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ryan
05-24-2012, 06:49 AM
1) UANL Tigres - 3rd in Apetura Table, Won Playoffs vs Santos Laguna 4-1. 5th in Clausura Table, Lost in Semis to Santos Laguna 3-3 (higher seed wins a tie). 1st appearance in CCL.
2) Santos Laguna - 4th in Apetura Table, Lost in Final vs UANL 1-4. 1st in Clausura Table, Won Playoffs vs Monterrey 3-2. 4th appearance in CCL, Runners Up last year.
3) LA Galaxy - 1st in 2011 MLS Table, Won Championship vs Houston Dynamo 1-0. Currently 17th in 2012 MLS Table. 3rd appearance in CCL. Quarterfinals last year.
4) Seattle Sounders - 2nd in 2011 MLS Table, Lost in Quarterfinal vs Real Salt Lake 2-3. Currently 5th in 2012 MLS Table. 3rd appearance in CCL. Quarterfinals last year.



If you could pick your victim, who would it be? :D

Lucky Strike
05-24-2012, 06:51 AM
We always seem to play well against LA, plus they are struggling this year, so that's my rationale.

Oldtimer
05-24-2012, 07:07 AM
TFC can beat Becks and Co.

I'm sure that ML$E would prefer that matchup too, for obvious reasons $$$.

Fort York Redcoat
05-24-2012, 07:18 AM
Tigres

I always want to see a new team.

Ageroo
05-24-2012, 07:24 AM
Galaxy....they are struggling just like us.....and we have proven we can beat them.

james
05-24-2012, 08:05 AM
they don't want to play a mexican team. MLS clubs have a bad record against them!

ryan
05-24-2012, 08:26 AM
They all have intrigue...

Tigres would be a new opponent for us, they could perhaps not get the seriousness of the competition yet and we could take advantage?
Santos would generate some headlines, the rematch, with Frings this time, some bad blood from the Semi Final...much interest there.
LA clearly would want revenge for the Quarterfinal but are in poor form. I imagine they play better by the summer, but they just seem to be lacking.
Seattle would be a difficult one. We don't play well at Video Games Online Field, I think they are a club we just don't match up with well.

I wouldn't be afraid of a mexican club, we won't be afraid to go play there.

FIAF
05-24-2012, 08:34 AM
Why only those 4? These new groups are trash...

Both Tigres and Santos are quite good. Santos is the Mexican champion and Tigres has a good defence...and unlucky not to have beaten Santos. Sounders, we can never play well VS the xbox team. So LA Galaxy most definitely.

jaahuuu
05-24-2012, 08:49 AM
I think LA would be the easiest to handle, I'd like to see Tauro too, I missed the game against them last year.

ryan
05-24-2012, 09:13 AM
I wish the group stage was 4x4 instead of 8x3. I feel it'll be too short with 4 matches as opposed to 6.

Brooker
05-24-2012, 09:56 AM
Bring on the Galaxy!

prizby
05-24-2012, 11:06 AM
Galaxy...a hopefully over used landycakes and keane + becks away for the Olympics (whether he plays or not).

MartinUtd
05-24-2012, 11:31 AM
I want another shot at Santos Laguna.

ManUtd4ever
05-24-2012, 12:57 PM
I want revenge against Hercules Gomez.

ManUtd4ever
05-24-2012, 01:24 PM
Then again, facing Becks and the Gals never gets old...

http://nationalpostsports.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/0307beckham.jpg?w=620

TFC07
05-24-2012, 01:45 PM
It's worth noting that these Mexican teams will not be on season form since they will be coming back from a summer break. So it's best time to play against Mexican teams.

But on the hand beating MLS' favour team (L.A.) would be funny.

Yohan
05-24-2012, 01:49 PM
A Mexican team, because TFC can use all the experience, to be a better team.

kaiteng
05-24-2012, 07:52 PM
Galaxy would sell the best, followed by Santos Laguna, which Canadian soccer fans should know the name already. MLSE will love to have Galaxy, but I want something new i.e. Tigres.

