TFC 2012-2013 off-season general player moves/speculation/etc.

[Ageroo]

Official...

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/12/toronto-acquires-bendik-draft-pick

[Canary10]

Getting allocation and a back-up keeper makes it more worthwhile imo.

[Ajax TFC]

Mariner is an idiot.

Yes frei is qualit, but he'll head across the pond as soon as he can....Frei also is a softy in the air and struggles on set pieces.

Kocic was MLS perfect. Not as good a shot stopper, but a big, imposing keeper who was strong enough to impose his will. He would have been a long term option in net. Mariner didnt want him because he showed disloyalty to the team, a team that had nothing left to play for, when he missed games to be with his sick newborn...

Mariners an idiot. Kocic is character. Ill miss him.
This is pure truth. Frei was extremely shaky in that game vs LA at home, got replaced by Kocic, and then injured. He also makes more than what Kocic likely would have even if he got a raise. Then Mariner comes out and publicly states that Kocic has no chance of competing for the #1 spot because it will automatically be handed to Frei without any competition. I'm happy for Kocic that he can go to a team where he has a chance of competing for the #1 spot and has a chance of getting a raise (here if you ask for a raise, you're seen as disloyal and discarded).

[Ultra & Proud]

Mariner is an idiot.

Yes frei is qualit, but he'll head across the pond as soon as he can....Frei also is a softy in the air and struggles on set pieces.

Kocic was MLS perfect. Not as good a shot stopper, but a big, imposing keeper who was strong enough to impose his will. He would have been a long term option in net. Mariner didnt want him because he showed disloyalty to the team, a team that had nothing left to play for, when he missed games to be with his sick newborn...

Mariners an idiot. Kocic is character. Ill miss him.

I think the Frei overseas thing is dead in the water now for at least a few seasons and in my opinion he was much better at controlling the box than Kocic. For a big guy Kocic didn't really get out there and claim balls in the box and his distribution was absolutely terrible. Horrible actually. I was all pro-Kocic at the beginning of last season, even before Frei busted his leg but after seeing him for nearly the whole season it was clear to me who was better.

Also, this would be Payne's handy work now. Not Mariner's.

[Yohan]

http://www.portlandtimbers.com/news/2012/12/timbers-acquire-ryan-johnson-milos-kocic-toronto-fc-exchange-joe-bendik-2013-superdraft

Reporting that TFC also get some allocation money out of this. Nice piece of business IMO

[DichioTFC]

Bendik made league minimum last year, so not much of a cap hit at all.

Bendik and Kocic are standard backup GKs, so they cancel each other out. This trade is Ryan Johnson for the 3rd pick overall. Not sure how I feel about this on paper, but if Johnson was committed to leaving or was otherwise unhappy here, it's pretty good compensation.

I would prefer TFC draft either CBs Andrew Farrell or Walker Zimmerman, as Ives suggested earlier today, with the first pick and trade the 3rd pick. We need one starting CB and we can trade the third pick for a starting CM.

[Northern Soul]

I like this quote from Payne. He actually sounds like he has a plan and vision, and wants to stick to it, as evidenced from day 1 here.

Payne added “We have a lot of work to do, from a roster and a salary cap standpoint, and this is a first step. Our objective is to put together a group of young, talented, athletic and hungry players that we can keep together for years to come.”

[Ultra & Proud]

This trade is Ryan Johnson for the 3rd pick overall. Not sure how I feel about this on paper, but if Johnson was committed to leaving or was otherwise unhappy here, it's pretty good compensation.

He probably was unhappy plus he made too much $$$ for what he brought. You can get better for less. Toss in whatever magical allocation amount we have coming and this is a win.

[ryan]

I'm pleased Johnson is gone. I don't think he's a bad player, I just didn't feel he's a player that fits what Toronto is doing. He always seemed to be on a different page, passing when it's not there, shooting a difficult shot when a pass is there, just always seemed of sync.

His frustration and quit level is something I found bothersome as well. Again, talented player, but I'm glad he's gone personally. I think it'll make the team better overall in the short and long run.


Kocic on the other hand, will be missed. I agree he was a good fit for an MLS keeper, but it seems politics paved the way for this one, so it is what it is.


Decent haul in return. Guess they have faith in the 2013 draft class studs to want to take two of them, unless another deal is in mind.

[Jeff s]

Funny how Frei goes a whole season without playing, but stays on the team. Are we just assuming he'll be the same GK? How do we know for sure. It's risky to give up Kocic without knowing. Not to mention, if Frei gets hurt again.....I don't even want to think about it.

Also funny how Lindsey was in the exact same situation and wasn't even given a second chance.

[tfcmanu]

TFC land-TFC trade is official, with Toronto also receiving GK Joe Bendik and allocation money along w/No. 3 overall pick in 2013 draft

(https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Bendik


https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves (https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves)

http://www.soccerbyives.net/2012/12/breaking-timbers-set-to-trade-first-round-pick-to-tfc-for-johnson-kocic.html (http://www.soccerbyives.net/2012/12/breaking-timbers-set-to-trade-first-round-pick-to-tfc-for-johnson-kocic.html)

[TFC07]

So where does this leave Freddy Hall? I thought he was our backup goalkeeper? Also, he doesn't fit in Payne's vision (younger and athletic player).

[Jpexxx]

Lindsay's injury and Frei's injury were completely different.

I am definitely going to miss Kocic though. Has Frei ever stopped a PK?

[Ajax TFC]

So where does this leave Freddy Hall? I thought he was our backup goalkeeper? Also, he doesn't fit in Payne's vision (younger and athletic player).
hopefully it leaves him as a free agent. With our luck though, it leaves him with a contract and taking up an international spot

[Ultra & Proud]

So where does this leave Freddy Hall? I thought he was our backup goalkeeper? Also, he doesn't fit in Payne's vision (younger and athletic player).

Freddy we hardly knew ya.

[Ajax TFC]

Lindsay's injury and Frei's injury were completely different.

I am definitely going to miss Kocic though. Has Frei ever stopped a PK?
He stopped one in preseason two years ago, only to rebound it right onto the shooter's feet. And his form while trying to stop one is bad enough to make a grown man cry.

[Ultra & Proud]

I think Kocic is getting a bit of that Avila and Cordon hometown bias. He was surely better than them two but when compared to other GKs league-wide, he is just another MLS GK.

[Benficachop20]

so in the end of the day we're still stuck with 4 gks in a salary cap league.... Unless we get rid of hall then bringing in Bendik is a stupid move. Don't mind Johnson going, hate to see Kocic gone though.

[SirBobSaget]

hopefully it leaves him as a free agent. With our luck though, it leaves him with a contract and taking up an international spot

Didn't Mariner offer him a 2 year extension before Payne came in?

Hall determined to keep his number one jersey (http://www.royalgazette.com/article/20121123/SPORT01/711239910)“We’re in (contract) negotiations right now and hopefully everything will be sorted in the next few weeks so I can be ready for preseason."

also

Hall is likely to be joined in preseason by Robin Hood striker Antwan Russell who has been invited to return to BMO Field in January after impressing during a recent trial.

[Ultra & Proud]

so in the end of the day we're still stuck with 4 gks in a salary cap league.... Unless we get rid of hall then bringing in Bendik is a stupid move. Don't mind Johnson going, hate to see Kocic gone though.

Hall can be dumped. Not resigned as far as I know. Talks were ongoing. Roberts can as well but I say he gets loaned out to the CSL. All I have to say is Bendik > Hall by a mile. That is an improvement. And yeah, Kocic was a good back up but he wanted a substantial raise (and a chance to start) and that's why he is gone. In a salary capped league you can't overpay backup GKs.


So in this trade we swapped back up GKs, and sent an overpaid RJ away for the 3rd pick and allocation.

In a ton of earlier threads people on here bemoaned the acquiring of Hassli for a 1st rounder which has no guarantee of being 3rd spot or higher (hopefully not). A first rounder was said to be very important and it should not have been traded away, even for a DP. So here Portland just did the same thing only for a player who scores less goals and they also included allocation.

[Phil]

On the Tweeter according to Larson: Earl is saying the option in Freddy Hall was declined for next year.

As well, terms can't be met with Avilia so don't expect to see him in TO next year.

[ag futbol]

Definitely will miss Kocic, but this league has more than a few good keepers. That being said, Frei has shortcomings and I hope he is willing to work on them.

Would rather us flip at least one of these picks rather than keep both. Draft this year sounds so-so and defender heavy. I'd take one but not two CB projects considering we already have Henry.

Rebuilding with a young athletic team doesn't exactly fill me with joy, but I'll wait until I see the results.

[Ultra & Proud]

Rebuilding with a young athletic team doesn't exactly fill me with joy, but I'll wait until I see the results.
Fills me with more joy than staying with an aging team of hacks though.

[ManUtd4ever]

A fairly good return, all things considered. It will be up to Payne to make proper use of the allocation vis a vis free agent player acquisitions, and to draft wisely. I would assume that two future starters can be drafted with two of the top three picks in the upcoming draft.

I wish Johnson and Kocic well, as they were significant contributors to our memorable 2011-2012 CCL run.

[notthesun]

Agreed that Frei going over to Europe isn't in the cards any time soon. With his injury he'll need at least two seasons of being recognized as an undisputed top 3 MLS keeper before a European team of any significance takes a crack at him.

Gotta say I'm impressed with Payne so far. Canadian Soccer News reported the likely deal was going to be Bendik and allocation for Johnson and Kocic. It happened, but Payne got us a first round pick to boot. Good stuff.

edit: Freddy Hall on his way out? Today keeps getting better and better. Avila was to be expected. I wouldn't have minded keeping him but he was treated pretty poorly. Probably best if he leaves.

[Ajax TFC]

In a ton of earlier threads people on here bemoaned the acquiring of Hassli for a 1st rounder which has no guarantee of being 3rd spot or higher (hopefully not). A first rounder was said to be very important and it should not have been traded away, even for a DP. So here Portland just did the same thing only for a player who scores less goals and they also included allocation.
just shows Portland's stupidity. It doesn't justify our own.

[Morlesio14]

But would we really trade our 1st overall pick? This draft doesn't have one standout but depth. Mabye we'll pick a good left or right midfielder.

[ag futbol]

Fills me with more joy than staying with an aging team of hacks though.
Perhaps, but not by much though.

I think phily was a good example of a young hungry team this year ( who fired their coach as well). Didn't exactly light it up.

[gracos]

Toronto has definitely opened some cap space in bringing in new players, we have about $800K to play around with from last season to this season excluding Allocation monies

http://www.mlsplayers.org/salary_info.html

[sashavukelich]

Toronto has definitely opened some cap space in bringing in new players, we have about $800K to play around with from last season to this season excluding Allocation monies

Gracos that number gets me sooooo excited, where did you work it out though?!?!

[Morlesio14]

Can't wait to see who we bring in!!!

[Ultra & Proud]

Gracos that number gets me sooooo excited, where did you work it out though?!?!

As per Canadian Soccer News:

Below a list of the 18 players currently under contract for 2013 and their estimated cap hit.

Darren O'Dea -- $400,000
Torsten Frings -- $367,000
Danny Koevermans -- $367,000
Eric Hassli -- $367,000
Richard Eckersley -- $220,500
Stefan Frei -- $183,750
Justin Braun -- $107,225
Terry Dunfield -- $90,300
Reggie Lambe -- $63,000
Joao Plata -- $52,500.00
Quincy Amarikwa -- $46,300.00
Joe Bendik -- $46,200
Logan Emory -- $46,100
Doneil Henry -- $0
Ashtone Morgan -- $0
Quillan Roberts -- $0
Luis Silva -- $0
Matt Stinson -- $0

Total estimated cap hit –
$2,356,879

2013 salary cap –
$2,950,000

Remaining cap room –
$639, 325

*Edited - that one had Freddy Hall on it so I adjusted it.

[TFC07]

O'Dea salary counts as $400,000? What an awful contract. Talk about killing salary cap. lol See, it's signing players like O'Dea that kills this team, not DP's that a lot of people like to point their fingers. DP's are fine to sign as long they live up to their hype (I think it's safe to say Danny K and Frings have been worth taking 350,000 to 400,000 hit on salary cap).

[sashavukelich]

As per Canadian Soccer News:

Below the jump a list of the 19 players currently under contract for 2013 and their estimated cap hit.

