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View Full Version : Matchday 33: Toronto at Chicago, Sat 19 Oct, 830pm



Yohan
10-09-2013, 01:02 AM
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/goalie-stefan-frei-may-get-1-more-toronto-fc-start-1.1930474?cmp=rss

Bye week, but with Bendik suspended, looks like Frei will get one more start for TFC.

Chicago is in the hunt for final playoff spot.

pdubs
10-09-2013, 09:09 AM
Hall is also out with yellow card accumulation

CommradePolski
10-09-2013, 02:12 PM
We are going to lose. And its ok. 2-1 odds that Mr. Mike "Bradley Cooper" Magee (Magoo) scored for the fire.

Richard
10-09-2013, 02:30 PM
Frei should be given the last two games, no ifs, ands, or buts.

OgtheDim
10-09-2013, 02:50 PM
You know, I get the whole "Frei did a lot for us." sentiment. But, I am getting tired of people who think that if he isn't in goal for these last two that it is a crime against humanity worth mounting the barricades and a fireable offence.

He's a player.

He has done well for us.

His contract is too large for us.

He will be gone.

Sure, if he gets two games to end the season, great. I'd love to see him stop a penalty in Extra time against Di Vaio to put Montreal out of the playoffs.

But, if he is one player in a long line we will see come and go over the years. I can not afford myself the luxury of anger for things not being done on the pitch for sentimental reasons.

BTW, I got angry at how Frings was honoured - and people shrugged and said "Meh..."

pdogg
10-09-2013, 03:32 PM
You know, I get the whole "Frei did a lot for us." sentiment. But, I am getting tired of people who think that if he isn't in goal for these last two that it is a crime against humanity worth mounting the barricades and a fireable offence.


I was a vocal supporter of Frei receiving two last games way back in mid season and have since been resigned to him not playing the rest of the season. I've seen many of the players who have put everything behind the badge become victims of idiocy in the back office come and go. I want to see Frei play, but the realistic part is that he wouldn't be playing if Bendik didn't get the second yellow.

There are very few players left on this team that fans will be able to identify with - it was always nice knowing #24 was still there. I have a few jerseys, but only one with a name and number on the back. Same with the wife.

So it's not a fireable offence, but it plays a large part in how I feel about the team. It shouldn't be about the name on the back of the jersey, but a bit of recognition for those who played for the team and not the number shows class. I'm sure Nelsen appreciated the send off he received at QPR, he's only months removed from that.


The retiring All Whites captain Ryan Nelsen has played his last game in English football's Premier League, and the 35-year-old stalwart was sent off the pitch at Queens Park Rangers' home ground of Loftus Road by a guard of honour from his team-mates.

He played a half season, encompassing 21 games for them. Not 5 seasons and 98.

Yohan
10-09-2013, 03:34 PM
I was a vocal supporter of Frei receiving two last games way back in mid season and have since been resigned to him not playing the rest of the season. I've seen many of the players who have put everything behind the badge become victims of idiocy in the back office come and go. I want to see Frei play, but the realistic part is that he wouldn't be playing if Bendik didn't get the second yellow.

There are very few players left on this team that fans will be able to identify with - it was always nice knowing #24 was still there. I have a few jerseys, but only one with a name and number on the back. Same with the wife.

So it's not a fireable offence, but it plays a large part in how I feel about the team. It shouldn't be about the name on the back of the jersey, but a bit of recognition for those who played for the team and not the number shows class. I'm sure Nelsen appreciated the send off he received at QPR, he's only months removed from that.



He played a half season, encompassing 21 games for them. Not 5 seasons and 98.
someone should remind Nelsen of this.

though I am really of opinion that best player should play, especially if the game has playoff implications for Montreal (and Frei really had a terrible time giving up 6 goals last time he faced Montreal)

Pint
10-09-2013, 04:01 PM
100th appearance and a chance to knock Montreal out of the playoff... would be the right way to send him on his way.

Richard
10-09-2013, 04:07 PM
someone should remind Nelsen of this.

though I am really of opinion that best player should play, especially if the game has playoff implications for Montreal (and Frei really had a terrible time giving up 6 goals last time he faced Montreal)


I would rather have a rusty Frei than someone who has 25 games total as a professional in Konopka. But we don't know the form of the player is in training, who knows what happens but surely he has to be ahead of Konopka.



Years

Team

Apps†

(Gls)†



2004

Jersey Falcons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Falcons)

8

(0)



2007

Kansas City Wizards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City_Wizards)


(0)



2008

Bohemian FC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_FC)


(0)



2009

Sporting Fingal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sporting_Fingal_F.C.)

3

(0)



2010

Waterford United (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterford_United)

12

(0)



2011

New York Red Bulls (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Red_Bulls)

1

(0)



2012–2013

Philadelphia Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Union)

1

(0)



2013–

Toronto FC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_FC)


(0

Pint
10-09-2013, 04:12 PM
I would rather have a rusty Frei than someone who has 25 games total as a professional in Konopka. But we don't know the form of the player is in training, who knows what happens but surely he has to be ahead of Konopka.



Years
Team
Apps†
(Gls)†


2004
Jersey Falcons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Falcons)
8
(0)


2007
Kansas City Wizards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City_Wizards)

(0)


2008
Bohemian FC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_FC)

(0)


2009
Sporting Fingal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sporting_Fingal_F.C.)
3
(0)


2010
Waterford United (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterford_United)
12
(0)


2011
New York Red Bulls (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Red_Bulls)
1
(0)


2012–2013
Philadelphia Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Union)
1
(0)


2013–
Toronto FC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_FC)

(0




I think what he was saying is he would play Bendik against Montreal if we have a chance to knock them out of the playoffs.

Yohan
10-09-2013, 04:25 PM
I think what he was saying is he would play Bendik against Montreal if we have a chance to knock them out of the playoffs.
correct

QBall
10-14-2013, 07:57 AM
Chicago desperately needs the win if they want to hold on to a playoff spot so I imagine they'll come out guns blazing. Then again TFC have nothing to lose so they could spend the entire time playing keep away with Chicago and then maybe sneak in a goal when the Fire lose their minds and slip up. Could be an entertaining game after all.

