If the season started 9 games ago:

[Pookie]

This is absolutely NOT an endorsement for our new direction. However, I get tired of looking at the current table so wondered what would the Eastern table look like if it was reset at the time we made a coaching change (and DK returned to health and form)? Well wonder no more:



Team
GP
W
L
D
Points


DC United
9
6
3

18


Chicago
9
5
3
1
16


Sporting KC
9
4
2
3
15


NYRB
9
4
2
3
15


Toronto
9
3
2
4
13


Houston
8
3
2
3
12


Philadelphia
8
4
4

12


Montreal
10
3
6
1
10


New England
8
2
2
4
10


Columbus
8
3
4
1
10




We'd be hanging on to the last playoff spot with 2 teams 1 point behind us with a game in hand and 2 more with 3 points to make up with one game remaining.

Clearly, this shows we need to play MTL and VAN more often. Maybe we can combine this with the FO's new theme nights and call it "Annual Guaranteed 3 Point Night."

Will try to update this after the next 10 games and see what it looks like.

[jrober38]

The team has obviously improved by a considerable margin since PM took over (or AW was fired; however you want to look at it).

The biggest improvement has been on offense with a marginal improvement on defense, with a record of 14 goals scored to 15 allowed in those games compared to 8 for and 21 allowed in the first 9 games.

Losing DK should really hurt us though. We saw what the offense looked like at the beginning of the season without him in the lineup much and it was extremely ugly.

TFC need to be looking for a striker if they want to keep up this improvement which can hopefully allow them to carry some momentum into next season.

[Pookie]

The team has obviously improved by a considerable margin since PM took over (or AW was fired; however you want to look at it).

The biggest improvement has been on offense with a marginal improvement on defense, with a record of 14 goals scored to 15 allowed in those games compared to 8 for and 21 allowed in the first 9 games.

Losing DK should really hurt us though. We saw what the offense looked like at the beginning of the season without him in the lineup much and it was extremely ugly.

TFC need to be looking for a striker if they want to keep up this improvement which can hopefully allow them to carry some momentum into next season.

Agreed. And like most seasons, there is early season congestion and the results even out over time. One game would swing the results (ie. a NE win would have essentially swapped our spots) at this point.

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.

[jrober38]

Agreed. And like most seasons, there is early season congestion and the results even out over time. One game would swing the results (ie. a NE win would have essentially swapped our spots) at this point.

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.

All I know is that this team isn't going to continue its run of form without finding a comparable replacement for DK.

Without his offensive production, we probably look a lot like the team that started this season without being able to win at all...

[Ultra & Proud]

Agreed. And like most seasons, there is early season congestion and the results even out over time. One game would swing the results (ie. a NE win would have essentially swapped our spots) at this point.

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.

Yeah but take a look at our road record in these past 9 matches. Never in our history have we performed this well on the road. We have twice the number of road wins in these 9 matches compared to what Winter's team managed in 44 matches. That, right there, is the biggest telling point in comparing the two regimes.

[jrober38]

Yeah but take a look at our road record in these past 9 matches. Never in our history have we performed this well on the road. We have twice the number of road wins in these 9 matches compared to what Winter's team managed in 44 matches. That, right there, is the biggest telling point in comparing the two regimes.

We've played well, but we just lost our MVP by a massive margin.

Without DK scoring goals by converting a huge percentage of his chances, this team is going to struggle massively to win for the rest of the season. Once he went down with the injury, we couldn't string passes together and got destroyed in possession. Losing the possession battle 30-70 is not sustainable if we want to keep winning games, and having a guy up front who can hold the ball up is extremely important.

The team needs to be doing everything in its power to bring in a new DP Striker or else we're screwed.

[TOBOR !]

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.

Where's the irony ? That 3-2-4 for 14 under PM is considered an accomplishment, while the same stats under Winter is considered a failure ? Well, that's not irony either - that's a contradiction.

[T-boy]

Agreed. And like most seasons, there is early season congestion and the results even out over time. One game would swing the results (ie. a NE win would have essentially swapped our spots) at this point.

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.

The problem with Winter wasn't last season, as we clearly ended the season fairly well. The problem was what happened over the over season? We all assumed TFC would come back a better team given that Winter had a whole off season to work with his players. But that didn't happen - Winter had a whole off season and the team came back a lot worse! I have no idea what happened there? It's like they didn't do any of season work at all! TFC should have been better in their second season under Winter, not significantly worse!

[Pookie]

The problem with Winter wasn't last season, as we clearly ended the season fairly well. The problem was what happened over the over season? We all assumed TFC would come back a better team given that Winter had a whole off season to work with his players. But that didn't happen - Winter had a whole off season and the team came back a lot worse! I have no idea what happened there? It's like they didn't do any of season work at all! TFC should have been better in their second season under Winter, not significantly worse!

t-boy, you'd be wise to learn the lessons investors everywhere know. Past performance does not indicate future results. Never is that more evident than with Winter's team that ended 2011 and the one that started 2012.

