Potenial summer friendly for TFC vs Penarol of Uruguay

[moralis]

It seems Uruguayan club Penarol is looking to set up a summer friendly with Toronto FC:

Carbonero Digital ‏@CDigitalCom (https://twitter.com/CDigitalCom) 13m (https://twitter.com/CDigitalCom/status/344953298668892160) Se está negociando con el Toronto FC, de la MLS (Liga de USA), para jugar el 24, previo a la partida rumbo a Lisboa.

https://twitter.com/CDigitalCom

http://www.carbonerodigital.com/2013/06/gira-penarol-prepara-amistosos-en.html

What are your thoughts? I personally do want one. TFC MANAGEMENT NEVER LEARN. NO FRIENDLIES.

[moralis]

TFC have home league games July 20 vs New York and July 27 vs Columbus

http://www.torontofc.ca/schedule

[ag futbol]

Well, we don't necessarily have to give them the first team players. Look at is as another reserve league game...

I wouldn't have a problem with that if they handled it that way.

[David_Oliveira]

Sporting is at Nottawasaga Inn around this time no?
CONFIRMED VS SPORTING
http://www.abola.pt/nnh/ver.aspx?id=408237

O Sporting comunicou que irá defrontar o Peñarol, atual campeão uruguaio, no dia 21 de julho, durante a digressão dos «leões» no Canadá.
O clube leonino não revelou onde o encontro será disputado, mas ao que tudo indica este terá lugar em Toronto.

Sporting confirmed that they will face Penarol, the current Uruguaian champ, on July 21st, during their training camp in Canada.
The club didn't reveal where the match would be played, but it would probably be in Toronto

[moralis]

Yes, Sporting are having a week per-season trip in Alliston, Ontario at Nottawasaga Inn and playing Penarol on July 21. That is confirmed.

[burlington Red]

Good match, we can see what they have, Man Utd have just signed a lad who has only played 1 league game for them, Guillermo Varela. If big clubs like that can scout from them, then there is obviously talent there and perhaps we can snap up something

ps excuse the underlining, can't switch it off lol

[Pint]

A mid week friendly from the sounds of it... I expect a very small crowd at the game.

[Abou Sky]

It's a reserves game, which I am all for.

[[NBF]]

So they wont play TFC or who are they playing?

[Fort York Redcoat]

What are your thoughts? I personally do want one. TFC MANAGEMENT NEVER LEARN. NO FRIENDLIES.

do or don't?


No to midseason friendlies.

I can't see this as a true reserves match because our squad is never big enough in the summer madness.

TFC Management is partially responsible for who we play not if we play. MLS wants every team to have midseason friendlies because they are successful marketing tool. Just so we know who's to blame here.

[prizby]

TFC Management is partially responsible for who we play not if we play. MLS wants every team to have midseason friendlies because they are successful marketing tool. Just so we know who's to blame here.

then mls should have a break in the schedule for teams to schedule mid-season friendlies

[Fort York Redcoat]

then mls should have a break in the schedule for teams to schedule mid-season friendlies


Why the consolation request? Why say they should have a break at all when we both know they damage the game by doing it? Marketing is not a good enough reason. Much like playoffs in NA that go on forever that will not mean they ever shorten regular seasons- It's about $$$

[brad]

then mls should have a break in the schedule for teams to schedule mid-season friendlies

I agree in sentiment, but most of the time the foreign clubs are dictating the schedule, not the MLS clubs (a club like Real Madrid says we will play you on this date, take it or leave it). Would have to leave a large block of time open.

Otherwise, I just don't see the MLS saying "Sorry Real Madrid, we can't play you then. Could you come the week before instead".

[brad]

Why the consolation request? Why say they should have a break at all when we both know they damage the game by doing it? Marketing is not a good enough reason. Much like playoffs in NA that go on forever that will not mean they ever shorten regular seasons- It's about $$$

Fundamental problem with the state of the league the way it is today. Marketing is a driving concern for the league. We see it in friendlies, we see it in rules changing for player acquisitions, we see it when players like McBride come back and the league forces things to happen to put that player where they want.

Ideally, all decisions should be made for footballing reasons. They are not. That said, growing the MLS also very important, and I'm not blind to the fact that the value of such things might be beneficial to the league and the sport in the long term.

[ag futbol]

Fundamental problem with the state of the league the way it is today. Marketing is a driving concern for the league. We see it in friendlies, we see it in rules changing for player acquisitions, we see it when players like McBride come back and the league forces things to happen to put that player where they want.

Ideally, all decisions should be made for footballing reasons. They are not. That said, growing the MLS also very important, and I'm not blind to the fact that the value of such things might be beneficial to the league and the sport in the long term.
Agreed, things are over-managed. Too much tinkering with the schedule is making the end result sub-optimal.

Following TFC this year is maddening with these huge layoffs.

[Abou Sky]

Guys, marketing has gotten us very far. More $ means bigger caps means more international exposure to get big players here etc.

Until we live in Star Trek world where we all live only to better ourselves and our world, $ makes the world go round.

[glaze]

I don't see the harm in it. We are not going to make the playoffs this season. We are eliminated from the CCL. Why not give the coach and management more time to evaluate the team, and give some of the players a proper look? I don't think we can make a blanket friendlies/no friendlies statement, it should be on a year to year basis.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I don't see the harm in it. We are not going to make the playoffs this season. We are eliminated from the CCL. Why not give the coach and management more time to evaluate the team, and give some of the players a proper look? I don't think we can make a blanket friendlies/no friendlies statement, it should be on a year to year basis.

Disagree but I won't take away from those fans who genuinely get to watch their first team, be it foreign, play live in their town and for a very few, come back to watch TFC at BMO.

[Couchy81]

This is cool, I know some hardcore Penarol fans

[eustacchio]

I agree in sentiment, but most of the time the foreign clubs are dictating the schedule, not the MLS clubs (a club like Real Madrid says we will play you on this date, take it or leave it). Would have to leave a large block of time open.

Otherwise, I just don't see the MLS saying "Sorry Real Madrid, we can't play you then. Could you come the week before instead".

And that's why they rescheduled the NYRB game and brought in real grass so we could play Real Madrid. If I remember correctly, we ended up playing the NYRBs twice at home in four days.

[moralis]

Paul Beirne as at it again arranging as you guessed it another summer friendly in a really busy TFC schedule:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2013/06/18/toronto-fc-negotiations-bring-big-name-international-opponent-town-summer-fr

TFC management never learn. Only caring about making more money and not on making this team better on the field.

Maybe it's time for a banner that says simply:

"FOCUS ON TEAM NOT ON MORE SUMMER FRIENDLIES"

[OgtheDim]

"I had to look up who Peñarol were,” Beirne said.


:facepalm:


We should start a stupid Beirne quotes thread.

[Couchy81]

"I had to look up who Peñarol were,” Beirne said.


:facepalm:


We should start a stupid Beirne quotes thread.


This is one of the reasons this team has failed from the start. Lack of soccer knowledge in general.

[tfcleeds]

Lol @ Beirne. Yeah, they're only the biggest Uruguayan club with 5 Copa Libertadores and 3 Intercontinental Cups to boot.

[Haddy]

"I had to look up who Peñarol were,” Beirne said.

And he followed up with:

“We are currently talking to a lot of people. We are interested in playing clubs that are of a tier and a geographic relevance that makes sense to the people of Toronto. Of course the people of Toronto are from all over the planet, but there are certain regions of the world that will really resonate here.”

Between the swipe at Peñarol and his follow-up, they're not playing here against TFC. Unless they like insults.

[jloome]

Maybe he's trying for a buyout, or something. That's beyond stupid and embarrassing. He's been a soccer executive for six years and he doesn't know who Penarol is? Fuck me, that's just ... wow.

How this man stays employed is baffling.

[Richard]

Classic TFC folks, the game has a very long way to go in Canada with guys like him and Cock.

[ag futbol]

Guys, marketing has gotten us very far. More $ means bigger caps means more international exposure to get big players here etc.

Until we live in Star Trek world where we all live only to better ourselves and our world, $ makes the world go round.
It's not the existence of marketing that's the problem. Nobody is arguing with the need to market a product. The issue is things are being stretched in 10 different directions at once, so what's being marketed and what's actually being delivered are fundamentally different. That's not a way to make money as a business. It's short sighted and long run detrimental when the product doesn't come through on what's promised.

[T-boy]

I don't follow the Uraguay league at all and have absolutely no idea who Panareol are! Does that make me an idiot? Probably not. It just proves that this game wouldn't be a crowd puller at all!

I'll add - although I'm not a fan of the mid season friendlies - MLS is still in its infancy in many ways. It's major marketing icon is gone (Beckham) and the league still needs to gain international support. Therefore, I still think mid season friendlies against the "worlds best" is still a worthwhile marketing ploy at this moment in time.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Paul Beirne as at it again arranging as you guessed it another summer friendly in a really busy TFC schedule:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2013/06/18/toronto-fc-negotiations-bring-big-name-international-opponent-town-summer-fr

TFC management never learn. Only caring about making more money and not on making this team better on the field.

