PDA

View Full Version : Which max cap hit players should we keep?



jloome
10-21-2012, 10:41 PM
Right now, we have five players at the cap max next season if they all come back. Obviously, this isn't going to work.

If you look at the illustration on the link below, it suggests we're getting frings and Hassli back. But I'd be willing to bet the majority of people who watch this team play, if they had their choice, would pick Danny K over both and might even pick O'Dea or Eckersley over both.

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/10/anselmi-lower-prices-higher-expectations

So here's a multiple choice poll, keeping in mind that the max cap hit for each is $350,000. Who do we keep if we're smart about it?

Eckersley - $390,000
O'Dea - $436,250
Frings - $2.41 million
Hassli - $790,000
Koevermans - $1.56 million

spe18
10-21-2012, 10:47 PM
Who is guaranteed for next season?

Beach_Red
10-21-2012, 10:51 PM
This would have been a completely different season without the injuries, and yet the injuries seemed inevitable. This team spends way too much on guys on the downward slope of their careers. Does anyone really think Frings or Hassli or Kouvermans is going to play a full season each next year? So, I guess I'd pick Eckersley and O'Dea...

Benficachop20
10-21-2012, 11:17 PM
ecks and o'dea are getting paid way to much for being nothing more than average players in their position. Think Frings is done and also don't believe Hassli is dp worthy. Keep Koevermans.

mowe
10-21-2012, 11:21 PM
None of the above.

Hassli has not impressed, there's a reason Vancouver let him go. Frings is too old/slow to play in this league, especially as a DP. Eckersley and O'Dea are MLS-level talents (at their natural positions) but are vastly overpaid. Koevermans won't be ready until a few months into the season, and who knows how he'll play after the injury.

Of course finding replacements for all these players is probably not feasible so Ecks/O'Dea will stay. I'm hoping Frings helps us out and retires. Hassli needs to be let go, but I think Mariner will keep him around as cover until Koevermans gets back.

To field a competitive team we really need cut down to one DP (or ideally none) because of the max cap hits of Ecks and O'Dea. Use the cap space to sign a CB to pair with O'Dea or just commit to Henry at that spot (unlikely Mariner would do that). Now that I think about it there are holes all over the roster.

We need a new midfield around Silva, and new strikers. Hopefully the draft will help out here and get us a player on the level of Mattocks or Wenger. Eriq Zavaleta looks good, and he's GA too.

Kocic
Ecks - Henry - O'Dea - Morgan
Lambe - DM - Silva - LM
Draft pick - F

Oldest player in that lineup is Kocic at 27. This can be a decent young group that can grow together. Since we're stuck with Mariner I wish him good luck with finding some overlooked players with upside. We need to start building some continuity and the first step is to cut loose the players who aren't part of the future.

narduch
10-22-2012, 05:56 AM
I think they will all be back. Frings and Koevermans are on guaranteed money.

Eckersley and O'Dea are Mariner's prized signings.

And Hassli was traded for a first rounder. They will want to keep him to not make that trade look too stupid.

Phil
10-22-2012, 08:07 AM
Hassli is on an option. All others are for sure coming back unless injury forces them to retire or some move is made.

I know Danny is training like a beast so I do expect to see him back.

Frei and Kocic are out of contract, I would only expect to see one of them lured back.

[NBF]
10-22-2012, 08:18 AM
I think they will all be back. Frings and Koevermans are on guaranteed money.

Eckersley and O'Dea are Mariner's prized signings.

And Hassli was traded for a first rounder. They will want to keep him to not make that trade look too stupid.

I think there's a deadline to cut DP's although I dont think you want to have the reputation of dumping DP's, but at this point it really dont get worse than being called the worst team in the world.

Explain how Paul Mariner gets credit for signing Richard Eckersley, but he doesnt take credit for all the other signings or lack there of when Aron Winter was in charge? If you recall he was on loan to TFC from Burnley in 2011. So how does Paul Mariner get credit for him and not others?

