Sat 1 Mar 1pm: Mickey Mouse Cup Game 4, TFC v. Fluminense FC

[Oldtimer]

A chance to see Cesar play against a Brazilian side? Should be entertaining to watch, and give more game minutes to TFC's starting 11.

[tfcleeds]

No doubt he'll be pumped for this one. As a former Flamengo player, he'll want to put one over his former rivals, Fluminense.

[Yohan]

Or, Nelsen may just put out the reserves.

Fluminense kids haven't looked exactly good. Technically decent, but not well organized. Played mentally weak IMO

[prizby]

out of curiosity, anyone think TFC will have a closed door friendly next week sometime, maybe against Rochester?

[tfcleeds]

^Would make sense if they did - 2 weeks is a long time, they'll be rusty for the season opener if they don't.

[Areathrasher]

I was thinking the same thing. They are going to have to do something over the next 2 weeks.

[Leedsoronto]

#TFClive Starting XI: Bendik, Hall, Henry, Caldwell, Morgan, Jackson, Bradley, Bekker, Rey, Wiedeman, De Rosario

[Dunkers]

Is there a youtube stream? Or only the Torontofc.com one?

[Waggy]

Is the tfc live stream working for anyone else? Or is it just me it's not loading for?

[AlanO]

Is the tfc live stream working for anyone else? Or is it just me it's not loading for?

Not working for me either. Won't load.

[David_Oliveira]

Now Working for me


Is the tfc live stream working for anyone else? Or is it just me it's not loading for?

[Pookie]

Working for me.

Just came in from shoveling... again. That grass and sunshine look soooo nice right now. Hopefully by May, it melts in Ontario.

[Leedsoronto]

Nothing?

[Waggy]

Now Working for me

God damn it. Just because it's the mickey mouse tourny doesn't mean they should keep using the stream powered by a mouse running on a hamster wheel

[AlanO]

Just started working

[adam1001]

I'm surprised Cesar isn't starting

[Pookie]

Starting XI: Bendik, Hall, Henry, Caldwell, Morgan, Jackson, Bradley, Bekker, Rey, Wiedeman, De Rosario

[Waggy]

It's alive!!

[jloome]

Nothing?

Refresh, it's there now.

Fluminese u23's have been run over all week; they might play hard today, try to get at least one goal or result before heading home.

[Waggy]

Someone needs to tell TFC that they need to program a 'minimize' option in their full screen live stream. It's so freaking annoying to have to alt tab and reload the page if I decide I want to check another window. Or am I retarded?

[notthesun]

Someone needs to tell TFC that they need to program a 'minimize' option in their full screen live stream. It's so freaking annoying to have to alt tab and reload the page if I decide I want to check another window. Or am I retarded?

Press Esc?

Game underway now.

[Leedsoronto]

I hear we is winning can any one confirm

[Pookie]

I love having no commentators. All games should be like this.

Just mic the crowd, the pitch. Simple. Just like you are there.

[Pookie]

I hear we is winning can any one confirm

No score

[Waggy]

Press Esc?

Game underway now.

God bless you. So yes, I am retarded apparently haha

[Leedsoronto]

My link won't work on iphone, any one post a link here please to try

[Waggy]

I love having no commentators. All games should be like this.

Just mic the crowd, the pitch. Simple. Just like you are there.

Since the specialty channel explosion I've been BEGGING for that option for all sports. I'd LOVE to have the option to watch every sport event with no commentators, just the crowd mic'd

[AlanO]

I love having no commentators. All games should be like this.

Just mic the crowd, the pitch. Simple. Just like you are there.
+1

I like this stream.

[adam1001]

Bradley is a stud.

[AlanO]

DeRo dropping back and being unselfish with the ball. Good to see.

[notthesun]

Shows how much of a general Bradley really is out there. Yelling out to receive the ball or calling out names of teammates as the best option constantly.

[notthesun]

Nice build up leading to a wide, wide open volley in the box for Jackson. Hit it straight at the keeper unfortunately.

[daner90]

love the options of Rey and Jackson out wide....

[Pookie]

1-0 Fluminense

[JuliquE]

Morgan has never blocked a cross in his life.

[Waggy]

.....

[Dv23]

Right through three of our players on that one. Defence still not where I want it to be.