Maybe it's time for a banner that says simply:

"FOCUS ON TEAM NOT ON MORE SUMMER FRIENDLIES"

If the game were forced upon us and included in our seasons then I absolutely would but if it's an extra game that fans pay for they won't be getting money for me to protest the game.

[ensco]

I know lots of people here don't like friendlies, but all this vitriolic "it's an insult" and "team first" stuff sounds a tiny bit childish in a year that the competitive implications of playing a midseason friendly are zero.

[jloome]

I know lots of people here don't like friendlies, but all this vitriolic "it's an insult" and "team first" stuff sounds a tiny bit childish in a year that the competitive implications of playing a midseason friendly are zero.

True. I think more people are insulted that one of our major execs doesn't know who Penarol are. I mean, it's not like they should be scouting in this hemisphere or anything...:facepalm:

[ensco]

True. I think more people are insulted that one of our major execs doesn't know who Penarol are.

Maybe he's a Nacional man?

[OgtheDim]

Frankly, I don't care if he doesn't know where Penarol is.

What I care about is that he WANTED to be quoted saying that.

Its unprofessional, elitist in a dumb jock sort of way and, just as importantly, not helpful when were are trying to develop relationships all over the world to bring in decent players.

Do something like that once, you should be talked to, with the meeting documented.

Do it more then once, you'd be given a letter.

Do it 3 times and you're out the door.

It boggles my mind that people like that can keep jobs.

[BuSaPuNk]

^ It's true the lack of knowledge and respect isn't helping our cause to bring in international players.

[Haddy]

^ It's true the lack of knowledge and respect isn't helping our cause to bring in international players.

It's frustrating, but I'd like to think prospective players have better things to do than read quotes from Paul Beirne regarding friendly speculation.

[werewolf]

"I had to look up who Peñarol were,” Beirne said.


:facepalm:


We should start a stupid Beirne quotes thread.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEOLQQgz7P8

[BuSaPuNk]

It's frustrating, but I'd like to think prospective players have better things to do than read quotes from Paul Beirne regarding friendly speculation.

For sure but things like this and the mismanagement of these players when they come here doesn't help. Have to think that players talk and if they have a bad experience somewhere they make it pretty clear to guys.

[Haddy]

For sure but things like this and the mismanagement of these players when they come here doesn't help. Have to think that players talk and if they have a bad experience somewhere they make it pretty clear to guys.

Fair point.

Well, at least we have the training ground :facepalm:

[prizby]

Paul Beirne as at it again arranging as you guessed it another summer friendly in a really busy TFC schedule:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2013/06/18/toronto-fc-negotiations-bring-big-name-international-opponent-town-summer-fr

TFC management never learn. Only caring about making more money and not on making this team better on the field.

Maybe it's time for a banner that says simply:

"FOCUS ON TEAM NOT ON MORE SUMMER FRIENDLIES"

I still have mine from last year

#SilverwareNotFriendlies

[prizby]

I know lots of people here don't like friendlies, but all this vitriolic "it's an insult" and "team first" stuff sounds a tiny bit childish in a year that the competitive implications of playing a midseason friendly are zero.

Remember the aston villa friendly in 2007?
Remember Ronnie O'Brien getting injured?
Remember him not being the same player he was after?
Remember him taking an early retirement a year later after a season at San Jose?

it is a meaningless midseason game thats potential costs heavily outweigh the benefits.

[ensco]

Remember the aston villa friendly in 2007?
Remember Ronnie O'Brien getting injured?
Remember him not being the same player he was after?
Remember him taking an early retirement a year later after a season at San Jose?

it is a meaningless midseason game thats potential costs heavily outweigh the benefits.

We had 10 guys go down that year. I blame the plastic for that.

They are not 100% bad for the team. Friendlies are good for locker room morale.

You don't build ships to keep them in the harbour. You put them out to sea. Sometimes for good reasons with valuable cargo, sometimes empty, on a stupid repositioning trip.

Sometimes they sink. You can't overthink it.

[BuSaPuNk]

I usually am on the same not friendlies but silverware bus. However this year were not doing anything, no CONCACAF, no playoffs. It's a write off year. I'd be okay with a friendly.

However I think there also missing the boat in terms of making a splash. It's a year were we are struggling to find fans to park there butts in the seats. This is the year if anything they should be looking to bring a big big club here. Ie United, City, Bayern, Juventus, Barca. Ect.

I know a friendly with a big club wil bring that clubs fans and we all hate that, however it might attract new fans to the MLS. Very doubtful if at all this works.

[TOBOR !]

Hey mlsintoronto ; You asked about Penarol :

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-on0kCJUZqcM/Tot-EpKVbgI/AAAAAAAAFvw/B3LonN9UCDI/s1600/3.jpg

from this site : http://labandaizquierda.blogspot.ca/2011/10/manana-se-estrena-en-uruguay-la.html

From Wiki :

Club Atlético Peñarol (Spanish pronunciation: [kluβ aˈtletiko peɲaˈɾol] ( listen); English: Peñarol Athletic Club) also known as Carboneros, Aurinegros and familiarly as Manya, is a Uruguayan sports club from Montevideo. Founded as Central Uruguay Railway Cricket Club (CURCC) on 28 September 1891, the club changed its name to Club Atlético Peñarol in 1913. The name Peñarol comes from the Peñarol neighbourhood, located in the outskirts of Montevideo.

Throughout its history the club has also participated in sports such as basketball and cycling. However, it has been almost exclusively dedicated to football, a sport in which Peñarol has achieved great recognition.

Peñarol holds the record for the most professional Uruguayan Primera División championships, with 37 trophies. Likewise, when considering those won under the name of CURCC, it is the club with the most Uruguayan championships in history, having won 47 amateur and professional trophies. In addition, Peñarol won the Uruguayan championship of the Federación Uruguaya de Football in 1924 and the cup of the Consejo Provisorio (Provisory Council) in 1926, giving it a total of 49 Uruguayan Primera División championships.

In international competition, Peñarol is the club with the third most Copa Libertadores, having won it five times.The club was the first to win three Intercontinental Cups and holds the most titles in said competition. In September 2009, Peñarol was chosen the Best Club of the 20th Century by the IFFHS.

Please do a bit of research next time you plan on speaking to an audience.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I know lots of people here don't like friendlies, but all this vitriolic "it's an insult" and "team first" stuff sounds a tiny bit childish in a year that the competitive implications of playing a midseason friendly are zero.


As always, it's perspective. I think it more important to finish as high in the league as possible. You do not. You are not alone.

[jabbronies]

I don't follow the Uraguay league at all and have absolutely no idea who Panareol are! Does that make me an idiot? Probably not. It just proves that this game wouldn't be a crowd puller at all!

I'm with you. I had no idea who they were until I came into this thread. And to be honest, I couldn't give a single fuck about who they are now that I do know who they are.
The only time I will maybe bat an eye at them is when/if they ever face TFC in a meaningful game.

As for friendlies, I could care less about them and will not go to this one either.

[Ultra & Proud]

Does anyone even know if this is even happening or if it's just a reserves match before readying the anti-friendlies banners? Fuck maybe we should protest the MLS Reserves league too, you know, because giving our mostly unused subs and senior academy members minutes against decent competition is ruining our playoff push :facepalm:

[OgtheDim]

MLS likes mid season friendlies, so its going to happen.

My issue is we should put this in our field, not the Dome.

[Haddy]

My issue is we should put this in our field, not the Dome.

Beirne confirmed that, if a friendly does happen this year, it will be at BMO. He left it open to return to Rogers Centre for other friendlies down the line.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Does anyone even know if this is even happening or if it's just a reserves match before readying the anti-friendlies banners? Fuck maybe we should protest the MLS Reserves league too, you know, because giving our mostly unused subs and senior academy members minutes against decent competition is ruining our playoff push :facepalm:

So much unconfirmed...

[prizby]

Does anyone even know if this is even happening or if it's just a reserves match before readying the anti-friendlies banners? Fuck maybe we should protest the MLS Reserves league too, you know, because giving our mostly unused subs and senior academy members minutes against decent competition is ruining our playoff push :facepalm:

you going to play the reserves for 90 minutes against a big club #doubtful

[Carts]

I'm with you. I had no idea who they were until I came into this thread. And to be honest, I couldn't give a single fuck about who they are now that I do know who they are.
The only time I will maybe bat an eye at them is when/if they ever face TFC in a meaningful game.

As for friendlies, I could care less about them and will not go to this one either.

I didn't know who they were either until this came up...

[Oldtimer]

Why protest a friendly?