BTW, I voted for Eckersley and O'Dea, because I think this season proved that you cant overpay for starters and experience on defense. I also agree with everyone else that the team should cut down on the DP's until they have a solidified defense. Henry really needs to compete against an experience defender so that he can improve, so getting another centre back is essential.

starter
10-22-2012, 10:13 AM
I only choose Danny, since I find others compensation limiting team options going forward.

narduch
10-22-2012, 10:16 AM
;1538000']I think there's a deadline to cut DP's although I dont think you want to have the reputation of dumping DP's, but at this point it really dont get worse than being called the worst team in the world.

Yes, there is a window where you can buy out a DP. But that it is up to the club and the player to come up with a resolution. Do you really think Koevermans or Frings are going to walk away from all that money? And we saw through the handling of De Guzman that they aren't interested in a a full payout. Which is probably what it will take to get either to walk away.

MartinUtd
10-22-2012, 10:19 AM
O'Dea, Ecks & Koevermans.

Two good defenders who are over paid, but I have no confidence that the people making the decisions can do better with their money. I like Frings and would be happy to see him back, but I would prefer a somebody a bit younger. Koevermans is a beast and if it wasn't for one dangerous tackle after a shit defender got beat on a turf surface, he would have bagged 20 goals this season. I never rated Hassli and wanted him gone as soon as he got here.

prizby
10-22-2012, 10:39 AM
Hassli is on an option. All others are for sure coming back unless injury forces them to retire or some move is made.

I know Danny is training like a beast so I do expect to see him back.

Frei and Kocic are out of contract, I would only expect to see one of them lured back.

didn't frei sign a 3 year contract last year?

Joe Kool
10-22-2012, 10:49 AM
Frei and Kocic are out of contract, I would only expect to see one of them lured back.

Frei told me he is back next year for sure. Maybe he was just feeling confident but that's what he said. It didn't sound like there was any doubt. Guess we will see. The only GK I don't want back next year is Freddy Hall. Seems like nice enough guy but I have zero confidence in him.

As far as the poll goes I voted Koevermans, O'Dea and Ecks. I don't think we will get any better options to replace them in the offseason. Koevs can still be the man for us for at least another year if he can get fit. I don't think Frings has it so much anymore even though he says we will be back too. Hassli didn't sound like he was too sure that he would be here in his post game interview when asked but it might have been a language thing too in the way he answered. I think if Danny is good we should spend money elsewhere and not on Hassli.

ag futbol
10-22-2012, 11:00 AM
At the salaries they are being paid? I don't want any of them back. Maybe Koevermans, if he can stay healthy.

Torsen - not sure what he has left in the tank

O'Dea + Eckersley - maybe at half their wages

Hassli - I'd like someone a little more durable for DP money.


Realistically, who is coming back? All of them. We're tied to all these guys for the reasons other posters have mentioned above. Going to be one hell of a year....

ManUtd4ever
10-22-2012, 12:18 PM
The only player from the OP's list that doesn't have a guaranteed contract next season is Hassli. I think Hassli can be an impact player in this league, but his durability is a concern. If Koevs' recovery goes well during the off season, the cap space that would need be utilized to exercise the club option to retain Hassli would probably be better served elsewhere. If Koevs' recovery does not progress well, it might be worth a gamble bringing Hassli back for another season.

As for Frings, Ecks, and O'Dea, they are pretty much all guaranteed to be back next season unless one or more of them are traded within MLS during the off season, which is unlikely based on their respective salaries.

Our best hope is that Koevs makes a full recovery, and our other top paid players perform to their capabilities, so that their cumulative salaries will be somewhat justified next season.

ensco
10-22-2012, 01:01 PM
Given existing contracts, they have maybe 500K to spend on 10 guys.

It's going to be the quietest offseason in MLS history.

narduch
10-22-2012, 01:05 PM
Given existing contracts, they have maybe 500K to spend on 10 guys.

It's going to be the quietest offseason in MLS history.

The discovery signing rule will complicate things as well. We can only make 6 discovery signings.

That doesn't affect homegrown players though. So I expect guys like Stinson, Cordon, etc. to be released for a new crop of Academy players/guinea pigs.