[notthesun]

1-0 for Fluminense. Right winger worked on Morgan a bit then drilled a low cross. Made it to the back post for a tap in. Really their first attack of the game.

[Lennon]

Morgan has never blocked a cross in his life.

Was just about to post this.

[Pookie]

^ seems like Fluminense has had decent possession thus far.

[Leedsoronto]

Are we looking like a Super team yet, I can't get a lookee see no iphone link :@(

[David_Oliveira]

I find out style very one dimensional. All it is is pass it to Bradley and let him deal with it. A team that can negate him from the game will have no trouble with us

[notthesun]

Bradley free kick. Beauty. 1-1.

[adam1001]

beauty 1-1

[AlanO]

Bradley with a stellar free kick goal!

[Waggy]

OOOOOOOOHHHHHHHH. Aaaaand I'm spent

[jloome]

Unstoppable. Wow.

[David_Oliveira]

I find out style very one dimensional. All it is is pass it to Bradley and let him deal with it. A team that can negate him from the game will have no trouble with us

Nevertheless, what a goal

[tfcleeds]

Awesome - looking forward to seeing more of that this season!

[Soccerpro]

Morgan has never blocked a cross in his life.

Frei never stopped a penalty, Morgan has never blocked a cross.

[jloome]

Think DeRo might have been robbed on that one, looked onside.

[David_Oliveira]

I've really liked seeing Bekker play. He's had a great preseason in my opinion

[notthesun]

DeRo bicycle/scissor kick goal off a flick on from a corner kick. Ruled offside, DeRo didn't seem to think so. I have no idea whether it was or not. Great finish though.

[notthesun]

2-1 Fluminense. Beat our defense pretty clean right there. Goal came from the right again. Morgan should get time at Wilmington.

[adam1001]

defense still sucks

[jloome]

Both central mids out of position on that goal, no pressure at the top of the box. Where was Bekker? Jogging back, not paying attention to the other side of the pitch.

[Dv23]

OH BABY WHAT A HEADER. Great response.

[adam1001]

I keep missing goals as I type! Damn

[jloome]

I've really liked seeing Bekker play. He's had a great preseason in my opinion

He's been awful. Completing less than half his passes, out of position constantly, behind the play. Today he's been okay, but on that goal he was out of position.

[notthesun]

2-2. Scored directly from the possession off the kick off. Near post cross from Rey to DeRo who gets a half step on his man and heads home.

[Leedsoronto]

Wow what a game, sounds like tfc found there level, let's enter a U23 league, we could win it !!!!!

[Stress]

Excellent finishes from De Ro (even if only one counts). Bekker actually closing down and showing some hustle which is nice.

Missed both of their goals... can you place any blame on Cesar?

[AlanO]

Excellent finishes from De Ro (even if only one counts). Bekker actually closing down and showing some hustle which is nice.

Missed both of their goals... can you place any blame on Cesar?
It's Bendik between the sticks. But IMO he couldn't have done much on either goal, was hung out to dry.

[David_Oliveira]

He's been awful. Completing less than half his passes, out of position constantly, behind the play. Today he's been okay, but on that goal he was out of position.

I think he has shown well. He will provide good depth this season and has come back better in this game. I don't think his passing has been that bad tbh. And to say he is out of position? It will take a while for anyone who plays next to Bradley to get the positioning right. The guy is all over the place (in a good way).

[Stress]

It's Bendik between the sticks. But IMO he couldn't have done much on either goal, was hung out to dry.

Lol i couldn't tell with this camera angle. they both have a similar frame from this perspective. thanks for the info.

[notthesun]

Based on preseason I see Jackson being a good but frustrating player. He likes to dribble and dribble with speed. When it works it's deadly but often he ignores open passes. On his day he'll be a huge threat but I also see him being first subbed off many times.

[notthesun]

That's the first half, 2-2 score. TFC the better team overall, 2 defensive lapses proving costly however.

[adam1001]

Based on preseason I see Jackson being a good but frustrating player. He likes to dribble and dribble with speed. When it works it's deadly but often he ignores open passes. On his day he'll be a huge threat but I also see him being first subbed off many times.
This is exactly what the Dallas fans were saying when he got traded.

