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MartinUtd
12-03-2013, 05:39 PM
I’d like to see the Canadian Championship expanded.

There’s been a lot of talk about expansion lately whether it be MLS down south or a variety of different ways up here. Now I know the footy landscape is extremely fragmented in Canada and I don’t know who it falls on to take care of this, but I feel the simplest way to promote the game would be to have a proper Canadian Championship that extends beyond a 4 team, early season knock out. Since creating our own pro league seems less feasible, having that many more games competing for the Voyagers Cup would go a long way in fostering support for Canadian football.

The immediate players are obvious – Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver, Edmonton & Ottawa – still not enough for a functioning competitive environment.

Speculation Time!

So what markets could potentially house a division 2 team? There’s been noise in the past of teams in Calgary, Winnipeg, Hamilton and more recently Quebec City. If all of these could come to fruition, that would leave us with 9 professional teams. With Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary & Winnipeg in the west and Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, Hamilton & Quebec in the east, we potentially have a two division round robin that could lead into a proper knock out.

To achieve this we would have to ditch the narrow time frame we currently operate under and stretch the tournament across an entire season – much like the US open cup. Each team could play a single game against their regional counterparts and the top two from each division would enter a two legged knock out. So if TFC played in the 5 team eastern division/conference and make it to the final; that would be 4 games plus 4 more in the knock out – at total of 8 games against Canadian competition.

The tournament would have to end around the time CONCACAF starts so we can avoid hampering the previous year’s winner down the stretch, but that still allows us an extra 6 weeks.

And from there who knows where else could support a division 2 team. I could see potential markets such as Regina, Moncton, or possibly Thunder Bay attracting 5000+ on a regular basis. Maybe not the latter, but one can dream, right?

trane
12-03-2013, 05:44 PM
Let me ask this. Are Italian community based clubs going to be allowed to compete???????

[JOKE]

trane
12-03-2013, 05:45 PM
I would love to see a country wide, pro semi-pro club competition.

[ the semi-pro club I am talking about is TFC off course]

Gazza
12-03-2013, 05:47 PM
Let me ask this. Are Italian community based clubs going to be allowed to compete???????

[JOKE]

Haha, nice one. You beat me to it.

MartinUtd
12-03-2013, 05:49 PM
lol... well played. I'd like to see that too but I would think there's a broader appeal to matches between MLS and NASL teams. Plus with CBC losing the NHL, they're dying for local content... it could work.

djking2
12-03-2013, 06:03 PM
Actually a 5 team group playing each team home and away makes 8 games for each team. The winner the team with the most points is a more interesting format. Question is could they handle the travel and added games in the schedule. It's not likely gonna fit easily into the budget of teams like Ottawa and Edmonton

trane
12-03-2013, 06:26 PM
You would have to do a regional tournament first, to make it to the final tournament. three regions, every pro/semi pro team in the provincial associations or at least the winners get to compete.

Beach_Red
12-03-2013, 06:31 PM
I would love to see a country wide, pro semi-pro club competition.

[ the semi-pro club I am talking about is TFC off course]

You're on fire today.... ;)

WestStandGeoff
12-03-2013, 06:33 PM
I've thought that it would great to literally have this be a truly open cup, down to semi-pro, or even recreational levels. Not that a typical mens rec team would likely ever make it deep enough to actually play one of the MLS sides, but there would at least be the distant chance...

The lower levels could play in some regional competitions to find winners who then move on to play Ottawa/Edmonton/any other USL/NASL tier team. The winner after those rounds would then enter with the 3 MLS teams for the final knock-out round. Costs would be minimized by keeping things relatively regional until the final couple rounds, and (assuming the current set-up with Ottawa and Edmonton) it would only then be a matter of 4 clubs needing to travel which could be subsidized by the MLS clubs.

This might need to happen over the winter or something, ie. have the lower-level competitions in the fall, right after the season is over, which would either reduce the pool to 2 who then face-off with Ottawa and Edmonton right at or before the season starts back up in the spring, or at least reduce the pool to a manageable number so that the MLS teams involvement comes at relatively the same time as it currently does.

trane
12-03-2013, 07:03 PM
You're on fire today.... ;)

I thought you may appreciate that one.

trane
12-03-2013, 07:04 PM
I've thought that it would great to literally have this be a truly open cup, down to semi-pro, or even recreational levels. Not that a typical mens rec team would likely ever make it deep enough to actually play one of the MLS sides, but there would at least be the distant chance...

The lower levels could play in some regional competitions to find winners who then move on to play Ottawa/Edmonton/any other USL/NASL tier team. The winner after those rounds would then enter with the 3 MLS teams for the final knock-out round. Costs would be minimized by keeping things relatively regional until the final couple rounds, and (assuming the current set-up with Ottawa and Edmonton) it would only then be a matter of 4 clubs needing to travel which could be subsidized by the MLS clubs.

This might need to happen over the winter or something, ie. have the lower-level competitions in the fall, right after the season is over, which would either reduce the pool to 2 who then face-off with Ottawa and Edmonton right at or before the season starts back up in the spring, or at least reduce the pool to a manageable number so that the MLS teams involvement comes at relatively the same time as it currently does.