Darren O'Dea -- $400,000
Torsten Frings -- $367,000
Danny Koevermans -- $367,000
Eric Hassli -- $367,000
Richard Eckersley -- $220,500
Stefan Frei -- $183,750
Justin Braun -- $107,225
Terry Dunfield -- $90,300
Reggie Lambe -- $63,000
Joao Plata -- $52,500.00
Quincy Amarikwa -- $46,300.00
Freddy Hall -- $46,204.00
Joe Bendik -- $46,200
Logan Emory -- $46,100
Doneil Henry -- $0
Ashtone Morgan -- $0
Quillan Roberts -- $0
Luis Silva -- $0
Matt Stinson -- $0

Total estimated cap hit –
$2,356,879

2013 salary cap –
$2,950,000

Remaining cap room –
$593,121

hell we can add another 46,204.00 to that cap!!! Freddy Hall's option has not been picked up. Also for Darren O'Dea isn't the maximum 367? Thus buying us another 33,000 in CAP space.....

Bringing our remaining Cap room to...

672,325.00 (roughly).


Damn..... we look in good shape;

[DichioTFC]

He probably was unhappy plus he made too much $$$ for what he brought. You can get better for less. Toss in whatever magical allocation amount we have coming and this is a win.

Johnson was making $137K, a pretty standard salary for a league starter and a team leading scorer. I think a fair salary for him would be $115K but again, you're right that we can get better for less.

I like Braun, he seems to be a player that fits the style Mariner is trying to incorporate (hard-nosed, grinding, 100% effort football). Johnson disappeared when his heart wasn't into it, I can't see Braun letting his determination slip.

[Ultra & Proud]

Frings have been worth taking 350,000 to 400,000 hit on salary cap
Not really. A 25 year old O' Dea has more long term value than a 35 year old Frings. If Frings is dumped you could change O'Dea's contract to a DP one and save another $33k. Actually more than that if we still kept Koevs & Hassli. No guarantee on that though. Not anymore.

[TFC07]

Not really. A 25 year old O' Dea has more long term value than a 35 year old Frings. If Frings is dumped you could change O'Dea's contract to a DP one and save another $33k.

Not for 400,000 per year. You can bring better talent for half the cost. O'Dea is just championship division reject who couldn't get a contract in 2nd division in England. It's awful cap management from TFC that is making it harder to build quality depth. Frings brings in leadership, skills, IQ and unlike most players, he has played with and against best players in the world. He's worth taking a cap hit.

[DichioTFC]

As per Canadian Soccer News:

Below a list of the 18 players currently under contract for 2013 and their estimated cap hit.

Darren O'Dea -- $400,000
Torsten Frings -- $367,000
Danny Koevermans -- $367,000
Eric Hassli -- $367,000
Richard Eckersley -- $220,500
Stefan Frei -- $183,750
Justin Braun -- $107,225
Terry Dunfield -- $90,300
Reggie Lambe -- $63,000
Joao Plata -- $52,500.00
Quincy Amarikwa -- $46,300.00
Joe Bendik -- $46,200
Logan Emory -- $46,100
Doneil Henry -- $0
Ashtone Morgan -- $0
Quillan Roberts -- $0
Luis Silva -- $0
Matt Stinson -- $0

Total estimated cap hit –
$2,356,879

2013 salary cap –
$2,950,000

Remaining cap room –
$639, 325

*Edited - that one had Freddy Hall on it so I adjusted it.

Currently we have $800K of roster space. It's all calculated here
http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?33013-2013-Salary-Cap-Roster-Discussion

[Ultra & Proud]

Currently we have $800K of roster space. It's all calculated here
http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?33013-2013-Salary-Cap-Roster-Discussion
The more $$$ the better. Now, let's sign wisely. This Fridays draft should be interesting now. I'd be right in there. For the right price.

[DichioTFC]

I'd agree with you 100%

Also, just to update the other post, its actually $740K in cap space. But either way, lots of room to maneuver

[Jpexxx]

Maybe the worth of a (albeit early) Superdraft pick is not actually as valuable as the consensus seems to believe around these parts?

It seems that proven MLS talent out-weighs the potential the best the NCAA can offer.

[Ultra & Proud]

I'd agree with you 100%

Also, just to update the other post, its actually $740K in cap space. But either way, lots of room to maneuver
I wonder how much mythical allocation money we have?

[DichioTFC]

I wonder how much mythical allocation money we have?

Ah yes, the mystical and magical "allocation money". I figure we would have a lot considering we missed on the playoffs, we won NCC and we made it to CCL (both of those are separate categories for allocation). Plus with trades like the Portland one, we'll have quite a bit.

How much is anyone's guess, but safe to say we can exceed the $2.95 million cap for 2013.

[DichioTFC]

Maybe the worth of a (albeit early) Superdraft pick is not actually as valuable as the consensus seems to believe around these parts?

It seems that proven MLS talent out-weighs the potential the best the NCAA can offer.

Proven MLS talent is always valuable, but they tend to become overvalued very quickly. Plus you never know when you can catch lightning in a bottle. There's been a history of success with the first and third SuperDraft picks and, if I were in charge of those picks, it would take a lot of me to give them up.

[KGH]

Currently we have $800K of roster space. It's all calculated here
http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?33013-2013-Salary-Cap-Roster-Discussion

1 - Both Henry and Morgan signed new deals this year. They will not be at league min and as it's there 2nd contract they won't count as homegrown. I'd imagine Morgan is at about $75-100k and Henry is around $60k.

2- The first highest 20 Salaries count towards the cap. Might be semantics but you have to plug those existing people in as they currently count towards the cap. Right now the only one who won't is Roberts s he's a home grown.

3 - I also believe the league minimum salary increases by 5-10% this year. i just can't remember which it is and don't want to look it up.

When you factor that in we have ~$400k in room (+ allocation) above $46k per signing. What this means is if we sign someone for $100k the impact will only be $54k as they are pushing one of the lower salaried players to slot 21.

[DichioTFC]

Both Henry and Morgan signed new deals this year. They will not be at league min and as it's there 2nd contract they won't count as homegrown. I'd imagine Morgan is at about $75-100k and Henry is around $60k.

They might not be league minimum, but no way did Morgan get anywhere near $100K. $60K is a good guess, but considering the allocation coming our way, it all evens itself out in the end. Plus I addressed the assumption of increased player salaries in the first post.

[19Barrett19]

Ah yes, the mystical and magical "allocation money". I figure we would have a lot considering we missed on the playoffs, we won NCC and we made it to CCL (both of those are separate categories for allocation). Plus with trades like the Portland one, we'll have quite a bit.

How much is anyone's guess, but safe to say we can exceed the $2.95 million cap for 2013.

If i where to guess I would guess the following:

Finishing last: 250K
CCL: 200K
RJ9 trade: 100K
= 550k + 800k= 1.35m

I could be wrong. Some of that money will be used to buy down O'dea's contract to a league minimum that leaves us will a Million dollars to mess with. Add another 70K if we don't use roster spots 29&30. Currently TFC has about 19 players. we need to get to 26 or 27.

[Cell]

Not sure if anyone has posted this but
Toronto FC is negotiating a transfer fee with Swedish side Hammarby for Canadian international midfielder Nik Ledgerwood.

The 27-year-old is looking to escape the Swedish second tier after his club failed to promote last season.
Source: Canadian Soccer News

If true hes looking at around 175k to 200k

[JayMolly]

Can't wait to see who we bring in!!!

I agree. It may be December, but I can't wait for the new season.

Payne may cause pain to some of our current players but this is a step in the right direction! Go TFC!

[brad]

O'Dea salary counts as $400,000? What an awful contract. Talk about killing salary cap. lol See, it's signing players like O'Dea that kills this team, not DP's that a lot of people like to point their fingers. DP's are fine to sign as long they live up to their hype (I think it's safe to say Danny K and Frings have been worth taking 350,000 to 400,000 hit on salary cap).

If..if..if. Having all or our eggs tied up in 3 DP's isn't working out so well for us because they are injury prone.

When they were fit and firing, they were great, but based on how much they have been injured I don't agree they are worth the hit.

[TFC07]

If..if..if. Having all or our eggs tied up in 3 DP's isn't working out so well for us because they are injury prone.

When they were fit and firing, they were great, but based on how much they have been injured I don't agree they are worth the hit.

Frings and Danny K didn't have history of being injury prone before they were signed, right? Blame Mariner and Co for Hassli. That was a bad signing. If I had chance to acquire three world cup players, then I would do it in a heartbeat. BTW: L.A. has three DP and they won MLS Cup again!

[Yohan]

BTW: L.A. has three DP and they won MLS Cup again!
Three healthy DPs... makes a helluva difference

[brad]

Three healthy DPs... makes a helluva difference

Especially when you put them on top of a solid MLS squad like LA have, unlike our handful of decent player and a bunch of scrubs.

It's a calculated risk.

[TFC07]

Especially when you put them on top of a solid MLS squad like LA have, unlike our handful of decent player and a bunch of scrubs.

It's a calculated risk.

Or just better management which TFC lacks. Problem isn't exactly DP (though some DP signings weren't great, but overall it was decent for TFC POV), but wasting cap space on average players like O'Dea and Ecks. Not saying they're awful players, but they're not worth close to $350,000-400,000. You can get two or three players for $350-400K combined who can produce and provide same thing like O'Dea and Ecks can provide to the team.

[TFC07]

Three healthy DPs... makes a helluva difference
How many people predicted that Frings and Danny K were going to be injury prone players before being signed to Toronto? It's just bad luck we couldn't have those two healthy throughout the season.

[ensco]

How many people predicted that Frings and Danny K were going to be injury prone players before being signed to Toronto?

Actually quite a few.

Here's my handy dandy prediction for the next 32 or 34 year old signed by any team in any league, who is expected to play 90 minutes: the player will probably have injury problems.

[Ajax TFC]

Actually quite a few.

Here's my handy dandy prediction for the next 32 or 34 year old signed by any team in any league, who is expected to play 90 minutes: the player will probably have injury problems.
and is expected to run their ass off for the full 90, every game, no matter how close together those games are.

[Auzzy]

I can't look it up right now, but I remember hearing that Danny K was somewhat injury-prone in Holland as well, before he came here. Plus, before he went down, I remember being very worried that he was being over-played for his age & position, considering also he didn't start the season at the best fitness level. (Often a precursor to injury.) Poor roster & game management meant there was a huge drop-off if Danny wasn't playing. Plus coach wasn't adjusting his playing style to protect Danny, or to find a different style of play that would work when Danny was off the field (e.g., if he were to be subbed off around the 60-minute mark, to protect him during busy stretch of the schedule). So the team was depending on him playing 90 minutes every game, until he screwed his knee.

Frings was also known to have lost a step before he started here. He was being played non-stop during a grueling stretch, even slotting in at CB to fill holes. He had some smaller injuries first, but they didn't get the hint. He was played 90+ minute despite an existing hip condition, right up until his surgery.

Similar issues for Hassli: he was signed with an injury (to salvage a hopeless season). Then he was played in a style & position that subjected him to lots of abuse.

So no, not just bad luck that we had a bunch of aging DPs, who then got hurt. (Frei's injury was more like bad luck; but Kocic is a good enough keeper that we would have done OK with a half-decent defense & defensive midfield.) The sport clinicians at the Milan Lab would be able to predict many of our injuries incl. the DPs with some accuracy, looking at the number of games played & fixture congestion (plus travel); age; general fitness level; injury history; position & style of play; etc.

RE LA: they also had to deal with some serious injuries & absences during this season, incl. some of their DPs. Yet they rallied, made the playoffs, and won the cup. A well-built & well-coached squad.

[Soccerpro]

Danny K was extremely injury prone when he signed. He missed a lot of time due to Injury in Holland. The fact he wasn't injured much in his first 1/2 season is just dumb luck. You take an aging, injury prone player, put them in a physical league with a ton of travel and make him play on turf every 2nd or 3rd game = calculated risk my ass.

[Auzzy]

I actually had a discussion with somebody about this on Twitter. I wonder if it's someone else on this board. My #TFCLive wish for next season was simple: No more excuses.

The club Twitter account answered, Even if all three of our DPs are injured again? I then started a mini-debate with them and some other TFC fan. I still say, no more excuses! Especially when things are as lame as with our DP situation this year.

[Soccerpro]

I actually had a discussion with somebody about this on Twitter. I wonder if it's someone else on this board. My #TFCLive wish for next season was simple: No more excuses.

The club Twitter account answered, Even if all three of our DPs are injured again? I then started a mini-debate with them and some other TFC fan. I still say, no more excuses! Especially when things are as lame as with our DP situation this year.

It annoys me to no end when clubs point to their injury problems WHEN THEY SIGNED OLD INJURY PRONE PLAYERS.

If they trot that line out again next year, what's the point?

[Morlesio14]

People are talking about signing Nik Ledgerwood. Why the heck would we do that???? He's a defensive midfielder. We already have Frings, yes he's injury prone, but what if he doesn't get injured where would ledgerwood be playing? Sign someone else instead of him for a different position. CB anyone????

