David Beckham wants to eliminate the MLS salary cap

[denime]

David Beckham wants to eliminate the MLS salary cap (http://hsrd.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KLthSeqzpTfvQABd.bvZx4;_ylu=X3oDMTRzZDZlaXM 3BGJwb3MDMQRjY29kZQNsaXR0bGVfc2FudGFfbWFyaWFfbWF4a W1hbDJfbWFpbF9wcm9maWxlBGNwb3MDMgRjdAMxBGcDMDZhOTE 0NDQtNGY3My0zNjFmLWE2OTMtYzUwOTc2NTMzMmFjBGludGwDd XMEcGtndAM0BHBvcwMxBHNlYwN0ZC1zdHJtBHNsawN0aXRsZQR 0ZXN0AzMxMg--/RV=1/RE=1397563551/RH=aHNyZC55YWhvby5jb20-/RO=2/RU=aHR0cDovL3Nwb3J0cy55YWhvby5jb20vYmxvZ3Mvc29jY2V yLWRpcnR5LXRhY2tsZS9kYXZpZC1iZWNraGFtLXdhbnRzLXRvL WVsaW1pbmF0ZS10aGUtbWxzLXNhbGFyeS1jYXAtMDYxNDM5NzE 3Lmh0bWw-/RS=%5EADA6pQiCs1NtCVd1gZBqzJnk35X9L4-)

[flatpicker]

I like his ambitious thinking, but I think we would see some form of luxury tax implemented before the cap is removed altogether.

[Oldtimer]

Too early to do that, in fact it's debatable if it should ever happen. A higher cap is what we should see.

[jabbronies]

Horrible idea.

I agree to raise it to something where every player can make at least 6 figures. But to eliminate it altogether is absurd. The value of shit players will go up, thus raising the cost to run a franchise. The cost will end up being dumped on the fans.

What's the point of getting rid of it altogether? So that we can import more high calibre talent? Wasn't the point of the league to foster the homegrown talent that gets looked past overseas?

[brad]

Horrible idea.

I agree to raise it to something where every player can make at least 6 figures. But to eliminate it altogether is absurd. The value of shit players will go up, thus raising the cost to run a franchise. The cost will end up being dumped on the fans.

Raising it as you mention will also increase the value of the bad players as you mention though. Only way around that is to relax the international quotas (which goes against the development league goals you mentioned.


What's the point of getting rid of it altogether? So that we can import more high calibre talent? Wasn't the point of the league to foster the homegrown talent that gets looked past overseas?

Importing more high caliber talent is exactly the point.

I personally wonder how much the "foster homegrown talent" angle is still a factor - or how much longer it will be. The landscape is a lot different now than it was in when the league was formed.

[holdsteady]

I think the salary cap is great, just too low at the moment.

[Sweeper]

April Fools

[brad]

April Fools

I actually saw this yesterday afternoon as well - so I don't think it is April Fools day

[Initial B]

The salary cap is one of the few advantages MLS has over the other leagues. I don't want it to turn into European-syle league with a bunch of "have-nots" with a couple of "haves". Sorry, but I like Parity.

That said, the current cap is way too low. I was thinking that so long as MLS reached a $10 million cap by 2024, they could be considered a top league. However, now I'm reconsidering since the growth may not be fast enough as salary inflation from the european leagues leaves MLS behind.

Garber needs to hit the accelerator over the next 8 years. Start the 2015 cap at $5 million and raise it by 10% per year up to 2019. Based on the new TV contracts coming in, MLS should be able to afford this, especially if the increase in quality leads to increased interest from sports fans.

Assuming the next CBA will come into effect in 2020, set the cap at $10 million at that point (with a minimum cap of $5M to force the Krafts to ante up or sell) and again increase the cap by 10% per year to 2024, which should leave the Cap at $14.64 million, which is the equivalent of France's League 1. By this point, the franchise academies will have been churning out players for over 10 years and should be well established.

Key to all this will be the US advancing out of the group stage and possibly to the quarter finals in Brazil this year. That's the only proof to players around the world that MLS' quality is increasing.

[jabbronies]

Raising it as you mention will also increase the value of the bad players as you mention though. Only way around that is to relax the international quotas (which goes against the development league goals you mentioned.

I don't mind raising the wages of shit players. In a salary capped league that raise is managed. I think guys who have made it this far deserve to be able to live a comfortable life.

However, in a non-salary capped league, raising salaries becomes a game.

Using the housing market in Toronto as an example - assets that should be valued low, end up sky rocketing because of bidding wars. You end up with a shit box that should be worth fraction of the cost end up going for top dollar largely due to the fact that a couple of people are fighting over that one asset - which then sets the bar higher for similar assets in the future. It has nothing to do with talent, and everything to do with what's available and who's willing to pay the highest dollar. It's a chain effect that then runs the cost of actual valuable assets even higher.