Graeme
10-17-2013, 01:52 PM
I’m not even sure who is benched/injured on the team these days, but here’s my projected line-up:
--------------------Frei---------------------------
--Ecks-----Henry--Caldwell-----Morgan--
Rey--------Osario------Hall---------Convey
-------------Dike--Earnshaw-------------------

Let's steal a game here!

Leedsoronto
10-17-2013, 02:03 PM
If Frei is starting this game then Q Roberts should get a start with the reserves.

We should win this one, 2-0 clean sheet for Frei. :@)

Initial B
10-17-2013, 02:47 PM
We still don't have anyone who can score reliably, the backline still makes mistakes, and TFC is playing an away game. I say Chicago wins 2-1.

tfcleeds
10-17-2013, 02:59 PM
Hall out for this game too (suspension). I was under the impression people had forgotten about this game, lol.

Red4ever
10-17-2013, 03:20 PM
First (and likely only) game ever cheering against TFC. Gonna be a hoot.

--------------------Caldwell------------------
--Bekker-----(left blank)--Earnshaw-----Weideman--
--Dike-------Morgan---Russell (RC 2')-----Braun--
-------------Eckersley--Frei--------------

CommradePolski
10-17-2013, 03:22 PM
--------------------Frei------------------
--Bloom-----Henry--Caldwell-----Morgan--
--Rey-------Osario---Russell-----Convey--
-------------Dike--Earnshaw--------------

Bench: Richter, Konopka, Bekker, Agboss, Braun, Weideman, Eckersley

Ecks on the bench because we need the body. I torn between Morgan and Elmer starting. I think it will be Morgan over Elmer

cwell
10-17-2013, 03:44 PM
Russell for Hall, I would think.

69Chevy396
10-17-2013, 04:01 PM
100th appearance and a chance to knock Montreal out of the playoff... would be the right way to send him on his way.
At this point I doubt Frei could give a shit about playing anymore onthis miserable team. Not his fault he is overpaid. This team has a deplorable record of developing its draft players, Frei, in my opinion, had far more raw talent and ability, and potential, than the bum they have now. A year or two out of this mess and Frei will regain his confidence and become the player we thought he would become. And like so many others who have departed, we will read in these threads nothing but unfounded garbage laying blame on the player rather than the dreadful coaching that brings us year after year of unwatchable soccer. Canada now ranked at 111, and our best TFC players sit onthe bench when the NT plays. Very telling. If Frei is expendable, so are all the others.

Yohan
10-17-2013, 04:11 PM
At this point I doubt Frei could give a shit about playing anymore onthis miserable team. Not his fault he is overpaid. This team has a deplorable record of developing its draft players, Frei, in my opinion, had far more raw talent and ability, and potential, than the bum they have now. A year or two out of this mess and Frei will regain his confidence and become the player we thought he would become. And like so many others who have departed, we will read in these threads nothing but unfounded garbage laying blame on the player rather than the dreadful coaching that brings us year after year of unwatchable soccer. Canada now ranked at 111, and our best TFC players sit onthe bench when the NT plays. Very telling. If Frei is expendable, so are all the others.
Henry started for game vs Australia.

OgtheDim
10-17-2013, 04:47 PM
I kinda lose respect for people that call Bendik a bum just so they can whine about the team as a whole.

JayMolly
10-17-2013, 07:39 PM
At this point I doubt Frei could give a shit about playing anymore on this miserable team. Not his fault he is overpaid. If Frei is expendable, so are all the others.


It is too bad that it comes down to looking at what a player makes vs looking at a players ability . . .
O'Dea is gone, injury aside Danny K. will be gone and of course Ecks sits on the bench and may be gone too!

Fort York Redcoat
10-18-2013, 06:48 AM
At this point I doubt Frei could give a shit about playing anymore onthis miserable team. Not his fault he is overpaid. This team has a deplorable record of developing its draft players, Frei, in my opinion, had far more raw talent and ability, and potential, than the bum they have now. A year or two out of this mess and Frei will regain his confidence and become the player we thought he would become. And like so many others who have departed, we will read in these threads nothing but unfounded garbage laying blame on the player rather than the dreadful coaching that brings us year after year of unwatchable soccer. Canada now ranked at 111, and our best TFC players sit onthe bench when the NT plays. Very telling. If Frei is expendable, so are all the others.

Then you're wrong. Frei genuinely cares for the fans in this city and therefore wants to play and win for this team. The organization relationship obviously isn't going his way but I think he knows he can shine elsewhere. The question isn't if he has value. The question addressed is how much and how long can we afford to wait? If we were a complete team going forward but for the Goalkeeping I'd be up in arms.

BuSaPuNk
10-18-2013, 07:42 AM
To me if Frei wants to stay and told the FO he was willing to say for say 90k or so or even lower if say bring him back.

We know what we have in Frei. A soild keeper that is a starter that has top ability. If Bendik goes down at all (knock on wood) do we really rely on Konopka?

Guy has played only a handful of games in the last few years. Or do we go with a reliable backup who has almost 100 games under his belt?

Konopka at 46-48k and very little playing time in the last few years or Frei with almost 100 games of experience and wants to be here?

OgtheDim
10-18-2013, 08:15 AM
No way Frei stays for 90K as a backup.

He can make as much as he currently makes, in Europe, as a backup.

BuSaPuNk
10-18-2013, 09:39 AM
No way Frei stays for 90K as a backup.

He can make as much as he currently makes, in Europe, as a backup.

Don't think money is an issue to Step. He wants to stay loves the city and if given the oppurinity to stay by Biz and TL he would. Unfortunately I don't see it happening.

Richard
10-18-2013, 09:42 AM
I dont see why he would want to stay, sure he may love the city and the fans but he hasnt started in two years.

He wants to start and get his career back on track, he cant do that here.