Pookie
10-22-2012, 01:09 PM
Why are folks concentrating on buy-outs?

The market value for Hassli was apparently a 1st round pick just a few months ago. JDG went for Weideman. Surely, Torsten could help a team on the verge of gaining a playoff spot or going deeper?

I really don't want to see any of the DPs back but I don't think it would be wise to simply buy them out. Move them for an asset, even if just a draft pick. We don't have a 1st round pick in 2014 and surely we could recover some of that depth via trade.

I say that with all due respect to their talent, I just don't think we need older, more injury likely players on our roster next season. We don't have the depth to overcome the inevitable.

jloome
10-22-2012, 02:01 PM
Why are folks concentrating on buy-outs?

The market value for Hassli was apparently a 1st round pick just a few months ago. JDG went for Weideman. Surely, Torsten could help a team on the verge of gaining a playoff spot or going deeper?

I really don't want to see any of the DPs back but I don't think it would be wise to simply buy them out. Move them for an asset, even if just a draft pick. We don't have a 1st round pick in 2014 and surely we could recover some of that depth via trade.

I say that with all due respect to their talent, I just don't think we need older, more injury likely players on our roster next season. We don't have the depth to overcome the inevitable.

Their contracts are with the league. So they keep the money. Who's going to pick up Torsten Frings at $2.4M a season? No one. Hassli's out of contract. The only guy who's worth the money he's making is Koevermans, and even then he's out half the year injured.

We're not going to get a sack of hammers for them, let a lone a draft pick.

Alonso
10-22-2012, 02:25 PM
If I remember correctly Torsten, Danny and Hassli all got injured on turf.

What if we keep these guys off the turf next year or at least two of the three to prevent this into the future? Vancouver, Seattle and Portland are the only teams that play on turf now right???

Also... perhaps with Hassli playing mostly on our grass, he might last the whole year... wishful thinking I know...

ensco
10-22-2012, 02:34 PM
Who in their right mind trades for DPs, except TFC?

I think you could move Koevs for a return after 10 games, if his strike rate is there. Frings is at best an average MF now - so it's a JDG type deal only in his case. Hassli was never worth a first round pick, and still wouldn't be even if he was signed.

Only 34 of the 57 DP slots were even used in 2012.

Pookie
10-22-2012, 03:07 PM
Who in their right mind trades for DPs, except TFC?

I think you could move Koevs for a return after 10 games, if his strike rate is there. Frings is at best an average MF now - so it's a JDG type deal only in his case. Hassli was never worth a first round pick, and still wouldn't be even if he was signed.

Only 34 of the 57 DP slots were even used in 2012.

Granted, the trade was a bonehead move but there were a few trades this year involving assets coming back for a DP.

Sharlie Joseph went for a player, a 2nd round pick and allocation money. Angel went for a draft pick (albeit a late one). JDG went for Weideman.

TFC would obviously need to eat some (or all) of the salary but there are teams out that that are willing to offer assets. Not every team mind you but to immediately throw out the player on a buy out, to me at least, would be the last resort. After all, that's why Kijiji is so popular. People shop their un-usable wears before tossing them in the dump.

Yohan
10-22-2012, 04:00 PM
If I remember correctly Torsten, Danny and Hassli all got injured on turf.

What if we keep these guys off the turf next year or at least two of the three to prevent this into the future? Vancouver, Seattle and Portland are the only teams that play on turf now right???

Also... perhaps with Hassli playing mostly on our grass, he might last the whole year... wishful thinking I know...

Thierry Henry absolutely refuses to play on turf. He's also been mostly healthy this year for once since joing the Shite Bulls

Van, Portland, Seattle, New England, Mtl occassionally play on turf

Yohan
10-22-2012, 04:01 PM
Granted, the trade was a bonehead move but there were a few trades this year involving assets coming back for a DP.

Sharlie Joseph went for a player, a 2nd round pick and allocation money. Angel went for a draft pick (albeit a late one). JDG went for Weideman.

