at 4 p.m. #tfclive (https://twitter.com/hashtag/tfclive?src=hash)

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:10 PM
also

Toronto FC ‏@torontofc (https://twitter.com/torontofc) 55s (https://twitter.com/torontofc/status/506169849643823104)
RT @TSN_Sports (https://twitter.com/TSN_Sports): TSN.ca will have the presser at 4 p.m. #tfclive (https://twitter.com/hashtag/tfclive?src=hash)
Thanks! Much appreciated.

jabbronies
08-31-2014, 03:12 PM
The more I think about this - I'm not 100% comfortable with this whole situation. Feels like the same old BS that we've been through all these years now.

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 03:12 PM
Actually he is the best coach we have had todate, the players have sucked. They way they have played in the last month suggest a lot of BS behind the scenes...we were improving up to that time. Us as supporters will pay the price. Pathetic management..there are many ways to assert your authority rather than this. They will have to pay over the top to get a decent manager if one is prepared to come here at all.

The best coach we've had is a guy that never coached a day in his life before he came here?

Really?

I disagree 100%

He'd be among the worst coaches we've ever had. I don't even call him a coach. Not only was a he a former player….he was a current player that we named as a coach.

jabbronies
08-31-2014, 03:13 PM
http://www.tsn.ca/

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:14 PM
The best coach we've had is a guy that never coached a day in his life before he came here?

Really?

I disagree 100%

He'd be among the worst coaches we've ever had. I don't even call him a coach. Not only was a he a former player….he was a current player that we named as a coach.

Who was better?

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:14 PM
everybody else seeing the "live coverage to begin shortly" screen?

Relja
08-31-2014, 03:14 PM
any updates? Tsn.ca is not showing anything same with cp24 here in misssisauga?

Alonso
08-31-2014, 03:14 PM
everybody else seeing the "live coverage to begin shortly" screen?


Yup, that's all I am seeing.

Nuvinho
08-31-2014, 03:15 PM
on cp24 now

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 03:15 PM
Who was better?

Chris Cummins.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:15 PM
presser just started. Vanney in as interim.

notthesun
08-31-2014, 03:16 PM
Conference just started. Vanney confirmed.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
Chris Cummins.

Cummins had an ultra talented team for that point in MLS and couldn't make the playoffs. He lost the dressing room completely when Robinson went down, who most on the inside have said was the one who was basically the coach anyway. Cummins was not better than Nelsen.

portu
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
bez looks nervous as fuck

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
Who was better?
Chris Cummings, Preki, and Carver (barely).

Carver could design a set play that could score a goal, Nelsen can't despite this team competing on an athletic level which is a huge red flag.

Chris Cummings got us within one game of the playoffs despite have ZERO control over his roster and being actively undermined by Johnson at the same time. He said if they had offered him the full time job he would have told them where to put it.

Preki is an asshole, he plays brutal soccer, but his teams are well organized.

But none of these coaches are good enough.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
EDIT: Vanney not in as interim. He's been given the full head-coaching gig.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:17 PM
omg not interm. So another guy with no First Team Head manager experience?

notthesun
08-31-2014, 03:18 PM
Vanney NOT interim.

portu
08-31-2014, 03:18 PM
vanney is full time head coach

Kaz
08-31-2014, 03:18 PM
The more I think about this - I'm not 100% comfortable with this whole situation. Feels like the same old BS that we've been through all these years now.

I feel you... but this change should have been made in the off season, with Nelsen being offered a Assisting position until he learns the ropes.(which he likely wouldn't have taken)

He feels like Carver all over again... the silver lining is that Cummins wasn't bad. I'm holding onto that little bit of hope.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:19 PM
Bez on Nelsen's comments yesterday: "they were just excuses. We're not in the excuse business here".

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:21 PM
Watching the presser. Whether you liked Nelsen or not we all know this is BS. We all know this doesn't work either (as Norwich showed last year). This is Titanic time.

portu
08-31-2014, 03:22 PM
this screams of politics

Relja
08-31-2014, 03:22 PM
hire radomir antic you heard it here first

Qman
08-31-2014, 03:22 PM
i hope he has a replacement already lined up

I here Aron Winter is available

Cashcleaner
08-31-2014, 03:23 PM
Just got back in from being out of town and I'll be honest, this does not come as any surprise to me. A few remarks from the presser after yesterday's game and a few other statements made prior to the match really spoke volumes about Nelsen and his relationship with the club.

I think this could actually be for the best, though I'll admit the timing doesn't help. Changing coaches this far into the season and with our current position in the standings isn't going to help the prospect of a playoff run, but there have been plenty of times this year when I really felt Nelsen just wasn't capable of getting the most out of the roster we have. We have been under-performing and I absolutely feel Nelsen deserves to shoulder some of the blame for that.

More than anything else, I get the feeling that MLSE feels it needs TFC to make the playoffs more than it ever did.