That is kind of what I was talking about. I would love to see it.

Initial B
12-03-2013, 10:09 PM
To be honest, I don't like USSA format for deciding their CCL spots - it's always last year's team, which might have gone through some serious changes in the off season that makes them weaker. I prefer the Canadian format since you know the capabilities of the team entering the CCL for that year.

Eventually I'd like to see the Canadian Championship be a home-and-away, 3-round knockout tournament to be completed on Wednesdays from mid-June through the end of July. The top seeds would be the MLS teams and the highest Ranked Canadian NASL team. Any other teams that wanted to join the tournament would have to play for one of four remaining spots, in whatever format is to be decided, so long as it's completed by the beginning of June.

I like the idea to have teams sectioned into four groups on a regional basis (BC, Prairies, Ontario, Quebec/Maritimes?). They would play a single game against each group member starting in Mid-April until the beginning of June. The winner of each group gets to play in the Knockout Rounds - Pacific plays Vancouver, Prairies play the top NASL team, Ontario plays TFC, and Quebec/Maritimes play Montreal. It would at least make the first round affordable for whatever teams make it that far. If the underdogs make it further than that, well, they deserve to have the CSA possibly subsidize their travel expenses. :)

pdogg
12-03-2013, 11:07 PM
To be honest, I don't like USSA format for deciding their CCL spots - it's always last year's team, which might have gone through some serious changes in the off season that makes them weaker. I prefer the Canadian format since you know the capabilities of the team entering the CCL for that year.

I get what you're saying, but the CCL itself spills over two seasons already. Silva wasn't even on the roster, but played a huge part in the Galaxy Dome game. I like the idea of having the lower league teams play in 2014 for a spot in the 2015 tourney. It also gives them a chance to gear up, raise funds, whatever they need to do. If smalltown Alberta is going to host one of the MLS teams, it will give them a chance to get set-up, sell tickets and ensure financial viability.

Red CB Toronto
12-03-2013, 11:56 PM
Once you have sixth pro team in this country, I could see a format where you have two groups of three playing home away with a one game final played between the two group winners.

Wince
12-04-2013, 12:12 PM
Speculation Time!

Here's some speculation... My dream would be to have multiple rounds similar to the FA cup, but with the earlier rounds involving Provincial Challenge Cup winners, or smaller clubs. Advancing to the next round you get a shot at tougher competition until in the final round, if the small fish make it that far, you square off against the MLS/NASL clubs (who'd have an automatic buy into this last round).

So Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, Hamilton & Quebec get into the last round, but it could could get rounded out to 8 teams if it were guaranteed that one 1 winner of each region advanced this far.

I don't think it'll ever happen, but as you said, one can dream.

Fort York Redcoat
12-04-2013, 12:37 PM
Until Canada has a national league to speak of we could only really use the American Pyramid MLS, NASL, USLPro. Below that is all development. I'd rather see the grass roots of this structure be on solid ground then look to include more teams just to make up the numbers.

Mark in Ottawa
12-04-2013, 02:46 PM
Why not a true FA cup?? If the brits can figure out a way to run a competition with 700+ teams in it surely we in Canada can set an eligibility requirement and attract 100 or so teams from across the nation to start regional playdowns. Add the professional teams at later stages to finish up.

Yohan
12-04-2013, 02:50 PM
Why not a true FA cup?? If the brits can figure out a way to run a competition with 700+ teams in it surely we in Canada can set an eligibility requirement and attract 100 or so teams from across the nation to start regional playdowns. Add the professional teams at later stages to finish up.
again, this comes down to funding. it is a losing money proposition, and CSA would have to pinch in a lot of money to make it work. CSA also being cheap and poor, and they have other requirements, like WWC to worry about.

MartinUtd
12-04-2013, 02:56 PM
We need to forget about including semi-pro clubs for the time being. As much as I've love to see a proper tournament with dark horses playing MLS clubs, it's just not goign to happen given the fractures in the 3rd and 4th division. Just look at the mess involving the CSA/Ontario League 1 and SFC/CSL. Not to mention the fact that we've got similar level clubs playing in US leagues.

That's not even taking into account the financial ramifications of prompting small clubs to book a flight to Edmonton.

trane
12-04-2013, 03:38 PM
Why not include the leagues like the CSL? You would get pretty good draws at these games. Or at least allow the league winners to compete.

Yohan
12-04-2013, 03:44 PM
Why not include the leagues like the CSL? You would get pretty good draws at these games. Or at least allow the league winners to compete.
Because CSL is not sanctioned by CSA or OSA

MartinUtd
12-04-2013, 03:50 PM
Yeah there's a whole can of worms there that needs to be avoided. As great as it would be to have full inclusion, the path the CSL has taken makes in impossible for any of their teams to be eligible for FIFA (thus CONCACAF) sanctioned tournaments.

QBall
12-04-2013, 04:31 PM
While it would be nice to have more teams in the competition, seeing how Edmonton has never beaten Vancouver, Montreal or Toronto (no jokes!) I don't see how adding more teams from lesser leagues would do anything to improve competition. It's kind of like women's hockey. You can add all the teams from other nations that you want but in the end gold and silver goes either to Canada or the U.S. and that's not going to change any time soon.