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Initial B
03-01-2014, 07:35 PM
Okay, pre-season is done and now all that's left is speculation. After comparing the rest of the league, how many points do you think TFC will end up with by the end of the season? I think it's going to be a rocky start, say 3-5-3 leading up to the World Cup break. I'm sure injuries are going to expose our lack of depth, even as they start to gel. I figure that they'll go 7-11-5 the rest of the way. Unfortunately, that's only 38 points. Before preseason, I was thinking that TFC might be lucky to get 50 points, but even now I see that was optimistic.

Sorry big Tim, there will be no playoffs this year. Better figure out what you guaranteed if TFC didn't make the playoffs (I'm hoping refunds of some sort).

For comparison, here's last year's thread: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?33555-How-many-points-for-TFC-in-2013

Yohan
03-01-2014, 07:36 PM
It'd have been better if you put up a poll

Initial B
03-01-2014, 07:46 PM
Poll posted.

You guys saw their defense. I assumed that we would be as good or better than last year and that would net us points along with more goals scored. But now I see that we have no depth beyond the line of Orr - Caldwell - Henry - Morrow. Once one of them goes down, opposing teams will exploit that weakness in our backline for goals. Assuming that Defoe and Gilberto will struggle, we'll only post a 9 point improvement over last year. It's too bad, I really had high hopes for this year. We'd better brace ourselves for more disappointment. Hopefully everything will come together in 2015.

notthesun
03-01-2014, 07:59 PM
Assuming that Defoe and Gilberto will struggle, we'll only post a 9 point improvement over last year. It's too bad, I really had high hopes for this year. We'd better brace ourselves for more disappointment. Hopefully everything will come together in 2015.

Ladies and gentlemen, 7 years of Toronto FC.

I voted 51-55 points. Got it right last year, going for 2 in a row.

Globetrotter
03-01-2014, 08:13 PM
This should be stickied and the edit button should be removed so that nobody can change their prediction and that everyone is held accountable. If you say TFC stinks, but are rocking throughout the whole year, dont come back and say you knew it all along. You're locked in.

New York 1st in the East this season.
Toronto 4th (maybe 3rd)

Cashcleaner
03-01-2014, 08:23 PM
I'm gonna go with 41 to 45 points. We'll probably be behind New York and Kansas City in the East at the end of the regular season.

notthesun
03-01-2014, 08:31 PM
I'm gonna go with 41 to 45 points. We'll probably be behind New York and Kansas City in the East at the end of the regular season.

As in New York and KC top 2 and us in 3rd? Under the current playoff qualification format the last time 45 points would have been enough to qualify in the East was 2010.

Yohan
03-01-2014, 08:31 PM
keep in mind you'll likely need about 50 pts to qualify for playoffs.

JuliquE
03-01-2014, 09:11 PM
51-55

Canada67
03-01-2014, 09:44 PM
51-55

X2. Playoff bound!

OgtheDim
03-01-2014, 10:22 PM
I'm going to avoid my usual cautious approach to all this and say we are going to have a very very good fall run as certain teams fall apart and we get stronger.

56 points - 3rd position

I reserve the right to boast about this if it comes true, or complain about reality if it doesn't. :)

Cashcleaner
03-01-2014, 10:34 PM
As in New York and KC top 2 and us in 3rd? Under the current playoff qualification format the last time 45 points would have been enough to qualify in the East was 2010.

No, more just that New York and KC will remain top dogs in the East for at least another season.

But yeah, you're right about how many points we'd probably need for playoffs. I'm thinking we're going to squeeze in, but yeah, we will need more like around 48-50 in the least. I'm being far too conservative here.

SoccMan2
03-01-2014, 10:34 PM
No playoffs I know we had no choice with Laba but this is a major loss. Depth is a problem and will be the downfall of this team in 2014, I think Nelson still is not ready to be a head coach and will be shown the door by June. They will do a bit better than last year in terms of points just for the fact that having Bradley and Defoe will help, Gilberto I'm not too sure about. I hope I'm wrong but I'm just not seeing enough there that will change my mind going into the regular season.

Joe Kool
03-01-2014, 11:42 PM
As much as I want them to end with more points I have no faith that injuries or something will still bite us in the ass. I think we will do better than the last couple years but not as good as TL is predicting with a playoff berth. Voted 36-40 points. I really really hope I am wrong and just being a pessimistic little shit. It would be lovely to see us near the top of the table at the end of the season for a change. Would rather prepare for the worst and hope for the best as they say. Now where the hell are my season tickets?

Cashcleaner
03-02-2014, 12:03 AM
^ Honestly, after the previous 7 years, I really can't fault anyone for being a little pessimistic. I think playoffs are gonna happen, but I don't think we'll get there by a wide margin or anything.