Kaz
08-31-2014, 03:23 PM
omg not interm. So another guy with no First Team Head manager experience?
The difference is he has some experience in something.. but ya.. an experienced coach would be nice. It's been what 5 years since we had a coach start with first team experiences (not counting Mariner who was a train wreck) (though in his first 10 games he picked up a few wins and not so many loses before teams figured him out... if Varney can do that well in the last 10 matches we might stand a chance of making the playoffs)

speckles
08-31-2014, 03:23 PM
[QUOTE=v00d00daddy;1691030]The best coach we've had is a guy that never coached a day in his life before he came here?

Really?


Well you bias here resulting in most people not responding to you, just a good laugh instead. Look at this years record and who he brought in. unfortunately injuries have caused a tipping point in the season..now where do we go this season... unless little Tim has something lined up we are screwed.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:24 PM
Did they not have time to set up a proper press table?

It looks like they are holding the press conference in the corner of a denny's

sully
08-31-2014, 03:24 PM
This is a train wreck. Fire an inexperience coach and replace with another inexperienced coach. This will get worse before it gets better. He believes in 'the canadian player'? What does that mean? He should believe in all the players! This next coach will be a disaster based on this teleconference so far..

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:25 PM
Bez: the club has received multiple offers for Defoe. They will discuss the offer(s) over the next 24 hours.

Relja
08-31-2014, 03:25 PM
This is a train wreck. Fire an inexperience coach and replace with another inexperienced coach. This will get worse before it gets better. He believes in 'the canadian player'? What does that mean? He should believe in all the players! This next coach will be a disaster based on this teleconference so far..

sadly agree

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:25 PM
This is a train wreck. Fire an inexperience coach and replace with another inexperienced coach. This will get worse before it gets better. He believes in 'the canadian player'? What does that mean? He should believe in all the players! This next coach will be a disaster based on this teleconference so far..


The question was about which canadian and acadamey players could contribute. He was the Acadamy director... it was a pertinent question with a proper answer.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:25 PM
Jermain has left to have his injury checked out.
They have received many offers but one they are discussing over the next 24 hours.

Writing meet the wall.

Red4ever
08-31-2014, 03:26 PM
Not sure I care for Bez.

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:26 PM
Bez: the club has received multiple offers for Defoe. They will discuss the offer(s) over the next 24 hours.

He's gone clearly

cdnorman
08-31-2014, 03:27 PM
Jermain has left to have his injury checked out.
They have received many offers but one they are discussing over the next 24 hours.

Writing meet the wall.

And Harry Redknapp is looking to add to his team before the transfer window ends tomorrow.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:27 PM
Jermain has left to have his injury checked out.
They have received many offers but one they are discussing over the next 24 hours.

Writing meet the wall.
Agreed. He's done.

RealG-TFC
08-31-2014, 03:27 PM
There's no way we keep Defoe. Saying that we are "in talks with his people" cannot be a good thing.

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:27 PM
Bez clearly does not know what he's doing.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 03:27 PM
Bradley staying.

Kaz
08-31-2014, 03:28 PM
Jermain has left to have his injury checked out.
They have received many offers but one they are discussing over the next 24 hours.

Writing meet the wall.

Sadly I'm sorry to see him go.. if this was just an injury that was never properly dealt with, and he gets that help.. I will be more so. Could you imagine he heals up.. and then goes then next two years serious injury free. That would suck arse.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:28 PM
Watching the presser. Whether you liked Nelsen or not we all know this is BS. We all know this doesn't work either (as Norwich showed last year). This is Titanic time.

I disagree.

Bez putting a stamp on the team. Clear direction. Maybe Defoe out. Again, tough decision but they aren't waffling. Just making decisions they need to.

I may end up buying tickets next year… pretty optimistic… probably a few available too.

BBLaw
08-31-2014, 03:28 PM
No wonder the stands are half empty. This is an amateur organization in a professional city. Is anyone surprised? Another manager with no experience. Infighting(again!) Change the faces, same ol' TFC. They'll probably kick Defoe to the curb now. MLSE is an absolute joke.

What a disaster.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:29 PM
Bez clearly does not know what he's doing.

How do you get that from this at all?

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:30 PM
I disagree.

Bez putting a stamp on the team. Clear direction. Maybe Defoe out. Again, tough decision but they aren't waffling. Just making decisions they need to.

I may end up buying tickets next year… pretty optimistic… probably a few available too.

He made up the direction yesterday after the NE game.

speckles
08-31-2014, 03:30 PM
Well no serious plan B Tim..just politics at best or management by ego..seriously bad. Watch the key players jump ship now. New coach bounce is our only hope this season.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:30 PM
I wonder if Vanney will give DeRo some minutes in the midfield… 20-25 a game sounds about right.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:30 PM
He made up the direction yesterday after the NE game.

That's what he says. You really think the Defoe conversation hasn't been on for weeks now?

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:31 PM
How do you get that from this at all?

First he says they planned this yet Vanney hasn't considered one thing related to staff, etc. This happened last night.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:32 PM
How hard is it to put a microphone near the chairs… there have to be what… 10 people there?

speckles
08-31-2014, 03:32 PM
I disagree.