[AlanO]

Bradley's a monster, and DeRo certainly looks motivated.

After Bradley's goal, and just before Fluminese kicked off at centre, was interesting to see Bradley giving DeRo instructions on what he wanted from him.

[SoccMan2]

Jackson will be the first to be subbed off for who? Oh ya for Lambe, god!

[jloome]

It will take a while for anyone who plays next to Bradley to get the positioning right. The guy is all over the place (in a good way).

This is true. The reason Bekker was out was that he didn't see Bradley switch, so he didn't track over to cover his spot. The guy does cover a huge amount of ground.

[19Barrett19]

poor this pre-season so far is Morgan, Osorio, lambe, ...... the good bradley, bekker, rey, morrow,

[notthesun]

Don't see how Osorio's been poor.

[Pookie]

This is exactly what the Dallas fans were saying when he got traded.

This is why next year is a very important year and I hope like hell they are investing in scouting.

Picking up players via trade is a challenge for TFC. They have very limited US Domestic assets to offer other teams. Picking from waivers within MLS is like picking from the scrap heap.

Next year TFC has quite a few draft picks at their disposal. They need to use them and use them well. I liked a lot of what Kevin Payne tried to do here but his 2013 draft strategy, trading down to select two Canadians, one of whom they just released, was extremely puzzling.

They need to go for talent. For Generation Adidas talent if available and stock the cupboards. It won't change the team overnight but we can't keep adding Domestics the way we have. The only TFC drafted player currently on the roster is Bekker.

A quick look at SKC's roster yields drafted players like Besler, Bunbury, Sapong, Myers. That's the way we have to go.

[notthesun]

Aparicio for Wieds in the 2nd half.

[notthesun]

Penalty to Fluminense. That's why Hall doesn't play RB anymore.

edit: Goal. 3-2 Fluminense.

[Dv23]

Another poor defensive mistake. No need for that tackle.

[mowe]

Who was that with the terrible challenge giving away a penalty? Hall?

[Pookie]

Larson tweeted it was Hall...

And they convert 3-2

[Ivy]

Wow. Penalty given away for no reason. Horrible mistake.

[adam1001]

I feel like most of the goals we give up are directly related to the incompetence/stupidity of morgan or hall or a combination of the two.

[Pookie]

4-2 now. Fun

[Dv23]

Wow falling apart out there on defence. Completely unmarked.

[jloome]

Ouch. Four guys in the box and no one watching the back post. That's not good.

Defensively, we have issues. This team hasn't scored until today.

[AlanO]

Morgan's ticket to Wilmington might be one-way if he keeps playing like this.

[notthesun]

4-2 Fluminense. Wideeeeeee open player at the back post.

Once again, that's why Hall doesn't play RB anymore. He's a decent CM and an absolutely god awful RB. Standing in the middle of the six while his man is open at the back post and he has no idea.

[daner90]

not sure why hall is even on the roster still. guy is brutal...

[adam1001]

What's up with Orr? Still injured? We haven't seen a minute of him all preseason.

[jloome]

Hagglund in at RB, hall to mid for bekker.

[cochrdoc]

I am glad this is preseason,because we are playing just like last year.We have given up 8 goals in Florida.How many goals are our 2 dp strikers supposed to score.This team will fight to stay out of the basement.Lack of depth really shows.

[Yohan]

At least this will tell nelsen to not use hall on rb for seattle. I hope

[notthesun]

What's up with Orr? Still injured? We haven't seen a minute of him all preseason.

Yup. Bloom too. Sucks having to play makeshift RBs all preseason. Hagglund to his credit has done well enough there.

[notthesun]

At least this will tell nelsen to not use hall on rb for seattle. I hope

If it comes to that I'd rather see Hagglund. Or move Jackson back.

[Soccerpro]

Just think if we had Andrew Farrell at RB. The guy that everyone in MLS wanted to pick in the draft last year, except TFC who actually had the number one pick!

[notthesun]

Did they switch camera operators at half or something? Damn this guy is slow.

This game is pretty dead right now. We pretty much stopped playing.

[reggie]

that's it for me...cant watch this crap anymore...they got a lot work to do...

[jloome]

Dunno ... Nelsen may have told them to take the foot off the gas in teh second half. Night and day performance in a meaningless friendly, so maybe that's it. This got woeful pretty quickly.