Yohan
03-02-2014, 12:12 AM
it will all depend on after 18 May when Bradley and Defoe goes off the WC. Well, Defoe is a maybe but who knows. the depth... I don't know if TFC can grind out enough results in mid May-late June period

tfcocd
03-02-2014, 12:48 AM
Okay, pre-season is done and now all that's left is speculation. After comparing the rest of the league, how many points do you think TFC will end up with by the end of the season? I think it's going to be a rocky start, say 3-5-3 leading up to the World Cup break. I'm sure injuries are going to expose our lack of depth, even as they start to gel. I figure that they'll go 7-11-5 the rest of the way. Unfortunately, that's only 38 points. Before preseason, I was thinking that TFC might be lucky to get 50 points, but even now I see that was optimistic.

Sorry big Tim, there will be no playoffs this year. Better figure out what you guaranteed if TFC didn't make the playoffs (I'm hoping refunds of some sort).

For comparison, here's last year's thread: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?33555-How-many-points-for-TFC-in-2013


10 wins would be an improvement from last year but still a mediocre result. Defoe and Gilberto may struggle but I still believe Defoe will have a run of form and this might give them a few more wins if the team is able to create enough quality build ups and opportunities for him to finish. I think the capability was starting to develop at the end of last year and has been evident in pre-season even if the team is mostly at 90%.

tfcleeds
03-02-2014, 08:33 AM
I think we nab a playoff spot, but just barely. Think 2009 except instead of crapping the bed in that pivotal game, we actually win it. And that's assuming we don't have any major injury issues over the course of the season. I'm bracing myself for a slow start to the season, but improvement as the season goes on.

Initial B
03-02-2014, 08:36 AM
This should be stickied and the edit button should be removed so that nobody can change their prediction and that everyone is held accountable. If you say TFC stinks, but are rocking throughout the whole year, dont come back and say you knew it all along. You're locked in.

New York 1st in the East this season.
Toronto 4th (maybe 3rd)

I thought I'd made the poll so that you couldn't edit the results. If you click on the numbers voted column, you can see who voted where. You can do the same thing on last year's poll as well. I wanted to make it so we could all see what we thought we'll end up when we look back in October. Personally, I would be ecstatic if we make the playoffs with 51+ points and 3rd place, but I voted with my head rather than my heart. Maybe the team will be lucky this year and not have injuries and do well - karma owes us at least that much after 7 seasons of misery.

Fort York Redcoat
03-02-2014, 09:36 AM
Okay, pre-season is done and now all that's left is speculation. After comparing the rest of the league, how many points do you think TFC will end up with by the end of the season? I think it's going to be a rocky start, say 3-5-3 leading up to the World Cup break. I'm sure injuries are going to expose our lack of depth, even as they start to gel. I figure that they'll go 7-11-5 the rest of the way. Unfortunately, that's only 38 points. Before preseason, I was thinking that TFC might be lucky to get 50 points, but even now I see that was optimistic.

Sorry big Tim, there will be no playoffs this year. Better figure out what you guaranteed if TFC didn't make the playoffs (I'm hoping refunds of some sort).



Well thought out predictions until reaching the bolded text.g:D


This should be stickied and the edit button should be removed so that nobody can change their prediction and that everyone is held accountable. If you say TFC stinks, but are rocking throughout the whole year, dont come back and say you knew it all along. You're locked in.

New York 1st in the East this season.
Toronto 4th (maybe 3rd)

Yes, people can edit what they say but not how they voted so if there's funny business...

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_5XvBYfxU_dM/TdmCYUxiUbI/AAAAAAAARxc/yRWx4oF_Hbs/Splainin'ToDo-8x6.jpg

pdubs
03-02-2014, 12:33 PM
46-50. worried about injuries. all these "little nicks" we are picking up preseason doesn't put my mind at ease. I think our ceiling is higher than 46-50, but it will take time to gel and incorporate all our big signings into the squad. The start of our season is difficult (Seattle, rebuilt DC United, and Real Salt Lake) and we need results right away.

Also, if Bradley or Caldwell miss significant time we will suffer a lot. Midfield is all Bradley and back-line is all Caldwell (33 yrs, 34 in Sept)

jabbronies
03-02-2014, 12:43 PM
46-50. worried about injuries. all these "little nicks" we are picking up preseason doesn't put my mind at ease. I think our ceiling is higher than 46-50, but it will take time to gel and incorporate all our big signings into the squad. The start of our season is difficult (Seattle, rebuilt DC United, and Real Salt Lake) and we need results right away.