Bez putting a stamp on the team. Clear direction. Maybe Defoe out. Again, tough decision but they aren't waffling. Just making decisions they need to.

I may end up buying tickets next year… pretty optimistic… probably a few available too. This is a manger who said his coach was doing a good job four weeks ago. No class manger is going to come here.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:32 PM
Bez is just treading the line carefully.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 03:33 PM
I wonder if Vanney will give DeRo some minutes in the midfield… 20-25 a game sounds about right.

Ha Ha. We would truly be lost then.

Morlesio14
08-31-2014, 03:33 PM
I don't give a flying fuck who the coach is I wanna win. In bed we trust right. Fuck nelsen anyway

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:33 PM
"Not letting the other team dictate things, let's go at them"

THANK YOU. At least there's something I like about this presser. They want to actually play like a dominant team rather than a relegation battler.

Qman
08-31-2014, 03:33 PM
Bez clearly does not know what he's doing.

This has been obvious since the start of the season.

They need to hire a superboss manager who coaches and is the GM ... directs overall direction of the club - player recruitment, style of play, etc. Maybe they can get Bob Bradley away from his Norway club.

notthesun
08-31-2014, 03:33 PM
https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/506174976668745728

"Bez says Bradley not going anywhere."

... for now.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:34 PM
Armen Bedakian ‏@ArmenBedakian (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian) 48s (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian/status/506176080848642048)
Greg Vanney finally addresses the elephant in the room: too much back passing, too much building from the back. #TFC (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFC?src=hash) #MLS (https://twitter.com/hashtag/MLS?src=hash)

I agree with this. Vanney is saying all the right things and it sounds good. Problem is he has basically no experience doing this.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:34 PM
This is a manger who said his coach was doing a good job four weeks ago. No class manger is going to come here.
Because that's never happened before in professional sports right?

Vanny is basically undressing Nelsen's tactics right now and he's right. Now he's not the person I want replacing him - would rather have someone experienced - but at least this expresses an understanding of the way football has been played in the last 25 years.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:35 PM
Armen Bedakian ‏@ArmenBedakian (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian) 48s (https://twitter.com/ArmenBedakian/status/506176080848642048)
Greg Vanney finally addresses the elephant in the room: too much back passing, too much building from the back. #TFC (https://twitter.com/hashtag/TFC?src=hash) #MLS (https://twitter.com/hashtag/MLS?src=hash)

I agree with this. Vanney is saying all the right things and it sounds good. Problem is he has basically no experience doing this.
I don't think it was building from the back per say. It was more so we sit back and wait to counter and have no other plan. I've thought this for some time.

Kaz
08-31-2014, 03:36 PM
First he says they planned this yet Vanney hasn't considered one thing related to staff, etc. This happened last night.

I don't think they planned to fire him until after the game yesterday after Nelsen's comments. I really think Nelsen is the reason the boys were effected by Bez words. I'm willing to bet that he went in there and said shit he shouldn't have and just left the players blah. Nelsen gave up. And he was canned.. I'm betting someone in the locker room isn't happy with him, and said so after the game to Bez.

Be it Bradley, or DeRo or someone else... it was not great.

My hope is that Bradley has been unhappy with Nelsen, and his lackluster play has been a result of that.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:36 PM
5pm transfer window tomorrow.

I speculated that the Defoe situation wouldn't play out until the end of the season. I recant that. Sorry folks. I was wrong.

portu
08-31-2014, 03:37 PM
the more i think about this the more i think that bez brought in vanney 6 months ago knowing that he would take over from nelsen as soon as he had a reason

sully
08-31-2014, 03:38 PM
I'd love an experienced head coach who's a proven winner, takes responsibility for losses, is a strong personality and doesn't talk shite. Is that that hard to find? Vanny is none of those things. Very disappointed.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:38 PM
I wonder if we'll see a reshuffling of playing time after this.

PopePouri
08-31-2014, 03:39 PM
Because that's never happened before in professional sports right?

Vanny is basically undressing Nelsen's tactics right now and he's right. Now he's not the person I want replacing him - would rather have someone experienced - but at least this expresses an understanding of the way football has been played in the last 25 years.

Nelsen's fucking around with Warner and Bradley basically lost him his job.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 03:40 PM
Vanney understands tactics, much more than Nelsen has. He also has actual coaching experience, although not at this level. That being said, I would prefer first team experience.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:41 PM
I'd love an experienced head coach who's a proven winner, takes responsibility for losses, is a strong personality and doesn't talk shite. Is that that hard to find? Vanny is none of those things. Very disappointed.

How do you know he's none of those things except highly experienced? Yet again, made up negative facts rule the narrative.

billyfly
08-31-2014, 03:41 PM
Good riddance.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:41 PM
Nelsen's fucking around with Warner and Bradley basically lost him his job.
Agreed.