Winter's 2011 end of season stretch is the same as Mariner's. Including a win on the Road in Columbus of all places and home victories against RSL and Colorado. He too had a healthy DK and TF which Mariner enjoyed over his 9 game stretch and endured a travel and mid-week schedule much worse than Mariner has had

Then injuries. Then the bottom fell out.

I stand corrected on the irony part, it is indeed a contradiction. I'd wager we are about to see whether history (ie. DK injuries) will repeat itself and whether Mariner will be given the same short leash.

[jrober38]

I stand corrected on the irony part, it is indeed a contradiction. I'd wager we are about to see whether history (ie. DK injuries) will repeat itself and whether Mariner will be given the same short leash.

If Mariner is smart, he'll sign a striker ASAP.

If he's not, he'll continue along with the plan to sign two CBs only to realize this team (and every other MLS team) is nothing without a reliable striker up front.

[T-boy]

I can't see into the future, nobody can! I can only observe on the past. We don't know what Mariner's future TFC will do. The fact remains that Winter's team got worse from 2011 to the start of 2012. I'm not saying that won't be the case from this point onwards under Mariner, although I don't think it will be. The team has obviously done better since Winter left. Some people are linking Koev's form to Mariner's team. Personally, I don't buy that, and I think a LOT of the players have improved vastly under Mariner. We now have the most unfortunate "gift" of knowing whether Koev's form is the key or not! Those of you who are saying its "all because of Koev's" will now find out if you are correct or not, right?! :(

[Beach_Red]

Where's the irony ? That 3-2-4 for 14 under PM is considered an accomplishment, while the same stats under Winter is considered a failure ? Well, that's not irony either - that's a contradiction.

No, it's not a contradiction, it's just not an exact comparison. It's like the old joke, the kid explaining Einstein to his grandfather and he says, "You know how spending ten minutes with a nagging shrill woman seems a lot longer than spending ten minutes with a pleasant beautiful woman? That's relativity," and the grandfather says, "From this, he makes a living?" (maybe you need Mel Brooks doing the accent...)

[jrober38]

I can't see into the future, nobody can! I can only observe on the past. We don't know what Mariner's future TFC will do. The fact remains that Winter's team got worse from 2011 to the start of 2012. I'm not saying that won't be the case from this point onwards under Mariner, although I don't think it will be. The team has obviously done better since Winter left. Some people are linking Koev's form to Mariner's team. Personally, I don't buy that, and I think a LOT of the players have improved vastly under Mariner. We now have the most unfortunate "gift" of knowing whether Koev's form is the key or not! Those of you who are saying its "all because of Koev's" will now find out if you are correct or not, right?! :(

How we looked after he got hurt was very reminiscent of how we looked early in the season, when we couldn't pass or keep hold of the ball. The only difference is we miraculously kept the ball out of our net this time. The issue is I'm not sure we'll be so fortunate going forward without any semblance of an offense to keep hold of the ball.

[T-boy]

How we looked after he got hurt was very reminiscent of how we looked early in the season, when we couldn't pass or keep hold of the ball. The only difference is we miraculously kept the ball out of our net this time. The issue is I'm not sure we'll be so fortunate going forward without any semblance of an offense to keep hold of the ball.

We shall see. I agree that Koev's holds the ball up well. Tomorrow's game will be very telling as to the effect of playing with/without Koev's.

[TOBOR !]

No, it's not a contradiction, it's just not an exact comparison. It's like the old joke, the kid explaining Einstein to his grandfather and he says, "You know how spending ten minutes with a nagging shrill woman seems a lot longer than spending ten minutes with a pleasant beautiful woman? That's relativity," and the grandfather says, "From this, he makes a living?" (maybe you need Mel Brooks doing the accent...)

Mel Brooks - lol... anyway, the contradiction lies within the conclusion : 3-2-4 = Bad / 3-2-4 = Good. Anyway - whatevs - let's move on.

[Canary10]

We shall see. I agree that Koev's holds the ball up well. Tomorrow's game will be very telling as to the effect of playing with/without Koev's.

The last 60 minutes against New England may be a preview of what's to come. I have to agree with the priority being a striker now - one that can also hold the ball up the way Koefs could. We need a new striker to save the defense!

[T-boy]

The last 60 minutes against New England may be a preview of what's to come. I have to agree with the priority being a striker now - one that can also hold the ball up the way Koefs could. We need a new striker to save the defense!

The last 60 in NE was very remeniscant of the second halfs against Houston (3-3) and at home to NE (2-2) and Koev's was playing for both of those games. So the last 60 in NE may not be that indicative of the Koev's effect.

[Canary10]

The last 60 in NE was very remeniscant of the second halfs against Houston (3-3) and at home to NE (2-2) and Koev's was playing for both of those games. So the last 60 in NE may not be that indicative of the Koev's effect.

Let's hope.

[Huyton]

Agreed. And like most seasons, there is early season congestion and the results even out over time. One game would swing the results (ie. a NE win would have essentially swapped our spots) at this point.

Ironically, guess what Aron Winter's MLS record was over the last 9 games to close out the 2011 MLS season?

3-2-4 for 13 points.