JayMolly
10-18-2013, 10:50 AM
Our football and hockey clubs are in Chicago Saturday night.
It would be great for both teams to leave with some points.
Go TFC Go, Go Leafs Go!
J&M

Fort York Redcoat
10-18-2013, 01:53 PM
Our football and hockey clubs are in Chicago Saturday night.
It would be great for both teams to leave with some points.
Go TFC Go, Go Leafs Go!
J&M

Joe's will have both on tomorrow plus basesball I'm sure.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 06:35 PM
Starting XI: Frei, Bloom, Calwell, Henry, Morgan, Rey, Osorio, Bekker, Lambe, Earnshaw, Dike

Bench: Roberts, Boss, Elmer, Richter, Thomas, Wiedeman, Braun

Well my interest in this game just about doubled. Not only is Bekker starting but we're not playing a DM for the first game in probably years. Hope we don't get run over in center mid.

Roberts makes the bench over Konopka, Richter over Ecks. Are we missing both Russell & Hall? I thought only one was out.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 06:45 PM
lol. did Ecks pack his bags already?

moralis
10-19-2013, 06:57 PM
Hall is suspended because of yellow card accumulation and Russel is injured

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 07:15 PM
http://www.feed2all.eu/watch/215491/1/watch-chicago-fire-vs-toronto-fc.html , in theory.

flamehawk
10-19-2013, 07:34 PM
MLSlive is showing Laba as starting .. got excited for a moment :(

Marc"2L"
10-19-2013, 07:37 PM
Nelly must of been watching Bekker in London

khso11
10-19-2013, 07:37 PM
great to see frei again

khso11
10-19-2013, 07:39 PM
bekker has to prove himself tonight, here is his chance.

__wowza
10-19-2013, 07:40 PM
it's scary to see that a TFC win would put montreal in a better playoff position.
watch this be one of the only games we actually pull out despite it's negative connotations.

AlanO
10-19-2013, 07:45 PM
oh come on, Earnshaw

khso11
10-19-2013, 07:45 PM
earnshaw should of scored, once again bloom finds someone in the box

Yohan
10-19-2013, 07:45 PM
oh Earnshaw

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 07:45 PM
Earnshaw should have scored there. Good work by Bloom.

Marc"2L"
10-19-2013, 07:45 PM
great to see frei again

Yeah... Wow

__wowza
10-19-2013, 07:46 PM
classic frei.

AlanO
10-19-2013, 07:46 PM
Big save!!

notthesun
10-19-2013, 07:46 PM
Frei, what a save. Nice to see that again.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 07:49 PM
Here's hoping Lambe doesn't have many games left starting here.

PopePouri
10-19-2013, 07:51 PM
Chicago Fire! Clap Clap ClapClapClap!

notthesun
10-19-2013, 07:58 PM
Nice moves by Rey there.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:01 PM
Hmmm.....missing a strong presence in the midfield. Bekker and Osorio running around a lot but passes are going past them.

mowe
10-19-2013, 08:06 PM
Earnshaw cmon you were CLEARLY offside. Let that one go and Bekker gets his first goal.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 08:07 PM
That wasn't anywhere near going in, goalie had it covered all the way

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:07 PM
Earnshaw cmon you were CLEARLY offside. Let that one go and Bekker gets his first goal.

It was missing to the left. And Bekker hit it into the ground.

vince93
10-19-2013, 08:08 PM
Earnshaw cmon you were CLEARLY offside. Let that one go and Bekker gets his first goal.

that was not going in

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:12 PM
Aaaa...there's the other part of Frei I remember, wayward kicks to nobody.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 08:23 PM
there are 2 kinds of DMs in MLS. strong, tenacious ones that wins balls by sheer grit, and smart, cerebral ones that reads plays to intercept.

Bekker has neither. gets pushed around too easily, nor does he read the game well

AlanO
10-19-2013, 08:25 PM
Has there ever been a player softer than Kyle Bekker?

Never seen anyone so unwilling to make even the smallest challenge.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:25 PM
So he called a foul for simulation but didn't give a yellow?

Yeah, this is this guy's 16th game.

flamehawk
10-19-2013, 08:27 PM
Paul Sharman tweeted "A former goalkeeper very much in the know questioned this week why Stefan Frei would even agree to playing this wkd. Gotta say I wonder too."

Can anyone shed some light as to why Stefan Frei shouldn't be playing this game??

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:30 PM
Any keeper who refused to play this game, or claimed an injury, would have issues finding a decent contract next season. That keeper the tweet mentions is way far out of "the know".

Greatest Ripoff
10-19-2013, 08:35 PM
I hope we stuff them in the second half. Hearing these american announcers constantly slag us off is annoying.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:45 PM
Morgan's not having a great game.

vince93
10-19-2013, 08:50 PM
Has there ever been a player softer than Kyle Bekker?

Never seen anyone so unwilling to make even the smallest challenge.

This past draft must have been the worst ever for TFC

flamehawk
10-19-2013, 08:52 PM
This past draft must have been the worst ever for TFC

Especially considering we could've obtained players like Manneh, Deshorn Brown and Farrel

Yohan
10-19-2013, 08:54 PM
Osorio seems more effective as a winger. he's not influencial enough in the centre

vince93
10-19-2013, 08:55 PM
Especially considering we could've obtained players like Manneh, Deshorn Brown and Farrel

Yes but we got our team MVP Al-O-Cation

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 08:55 PM
Chicago tv guys seemed to have missed the Fire captain throwing his arm back, twice.

And now he is comparing him to Roy Keane.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 08:56 PM
Yes but we got our team MVP Al-O-Cation
i hear that guy is wanted by every team in MLS though.

vince93
10-19-2013, 08:56 PM
Big Red, Big Red, Big Red, Big Red, Big Red, Big Red,WTF

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:00 PM
terrible handball call. Magee puts it away for 1-0 Chicago

what a trade that was for Chicago

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:00 PM
Well that's a garbage penalty call if I've ever seen one.

I guess this makes next week more interesting anyways.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:00 PM
Soft penalty but Osorio has to watch where his arms are.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:01 PM
Reffing like that makes me want to puke.