Vanney just addressed having "more defined roles" again. Nelsen definitely did not get the middle of the park sorted. They pulley system was garbage and yesterday was just another example of it.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:42 PM
Vanney understands tactics, much more than Nelsen has. He also has actual coaching experience, although not at this level. That being said, I would prefer first team experience.

So would I. I just don't think there's anyone out there right now. On the upside, somoene working in tandem with a very capable guy like Bez can't be a bad thing. Vanney and Bez are definitely on the same page.

RealG-TFC
08-31-2014, 03:42 PM
I always thought we should have signed Gila anyway.

Canary10
08-31-2014, 03:43 PM
That's what he says. You really think the Defoe conversation hasn't been on for weeks now?

I think you're conflating some things. I get that you wanted Defoe out, that's fine. But doing you think this coaching change was even remotely thought out? That they were so impressed with Greg Vanney as a coaching saviour that they just had to get him in charge?

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:44 PM
To me, I'm cautiously optmostic about Vanney. He could see very clealry what the problems were with this team under Nelsen and said a lot of good things about how to improve this team. In the long-term, he also sees the importance of a good academy.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:45 PM
I always thought we should have signed Gila anyway.
We need to stop buying into somebody else's brand and picking up guys on the back end of their career. You can go to South America or middle rung european leagues and pick up very high quality players who have 6-8 years of high level football left, don't have the same level of injury risk, and can perform in this league.

I don't want anybody I've heard of before they show up here. I want people coming to watch TFC, not "guy from my country that used to be good".

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 03:47 PM
I think you're conflating some things. I get that you wanted Defoe out, that's fine. But doing you think this coaching change was even remotely thought out? That they were so impressed with Greg Vanney as a coaching saviour that they just had to get him in charge?
There is no way he gets approval to let Nelsen go unless he's walked the more senior people through it or kept them up to date about what expectations are. He's too new to have the ability to pull the trigger on it himself.

I'm surprised they did it this quickly but Nelsen unloading yesterday after the presser makes more sense in the context that he knew he was done.

RealG-TFC
08-31-2014, 03:48 PM
Not because he was the other option, but because it seems as if he would have been a better fit with Gilberto. We all knew the Defoe-Gilberto partnership wasn't going to work. We had heard Gilberto liked to play up top.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:49 PM
I think you're conflating some things. I get that you wanted Defoe out, that's fine. But doing you think this coaching change was even remotely thought out? That they were so impressed with Greg Vanney as a coaching saviour that they just had to get him in charge?


I have to think that since Bez didn't hire Nelsen there was always an element of "proof" that RN had to exhibit. TB did hire Vanney though so there is a level of trust and don't think that he didn't contemplate the idea that this day would eventually come.

Most new GMs will come in and eventually replace staff with their own.

Not to oversimplify it but there is a cycle and it all relates to buying time. Sports management always carries an element of self preservation.

New GM gives the existing staff time because it is a no lose situation. If the existing staff wins, everyone is happy. If they lose, they can be moved, the GM says that it wasn't his guy and replacements happen. More time is given.

Bez is now on the clock though. In not making Vanney interim, he is hitching his ride to Greg. He might be able to squeeze one more coaching change out of it but with Defoe leaving, I suspect his clock will be skipping ahead a few hours.

I don't think for a second that Bez felt RN was his coach forever. I suspect he was tired of "excuses" as he noted in his press conference and seized the corner backing situation that RN put him in to put his own plan into play.

speckles
08-31-2014, 03:49 PM
It is easier to talk the talk on tactics..the issue is theses players have not demonstrated consistently the ability to do what is required and especially Brady post-op. Current he is going nowhere as I suspect on current form no one may want him.

pdubs
08-31-2014, 03:50 PM
maybe Vanney will get a true DP CAM in the next window. Could be interesting. Mean time survey says we implode down the stretch this season.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 03:50 PM
This move is cover your ass shite. Things aren't going well, fire the coach (which shifts blame to him), hire a new one (to show you are doing something) and if things don't end well you can't be called a "do-nothing manager" which means you are totally to blame. This move is the second worst move in TFC history. It is right behind Aron Winter and the hiring of Paul Mariner. This new guy is too full of clichés for my liking.

adam1001
08-31-2014, 03:50 PM
To me, I'm cautiously optmostic about Vanney. He could see very clealry what the problems were with this team under Nelsen and said a lot of good things about how to improve this team. In the long-term, he also sees the importance of a good academy.
I'm thoroughly convinced that my beer league coach can run a team better than Nelsen. Vanney must be an upgrade.

cdnorman
08-31-2014, 03:51 PM
Jermain has left to have his injury checked out.
They have received many offers but one they are discussing over the next 24 hours.

Writing meet the wall.

And Harry Redknapp is looking to add to his team before the transfer window ends tomorrow.

sully
08-31-2014, 03:53 PM
Because of how he came across in the conference and because he's got no high level experience to speak of. Bez talked about results being what matterd but new coach hasnt won anything of significance according to wiki. He's an experiment. Good luck to him. Its my sense he will fail, I hope i'm wrong, but seems to me he's a "yes man" for Bez.