[notthesun]

Dunno ... Nelsen may have told them to take the foot off the gas in teh second half. Night and day performance in a meaningless friendly, so maybe that's it. This got woeful pretty quickly.

They totally shut it down after the penalty goal. Doesn't look like they're even trying to attack anymore.

[SoccMan2]

We will be better right? It's only preseason this means nothing, they will be one of the better teams in the MLS just give them time right? I'm hoping this preseason means nothing I'm hoping but you know after 7 seasons, well you know what I'm getting at.

[jloome]

LOL, listen to Caldwell directing the kids. Lovetz was waaaay too central there.

[notthesun]

Kene Eze came on for Hall at some point recently it seems. Aparicio drops to mid.

[notthesun]

Eze grazes the post with a low shot from the edge of the box. Decent try though he had passes on as well.

[notthesun]

That's the game, 4-2.

Commence sky is falling posts.

[jloome]

Well, the second half was putrid. The first half was pretty good, except the absence of starting fullbacks.

[Detroit_TFC]

Not sure what to say about this. After the penalty, seemed that zero fucks were given. Not saying there should have been but seems like a bad attitude at the end of preseason camp.

[tfcleeds]

Not the way you want the last preseason game to go - still got a lot of work to do before the season starts.

[Soccerpro]

I don't think anyone can deny our defence is questionable. It especially has a lack of depth.

[reggie]

not liking Jackson play that much...morgan is jus awful...maybe in my life time we may get a #10 type player.maybe defoe will sort of play that role..

[Pookie]

I don't think anyone can deny our defence is questionable. It especially has a lack of depth.

Same issues a few have been highlighting as the big names were rolling in. Only as good as the weakest player.

Maligning the D is easy. I tend to subscribe to the school of thought that D starts with forwards. If they don't hold the ball up, the mids need to. If they don't, then the D gets involved.

Our midfield is a problem area as well. Under pressure the balls get turned over and holding it up hasn't been a forte.

[nick.mastro]

This is bad...

[TFC07]

Bit nervous about first game, but thankfully TFC got plenty of time to train and gel since they don't play first week in MLS season.

[adam1001]

As long as we are relying on the likes of Morgan/Hall/Weeds, we will be in trouble. Jackson hasn't really impressed me this preseason either. I can see Defoe and Cesar becoming extremely frustrated when the season starts. Hope I'm wrong.

[Detroit_TFC]

Tim B needs to start making some calls. We need to use some of that newly freed up cap space.

[Richard]

They cant seriously think they shouldn't have another game, the D still needs work.

[pdubs]

as long as Nelson learns a few lessons from the game/preseason I am not too worried.. and look forward to our DP strikers aha
-morgan needs to go out on loan and learn defense
-never ever play Hall again. RB- use Hagglund if everyone else is injured, CM- ill take Bekker over Hall.

[notthesun]

TFC goals are up: http://www.torontofc.ca/video/channel/all

DeRo's disallowed goal is very difficult to tell from that angle but he may have been very slightly offside.

[UltraSuperMegaMo]

Is there a link to the archived stream like on the other matches? I searched "2014 Disney Pro Soccer Classic Toronto FC vs Fluminense" on Youtube?

[Yohan]

Is there a link to the archived stream like on the other matches? I searched "2014 Disney Pro Soccer Classic Toronto FC vs Fluminense" on Youtube?SKC did the youtube stream, but didn't for this game. Looks like you're stuck with just game in 6

[mowe]

I really hope Orr is fit soon. We badly need some experience on the back line.

[SKB]

Well, terrible play from RB-Hall and LB-Morgan. I was really hoping they could trade Hall in off season, but probably no takers. However, these will not be are starting backs. I assume that they will be Orr and Morrow. On the fourth goal DeRo was ball watching. Rookie mistake he should not make. To be honest I have no idea where the team is because we never had one game with are starting line up. We need to see what the team is like with Defoe, Gilberto and Bradley playing. One thing seems to becoming more evident. We do not have as much depth as we initially thought. If Caldwell, Bradley or any of our first line strikers get injured for an extended period of time we are vulnerable.

[notthesun]

I really hope Orr is fit soon. We badly need some experience on the back line.