Greatest Ripoff
10-19-2013, 09:01 PM
Osorio seems more effective as a winger. he's not influencial enough in the centre

How so? All of the goals he has scored have been from playing centrally.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:01 PM
Soft penalty but Osorio has to watch where his arms are.

guy blasts straight at him. he's got like, milisec to react

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:02 PM
How so? All of the goals he has scored have been from playing centrally.

he doesn't see his teammates well. keeps missing good passes he can make. if TFC expects Osorio to run the offence, it's no good

0bl1vious
10-19-2013, 09:02 PM
The penalty call was spot on. It's the free kick that should have never happened. It was clearly off Osorio's chest.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:03 PM
"Osorio did lean into that ball"

LOL who are these commentators

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:03 PM
Soft penalty but Osorio has to watch where his arms are.

Watch where his hands are? His arms were tight to his chest! Unless you're arguing he shouldn't have turned, I don't know what he could have done to avoid the ball kicked from 10 yards away from smoking him in the upper arm...

vince93
10-19-2013, 09:03 PM
these American broadcasters are such homers, while our home broadcasters do nothing but rip tfc

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:05 PM
^^^ wow 0bl1vious... either some mega trolling, or just living up to your name.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:05 PM
lol, some of you guys...

Short of removing his arms from their sockets and hiding them behind his back there was nothing Osorio could've done there. A real amateur call, nothing Osorio did could be construed as "deliberate".

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:05 PM
guy blasts straight at him. he's got like, milisec to react

Watched it in slow mo. He twisted around and had his arm up from his side. He HAS to keep his arm down so he doesn't give the ref the opportunity to make that call.

Greatest Ripoff
10-19-2013, 09:05 PM
he doesn't see his teammates well. keeps missing good passes he can make. if TFC expects Osorio to run the offence, it's no good

All of his goals are from playing centrally. I'd say that he runs the offense well from there.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:07 PM
^^^ wow 0bl1vious... either some mega trolling, or just living up to your name.

Opinion.

Happens on the internet.

Red4ever
10-19-2013, 09:07 PM
So fun cheering against TFC this week. It's nice to have a break.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:15 PM
If we could sign just one outside back that can consistently cross the ball with decent accuracy that'd be great.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:18 PM
If we could sign just one outside back that can consistently cross the ball with decent accuracy that'd be great.

bring back O'Dea? ;)

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:18 PM
Looking forward to having 90 minutes a night from Dike next season.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:26 PM
Bekker can pass pretty well. He's a more accurate passer than any of our other CMs except Laba.

Unfortunately that's pretty much where the positives end. He needs so much more playing time. Needs to learn better decision-making and how to be more responsible defensively. And he should train beside Laba every day to learn how to carry himself with a sense of urgency and how to be tougher on the ball.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:28 PM
Bekker can pass pretty well. He's a more accurate passer than any of our other CMs except Laba.

Unfortunately that's pretty much where the positives end. He needs so much more playing time. Needs to learn better decision-making and how to be more responsible defensively. And he should train beside Laba every day to learn how to carry himself with a sense of urgency and how to be tougher on the ball.

and how to not to panic with the pressure on and make dumb ass decisions

0bl1vious
10-19-2013, 09:29 PM
^^^ wow 0bl1vious... either some mega trolling, or just living up to your name.

Classy.

PopePouri
10-19-2013, 09:29 PM
Well that game can fuck off.

notthesun
10-19-2013, 09:32 PM
Fuck it, now we knock the Limpact out of the playoffs next week. It'll all be worth it.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:36 PM
Classy.

OK then, that answers it. I guess it is trolling and not just obliviousness.

jiforio
10-19-2013, 09:36 PM
Terrible officiating and no consistency with the calls... Osorio got burnt big time, perhaps he got on the refs bad side earlier in the game?! ... 10 min. later I saw a Chicago defender hand the ball and no call (arm was up in the air as well)... Guess it just makes me more pumped to get on the officials at BMO for our last game!

Yohan
10-19-2013, 09:36 PM
that PK was soft, but can't say TFC deserved anything.

lacking a DM to break up plays centre of the pitch put TFC on back foot way too much

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:41 PM
And now get set for the next installment of "well if it hadn't been for a soft decision, we would have gotten a point there. The boys played hard and we dominated much of the game" etc. etc.


******


Reality is we gave them a lot of chances but both offences are not all that good. One great save from Frei and one great save from their keeper. We deserved to lose but more like 2-1 .

Dike and Weidman are the only strikers we have who go after the ball. Earnshaw has lost a step and Braun...well he had an open look from near the top of the box and chose to pass it square, which tells me a lot about his confidence in handling the speed fo defenders.

Henry didn't play to bad. Bloom was steady in defence. They targeted Morgan and he showed why he is a target - can't handle technical wingers.

Frei played well. One great save and steady the rest of the way. A bit wayward with some of his kicks.

Rey did OK but Lambe looked out of his depth. I really hope he's gone next season.


Bekker - can't handle the pace of the game. Has not adjusted all season. Needs a loan out. And when Osorio has to step it up in defence, he suffers.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:43 PM
Terrible officiating and no consistency with the calls... Osorio got burnt big time, perhaps he got on the refs bad side earlier in the game?! ... 10 min. later I saw a Chicago defender hand the ball and no call (arm was up in the air as well)... Guess it just makes me more pumped to get on the officials at BMO for our last game!

You know, I was saying pretty much the same thing to my wife as we were watching... I think it would sting a bit less if it seemed like we at least were on the positive side of some of those shit calls, but somehow it always seems we're the ones giving up a penalty from a ball-to-hand situation.

Bantamfan
10-19-2013, 09:43 PM
Soft penalty but Osorio has to watch where his arms are.
His arms are by his side. Where else
would they be? Waving about?

nonc
10-19-2013, 09:43 PM
that PK was soft, but can't say TFC deserved anything.