MLB has a luxery tax, but they still has a problem.





Importing more high caliber talent is exactly the point.

I personally wonder how much the "foster homegrown talent" angle is still a factor - or how much longer it will be. The landscape is a lot different now than it was in when the league was formed.

I think that we are finally seeing the maturity of the "Foster homegrown talent" angle.
The top American players are coming home - that's huge for the league IMO.

I'd rather see that high calibre talent stay here and get paid, rather than brining in internationals at an inflated rate.

[Detroit_TFC]

Personally, I feel the salary cap did what it needed to in the early days and needs to be replaced with other forms of salary management, like a luxury tax. But some might make a case that getting rid of it altogether will undercut the legal basis of MLS's modified single entity system and no way will the MLS board do that willingly.

[Oldtimer]

Here is a (dated) Big Sawker thread where they compared several alternative cap structures.
The alternatives were NFL, NHL, NBA, Richard Snowden's two cap structure (soft cap plus hard cap), MLB, and Platini's percentage of revenue (which is now Europe's standard going forward). Take a look, it's pretty informative.

http://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/what-type-of-salary-cap-is-best-for-mls-part-ii.1100492/

[Cashcleaner]

Personally, I feel the salary cap did what it needed to in the early days and needs to be replaced with other forms of salary management, like a luxury tax. But some might make a case that getting rid of it altogether will undercut the legal basis of MLS's modified single entity system and no way will the MLS board do that willingly.

To be honest, I'm fine with the cap fundamentally speaking, but I absolutely agree that it needs to be increased to a more reasonable level. Perhaps more importantly, though, I'd like to see the league reduce all the crazy restrictions and loopholes. Something like Generation Adidas has no place in a pro soccer league that claims to be a world-class organization. And why the heck are we only allowed to sign one player a year from our own academy system?!

Simplicity should be the mantra the next time the league looks at changing it's procedures for player acquisitions and salaries.

[Richard]

First things first, lets get some competent refs. I agree the cap should be raise,d but there also needs to be a significant investment in refereeing.

[Oldtimer]

And why the heck are we only allowed to sign one player a year from our own academy system?!

Simplicity should be the mantra the next time the league looks at changing it's procedures for player acquisitions and salaries.

The restriction on signing academy players was eliminated as part of the deal for the Whitecaps to join MLS.

The Bundesliga gives a huge parallel to MLS. At the time it was founded, football was a secondary sport (the number one sport was gymnastics). It had all kinds of crazy salary and roster restrictions to start. Eventually, they eliminated all of them. I've often felt that the Bundesliga is the European league that is the most like MLS in character, and it's no surprise that there have been co-operative efforts between the two leagues.

I believe that MLS should have a cap so the clubs remain solvent and make reasonable money (unlike many around the world). I think the system should be simple and transparent, and that the league is almost ready to make that step. Crazy arcane roster rules should be gone. There should be a domestic requirement because part of the mandate of MLS is to improve the US and Canadian national teams, and I believe that is a reasonable concession that the league should make to be recognized as an official D-1 league.

[Futbolista]

Horrible idea.

I agree to raise it to something where every player can make at least 6 figures. But to eliminate it altogether is absurd. The value of shit players will go up, thus raising the cost to run a franchise. The cost will end up being dumped on the fans.

What's the point of getting rid of it altogether? So that we can import more high caliber talent? Wasn't the point of the league to foster the homegrown talent that gets looked past overseas?

????
Sorry but horrible?
Canada does not benefit at all in this salary cap bull crap, as our players do not count as domestic player in an U.S team. Plus the quality of player still far from what other leagues have, and why is that?. They pay good money for international players to play in their leagues and set higher standards for other players to fallow.
Is time to let the big boys be the big boys of the MLS. Let the NY teams (both), LA and Seattle and of course TFC be the Super clubs of our league, set the standards. Barcelona or Man U dont care what the little teams can or cant afford and they have some of their best players playing for their national teams. The salary cap is not designed to overpaid for crappy players is designed to maximize profit for the owners...

[ag futbol]

The restriction on signing academy players was eliminated as part of the deal for the Whitecaps to join MLS.

The Bundesliga gives a huge parallel to MLS. At the time it was founded, football was a secondary sport (the number one sport was gymnastics). It had all kinds of crazy salary and roster restrictions to start. Eventually, they eliminated all of them. I've often felt that the Bundesliga is the European league that is the most like MLS in character, and it's no surprise that there have been co-operative efforts between the two leagues.