Don Julio
05-25-2012, 09:03 AM
When's the game? Could Becks be at the Olympics?

Fort York Redcoat
05-25-2012, 09:40 AM
2012

JULY
31- August 2 Group Stage – Round 1

AUGUST
21-23 Group Stage – Round 2
28-30 Group Stage – Round 3

SEPTEMBER
18-20 Group Stage – Round 4
25-27 Group Stage – Round 5

OCTOBER
23-25 Group Stage – Round 6
2013

MARCH
5-7 Quarterfinals


Olympics go from July 26-Aug 11.

So yeah LA prolly don't want to play that first round date..

ryan
05-25-2012, 10:48 AM
I dont understand why 6 match dates for 4 games?

Roogsy
05-25-2012, 10:53 AM
I think it's a no-brainer. If we want to succeed and progress, it has to be LA, the team we have the best chances against. Especially given their current form.

Fort York Redcoat
05-25-2012, 10:58 AM
I dont understand why 6 match dates for 4 games?

I'd suggest to be flexible for clubs in other tournaments, leagues.

Greatest Ripoff
05-25-2012, 11:01 AM
Does anyone know when the draw for this is?

TOBOR !
05-25-2012, 12:16 PM
I want another shot at Santos Laguna.

This - only to play the full 180 minutes (instead of 135).

TOBOR !
05-25-2012, 12:18 PM
I dont understand why 6 match dates for 4 games?

4 teams per group = 6 games each (home and away against the other three teams).

Fort York Redcoat
05-25-2012, 12:22 PM
4 teams per group = 6 games each (home and away against the other three teams).

Your sense, it makes better.

Yohan
05-25-2012, 12:24 PM
4 teams per group = 6 games each (home and away against the other three teams).it's 3 teams in 8 groups now. so 4 games per team in 6 CCL matchdays during group stage

Dbl_D
05-25-2012, 12:27 PM
4 teams per group = 6 games each (home and away against the other three teams).
from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League)

"On January 12, 2012, CONCACAF announced that the 2012–13 tournament will be played under a different format than previous editions.[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League#cite_not e-format-4) The Preliminary Round will be eliminated, and all 24 teams are instead placed into eight groups of three teams each for the Group Stage of the tournament. For the Group Stage draw, the teams are seeded into three pots, based on their national association and qualifying berth. Teams from the same association (excluding "wildcard" teams which replace a team from another association) cannot be drawn with each other in the Group Stage, and each group is guaranteed to contain a team from either the United States or Mexico, meaning U.S. and Mexican teams will not play each other in the first round."

im still confused.. ;)

bigredone
05-25-2012, 12:41 PM
In whatever group we get drawn into, will that group also contain a Honduran/panamanian/salvadorian etc. team?

TOBOR !
05-25-2012, 12:57 PM
from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League)

"On January 12, 2012, CONCACAF announced that the 2012–13 tournament will be played under a different format than previous editions.[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012%E2%80%9313_CONCACAF_Champions_League#cite_not e-format-4) The Preliminary Round will be eliminated, and all 24 teams are instead placed into eight groups of three teams each for the Group Stage of the tournament. For the Group Stage draw, the teams are seeded into three pots, based on their national association and qualifying berth. Teams from the same association (excluding "wildcard" teams which replace a team from another association) cannot be drawn with each other in the Group Stage, and each group is guaranteed to contain a team from either the United States or Mexico, meaning U.S. and Mexican teams will not play each other in the first round."

im still confused.. ;)

Okay - in that case, three teams per group means 6 games in total : AvB, BvA, AvC, CvA, BvC, CvB

six rounds, but only one game from each group per round.

ryan
05-25-2012, 01:10 PM
Okay - in that case, three teams per group means 6 games in total : AvB, BvA, AvC, CvA, BvC, CvB

six rounds, but only one game from each group per round.

Derp derp. lol @ me not making the connection for all teams not being able to play at once...in a 3 team group.