It's one thing if it's 2009 and the Reds may have missed the post-season because of a stupid friendly.

In 2013 playoffs are out of the picture. Why not enjoy a decent team coming here (or at least their reserves)?

[Fort York Redcoat]

Why protest a friendly?

It's one thing if it's 2009 and the Reds may have missed the post-season because of a stupid friendly.

In 2013 playoffs are out of the picture. Why not enjoy a decent team coming here (or at least their reserves)?

Principle.

For some there is more to the season than post season.

I'd love to see friendlies outside of the season.

[Canary10]

I don't mind friendlies either. I quite enjoyed the Liverpool game last year. Also travelled to NYC to watch the Red Bulls play Tottenham. The Red Bulls had a meet and greet for their season ticket holders with the Spurs players the day before (which we were allowed into despite not being Red Bulls season seat holders because of a really friendly front office guy who wanted to make sure our visit there was a good one). I can tell you the thousand or so Red Bulls SSH who got pictures and autographs with Gareth Bale weren't that concerned about the extra game. And the game itself was really enjoyable. It's a great way to give something back to SSHs if done properly (ie. not forced into the ticket package, and an opportunity for autographs).

There are two reasons why I'm not concerned about it. One, MLS is a minor league. The league still has a lot to do to attract football fans who view the EPL or another league as their primary league. Getting them into BMO Field to watch a high level club is a good idea if it can convert some into TFC fans. Two, we play way less games than a typical European side. MLS is supposed to be a physical league with players who are athletic. Well an extra game isn't an extra burden for professional athletes with professional trainers and physio. That's my view.

[tfcleeds]

Can't say I'm too bothered about us playing one friendly, given the fact that we have virtually nothing to play for. If we were in the CCL again, I'd feel differently.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Two, we play way less games than a typical European side. MLS is supposed to be a physical league with players who are athletic. Well an extra game isn't an extra burden for professional athletes with professional trainers and physio. That's my view.

Less games with a smaller squad. It evens out IMO.

[Canary10]

Less games with a smaller squad. It evens out IMO.

Chelsea played like 60 games last year. Squads aren't that much smaller.

I can understand on principal being opposed, but in terms of fitness, etc I don't see it. Especially without the Champions League games.

[Joe Kool]

If it is a club I am interested in and the price is right for my seats I will go. If not then whatever... Like some are saying, we aren't in a playoff race or in the CCL or anything and they are not playing on turf risking added chance for injury from that so I don't see an issue personally. Not being in the CCL this year I am going to miss not playing clubs from other leagues so may be fun to see. It's nice to see different teams with different styles in person.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Chelsea played like 60 games last year. Squads aren't that much smaller.

I can understand on principal being opposed, but in terms of fitness, etc I don't see it. Especially without the Champions League games.


Chelsea isn't the average. I still think it evens out. Agree to disagree.

[Canary10]

Chelsea isn't the average. I still think it evens out. Agree to disagree.

Don't want to belabor the point, but I will anyway. An English Championship team plays 46 games, not including cup games and the promotion playoffs. With 24 players per squad. MLS has 30 players on a squad, although admittedly the last 10 or so aren't high quality, and play 34 games plus cups. Make what you will of that.

[OgtheDim]

English teams get heat stroke if the temperature gets above 18 Celsius and feel frozen if it gets less then 5.

And travel less then some of the 75 mile bastards are doing this season.

You can't compare MLS to European leagues as far as workload is concerned.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Don't want to belabor the point, but I will anyway. An English Championship team plays 46 games, not including cup games and the promotion playoffs. With 24 players per squad. MLS has 30 players on a squad, although admittedly the last 10 or so aren't high quality, and play 34 games plus cups. Make what you will of that.

Fair enough, we have a bigger squad than the English Championship. Would you call us a deeper squad? I can't support these friendlies as training. Our reserve league should have more games to ensure those that come up could be as productive as it is when your Championship reserve kids get put in for a match.

[Canary10]

Fair enough, we have a bigger squad than the English Championship. Would you call us a deeper squad? I can't support these friendlies as training. Our reserve league should have more games to ensure those that come up could be as productive as it is when your Championship reserve kids get put in for a match.

Definitely not deeper!

I still think they can play one extra game. They have the support personnel to maximize recovery after games. As pros they can do it. Totally understand the objections though. Just didn't want it to look one-sided, as I do think there is a role for these games in selling the sport in North America.

[ProfessorDamage]

I had no idea who Penarol are, and had to look them up. But if I was a TFC executive, I would NEVER, EVER, EVER want to be quoted as saying that, because it's unprofessional, disrespectful and says a lot about the attitudes of the organization.

As for friendly opponents, our sked's light this summer so bring it on as long as it's part of my season package already and I don't have to pay more. Well, maybe to see Chelsea or another major EPL squad, I'd drop a few extra dollars...

[TOBOR !]

The xenophobic, small-mindedness of some folk is downright depressing.

Perhaps I should just leave it as "it's not you, it's me", but reading comments like "I don't follow the Uruguayan league" and "I don't give a shit who Penarol are" makes me sad.

If you love the game, you might learn about it beyond the range of your local club, World Cups, and other stuff that gets beamed into your living room.

I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.

If you love your team, and that is all, then you are missing out. Missing out on where it is placed on the tapestry of the history of football. Missing out on the complete story.

Anyway, if they do go ahead with this friendly with Penarol, I hope they are smart about it and market Penarol for who they are : a giant of a club from a football-mad country.

[ProfessorDamage]

Anyway, if they do go ahead with this friendly with Penarol, I hope they are smart about it and market Penarol for who they are : a giant of a club from a football-mad country.

If Penarol was to agree to a friendly with us now following Beirne's idiotic comments, it would say more about them than us. That said, as (again) Beirne's idiotic comments spell out, TFC is aiming bigger with this one. Put it this way, when it's announced, you won't need wikipedia to look up the club and you'll know at least a few of the guys in their starting XI.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Just didn't want it to look one-sided, as I do think there is a role for these games in selling the sport in North America.

Yep I understand WHY they grow the league the way they do but I want to be consistent in saying that I aspire my team and the league to be better, and wish this wasn't such a market spotlight.


And the robot is right. If you consider yourself into this game, this team, our team, our league depends on leagues outside of Europe. At least half of Penarol would be welcome, helpful additions to our squad.


I'd love to see them play a friendly with them outside of the season.

[brad]

As always, it's perspective. I think it more important to finish as high in the league as possible. You do not. You are not alone.

Due to the draft system, one could easily make the argument (and to be clear, I'm not making it) that if you are out of playoff contention, it's in your best interests to finish as a low as possible to get a better draft pick.

[tfcleeds]

Regardless of whether people are familiar with Penarol or not, the fact is, they are on a par with the Flamengos and the River Plates, if we are talking about S. American football. Even if Beirne wasn't familiar with them (as an exec of a MLS team, I would hope he should) he shouldn't have publicly said something like that and act so dismissive about them. It just shows how bush league some aspects of this organization still are.

[brad]

Chelsea played like 60 games last year. Squads aren't that much smaller.

I can understand on principal being opposed, but in terms of fitness, etc I don't see it. Especially without the Champions League games.

There is a difference is squad quality though. They have depth, and while their bench players are not always going to be at the same level, most bench players at the big clubs would be starters for a lot of other teams in the league. In the MLS, you have steep drop in class.

They can also rotate the squad around a lot more to rest players while staying competitive.

[TFC07]

Juventus coming to town? I was reading CSN article about this issue and end of the article it mention:


Anyway. This is probably happening. The harsh truth is that those pushing the no friendlies ever agenda aren't the target audience of these type of initiatives. The empty seats in the middle of BMO Field and those that don't fill them are. That's especially the case when those absent are usually found at Scallywags and The Football Factory watching their favourite Euro teams.

So this is probably happening and it will sell better than anyone in the supporter's community wants to admit.

Especially since it's probably going to be Juventus.

[brad]

I do wonder if game day revenue continues to decline due to drops in ticket sales if we will start seeing more friendlies? The money is going to come from somewhere.

[T-boy]

The length of this thread suggests to me that the average RPB is kinda bored right now! Let's bring on some summer signings and some wins for TFC and we will have something real and exciting to talk about :)

[Fort York Redcoat]

Due to the draft system, one could easily make the argument (and to be clear, I'm not making it) that if you are out of playoff contention, it's in your best interests to finish as a low as possible to get a better draft pick.


Stop...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMS0O3kknvk&feature=player_detailpage#t=60 s

[TOBOR !]

ProfessorDamage ;

If Penarol was to agree to a friendly with us now following Beirne's idiotic comments, it would say more about them than us. That said, as (again) Beirne's idiotic comments spell out, TFC is aiming bigger with this one. Put it this way, when it's announced, you won't need wikipedia to look up the club and you'll know at least a few of the guys in their starting XI.