I believe that MLS should have a cap so the clubs remain solvent and make reasonable money (unlike many around the world). I think the system should be simple and transparent, and that the league is almost ready to make that step. Crazy arcane roster rules should be gone. There should be a domestic requirement because part of the mandate of MLS is to improve the US and Canadian national teams, and I believe that is a reasonable concession that the league should make to be recognized as an official D-1 league.
Of note: Bundesliga has a "cap" in the form of limiting wages (maybe transfers as well, not sure) to a set percentage or prior year club revenues. IMO a reasonable way to run things for a financially stable organization.

[brad]

The restriction on signing academy players was eliminated as part of the deal for the Whitecaps to join MLS.

The Bundesliga gives a huge parallel to MLS. At the time it was founded, football was a secondary sport (the number one sport was gymnastics). It had all kinds of crazy salary and roster restrictions to start. Eventually, they eliminated all of them. I've often felt that the Bundesliga is the European league that is the most like MLS in character, and it's no surprise that there have been co-operative efforts between the two leagues.

I believe that MLS should have a cap so the clubs remain solvent and make reasonable money (unlike many around the world). I think the system should be simple and transparent, and that the league is almost ready to make that step. Crazy arcane roster rules should be gone. There should be a domestic requirement because part of the mandate of MLS is to improve the US and Canadian national teams, and I believe that is a reasonable concession that the league should make to be recognized as an official D-1 league.

Is this true - the part about Canada? Did the mandate change with Canadian teams coming into the league, or is it still focused on the USMNT like it was initially?

[Oldtimer]

Of note: Bundesliga has a "cap" in the form of limiting wages (maybe transfers as well, not sure) to a set percentage or prior year club revenues. IMO a reasonable way to run things for a financially stable organization.

That's true. They had no restrictions for a while, and now they have the fiscal responsibility restrictions.


Is this true - the part about Canada? Did the mandate change with Canadian teams coming into the league, or is it still focused on the USMNT like it was initially?

MLS had to agree to support Canadian players as a condition of being recognized as D-1 by the CSA. However, the CSA has set the bar really low due to the poor Canadian player pool. MLS was set up originally just to support US Soccer, and that has always been a much higher priority than what happens in Canada.

[Commie Red]

Is this true - the part about Canada? Did the mandate change with Canadian teams coming into the league, or is it still focused on the USMNT like it was initially?
Yes, it is true. MLS is focused on improving the USMNT and the Canadian clubs are being used as part of that development. Canadian players are treated as foreign in the U.S., while American players are treated as "domestic" in Canada (I can't believe that that is even legal in Canada). There is only a token nod to Canadian player development (9 out of the 90 roster spots in Canada must be Canadian). So while American players represent the majority of players in the MLS (58%) only 3.31% of players in the league are Canadian (compared to 16% of the teams in the league being located in Canada). I don't understand why any supporter of CMNT would ever point to the current "domestic" (sic) player requirements of MLS as a good thing -- when we are being used to bolster the ranks and development of a rival.

[jabbronies]

????
Sorry but horrible?

Canada does not benefit at all in this salary cap bull crap, as our players do not count as domestic player in an U.S team.

This has nothing to do with salary cap at all.




Plus the quality of player still far from what other leagues have, and why is that?. They pay good money for international players to play in their leagues and set higher standards for other players to fallow.


Agree with this 100%




Is time to let the big boys be the big boys of the MLS. Let the NY teams (both), LA and Seattle and of course TFC be the Super clubs of our league, set the standards. Barcelona or Man U dont care what the little teams can or cant afford and they have some of their best players playing for their national teams.

If you think MLS will be on the same page as the clubs you've mentioned just by getting rid of the salary cap - you are wrong.

The reason bottom feeder teams in England, Spain, hell even Mexico exist is because they are steeped in tradition with those communities. They can live at the bottom of the table and still survive because people actually care about soccer and they attend matches because they love the sport - in Toronto the Leafs would be the equivalent of that.

Small market teams in NA would die without a salary cap because no one wants to pay to watch a crappy team. They don't have that love/tradition for their clubs. Get rid of those bottom feeders and all you are left with is what...7-8 teams?

And when TFC fuck it all up and end up being the bottom feeders or that 8 team league, then what? Don't you remember what they stadium looked like last year?





The salary cap is not designed to overpaid for crappy players is designed to maximize profit for the owners...

The salary cap as it stands - yes. I agree
Raise the cap - but it needs to remain - otherwise you have teams paying 7 million for a player like Bebe and then we as supporters get stuck with the bill or the team goes into bankruptcy.