[Ajax TFC]

People are talking about signing Nik Ledgerwood. Why the heck would we do that???? He's a defensive midfielder. We already have Frings, yes he's injury prone, but what if he doesn't get injured where would ledgerwood be playing? Sign someone else instead of him for a different position. CB anyone????
you think we can go the whole season with just one good DM? hell we don't even have a second decent DM. Ledgerwood would be an improvement over Dunfield at least, and can play out wide if we need him to.

[ag futbol]

I actually had a discussion with somebody about this on Twitter. I wonder if it's someone else on this board. My #TFCLive wish for next season was simple: No more excuses.

The club Twitter account answered, Even if all three of our DPs are injured again? I then started a mini-debate with them and some other TFC fan. I still say, no more excuses! Especially when things are as lame as with our DP situation this year.

The club twitter account needs a good smack in the side of the head. The list of TFC excuses is so vast and all encompassing we shall never win anything ever. It's like a no-returns clause written by the best group of corporate lawyers in the world.

TFC shalt win every game ever unless:
1. there are too many canadians on the roster
2. the turf prevents us from signing good players
3. Being in Canada prevents us from signing good players
4. the management team just needs more time to "get it right"
5. the greatest finisher in the modern era doesn't actually live up to his name
6. game is 90 minutes instead of 75, which for some reason leads to team to give up more goals in last 15 minutes
7. despite his insistence, the manager isn't actually very good at what he does
8. MLS blocks star defender signing, club settles for playing RB out of position
9. club folk hero can't get on plane due to wear & tear on body, hangs up boots
10. The injury-prone striker we traded for unexplainably gets injured again

If half them weren't close to actual excuses floated by the club it might be funny.

[Yohan]

you think we can go the whole season with just one good DM? hell we don't even have a second decent DM. Ledgerwood would be an improvement over Dunfield at least, and can play out wide if we need him to.

Between Frings, Dunfield, Stinson and Jeremy Hall (if re-signed), DM position is covered? I think priority is signing a good box to box CM with good passing ability if Mariner is going to stick with 4-4-2

[DoubleUp]

People here really under value the importance of the midfield position, no backline in the world can stop an onslaught if your midfield cant control the tempo. Games are won and lost in the midfield.

[mowe]

People here really under value the importance of the midfield position, no backline in the world can stop an onslaught if your midfield cant control the tempo. Games are won and lost in the midfield.

Yup, and our midfield is shit. By far the biggest holes in the roster.

It's dangerous to rely heavily on a 36-year-old Frings, Dunfield is best suited as a bench player, and Mariner has showed zero faith in Stinson - no reason to see that changing now.

We still need at least two starting midfielders to play with Frings and Silva. Plus one or two depth players to add to Stinson/Dunfield/Lambe.

Not saying Ledgerwood is the answer and if we have to pay a transfer fee he's definitely not worth it. But he's the type of decent utility midfielder that this team desperately needs.

[jloome]

Between Frings, Dunfield, Stinson and Jeremy Hall (if re-signed), DM position is covered? I think priority is signing a good box to box CM with good passing ability if Mariner is going to stick with 4-4-2



Frings = too slow
Dunfield = too untalented
Hall = Worst defender in the league
Stinson = A massively inexperienced kid

Right now we need two "two-way" midfielders to compete. Unless he anchors in front of the backline Frings' speed is going to be a real problem for us starting.

[T-boy]

Danny K was extremely injury prone when he signed. He missed a lot of time due to Injury in Holland. The fact he wasn't injured much in his first 1/2 season is just dumb luck. You take an aging, injury prone player, put them in a physical league with a ton of travel and make him play on turf every 2nd or 3rd game = calculated risk my ass.

When a lot of players get to their mid thirties they often get injury prone very quickly. There aren't many players like Scholes and Giggs that just seem to be able to play week in week out. Look at Lampard, a guy who has never picked up many injuries, suddenly gets to mid 30's and can't play more than 2 games without getting another injury. Koev's and frings shouldn't be "relied" upon to play 2 games a week all next season. We really need depth to cover resting them regularly.

[ensco]

Right now we need two "two-way" midfielders to compete. Unless he anchors in front of the backline Frings' speed is going to be a real problem for us starting.

They won't do it, but Frings needs to be bought out. Same as JDG needed to be bought out last offseason. Get him off the cap and move on.

I believe Frings was kinda sorta angling for this (hence some of the odd things that happened around the time he got hurt, and afterwards) but Frings is a pro, and if we keep him, he'll do his best. But he's not even an average MLS midfielder.

[ryan]

They won't do it, but Frings needs to be bought out. Same as JDG needed to be bought out last offseason. Get him off the cap and move on.

I believe Frings was kinda sorta angling for this (hence some of the odd things that happened around the time he got hurt, and afterwards) but Frings is a pro, and if we keep him, he'll do his best. But he's not even an average MLS midfielder.

I disagree.

I don't think this club is ready to win a title this coming year (lol), so why buy him out of his last year?

Let him lead/teach the younger kids (including draft picks 1 and 3) and get your worth from there. If this contract was holding us back from adding a piece that would push us over the top into a contender, sure, buy him out, but now? I just don't see the value in it.


Also, perhaps this injury held him back last year and knowing that it may be his last season as a pro footballer, he may find a bit more in the tank to give. Judging his class, work rate and personality, I believe this to be what we'll get from him.

[Morlesio14]

Maybe pick up a cheap DM in the re entry draft to back up Frings. We should spend the money for players for the positions we really need.

[brad]

I actually had a discussion with somebody about this on Twitter. I wonder if it's someone else on this board. My #TFCLive wish for next season was simple: No more excuses.

The club Twitter account answered, Even if all three of our DPs are injured again? I then started a mini-debate with them and some other TFC fan. I still say, no more excuses! Especially when things are as lame as with our DP situation this year.

I hate that excuse. If you choose tie up 36% of your cap in three players (that happen to be older and injury prone), and they go down injured that is not a free pass to suck. That is a clear case of roster mismanagement.

[Oldtimer]

I disagree.

I don't think this club is ready to win a title this coming year (lol), so why buy him out of his last year?

Let him lead/teach the younger kids (including draft picks 1 and 3) and get your worth from there. If this contract was holding us back from adding a piece that would push us over the top into a contender, sure, buy him out, but now? I just don't see the value in it.


Also, perhaps this injury held him back last year and knowing that it may be his last season as a pro footballer, he may find a bit more in the tank to give. Judging his class, work rate and personality, I believe this to be what we'll get from him.

I agree. Let Frings play out his last year and mentor the younger players. Once he and Koevs' contracts expire, replace them with no one. Instead, build a balanced roster with only 1 DP (and make that DP a striker).

[ensco]

I disagree.

I don't think this club is ready to win a title this coming year (lol), so why buy him out of his last year?

Let him lead/teach the younger kids (including draft picks 1 and 3) and get your worth from there. If this contract was holding us back from adding a piece that would push us over the top into a contender, sure, buy him out, but now? I just don't see the value in it.


Also, perhaps this injury held him back last year and knowing that it may be his last season as a pro footballer, he may find a bit more in the tank to give. Judging his class, work rate and personality, I believe this to be what we'll get from him.

The mentoring thing will only work as long as his onfield performance supports that role.

I doubt that'll be the case.

[ryan]

The mentoring thing will only work as long as his onfield performance supports that role.

I doubt that'll be the case.

Fair enough but regardless of his performance, I don't think TFC as a seperate business unit within MLSE, can spare to eat 2M though. Basically eating your entire team salary cap? A bit crazy.

I don't agree that his on field performance is required to be able to mentor the kids though, he's oozing experience from the top of the footballing world and I would hope it's being absorbed in every occasion. Practice, road trips, big away crowds, dealing with all these things the players just aren't used to, but he's faced more times than I'm sure he remembers.

[brad]

Fair enough but regardless of his performance, I don't think TFC as a seperate business unit within MLSE, can spare to eat 2M though. Basically eating your entire team salary cap? A bit crazy.


It's not about the salary over and above the cap that MLSE have to pay, it's about the opportunity cost of the cap space tied up in Frings. For that cap space you could bring in a very good player or 2-3 regular MLS players.

[Oldtimer]

Rumour has it Hall's been released:

http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4020-Hall-released

[brad]

Rumour has it Hall's been released:

http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4020-Hall-released

Makes sense since we received another backup keeper from Portland.

[ManUtd4ever]

Frings = too slow
Dunfield = too untalented
Hall = Worst defender in the league
Stinson = A massively inexperienced kid

Right now we need two "two-way" midfielders to compete. Unless he anchors in front of the backline Frings' speed is going to be a real problem for us starting.


They won't do it, but Frings needs to be bought out. Same as JDG needed to be bought out last offseason. Get him off the cap and move on.

I believe Frings was kinda sorta angling for this (hence some of the odd things that happened around the time he got hurt, and afterwards) but Frings is a pro, and if we keep him, he'll do his best. But he's not even an average MLS midfielder.

Agreed on all points, but realistically, Frings' contract is far too lucrative to entertain the thought of a buyout, so for all intents and purposes, he will be be a starting DM for TFC next season when he's healthy.

With that in mind, I still believe he can contribute if he is utilized properly by minimizing his detrimental lack of speed. Ideally, I would like to see him deployed in front of the backline as jloome suggested, perhaps in a 4-1-3-2 formation.

[ManUtd4ever]

Rumour has it Hall's been released:

http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4020-Hall-released

Good.

[19Barrett19]

Picking up Ledgerwood would be really nice! Why? Because he is an upgrade over dunfield in the CDM position. Another reason it provides cover for Eks in RB this means we could get rid of the other Hall Jeremy. Ledgerwood can also play RM very versatile player the kind you want in MLS. I've looked him up and his contract expires On Dec 31 2012 which means TFC can get him on a free. Overall my main reason I would like to see him join the squad is to get the worst defender on the team outta town. Essentially Hall can play the same position as Ledgerwood but Nick is an upgrade over Hall and they would cost about the same 150k range no more.

[19Barrett19]

Rumour has it Hall's been released:http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4020-Hall-releasedAlleluia

[Ajax TFC]

Between Frings, Dunfield, Stinson and Jeremy Hall (if re-signed), DM position is covered? I think priority is signing a good box to box CM with good passing ability if Mariner is going to stick with 4-4-2
Hall is likely gone, and he plays wide midfield, not DM. Stinson looked pretty poor in preseason, and Mariner rated him behind Maund last season. He may develop into someone, but right now I don't consider him a solid option. Dunfield is just crap. There's no other way to put it. Mariner likes to play with two DMs. The only way you're going to get a box to box CM with good passing is if He's a hard tackling, hard working DM first off, and attacking and passing abilities are an added bonus. Those types of players are rare in MLS, and you need good scouts to find them. If Ledgerwood is cheap enough, as in less that 90k cap hit, we should take him. Otherwise, we should look for players who aren't currently under contract (duh)

People here really under value the importance of the midfield position, no backline in the world can stop an onslaught if your midfield cant control the tempo. Games are won and lost in the midfield.
Thank You!!! the CB fetish among many TFC fans is sickening. So many people think that all our problems would go away if we got a stud CB. They've been saying that since the beginning. We signed O'Dea at more than max hit, and when he can't stop the onslaught of goals (because there's no midfield cover), people talk about getting a stud CB to partner him! Honestly, I think we could sign Thiago Silva, and then when we keep conceding goals (because there's no midfield), people will call for another stud CB

[19Barrett19]

Hall is likely gone, and he plays wide midfield, not DM. Stinson looked pretty poor in preseason, and Mariner rated him behind Maund last season. He may develop into someone, but right now I don't consider him a solid option. Dunfield is just crap. There's no other way to put it. Mariner likes to play with two DMs. The only way you're going to get a box to box CM with good passing is if He's a hard tackling, hard working DM first off, and attacking and passing abilities are an added bonus. Those types of players are rare in MLS, and you need good scouts to find them. If Ledgerwood is cheap enough, as in less that 90k cap hit, we should take him. Otherwise, we should look for players who aren't currently under contract (duh)

Thank You!!! the CB fetish among many TFC fans is sickening. So many people think that all our problems would go away if we got a stud CB. They've been saying that since the beginning. We signed O'Dea at more than max hit, and when he can't stop the onslaught of goals (because there's no midfield cover), people talk about getting a stud CB to partner him! Honestly, I think we could sign Thiago Silva, and then when we keep conceding goals (because there's no midfield), people will call for another stud CB

Totally agree with you 100% you need the mid to cover and work with the def for our goals against to go down. What if Frings plays along side Darren and ledgerwood in the CDM that could look interesting. I strongly feel like Henry could do the job just get the right midfield in place.