Sure. Which is the same thing as not going to see a film unless Tom Cruise is in it.

edit - nice post there Fortsy. :D
edit 2 - bah.

[jabbronies]

The xenophobic, small-mindedness of some folk is downright depressing.

Perhaps I should just leave it as "it's not you, it's me", but reading comments like "I don't follow the Uruguayan league" and "I don't give a shit who Penarol are" makes me sad.

If you love the game, you might learn about it beyond the range of your local club, World Cups, and other stuff that gets beamed into your living room.

I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.

If you love your team, and that is all, then you are missing out. Missing out on where it is placed on the tapestry of the history of football. Missing out on the complete story.

.

I find these highlighted statements to be a bit much.
You don't have to dig deep into the history of football in every part of the world to love the game.

I personally could care less about the Central and South American leagues, add to that the Asian, African and Middle Eastern leagues and Multiple European leagues. I understand that there are good players and good teams that come out of these locations, and I don't mind watching how they develop on the world stage, but to be honest, they are just not on my radar in terms of interest in the sport.

I devout a huge portion of time and money and effort into my adopted EPL team and my local team. Then fill the rest of it engaging with multiple European leagues and teams.

You seem to be insinuating that because I only focus on those two parts of the world (North America and Europe) and could care less about a team that dominates a league I have no interest in, it makes me a small-minded follower of the game - which I find very insulting TBH. It wreaks of soccer snobbery that doesn't really prove you understand the game more than someone else.

Football is football. Doesn't matter what part of the world it's played in or the history of the sport in that country. You play it, you watch it, you argue about it you get divorced because of it - it becomes your life - That is what makes the love of the game what it is. If you believe that knowing the complete history across the globe and caring about every single team that dominates each league makes your love of the game legitimate - then my friend, I think you've lost the plot.

[TOBOR !]

jabbronies ;

I said
I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.

You said
If you believe that knowing the complete history across the globe and caring about every single team that dominates each league makes your love of the game legitimate - then my friend, I think you've lost the plot.

I'm saying that people should be interested in seeing a club like Penarol, you're just looking for an argument.

[TFC07]

The xenophobic, small-mindedness of some folk is downright depressing.

Perhaps I should just leave it as "it's not you, it's me", but reading comments like "I don't follow the Uruguayan league" and "I don't give a shit who Penarol are" makes me sad.

If you love the game, you might learn about it beyond the range of your local club, World Cups, and other stuff that gets beamed into your living room.

I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.

If you love your team, and that is all, then you are missing out. Missing out on where it is placed on the tapestry of the history of football. Missing out on the complete story.

Anyway, if they do go ahead with this friendly with Penarol, I hope they are smart about it and market Penarol for who they are : a giant of a club from a football-mad country.

Well said. Penarol is club with a rich history. I wish people here open up their minds to global football instead of just following EPL and TFC.

[Dreadlocks]

I think many here are overlooking a major point. If one of the big clubs from a big league comes to play TFC, great! They would definitely sell tickets for the match but it's not likely that we will EVER see any of the players on said club play for TFC. They would be far too expensive obviously (amongst other things). However, a team like Penarol coming to play TFC in Toronto may shine some light on the city, the team and the league, encouraging players from Penarol or the Uruguayan league to consider the MLS as a career option.

I look at a match like this as a marketing thing. Not to get bums in seats directly, but to expose the MLS and TFC to better, obtainable players.

Hope what I'm saying is clear.......

[Couchy81]

I personally could care less about the Central and South American leagues, add to that the Asian, African and Middle Eastern leagues and Multiple European leagues. I understand that there are good players and good teams that come out of these locations, and I don't mind watching how they develop on the world stage, but to be honest, they are just not on my radar in terms of interest in the sport.





Personal interest as a fan aside, our team's management should be well aware of the South American, Asian, African and Middle Eastern leagues. MLS is on or lower than their level. If you want to improve your team you damn well better know what leagues are producing a superior product and what leagues are beneath you. It is in the best interest of OUR club for them to know what to look for in players from other leagues and try to make our team better.

[Greatest Ripoff]

The xenophobic, small-mindedness of some folk is downright depressing.

Perhaps I should just leave it as "it's not you, it's me", but reading comments like "I don't follow the Uruguayan league" and "I don't give a shit who Penarol are" makes me sad.

If you love the game, you might learn about it beyond the range of your local club, World Cups, and other stuff that gets beamed into your living room.

I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.

If you love your team, and that is all, then you are missing out. Missing out on where it is placed on the tapestry of the history of football. Missing out on the complete story.

Anyway, if they do go ahead with this friendly with Penarol, I hope they are smart about it and market Penarol for who they are : a giant of a club from a football-mad country.

I totally agree with this. Some of the things I have read here are crazy. Penarol are one half of arguable the most historic derby in world football.

[OgtheDim]

What any of us think or say about Penarol means nothing.

That one of the execs of TFC happily said in an interview he had to look them up means something.

[David_Oliveira]

http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1186709/media-advisory-joao-peres-sport-holds-press-conference-to-announce-a-pre-season-match-between-sporting-lisbon-and-penarol-montevideo

Announcement tomorrow for sporting vs penerol.

[brad]

Personal interest as a fan aside, our team's management should be well aware of the South American, Asian, African and Middle Eastern leagues. MLS is on or lower than their level. If you want to improve your team you damn well better know what leagues are producing a superior product and what leagues are beneath you. It is in the best interest of OUR club for them to know what to look for in players from other leagues and try to make our team better.

He's a business exec, so I could really care less if he knows who they are. The staff in charge of the playing side are the ones I'd expect to be in the know. He should know better than to insult them like that though.

[TOBOR !]

brad ; I don't think he insulted them, or even if he meant to. However, out of arrogance he has revealed his own ignorance.

Better to be thought a fool and remain silent, etc.

[jabbronies]

@jabbronies (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=19) ;

I said
I'm not suggesting following every domestic league, but if you dig a little into the history of the game, and find out about how it migrated around the world, you appreciate the history of clubs like Penarol.



I had no problem with the above line you posted that's why I didn't bold it - it was the other stuff that I did bold that I had the problem with and brought me to the conclusion of what I said.

There are hundreds of teams that have rich history in football that can be compared to the rich history of this team. At the end of the day, they play in a league that some of us just don't care for. Their impact as a club to any club I follow is very minimal, if anything almost non-existent.

I don't think it's that audacious that people don't really care to watch them play, or really care who they are or what they've done in their lifetime.

You guys make it seem like it's the worst thing any supposed football fan could do:

Making assumptions like this one over and over and over again is pretty small minded and ignorant:

Well said. Penarol is club with a rich history. I wish people here open up their minds to global football instead of just following EPL and TFC.

I follow the EPL because that is the game that I enjoy watching. I supplement it with Portuguese, German, French and Italian league.
Why do you think that just because people are not interested in a club that is rarely televised here from a country who's league is pretty much a two team league, they are automatically just following EPL and TFC?

You people make them sound like this International powerhouse that we should all recognize. Most of their success was in the 60's with a couple trophies in the 80's. For those who were born in the 80's, none of this means anything to us. They were a team of yester-year. Good for them that they have won some big trophies in their lifetime, but does not following them deprive me of something another team around the world that I may follow can't give me?
Is their style of play, tactics, management style that unique that I wouldn't be able to enjoy it elsewhere...I highly doubt that.

[BuSaPuNk]

http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1186709/media-advisory-joao-peres-sport-holds-press-conference-to-announce-a-pre-season-match-between-sporting-lisbon-and-penarol-montevideo

Announcement tomorrow for sporting vs penerol.

Lol all this time were not even playing

[Fort York Redcoat]

Why do you think that just because people are not interested in a club that is rarely televised here from a country who's league is pretty much a two team league, they are automatically just following EPL and TFC?

You people make them sound like this International powerhouse that we should all recognize. Most of their success was in the 60's with a couple trophies in the 80's. For those who were born in the 80's, none of this means anything to us. They were a team of yester-year. Good for them that they have won some big trophies in their lifetime, but does not following them deprive me of something another team around the world that I may follow can't give me?
Is their style of play, tactics, management style that unique that I wouldn't be able to enjoy it elsewhere...I highly doubt that.

I think this post makes the point of this discussion. While you don't care for or follow the Uruguayan League you would care enough about our team to look up their history now that there was the rumour of our playing them. I don't think it's important to follow every league in the world or follow another league every week but it doesn't take much research nowadays to be informed about clubs worldwide. Even if you don't rate the league for quality or entertainment you care enough to learn about it.

All is well.

I'm happy for Sporting and Penarol fans in the area. Enjoy.

[TOBOR !]

jabbronies ;


Why do you think that just because people are not interested in a club that is rarely televised here from a country who's league is pretty much a two team league, they are automatically just following EPL and TFC?

That statement could apply to many other countires. Anyway, they have done well internationally of late, it may well be worth the while taking note of their league and the players they're producing.