That's Nelsen Kiwi ball, gunning for the 0-0 draw. Plus, cemented Chicago win with Braun swapping out Dike.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:47 PM
That's Nelsen Kiwi ball, gunning for the 0-0 draw. Plus, cemented Chicago win with Braun swapping out Dike.

Dike is still coming off an ACL. He was looking gassed.

mowe
10-19-2013, 09:47 PM
Bekker can pass pretty well. He's a more accurate passer than any of our other CMs except Laba.

Unfortunately that's pretty much where the positives end. He needs so much more playing time. Needs to learn better decision-making and how to be more responsible defensively. And he should train beside Laba every day to learn how to carry himself with a sense of urgency and how to be tougher on the ball.

You can see why Nelson hasn't played him, Bekker is not his type of player. Doesn't get stuck in, doesn't work hard to win the ball back, lacks physicality, etc. Doesn't really fit in a flat 4-4-2. No way Nelson picks him 3rd overall. But I guess that's what you get when you hire a coach who couldn't be at the draft because he's still playing professionally.

nonc
10-19-2013, 09:48 PM
His arms are by his side. Where else
would they be? Waving about?

Incorrect, Osorio's arm was shoulder level or above. There's definitely a ball to hand element but it's kind of canceled out by not having control of his arms and their bad positioning in relation to his body. It's not a good PK call but not an awful one.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:52 PM
Dike is still coming off an ACL. He was looking gassed.

Agreed - still doesn't make the fact that our only viable option for a sub without changing formation was Braun.

Initial B
10-19-2013, 09:55 PM
Saw up to the half, then had to put my daughter to bed. Came back and saw that Chicago beat Toronto on Penalty kicks. Then I realized that my son and his friend had switched to playing FIFA14. Shooed them to bed and saw that Chicago had won on a penalty kick. *sigh*

Well, at least we have something to play for next weekend. I'd like nothing better than to stick it to the Impact.

nonc
10-19-2013, 09:56 PM
Dike is still coming off an ACL. He was looking gassed.

A gassed Dike is better than anything Braun can do. He's played 90 or nearly that a few times before today I don't see fitness as an issue. The ACL history is irrelevant if it was physically relevant he wouldn't be playing.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 09:56 PM
Incorrect, Osorio's arm was shoulder level or above. There's definitely a ball to hand element but it's kind of canceled out by not having control of his arms and their bad positioning in relation to his body. It's not a good PK call but not an awful one.

I'm having a hard time understanding what you saw... replys on TSN clearly showed the ball hitting his arm between the elbow and shoulder, with his arm tight to his torso. At worst, you can blame him for turning 90-degrees to the ball and exposing his arm, but as Yohan said earlier, it's really a matter to a fraction of a second between the ball getting kicked and it hitting Osorio.

OgtheDim
10-19-2013, 09:59 PM
Agreed - still doesn't make the fact that our only viable option for a sub without changing formation was Braun.

If we had a decent sub midfielder, we could have brought him in for Dike and pushed Osorio up - I saw that earlier this season.

But all of our 4 decent midfielders were injured or out there (Osorio, Laba, Convey, Rey). The fact we rely upon Hall and Russel and Lambe for midfield depth, and that nobody in management is talking about an upgrade there, is just mind boggling.

nonc
10-19-2013, 10:05 PM
But all of our 4 decent midfielders were injured or out there (Osorio, Laba, Convey, Rey). The fact we rely upon Hall and Russel and Lambe for midfield depth, and that nobody in management is talking about an upgrade there, is just mind boggling.

Which is why bringing Earnshaw back with significant 6 figures would be the death of 2014 TFC. Spend it on midfield, better yet bring in a DP midfielder. Two DP forwards seems comical.

Soccerpro
10-19-2013, 10:05 PM
Reggie Lambe with yet another start with no assist or goal, that must be some kind of MLS record for a winger.

And who thought signing Justin Braun to a 100k contract before the season started after being let go by two teams last year? Not me.

Go Jeremy Hall! Portland and Dallas fans couldn't understand why anyone would trade for you after being on their teams, but we're TFC so we think you're great!

These 3 players are just a small example of the TFC players who don't belong in MLS. I don't mean not playing but on the roster, I mean not in MLS.

And if Bekker somehow doesn't look great come next year, then TFC sure will sure look stupid at this draft after seeing the Rapids 2 stud rookies or Andrew Farrell - the consensus #1 pick at the draft....for everyone that is, except Kevin Payne who said both Boss and Henry were already better!! You can't make this stuff up.

WestStandGeoff
10-19-2013, 10:08 PM
Reggie Lambe with yet another start with no assist or goal, that must be some kind of MLS record for a winger.

And who thought signing Justin Braun to a 100k contract before the season started after being let go by two teams last year? Not me.

Go Jeremy Hall! Portland and Dallas fans couldn't understand why anyone would trade for you after being on their teams, but we're TFC so we think you're great!

These 3 players are just a small example of the TFC players who don't belong in MLS. I don't mean not playing but on the roster, I mean not in MLS.

And if Bekker somehow doesn't look great come next year, then TFC sure will sure look stupid at this draft after seeing the Rapids 2 stud rookies or Andrew Farrell - the consensus #1 pick at the draft....for everyone that is, except Kevin Payne who said both Boss and Henry were already better!! You can't make this stuff up.

Lol - I was thinking exactly that about Braun when he came on... hell, I was thinking that he'd barely get a spot on a USL bench with that form!

notthesun
10-19-2013, 10:09 PM
Nelsen with some praise for Frei in his post-game comments but coy on whether he'll get the start over Bendik next week.

I hope he picks Frei, I think that would actually work out well. We can give him a well earned sending off and Nelsen can avoid the politics by saying he's just rewarding players for taking their chances.

Yohan
10-19-2013, 10:24 PM
Reggie Lambe with yet another start with no assist or goal, that must be some kind of MLS record for a winger.

And who thought signing Justin Braun to a 100k contract before the season started after being let go by two teams last year? Not me.