MartinUtd
05-25-2012, 01:23 PM
Does anyone know when the draw takes place?

TOBOR !
05-25-2012, 02:17 PM
^ nah - but I bet if you check that Wiki link it's there.

LOL @ Ryan :D

edits - I wonder how much longer Canada will get only one berth, while El Sal gets 3, and Nic, Hon, etc. get two ?

Maybe there'll be 1/2 spots where Vancouver can play home and away against a Central AM outift to get in (I don't see another way for them, TBH).

Phil
05-25-2012, 02:33 PM
Then again, facing Becks and the Gals never gets old...

http://nationalpostsports.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/0307beckham.jpg?w=620

Anyone else find it funny that they LA played that game in their training jerseys?

Technorgasm
05-25-2012, 03:12 PM
Tigres.. new team. . new scalp for TFC to collect.
easy.

kodiakTFC
05-25-2012, 05:26 PM
LA. I love a full house.

Joe Kool
05-28-2012, 08:09 AM
I say whatever gets us to avoid playing at the Skydome. I want my BMO Field seat for these games.

bigredone
05-28-2012, 09:30 AM
I say whatever gets us to avoid playing at the Skydome. I want my BMO Field seat for these games.

Agreed, and I will proudly say - I FUCKEN LOVE BMO -

bigredone
05-28-2012, 09:37 AM
On June 11th there is a CONCACAF champions Team summit. Perhaps then. Last year the draw was near the end of May I think so perhaps with Euro and WCQ the powers that draw are busy this year.

Sorry, this is in response to the "when is the draw" question my MartinUtd. Anyone else have any info?

JamboAl
05-29-2012, 09:26 PM
According to the CONCACAF Champions League site, the draw is June 5th.

spe18
05-29-2012, 10:08 PM
Although this certainly won't happen, my choice would be:

Antigua Barracuda FC
W Connection
Real Esteli

This way, tfc would almost certainly move onto the next round :D

mdc 77
05-30-2012, 10:48 AM
Although this certainly won't happen, my choice would be:

Antigua Barracuda FC
W Connection
Real Esteli

This way, tfc would almost certainly move onto the next round :D

TFC will be in a group with 2 other teams. One of them will be Galaxy, Santos Laguna, UANL or Sounders. The other team will be from one of the weaker Central American or Caribbean clubs. Either way to move on TFC will have to win the group of 3 teams. Only the group winners move of the the round of 8.

Joe Kool
05-31-2012, 09:45 AM
I kind of hope we take on Santos Laguna right away because if we can't beat teams like that then the rest of the rounds are a waste of time and are a potential for injuries if we are just going to be beat out of the competition later on. It was nice though being the only MLS team in it last year for that short period of time even though all of MLS media and fans were saying we were going to blow it. I also would like to see a rematch with SL anyway to see if we can pull it out this time against them.

ryan
05-31-2012, 10:07 AM
I would guess that Mex clubs will take the group stage a bit less seriously than the knockout round so perhaps a point where we can take advantage. Also helps that they are in offseason while we're in high gear in MLS as opposed to the opposite for the knockouts.

Although, SL would probably want to play well vs us after last season. Perhaps Tigres might be a better choice, especially being their 1st venture into the tournament.

ryan
06-05-2012, 07:55 AM
FYI - Draw is in 2 hours

WestStandGeoff
06-05-2012, 09:05 AM
TFC will be in a group with 2 other teams. One of them will be Galaxy, Santos Laguna, UANL or Sounders. The other team will be from one of the weaker Central American or Caribbean clubs. Either way to move on TFC will have to win the group of 3 teams. Only the group winners move of the the round of 8.

Where are you getting this from? Only rule I see is about teams from the same country not facing each other in the first round, but nothing about TFC only being drawn against the US and Mexican teams from Pot A.

ryan
06-05-2012, 11:54 AM
Where are you getting this from? Only rule I see is about teams from the same country not facing each other in the first round, but nothing about TFC only being drawn against the US and Mexican teams from Pot A.