TFC would obviously need to eat some (or all) of the salary but there are teams out that that are willing to offer assets. Not every team mind you but to immediately throw out the player on a buy out, to me at least, would be the last resort. After all, that's why Kijiji is so popular. People shop their un-usable wears before tossing them in the dump.
Freddy Ljungberg and Alvaro Fernandez to Chicago

ensco
10-22-2012, 04:42 PM
OK I'll rephrase:

There is no football trade available for any of these guys (ie one where we free up cap space).

spe18
10-22-2012, 04:59 PM
And also, as a friendly reminder; according to the rule book, a team may by out one guaranteed contract in the off season

(D) BUYOUT OF GUARANTEED CONTRACT


Teams may have the ability to buyout one guaranteed player as follows:




A Team may buy out one (1) guaranteed player (including a DP’s) contract during the off-season and free up the corresponding budget space. Such a buyout is at the particular MLS Team’s own expense.



A Team may not free up budget space with a buyout of a player’s salary budget charge during the season. Such a buyout will be conducted by the League and count on a Club’s budget in a manner consistent with current MLS guidelines.

Ajax TFC
10-22-2012, 06:13 PM
If we could get rid of anyone we wanted, I would only keep Koevermans. He's one of the best strikers in the league, so he's worth the risk coming back from injury. I like Frings, but I don't think he has enough left to offer to make him worth the cap hit. Eckersley and O'dea are good, but not nearly good enough to justify a cap hit that will seriously limit the depth quality



Sharlie Joseph went for a player, a 2nd round pick and allocation money. Angel went for a draft pick (albeit a late one).

Both players were traded to the only team comparable to us in shittyness


JDG went for Weideman.
But they only took him because TFC would pay his salary and because they had the extra cap space, so it didn't at all hurt them to add him to their team.
That being said I think Eckersley and O'Dea would be the easiest to get rid of. If there's a team that has their front line and midfield in order at the beginning of the season with money to spare, they might be willing to splash out on someone to solidify their back line. Koevermans would be the easier of the DPs to move although he's also the one that I would want to keep on because he brings more than just leadership.

Of course there's always the chance that Chivas would take them and give us something good in return.

Auzzy
10-22-2012, 08:39 PM
I wonder if some of these guys also have no-trade clauses.

Soccerpro
10-22-2012, 09:30 PM
None of the above.

Hassli has not impressed, there's a reason Vancouver let him go. Frings is too old/slow to play in this league, especially as a DP. Eckersley and O'Dea are MLS-level talents (at their natural positions) but are vastly overpaid. Koevermans won't be ready until a few months into the season, and who knows how he'll play after the injury.

Of course finding replacements for all these players is probably not feasible so Ecks/O'Dea will stay. I'm hoping Frings helps us out and retires. Hassli needs to be let go, but I think Mariner will keep him around as cover until Koevermans gets back.

To field a competitive team we really need cut down to one DP (or ideally none) because of the max cap hits of Ecks and O'Dea. Use the cap space to sign a CB to pair with O'Dea or just commit to Henry at that spot (unlikely Mariner would do that). Now that I think about it there are holes all over the roster.

We need a new midfield around Silva, and new strikers. Hopefully the draft will help out here and get us a player on the level of Mattocks or Wenger. Eriq Zavaleta looks good, and he's GA too.

Kocic
Ecks - Henry - O'Dea - Morgan
Lambe - DM - Silva - LM
Draft pick - F

Oldest player in that lineup is Kocic at 27. This can be a decent young group that can grow together. Since we're stuck with Mariner I wish him good luck with finding some overlooked players with upside. We need to start building some continuity and the first step is to cut loose the players who aren't part of the future.

This x 1000000. No one can defend any of these players at these prices.

Pookie
10-23-2012, 06:00 AM
This x 1000000 (tel:1000000). No one can defend any of these players at these prices.

"at these prices" is the key phrase there.

There is more than reasonable doubt to suggest that Eckersley counts just $210k against the cap due to the ongoing question as to base vs guaranteed compensation being used in the calculation.

Secondly, TFC has received quite a bit of allocation money and cap hits of designated players can be bought down using that tool.