Also, if Bradley or Caldwell miss significant time we will suffer a lot. Midfield is all Bradley and back-line is all Caldwell (33 yrs, 34 in Sept)

TFC need a to sign a younger Steven Caldwell (YSC). Someone who actual Steven Caldwell can groom as his replacement. That way if/when actual Caldwell goes down, YSC can step up and marshal the back line in his absence.

Same goes for Bradley. We need a non-international version of him - so that when he goes on International leave, the other guy can fill in. I always thought Laba would be that guy, but now...we have no one capable of filling that role.

After watching Bradley play this preseason, I get more and more worried that everything we do moving forward will be based around him. Without him, we have nothing!

jazzy
03-02-2014, 09:24 PM
it will all depend on after 18 May when Bradley and Defoe goes off the WC. Well, Defoe is a maybe but who knows. the depth... I don't know if TFC can grind out enough results in mid May-late June period

this is great point...we lost strength and heart with Dike's injury and Laba's dumping (bitter, yup) , but I wonder how many of us remember our stars may go missing for a bit....too many of last years not ready for MLS players will be asked again, to overachieve . We need a strong mid core and alas I think it's suspect.

jazzy
03-02-2014, 09:29 PM
TFC need a to sign a younger Steven Caldwell (YSC). Someone who actual Steven Caldwell can groom as his replacement. That way if/when actual Caldwell goes down, YSC can step up and marshal the back line in his absence.

Same goes for Bradley. We need a non-international version of him - so that when he goes on International leave, the other guy can fill in. I always thought Laba would be that guy, but now...we have no one capable of filling that role.

after watching Bradley play this preseason, I get more and more worried that everything we do moving forward will be based around him. Without him, we have nothing!

call me crAzY but I give Henry that chance

jloome
03-02-2014, 09:59 PM
46-50. worried about injuries. all these "little nicks" we are picking up preseason doesn't put my mind at ease. I think our ceiling is higher than 46-50, but it will take time to gel and incorporate all our big signings into the squad. The start of our season is difficult (Seattle, rebuilt DC United, and Real Salt Lake) and we need results right away.

Also, if Bradley or Caldwell miss significant time we will suffer a lot. Midfield is all Bradley and back-line is all Caldwell (33 yrs, 34 in Sept)

I'm going with 49 pts and maybe we get in, maybe we don't. Can't get much more on the fence than that.

jabbronies
03-03-2014, 12:58 AM
call me crAzY but I give Henry that chance
he's too young

jabbronies
03-03-2014, 01:18 AM
41-45 pts.

They will Toronto Blue Jays this season and fuck it right up.

Ultra & Proud
03-03-2014, 09:37 AM
I took 41-45 pts.

Not expecting Jays style bomb but expecting growing pains, problems during WC, and injuries. Probably get around 45 points possibly up to 49 if all went well. Regardless, this should be our best season yet.

MartinUtd
03-03-2014, 09:40 AM
I picked 46-50 because I see us getting 1 more point than the Impact's 49 last season.

brad
03-03-2014, 09:48 AM
I picked 41-45. 40-50 was my prediction before this.

*Squad depth is worrying as others have pointed out. I also worry that this will lead to overplaying certain players instead of resting them when needed (key part of avoiding injuries is proper squad rotation).
*I don't have a lot of faith in Nelsen tactically, I don't have a lot of faith in him being able to outmaneuver the better managers in this league. Doesn't matter how good the players are if the manager is not.
*I also think the early results will be bumpy due to the squad turnover and new players adapting to the league. I think PPG in the first few months are going to be off the playoff mark. I think post WC - probably July/Aug - will see this improve a fair amount (barring injuries). I really think the key is going to be hang in enough pre-WC and make a run afterwards.

Brooker
03-03-2014, 10:07 AM
I'm so used to us being hopelessly shit I don't remember the last time I even checked to see how many points we had at any point. Better chances of me seeing a headless child tap dancing down the sidewalk on my way to work.

Let this be the year.

Detroit_TFC
03-03-2014, 10:32 AM
East is going to be tight, nearly everyone in the mix until the end. TFC gets 48 pts, 3 way tie for 5th slot, get through on tiebreaker

Reminder of the Standings Tiebreakers:
1. Most Wins
2. Goals For (See column labeled GF on www.MLSsoccer.com/standings (http://www.mlssoccer.com/standings) page)
3. Goal Differential (GD)
4. Fewest Disciplinary Points
5. Road Goals
6. Road Goal Differential
7. Home Goals
8. Home Goal Differential
9. Coin Toss (2 teams) or Drawing of Lots (3 or more)

Initial B
03-03-2014, 10:34 AM
You might have to wait another year, Brooker. The weighted average of RPB collective voting is 48 Points. I think MLS teams will need at least 51 points to get into the playoffs.