You people make them sound like this International powerhouse that we should all recognize. Most of their success was in the 60's with a couple trophies in the 80's. For those who were born in the 80's, none of this means anything to us. They were a team of yester-year.

Ha ! Change 60's to 70's there, and you've pretty much just described Liverpool.

Listen, I don't begrudge you being a cheerful consumer of top-brand football. However, one day it may not be enough for you.

You may go on walk-about looking for more... and who knows where you'll end up. In the meantime, keep your mind open.

[Ultra & Proud]

I find it typically hilarious that just the (false) rumor of a friendly can cause a 3 page thread with talk of getting the protest banners ready.

[tfcleeds]

I think this post makes the point of this discussion. While you don't care for or follow the Uruguayan League you would care enough about our team to look up their history now that there was the rumour of our playing them. I don't think it's important to follow every league in the world or follow another league every week but it doesn't take much research nowadays to be informed about clubs worldwide. Even if you don't rate the league for quality or entertainment you care enough to learn about it.This is a key point. I think the discussion has gotten sidetracked a bit. I really don't think it matters what anyone here thinks of Penarol or whether they follow the Uruguayan league or not. Heck, I don't follow it. But Penarol are a famous name, and the fact that a TFC executive (Beirne) would admit ignorance, and almost be proud of it in a public statement, just highlights the lack of awareness in general that has plagued this front office since the inception of this club. I mean, it's not like O'Higgins are coming here to play a friendly. (they are a Chilean club)

[nonc]

How has Beirne not been fired? I can't see a soccer nut like Leiweke having any patience for such a bonehead, unless he's not as useless as he acts. Didn't he also congratulate the Impact front office shortly after crushing TFC...

[Dreadlocks]

@jabbronies (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/member.php?u=19) ;
That statement could apply to many other countries. Anyway, they have done well internationally of late, it may well be worth the while taking note of their league and the players they're producing.


This is what it is for me. I couldn't care less who has heard of any team that we play against in a friendly. Bernie has already proven to be an idiot so no surprise there. The main thing is that we could get a look at potential players that would be at a reasonable price and they would get chance to have a look at TFC and MLS.

I realize that TFC is not playing Penarol but I think playing a friendly against a team like Penarol would have WAY more value to the league and the club than if we played a big club from a big league.

Shit, I have my name inscribed into the North bank at the Emirates stadium but would still rather see TFC play Penarol over Arsenal.

edit: I post in reply to those who question if we should be playing these friendlies or not.

[T-boy]

This is what it is for me. I couldn't care less who has heard of any team that we play against in a friendly. Bernie has already proven to be an idiot so no surprise there. The main thing is that we could get a look at potential players that would be at a reasonable price and they would get chance to have a look at TFC and MLS.

I realize that TFC is not playing Penarol but I think playing a friendly against a team like Penarol would have WAY more value to the league and the club than if we played a big club from a big league.

Shit, I have my name inscribed into the North bank at the Emirates stadium but would still rather see TFC play Penarol over Arsenal.

edit: I post in reply to those who question if we should be playing these friendlies or not.

We have to remember that most of the RPB's are seriously dedicated football fans. But any friendly has to appeal to the masses, not just to us hardcore football addicts.

How many non-hardcores would want to see TFC play Panerol?! I would say, not many at all. Then you have to think of any additional fanbase in the city - what is the Toronto population of Uruguayans? Again, not very many. So, would a TFC versus Panerol sell tickets? I don't think it would.

Like it or not, any friendly will have to appeal to the mass Toronto market, so we are looking at British clubs, Italian, and Spain, maybe Portuegese clubs, plus the top 2 Mexican and German sides, and PSG. Otherwise, a friendly wouldn't have much appeal in the GTA.

[tfcleeds]

Needless to say, I think Sporting will have a slight edge when it comes to fan support in this one...;)

[Ultra & Proud]

How has Beirne not been fired? I can't see a soccer nut like Leiweke having any patience for such a bonehead, unless he's not as useless as he acts. Didn't he also congratulate the Impact front office shortly after crushing TFC...

He's just a business guy not a Football guy. Plus when you read the full article you can see how the statement about Penerol was made. Kind of in an arrogant manner but meant to imply that when we book a friendly it'd be against a more recognizable side and one must remember that all these TFC story things are geared towards the average joe and not supporters. I go to matches with average joes sometimes and they couldn't name you more than a dozen or so teams in Europe yet alone South America. Some of these people are season ticket holders from day one and don't even know all the teams in MLS. They go for the entertainment and a good day out and have no idea about standings, players, or anything else other than a good day out with friends and beers. To them Penerol may as well be from Mars so Bierne is just speaking their lingo.

[Dreadlocks]

We have to remember that most of the RPB's are seriously dedicated football fans. But any friendly has to appeal to the masses, not just to us hardcore football addicts.

How many non-hardcores would want to see TFC play Panerol?! I would say, not many at all. Then you have to think of any additional fanbase in the city - what is the Toronto population of Uruguayans? Again, not very many. So, would a TFC versus Panerol sell tickets? I don't think it would.

Like it or not, any friendly will have to appeal to the mass Toronto market, so we are looking at British clubs, Italian, and Spain, maybe Portuegese clubs, plus the top 2 Mexican and German sides, and PSG. Otherwise, a friendly wouldn't have much appeal in the GTA.

Totally agree with you T-Boy. A match vs Penarol (or a similar team) would not appeal to the masses or sell tickets. But I would argue that although it will not sell tickets for one match, it potentially/indirectly could sell tickets for many matches in the future. As I have mentioned already, it would be a chance to expose TFC and MLS to Uruguayans, making TFC a career option to them. If we find say 2 players on 'Pernarol' that would be willing to come to Toronto, it in theory would improve the team making it more competitive - selling more tickets. If TFC were to play Arsenal, sure it would sell tickets - I'd be there for sure! But I wouldn't think that TFC would have ANY chance on nabbing Jack Wiltshire to fix our attacking mid issues.

But I completely understand the need to attract the masses. I'm just trying to take a different perspective. I guess my question is, do you want to appeal to the masses on one night a year? Or would you rather appeal to the masses for an entire season or more?

Sorry, but I sometimes have trouble articulating my point so I hope what I'm saying is clear.

[pdogg]

Totally agree with you T-Boy. A match vs Penarol (or a similar team) would not appeal to the masses or sell tickets. But I would argue that although it will not sell tickets for one match, it potentially/indirectly could sell tickets for many matches in the future. As I have mentioned already, it would be a chance to expose TFC and MLS to Uruguayans, making TFC a career option to them. If we find say 2 players on 'Pernarol' that would be willing to come to Toronto, it in theory would improve the team making it more competitive - selling more tickets. If TFC were to play Arsenal, sure it would sell tickets - I'd be there for sure! But I wouldn't think that TFC would have ANY chance on nabbing Jack Wiltshire to fix our attacking mid issues.

But I completely understand the need to attract the masses. I'm just trying to take a different perspective. I guess my question is, do you want to appeal to the masses on one night a year? Or would you rather appeal to the masses for an entire season or more?

Sorry, but I sometimes have trouble articulating my point so I hope what I'm saying is clear.


My only reservation would be that the Penarol (or similar) would come to a half filled BMO. If you had the fan atmosphere of yesteryear and the training facilities of today, that would be a definitive selling point.

[brad]

Ha ! Change 60's to 70's there, and you've pretty much just described Liverpool.

Listen, I don't begrudge you being a cheerful consumer of top-brand football. However, one day it may not be enough for you.

You may go on walk-about looking for more... and who knows where you'll end up. In the meantime, keep your mind open.

Funnily, I'm exactly the opposite. When I was younger I used to follow a ton of football from around the world. Now that I'm a bit older and don't have as much free time on my hands,I really only follow TFC, the EPL and La Liga.

[brad]

My only reservation would be that the Penarol (or similar) would come to a half filled BMO. If you had the fan atmosphere of yesteryear and the training facilities of today, that would be a definitive selling point.

On a tangent but similar, when we played River a few years ago there were a bunch of River Fans behind me. They were having a great time, chatting with a few of them they were not TFC fans & hadn't been to BMO but said they'd probably come out and check out some TFC games in the future as they were having a good time.

These guys had a couple of flags. This was a non-supporters section, they were standing, but they were in the very back row with no one behind them. Part way through game - security came up, confiscated their flags and told them they had to sit down or they would be kicked out. Needless to say, they were pretty pissed off and said they'd never set foot in BMO again.

[moralis]

There you go Penarol has confirmed on twitter and on their official website that they are playing Toronto FC on July 24:

Carbonero Digital ‏@CDigitalCom 1h #Peñarol enfrentará a Sporting de Lisboa el 21 de julio y al Toronto FC el 24. Ambos juegos serán en Toronto, Canadá.

https://twitter.com/CDigitalCom/status/347846347774390272

http://www.carbonerodigital.com/2013...peran-por.html

What does Paul Beirne have to say now?