In a league that makes allocation money available on a whim, and a team like LA can flaunt the cap, I don't know why we try to pretend this is a hard cap like the NHL.

We are debating this issue without all the variables being known. A better question is whether these five should be our highest paid.

Ultra & Proud
10-23-2012, 11:39 AM
Eckersley only makes $210k. The $390k this season included bonus and/or transfer fee. Not sure if the same applies to O' Dea in terms of signing bonus. Both are worth keeping. Koerverman's also if healthy enough to have a back to form return.

Greatest Ripoff
10-23-2012, 12:35 PM
Eckersley only makes $210k. The $390k this season included bonus and/or transfer fee. Not sure if the same applies to O' Dea in terms of signing bonus. Both are worth keeping. Koerverman's also if healthy enough to have a back to form return.

Regardless of how you slice up of $390K for Eckersley and $436K O'Dea the club is still spending all of that money on very average MLS players that could be put to better use if the team could properly identify talent. Especially when you consider that revenue will be down next year due to the ticket price decrease. TFC can't be putting that much money to poor use.

Yohan
10-23-2012, 12:47 PM
Regardless of how you slice up of $390K for Eckersley and $436K O'Dea the club is still spending all of that money on very average MLS players that could be put to better use if the team could properly identify talent. Especially when you consider that revenue will be down next year due to the ticket price decrease. TFC can't be putting that much money to poor use.
Players under the salary cap, except DPs's wages minus 350k per player, has their salary paid by the league

jloome
10-23-2012, 02:38 PM
The cap hit is their guaranteed compensation, not their base salary. if they're above 350,000 it's because they're either a dp or allocation cash is covering part of it

Yohan
10-23-2012, 02:46 PM
The cap hit is their guaranteed compensation, not their base salary. if they're above 350,000 it's because they're either a dp or allocation cash is covering part of it

it's somewhere between base salary and guaranteed compensation. mls never said what was included in cap hit, so most assume cap hit number is somewhere between base salary and guaranteed compensation

Wooster_TFC
10-23-2012, 03:46 PM
O'Dea and Eckersley I keep if they aren't actually max cap hit (up for discussion).

Koevermans I keep because he can poach with the best of them.

Frings I would keep if we are playing 4-3-3 and he can be the midfield distributor. If we play the way we played this year under Mariner, for the good of the team (and his good too), he needs to go.

Hassli I think can be had at less than max cap. At max cap, he's gone. If we are keeping Koevermans and not playing 2 strikers, he's gone.

Detroit_TFC
10-25-2012, 03:10 PM
Seems that all the DPs all want to come back. The club will exercise its option to buy out one of them. I think that one will be Frings, he has a better post-retirement arrangement set, and the FO will make the case to him that its necessary to have the availability of a DP slot to revive the team.

Ajax TFC
10-25-2012, 08:07 PM
Seems that all the DPs all want to come back. The club will exercise its option to buy out one of them. I think that one will be Frings, he has a better post-retirement arrangement set, and the FO will make the case to him that its necessary to have the availability of a DP slot to revive the team.
I don't think the club will have to make any case to him. I think he'll gladly take the money and be on the first plane back to Bremen. Also the club shouldn't use the freed up DP spot. they need the cap space to use on depth. I think they should also decline Hassli's option. Koevermans, Silva, Johnson, and even Plata is good enough and we could probably sign a decent backup for a lot less than 350k *cough* Moises Orozco*

West220Side
10-26-2012, 03:52 PM
I'm hoping Frings does us a favor and retires in the off season. Our manager forced him to play with injury, and he just looked poor quality at that point. Would rather throw some MLS quality midfielders on $80-$100k then have Frings in the middle.

Hassli/Koevermans - I would take one back, but not both, preferably Koevermans if theres a hope he can regain his quality finishing skills, but neither would be on a designated player salary, somewhere between $180-$250k would be just right for them I think, but again only one should return.