[Auzzy]

The club twitter account needs a good smack in the side of the head. The list of TFC excuses is so vast and all encompassing we shall never win anything ever. It's like a no-returns clause written by the best group of corporate lawyers in the world.

TFC shalt win every game ever unless:
1. there are too many canadians on the roster
2. the turf prevents us from signing good players
3. Being in Canada prevents us from signing good players
4. the management team just needs more time to "get it right"
5. the greatest finisher in the modern era doesn't actually live up to his name
6. game is 90 minutes instead of 75, which for some reason leads to team to give up more goals in last 15 minutes
7. despite his insistence, the manager isn't actually very good at what he does
8. MLS blocks star defender signing, club settles for playing RB out of position
9. club folk hero can't get on plane due to wear & tear on body, hangs up boots
10. The injury-prone striker we traded for unexplainably gets injured again

If half them weren't close to actual excuses floated by the club it might be funny.

Very good points! Except that the list of actual excuses that we've heard is probably 2-3 times longer than that...

[ensco]

Keep Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million salary
Dump Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million buyout plus $350K for new player

The real problem isn't the money, it's the fact that Frings' picture is on every piece of TFC promotional material, and that it's the sort of move that makes waves - not sure Payne wants to shine the klieglight on himself quite so hot, quite so early.

But it would be a ballsy thing to do.

[jloome]

Agreed on all points, but realistically, Frings' contract is far too lucrative to entertain the thought of a buyout, so for all intents and purposes, he will be be a starting DM for TFC next season when he's healthy.

With that in mind, I still believe he can contribute if he is utilized properly by minimizing his detrimental lack of speed. Ideally, I would like to see him deployed in front of the backline as jloome suggested, perhaps in a 4-1-3-2 formation.

There are options. I wouldn't call him a bad midfielder by MLS standards, just slow. His vision and passing technique are exceptional; his stats looked worse last year than they should because he was the only midfielder trying anything. Someone pointed out that Dunfield had a higher passing percentage; I'd point out that Frings tried five times as many passes over 10 yards as Dunfield, and stats can be deceiving.

He has value. But he can't cover a lot of space, so we need him in a sit-back spot where he has time to read the play and adjust to cut off passing lanes. Can't do that with his limited wheels unless he's playing as a holder.

We can still play flat in the middle, but that would make us utterly dependent on wing play, because an advancing central midfielder with no support behind him causes problems.

[ryan]

It's not about the salary over and above the cap that MLSE have to pay, it's about the opportunity cost of the cap space tied up in Frings. For that cap space you could bring in a very good player or 2-3 regular MLS players.

Yeah but again, 2-3 regular MLS players (which aren't entirely easy to come by, clearly) aren't going to make us a champion in 2013. So why set $2,000,000 on fire? Just wait one bloody season and build the rest of the club (to then put us 2-3 players away and poof, we'll have the space without the buyout then).

I mean what opportunity? More minutes for Dunfield? With Mariner in charge, that's all you're getting. Stinson is there, but he's not ready for starter minutes and he's next in line after those 2.

If we had someone, like a Tiebert in Vancouver, a player who's got a ton of potential and is on the verge of cracking a starting XI, sure, okay I get it. But that's not Stinson and I'm as big of a Canadian player homer as anyone.

[ryan]

Keep Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million salary
Dump Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million buyout plus $350K for new player


You're ignoring what you get by having him for a season.

But I digress, you think he brings nothing of that ilk so whatever.

[jloome]

Keep Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million salary
Dump Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million buyout plus $350K for new player

The real problem isn't the money, it's the fact that Frings' picture is on every piece of TFC promotional material, and that it's the sort of move that makes waves - not sure Payne wants to shine the klieglight on himself quite so hot, quite so early.

But it would be a ballsy thing to do.

They should give him a dozen games; if the speed is really hurting the team, offer him a player-assistant coach job, give him a chance to keep the contract but earn (some of) the money back, and help him get his licenses for coaching, while using him for late-game spot duty to nail down games, when other players legs are tired and his speed isn't an issue.

They're gonna have to pay him anyway, and it puts him in a good spot to take over one of Werder Bremen's youth teams.

[Oldtimer]

Hall is likely gone, and he plays wide midfield, not DM. Stinson looked pretty poor in preseason, and Mariner rated him behind Maund last season. He may develop into someone, but right now I don't consider him a solid option. Dunfield is just crap. There's no other way to put it. Mariner likes to play with two DMs. The only way you're going to get a box to box CM with good passing is if He's a hard tackling, hard working DM first off, and attacking and passing abilities are an added bonus. Those types of players are rare in MLS, and you need good scouts to find them. If Ledgerwood is cheap enough, as in less that 90k cap hit, we should take him. Otherwise, we should look for players who aren't currently under contract (duh)

Thank You!!! the CB fetish among many TFC fans is sickening. So many people think that all our problems would go away if we got a stud CB. They've been saying that since the beginning. We signed O'Dea at more than max hit, and when he can't stop the onslaught of goals (because there's no midfield cover), people talk about getting a stud CB to partner him! Honestly, I think we could sign Thiago Silva, and then when we keep conceding goals (because there's no midfield), people will call for another stud CB


Totally agree with you 100% you need the mid to cover and work with the def for our goals against to go down. What if Frings plays along side Darren and ledgerwood in the CDM that could look interesting. I strongly feel like Henry could do the job just get the right midfield in place.

A strong midfield is less necessary with hoofball, that is why the focus is on a stud CB. However, in building for the long term we can assume that Mariner will be gone by the end of the season, and then we will need to have some talent in the mid.

[brad]

Keep Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million salary
Dump Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million buyout plus $350K for new player

The real problem isn't the money, it's the fact that Frings' picture is on every piece of TFC promotional material, and that it's the sort of move that makes waves - not sure Payne wants to shine the klieglight on himself quite so hot, quite so early.

But it would be a ballsy thing to do.

Not really IMHO. They buy him out, he announces that he is retiring and no one without inside information is the wiser...

[Ultra & Proud]

Not really IMHO. They buy him out, he announces that he is retiring and no one without inside information is the wiser...
This is what I think will happen.

[Ajax TFC]

A strong midfield is less necessary with hoofball, that is why the focus is on a stud CB. However, in building for the long term we can assume that Mariner will be gone by the end of the season, and then we will need to have some talent in the mid.
A strong midfield might not be necessary to hold possession and launch attacks, but it's still necessary to absorb the continuous onslaught of attacks that you will face when you constantly hand the ball back to the other team. two CBs can't deal with five opponents running at them from an open midfield completely unchallenged. Juninho's goal against us last year was a perfect example. The defenders were marking the strikers, and the midfielders were just standing on top of the box, and no one put any pressure on Juninho with the ball (Dunfield was in fact backing away from him, as he often does), so he took a shot at goal because there was no one even close enough to block it. Then everyone dismisses it as us being unlucky to have had a wonder goal scored on us, when in fact proper midfield play would have prevented it.

[brad]

Yeah but again, 2-3 regular MLS players (which aren't entirely easy to come by, clearly) aren't going to make us a champion in 2013. So why set $2,000,000 on fire? Just wait one bloody season and build the rest of the club (to then put us 2-3 players away and poof, we'll have the space without the buyout then).

Agree that finding a couple of players is not easy, and agree that those players, if found would not make us champions. That is not the question. The question is would we be a better team with these players or Frings? Frings will play less this year.

Why do it now? To start attempting to build a core of players under Payne's vision as soon as possible. Teams take time to gel. The sooner we get a core group of players playing together (assuming the right core), the closer we become to actually being a championship team.


I mean what opportunity? More minutes for Dunfield? With Mariner in charge, that's all you're getting. Stinson is there, but he's not ready for starter minutes and he's next in line after those 2.

Opportunity cost - "The loss of potential gain from other alternatives when one alternative is chosen".

Meaning, what do we lose by keeping Frings. Directly one DP slot and $335k of cap space. What could that be used for if it were to become available? Players could be brought in for that salary - players that could potentially mean we see less of Dunfield. It could mean another DP if they want to go that route - potentially a young one with a smaller cap hit. If they don't plan on going the 3 DP route anytime soon, trade the slot of allocation and further bolster the team. These are just examples, but there are plenty of permutations that could make us a better team.

The point is - what do we get out of a slow, injury prone Frings this year vs other options. Frings minutes will be managed this year. He will spend a lot more time on the bench in an attempt to not wear him down. Either this works and we get some use out of him, or they wear him down and he goes out injured again. Either way, you have a good chunk of your cap tied up in a player that is not being heavily utilized. You can't get away with that in this league.


If we had someone, like a Tiebert in Vancouver, a player who's got a ton of potential and is on the verge of cracking a starting XI, sure, okay I get it. But that's not Stinson and I'm as big of a Canadian player homer as anyone.

Again - it's not about the players we have, it's about what we could possibly get.

[zamperina]

Per Kurtis Larson of the Sun. (See TFC Notes below for some interesting news)

The chances of Toronto FC selecting in Stage 2 of Major League Soccer’s re-entry draft Friday afternoon are “good,” according to Earl Cochrane, TFC’s director of team and player operations.
“There are some talented players remaining,” Cochrane told the Sun. “As long as they stay remaining … the chances are pretty good that we will do something on Friday.”
To clarify, the Reds will likely exercise the first pick in Friday’s re-entry draft unless they were planning to select one of Justin Mapp or Ike Opara.
Mapp, a midfielder with the Montreal Impact, was re-upped Wednesday by the Quebec outfit while Sporting KC received Opara in a trade with San Jose.
Assuming TFC wasn’t targeting one of the above names, a few players stick out as potential selections in Friday’s draft due to the club’s current needs and cap concerns.


DF Julius James, $100,000 in 2012 with Columbus
DF Hunter Freeman, $110,000 in 2012 with Colorado
MF Jamie Smith, $159,000 in 2012 with Colorado
DF Tyson Wahl, $86,000 in 2012 with Montreal
MF Colin Clark, $110,000 in 2012 with Houston
F Paulo Jr., $75,000 in 2012 with Salt Lake
MF Luke Sassano, $83,000 in 2012 with KC
MF John Thorrington, $170,000 in 2012 with Vancouver

Former TFC attacker Maicon Santos was the only player taken during last week’s opening stage of the MLS re-entry draft. The Brazilian was selected by the Chicago Fire in Stage 1, a stage that requires clubs to pick up player contracts without negotiation.
Stage 2 permits clubs to select out-of-contract players and renegotiate deals ahead of next season.
TFC NOTES
Cochrane told the Sun he’d be “surprised” if Eric Avila was with Toronto in 2013. The club and Avila simply can’t come to terms on a new deal … Freddy Hall is no longer with Toronto. The club’s No. 2 ‘keeper for much of 2012 recently had his option declined … The Reds are still negotiating potential deals with Andrew Wiedeman and Jeremy Hall, both of who are available in Friday’s re-entry draft unless Toronto agrees to terms with a pair of players who are heading into options years. Prevalent thought is that Toronto could still sign the pair if they agree to take a significant salary cut in 2013.

[gdg_9]

Picking up Ledgerwood would be really nice! Why? Because he is an upgrade over dunfield in the CDM position. Another reason it provides cover for Eks in RB this means we could get rid of the other Hall Jeremy. Ledgerwood can also play RM very versatile player the kind you want in MLS. I've looked him up and his contract expires On Dec 31 2012 which means TFC can get him on a free. Overall my main reason I would like to see him join the squad is to get the worst defender on the team outta town. Essentially Hall can play the same position as Ledgerwood but Nick is an upgrade over Hall and they would cost about the same 150k range no more.


I'm pretty sure his contract runs until Dec 2013. (http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/nikolas-ledgerwood/profil/spieler_8283.html)

The reason he's rumoured to be available is that his club failed to get promoted this season, and he wants to move on to a better league than Sweden's 2nd division.

His club is, apparently, asking a $300k transfer fee, which TFC supposedly scoffed at (rightfully so).

If TFC can get him on a cheap ($0 - $100k) transfer, then I wouldn't be against it.
But there are much better players to spend allocation $ on.

[Ajax TFC]

DF Julius James, $100,000 in 2012 with Columbus

We should pick him, and then trade him for DeRo!g:D




Cochrane told the Sun he’d be “surprised” if Eric Avila was with Toronto in 2013. The club and Avila simply can’t come to terms on a new deal … Freddy Hall is no longer with Toronto.
FFS just sign him at his 2012 salary! He's worth it.