It comes from the fact that no Mexican and US side will be drawn together. Which with a bit of logical process, rules out us getting a non US/MEX Pot A team.

TFCBarrie
06-05-2012, 12:08 PM
We get Aguila and Santos - Confirmed.

http://www.concacaf.com/page/CL/NewsDetail/0,,12813~2798152,00.html

ManUtd4ever
06-05-2012, 12:12 PM
In the revised CCL format, only the group winners will advance to the knockout round. TFC will certainly have their work cut out for them this time around, but if history is any indication, anything is possible.




Group 1
Santos Laguna (MEX)
Toronto FC (CAN)
Aguila (SLV)

Group 2
Herediano (CRC)
Real Salt Lake (USA)
Tauro FC (PAN)

Group 3
Olimpia (HON)
Houston Dynamo (USA)
FAS (SLV)

Group 4
Seattle Sounders FC (USA)
Marathon (HON)
Caribbean 1

Group 5
LA Galaxy (USA)
Metapan (SLV)
Caribbean 3

Group 6
Tigres UANL (MEX)
Alajuelense (CRC)
Real Esteli (NIC)

Group 7
Chorillo (PAN)
Monterrey (MEX)
Municipal (GUA)

Group 8
Xelaju (GUA)
Chivas de Guadalajara (MEX)
Caribbean 2

ManUtd4ever
06-05-2012, 12:15 PM
On another note, the matches against Santos Laguna should be intense. It's great to have a quasi-rivalry in the CCL with a club outside MLS.

Detroit_TFC
06-05-2012, 12:19 PM
Brutal draw for us. But like Mr ManUtd4ever says, we got some history with them now. Still going to be extraordinarily difficult for us but the game atmosphere for those games should be excellent.

SirBobSaget
06-05-2012, 12:19 PM
I would really like to see the rationale (do they use coefficients??) behind allocation of berths.

El Salvador will be given 3 places again this year even though they have performed terribly recently in CONCACAF competition. El Salvador has only won 1 out of 6 prelim series, Canada has won 3 out of 4 of their prelim series. El Salvador only made it out of group stage 1 out of 4 attempts, Canada qualified out of groups 2 out of 3 times.


Here are some stats I have compiled comparing Canada vs El Salvador for last 4 competitions:


Places Given:
Canada 1 preliminary entry each competition,
total of 4

El Salvador total of 6 preliminary entries and allowed direct entry to group stage on 3 occasions,
total of 9


Record (W-D-L) for Prelim Round
Can 3-3-2 -> advancing 3 out of 4
ElS 2-5-5 -> advancing 1 out of 6


Record (W-D-L) for Group Round
Can 8-5-5 -> advancing 2 out of 3
ElS 4-4-14 -> advancing 1 out of 4

Record (W-D-L) for Knockout Rounds
Can 2-2-2 -> advancing 1 out of 3
ElS 0-1-1 -> advancing 0 out of 1

TOBOR !
06-05-2012, 12:27 PM
^ it probably has something to do with El Sal (and just about every other country in CONCACAF) having a National Professional League.

ManUtd4ever
06-05-2012, 12:28 PM
I would really like to see the rationale (do they use coefficients??) behind allocation of berths.

El Salvador will be given 3 places again this year even though they have performed terribly recently in CONCACAF competition. El Salvador has only won 1 out of 6 prelim series, Canada has won 3 out of 4 of their prelim series. El Salvador only made it out of group stage 1 out of 4 attempts, Canada qualified out of groups 2 out of 3 times.