O'dea and Eckersley I would have back, theyre a solid defensive duo (please god somebody shift Ecks back to rightback)


Our current deisgnated players are Hassli, Frings, and Koevermans. If we're hitting the reset button as they say, shouldn't we start with no designated players on the books? Make as little of a mess as we can for next year. (Salary wise) If we fuck it up again next year I dont want anybody (New manager, old manager) to have the freedom to say something about how his hands were tied because of old players on the books.

ensco
10-26-2012, 03:55 PM
I'm hoping Frings does us a favor and retires in the off season.

Sounds to me like hoping there's an Easter bunny.

Two million five hundred thousand reasons to be back.

Ajax TFC
10-26-2012, 06:00 PM
I'm hoping Frings does us a favor and retires in the off season. Our manager forced him to play with injury, and he just looked poor quality at that point. Would rather throw some MLS quality midfielders on $80-$100k then have Frings in the middle.

Hassli/Koevermans - I would take one back, but not both, preferably Koevermans if theres a hope he can regain his quality finishing skills, but neither would be on a designated player salary, somewhere between $180-$250k would be just right for them I think, but again only one should return.

O'dea and Eckersley I would have back, theyre a solid defensive duo (please god somebody shift Ecks back to rightback)


Our current deisgnated players are Hassli, Frings, and Koevermans. If we're hitting the reset button as they say, shouldn't we start with no designated players on the books? Make as little of a mess as we can for next year. (Salary wise) If we fuck it up again next year I dont want anybody (New manager, old manager) to have the freedom to say something about how his hands were tied because of old players on the books.
Neither Koevermans or Frings is going to just abandon two million bucks for the greater good of the team.
Koevermans is one of the most prolific strikers this league has seen when he's healthy. Only way he plays for less than his salary is if they pay him all of it in the off season (buying him out) and then re-signs for the amount you suggested. But that also means that they can't buy out Frings, and like I said, there's no way that he waives two million dollars. Next season is an option year for Hassli, so I believe he would go through the re-entry draft at his current salary before we would have the chance of negotiating him down. I think we're better off cutting our losses on him and signing a new backup in the off-season.

Yohan
10-26-2012, 07:22 PM
Hassli dont have three yrs in the league so dont qualify for reentry draft. Tfc will be holding on to his rights

Ajax TFC
10-26-2012, 07:37 PM
even if we decline his option? I still don't think he'd be willing to take a big enough cut. I imagine he'd pursue his options overseas if we don't offer him what he feels he deserves

Yohan
10-26-2012, 07:44 PM
Unless put on waivers, team retains right to a player once contract expires.

DichioTFC
10-31-2012, 12:13 PM
O'Dea and Eckersley take up $330K and $210K of a cap hit respectively. Yes, with bonuses they're being paid more, but its their current base salary that counts under the cap (says so on the Players Union site).

That being said, I would have all five back. They all serve a first-team role and they're not replaceable by the current players on the team (with the exception being Hassli, Ryan Johnson could replace him IMO).

T-boy
10-31-2012, 12:31 PM
Its difficult actually:

Eckersley - I would keep. He's not actually at the cap due and I think he's worth what he's being paid *especially* at full back. Not so much at CB, but he should go back to his best position next season.
O'Dae - I don't think we saw the best out of him, and he wasn't consistently in the team due to injury and internationals. But at his age he should be worth the max salary hit.
Koevs and Frings - I will look at together. I love them both - BUT, the problem with them is their age and injuries/fitness catching up to them. Both have been fairly dogged with fitness issues, and I really think this will just get worse, not better. The issue is that even if they both come back, the chances of them getting injured again is fairly high. I'm not sure TFC can afford to take the risk of having both/one of them on salary if they are irreplaceable when they get injured. I'm going to be fairly harsh and say we should drop both for next season.
Hassli - I *really* wanted to like the guy. But he hasn't really done much. And to be honest, 15 goals in over 50 games is not worth DP money/max salary hit. There are many MLS strikers who have scored more than Hassli who aren't making DP, or even max salary money. I would consider Hassli at a wage drop, but if he's not willing to go below 350k, I would say no to him for next season.

spark
11-06-2012, 05:24 PM
O'Dea and Eckersley take up $330K and $210K of a cap hit respectively. Yes, with bonuses they're being paid more, but its their current base salary that counts under the cap (says so on the Players Union site).