Go Jeremy Hall! Portland and Dallas fans couldn't understand why anyone would trade for you after being on their teams, but we're TFC so we think you're great!

These 3 players are just a small example of the TFC players who don't belong in MLS. I don't mean not playing but on the roster, I mean not in MLS.

And if Bekker somehow doesn't look great come next year, then TFC sure will sure look stupid at this draft after seeing the Rapids 2 stud rookies or Andrew Farrell - the consensus #1 pick at the draft....for everyone that is, except Kevin Payne who said both Boss and Henry were already better!! You can't make this stuff up.
TFC didn't sign Justin Braun to 100k contract. He was traded to TFC by RSL for Aaron Maund

__wowza
10-19-2013, 10:38 PM
TFC didn't sign Justin Braun to 100k contract. He was traded to TFC by RSL for Aaron Maund


this just reminded me of something.. a friend asked me if i was hoping we'd tank our last two games to get a better draft spot, and then i remembered:

WE GAVE AWAY OUR TOP DRAFT PICK FOR ERIC HASSLI.

Marc"2L"
10-19-2013, 10:48 PM
this just reminded me of something.. a friend asked me if i was hoping we'd tank our last two games to get a better draft spot, and then i remembered:

WE GAVE AWAY OUR TOP DRAFT PICK FOR ERIC HASSLI.




im sure MLS will get involved and get us a pick, right?

RIGHT?

Probably just force a trade for Hall and Lambe.

Auzzy
10-19-2013, 10:58 PM
LOL the folks that can't see the replay and tell that's a straight-up bad penalty call. Awful ref.

But Chicago hit a couple of crossbars & uprights, while TFC was toothless upfront once again, so there's really not anything to complain about wrt. the result.

Bekker had a few positive moments. But the way he was running backwards, far away from Chicago's players in the midfield, fearful of challenging them, until Bekker was at the end of our penalty area, that was plain awful. Actually various TFC players were leaving them way too much room to tee up passes or long shots.

Morgan's repeated nonchalance when he's facing a player who is consistently beating him is really frustrating. Ashtone, forget that act when you keep getting burned.

Thomas
10-19-2013, 11:32 PM
Horrible passes from Becker, especially when under pressure.


Bekker can pass pretty well. He's a more accurate passer than any of our other CMs except Laba.

Unfortunately that's pretty much where the positives end. He needs so much more playing time. Needs to learn better decision-making and how to be more responsible defensively. And he should train beside Laba every day to learn how to carry himself with a sense of urgency and how to be tougher on the ball.

ag futbol
10-20-2013, 12:05 AM
Bekker needs to improve something about his game if he’s going to have a future as a professional. If he thinks he’s an attacker he needs to learn how to run defenders and attack space. Forces the pass far too often. If he’s going to be a DM or box-to-box guy he better start getting in better shape and getting stuck in more. Either way his game is disappointing.

Bekker aside, the guys we play centrally seem to take a lot of flak attack wise. I would blame at least part of this on the coaching staff. We are playing a flat 4-4-2 and forcing the ball down the channels. That doesn't put the central mids in the pockets of space to make great attacking plays very often. We have the most amateur tactics in the entire league.

Ivy
10-20-2013, 02:50 AM
I called Bekker as not being good enough for this league the first time I saw him play. He turned a lot of heads at the Combine after the free kick he scored, and having a few good passes - but that's all he still is. Has a powerful and accurate shot when given a BIG window to shoot it, and can connect a decent pass in one out of fine attempts. Unfortunately with his last few interviews, it seems to me that he is not getting along with Nelsen because he isn't getting the minutes that he feels he deserves.
Its a shame he's getting called up to the national team without being able to crack the TFC lineup - it really spoiled him.
Unless something MAJOR changes, I don't see him or Welshman staying.

Kaz
10-20-2013, 03:43 AM
Is it wrong that when I saw the twitter feed that said McGee scored on a Penalty, I instantly thought what bogus call was it this time... now I've seen the play... and I'm thinking if the ball hits his arm right on the Canadian Flag, and that arm is fully connected to his body how is that a hand ball?

We didn't play well but still that was a really really messed up call.

Blizzard
10-20-2013, 06:55 AM
Incorrect, Osorio's arm was shoulder level or above. There's definitely a ball to hand element but it's kind of canceled out by not having control of his arms and their bad positioning in relation to his body. It's not a good PK call but not an awful one.

Nonsense. The ball struck his upper arm just below shoulder level. His lower arm was out slightly but it didn’t hit hit his lower arm. The referee guessed and got it wrong. Furthermore, the first call was wrong too. Osorio took it off his midsection. No handball at all.

0bl1vious
10-20-2013, 08:15 AM
OK then, that answers it. I guess it is trolling and not just obliviousness.

Don't be so butt hurt just because my opinion differs from yours.

Fort York Redcoat
10-20-2013, 08:23 AM
this just reminded me of something.. a friend asked me if i was hoping we'd tank our last two games to get a better draft spot, and then i remembered:

WE GAVE AWAY OUR TOP DRAFT PICK FOR ERIC HASSLI.






This makes me think I'd love to see everyone change their av to a pic of the shirt they bought of an infamous TFC player. I know there's a Hassli shirt out there and thinking about some of them now will date those staunch supporters who took a chance on the name on their backs. Hassli, I remember talking to a kid who got a Robert on his back, I'd love to see the guys who got a Mista shirt...the list goes on...

ag futbol
10-20-2013, 12:04 PM
Reggie Lambe with yet another start with no assist or goal, that must be some kind of MLS record for a winger.

And who thought signing Justin Braun to a 100k contract before the season started after being let go by two teams last year? Not me.

Go Jeremy Hall! Portland and Dallas fans couldn't understand why anyone would trade for you after being on their teams, but we're TFC so we think you're great!

These 3 players are just a small example of the TFC players who don't belong in MLS. I don't mean not playing but on the roster, I mean not in MLS.