Redcoe15
08-31-2014, 03:53 PM
*SIGH* :facepalm:

Sometimes I think the soccer gods hate Toronto with a white hot passion.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:53 PM
This move is cover your ass shite. Things aren't going well, fire the coach (which shifts blame to him), hire a new one (to show you are doing something) and if things don't end well you can't be called a "do-nothing manager" which means you are totally to blame. This move is the second worst move in TFC history. It is right behind Aron Winter and the hiring of Paul Mariner. This new guy is too full of clichés for my liking.

Brendan Rodgers is more full of cliches than a Death Wish movie.

I don't see how this was a bad hire. Something had to be done. After yesterday, Nelsen just wasn't going to cut it. what did you want them to do?

PopePouri
08-31-2014, 03:54 PM
Agreed.

Vanney just addressed having "more defined roles" again. Nelsen definitely did not get the middle of the park sorted. They pulley system was garbage and yesterday was just another example of it.

Right. Everybody with a little bit of tactical sense understands that we needed a designated holder. Yet, Nelsen and his coaching staff couldn't figure that out.


It is easier to talk the talk on tactics..the issue is theses players have not demonstrated consistently the ability to do what is required and especially Brady post-op. Current he is going nowhere as I suspect on current form no one may want him.

That's all on Nelsen's tactics. Bradley can be better if Nelsen hadn't leashed him.

Pookie
08-31-2014, 03:54 PM
QPR reportedly offering $11M

shwade
08-31-2014, 03:55 PM
Oh man. I would've taken Aron Winter back in a heartbeat pre season. At least the guy understood tactics and was trying to implement a system, from the bottom up.

starter
08-31-2014, 03:56 PM
Since he is not an interim, when is Vanney contract will run to?

I wonder if Bez repeating Paynes mistake here with rookie coach?

He could have had Laudrup, who ended up in Qatar.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:57 PM
QPR reportedly offering $11M

if it was during the MLS transfer window I'd say bite their fucking hand off... But now that we can't bring in a replacement I'm not sure.

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 03:57 PM
[QUOTE=v00d00daddy;1691030]The best coach we've had is a guy that never coached a day in his life before he came here?

Really?


Well you bias here resulting in most people not responding to you, just a good laugh instead. Look at this years record and who he brought in. unfortunately injuries have caused a tipping point in the season..now where do we go this season... unless little Tim has something lined up we are screwed.

You can laugh all you want. You can call me biased too. I'm curious to know what you say my bias is. I've admitted to be biased many times. We all are.

That being said…you justify Nelsen being the best coach based on the record (which is fake considering we're being caught and we're the only eastern playoff team that concedes more goals than they score even though we score a lot) by saying "look at the players he's brought in"????

1. Who did he bring it?

2. Is bringing in players the coaches job?

I think we expect different things from coaches. I expect good tactics. Good adjustments to tactics if what you've chosen isn't working. Good player selection based on positional ability and proper substitutions and use of depth on the roster.

I think he has sucked since day one on all of those.

What the Tims spent on Defoe, Gilberto and Bradley extended Nelsen's coaching life and masked his lack of ability to coach.

A player who is still taking off his cleats while you're handing him the coaching job is a bad idea and it was done merely for optics and to keep supporters quiet. It failed but you're still defending him.

So…tell me my bias and tell me which points of mine are wrong.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 03:59 PM
Oh man. I would've taken Aron Winter back in a heartbeat pre season. At least the guy understood tactics and was trying to implement a system, from the bottom up.

Winter was hands down our second worst coach after Mo. Winter's idea of tactics was having our right FB launch long balls to Plata. Because Winter was dutch we all thought he knew how to implement their tactics. Winter had worse tactical acumen than Nelsen.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 04:00 PM
Oh man. I would've taken Aron Winter back in a heartbeat pre season. At least the guy understood tactics and was trying to implement a system, from the bottom up.

I wouldn't. What he wanted was way over the head of most MLS players, and his man-management was abysmal.
Besides, you can play smart, tactically sound football without the need to get quite so complex. I'm also not quite convinced he knew Dutch football tactics as much as we were sold.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 04:00 PM
Brendan Rodgers is more full of cliches than a Death Wish movie.

I don't see how this was a bad hire. Something had to be done. After yesterday, Nelsen just wasn't going to cut it. what did you want them to do?

He is a bad hire because we fired a coach with only 10 games to go, he has no head coaching experience and he was a defender. The last two reasons are why some wanted to get rid of Nelson. Besides I hate clichés which is reason enough. More fodder for the firing squad.

Bardown Snipes
08-31-2014, 04:00 PM
If TFC loses Defoe, we're done. He is the star of the team and without him, we do not play well. Having Gilberto isn't enough to bring the team to the playoffs. This was probably the worst time to fire Ryan Nelsen. There is a month left and 30 points on the line, bringing in another inexperienced coach is not going to help TFC make the post season. While I agree, Nelsen hasn't been doing the best job, he was still winning games and brought us this far. If he really needed to be fired, it should have been done in the off season and not with a month to go. MLSE has really messed up big on this one.