[Commie Red]

This has nothing to do with salary cap at all.
...



I believe Futbolista was responding to your argument that the salary cap somehow aids in the development of "domestic" (read American) players.



What's the point of getting rid of it altogether? So that we can import more high calibre talent? Wasn't the point of the league to foster the homegrown talent that gets looked past overseas?

He was arguing that Canadian players, by and large, already compete on the open market in the MLS. So for a Canadian to raise the "development" issue in defence of the cap makes little sense.

[Cashcleaner]

The restriction on signing academy players was eliminated as part of the deal for the Whitecaps to join MLS.


Ah yes, that's right. I remember the argument the Whitecaps brass were making at the time. Makes total sense given how extensive their academy network is: http://www.whitecapsfc.com/youth/programs/academycentres.



The Bundesliga gives a huge parallel to MLS. At the time it was founded, football was a secondary sport (the number one sport was gymnastics). It had all kinds of crazy salary and roster restrictions to start. Eventually, they eliminated all of them. I've often felt that the Bundesliga is the European league that is the most like MLS in character, and it's no surprise that there have been co-operative efforts between the two leagues.

I believe that MLS should have a cap so the clubs remain solvent and make reasonable money (unlike many around the world). I think the system should be simple and transparent, and that the league is almost ready to make that step. Crazy arcane roster rules should be gone. There should be a domestic requirement because part of the mandate of MLS is to improve the US and Canadian national teams, and I believe that is a reasonable concession that the league should make to be recognized as an official D-1 league.

Totally agree that we should keep certain requirements for domestic players. It's vitally important to the continued growth of the sport in North America to cultivate Canadian and American players.

[Kaz]

The Cap is a good thing for the league.. the cap needs to start being raised... but not to bring in more super stars to raise the minimums so that there is a reason for players to want to play.

If you are 20 and you are picking up 36k that isn't bad... but if you only have a 5 year career what did you waste to get that salary? At 60-80k minimum the younger players have an incentive and if they washout in a year or two they have Collage (well Canadian University) paid for if they manage their money well.

The cap needs to be raised to allowed $500,000 salaries, and 60-80k minimums, the creation of a Transfer Fee Rule.. to allow a fee to be paid for an under 24 player without them being a young DP once a year. And allow 3 DPs and a Young DP.

MLS needs to be developed as a Northern North American League... it needs the caps and the rules to allow that.

Sure top leagues have no cap.. they also have teams that can't pay their players.

[Commie Red]

Insightful article here on the "Brotherly Game" website (http://www.brotherlygame.com/2014/4/1/5544564/the-mls-cba-a-point-of-view-on-player-salaries) (a Philadelphia Union Blog). It essentially argues that the minimum and top end pay in MLS is not greatly out of line with other leagues but rather the "middle class" wages are where the problem lies (similar to Kas' point above).

Here are some telling graphs from the article to consider. Although 58% of MLS teams made a profit last year wages only accounted for 20% of revenue earned.


http://i.imgur.com/yLQx15d.jpg





And compared to U.S. or North American leagues (unfortunately, NHL stats are not provided although the current CBA states 50% of revenue. So, similar to the Budesliga):

http://i.imgur.com/iqOFMAs.jpg (http://imgur.com/iqOFMAs)



The article points out that in order for MLS to attain the level of the Bundesliga by 2022 (Gerber's stated vision) salaries would need to increase by 27% a year.

[Oldtimer]

^Information like that will undoubtedly be used by the Player's Union.

[jabbronies]

I believe Futbolista was responding to your argument that the salary cap somehow aids in the development of "domestic" (read American) players.

He was arguing that Canadian players, by and large, already compete on the open market in the MLS. So for a Canadian to raise the "development" issue in defence of the cap makes little sense.

I was mainly speaking about American players. TBH Canadians are not even on my radar when I made my argument. That is whole other issue to get into.

[Abou Sky]

http://www.neowin.net/forum/uploads/monthly_08_2013/post-2-0-15170100-1377795095.jpg

[james]

To many leagues in Europe have really only a top 2-4 teams that will actually compete for a league tittle. This may work in Europe, but in USA/Canada....I don't think so. Teams that can never compete will go broke and fold in this country. And to be honest, some Europe leagues are boring, you know each and every year who the top contender teams are going to be. Its good to have different teams competing each year like MLS. That said, I would like less restrictions, but I don't want teams to spend like its the wild Europe, but I also don't want to have to pay less money on players because little Columbus or Dallas or whoever can't make any profits. I see it in NHL all the time and it shouldn't be our fault that there support numbers are so low. If there was some way to balance money vs profits vs attendance and so forth id be up for that, if that is even doable.