Canary10
03-03-2014, 10:46 AM
East is going to be tight, nearly everyone in the mix until the end. TFC gets 48 pts, 3 way tie for 5th slot, get through on tiebreaker

Reminder of the Standings Tiebreakers:
1. Most Wins
2. Goals For (See column labeled GF on www.MLSsoccer.com/standings (http://www.mlssoccer.com/standings) page)
3. Goal Differential (GD)
4. Fewest Disciplinary Points
5. Road Goals
6. Road Goal Differential
7. Home Goals
8. Home Goal Differential
9. Coin Toss (2 teams) or Drawing of Lots (3 or more)

48 seems pretty reasonable to me. That's 6 more wins from last year. I think this team should be capable of that. I tend to think we won't make it to 50. That's a pretty big jump in one year. 48 will be close to playoffs depending on what else happens, but borderline. I can see 5th or 6th.

LFC8
03-03-2014, 12:04 PM
Lol at everyone being so cautious. 10 out of 19 teams make the playoffs. If we don't make the playoffs, it would be TFC's worst season to date. We are the best team on paper. The best team on paper doesn't always win it all but they always make the playoffs.

Canary10
03-03-2014, 12:10 PM
^ Have you been around this team for the past seven years? Don't think we're the best on paper either, although I do think we are a top team on paper.

ag futbol
03-03-2014, 12:15 PM
^ Have you been around this team for the past seven years? Don't think we're the best on paper either, although I do think we are a top team on paper.
Agreed. Let's remember we haven't seen everything come together as of yet either. We might get 10-15 games in a realize we have a lot of talent but the team is lacking in certain departments. The best MLS teams are talented, but also very balanced.

For the record I voted for between 46-50 pts. I expect a strong second half of the season and a meddling first half.

bones
03-03-2014, 12:21 PM
I voted extremely low for 2 reasons: Sloppy pre-season and player depth. I know many combinations were used to give the coach a good look at everyone but their play was very sloppy from an organization perspective. With big name signings comes thin replacements and with the world cup and the risk of injury to our older players I'm concerned that we could go from "best team on paper" to mega bust easily and it scares the hell out of me.

Please prove me paranoid and wrong TFC.

Pookie
03-03-2014, 12:36 PM
Poll results are interesting, particularly during the offseason.

With 12% expecting 56 points or more and 9% expecting a flat or declining point total, more people expect TFC to post the single largest season over season turnaround in MLS history and challenge the league record for most points than those that are expecting them to falter.

And over half the fan base here is expecting TFC to post between 17 and 26 point improvement which would likely give Nelsen MLS Coach of the Year honours for being amongst the largest single season turn arounds in MLS history.

That's something to be said for optimism, isn't it?

Canary10
03-03-2014, 12:46 PM
Poll results are interesting, particularly during the offseason.

With 12% expecting 56 points or more and 9% expecting a flat or declining point total, more people expect TFC to post the single largest season over season turnaround in MLS history and challenge the league record for most points than those that are expecting them to falter.

And over half the fan base here is expecting TFC to post between 17 and 26 point improvement which would likely give Nelsen MLS Coach of the Year honours for being amongst the largest single season turn arounds in MLS history.

That's something to be said for optimism, isn't it?

San Jose improved by about 30 points two seasons ago. That was the most I could find at the time, looking a few years back. Improving in the neighbourhood of 20 points is a fairly regular occurrence in MLS. I think we could pull that off. Above that though, I doubt it. It'll be tough to get that last playoff spot I think.

LFC8
03-03-2014, 12:52 PM
This is also the first time we've had a playoff-calibre team. It seems like a lot of people on this board have heard of players like Defoe, Cesar and Bradley but haven't actually seen them play. They are miles ahead of any past TFC player(Besides Frings). These guys are ELITE in a league like the MLS. This year's team is obviously a complete turnover from last year so a slow start is definitely possible because they'll need some time to gel but they won't miss the playoffs. Too much quality.

jabbronies
03-03-2014, 12:53 PM
Poll results are interesting, particularly during the offseason.

With 12% expecting 56 points or more and 9% expecting a flat or declining point total, more people expect TFC to post the single largest season over season turnaround in MLS history and challenge the league record for most points than those that are expecting them to falter.

And over half the fan base here is expecting TFC to post between 17 and 26 point improvement which would likely give Nelsen MLS Coach of the Year honours for being amongst the largest single season turn arounds in MLS history.

That's something to be said for optimism, isn't it?

This is just me being an optimist but, it's not that far fetched to do this.

We lost 12 games by 1 goal last season and tied 17 games overall
We just beefed up our offensive prowess - therefore we should be scoring more goals.