Here are some stats I have compiled comparing Canada vs El Salvador for last 4 competitions:


Places Given:
Canada 1 preliminary entry each competition,
total of 4

El Salvador total of 6 preliminary entries and allowed direct entry to group stage on 3 occasions,
total of 9


Record (W-D-L) for Prelim Round
Can 3-3-2 -> advancing 3 out of 4
ElS 2-5-5 -> advancing 1 out of 6


Record (W-D-L) for Group Round
Can 8-5-5 -> advancing 2 out of 3
ElS 4-4-14 -> advancing 1 out of 4

Record (W-D-L) for Knockout Rounds
Can 2-2-2 -> advancing 1 out of 3
ElS 0-1-1 -> advancing 0 out of 1

It's a contentious issue that has been lamented many times within RPB Forums, and I agree that it seems unfair based on the results in the CCL since it's inception.

Unfortunately, unless the CSA expands the Voyageurs Cup tournament, Canada will not be granted more than one entry in the CCL with only 4-5 professional clubs represented within the country.

Furtado91
06-05-2012, 12:28 PM
so how will the matches work out with only 3 teams in each group. so if Toronto Fc faces Santos Laguna, Aguila will not be playing?

MartinUtd
06-05-2012, 12:29 PM
Sorry guys, I voted for Santos :D

ManUtd4ever
06-05-2012, 12:30 PM
so how will the matches work out with only 3 teams in each group. so if Toronto Fc faces Santos Laguna, Aguila will not be playing?

Exactly. Each club will play a total of four matches; two home, two away.

denime
06-05-2012, 12:32 PM
CCL SCHEDULE DATES FOR 2012

2012
JULY 31- August 2 Group Stage Round 1

AUGUST
21-23 Group Stage Round 2
28-30 Group Stage Round 3

SEPTEMBER
18-20 Group Stage Round 4
25-27 Group Stage Round 5

OCTOBER 23-25 Group Stage Round 6

Furtado91
06-05-2012, 12:37 PM
lets hope the 2nd match is at bmo against those diving cry babies santos laguna. DIG A HOLE AND BURY THEM.

Ryan1984
06-05-2012, 12:57 PM
wow the four american MLS teams got a nice draw funny how they all avoided mexican teams.

Oldtimer
06-05-2012, 01:00 PM
wow the four american MLS teams got a nice draw funny how they all avoided mexican teams.

Well, we wouldn't want to insinuate anything, because we know that everything is transparent and fair in CONCACRAP.

Yohan
06-05-2012, 01:02 PM
Well, we wouldn't want to insinuate anything, because we know that everything is transparent and fair in CONCACRAP.
Concacaf made it clear that mexican and american teams will not play each other in group stages

Oldtimer
06-05-2012, 01:04 PM
Concacaf made it clear that mexican and american teams will not play each other in group stages

it's all about the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

denime
06-05-2012, 01:05 PM
wow the four american MLS teams got a nice draw funny how they all avoided mexican teams.

They announced long time ago that no Mexican or American teams will be in the same group in the new format.


No team will be drawn into a group with a club from its own country, with the possible exception of CD FAS, a wildcard team which qualified in the berth allocated to Belize. Belize's berth was revoked because the country lacks a stadium that meets the tournament's minimum standard requirements. The teams from the United States and Mexico also will not face each other in the Group Stage.

http://www.concacafchampions.com/page/CL/NewsDetail/0,,12856~2797493,00.html

ryan
06-05-2012, 01:18 PM
Do you have a refernece to back that up? Only relevant rule I'm seeing is:



So it's completely possible for Seattle (Pot A) to be in the same group as Monterrey (Pot B), or for Santos (A) to be in the same group as RSL (B). Seattle just can't be grouped with RSL, and neither can Santos and Monterrey.

Unless you're suggesting some conspiracy at CONCACAF to make sure no US and Mexican teams match up in the group stage...


EDIT - moot point now that results are out

Just read the rules of the tourney mate. You can find those anywhere...it's fact.

SirBobSaget
06-05-2012, 01:21 PM
^ it probably has something to do with El Sal (and just about every other country in CONCACAF) having a National Professional League.

The Salvadoerean Primera Division is junk though. Only 10 teams and 6 of them play in stadiums with 10,000 or less capacity. The 3 Canadian MLS teams are better quality then any of their teams, FC Edmonton can probably hold their own as well.