He expects to be in full training by Tuesday. Should be 100% by Seattle.

[SoccMan2]

I'm concerned because as many have stated we don't have much depth and if this is not taken care of we will struggle for the 8th season in a row. We all know we will have injuries to our starters and we don't have much in terms of depth to come in and cover for any injuries. Guys like Morgan,Hall, Wiedeman and Lambe would have a tough time making most MLS benches as subs.

[ag futbol]

Anyone have a link to the whole game? So far I can only see the game in 6.

[notthesun]

Anyone have a link to the whole game? So far I can only see the game in 6.

Wasn't broadcast on Youtube so I don't think there's an archive of the full game. If you'd like a synopsis it's basically this: movement, passing and possession was about as good as the Philly game in the first half, but two defensive lapses led to goals. After the penalty in the first 5 or so minutes of the 2nd half they visibly stopped trying to win the game.

[Pookie]

Not on Goltv either. There were no commentators so it may not be available on any network..?

As for depth, yep. That's the challenge that this year's Koevermans/Frings 2.0 Plan brings.

Next year it is imperative to keep the draft picks AND draft well. Hopefully, with all the money being thrown around they have put a little aside to get a scout.

[OgtheDim]

...Next year it is imperative to keep the draft picks AND draft well. Hopefully, with all the money being thrown around they have put a little aside to get a scout.


Hagland's a good player, so somebody seemed to do their homework.

***


Only caught the video highlights on my phone - I was wondering who the young guy was who got that goal that wasn't. DeRo pretty flexible at his age.


And can we just give Bradley the ball in dead ball situations now unless Defoe wants them? Nobody else need apply.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Not on Goltv either. There were no commentators so it may not be available on any network..?

As for depth, yep. That's the challenge that this year's Koevermans/Frings 2.0 Plan brings.

Next year it is imperative to keep the draft picks AND draft well. Hopefully, with all the money being thrown around they have put a little aside to get a scout.

I get what your saying but who was Gilberto and Hagglund last year?

[ag futbol]

Wasn't broadcast on Youtube so I don't think there's an archive of the full game. If you'd like a synopsis it's basically this: movement, passing and possession was about as good as the Philly game in the first half, but two defensive lapses led to goals. After the penalty in the first 5 or so minutes of the 2nd half they visibly stopped trying to win the game.
Thanks.

From my brief view of the highlights I would focus in on the second goal. As far as I can see that's EXACTLY how we are trying to play / break down the other team. Midfield uses their range of passing to directly find the wide players, wide players pick out the strikers who try to pull off the defenders. Still feel this plays pretty channel focused and the occasional tendency of the midfielders to stretch leave us exposed.

I'm not certain if we should be concerned about the defensive lapses or not. They might be a youth focused team but they are much more balanced than a typical MLS squad. Movement off the ball is far superior compared to what we typically play against. Have never been much of a fan of Morgan, I don't think we saw anything strange today, just more of the usual.

[notthesun]

If you look at the goals they scored our outside backs hurt us hard. The first goal Caldwell takes his man and sticks to him, but Hall is completely unaware of the drifter until it's too late (Bekker not exactly covering himself in glory either). Morgan still can't defend 1v1 either.

Second goal was more of a team breakdown, but Morgan is still caught between applying heavy pressure to block the pass, and covering the overlapping player. Instead he's useless. Those who think DeRo should play in midfield would do well to watch this goal again also.

On the 3rd goal Hall is behind his man for no reason (if he was in front he could've just cleared it). Taking another look at it now it actually seems like a totally clean tackle, but regardless there's no reason to slide in there, the guy is going nowhere.

4th goal is straight up terrible. Seems like a communication error because Hall points to the guy before the cross comes in, but Jackson doesn't respond. But that's still Hall's man to pick up and he does an awful job.

My main concern heading into the season with the defense is the fact that our RB will have no game experience with the rest of the backline. If you plug in Morrow instead of Morgan today I think we avoid a goal or two, and Morrow has had time with the rest of the group on the field. Orr will simply have to perform on the day otherwise we could be in trouble.

[ag futbol]

I'm still confused by our organization and to a certain extent the collection of players we have on this club.

[Pookie]

I get what your saying but who was Gilberto and Hagglund last year?