[Pint]

So mid week game when we already have games the 13th, 17th, 20th, and 27th already?

This game has to be free for SSH or they will not get more than a couple thousand out for the game.

[Richard]

I wish they would fire that clown already, seriously. If I was Payne I would be pissed. You don't insult the other team like that when your going to play them, and possibly create some sort of club links with other teams down South.

[nfitz]

http://www.carbonerodigital.com/2013...peran-por.htmlLink broken - try this one - http://www.carbonerodigital.com/2013/06/gira-canada-y-portugal-esperan-por.html


What does Paul Beirne have to say now?Good question! I've tweeted him.


So mid week game when we already have games the 13th, 17th, 20th, and 27th already?

This game has to be free for SSH or they will not get more than a couple thousand out for the game.It does seem odd.

The only good date available is Saturday July 6th. As we have a break during the Gold Cup from July 3rd to July 13th.

On the other hand. Who cares? It's not like it's going to impact our play-off hopes. If they do a $10 or $15 general admission, it might be a pleasant evening, if it's a hot day. I can't see it working well at anywhere close to normal pricing. It's not like there's a huge Uruguyan community in Toronto (only 2,600 in the GTA according to this website - http://www.ureachtoronto.com/content/uruguayan)

[Pint]

Link broken - try this one - http://www.carbonerodigital.com/2013/06/gira-canada-y-portugal-esperan-por.html

Good question! I've tweeted him.

It does seem odd.

The only good date available is Saturday July 6th. As we have a break during the Gold Cup from July 3rd to July 13th.

On the other hand. Who cares? It's not like it's going to impact our play-off hopes. If they do a $10 or $15 general admission, it might be a pleasant evening, if it's a hot day. I can't see it working well at anywhere close to normal pricing. It's not like there's a huge Uruguyan community in Toronto (only 2,600 in the GTA according to this website - http://www.ureachtoronto.com/content/uruguayan)

pretty sure the twitter feed says they play sporting Lisbon on the 21st and us on the 24th of july.... extremely congested fixture schedule

[nfitz]

pretty sure the twitter feed says they play sporting Lisbon on the 21st and us on the 24th of july.... extremely congested fixture scheduleThe article says that too. I was pointing out when the only very good date for an international friendly would be. (but way late, given it's about 2 weeks away).

If true, it's not ideal. But hardly extremely congested. Two games a week for two weeks isn't even that extreme for us. And nothing compared to what some teams have had to deal with. Really, what's the downside (in terms of too many games) for us? Presumably they'd only have the first team on for half the game, with perhaps not playing the older guys at all. It's not like we are in contention for anything this season, other than the first draft spot, and we've a lot of young players who could do with some practice.

[Fort York Redcoat]

So mid week game when we already have games the 13th, 17th, 20th, and 27th already?

This game has to be free for SSH or they will not get more than a couple thousand out for the game.

FUCK THAT.

I don't want this in my ticket package.

Announce it is and Ima Banner makin'...

[nfitz]

FUCK THAT.

I don't want this in my ticket package.

Announce it is and Ima Banner makin'...There weren't any extra games in the season package. We've already been given a refund (the $10 showed up on my credit card already) for the Voyageurs Cup game we didn't qualify for.

If they tossed in a free match, your going to complain? Did you complain about the free ticket to the game at the Big O?

[Fort York Redcoat]

There weren't any extra games in the season package. We've already been given a refund (the $10 showed up on my credit card already) for the Voyageurs Cup game we didn't qualify for.

If they tossed in a free match, your going to complain? Did you complain about the free ticket to the game at the Big O?

Nope. It meant something.

[jabbronies]

That statement could apply to many other countries. Anyway, they have done well internationally of late, it may well be worth the while taking note of their league and the players they're producing.
Ha ! Change 60's to 70's there, and you've pretty much just described Liverpool.


I'll watch them on the International stage for sure and take note that way. At least the crap has been sifted out and you are watching the best of what that country has to offer.




Listen, I don't begrudge you being a cheerful consumer of top-brand football. However, one day it may not be enough for you.
You may go on walk-about looking for more... and who knows where you'll end up. In the meantime, keep your mind open.

Umm Hellooooo consumer of top brand football? I do follow TFC and hence the MLS - definitely not top brand football - LOL:)

I've read over and over and over again on this board that I should follow lower level soccer - DIV2-DIV3-Div4 stuff, it's a good watch etc etc.
I have watched games here and there because it's been convenient, but TBH, it's crap football where the fundamentals of the game are constantly ignored and or just not executed. I find that extremely frustrating to watch and I couldn't justify wanting to spend more of my hard earned time and money watching it LOL I mean I already watch this team do enough of that!

There's just things I and other consumers of top brand football don't really want to deal with. For instance, the thing about watch watching Portuguese league that I can't stand is all of the flopping and lame stoppages in play due to people flopping on the pitch. This happens a lot more in the mid-lower table matches and It's not very interesting to watch. It's even worse the lower you get in the FA.

It's one thing to watch some U-19 teams going out and play a match - make some rookie mistakes. Do some things they really shouldn't be doing, But at the end of the day you are watching Raw talent being developed.
However, watching Div 2/3/4 calibre team of older "Professionals" going out and making those same mistakes - knowing that these guys are fixed in their ways, well i find that to be more frustrating than enjoyable.
Watching guys who have 20 yards of space in either direction decide to head the ball back into a group of opposing players rather than drop the ball and make an educated pass isn't my idea of good football. That's what these leagues provide you with.

I guess your tolerance of crap is higher than mine LOL:)

[Oldtimer]

I'm not into protests. If you don't like the friendly stay home, and don't watch it on TV.

[ag futbol]

He's just a business guy not a Football guy.
And that's been a major problem with the way MLSE has been run since day one. Being the business guy does not excuse you from understanding your subject matter, it provides you with further responsibility to be educated on it. If you're going to be successful as a business person unless you understand what it is that you're managing. Take the training grounds for example, something they actually got right. They spent a year visiting training facilities across the globe and looking at different youth setups to determine what they wanted to build here. In other words, they needed to understand what other people were doing in order to find the best practice to implement at TFC. The sports people and the business people need to work together to make things happen.

So back to PB for a second. At face value, I don't find either this or the post-Mtl statement particularly incriminating. However, if taken into context of the way TFC has performed over its history, I do find it slightly annoying. They just both seem out of place for a person working for a team that's a perennial loser. Go ahead and congratulate the winner, but be mindful of your fans who are putting up with yet another setback. If he didn't know about a team that is much more successful than ours, he can feel free to keep that to himself.

[Phil]

There are benefits for friendly games, as I am sure most are aware. The idea of playing them mid season is not going to appeal to supporters so no surprise there.

Protests are not needed, its just the logical argument that we are going to make, and its the dollar sign and relationships with other clubs that TFC are in persuit of.

Keep my seasons ticket prices low and for the love of God, please don't let any injuries to our players happen.

[TOBOR !]

jabbronies ;
I guess your tolerance of crap is higher than mine LOL

Apparently.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I'm not into protests. If you don't like the friendly stay home, and don't watch it on TV.

Which is fine and I will...unless I already paid for it in my seasons ticket pkg.

[cmonyoureds]

And he followed up with:

“We are currently talking to a lot of people. We are interested in playing clubs that are of a tier and a geographic relevance that makes sense to the people of Toronto. Of course the people of Toronto are from all over the planet, but there are certain regions of the world that will really resonate here.”

Between the swipe at Peñarol and his follow-up, they're not playing here against TFC. Unless they like insults.


Good grief. Of a "tier"???? As in quality names?

What bloody "tier" would that be? The novelty and marketing has worn off Toronto. The man is delusional. The days of Madrid are long past.

He should be thanking his lucky stars that Penarol would even consider showing up here.

The days of being an MLS poster franchise ended a while ago. Now, I could see NYRB or LA getting the big names to come in. Big $ tickets, large crowds and cross marketing would be the appeal.

What, if any, of those would this current sh** show have to offer, Paul?

[nfitz]

Nope. It meant something.Should we protest about TFC players in reserve games? What if one got injured?

[Fort York Redcoat]

Should we protest about TFC players in reserve games? What if one got injured?

Nope. Why would you make such a comparison? If those players need time in the reserves it's for a reason. If they do I know how to go watch them and their games have nothing to do with my season ticket package.

I don't think you're being genuine with the quoted question but I'll do you the courtesy.

[nfitz]

Nope. Why would you make such a comparison? If those players need time in the reserves it's for a reason. If they do I know how to go watch them and their games have nothing to do with my season ticket package.

I don't think you're being genuine with the quoted question but I'll do you the courtesy.No, it was genuine. It was an example of similar players getting some game time.