TFC07
08-31-2014, 04:04 PM
If TFC loses Defoe, we're done. He is the star of the team and without him, we do not play well. Having Gilberto isn't enough to bring the team to the playoffs. This was probably the worst time to fire Ryan Nelsen. There is a month left and 30 points on the line, bringing in another inexperienced coach is not going to help TFC make the post season. While I agree, Nelsen hasn't been doing the best job, he was still winning games and brought us this far. If he really needed to be fired, it should have been done in the off season and not with a month to go. MLSE has really messed up big on this one.

When was the last time TFC won a game? When was last time we won at home?

Nelsen had to go especially after yesterday's performance where players looked like they lost hope.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 04:04 PM
Can we all just stop assuming we for sure we're not going to make the playoffs.

Like I said before, We went four wins four draws two losses in our first ten under Mariner. Jeremy Hall, Eckersley, Silva, Morgan etc. all looked like world beaters.

anything can happen over the next ten games.

Oldtimer
08-31-2014, 04:04 PM
he was still winning games One home game out of six is "winning?"
An average MLS team will outright win half their home games.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 04:07 PM
One home game out of six is "winning?"
An average MLS team will outright win half their home games.

The new guy hasn't won anything at all

mcolvy
08-31-2014, 04:08 PM
The one thing Nelsen did have right was that Morgan was useless.. Vanney may turn to him based on his Canadian status..

spark
08-31-2014, 04:08 PM
Cummins had an ultra talented team for that point in MLS and couldn't make the playoffs. He lost the dressing room completely when Robinson went down, who most on the inside have said was the one who was basically the coach anyway. Cummins was not better than Nelsen.

His winning percentage says otherwise!

CUMMINS STILL #1!!!!

Beach_Red
08-31-2014, 04:08 PM
No wonder the stands are half empty. This is an amateur organization in a professional city. Is anyone surprised? Another manager with no experience. Infighting(again!) Change the faces, same ol' TFC. They'll probably kick Defoe to the curb now. MLSE is an absolute joke.

What a disaster.

What makes this a professional city? It wants to be, sure, but is it? A few banks and telcos protected from foreign competition and a bunch of sports teams that can't make the playoffs....

Pookie
08-31-2014, 04:08 PM
If TFC loses Defoe, we're done. He is the star of the team and without him, we do not play well. Having Gilberto isn't enough to bring the team to the playoffs. This was probably the worst time to fire Ryan Nelsen. There is a month left and 30 points on the line, bringing in another inexperienced coach is not going to help TFC make the post season. While I agree, Nelsen hasn't been doing the best job, he was still winning games and brought us this far. If he really needed to be fired, it should have been done in the off season and not with a month to go. MLSE has really messed up big on this one.

Respectfully disagree.

TFC doesn't have Defoe right now. He's supposedly hurt.

Secondly, Defoe isn't even in Toronto anymore. Quite a bit of this rests on his shoulders. MLS may not have been his Cup of tea. It sounds as if his people have been putting out feelers for months now about a return to England.

I hope Bez has the courage to make a football decision here in the best interests of this team. I think he will and I think Jermain is as good as gone.

speckles
08-31-2014, 04:09 PM
Well we will see how the players respond, see if they start to pass accurately and actually run hard under a new coach:-) Total lack of professionalism in the last game. That comes from within not the coach. Need someone upfront if Defoe is gone. Dero has had his chance first half of the season..his legs were gone so now we have suggestions everywhere he could make the difference...we will see. At least it will be dramatic for the last part of the season.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 04:10 PM
Respectfully disagree.

TFC doesn't have Defoe right now. He's supposedly hurt.

Secondly, Defoe isn't even in Toronto anymore. Quite a bit of this rests on his shoulders. MLS may not have been his Cup of tea. It sounds as if his people have been putting out feelers for months now about a return to England.

I hope Bez has the courage to make a football decision here in the best interests of this team. I think he will and I think Jermain is as good as gone.
Yeah, I might venture a guess that if Leiweke was still around he would have waited until the off season to leave but with all the change afoot and QPR making a bid he decided he could leave early.

That's really something people should consider. Leiweke could still be here and Defoe decides this isn't for him.

portu
08-31-2014, 04:10 PM
Guys regardless of what we think of the appointment we still need to support our club. The reality is we still have playoffs in sight and anything is possible. We need to have faith and give our full support to the team whenever they take the pitch. We have no control over who comes to and leaves this club but we do have control over how much enthusiasm and support we give at each and every match our boys play, and we can only hope that enthusiasm and support creates a positive atmosphere in which our players can latch onto. In the end we are fans and we've gotta do what good fans do best, have faith and support their club to the fullest regardless of circumstance.