The Reds are still negotiating potential deals with Andrew Wiedeman and Jeremy Hall

WHHAATTT??!!?? WHY??? Weideman is a pylon. Hall isn't horrible when played in a more advanced role, but I'm sure they see him as a RB. The thing that worries me is that when they go unselected in the draft, they'll sign the contracts we're offering them and we'll be stuck with them for an other season

[KGH]

Accoring to Ives as part of the Deal yeasterday we swapped allocation spots with the timbers....

http://www.soccerbyives.net/2012/12/breaking-timbers-lining-up-move-for-diskerud.html

[Ajax TFC]

that would give us the second spot right?

[ensco]

So why set $2,000,000 on fire?

The money is already gone.

When you go to a movie, having paid 15 bucks, and 20 minutes in, you decide the movie is crap, what's the move? Leave, or stay and waste two hours?

Most people get this wrong.

You have to really believe Frings is still a good player to want to keep him. Not an OK player. Not "let's give it a few games" because the cap space isn't freed if you do that.

You are paying him either way.

[Phil]

Accoring to Ives as part of the Deal yeasterday we swapped allocation spots with the timbers....

http://www.soccerbyives.net/2012/12/breaking-timbers-lining-up-move-for-diskerud.html

wow, that changes things a bit...

[ag futbol]

Keep Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million salary
Dump Frings: costs MLSE $2.5 million buyout plus $350K for new player

The real problem isn't the money, it's the fact that Frings' picture is on every piece of TFC promotional material, and that it's the sort of move that makes waves - not sure Payne wants to shine the klieglight on himself quite so hot, quite so early.

But it would be a ballsy thing to do.
I was just about to write the same thing. The issue with dumping Frings isn't the money, it's the perception.

[Mr. Bigby]

wow, that changes things a bit...

Actually, according to the update, Toronto keeps the #1 spot, but agrees not to select Diskerud. Seems like a gentlemanly agreement to me, unless you were Jonesing over Diskerud.

[ensco]

wow, that changes things a bit...

Diskerud sounds like exactly the kind of player we should be desperate to acquire. If he wouldn't come here, that's not good.

[KGH]

Diskerud sounds like exactly the kind of player we should be desperate to acquire. If he wouldn't come here, that's not good.

Sounds like he's following a coach. Not much we can do with that other than over pay

[brad]

If we pass over him - do we keep our allocation spot for the next potential player?

[KGH]

If we pass over him - do we keep our allocation spot for the next potential player?

Yes we do

[ensco]

Sounds like he's following a coach. Not much we can do with that other than over pay

True. Just getting super tired of this story line happening over and over again.

[Soccerpro]

True. Just getting super tired of this story line happening over and over again.

Why would a player want to come back to MLS and join TFC given its recent history?

If TFC were to get its house in order, they might be able to attract someone.

[Oldtimer]

The money is already gone.

When you go to a movie, having paid 15 bucks, and 20 minutes in, you decide the movie is crap, what's the move? Leave, or stay and waste two hours?

Most people get this wrong.

You have to really believe Frings is still a good player to want to keep him. Not an OK player. Not "let's give it a few games" because the cap space isn't freed if you do that.

You are paying him either way.

It depends. If it's a double feature and the second movie is good, it's worth waiting through the crap. Happened to me once, and the second movie made waiting through the first horrible one worthwhile. :)

For a player, if Frings' play picks up after his surgery, many people here will be singing another tune.
Of course, I'm biased. :D

[ag futbol]

Why would a player want to come back to MLS and join TFC given its recent history?

If TFC were to get its house in order, they might be able to attract someone.
Yeah, I think that's still an issue. It's one thing to be bad, a la Chivas, but it's another to be bad and in a state of constant flux. Puts players in a position of signing with a poor team, not getting anywhere, and then being subject to a new coach that isn't vested in them as a player.

But I think this will eventually work its way out providing Payne provides us with some stability.

[ensco]

I'm depressed. I've been reading a profile on Diskerud in ESPN Insider (can't provide a link, it's behind a paywall). Guys like this (22 years old, off a breakthrough season at Rosenborg) have NEVER come into MLS before.

We cannot make the allocation system work for us. We were fourth last year and the slot died on the vine. Bocanegra chose La Liga 2 over TFC.

This is going to take a long time. Payne is no miracle worker.

[Detroit_TFC]

I'm depressed. I've been reading a profile on Diskerud in ESPN Insider (can't provide a link, it's behind a paywall). Guys like this (22 years old, off a breakthrough season at Rosenborg) have NEVER come into MLS before.

We cannot make the allocation system work for us. We were fourth last year and the slot died on the vine. Bocanegra chose La Liga 2 over TFC.

This is going to take a long time. Payne is no miracle worker.

Way more about Porter than TFC. If it was Chicago or SKC in the top spot he would have passed them over too.

Well, probably. He knows Porter and he'll know what he's getting into there. I don't think he was looking just to come into MLS. Could have easily got a slot somewhere in Europe but starting minutes might have been a question. Klinsmann is getting more picky about US players getting minutes to get call ups and playing for Porter at Portland likely was his best bet to ensure that.

[Yohan]

Way more about Porter than TFC. If it was Chicago or SKC in the top spot he would have passed them over too.

Well, probably. He knows Porter and he'll know what he's getting into there. I don't think he was looking just to come into MLS. Could have easily got a slot somewhere in Europe but starting minutes might have been a question. Klinsmann is getting more picky about US players getting minutes to get call ups and playing for Porter at Portland likely was his best bet to ensure that.
another sign of league's growth when a young up and comer choose MLS over mid level European league

[ensco]

Way more about Porter than TFC. If it was Chicago or SKC in the top spot he would have passed them over too.

Well, probably. He knows Porter and he'll know what he's getting into there.

Maybe. Who knows.

Mostly guys do not refuse to sign with the team that has the allocation slot. Except us I guess.

The signalling is terrible. You can see here that the FO is trying to quash this - they just want to say they passed on the guy. Who would want a 23 year old USMNT player in a position we desperately need to fill anyway?

http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4022-TFC-denies-report-it-had-traded-No-1-allocation-selection

[moralis]

Andrew Wiedeman and Jeremy Hall are off the MLS Re-entry draft list:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

http://blogs.canoe.ca/reds/sports/toronto-fc-likely-to-select-in-fridays-re-entry-draft-cochrane/

Looks like they are renegotiating with TFC management. A deal could be happening, but for a major salary cut.

I would not keep either of them.

[gracos]

Jeremy Hall and Andrew Wiedeman might be returning to TFC next season
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

[brad]

I'm depressed. I've been reading a profile on Diskerud in ESPN Insider (can't provide a link, it's behind a paywall). Guys like this (22 years old, off a breakthrough season at Rosenborg) have NEVER come into MLS before.

We cannot make the allocation system work for us. We were fourth last year and the slot died on the vine. Bocanegra chose La Liga 2 over TFC.

This is going to take a long time. Payne is no miracle worker.

I wouldn't blame any player for not wanting to come here. We need to undo the damage that has been done to our reputation (of being snakes). Hopefully Payne is a start on that. We need to stop the revolving door of players and managers. We need to stop changing our focus on style of play. We need to start winning, we need to start playing competent football. We need the stands full again and we need an atmosphere that players will want to play in again.

So yes, I agree - it's going to take a long time.

Once that is all fixed, then players returning might want to play for us. I think there will always be US players that want to go home and play in the US, not Canada, and there is nothing we can do about that though.

[Richard]

Jeremy Hall and Andrew Wiedeman might be returning to TFC next season
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

:facepalm:


I would rather have an academy player for minimum wage than these two useless clowns.

[DoubleUp]

Jeremy Hall and Andrew Wiedeman might be returning to TFC next season
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

Could we not bring in Kyle Porter Instead???

[ag futbol]

:facepalm:


I would rather have an academy player for minimum wage than these two useless clowns.
To add to that, is there really any way someone like Wiedeman is that different from someone like Josh Janniere? -who is currently trialing with Sutherland, probably at the recommendation of Dichio who hooked him up with Colorado after we took a pass.

At the very least, we build some goodwill with our local players by keeping them in the fold.

[Richard]

To add to that, is there really any way someone like Wiedeman is that different from someone like Josh Janniere? -who is currently trialing with Sutherland, probably at the recommendation of Dichio who hooked him up with Colorado after we took a pass.

At the very least, we build some goodwill with our local players by keeping them in the fold.

I agree that we should be building goodwill.

We never even gave Stefan Vukovic a shot, I know he was later release by Montreal but we could have atleast given a homegrown player chance. Im not going to pass judgment of Payne because its to soon, it may be Mariners idea as well. Last year when we had nothing to play for Stinson wasnt even given a run of games, atleast give the guy a shot.

[KGH]

I agree that we should be building goodwill.

We never even gave Stefan Vukovic a shot, I know he was later release by Montreal but we could have atleast given a homegrown player chance. Im not going to pass judgment of Payne because its to soon, it may be Mariners idea as well. Last year when we had nothing to play for Stinson wasnt even given a run of games, atleast give the guy a shot.

Stinson was out for a significant period of last year with an injury including most of the last 2-3 months (quad I think). Why do people keep forgetting that?

[Jpexxx]

I agree that we should be building goodwill.

We never even gave Stefan Vukovic a shot, I know he was later release by Montreal but we could have atleast given a homegrown player chance. Im not going to pass judgment of Payne because its to soon, it may be Mariners idea as well. Last year when we had nothing to play for Stinson wasnt even given a run of games, atleast give the guy a shot.


Rongen said at the year end that none of the Academy kids were ready yet for going pro. Personally I would much prefer a much cheaper Weideman and Hall to come off the bench (i am definitely not going to argue they deserve many minutes).|

If nobody is ready for the jump yet, I would rather keep them down there so we don't re-live the Cordon-esque story lines.

[ryan]

I'm depressed. I've been reading a profile on Diskerud in ESPN Insider (can't provide a link, it's behind a paywall). Guys like this (22 years old, off a breakthrough season at Rosenborg) have NEVER come into MLS before.

We cannot make the allocation system work for us. We were fourth last year and the slot died on the vine. Bocanegra chose La Liga 2 over TFC.

This is going to take a long time. Payne is no miracle worker.

Americans just don't want to play sports in Canada, period.


I interact with many on a daily basis, their perception of the country is literally straight out of TV. The way South Park depicts Canada is a legitimate comparison to what many Americans literally think of Canada.


You have to have a legendary franchise (Toronto Maple Leafs) or a boat load of cash (Toronto Blue Jays), or else you aren't getting decent American talent up here outside of the small percentage who don't fall into what I said above.

[gracos]

Jeremy Hall and Andrew Wiedeman might be returning to TFC next season
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

I just thought about it, but maybe none of our academy kids are ready to be brought up, and we only get 6 discovery claims, so they still maybe on our team but not for long, if they dont improve next year

[Soccerpro]

Jeremy Hall and Andrew Wiedeman might be returning to TFC next season
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/13/mls-unveils-player-list-fridays-re-entry-draft-stage-2

Just when you think TFC management aren't complete clowns, it looks like they're going to resign these two.
FC Dallas fans were literally laughing on Big Soccer forum when they heard TFC acquired Jeremy Hall and his 100k plus salary.

Our forward line this year so far is shaping up to be:
Old broken down Danny K and Eric Hassli, Justin Braun (who was let go by 2 different teams this past season for nothing), Wiedeman who everyone agrees isnt MLS level, Quincy Amarikwa who was waived by Colorado and then claimed by NY and sent to Toronto for a bag of balls.

How does that inspire confidence?

Nevermind that our midfield is the same as last year, a complete mess.

[Yohan]

Just when you think TFC management aren't complete clowns, it looks like they're going to resign these two.
FC Dallas fans were literally laughing on Big Soccer forum when they heard TFC acquired Jeremy Hall and his 100k plus salary.

Our forward line this year so far is shaping up to be:
Old broken down Danny K and Eric Hassli, Justin Braun (who was let go by 2 different teams this past season for nothing), Wiedeman who everyone agrees isnt MLS level, Quincy Amarikwa who was waived by Colorado and then claimed by NY and sent to Toronto for a bag of balls.

How does that inspire confidence?

Nevermind that our midfield is the same as last year, a complete mess.
I'd save the doom and gloom talk until pre-season... still a lot of time for TFC to work some deals and such

[Auzzy]

From Twitter, 1 hour ago:


Andrew Wiedeman ‏@awiedeman3
(https://twitter.com/awiedeman3)Stoked to be heading back to Toronto for another season!

I'm not stoked personally, but if the salary is decent for a backup guy, I'm not going to lose my shit either. We shall see I guess.