Not sure I understand, are you talking about depth on this year's team vs last year?

For me, I think that Domestic depth is the key to the league. Trading up to get Hagglund is an example of what we need to be doing with more regularity. To this point, the only other draft pick we had was Bekker.

A quick look at SKC's roster yields drafted players like Besler, Bunbury, Sapong, Myers still very active and contributing. We can't keep relying on trades and the waiver draft to find Domestic players.

TFC Draft History (1st round picks):

2007 - Maurice Edu (1st)
Andrew Boyens (10th)

2008
*TFC was to select 2nd overall but they traded that to Dallas to get Richard Mulroney. Dallas drafted Brek Shea
Julius James (10th)
Pat Phelan (11th)

2009
Sam Cronin (2)
O’Brien White (4)
Stefan Frei (13)

2010 – no pick, traded to Dallas for Adrian Serioux (5th overall)

2011 – no pick, traded to Vancouver for Nathan Sturgis (8th overall)

2012
Luis Silva (4)
Aaron Maund (12)

2013
Kyle Bekker (3)
Emery Welshman (16)* TFC traded down a couple of times to get Welshman. This was originally a 4th overall pick that Vancouver used to select Kekuta Manneh, a Generation Adidas player with no budget charge who scored 6 in 20 apps for the Caps last year

2014
* Originally had the 3rd overall pick but that went to Vancouver for Hassli
Nick Hagglund (10)

[reggie]

I have not seen Bekker make a tackle yet....way too soft.

[Initial B]

Morgan just earned himself a trip to Wilmington, if he's lucky. I don't know why he's in such a funk for the last two seasons. I have a feeling there's some mental issues there. Maybe he just needs to get some confidence back.

[Soccerpro]

Not sure I understand, are you talking about depth on this year's team vs last year?

For me, I think that Domestic depth is the key to the league. Trading up to get Hagglund is an example of what we need to be doing with more regularity. To this point, the only other draft pick we had was Bekker.

A quick look at SKC's roster yields drafted players like Besler, Bunbury, Sapong, Myers still very active and contributing. We can't keep relying on trades and the waiver draft to find Domestic players.

TFC Draft History (1st round picks):

2007 - Maurice Edu (1st)
Andrew Boyens (10th)

2008
*TFC was to select 2nd overall but they traded that to Dallas to get Richard Mulroney. Dallas drafted Brek Shea
Julius James (10th)
Pat Phelan (11th)

2009
Sam Cronin (2)
O’Brien White (4)
Stefan Frei (13)

2010 – no pick, traded to Dallas for Adrian Serioux (5th overall)

2011 – no pick, traded to Vancouver for Nathan Sturgis (8th overall)

2012
Luis Silva (4)
Aaron Maund (12)

2013
Kyle Bekker (3)
Emery Welshman (16)* TFC traded down a couple of times to get Welshman. This was originally a 4th overall pick that Vancouver used to select Kekuta Manneh, a Generation Adidas player with no budget charge who scored 6 in 20 apps for the Caps last year

2014
* Originally had the 3rd overall pick but that went to Vancouver for Hassli
Nick Hagglund (10)

This. Many of the top ten picks from last year's draft were studs last year. TFC could have had great players.

[OgtheDim]

One thing we don't know fully about last season was the position we were in vis-a-vis wages as left over by the geniuses that were running the team before KP got here. From what I could parse from KP and RN during interviews last season, we were at or near the cap with not that many players on the roster.

Although we could have gotten this or that player in the draft in 2013, it looks like the goal of that draft was to get allocation to help deal with the mess. In that, KP succeeded.

Moving to 2015, IIRC, TL hates the idea of giving up draft picks or position for allocation. We may trade those picks but I would be very surprised. It has become obvious that this team lacks depth, and out of 4 first round drafts next season, there should be somebody able to provide depth (like Haggelund seems to be doing this season).

As for Bekker, the guy needs to play a lot against more skillful and experienced opponents then he saw in college ball - he would get that in Wilmington. I fear though that our depth is so bad in the midfield that unfortunately, Bekker is the #3 guy this season.

[tfcocd]

This. Many of the top ten picks from last year's draft were studs last year. TFC could have had great players.