Where? I don't see anywhere on the site that states that specifically.

spark
11-06-2012, 05:43 PM
If I remember correctly Torsten, Danny and Hassli all got injured on turf.

What if we keep these guys off the turf next year or at least two of the three to prevent this into the future? Vancouver, Seattle and Portland are the only teams that play on turf now right???

Also... perhaps with Hassli playing mostly on our grass, he might last the whole year... wishful thinking I know...

I know Torsten got messed up in Seattle, Danny was in New England but I'm positive Hassli's injury came at home, I think against Philly.

prizby
11-06-2012, 06:05 PM
I know Torsten got messed up in Seattle, Danny was in New England but I'm positive Hassli's injury came at home, I think against Philly.

hassli came to toronto with an injury that caused him to miss time

bigredone
11-10-2012, 06:47 PM
Get rid of our DP's and we can add "least goals in a season, worldwide" to our "worst team in the world" slogan. I know the latter is getting old....sorry.

spe18
11-11-2012, 03:49 PM
Get rid of our DP's and we can add "least goals in a season, worldwide" to our "worst team in the world" slogan. I know the latter is getting old....sorry.

Or better yet, we'd become the best team in the world!! (this is based on the fact this year's supporters shield winners didn't have a DP on their team :))

Ajax TFC
11-13-2012, 12:00 PM
We should keep all the max hit players! We can fill out the squad with Bermudans, supplemental draft picks (since superdraft picks' salaries are too high), and various other MLS rejects and USL players. They would tear this league apart!

bigredone
11-13-2012, 04:03 PM
Or better yet, we'd become the best team in the world!! (this is based on the fact this year's supporters shield winners didn't have a DP on their team :))

It does sound nice and I would like to see that too. We will get to that point if only we survive the massive short term drop in fan interest.

Pookie
11-14-2012, 04:12 PM
it's somewhere between base salary and guaranteed compensation. mls never said what was included in cap hit, so most assume cap hit number is somewhere between base salary and guaranteed compensation

Actually, there is a lot to this.

I have an article going live tomorrow (WakingtheRed) which gets into a number of these issues, including base vs guaranteed and the whole idea of budget flexing. What started as a piece focused on Toronto FC's salary cap space in the off-season became an eye opening look into the league. Should go live about 9am tomorrow for those that are interested.

Pookie
11-15-2012, 10:29 AM
^ this is the link to the article that I referenced yesterday.

In short, there is no salary cap in MLS. No language in the CBA reflecting "cap" and no penalties for exceeding this supposed cap (such as a luxury tax or other). There is plenty of language regarding budgets and these budgets get flexed. Since the league owns the teams, pays the salaries and signs the contracts, there is no need for a cap.

As for base vs guaranteed counting against a budget, the answer is neither counts and I explain why. For those that like to play armchair GM, like me, it was a very interesting research experience which has left me with a new view on the league.

http://www.wakingthered.com/2012/11/15/3637094/mls-salary-cap-details-la-galaxy-robbie-keane-toronto-fc

ag futbol
11-15-2012, 12:17 PM
^ I am not a lawyer, but the very simple explanation is that a lot of what you are talking about is covered in a separate agreement, which is not publicly disclosed.

As far as legal documents go, the CBA and other things you have referenced are very simplistic, which leads me to believe there is more to it.

Pookie
11-15-2012, 12:39 PM
^ I am not a lawyer, but the very simple explanation is that a lot of what you are talking about is covered in a separate agreement, which is not publicly disclosed.

As far as legal documents go, the CBA and other things you have referenced are very simplistic, which leads me to believe there is more to it.

^ perhaps though the agreement would presumably have to call to it (via an appendix or exhibit) if it existed. This CBA is very clear that the league pays the salaries. In fact, it lays out what happens if the league can't meet its minimum budget obligations to players.

In any event, the language the league uses is pretty clear... budget. It pays the salaries, holds the contracts. There is no need for a salary cap. It sets budgets. It flexes budgets. We work within our allotted budget, with their money that they can flex any time they like.

.