[Benficachop20]

From Twitter, 1 hour ago:



I'm not stoked personally, but if the salary is decent for a backup guy, I'm not going to lose my shit either. We shall see I guess.


http://assets0.ordienetworks.com/images/GifGuide/michael_scott/The-Office-gifs-the-office-14948948-240-196.gif

[Morlesio14]

Wiedeman can play backup LM or RM. Why did Payne do this?

[T-boy]

Wiedemann isn't the shittest player we have ever seen at BMO by any means. So, as long as he isn't first choice or in the first 11 every week, then I'm ok with him being at the club. He's a decent backup, and he can play various positions.

I think a few of us are judging the players last season based on the fact that they ended up being "first choice" players given the injuries we had. But if Koev's and Frings were fit, there would have been no way players like Wiedemann would have played every week. I think I would have been ok with Wiedemann coming on as an 80 minute sub to see out games. And at the right plice, I would be ok if he took that roll next season. But, as I say, as long as he's not first choice, and at the right price ONLY.

[jloome]

I'm depressed. I've been reading a profile on Diskerud in ESPN Insider (can't provide a link, it's behind a paywall). Guys like this (22 years old, off a breakthrough season at Rosenborg) have NEVER come into MLS before.

We cannot make the allocation system work for us. We were fourth last year and the slot died on the vine. Bocanegra chose La Liga 2 over TFC.

This is going to take a long time. Payne is no miracle worker.

Most paywalls are easily defeated by turning on "private browsing" on your web browser; Firefox is particularly good for it. If you turn off all histories and cookies, you also avoid the secret "perma-cookies" that Google and others have started storing on people's computers, which stay resident even if you clear your cache.

[jloome]

I actually like Wiedeman. I think he took a lot of grief for being Mariner's boy, but he played OK. He doesn't look like a starter, but he's young, good depth. He can dribble, create on the ball, shoots OK.

[jloome]

Americans just don't want to play sports in Canada, period.


I interact with many on a daily basis, their perception of the country is literally straight out of TV. The way South Park depicts Canada is a legitimate comparison to what many Americans literally think of Canada.


You have to have a legendary franchise (Toronto Maple Leafs) or a boat load of cash (Toronto Blue Jays), or else you aren't getting decent American talent up here outside of the small percentage who don't fall into what I said above.

It's football. Anelka is in China; Grafite is in Dubai or some place. They'll go ANYWHERE if the Benjamins are significant enough.

[Yohan]

I actually like Wiedeman. I think he took a lot of grief for being Mariner's boy, but he played OK. He doesn't look like a starter, but he's young, good depth. He can dribble, create on the ball, shoots OK.

I agree. He's got poacher's instinct that I can see made him a success in NCAA. I don't know what happened to him in Dallas (partially having to play in 4-5-1 system under Hyndman not suited to his skills), but for depth striker, Wiedeman is not bad.

[SweetOwnGoal]

I approached them, so I don't think they are trying to quash anything.

Bocanegra didn't turn TFC down. He was in active talks but they couldn't make the money work. I was talking to Ives yesterday and he reiterated that to me.

Duane Rollins




Maybe. Who knows.

Mostly guys do not refuse to sign with the team that has the allocation slot. Except us I guess.

The signalling is terrible. You can see here that the FO is trying to quash this - they just want to say they passed on the guy. Who would want a 23 year old USMNT player in a position we desperately need to fill anyway?

http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?4022-TFC-denies-report-it-had-traded-No-1-allocation-selection

[ManUtd4ever]

I actually like Wiedeman. I think he took a lot of grief for being Mariner's boy, but he played OK. He doesn't look like a starter, but he's young, good depth. He can dribble, create on the ball, shoots OK.

Agreed. He gets a lot of flack around here because of Mariner's infamous "one of the best finishers of the modern era" quote.

[T-boy]

Agreed. He gets a lot of flack around here because of Mariner's infamous "one of the best finishers of the modern era" quote.

I would agree with that. I think if Mariner had said that Wiedemann was "a decent depth player" then we wouldn't even care that he is being resigned. But the fact that Mariner said something stupid has stuck to the player like shit, and now we just smell the shit instead of look at the player!

[ryan]

It's football. Anelka is in China; Grafite is in Dubai or some place. They'll go ANYWHERE if the Benjamins are significant enough.

Of course, but again, it doesn't deny there's cultural negativity towards Canada with Americans.

[ensco]

I approached them, so I don't think they are trying to quash anything.

Bocanegra didn't turn TFC down. He was in active talks but they couldn't make the money work. I was talking to Ives yesterday and he reiterated that to me.

Duane Rollins

Thanks for posting that here.

Re Bocanegra, OK.

Re Portland trade, we haven't got enough to be able to have an opinion. If they pass on Diskerud, I'm hopeful you and others will press them as to exactly why we didn't just take one of the best prospects to come into the league via allocation ever

[Ultra & Proud]

TRe Portland trade, we haven't got enough to be able to have an opinion. If they pass on Diskerud, I'm hopeful you and others will press them as to exactly why we didn't just take one of the best prospects to come into the league via allocation ever

Because we wouldn't have pulled off the Portland trade with the 3rd overall pick and allocation otherwise. Again I say, people on here highly value first round picks, moreso than DPs, so then doing a handshake agreement to pass on a player who may or may not pan out seems like a logical move for that 3rd overall pick, a solid back up GK, and the allocation, along with RJ and Kocic going the other way of course.

[ag futbol]

Who is ready to get excited??


Enrique Lanza (http://twitter.com/kikelanza10)

@kikelanza10 (http://twitter.com/kikelanza10)


l Ya hubo platicas de Amado Guevara con el Toronto FC. Aun mas tambien tiene una oferta del Cosmo de NY en la Segunda Division de los EEUU.

He's old these days, but I doubt those spot kicks have changed much and if Blanco could do it at 38, I think he has a similar quality.

[Yohan]

Guevara will be 37 next season. Don't need no old geezers for part time player. no thanks

[flamehawk]

We have selected Danny Calliff. Decent but I wonder how much he makes?

[Ageroo]

We have selected Danny Calliff. Decent but I wonder how much he makes?

Second stage so we will negotiate now...

[Yohan]

We have selected Danny Calliff. Decent but I wonder how much he makes?

made 275k this season. but let's see if TFC can negotiate him down to about 175k

[Auzzy]

made 275k this season. but let's see if TFC can negotiate him down to about 175k

Ha. With Marquez gone, maybe TFC can make their backline twice as expensive as all other teams in MLS. Morgan still too inexpensive though. We need some over-paid LB to replace him. ;)

[Auzzy]

Official, J. Hall & Wiedeman both re-signed. http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/12/hall-wiedeman-return-2013

[jloome]

Of course, but again, it doesn't deny there's cultural negativity towards Canada with Americans.

There's a cultural negativity between everyone, everywhere. It's part of our subconscious survival instinct. People in Canada think Americans hate them; people in America think everyone hates them. To a degree, everything is true in society.

On the most, the majority of people in the majority of countries are too worried about their own backyard to give much of a shit about anyone else's. I've lived around the world; xenophobics are always a minority, but always the loudest people. In a place like the U.S., where repetition and the transmission of informational detritus serve as a greater distraction for a variety of reasons, they're just a little louder, that's all.

[tfcmanu]

Steven Goff ‏@SoccerInsider Toronto FC had reached a new contract agreement with Danny Califf before #mls (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/search?q=%23mls&src=hash) re-entry draft even took place, I'm told

[ArmenJBX]

Amado Guevara rumoured to be returning to Toronto FC

Saw this little tidbit in the news and on the Twittersphere today.


"Inicio en enero si Dios quiere , porque es otra etapa y me tengo que preparar bien. Todo lo vamos a manejar en su debido tiempo. La idea es aprovechar con los entrenadores de la MLS como el profesor Bruce Arenas o con el equipo Toronto o con New York", afirmó.

I threw it in google translate for those who don't know Spanish.


"Starting in January, God willing, because it is another step and I have to prepare well. Whatever we manage it in due time. The idea is to take advantage of the MLS coaches like Professor Bruce Arenas or Toronto or equipment with New York, "he said.

He's saying he wants to prepare for a return to MLS in January and possibly sign for Toronto FC, the Galaxy or The New York Cosmos, not the Red Bulls.

Here's the source: http://diez.hn/Ediciones/2012/12/12/Noticias/Amado-Guevara-inicia-en-enero-estudios-de-entrenador#.UMuVdqWfM_t

[ryan]

There's a cultural negativity between everyone, everywhere. It's part of our subconscious survival instinct. People in Canada think Americans hate them; people in America think everyone hates them. To a degree, everything is true in society.

On the most, the majority of people in the majority of countries are too worried about their own backyard to give much of a shit about anyone else's. I've lived around the world; xenophobics are always a minority, but always the loudest people. In a place like the U.S., where repetition and the transmission of informational detritus serve as a greater distraction for a variety of reasons, they're just a little louder, that's all.

I work for an American business, with Americans.
MLB American athletes only ever come to Toronto when big money is involved.
NBA American athletes avoid Toronto like the fucking plague.

I think? No. I simply see and comment on what I see.

When an American athlete thinks about playing in Canada, I would be sure that for many of them, the first thought is "inferior"


Agree to disagree I guess.

[ryan]

Steven Goff ‏@SoccerInsider Toronto FC had reached a new contract agreement with Danny Califf before #mls (http://www.redpatchboys.ca/search?q=%23mls&src=hash) re-entry draft even took place, I'm told

Quite surprised, I assume the comments about him wanting to avoid Toronto may have been exaggerated if he was willing to work it out before hand.

[ensco]

Califf, wow. Remember this?

http://blogs.canoe.ca/reds/sports/reds-draft-califf-who-just-a-few-months-ago-said-some-harsh-things/

[Yohan]

I work for an American business, with Americans.
MLB American athletes only ever come to Toronto when big money is involved.
NBA American athletes avoid Toronto like the fucking plague.

I think? No. I simply see and comment on what I see.

When an American athlete thinks about playing in Canada, I would be sure that for many of them, the first thought is "inferior"


Agree to disagree I guess.
word of mouth is the best persuader. some Americans have good experience with Canada. some don't. for TFC, there are guys like Jacob Peterson who didn't like Toronto (though more to do with TFC FO than anything else). but a lot of MLS players are friends or teammates with guys who have played in Canada.

[gdg_9]

Califf, wow. Remember this?

http://blogs.canoe.ca/reds/sports/reds-draft-califf-who-just-a-few-months-ago-said-some-harsh-things/


Supposedly he's already agreed to a deal with TFC and is telling people he "Can't wait to come North"

- as per Neil Davidson of CP

[Morlesio14]

I actually don't mind seeing Hall and Wiedeman come back. Yes they both suck. But for an extremely cheap salary for both I wouldn't mind having Hall playing backup RB and wiedeman playing backup LM or RM.

[notthesun]

Wiedeman has value as a depth striker, but he's useless in midfield. Just useless. Speaks to Mariner's tactical ignorance and just general incompetence that he'd sign a player he thinks is "one of the best finishers in the modern era" and then stick him at right midfield.

He scored two goals for us, both simple enough inside the box (one toe poke/deflection, one side foot on a 1-on-1). Bring him in off the bench when we need a goal and bodies in the box and he could be useful.

As for Hall, only reason we re-signed him must be because he's versatile. If he couldn't play either side of defense or midfield he'd be gone because he can't defend 1-on-1 worth a damn.

[PopePouri]

Most likely Payne's influence brought Califf here. If he made the comment earlier, I'm going to assume that was because of who was in charge and not with regard to the city.

[tfcmanu]

As for Danny Califf I bet Kevin Payne had alot of influence remember Kevin Payne is involved with Soccer America and Califf has played for the US National team.

[tfcmanu]

You took the words out of my mouth You are bang on for sure...
Most likely Payne's influence brought Califf here. If he made the comment earlier, I'm going to assume that was because of who was in charge and not with regard to the city.

[Yohan]

I dunno. I think Califf's on decline since his Philly days. He's lost a lot of step and now tries to be overly aggressive to make up for it. I'd be happy with Califf as 3rd CB but not a starter

[brandrews]

califf officially signed as per tfc website now.

[gdg_9]

It's official as per team's twitter... Califf has signed.

[ManUtd4ever]

Califf will add leadership and sandpaper to our backline. Solid signing if the contract is reasonable.

On another note, I'm loving the Guevara rumors. Granted, he's a bit longer in the tooth now, but he would still add some much needed attacking flair and creativity to our midfield.

[Benficachop20]

oh god people are actually ok with wiedeman? I don't care about Mariner's quote, just look at how he plays. The guy was a give away machine, and had no tactical awareness. We can't rely on players like him in the starting 11 or coming off the bench. I swear we are so used to seeing crap we just accept anybody no matter how bad. If u want to move up the standings resigning poor players like Hall and Wiedeman isn't a good start and i also gotta say, was never a fan of Califf.