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 04:11 PM
Winter was hands down our second worst coach after Mo. Winter's idea of tactics was having our right FB launch long balls to Plata. Because Winter was dutch we all thought he knew how to implement their tactics. Winter had worse tactical acumen than Nelsen.

Hahaha.

Better player than Nelsen ever was and actually went through coaching build up.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I'll take a Dutch based football trained mind who actually coached over a guy like Nelsen any day.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 04:11 PM
I think we should fire Vanney now before things go bad. Admit we made a mistake and hire a new coach or even the old one back. Fire him before its too late.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 04:12 PM
Well we will see how the players respond, see if they start to pass accurately and actually run hard under a new coach:-) Total lack of professionalism in the last game. That comes from within not the coach. Need someone upfront if Defoe is gone. Dero has had his chance first half of the season..his legs were gone so now we have suggestions everywhere he could make the difference...we will see. At least it will be dramatic for the last part of the season.
He didn't look great but let's take into account he was taking directions from a tactical luddite of a coach.

He had Dero playing with his back to goal like a centre forward playing off Defoe, it was entirely ridiculous. Get the guy the ball at his feet and see what he can do with it FFS, that's how he's made his living his entire MLS career.

BBLaw
08-31-2014, 04:15 PM
Yeah, I might venture a guess that if Leiweke was still around he would have waited until the off season to leave but with all the change afoot and QPR making a bid he decided he could leave early.

That's really something people should consider. Leiweke could still be here and Defoe decides this isn't for him.

Defoe realized how much of a sham MLSE is and wants to force his way out, Bradley will be next and I can't blame either of them. A bunch of suits from two giant media conglomerates who hate each other trying to run four sports franchises simultaneously is an absolute disaster.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 04:16 PM
Winter was hands down our second worst coach after Mo. Winter's idea of tactics was having our right FB launch long balls to Plata. Because Winter was dutch we all thought he knew how to implement their tactics. Winter had worse tactical acumen than Nelsen.
Winter's biggest problem's were:

1) He didn't understand the level of MLS
2) He didn't understand north american players

I can believe his tactics would have worked if he better understood his environment and had a better ability to bring in players. Having a vision and implementing it are fundamentally different. I think Winter "gets it" he just doesn't fit here.

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 04:16 PM
Guys regardless of what we think of the appointment we still need to support our club. The reality is we still have playoffs in sight and anything is possible. We need to have faith and give our full support to the team whenever they take the pitch. We have no control over who comes to and leaves this club but we do have control over how much enthusiasm and support we give at each and every match our boys play, and we can only hope that enthusiasm and support creates a positive atmosphere in which our players can latch onto. In the end we are fans and we've gotta do what good fans do best, have faith and support their club to the fullest regardless of circumstance.

Totally agree on the sentiment but I'm sure we'd disagree on the definition of support. I think the club should know full well that the people that fill the seats, watch on tv, buy the jerseys and talk online about them are pissed off and expect more.

For the record…I don't mean we should boo the players on the field or stuff like that. But to cheer louder and louder, regardless of what they've done to us is not my cup of tea. LOL

v00d00daddy
08-31-2014, 04:18 PM
Winter's biggest problem's were:

1) He didn't understand the level of MLS
2) He didn't understand north american players

I can believe his tactics would have worked if he better understood his environment and had a better ability to bring in players. Having a vision and implementing it are fundamentally different. I think Winter "gets it" he just doesn't fit here.

I agree. I think firing him was justified. I would have liked to have kept the mentality that came along with him though.

I also think we should add:

3) He didn't understand dealing with an assistant GM that wanted to be head coach and would backstab him at every opportunity.

tfcfans
08-31-2014, 04:18 PM
Can't wait for the renewal dates to be pushed until November while they wait and see (pray?!) if they make the playoffs and then gouge us on a ST price increase for next year ----- and if Defoe is gone and they fail to make it, are they freezing prices again (not bloody likely!)? I think lots of supporters will bail if they increase yellows and light grays to match their prices from 3-4 years ago (which is about double their current price which frankly was a tremendous deal this year and hence why many people renewed before the signings!). With another 8,000-10,000 seats to sell, supply will sorely outstrip demand if the prices get jacked up in the cheaper sections. Most supporters that I speak with stuck around because they could get "cheaper" tickets ($10-$12 a game!), if that carrot is gone and the "buzz" leaves, empty seats will abound in our larger stadium next year. We got "real grass" from the Edu transfer, does the Defoe transfer start to pay for a roof? If we can sell a few more players we might get a proper stadium by 2025!! ;)

cdnorman
08-31-2014, 04:20 PM
Can we all just stop assuming we for sure we're not going to make the playoffs.

Like I said before, We went four wins four draws two losses in our first ten under Mariner. Jeremy Hall, Eckersley, Silva, Morgan etc. all looked like world beaters.

anything can happen over the next ten games.

Agreed. I'm not that happy with this, but Bez made a point that it is because there are 10 games left that he made his choice. There are up to 30 points available. That's a lot and, who knows, Vanney might be the catalyst to get things working. Of course, without Defoe that might negate whatever good things he brings in given the MLS transfer window is done and we're left with what we have.