1 extra goal in even half of those games and we've made up approximately 21pts (based on 5 more ties = 5pts; 8 more wins = 16pts)
That would have brought our season record to 14 - 11 - 9

Good enough for middle of the pack status (51pts)

personally I don't think we'll get past 45 - but hey - it is possible

Pookie
03-03-2014, 12:56 PM
San Jose improved by about 30 points two seasons ago. That was the most I could find at the time, looking a few years back. Improving in the neighbourhood of 20 points is a fairly regular occurrence in MLS. I think we could pull that off. Above that though, I doubt it. It'll be tough to get that last playoff spot I think.

The RYRBs were on a 30 point improvement too. I was using that coach of the year thing based on Porter and the Timbers improving by 24 points. That would be what Nelsen would be in store for if he can do it.

Canary10
03-03-2014, 12:58 PM
The RYRBs were on a 30 point improvement too. I was using that coach of the year thing based on Porter and the Timbers improving by 24 points. That would be what Nelsen would be in store for if he can do it.

When did New York do it?

jabbronies
03-03-2014, 01:10 PM
When did New York do it?

assuming 2010

went from like 21 pts in 2009 to 51 in 2010

jabbronies
03-03-2014, 01:13 PM
assuming 2010

went from like 21 pts in 2009 to 51 in 2010

Aside from a new manager - we've replicated the overhaul that they made

New DP striker and DP Central Midfielder, upgraded attacking mid

Detroit_TFC
03-03-2014, 01:19 PM
DCU did +17 2011 over 2010, then +19 2012 over 2011 (then -42 2013 over 2012, let's not think about that).

tfcleeds
03-03-2014, 01:40 PM
We have absolutely no depth - that's one thing that could be gleaned from the preseason, if anything. Yes, the likes of Defoe, Bradley, and Julio Cesar are among the very best in the world at their respective positions, and are better than anything we've had. But heaven forbid, if one of them goes down for whatever reason, we are screwed. Not to mention 2 or 3 players do not a team make. A team is only as good as its weakest player. And we've still got quite a few players that wouldn't make most other MLS benches that we are counting on for depth. That is why people are being cautious.

ManUtd4ever
03-03-2014, 01:55 PM
If we don't make the playoffs, it will have to be considered the most epic failure in the history of the franchise, and perhaps the league as a whole.

I don't care if we squeak in by 1 point on the last day of the season, but it's playoffs or bust. It has to be.

OgtheDim
03-03-2014, 01:58 PM
...And we've still got quite a few players that wouldn't make most other MLS benches that we are counting on for depth. .

Hmmm..

Goal - Bendik

RB- Bloom

CD - Agboss, Haggaland, Richter

LB - Morgan

Wing - Lambe, Aparicio, DeRo(?)

Midfield - Bekker, Hall, DeRo (?)

Forwards - DeRo (?), Wiedeman



Of those, I'd say Aparicio, Hall, Lambe, Richter, Bekker, and Agboss are not good enough for most MLS teams as backups.

Leaving us with Bendik, Bloom, Haggland, Morgan, DeRo and Wiedeman as decent enough back ups.

****

Mind you, this time last season, who the heck thought Osorio would be a consistent starter?

Oldtimer
03-03-2014, 02:09 PM
This is also the first time we've had a playoff-calibre team. It seems like a lot of people on this board have heard of players like Defoe, Cesar and Bradley but haven't actually seen them play. They are miles ahead of any past TFC player(Besides Frings). These guys are ELITE in a league like the MLS. This year's team is obviously a complete turnover from last year so a slow start is definitely possible because they'll need some time to gel but they won't miss the playoffs. Too much quality.

Our offense is great. Our defense is still pretty poor (one of the worst in MLS, I'd say). I gave 41-45 points expecting significant improvement later in the year, we may not see the playoffs, or we may just get in.

Initial B
03-03-2014, 02:18 PM
We lost 12 games by 1 goal last season and tied 17 games overall
We just beefed up our offensive prowess - therefore we should be scoring more goals.

1 extra goal in even half of those games and we've made up approximately 21pts (based on 5 more ties = 5pts; 8 more wins = 16pts)
That would have brought our season record to 14 - 11 - 9

Good enough for middle of the pack status (51pts)

personally I don't think we'll get past 45 - but hey - it is possible
That's what I originally thought as well, but then I watched the preseason games and the absolute mess that was our backline. We let in goals in all but one of the games and we still had problems scoring, even with Gilberto on the field. I don't think Defoe will be as good as everyone says, at least in his first season in MLS. Sure TFC has a little more quality, but the same issues that bit us last year are still there in this iteration.

brad
03-03-2014, 02:18 PM
This is also the first time we've had a playoff-calibre team. It seems like a lot of people on this board have heard of players like Defoe, Cesar and Bradley but haven't actually seen them play. They are miles ahead of any past TFC player(Besides Frings). These guys are ELITE in a league like the MLS. This year's team is obviously a complete turnover from last year so a slow start is definitely possible because they'll need some time to gel but they won't miss the playoffs. Too much quality.