Aug 13 Salt Lake (H) ...1-0 ...W ...MLS
Aug 18 Tauro FC (a) ....1-2 ...W ...CCL
Aug 21 Chicago (a) .....2-0 ...L ...MLS
Aug 25 Dallas (h) ......0-1 ...L ...CCL
Aug 27 San Jose(h) .....1-1 ...T ...MLS
Sep 10 Columbus (a) ....4-2 ...W ...MLS
Sep 14 UNAM (a) ........4-0 ...L ...CCL
Sep 17 Colorado (h) ....2-1 ...W ...MLS
Sep 20 Tauro (h) .......1-0 ...W ...CCL
Sep 24 Chivas (a) ......3-0 ...L ...MLS
Sep 27 UNAM (h) ........1-1 ...T ...CCL
Oct 1 New York(h) .....1-1 ...T ...MLS
Oct 15 Philly (a) ......1-1 ...T ...MLS
Oct 18 Dallas (a) ......0-3 ...W ...CCL
Oct 22 New Eng (h) .....2-2 ...T ...MLS

Note the two weeks off for the international break between Oct 1 and the 15th. If you're going to count only the MLS games, then also note the first International break at the beginning of September.

All competitions: LWWLTTTLT: W2 L2 T5
MLS only: WLTWWLTTT: W3 L2 T4

[Pookie]

Aug 13 Salt Lake (H) ...1-0 ...W ...MLS
Aug 18 Tauro FC (a) ....1-2 ...W ...CCL
Aug 21 Chicago (a) .....2-0 ...L ...MLS
Aug 25 Dallas (h) ......0-1 ...L ...CCL
Aug 27 San Jose(h) .....1-1 ...T ...MLS
Sep 10 Columbus (a) ....4-2 ...W ...MLS
Sep 14 UNAM (a) ........4-0 ...L ...CCL
Sep 17 Colorado (h) ....2-1 ...W ...MLS
Sep 20 Tauro (h) .......1-0 ...W ...CCL
Sep 24 Chivas (a) ......3-0 ...L ...MLS
Sep 27 UNAM (h) ........1-1 ...T ...CCL
Oct 1 New York(h) .....1-1 ...T ...MLS
Oct 15 Philly (a) ......1-1 ...T ...MLS
Oct 18 Dallas (a) ......0-3 ...W ...CCL
Oct 22 New Eng (h) .....2-2 ...T ...MLS

Note the two weeks off for the international break between Oct 1 and the 15th. If you're going to count only the MLS games, then also note the first International break at the beginning of September.

All competitions: LWWLTTTLT: W2 L2 T5
MLS only: WLTWWLTTT: W3 L2 T4


Think you missed something there in all competitions. LWWLTTTWT That 2nd last one was a W in Dallas

3-2-4 sliced either way

[Gazza]

We're half way to being the greatest team in the world.

[69Chevy396]

We're half way to being the greatest team in the world.
What a bizarre thread. I suppose when you support the worst team in MLS history there aint much you can cheer about. The last time I checked the season lasts until October and good teams are measured at the conclusion, not the midway mark.
I have a suggestion. MLSE should be forced to refund ticket holders every time the club loses at home, then the tide will finally turn for this team.

[Huyton]

Think you missed something there in all competitions. LWWLTTTWT That 2nd last one was a W in Dallas

3-2-4 sliced either way

You're right. Sorry about that.

Last year was awful, though, wasn't it? In MLS play, from May 7th, when we won at home against Houston, to August 13th, when we beat Real Salt Lake at BMO field, we had just a single win - against Vancouver. That run of 16 games saw 1 win, 8 losses and 7 draws. No wonder we were optimistic going into 2012 after the horror of mid-summer.

And 39 different players who saw at least part of one game.

In both cases, after a horrible W1-L8-T7, and this years W1-L9-T0, a record of W3-L2-T4 looks good.

[123 elite]

The last 60 minutes against New England may be a preview of what's to come. I have to agree with the priority being a striker now - one that can also hold the ball up the way Koefs could. We need a new striker to save the defense!

The last 60 mins against new england was nothing to do with koevermans. They barely got it out of their half. They could have had Messi up there and it would have been the same

[Canary10]

The last 60 mins against new england was nothing to do with koevermans. They barely got it out of their half. They could have had Messi up there and it would have been the same

Yeah they did. They just couldn't keep it there.

[Shakes McQueen]

Where's the irony ? That 3-2-4 for 14 under PM is considered an accomplishment, while the same stats under Winter is considered a failure ? Well, that's not irony either - that's a contradiction.

Even then, it's only a contradiction if you considered Winter's last 9 games in the 2011 season to be a "failure", specifically. I don't think I've heard anyone make this point.

- Scott

[TOBOR !]

Even then, it's only a contradiction if you considered Winter's last 9 games in the 2011 season to be a "failure", specifically. I don't think I've heard anyone make this point.

- Scott

http://whoismicheleprice.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/dog-on-a-bone.jpg

It must have been implied somewhere. Perhaps in another thread if not this one.

[james]

Toronto Maple Leafs start the season ok, half way through they just turn to shit and lose everything. Toronto FC start bad and then become ok half way through the season. This is Toronto and either way you look at it...the teams still suck!