However, Defoe's been out a lot and frankly, if the guys are firing on all cylinders (and reasonably healthy) I believe they'll make the playoffs.

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 04:21 PM
Molinaro on the fan right now.

Kaz
08-31-2014, 04:23 PM
What ever happens... lets give the guy more then 4 days to adjust.

Fort York Redcoat
08-31-2014, 04:24 PM
I think we should fire Vanney now before things go bad. Admit we made a mistake and hire a new coach or even the old one back. Fire him before its too late.

So happy we got this post out of the way early.

'Grats on being first! Only an hour in to the job!:smilielol5:

flamehawk
08-31-2014, 04:25 PM
Well I have been driving to ottawa all day and just took a break in kemptville only to read this. I was talking to some friends yesterday and called this. A little disappointed that vanney is here not just interim but he has more experience at least than Nelsen. Hope we can get someone like Pareja in

MightyDM
08-31-2014, 04:26 PM
I think we should fire Vanney now before things go bad. Admit we made a mistake and hire a new coach or even the old one back. Fire him before its too late.

bingo

ag futbol
08-31-2014, 04:27 PM
NY lost today. That's big for TFC.

molenshtain
08-31-2014, 04:28 PM
Hahaha.

Better player than Nelsen ever was and actually went through coaching build up.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I'll take a Dutch based football trained mind who actually coached over a guy like Nelsen any day.

That's fine. Winter's pedigree was obviously much better than Nelsen's. That says nothing about what we saw on the field. and what we saw on the field under Winter was a tactical effort to launch long, crossfield balls to Plata.

Fort York Redcoat
08-31-2014, 04:28 PM
Can't wait for the renewal dates to be pushed until November while they wait and see (pray?!) if they make the playoffs and then gouge us on a ST price increase for next year ----- and if Defoe is gone and they fail to make it, are they freezing prices again (not bloody likely!)? I think lots of supporters will bail if they increase yellows and light grays to match their prices from 3-4 years ago (which is about double their current price which frankly was a tremendous deal this year and hence why many people renewed before the signings!). With another 8,000-10,000 seats to sell, supply will sorely outstrip demand if the prices get jacked up in the cheaper sections. Most supporters that I speak with stuck around because they could get "cheaper" tickets ($10-$12 a game!), if that carrot is gone and the "buzz" leaves, empty seats will abound in our larger stadium next year. We got "real grass" from the Edu transfer, does the Defoe transfer start to pay for a roof? If we can sell a few more players we might get a proper stadium by 2025!! ;)

I think they are aware of how much momentum they've lost in marketing renewals.

I don't get how we even talk about a stadium upgrade when the team is in such flux. I couldn't care less about it when the teams season is in jeopardy.

LFC8
08-31-2014, 04:28 PM
The minute he called out Bez, you knew it was happening....

Red CB Toronto
08-31-2014, 04:29 PM
I will support this club through the highs and lows, not about to turn my back now. It is somewhat depressing what's going on, considering how much of a high the off-season was. I wonder where the Reds are going but we have to wait and see.

MightyDM
08-31-2014, 04:30 PM
You can laugh all you want. You can call me biased too. I'm curious to know what you say my bias is. I've admitted to be biased many times. We all are.

That being said…you justify Nelsen being the best coach based on the record (which is fake considering we're being caught and we're the only eastern playoff team that concedes more goals than they score even though we score a lot) by saying "look at the players he's brought in"????

1. Who did he bring it?

2. Is bringing in players the coaches job?

I think we expect different things from coaches. I expect good tactics. Good adjustments to tactics if what you've chosen isn't working. Good player selection based on positional ability and proper substitutions and use of depth on the roster.

I think he has sucked since day one on all of those.

What the Tims spent on Defoe, Gilberto and Bradley extended Nelsen's coaching life and masked his lack of ability to coach.

A player who is still taking off his cleats while you're handing him the coaching job is a bad idea and it was done merely for optics and to keep supporters quiet. It failed but you're still defending him.

So…tell me my bias and tell me which points of mine are wrong.

Your last point is the only one that matters. You never gave Nelsen a chance and in my view, based on your posts, never gave him credit for anything he did well. That's what's wrong.

Lumpy
08-31-2014, 04:31 PM
So happy we got this post out of the way early.

'Grats on being first! Only an hour in to the job!:smilielol5:

Ha Ha. I wanted to set a new record. I think we should at least let him finish the week out being a holiday week and all.

tfcfans
08-31-2014, 04:32 PM
They've been advertising and pushing the 2015 "wait list" pretty early this year ---- I have a feeling that no waiting will be required if you're willing to put $750+ per ticket down. At $200-$300 a seat there's a wait, at the other price points, I doubt people will stick around long term.

speckles
08-31-2014, 04:38 PM
Lets just say strategic planning and marketing momentum were not on Tim's mind today. He has created problems for himself from his lack of management experience that will just keep on giving.