A bold statement to make about people's knowledge of players. None the less.

Nobody is questioning the quality of these players, we are questioning the quality of the players surrounding them - including the players that will be filling in for them when the above players miss several games for the World Cup. We are also questioning the depth of the team should injuries strike these big name players, and whether or not an inexperienced manager in Nelsen can pull the strings in a way that will make these individuals perform like a team.

Adding a few top players doesn't win you things in the MLS. Building a solid MLS caliber team from back to front wins you things.

brad
03-03-2014, 02:23 PM
Our offense is great. Our defense is still pretty poor (one of the worst in MLS, I'd say). I gave 41-45 points expecting significant improvement later in the year, we may not see the playoffs, or we may just get in.

I still think we are going suffer with getting service up front to the forwards.

brad
03-03-2014, 02:32 PM
That's what I originally thought as well, but then I watched the preseason games and the absolute mess that was our backline. We let in goals in all but one of the games and we still had problems scoring, even with Gilberto on the field. I don't think Defoe will be as good as everyone says, at least in his first season in MLS. Sure TFC has a little more quality, but the same issues that bit us last year are still there in this iteration.

This is another reason I temper expectations. Henry scored 2 goals in 11 appearances in his first half season, and 14 in 26 apps in his second season. Di Vaio scored 5 in in 17 appearances in his first year before lighting it up with 20 goals in 31 last season. On the other hand - you have Robbie Keane who hit the ground running (but he was added into a very, very good team which may have played a role). Dempsey has yet to light the league up.

Basic point is - there is certainly a precedent set for top quality players not lighting up the MLS when moving over right away - but taking time to find their feet. There is also the precedent for the other side (with Keane). Point is - just because a player is a top player in a quality league, it doesn't mean they will just start banging them in the MLS.

Canary10
03-03-2014, 02:35 PM
That's what I originally thought as well, but then I watched the preseason games and the absolute mess that was our backline. We let in goals in all but one of the games and we still had problems scoring, even with Gilberto on the field. I don't think Defoe will be as good as everyone says, at least in his first season in MLS. Sure TFC has a little more quality, but the same issues that bit us last year are still there in this iteration.

In the few preseason games I saw from other teams, I saw defences in shambles as well. I'm not sure we can take that as what we should expect of this team. If it is, we aren't the only one in trouble there.

ag futbol
03-03-2014, 03:21 PM
This is also the first time we've had a playoff-calibre team. It seems like a lot of people on this board have heard of players like Defoe, Cesar and Bradley but haven't actually seen them play. They are miles ahead of any past TFC player(Besides Frings). These guys are ELITE in a league like the MLS. This year's team is obviously a complete turnover from last year so a slow start is definitely possible because they'll need some time to gel but they won't miss the playoffs. Too much quality.
What you'll find is, that people on this board have seen quality players of this nature come to MLS before. 1) they often take time to adjust. Be that to a new country, the travel, the nature of having worse teammates than they are used to or whatever. 2) it's still a team sport and you can't hide behind a couple of names.

jazzy
03-03-2014, 09:17 PM
A bold statement to make about people's knowledge of players. None the less.

Nobody is questioning the quality of these players, we are questioning the quality of the players surrounding them - including the players that will be filling in for them when the above players miss several games for the World Cup. We are also questioning the depth of the team should injuries strike these big name players, and whether or not an inexperienced manager in Nelsen can pull the strings in a way that will make these individuals perform like a team.

Adding a few top players doesn't win you things in the MLS. Building a solid MLS caliber team from back to front wins you things.


this seems logical to me and as of right now I am not overly confident of our core regulars....it is again a start . Does Bradley carry the whole team ? I don't see how that works . And I think stikers are overrated . I'd rather have control of the game through the middle . If Gilberto or Dafoe can't get service , will they be involved ?

Shakes McQueen
03-03-2014, 09:26 PM
I predict we get.... ALL THE POINTS.

- Scott

LFC8
03-03-2014, 09:58 PM
^Let's be reasonable here...i was thinking 99 pts....but 102 is a bit of a stretch don't ya think?

jabbronies
03-04-2014, 11:22 AM
That's what I originally thought as well, but then I watched the preseason games and the absolute mess that was our backline. We let in goals in all but one of the games and we still had problems scoring, even with Gilberto on the field. I don't think Defoe will be as good as everyone says, at least in his first season in MLS. Sure TFC has a little more quality, but the same issues that bit us last year are still there in this iteration.