I genuinely don't understand a serious objection to a mid-week friendly, if it isn't part of the season ticket package, doesn't have 90 minutes of older first team players, and we are in contention for absolutely nothing this year. No Champions League and no realistic chance of a playoff spot. What's wrong with letting some players who desperately need some real game play a run?

I understand objections when it might cost us something. Or has players running on astroturf. Or is costing big $ in seasons and partial packs. But I genuinely don't see a big issue here.

[Fort York Redcoat]

No, it was genuine.

I genuinely don't understand a serious objection to a mid-week friendly, if it isn't part of the season ticket package, doesn't have 90 minutes of older first team players, and we are in contention for absolutely nothing this year. No Champions League and no realistic chance of a playoff spot. What's wrong with letting some players who desperately need some real game play a run?

I understand objections when it might cost us something. Or has players running on astroturf. Or is costing big $ in seasons and partial packs. But I genuinely don't see a big issue here.


It's costing me a game I don't want to see. "Big Issue" is a bit much though. Me saying and making a banner for a game I didn't want in my seasons package isn't a big deal to me.

I won't address the "not costing us" anything as a team. It's been addressed elsewhere already. A lot.

[brad]

Good grief. Of a "tier"???? As in quality names?

What bloody "tier" would that be? The novelty and marketing has worn off Toronto. The man is delusional. The days of Madrid are long past.

He should be thanking his lucky stars that Penarol would even consider showing up here.

The days of being an MLS poster franchise ended a while ago. Now, I could see NYRB or LA getting the big names to come in. Big $ tickets, large crowds and cross marketing would be the appeal.

What, if any, of those would this current sh** show have to offer, Paul?

Liverpool didn't seem to have a problem with us last year.

Seriously though - for most big clubs the opposition in these preseason match matters little. It's about making apperances to increase the brand awareness.

[Yagbod]

I was part of a 'focus group', for lack of a better term, during the ticket drive for the Liverpool game last year. The organizers were almost literally shitting their pants because TFC was tanking it and no one wanted the game, but it was too late. They were concerned that it would be a complete disaster and if it wasn't Liverpool it would have been. TFC fans were not interested.

This is why if there is a friendly it has to be against a big team. They know now that TFC fans will not fill the dome or even BMO for a friendly. The reason they have TFC play at all is because they are cheap to hire compared to two big names.

This, I think, is why you will never see a club like Penarol or a similar level club come up for a friendly. They will go big or go home.

[nfitz]

It's costing me a game I don't want to see.How? There's 18 games in the package this season (after the 19th game was refunded. 17 MLS games and the Voyageurs Cup game we won at BMO versus Montreal.

So in Yellow $180. If they add a free friendly, it's $180. If they don't add one it's $180. If they charge for the friendly and you don't go it's $180.

Sorry to keep going ... but I don't see how it's costing you, unless they charge for the game, and you want to go to it. There's something I'm missing in all this. Perhaps I've misread something ...

Though I'm not convinced the game will actually occur ... or if it does, be anything more used a training game against a mixed Reserve/Academy side.

[jloome]

Paul Beirne should read Football365 occasionally, given that it's his business.

Guillermo Varela (Manchester United and Uruguay)
Such tournaments often offer a preview of potential Premier League recruits, with scouts from Europe's highest-profile clubs desperate to sign up another young prodigy, but in the case of Guillermo Varela, Manchester United have already completed their business, unveiling the Uruguayan on a five-year deal last week. The 20-year-old full-back, signed from Penarol in his native country, cost the club £1million and United fans can take the next three weeks as an opportunity to scout their new signing.

A South American right-back who actually seemingly enjoys defending as much as attacking, it is less a surprise to find a Uruguayan defender that is easily filed under 'no-nonsense'. However, with pace and impressive stamina (one of the principle reasons for United's purchase, according to the club), Varela is intended to provide genuine competition for Rafael within his first year at the club.

One thing is for sure, Jeff Powell will be watching intently, keen to clue up on the 'second-tier' defender.

[Fort York Redcoat]

How? There's 18 games in the package this season (after the 19th game was refunded. 17 MLS games and the Voyageurs Cup game we won at BMO versus Montreal.

So in Yellow $180. If they add a free friendly, it's $180. If they don't add one it's $180. If they charge for the friendly and you don't go it's $180.

Sorry to keep going ... but I don't see how it's costing you, unless they charge for the game, and you want to go to it. There's something I'm missing in all this. Perhaps I've misread something ...

Though I'm not convinced the game will actually occur ... or if it does, be anything more used a training game against a mixed Reserve/Academy side.

Yep. You don't get it. It's funny cause I understand your POV on it but don't share it, with respect. Sorry you can't see mine.

Here's hoping they charge for it and those that want to be there, can.

But I'd rather no friendly at all midseason.

[ensco]

You guys are wasting your time on Beirne. If he isn't up to it, it's not his fault.

The decision to keep him belongs to Payne or Anselmi. Same with Cochrane.

(Note to journalists: somebody still needs to follow that bit of yarn and see where it leads.)

[BeachTory]

I was part of a 'focus group', for lack of a better term, during the ticket drive for the Liverpool game last year. The organizers were almost literally shitting their pants because TFC was tanking it and no one wanted the game, but it was too late. They were concerned that it would be a complete disaster and if it wasn't Liverpool it would have been. TFC fans were not interested.

This is why if there is a friendly it has to be against a big team. They know now that TFC fans will not fill the dome or even BMO for a friendly. The reason they have TFC play at all is because they are cheap to hire compared to two big names.

This, I think, is why you will never see a club like Penarol or a similar level club come up for a friendly. They will go big or go home.


TFC were not the hosts and were not the organizers.
Liverpool did not really even show up. Many top names did not even travel from Boston. Yes the reserves of Liverpool showed and that was enough for the Liverpool supporters to whom the entire event was targetted.

that TFC accepted, during a CCL tight shedule, forcing the Chicago name into the WCQ window (when TFC was likely to loose a few players for Canada duty) in september is the sad reality.

i asked Payne about this at the box holders reception in February. He said it is important to play big names with the best squad possible. He cited examples in DC where he asked/told the manager to play their best players in an exhibition when they had a league game a few days later. Payne said it was more important to play and beat big names to market the team.

I said this market was more mature than that. I said playing Liverpool in front of toronto based liverpool fans would not increase the number of TFC seat sales as the Liverpool fans in attendance would have already decided if they would support both or only Liverpool years earlier. I summarized by saying the Toronto market might be more sophisticated than he though and therefore old ways of marketing might not get results

That all said, PLAYER recruitment comes from relationships. I don't believe in coincidences that Frei for example trained at Liverpool out of thin air. The training centre is a resource TFC wants to show off and so they do to help with player recruitment. Getting any south american team here to show them the resources will help. Osorio has opened eyes about possibilities

[nfitz]

Yep. You don't get it. It's funny cause I understand your POV on it but don't share it, with respect. Sorry you can't see mine.I might well understand your POV if you articulate it differently. Your point is that "It's costing me a game I don't want to see." Perhaps if you could expand on how it's costing you, I might see it.

Do you feel a duty to come to a game if it's happening, even if you don't want the game?

My views aren't intransient. I can be convinced of something, even to the point I'll start arguing the point of view I initially argued against.

[jloome]

You guys are wasting your time on Beirne. If he isn't up to it, it's not his fault.

The decision to keep him belongs to Payne or Anselmi. Same with Cochrane.

(Note to journalists: somebody still needs to follow that bit of yarn and see where it leads.)

I've never subscribed to the dissolution of personal responsibility that comes with the saying "don't hate the player, hate the game." The man's either delusional or is hanging onto a job at which he's no good. To me, that's his decision as much as his employer.

[ensco]

I've never subscribed to the dissolution of personal responsibility that comes with the saying "don't hate the player, hate the game." The man's either delusional or is hanging onto a job at which he's no good. To me, that's his decision as much as his employer.

I'm not saying you should "like" Beirne", but it's just not his responsibility in life to point out his own personal flaws/shortcomings. That level of self awareness is not reality for most people.

It's not easy to get a high paying gig like this.

[Greatest Ripoff]

I'll most likely go to this if it is priced right. I am moving overseas at the end of July so I am trying to fit in as much TFC (reserves, academy, ect) before I leave.

[Yagbod]

I'll go. I hate mid season friendlies. But, it's not going to affect anything, even if someone gets hurt.

We are already out 4 games due to CCL bed shitting. Any chance to get down to the park and see my friends and cheer on my team I will take.

[Brooker]

I used to despise these midseason friendlies.... Now I'm finding it hard to even care.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I might well understand your POV if you articulate it differently. Your point is that "It's costing me a game I don't want to see." Perhaps if you could expand on how it's costing you, I might see it.

Do you feel a duty to come to a game if it's happening, even if you don't want the game?