And if Bekker somehow doesn't look great come next year, then TFC sure will sure look stupid at this draft after seeing the Rapids 2 stud rookies or Andrew Farrell - the consensus #1 pick at the draft....for everyone that is, except Kevin Payne who said both Boss and Henry were already better!! You can't make this stuff up.
Exactly.

The most troubling thing about TFC right now is that this club seems to have no strategy to improve itself beyond signing a couple of star players. This isn't basketball, one or two players doesn't hide a bad roster.

Richard
10-20-2013, 12:35 PM
Classic TFC game:

Cant score
Frie makes marvalous save in game
Ref gives bogus penalty
Frie still cant stop a penalty to save his life
Loose instead of tie because of bogus call

Just about sums up the entire existance of TFC.

Yohan
10-20-2013, 01:12 PM
Exactly.

The most troubling thing about TFC right now is that this club seems to have no strategy to improve itself beyond signing a couple of star players. This isn't basketball, one or two players doesn't hide a bad roster.


No it doesnt, but one can still make the playoffs riding on hot streak of a striker. A la chicago and magee, mtl and di vaio etc

Leedsoronto
10-20-2013, 01:21 PM
How is that a penalty ? Officiating in the MLS needs to improve just as much as TFC do !!

Tony Santiago
10-20-2013, 01:55 PM
If I don't renew next year the poor officiating will have as much to do with it as anything. It's getting old. After watching 2 EPL games yesterday that were officiated professionally (even with some debatable yellows they got the big calls spot on) I couldn't handle watching MLS last night. The ref made me sick just looking at him.

OgtheDim
10-20-2013, 02:28 PM
The officiating at MLS level is never going to be as good as EPL.

By the time an official makes it to the EPL, he or she has probably done close to 200 games.

The guy last night was on his 16th - that's a Northern Conference level official in England.

ag futbol
10-20-2013, 02:41 PM
No it doesnt, but one can still make the playoffs riding on hot streak of a striker. A la chicago and magee, mtl and di vaio etc
It helps, but the core of those teams can at least be described as reasonable.

notthesun
10-20-2013, 02:51 PM
The officiating at MLS level is never going to be as good as EPL.

By the time an official makes it to the EPL, he or she has probably done close to 200 games.

The guy last night was on his 16th - that's a Northern Conference level official in England.

I think you misheard one of the commentators saying it was his 68th, because I remember hearing that and it seems to be accurate (http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/jurisevic/profil/schiedsrichter_2797.html).

OgtheDim
10-20-2013, 03:27 PM
Definately misheard, thank you.

He is one of the more experienced ones then....3 seasons.

Richard
10-20-2013, 03:28 PM
I think you misheard one of the commentators saying it was his 68th, because I remember hearing that and it seems to be accurate (http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/jurisevic/profil/schiedsrichter_2797.html).

Apparently those commentators don't know anything either.

According to this Mark Geiger has 102 MLS games reffed.

http://www.worldfootball.net/referee_summary/mark-geiger/1/1/

notthesun
10-20-2013, 04:03 PM
On the topic of hot strikers, remember last season after we ended the losing streak? We went 5-2-4 (W-L-D) over the next 11 games, then the spell ended. We had about a 1.7 points per game average during that time, enough to be into the playoffs this year stretched out over the whole season.

We did that playing awful Mariner hoofball for the most part. And the main reason we did all right is because Koevermans hit a ridiculous hot run of form, and then Silva had some nice games directly after. Koevermans scored 7 goals in the first 7 games, then Silva scored 2 in the next 3, and in the 4th had 2 assists in our 2-1 victory over Colorado, the 11th game. The Colorado match was the only one in the whole run where we had over 50% possession.

The value of a hot striker is really incredible. Koevermans tore his ACL in the match before the Colorado one, Silva cooled off, and then we didn't win again for the rest of the year. If you have a hot striker you can get a significant amount of points you don't deserve on the balance of play.

That being said, over a whole season things will balance themselves out enough that you obviously need a solid core of guys to be competitive from the get-go, which we didn't have, and so we got buried both at the start of the year and at the end, when we didn't have any strikers scoring consistently.

Tony Santiago
10-20-2013, 06:40 PM
The officiating at MLS level is never going to be as good as EPL.

By the time an official makes it to the EPL, he or she has probably done close to 200 games.

The guy last night was on his 16th - that's a Northern Conference level official in England.

I'm not asking them to be the equal to some of the world's better refs, but I don't want them to be distractingly bad. I've been watching piss poor officiating for 7 years now and I'm sick of it.

It's to the point where I honestly don't feel like renewing and the refs are playing a part in that. They need to take their officiating far more seriously.

Yohan
10-20-2013, 06:59 PM
I'm not asking them to be the equal to some of the world's better refs, but I don't want them to be distractingly bad. I've been watching piss poor officiating for 7 years now and I'm sick of it.

It's to the point where I honestly don't feel like renewing and the refs are playing a part in that. They need to take their officiating far more seriously.
MLS and USSF is working on this.
But the reffing has never been taken seriously in NA, and to get better refs, only way is for them to officiate more games. So either you accept the growing pains, or not.

The reffing still sucks, but it's way better than what it was 7 years ago.

tfcleeds
10-21-2013, 09:29 AM
This makes me think I'd love to see everyone change their av to a pic of the shirt they bought of an infamous TFC player. I know there's a Hassli shirt out there and thinking about some of them now will date those staunch supporters who took a chance on the name on their backs. Hassli, I remember talking to a kid who got a Robert on his back, I'd love to see the guys who got a Mista shirt...the list goes on...I'm beginning to regret getting an Earnshaw jersey, lol. Didn't really perform to the level I thought he would. I still don't think we saw the best of him this year - he needs service, and he really never got anything decent this season in that regard. Still wonder what a healthy Koevs and him could have done, but there's no point in speculating I guess.

Tony Santiago
10-21-2013, 10:29 AM
MLS and USSF is working on this.
But the reffing has never been taken seriously in NA, and to get better refs, only way is for them to officiate more games. So either you accept the growing pains, or not.

The reffing still sucks, but it's way better than what it was 7 years ago.