In the few preseason games I saw from other teams, I saw defences in shambles as well. I'm not sure we can take that as what we should expect of this team. If it is, we aren't the only one in trouble there.

This isn't the EPL*. Reality is the MLS is a league where any team can beat another on any given night. Worst team can hand the first place team a spanking and no one would bat an eyelash to it. Parity is still there to a strong degree.

I don't think this team is solid, but they are not the worst either.
With the lineup they have, I don't see why they couldn't finish middle of the table this year.

Going back to the 2010 Red Bulls example. Even though Henry only scored a hand full of goals his first year, NY still managed to make up 30pts from the previous season.

*(I use the EPL as an example, but you can swap in any other major world league)

Initial B
03-04-2014, 01:22 PM
Good point about this being a parity league. The bookies must hate handicapping MLS games. I guess that's why they follow the CSL.

jabbronies
03-04-2014, 01:37 PM
Good point about this being a parity league. The bookies must hate handicapping MLS games. I guess that's why they follow the CSL.

But this is TFC...and they are more than capable of finishing dead last. So I wouldn't bat an eyelash if that happened as well lol

pdubs
03-04-2014, 04:03 PM
Remember when we beat the eventual MLS champs Sporting KC early last season? Yeah anything can happen.

I think the addition of Orr/Bloom will solve most of our back-line problem. Hopefully Morrow will settle in. Biggest worry is if Caldwell misses time. With Boss/Hagglund/Richter and primary backups..eeep.

pawlukj
03-04-2014, 08:21 PM
All I do know is that I am excited to get to some games... I think that the organization has provided us with a roster that is very worthy of fan attendance and something to not only look forward to but be proud about. As we have Bradley, Derosario back, and a surprise hit in Defoe.. plus Julio Caesar. I think we are being treated this year to a "show boat" team. How far that boat will actually go is up in the air but that is part of the fun in the excitement and seeing and hoping for some results. We can't be too harsh on the team yet we do need to elevate the standards in the club because with a roster such as this it is imperative that we get work done. In any event, and the moral to the story is congrats to TorontoFC for providing us with what should be a pretty sick season!

Initial B
05-19-2014, 12:38 PM
Okay, we're 1/4 of the way into the season and at it's current PPG TFC will end up with 51 points at the end of the season, which is about the average everyone expected at the beginning of the season. Nice to see our collective gut-feeling seems to be on track this year. But will that be enough to get into the playoffs this year?

BuSaPuNk
05-19-2014, 01:04 PM
Okay, we're 1/4 of the way into the season and at it's current PPG TFC will end up with 51 points at the end of the season, which is about the average everyone expected at the beginning of the season. Nice to see our collective gut-feeling seems to be on track this year. But will that be enough to get into the playoffs this year?

It's too hard to determine this early the magic number we should be aiming for. However no one has been running away with it this season and there's teams in positions that I don't think will still be there in 3-4 months.

I think we're in a perfect spot. Lots of games in hand and have done well to begin the season. And having multiple road wins is a plus.

We're looking good. But we have to get wins while Bradley is away an bank points against teams that are had off because of the WC like SKC.

Pookie
05-19-2014, 05:21 PM
Okay, we're 1/4 of the way into the season and at it's current PPG TFC will end up with 51 points at the end of the season, which is about the average everyone expected at the beginning of the season. Nice to see our collective gut-feeling seems to be on track this year. But will that be enough to get into the playoffs this year?

Interesting.

If 51 is the number, it would likely give Nelsen Coach of the Year honours for a 22 point turn around. One of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

If people really believe in 51 points, why is there a "Is Nelsen the right man for the job" thread?

Canary10
05-19-2014, 05:25 PM
Interesting.

If 51 is the number, it would likely give Nelsen Coach of the Year honours for a 22 point turn around. One of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

If people really believe in 51 points, why is there a "Is Nelsen the right man for the job" thread?

Very good question. That thread is running in isolation to our actual results.

BuSaPuNk
05-19-2014, 05:28 PM
Interesting.

If 51 is the number, it would likely give Nelsen Coach of the Year honours for a 22 point turn around. One of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

If people really believe in 51 points, why is there a "Is Nelsen the right man for the job" thread?

Because no matter what people don't believe in him as a coach. Some have good views and concerns and some just don't believe he's a coach at all.

If were on pace for this at the half way mark of the season I don't see how anyone could argue that he doesn't deserve to keep his job. On pace for the single largest turn around in leauge history.