My views aren't intransient. I can be convinced of something, even to the point I'll start arguing the point of view I initially argued against.


I think the fact this game isn't official is muddying the waters since different opinions are attached to different scenarios. IF this game is officially announced

It's a midseason friendly first and foremost. Some people enjoy the idea, the guest, the practice for the reserves/kids. I do not appreciate it since there will always be some starters that will have to play. It will be part of the contract in the friendly negotiation. This is goose for gander fair since most fans of the guest will want to see starters and they need to market the game. The use of our starters is a waste. The use of the rest is nice for them but should be in a reserve league game.

IF this is a separate game that we are given the opportunity to purchase than I disagree with the need for it but at least I can exclude myself from attending and just worry about someone getting hurt.

IF this is included in our seasons and flex packs then the semantic discussion begins. This free game for us is considered added value that wasn't there before and your perspective is in line with the club that it's no harm done.

Mine is that if you add value, any value it has to be considered valuable to the consumer. Since I think it hurts the team it's not added value to me. It's value that could be added in an alternative way that could benefit both team and consumer.

I now see that if one had no problem with the friendly one wouldn't see the value lost.

Here's an example that is applicable but not all encompassing:

"Update to the newest version of blah, blah, blah...it's free"

...Oh now the blah function is gone. I liked that.

LOST VALUE but it was free.

Hope that helps. I don't expect to change your mind but I expect more people taking a view on this subject once the plan and announcement becomes official.

[Phil]

I used to despise these midseason friendlies.... Now I'm finding it hard to even care.

This is the sadest thing I have read on here. The worst part is I totally understand where you are coming from with it.

[BuSaPuNk]

@24thminute: Yeah, it's Roma. @torontofc has made a major miscalculation of the market. You ain't in LA anymore Mr. Leiweke...#TFC

Yeah it's AS Roma. Looks like there here the dates that have been floating around for this http://www.procalciocanadafc.com/index.php/next-steps

No surprise really. $$$$$$ hope this thing is empty what a joke.

[TFC07]

@24thminute: Yeah, it's Roma. @torontofc has made a major miscalculation of the market. You ain't in LA anymore Mr. Leiweke...#TFC

Yeah it's AS Roma. Looks like there here the dates that have been floating around for this http://www.procalciocanadafc.com/index.php/next-steps

No surprise really. $$$$$$ hope this thing is empty what a joke.

Is it me or 24thminute have been on anti-TFC bandwagon since Payne was hired?

[BuSaPuNk]

I think everyone is at a breaking point with something with this team. Duane is no different.

[Haddy]

@24thminute: Yeah, it's Roma. @torontofc has made a major miscalculation of the market. You ain't in LA anymore Mr. Leiweke...#TFC

Forgive me, but how is it a miscalculation? I can think of a ton of Serie A fans who would love to see some of those guys come to town. Be it their fav club or not. I'm not predicting a sellout, but there is a market.

And why is it that some people are so shocked when TFC tries to make a buck? Hate to lay out a shocker here......making money is why MLSE bought a franchise in the first place. Sell lots of tickets, have friendlies to sell more tickets...and build an academy to develop players good enough to sell more tickets, and then sell them when they are good/popular enough.

[ensco]

I will pay up to go to see Roma if the game is at BMO. If it's at Skydome, pass.

[Haddy]

I will pay up to go to see Roma if the game is at BMO. If it's at Skydome, pass.

Beirne stated earlier that Skydome is not an option for this season.

[BuSaPuNk]

I think Duane is saying a miscalculation because of how a large portion of supporters and even regular fans will view this. A money grab that is detrimental to our club.

Bring big name clubs to Toronto/Canada I don't have a problem with that. I went to Celtic/Man Utd a few years back. Loved it. Two teams playing each other in a preseason game here I'm all for it. Throw in TFC in season for a meaningless friendly that's where I have the problem.

Someone tears a ACL or gets injured in a meaningless game alot of people here will be screaming bloody murder. And they should. Our team will already be missing probably three bodies because of the Gold Cup that month. Now your going to have our remaining squad run out for a meaningless friendly in the same month? Ridiculous to me.

[Haddy]

I think Duane is saying a miscalculation because of how a large portion of supporters and even regular fans will view this. A money grab that is detrimental to our club.

Bring big name clubs to Toronto/Canada I don't have a problem with that. I went to Celtic/Man Utd a few years back. Loved it. Two teams playing each other in a preseason game here I'm all for it. Throw in TFC in season for a meaningless friendly that's where I have the problem.

Someone tears a ACL or gets injured in a meaningless game alot of people here will be screaming bloody murder. And they should. Our team will already be missing probably three bodies because of the Gold Cup that month. Now your going to have our remaining squad run out for a meaningless friendly in the same month? Ridiculous to me.

I 100% understand the mid-season risks. But unfortunately, that's the nature of the MLS schedule vs. the schedule of every other club worth inviting for a friendly. They are busy in February and November.

They don't call it 'the almighty dollar' for nothin' ;)

[BuSaPuNk]

^ Completely understand that. But it's up to the FO to show that it's not all about the "almighty dollar" and give us something to believe in. Outside of the usual rebuild, tear down and make money off big friendlies as they have been.

Time to show that even the FO wants results. Because this just shows results mean nothing.

[Haddy]

^ Completely understand that. But it's up to the FO to show that it's not all about the "almighty dollar" and give us something to believe in. Outside of the usual rebuild, tear down and make money off big friendlies as they have been.

Time to show that even the FO wants results. Because this just shows results mean nothing.

It's the FO's job to show us results next year. They warned us about this year. Based on the schedule only consisting of league fixtures, TFC can handle one extra match.

I'm guessing that, in a perfect world, MLSE wants TFC to be a self-sustaining business. That also includes covering transfer fees if possible. A good way to generate easy funds is a friendly. It may be a necessary evil. One of those 'end justifies the means' type deals.

But if they pull these stunts while the team is threatening for playoffs in the future - I'm buying you drinks.

[brad]

Is it me or 24thminute have been on anti-TFC bandwagon since Payne was hired?

He loved Mariner, so I'm not surprised.

[Fort York Redcoat]

OK lads the talk about the friendly that is happening is in here (http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?34418-TFC-v-Roma-at-BMO-Aug-7-2013)


Unless they do one with Penerol let's continue discussion over there.


Thanks

[Oldtimer]

Continue all Roma discussion here: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?34418-TFC-v-Roma-at-BMO-Aug-7-2013

[nfitz]

Hope that helps. I don't expect to change your mind but I expect more people taking a view on this subject once the plan and announcement becomes official.Thanks for the explanation ... I'm out-of-town and only just read it.

Looks like some of this rumour was true. The Penarol/Lisbon game is listed on Ticketmaster for 3 pm July 21st - http://www.ticketmaster.ca/event/10004AD8D78AAF93 but doesn't seem to be on sale yet. Tickets start at $51!

Shame, I think I'd be likelier to pay $15 to see Penarol play TFC than $29 to see Roma play them.

[moralis]

I've read on Penarol's twitter account that they are looking for another opponent because Toronto FC have opted out:

Peñarol -Uruguay #49 ‏@mkCarbonero (https://twitter.com/mkCarbonero) "Se cayó el amistoso de Peñarol con el Toronto FC del 24/07, se esta buscando un rival para esa fecha" Via LVDF

https://twitter.com/mkCarbonero/status/352111895886577667

[Yohan]

I've read on Penarol's twitter account that they are looking for another opponent because Toronto FC have opted out:

Peñarol -Uruguay #49 ‏@mkCarbonero (https://twitter.com/mkCarbonero) "Se cayó el amistoso de Peñarol con el Toronto FC del 24/07, se esta buscando un rival para esa fecha" Via LVDF

https://twitter.com/mkCarbonero/status/352111895886577667
should have kept the friendly and just play the reserves and senior academy players

[Couchy81]

Shame, I think I'd be likelier to pay $15 to see Penarol play TFC than $29 to see Roma play them.

Agreed

[NolbertoS]

Don't know if you guys are aware but Penarol will play Benfica this upcoming weekend at BMO Field. First time I heard of this

http://www.ovaciondigital.com.uy/futbol/no-hubo-caso-tendra-que.html

[jabbronies]

Don't know if you guys are aware but Penarol will play Benfica this upcoming weekend at BMO Field. First time I heard of this

http://www.ovaciondigital.com.uy/futbol/no-hubo-caso-tendra-que.html

Benfica? I thought it was Sporting

[NolbertoS]

Benfica? I thought it was Sporting

You're right, read the article too quickly. They'll play Sporting at BMO and Benfica in Portugal. Game is this Sunday for anybody interested, not sure if its sold out.

[Yagbod]

Cheapest seat is $40 plus $11.25 'screw job' fee.

Holy shit. That place will be empty.

[Ivy]

Maybe it'll be free for those that have tickets to the NYRB game lol...