The draft history is pretty interesting. Looks like there are some very good picks (3) , a few solid picks ( 3 ) and some shocking gaps. For a club that only had 6 wins in 2011. I can't believe the 2 year gap. Fortunately next year should start a positive trend in the draft history (how many 1st round picks next year? 4?) with NCAA classes showing better quality each year. The 2015 draft alone should help upgrade the depth in players 12 - 20.

[Tony Santiago]

I'm still confused by our organization and to a certain extent the collection of players we have on this club.

What is it you're confused about?

[Tony Santiago]

One thing we don't know fully about last season was the position we were in vis-a-vis wages as left over by the geniuses that were running the team before KP got here. From what I could parse from KP and RN during interviews last season, we were at or near the cap with not that many players on the roster.

Although we could have gotten this or that player in the draft in 2013, it looks like the goal of that draft was to get allocation to help deal with the mess. In that, KP succeeded.

Moving to 2015, IIRC, TL hates the idea of giving up draft picks or position for allocation. We may trade those picks but I would be very surprised. It has become obvious that this team lacks depth, and out of 4 first round drafts next season, there should be somebody able to provide depth (like Haggelund seems to be doing this season).

As for Bekker, the guy needs to play a lot against more skillful and experienced opponents then he saw in college ball - he would get that in Wilmington. I fear though that our depth is so bad in the midfield that unfortunately, Bekker is the #3 guy this season.

Our team has way more depth than it did last year. I'm not sure how you say our depth in midfield is "so bad" that Bekker is the #3 guy (whatever that is). Our midfield is stacked by MLS standards. Bradley, De Ro, Rey, Osorio, Jackson, Hall, Lambe all are ahead of Bekker. That's a good midfield. I agree that Bekker should go to Wilmington to get experience. In my personal opinion he's not that good, so I don't really care where he goes. You can't learn heart.

You mentioned it. We were put in a horrible spot by Aaron Winter. TFC was capped out and had a terrible roster. We had the two highest paid defenders in the league (O' Day and Eckersley) and both were awful.

[Fort York Redcoat]

This. Many of the top ten picks from last year's draft were studs last year. TFC could have had great players.


Easy, friend. That's a sad road to travel.

Could'a Cres.
Should'a St.
Would'a Ave.

All on the wrong side of the tracks...:banghead:

[Fort York Redcoat]

Not sure I understand, are you talking about depth on this year's team vs last year?



Love all the draft work. It paints a picture but I respectfully disagree that this is the same M.O. as the Frings/Koevs year.

[tfcocd]

If you look at the goals they scored our outside backs hurt us hard. The first goal Caldwell takes his man and sticks to him, but Hall is completely unaware of the drifter until it's too late (Bekker not exactly covering himself in glory either). Morgan still can't defend 1v1 either.

Second goal was more of a team breakdown, but Morgan is still caught between applying heavy pressure to block the pass, and covering the overlapping player. Instead he's useless. Those who think DeRo should play in midfield would do well to watch this goal again also.

On the 3rd goal Hall is behind his man for no reason (if he was in front he could've just cleared it). Taking another look at it now it actually seems like a totally clean tackle, but regardless there's no reason to slide in there, the guy is going nowhere.

4th goal is straight up terrible. Seems like a communication error because Hall points to the guy before the cross comes in, but Jackson doesn't respond. But that's still Hall's man to pick up and he does an awful job.

My main concern heading into the season with the defense is the fact that our RB will have no game experience with the rest of the backline. If you plug in Morrow instead of Morgan today I think we avoid a goal or two, and Morrow has had time with the rest of the group on the field. Orr will simply have to perform on the day otherwise we could be in trouble.

Fullback has been an area they are still testing the depth, trialling agboss, hagglund and even hall. Have to hope Orr and bloom are 2 and 3 on the depth chart or this could be a problem. Maybe when they return Morgan will rise to the occasion like he showed when Elmer was brought in. It's a shame he is not improving more defensively as his athleticism should give him an edge.

[ag futbol]

What is it you're confused about?
I'll try to make this short, but formation wise I still feel there is a large hole between the strikers and the mid and of course our style of 4-4-2 makes me skeptical. In the midfield I think we lack quality ball winners outside of Bradley. Confused about the way they use Jackson out wide, don't think he's up for what we ask him to do. Up front, I think Gilberto - Defoe is an odd pairing.