So a 10 bad team league gets you 3 spots so that they can serve as group punching bags.
While having 3 quality teams that can consistently compete for knockout round competition gets you 1 spot.

ryan
06-05-2012, 01:22 PM
it's all about the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Then we should be a fuckin Pot A team.

Nobody outdrew our Rogers Centre showing and we'd pretty much have to play there in the QF if we made it, barring some unusually warm weather i guess?

Joe Kool
06-05-2012, 01:31 PM
I must have missed that little tidbit when I read about the changes to the format. What a load of crap that no American teams can play Mexican teams. Does anyone know if they ever gave a reasonable reason for this? (Besides the obvious conspiracy theory to make the American teams last longer in the competition to make more money). I agree with separating the teams from the same countries but can't think of a reason to separate US and Mexican teams. I guess they are trying to avoid creating a group of death or something. If so that is crap because that is all part of the draw.

TOBOR !
06-05-2012, 01:34 PM
The Salvadoerean Primera Division is junk though. Only 10 teams and 6 of them play in stadiums with 10,000 or less capacity. The 3 Canadian MLS teams are better quality then any of their teams, FC Edmonton can probably hold their own as well.

So a 10 bad team league gets you 3 spots so that they can serve as group punching bags.
While having 3 quality teams that can consistently compete for knockout round competition gets you 1 spot.

I don't disagree, but until we have a national league, we don't have a case.

Initial B
06-05-2012, 02:21 PM
You've got to be kidding me. How in the world did LA get such an easy drawing!?


What a load of crap that no American teams can play Mexican teams. Does anyone know if they ever gave a reasonable reason for this? ... I guess they are trying to avoid creating a group of death or something. If so that is crap because that is all part of the draw.
They did create a group of death - ours. You'd think the third team in our grouping would be a doormat, but instead it's the Salvadorean National Champions. CONCACAF is stacking the deck against TFC to make sure there is no repeat of this past year's run. I say screw them and prove them wrong.

MartinUtd
06-05-2012, 02:23 PM
Look at it this way, if we get out of this group we've already dropped the big dog in the tournament. I wouldn't want it any other way.

Oldtimer
06-05-2012, 02:26 PM
Then we should be a fuckin Pot A team.

Nobody outdrew our Rogers Centre showing and we'd pretty much have to play there in the QF if we made it, barring some unusually warm weather i guess?

A US team in the later stages will earn much more money on Mexican TV (and on Spanish language TV in the US) than a matchup against TFC. Who cares about gate revenue when you have TV revenue?



I must have missed that little tidbit when I read about the changes to the format. What a load of crap that no American teams can play Mexican teams. Does anyone know if they ever gave a reasonable reason for this? (Besides the obvious conspiracy theory to make the American teams last longer in the competition to make more money). I agree with separating the teams from the same countries but can't think of a reason to separate US and Mexican teams. I guess they are trying to avoid creating a group of death or something. If so that is crap because that is all part of the draw.

It's all setup for US vs Mexico semis and finals.



They did create a group of death - ours. You'd think the third team in our grouping would be a doormat, but instead it's the Salvadorean National Champions. CONCACAF is stacking the deck against TFC to make sure there is no repeat of this past year's run. I say screw them and prove them wrong.

Exactly. it's all about the $$$$$$$$.

GlenM
06-05-2012, 02:30 PM
We draw Santos

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2012/06/toronto-draws-santos-rematch

GlenM

Detroit_TFC
06-05-2012, 02:31 PM
This 3 team format is going to create a lot of bunker ball on the part of the B and C pot teams.

Roogsy
06-05-2012, 02:39 PM
I don't disagree, but until we have a national league, we don't have a case.

This. We can't really complain about our draw in this tourney when we are essentially backdooring our way in. Beggers can't be choosers.