[Gazza]

I have no problem with what Califf said about Toronto. If you had a choice to go anywhere in the mls during the season last year, wouldn't Toronto be at the bottom of your list too? We really, really sucked.

With a clean slate, this might now be his best option to keep his career on the right track. He can be a solid contributor to a team that has no where to go but up. With a rabid and starved fan base. Hopefully he fits in well.

[Ultra & Proud]

If u want to move up the standings resigning poor players like Hall and Wiedeman isn't a good start
What exactly do you expect to get for 40 some odd thousand bucks? Salary cap means saving cash where you can and spending low on young players in spots 18 and down is how it's done in MLS. Take a boo at the players on other teams rosters in those spots. Yeah, that's what you get. Also need I say that it's mid-December and we haven't even gotten into signings yet? It's not like these cut & resigned players were signed for less money to be the stars of the team. Keep your shirt on and start the complaining come February if we haven't got any better.

[Ultra & Proud]

With a clean slate, this might now be his best option to keep his career on the right track. He can be a solid contributor to a team that has no where to go but up. With a rabid and starved fan base. Hopefully he fits in well.
He is exactly the kind of player this town usually loves. Also nice to have a more experienced voice on the backline too and from what I recall he has a pretty big mouth out there too.

[Benficachop20]

What exactly do you expect to get for 40 some odd thousand bucks? Salary cap means saving cash where you can and spending low on young players in spots 18 and down is how it's done in MLS. Take a boo at the players on other teams rosters in those spots. Yeah, that's what you get. Also need I say that it's mid-December and we haven't even gotten into signings yet? It's not like these cut & resigned players were signed for less money to be the stars of the team. Keep your shirt on and start the complaining come February if we haven't got any better.

i would agree if they were actually getting paid the league minimum but they aren't. what we did was resign 2 very poor players that i dont even consider good enough for the usl making over 100 thousand (not sure if wiedemans gen contract is up) to sit on the bench, but then again Mariner will probably start them. ur telling me we can't get better players on that salary? take ur own advice and look at the roster of other teams and see how many better players there are in this league making the same or less than hall or Wiedeman. If we continue to rely on these type of of players coming off the bench or even start for next season than yes i'm gonna complain because it leads me to believe we will have the same season as the previous 6.

[Yohan]

i would agree if they were actually getting paid the league minimum but they aren't. what we did was resign 2 very poor players that i dont even consider good enough for the usl making over 100 thousand (not sure if wiedemans gen contract is up) to sit on the bench, but then again Mariner will probably start them. ur telling me we can't get better players on that salary? take ur own advice and look at the roster of other teams and see how many better players there are in this league making the same or less than hall or Wiedeman. If we continue to rely on these type of of players coming off the bench or even start for next season than yes i'm gonna complain because it leads me to believe we will have the same season as the previous 6.
1. we don't know what the new contract number is for Wiedeman and Hall is yet. they only had a big number on their contract because of their Generation Adidas status which was negotiated by MLS, not TFC

2. can't simply blow up the squad and expect team chemistry again. you need depth players and you need utility players that can play multiple positions in MLS. Hall and Wiedeman fits those categories. if they are signed to a 1 yr, plus team option contracts, I don't have problem with them re-signed. If they don't produce in 2013, they get the cut, and new players brought in.

[Ultra & Proud]

i would agree if they were actually getting paid the league minimum but they aren't. what we did was resign 2 very poor players that i dont even consider good enough for the usl making over 100 thousand (not sure if wiedemans gen contract is up) to sit on the bench, but then again Mariner will probably start them. ur telling me we can't get better players on that salary? take ur own advice and look at the roster of other teams and see how many better players there are in this league making the same or less than hall or Wiedeman. If we continue to rely on these type of of players coming off the bench or even start for next season than yes i'm gonna complain because it leads me to believe we will have the same season as the previous 6.
I agree with what Yohan said above but also both players took pay cuts to stay. They will both be closer to league minimum pay than $100k. And when I said look at other rosters I didn't mean to look at players are better at the old salaries of these players. I said to look at the players that fill MLS squads rosters from spot 16 and down. The pure bench players and reserves. Both of these players are decent in comparison to other teams reserves and both can play multiple positions. They are also both young enough that they may be able to improve also.

[Yohan]

https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves/status/279998712288268288

According to Ives, Guevara to be scouting Central America for TFC

[Oldtimer]

https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves/status/279998712288268288

According to Ives, Guevara to be scouting Central America for TFC

If true, that is a fantastic idea! Payne would be showing a smart move here... getting away from player agents to real scouts. This is what Payne did for DC United, they were the only MLS club that had two full-time scouts in Argentina back when there were few scouts in MLS.

[Yohan]

as much as I despise Honduran national team, that country produces some good footballers. and Guevara having so much respect in Honduran football, he should be able to find some good players and encourage them to sign for TFC. I'd be happy if TFC finds someone like Boniek Garcia from Honduras

[DichioTFC]

The roster is shaping up well.

--------------------Frei------------------
----Ecks-----O'Dea----Califf----Morgan---
------------------Frings-----------------
----Lambe--------Silva---------Plata-----
------------Hassli--------Koev-----------

Subs: Bendik, Henry, J. Hall, Dunfield, _______, Braun, Wiedeman
Reserves: Q. Roberts, Emory, Stinson, Amarikwa


A bit disappointed that our solution for starting CB is Danny Califf, he's more of a rotation option but he's definitely an upgrade. If we're going to run with a 4-1-3-2 formation (which I personally like) I would hope we can upgrade Lambe and increase our depth at CM (as Mariner put it, a box-to-box midfielder).

[DoubleUp]

The roster is shaping up well.

--------------------Frei------------------
----Ecks-----O'Dea----Califf----Morgan---
------------------Frings-----------------
----Lambe--------Silva---------Plata-----
------------Hassli--------Koev-----------

Subs: Bendik, Henry, J. Hall, Dunfield, _______, Braun, Wiedeman
Reserves: Q. Roberts, Emory, Stinson, Amarikwa


A bit disappointed that our solution for starting CB is Danny Califf, he's more of a rotation option but he's definitely an upgrade. If we're going to run with a 4-1-3-2 formation (which I personally like) I would hope we can upgrade Lambe and increase our depth at CM (as Mariner put it, a box-to-box midfielder).



This set up would get torched! frings can`t hold the midfield by himself. In this set up he is the only tackler, at his age thats suicide .


In this type of set up he needs to be flanked by(like you mentioned) Box to box midfielders not wingers. Who we get to play LM and RM will be the most crucial signings this season imo.

[SKB]

This set up would get torched! frings can`t hold the midfield by himself. In this set up he is the only tackler, at his age thats suicide .


In this type of set up he needs to be flanked by(like you mentioned) Box to box midfielders not wingers. Who we get to play LM and RM will be the most crucial signings this season imo.

I agree,

Frings has definitely lost a stop and is not quick enough. That's why he is "diving in" to tackle. His skill is really passing and distribution into the box.

Lambe, Plata and are both very weak defensively. We need a big upgrade at both outside mid positions. Otherwise it will not matter who we are using in the back four because they will be under constant pressure and facing odd man attacks.

[DichioTFC]

I agree there's still changes to be made, that's why I said it was shaping up well.

If Plata is to be used in a strictly offensive role, there's no need to look at his defensive liabilities. The CM or DM can help out the LB if Plata is unable to defend. The bigger concern would be if a two-way player for Lambe can't be found, it would stretch the defensive side of our mid apart. I agree that Lambe is a defensive liability. A two-way RSL-type player would be great on the opposing wing.

[DangerRed]

The roster is shaping up well.

--------------------Frei------------------
----Ecks-----O'Dea----Califf----Morgan---
------------------Frings-----------------
----Lambe--------Silva---------Plata-----
------------Hassli--------Koev-----------

Subs: Bendik, Henry, J. Hall, Dunfield, _______, Braun, Wiedeman
Reserves: Q. Roberts, Emory, Stinson, Amarikwa


A bit disappointed that our solution for starting CB is Danny Califf, he's more of a rotation option but he's definitely an upgrade. If we're going to run with a 4-1-3-2 formation (which I personally like) I would hope we can upgrade Lambe and increase our depth at CM (as Mariner put it, a box-to-box midfielder).

No disrespect, but this squad would get eaten alive, especially the hothead-loaded back four and the shaky (either old or inexperienced) midfield.

I also don't think folks appreciate how little juice Koev and Hassli have left in them. We need an awesome forward, either via trade or the Superdraft, in addition to a viable, long-term solution for the back 4.

[Morlesio14]

Is it possible to trade Frings? Does anyone think Ledgerwood is better than Frings?

[mowe]

Still on the shopping list, in order of priority:

(1) Starting central midfielder
(1) Starting wide midfielder
(1) Starting forward
(1) Backup left back
(1) Backup utility midfielder

Midfield has the biggest holes especially because I don't think Mariner wants to rely on Silva too heavily. Getting two starter-level players is essential. Lambe and Plata are best suited as backups and Frings is a big question mark. Basically every midfielder on the roster right now is a defensive liability. Needless to say, a recipe for disaster (again).

A starting forward is necessary because Koevermans doesn't come back until at least two months into the season. And who knows what his form will be like then. Braun and Amarikwa can't be depended upon for such a long stretch.

Defense looks okay. Califf isn't going to be a game-changer, but at least we have Henry for injury/international game cover. I'm banking on improvement from O'Dea (25), Eckersley (23), and Morgan (22). We still need a proper left back for depth. No more playing people out of position. Morgan is one of our most important players and we can't overplay him.

So yeah, definitely a lot more work to be done. Luckily we have two high draft picks coming up. The first pick should always be used on the best player in the draft which is a CB this year. For our second pick we should look to grab the best midfielder or forward. Might need to swing a trade for that, depending on what Chivas does with their pick.

As for the rest of the spots we have to rely on Mariner's Euro trip and Payne's connections to get us the talent we need. It's gonna come down to scouting and cap management. Looking forward to see what they come up with.

[Frings22]

Is it possible to trade Frings? Does anyone think Ledgerwood is better than Frings?

I'm not sure if you know who frings is.... lol comparing him to ledgerwood is like comparing beckham to dunfield.

[Morlesio14]

I'm not sure if you know who frings is.... lol comparing him to ledgerwood is like comparing beckham to dunfield.

Says the guy with the name Frings22 hahah. But on a more serious note, I see where you're coming from I believe we should play this last year of his contract.

[mcolvy]

@Morlesio14. Go wiki Ledgerwood, then go wiki Frings and let me know there comparative state.

Per cap dollar spent, I think Ledgerwood is the better bang for your buck, but thats without a transfer fee. Frings is in a pretty awkward spot right now. He's not a charismatic leader (never was- more soft-spoken, lead by example...), and he struggles with the language, so now finally being surrounded with english speaking, alpha male types will almost completely silence the man. Takes away his best asset. Leadership/experience.

I vote for Frings playing AM, he's dangerous in that position and it would hide his diminishing mobility.

[Morlesio14]

Frings should play as many games as he can this year in DM role. We could try him in an AM role for a game or 2. Otherwise time will tell. Ledgerwood is quicker and speaks english but Frings is better with the ball at his feet. Both could be argued for who'd be better in a DM role for us.

[Brooker]

https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves/status/279998712288268288

According to Ives, Guevara to be scouting Central America for TFC

My heart stopped for a second there. I would murder somebody to get him back.... but him as a scout is genius!

[KGH]

There's reports that Chiumiento is in talks with the 'caps. Because he was sold wouldn't he have to go through allocation to get back into the league? Now theres an attacking mid that would fit well behind two big strikers

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/17/caps-confirm-chiumiento-met-rennie-over-weekend

[Yohan]

There's reports that Chiumiento is in talks with the 'caps. Because he was sold wouldn't he have to go through allocation to get back into the league? Now theres an attacking mid that would fit well behind two big strikers

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/17/caps-confirm-chiumiento-met-rennie-over-weekendapparently wants DP money though

[KGH]

apparently wants DP money though

I imagine his current team would want a transfer fee as well.

[SoccMan]

How about having a look at Paul Stalteri he will be turning 36 on Oct 18th 2013. I think he still might have 2 good years left in him. He has recovered from his injuries and is ready to resume his career. He has probably been one of the most successful Canadians to have played in Europe and has always when called upon been eager to play for our national team. I think he can still contribute in the MLS and why not with TFC.