Kaz
05-19-2014, 06:23 PM
Interesting.

If 51 is the number, it would likely give Nelsen Coach of the Year honours for a 22 point turn around. One of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

If people really believe in 51 points, why is there a "Is Nelsen the right man for the job" thread?

Three game losing streak will do that, when you don't win a Regular season game in a 6 week stretch it's hard on peoples reactions.

defensor
05-19-2014, 07:27 PM
Interesting.

If 51 is the number, it would likely give Nelsen Coach of the Year honours for a 22 point turn around. One of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

If people really believe in 51 points, why is there a "Is Nelsen the right man for the job" thread?
TFC was what 3rd last in points last year and then spent the most in the summer in MLS history? it should be one of the largest single season improvements in MLS history.

Initial B
07-19-2014, 10:54 PM
Well, we're now at the halfway point and TFC is on track to end up with 52 points. It's just about identical to the pace through the first quarter of the season. Assuming we don't have a terrible drop in form in July/August, I think playoffs are doable. Nelson probably won't be up for coach of the year though, since Olsen has made an even bigger turnaround at DCU.

Cashcleaner
07-20-2014, 01:17 AM
^ We're currently sitting on 26 points with a record of 7 - 5 - 5. Not too shabby, and especially good compared to previous seasons. Playoffs are very doable.

Also, we're still only at 17 games played while most other clubs in the league are 19, 20, and 21.

Initial B
09-07-2014, 09:15 PM
It's amazing the difference a quarter-season makes, isn't it? Next year, I think I'll shut up and not speculate about a July and August loss of form. I recommend everyone take a look back at the first page and look at the prediction posts. It's quite entertaining.

At their current pace, TFC should end up with 43 points at the end of the season. Is that enough for a playoff spot? Who knows. Still they're doing better than I predicted at the start of the season, when I expected 38 points.

Ultra & Proud
09-08-2014, 10:10 AM
I was thinking we'd probably end up around 35 after these past few matches but after realistically looking at the schedule, I will say 41.

Lennon
09-08-2014, 11:32 AM
44 points minimum for me.
Wins against Chivas, Houston, Montreal at home and draws with Chicago and Portland.

Initial B
10-26-2014, 12:22 AM
From 8 months ago.


I think it's going to be a rocky start, say 3-5-3 leading up to the World Cup break. I'm sure injuries are going to expose our lack of depth, even as they start to gel. I figure that they'll go 7-11-5 the rest of the way. Unfortunately, that's only 38 points. Before preseason, I was thinking that TFC might be lucky to get 50 points, but even now I see that was optimistic.

Sorry big Tim, there will be no playoffs this year. Better figure out what you guaranteed if TFC didn't make the playoffs (I'm hoping refunds of some sort).

You guys saw their defense. I assumed that we would be as good or better than last year and that would net us points along with more goals scored. But now I see that we have no depth beyond the line of Orr - Caldwell - Henry - Morrow. Once one of them goes down, opposing teams will exploit that weakness in our backline for goals. Assuming that Defoe and Gilberto will struggle, we'll only post a 9 point improvement over last year. It's too bad, I really had high hopes for this year. We'd better brace ourselves for more disappointment. Hopefully everything will come together in 2015.

TFC ends the season with 41 points. A little better than I thought they'd do originally, so I'm willing to say they were successful. However, there are a lot of disappointed fans this year as expectations were higher based on hype. I hope next year whoever is the coach will have all the pieces in place and healthy for the start of the season. I won't even begin to guess what will happen in the off season. I'll just wait around until March and see if there's any hope for 2015.

Ultra & Proud
10-26-2014, 08:33 AM
I was thinking we'd probably end up around 35 after these past few matches but after realistically looking at the schedule, I will say 41.
I predicted every fixture result correctly except I had us drawing Portland and beating Montreal. I knew there was no hope with Vanney on game #1 of his tenure and he did nothing to show me otherwise. He stays next year andvI am calling for 38 points and a new manager by June 30th.

jabbronies
10-27-2014, 10:51 AM
41-45 pts.

They will Toronto Blue Jays this season and fuck it right up.

What do i win?

Voodooman
10-27-2014, 10:57 AM
Damn, well done guys. I thought we would squeak into playoffs with 46-50 pts.

Oh well, can't get them all.

Initial B
10-27-2014, 12:06 PM
What do i win?
Bragging rights for next year. :)

JuliquE
10-27-2014, 05:27 PM
What do i win?
The wrath of everyone blaming you for the hex. =P

jabbronies
10-30-2014, 09:18 AM
The wrath of everyone blaming you for the hex. =P

I'll take this prize.

The "bragging rights" prize just doesn't seem right.