[jloome]

I'll try to make this short, but formation wise I still feel there is a large hole between the strikers and the mid and of course our style of 4-4-2 makes me skeptical. In the midfield I think we lack quality ball winners outside of Bradley. Confused about the way they use Jackson out wide, don't think he's up for what we ask him to do. Up front, I think Gilberto - Defoe is an odd pairing.

I agree, for the most part. I don't know how it will play out but I'm hoping we'll see some tactical nuance this year, I.e. targeting our opponents' weakest spots and not just playing horizontally but on the diagonal as well. If Bradley's going to be a roving wrecker then we need the second player to be very positionally reliant on him or to play mostly just as an in-the-hole attacker, like in a diamond. Right now, we're playing flat with the second mid basically just playing a backup role to bradley, filling the opposing space, staying deep if the general goes up etc.

I'm not sure what they'll do with Defoe and Gilberto either, but since the latter seems to play off the shoulder all the time, and we know Defoe can dribble on the run and beat guys, maybe they'll play him a little deeper.

There seemed to be a lot of triangles, and overlapping and support play, but the final ball was lacking in the last three games. They also didn't pay nearly enough attention to the opposite field and got caught too narrow several times, with no one covering the back post man or the midfielders coming up to the top of the box for second balls or layoffs.

I wonder about Jackson; he really looks more like a fullback to me. He gets in hard on the tackle and he's quite careful, he has good speed; but he makes poor decisions about trying to beat his man.

Some of our young defenders are still prone to ball watching instead of closing on the ball and being positionally aware of who's lurking behind them. We may yet need a solid veteran defender to shore things up.

[jazzy]

I'm still confused by our organization and to a certain extent the collection of players we have on this club.

he speaks for us all...................Nelson's faith in our 'bench'...without demanding better may be his undoing.

[sashavukelich]

I think it's obvious for anyone to see that we have historically drafted very poorly and missed out on SOO much talent. That hopefully this year has finally changed.

[Pookie]

Love all the draft work. It paints a picture but I respectfully disagree that this is the same M.O. as the Frings/Koevs year.

2012 Winter/Mariner Era (Moves made before end of March)

DPs: Koevermans (30) Frings (34), JDG (28)
Signed: Lambe (22), Plata (19), Eckersley (23), Caceido (32), Aceval (31), Emory (24)
Traded for: Hall (24)
Drafted: Silva, Maund

Noteworthy: Traded JDG in the summer and then acquired Eric Hassli (31)

2013 The Payne Era (Moves made before end of March)

DPs retained: Koevermans (31), Frings (35)
Signed/Loan: DP Laba (22), Osorio (21), Earnshaw (31), Russell (33), Richter (24), Bostock (23), Ephraim (25)
Traded for: Braun (26), Bendik (24),
Drafted: Bekker, Welshman, Agbossoumonde, Califf (33)

Also noteworthy signed Rey, Elmer, Urutti through the season

2014 Tim L Era

DPs: Defoe (31), Bradley (26), Gilberto (24)
Traded for: Morrow (26), Jackson (25),
Signed/Loan: DeRosario (35), Orr (31), Cesar (35)
Drafted: Hagglund


What do you see as fundamentally different about this year's plan?

About the only real noticeable difference is that the DPs are younger. Though with Defoe having a lengthy injury not sure we can say that equals healthier.

Any better off than having Urutti and Laba?

A lot of the signed/loaned guys are 30+. Tim L/B hasn't used the draft as a vehicle yet though the stockpiling of 2015 picks is encouraging. Mostly rely on signings to improve depth. Morrow/Jackson make any bigger contribution than Braun/Bendik? We'll see.

[maninb]

Orr and Morrow will be our starting RB-LB,if they are healthy....Hall and Morgan have REPEATEDLY proven they are not even at MLS caliber.

[Tony Santiago]

I'll try to make this short, but formation wise I still feel there is a large hole between the strikers and the mid and of course our style of 4-4-2 makes me skeptical. In the midfield I think we lack quality ball winners outside of Bradley. Confused about the way they use Jackson out wide, don't think he's up for what we ask him to do. Up front, I think Gilberto - Defoe is an odd pairing.

Fair enough.