[flamehawk]

How about having a look at Paul Stalteri he will be turning 36 on Oct 18th 2013. I think he still might have 2 good years left in him. He has recovered from his injuries and is ready to resume his career. He has probably been one of the most successful Canadians to have played in Europe and has always when called upon been eager to play for our national team. I think he can still contribute in the MLS and why not with TFC.


I think he can still put a shift in, but given what Payne has said about wanting youth and having already signed a veteran defender in Califf, it doesn't seem likely.

Mason Trafford, Whitecaps Academy graduate, is also linked to coming back to MLS, Whitecaps specifically, after a stint in Finland. http://www.rednationonline.ca/Articles2012/Traffordexcitedforwhatcomesnext.aspx Worth a look?

[mdc 77]

Stalteri has been searching for a club since May of this year, with still no luck. He may not be officially retried but might as well be. I like adding a veteran with leadership to TFC, you need those guys around to help build the youth coming through. However we just added that guy in Califf. I wouldn't even consider Stalteri at this stage, makes no sense.

[TorontoPat]

Stalteri has been searching for a club since May of this year, with still no luck. He may not be officially retried but might as well be. I like adding a veteran with leadership to TFC, you need those guys around to help build the youth coming through. However we just added that guy in Califf. I wouldn't even consider Stalteri at this stage, makes no sense.
He was at the last TFC game at BMO, I got to meet him and his wife. I think he'd make a fine addition.

[SoccMan]

I have to disagree with some of you out here, something tells me that Stalteri would be a positive addition to our team, his work rate and experience would be a plus. He is a Toronto area guy born and raised here, played all his youth soccer here, remember he played soccer growing up here in Toronto at a time when having a pro team like TFC and the way it has been supported would only have been a dream for kids growing up and playing soccer back in Stalteri's youth soccer days. Therefore, to have a chance to play for your home town team with the kind of support it gets I think you would see a very determined player wanting to give back to his city. I think he deserves a chance to see if he has anything left. It would be a shame for this team to not at the very least give him a chance to see what he could still do.

[jazzy]

How about having a look at Paul Stalteri he will be turning 36 on Oct 18th 2013. I think he still might have 2 good years left in him. He has recovered from his injuries and is ready to resume his career. He has probably been one of the most successful Canadians to have played in Europe and has always when called upon been eager to play for our national team. I think he can still contribute in the MLS and why not with TFC.

such a big plus compared to Cailiff....even at his age ....he has very good soccer IQ.....

[jloome]

such a big plus compared to Cailiff....even at his age ....he has very good soccer IQ.....

I dunno, he got beaten like a mule in a cornfield when he went to Spurs. That was ugly. And he's a wide player, really (or a forward, or a midfielder. He is flexible, anyway.)

Never a tier 1 talent and he's 35, out for 18 months.

I want us to trade for Chiumiento, if he's coming back to MLS. He and Hassli love each other like bros and enjoy playing together, and we need a guy like him, a mobile DeRo type.

[jloome]

There's reports that Chiumiento is in talks with the 'caps. Because he was sold wouldn't he have to go through allocation to get back into the league? Now theres an attacking mid that would fit well behind two big strikers

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/12/17/caps-confirm-chiumiento-met-rennie-over-weekend

Hassli was the best man at his wedding.

[Oranje]

Apparently Anthony Isom has a MLS trial tour after having a go at some pretty big clubs

1st MLS Transfers ‏@MLSTransfers (https://twitter.com/MLSTransfers)
Anthony Isom, former Red Bulls Academy player has trials at Chicago,Portland,Montreal&Toronto as well as Apoel in Cyprus. Currently w/Empoli

2ndMLS Transfers ‏@MLSTransfers (https://twitter.com/MLSTransfers)
Anthony Isom apparently is off to England right now to trial with Everton. Youngster had trials with Fiorentina and Plymouth Argyle before.

[Lucky Strike]

FYI - MLSTransfers apparently is going to interview him and people can send questions to @MLSTransfers.

[GuelphStorm2007]

What are these rumours I have heard about Nick Ledgerwood true or false

[gdg_9]

FYI - MLSTransfers apparently is going to interview him and people can send questions to @MLSTransfers.


Confirms that he has been contacted by TFC along with Portland and Chicago, as well as Euro teams and lower level N/A teams.
Says he plans on coming "home" this season if trial at Everton doesn't work out.



What isn't clear is whether "home" means USA, or MLS in general.

Could be a good pickup for TFC, as we need to start finding replacements for our aging attacking corp.



EDIT: This is in reference to Anthony Isom, 19 year-old American AM/FW who has been in Empoli's system in Italy for a few years, but is now a Free Agent

[Morlesio14]

Would love to have Isom.

[19Barrett19]

Probably another stefanivic who now is doing really well at Torino in seria A. Would be nice to have a look at him alongside Frings silva plata lambe some young legs in the roster couldn't hurt.

[jloome]

Probably another stefanivic who now is doing really well at Torino in seria A. Would be nice to have a look at him alongside Frings silva plata lambe some young legs in the roster couldn't hurt.

Nope, same guy. But they basically had to tell him he'd be cut if his attitude didn't change. He spent his first year back there seeing spot duty.

Don't think anyone denied he had talent, but he was very raw and a ball hog, maybe from assuming he'd have an easier time of it in MLS.

[Whoop]

Ives reporting that TFC might be in on Gale Agbossoumonde.

[Yohan]

Ives reporting that TFC might be in on Gale Agbossoumonde.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gale_Agbossoumonde

21 yrs old CB. Highly rated. One cap with USMNT already. If TFC lands him (highest odds in the lottery), no need to use a pick to sign a CB and TFC has more options.

[gdg_9]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gale_Agbossoumonde

21 yrs old CB. Highly rated. One cap with USMNT already. If TFC lands him (highest odds in the lottery), no need to use a pick to sign a CB and TFC has more options.


If TFC lands him, which is highly likely given they have the greatest odds in the weighted lottery, you can bank on them trading the 1st overall pick.

[GuelphStorm2007]

If we can get this guy that will be great but we need Midfield help and some decent wingers Tat is on my Christmas Card shopping list.

[GuelphStorm2007]

Some how I cannot see Frings being back as a player for physical reasons but maybe as a trainer instead but who knows

[ag futbol]

If TFC lands him, which is highly likely given they have the greatest odds in the weighted lottery, you can bank on them trading the 1st overall pick.
Or we could shop him instead of the first overall pick. Either way some CB depth would be nice for a change. But between one new young guy, Henry, and Emory (cheap 5th option).. we should be covered.

Time to start shoring up some of the other areas.

[Whoop]

And TFC lands him.



@SoccerByIves (https://twitter.com/SoccerByIves)
Toronto FC has landed Gale Agbossoumonde. BIG addition for TFC. That sound you hear is the No. 1 pick in MLS Draft going up for sale.#TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash)

[MartinUtd]

Some how I cannot see Frings being back as a player for physical reasons but maybe as a trainer instead but who knows

I don't see Frings taking a coaching job anywhere in North America.

Agbossoumonde sounds interesting though. Do we know when the lottery is announced? All I can find is "today".

[MartinUtd]

Never mind then, Whoop is on it!

[ManUtd4ever]

And TFC lands him.

[/B]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

Nice!

[DoubleUp]

Is this kid gonna take developmental minutes from Henry.???

[reggie]

he played under TR on the US under 20s,could this be the end of another of PMs pets..logan emory...plzzz yes

[Richard]

Some how I cannot see Frings being back as a player for physical reasons but maybe as a trainer instead but who knows

He is going to be the youth coach/assistant at Werder Bremen once he retires, its been setup since he came here.

[Yohan]

Is this kid gonna take developmental minutes from Henry.???
keeps Henry from being complacent that he's the 3rd CB right now

[Richard]

So how much money do we have in defense now? If we do not have anywhere near the best defense in MLS then once again its a colossal failure, did we not have the highest paid defense last year?

[reggie]

i dont see any need to draft another CB .we have 4 now,unless PM decides to play them at DM..

[gdg_9]

he played under TR on the US under 20s,could this be the end of another of PMs pets..logan emory...plzzz yes

I see Emory sticking around this season as a Utlility D off the bench (he's played FB as well in the past)

[gdg_9]

So how much money do we have in defense now? If we do not have anywhere near the best defense in MLS then once again its a colossal failure, did we not have the highest paid defense last year?

Well Boss is supposedly coming in on a cheap contract (according to Ives), so he's a good pickup either way.

[moralis]

TFC academy director Thomas Rongen coached Gale Agbossoumonde during his time as US U-17 coach.

[DoubleUp]

keeps Henry from being complacent that he's the 3rd CB right now


We'll see how it plays out!.

[Canary10]

Wonder if there's any chance of getting rid of Eckersley. He's taking way too much money for what he brings.

[Alonso]

Wonder if there's any chance of getting rid of Eckersley. He's taking way too much money for what he brings.


Agreed. Plus he's the RPB man of the year, so it would only be fitting.

[Canary10]

^ Ha, forgot about that somehow.

[GuelphStorm2007]

keeps Henry from being complacent that he's the 3rd CB right now
Excellent Point Yohan this will be good for Henry

[Gazza]

Whoop there it is!

[Yohan]

http://www.carynews.com/2012/06/23/60000/railhawks-defender-enjoying-his.html

Athletic and fast, also has short passing ability. Injury ridden career so far and he's going to need a lot of mentoring from Califf and O'Dea

[GuelphStorm2007]

i AM A LITTLE WORRIED ABOUT ABOUT HIS INJURY HISTORY BUT WE WILL SEE

[tfcmanu]

Wiki - Toronto Fc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gale_Agbossoumonde (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gale_Agbossoumonde)

[moralis]

It's likely Gale Agbossoumonde plays most of his games alongside Doneil Henry in the new reserve league. Would be a solid combination going forward for years to come.

[Alonso]

http://www.carynews.com/2012/06/23/60000/railhawks-defender-enjoying-his.html

Athletic and fast, also has short passing ability. Injury ridden career so far and he's going to need a lot of mentoring from Califf and O'Dea


Plus his family is in Syracuse. Not far away at all. This has potential.

[Morlesio14]

Not bad at all. Can't wait to see who we can get back from that first pick because it's definitely going.

[Detroit_TFC]

Very promising (US Soccer Athlete of the Year in 2010) guy whose career got off to a bad start (his former agent - Traffic Sports* - too aggressively shopped him around Europe leading to a lot of loan deals, and injuries limited consistency). Hoping connection to Rongen might put him at ease about getting assigned to TFC, and get him focused.

* his deal with Traffic ended recently

[TFCwestcan]

And TFC lands him.

[/B]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

This must be our year! Is this the first lottery we have won ( I know we had the largest percentage of winning). Should be fascinating to see where we go at the draft. Perhaps choose one other CB and move into mid field? Or do we trade for an established MLS player? Options that's good.

[MartinUtd]

Brian McBride?

[Yohan]

Brian McBride?

allocation draft for returning USMNT players. different than this one (I know this is confusing...)

[TFCwestcan]

Brian McBride?


Which became the expensive Chad Barrett, Hmmm.

[Yohan]

Which became the expensive Chad Barrett, Hmmm.
and Stefan Frei

[moralis]

Looks like TFC has signed it's first player and it's Honduran attacking midfielder Arnold Peralta. I think Amado Guevara had a hand in scouting this player for TFC. Looks like Amado is our Honduran/Central American scout.

http://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.diez.hn/Ediciones/2012/12/27/Noticias/Carla-Dip-da-por-hecho-el-fichaje-de-Arnold-Peralta-por-el-Toronto-de-la-MLS&prev=/search%3Fq%3DCarla%2BDip%2Bda%2Bpor%2Bhecho%2Bel%2 Bfichaje%2Bde%2BArnold%2BPeralta%2Bpor%2Bel%2BToro nto%2Bde%2Bla%2BMLS%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DXCJ%26tbo%3Dd%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26channel%3Drcs&sa=X&ei=Ro7cUI-VMITk2QWDtICADg&ved=0CDgQ7gEwAA

https://twitter.com/search/realtime?q=Arnol...eralta&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search/realtime?q=Arnold+Peralta&src=typd)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnold_Peralta

I would say a younger version of Amado Guevara. Peralta is Guevara 2.0

Also played against Canada in that 8-1 game. Played the whole 90 minutes.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/match?id=333991&cc=5901

[mowe]

Hmm, this looks promising. 23-year-old Honduran national team player and played in the Olympics. I like it!

[ag futbol]

Fucking right, solid signing.

[Ajax TFC]

Looks like a good move. Now lets see how Mariner uses him...

[Corpand]

6 Month loan, I wonder if there is a nice clause to purchase in there if he's successful.

Is Plata coming back?