I don't think it has been much better this year than year 1, if any better at all. To say it's been way better seems odd to me because I haven't really seen it. We've had poor officiating all year.

This league is working on 20 years in existence. I don't accept that as growing pains anymore. To get better refs they simply need to hire top quality refs to start and get aggressive in recruiting and training. If they want this league to attract top talent, hire refs who would be comfortable working in some of the top leagues. Pay quality refs to get quality refereeing.

OgtheDim
10-21-2013, 11:03 AM
We don't grow top quality refs here and top quality refs from overseas are not going to come here.

The talent pool will always be domestic.

Yohan
10-21-2013, 11:05 AM
I don't think it has been much better this year than year 1, if any better at all. To say it's been way better seems odd to me because I haven't really seen it. We've had poor officiating all year.

This league is working on 20 years in existence. I don't accept that as growing pains anymore. To get better refs they simply need to hire top quality refs to start and get aggressive in recruiting and training. If they want this league to attract top talent, hire refs who would be comfortable working in some of the top leagues. Pay quality refs to get quality refereeing.
http://backpagefootball.com/top-irish-referee-to-move-stateside/64171/

http://www.proreferees.com/

edit: and in MLS, this doesn't happen... well, not yet ;)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02U9VvDfNqc

ag futbol
10-21-2013, 12:19 PM
We don't grow top quality refs here and top quality refs from overseas are not going to come here.

Well that's part of the problem.

In focus, the existing group of MLS refs have become a lot better since year 1. But, because of the growth of the league a lot more new officaials have been brought in who simply are not ready for prime time. They are now learning on the job.

MLS really only started investing more in the officiating process last year. Before that it was neglected and we are paying the price for that neglect currently.

i think it's a fair gripe about the quality of the product.

hulkrogan
10-21-2013, 12:35 PM
What a depressing game. No sign of building something towards next season.

Bekker is brutal. I can't stand watching that guy play. The fact he sees the field for Canada shows how rough of shape our program is in right now. He's lazy, unengaged, at most you hope he can get the ball to another teammate, which is not great upside from an "offensive" guy.

Earnshaw hasn't looked the same since his injury.

Rey needs Convey out there. With Lambe on the other wing they just focused on Rey and brought numbers to shut him down. He was able to bust through 3 guys with some impressive moves, but he can do so much more when he's constantly getting to go at guys 1v1 as we've seen in the past.

Bloom actually looks alright. No complaints there.

Ossorio is struggling without Laba. Not too worried, he's young, and has lots of time to round out.

Mark in Ottawa
10-21-2013, 07:02 PM
We don't grow top quality refs here and top quality refs from overseas are not going to come here.
If the league can bring in DP's why not "guest referees"??
If only for a game or two at a time. They can have some of ours ;)

To train up I mean.

Ivy
10-21-2013, 07:36 PM
http://backpagefootball.com/top-irish-referee-to-move-stateside/64171/

http://www.proreferees.com/

edit: and in MLS, this doesn't happen... well, not yet ;)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02U9VvDfNqc

LMFAO. Gold.

Richard
10-21-2013, 07:44 PM
http://backpagefootball.com/top-irish-referee-to-move-stateside/64171/

http://www.proreferees.com/

edit: and in MLS, this doesn't happen... well, not yet ;)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02U9VvDfNqc

My mind is blown, I'm still trying to figure if that is a goal or not lmao.

Wince
10-22-2013, 08:10 AM
If the league can bring in DP's why not "guest referees"??
If only for a game or two at a time. They can have some of ours ;)

To train up I mean.

Not a bad idea actually... there isn't much overlap between MLS and European seasons.

Tony Santiago
10-22-2013, 10:54 AM
We don't grow top quality refs here and top quality refs from overseas are not going to come here.

The talent pool will always be domestic.

Money talks. Pay quality people a better wage than they currently make and they'll come or offer quality people looking for an opportunity the opportunity. Hire top quality refs to teach our domestic talent and put an emphasis on it.

Why won't they come? Just because? I'm not sure of your reasoning. People go where the money is. Our league can pay for some quality players, it can afford some more quality refs too.

Yohan
10-22-2013, 11:08 AM
Money talks. Pay quality people a better wage than they currently make and they'll come or offer quality people looking for an opportunity the opportunity. Hire top quality refs to teach our domestic talent and put an emphasis on it.

Why won't they come? Just because? I'm not sure of your reasoning. People go where the money is. Our league can pay for some quality players, it can afford some more quality refs too.

USSF won't be doing too much hiring of foreign refs; it wants American refs to get experience.

Tony Santiago
10-22-2013, 05:41 PM
USSF won't be doing too much hiring of foreign refs; it wants American refs to get experience.

Doesn't MLS hire their own referees?

Yohan
10-22-2013, 07:06 PM
Doesn't MLS hire their own referees?
No. All refs are USSF/CSA sanctioned and assigned to games.

ag futbol
10-22-2013, 07:07 PM
Doesn't MLS hire their own referees?their excuse is that it's USSF managed, but really it is a hand-and-glove relationship. They've worked together since the start.

Tony Santiago
10-23-2013, 01:05 PM
No. All refs are USSF/CSA sanctioned and assigned to games.

Who pays? If MLS decided they wanted to pay more would the federations hire better quality refs? Is it related to money?

Yohan
10-23-2013, 01:06 PM
Who pays? If MLS decided they wanted to pay more would the federations hire better quality refs? Is it related to money?
I'm not sure. but one of USSF mandates is to grow the referee pool in US...

Tony Santiago
10-24-2013, 11:06 AM
I'm not sure. but one of USSF mandates is to grow the referee pool in US...

Yeah, I'm totally for that. In Canada too with the CSA.

I believe that the MLS decides how much they are going to pay their refs. I believe that if they wanted they could pay more and get better talent, and focus on training also by paying for good quality instructors. Higher salary refs would also start attracting people who could see a good career in being an MLS refs.

I hope they start heading down this avenue soon. It's very hard to see such inconsistency in the calls from week to week and even during the games themselves.