Roogsy
06-05-2012, 02:42 PM
Group 1
Santos Laguna (MEX)
Toronto FC (CAN)
Aguila (SLV)
Group 2
Herediano (CRC)
Real Salt Lake (USA)
Tauro FC (PAN)
Group 3
Olimpia (HON)
Houston Dynamo (USA)
FAS (SLV)
Group 4
Seattle Sounders FC (USA)
Marathon (HON)
Caribbean 1
Group 5
LA Galaxy (USA)
Metapan (SLV)
Caribbean 3
Group 6
Tigres UANL (MEX)
Alajuelense (CRC)
Real Esteli (NIC)
Group 7
Chorillo (PAN)
Monterrey (MEX)
Municipal (GUA)
Group 8
Xelaju (GUA)
Chivas de Guadalajara (MEX)
Caribbean 2


TFC got by far the toughest draw of all MLS teams though. :eek:

RealG-TFC
06-05-2012, 03:32 PM
^^ Yeah, I would have liked group 6 but whatever... F*ckin santos. :(

SirBobSaget
06-05-2012, 03:39 PM
To further tilt the competition to favor Mexican clubs lets watch as they are given byes on MatchDay 1. Seeing how those dates are really early in their season.


Also why not just put the 8 USA+Mex teams in Pot A, would have made their arbitrary rules a lot less confusing.

prizby
06-05-2012, 04:10 PM
I would really like to see the rationale (do they use coefficients??) behind allocation of berths.

El Salvador will be given 3 places again this year even though they have performed terribly recently in CONCACAF competition. El Salvador has only won 1 out of 6 prelim series, Canada has won 3 out of 4 of their prelim series. El Salvador only made it out of group stage 1 out of 4 attempts, Canada qualified out of groups 2 out of 3 times.

They (CONCACAF) are replacing a Central American team with another Central American team...the rational is outside of the Mexican league (since 4 teams per confederation is the max), El Salavador had the highest placing team in the last edition of CCL (Isidro Metepan made the Q/F's).

prizby
06-05-2012, 04:30 PM
wouldnt mind have santos laguna on the road for the first match day since they'll be just out of preseason and then having them up here in October on the last match day when its cold up here and everything is on the line!

Fishnicker
06-05-2012, 04:36 PM
2 of last years semi finalists in the same group? And I thought last years was scary with Pumas and Dallas.

maxpower
06-05-2012, 05:14 PM
OFFS, who is in charge of seeding at concacaf? How the hell do panama, Honduras and Guatemala get first seeds?

ryan
06-05-2012, 05:28 PM
https://p.twimg.com/AuqD7YnCIAAZpEC.jpg:large


New CCL patch.

FIAF
06-05-2012, 05:29 PM
I must have missed that little tidbit when I read about the changes to the format. What a load of crap that no American teams can play Mexican teams. Does anyone know if they ever gave a reasonable reason for this? (Besides the obvious conspiracy theory to make the American teams last longer in the competition to make more money). I agree with separating the teams from the same countries but can't think of a reason to separate US and Mexican teams. I guess they are trying to avoid creating a group of death or something. If so that is crap because that is all part of the draw.

It's clearly to help the US teams. I detest Concacrap. An American made this group format :facepalm:

LesH
06-05-2012, 06:10 PM
Fuck this crap!
This is utter bullshit!

All 4 USA teams have incredibly weak groups, for all of them should be a walk in the park to qualify if they take in serious this mickey mouse competition!
Would have been for TFC a walk in the park too in those groups, no matter how bad we are!

Damn, why I'm so angry, why I care?
But just look at all the groups, this is the definition of "ridiculous".

ryan
06-05-2012, 07:23 PM
It's CORRUPTACAF, what else do you expect?

mowe
06-05-2012, 07:58 PM
All this has been known for months (TFC will be in the group of death, US avoids Mexico until the knockout stages). I'm fine with it, but hopefully next year the Canadian champion can be in Pot A, although that would make little difference (would still get one Mexican or US team).

As for the other MLS clubs, RSL and LA do not have easy groups either. Herediano are Costa Rican champions and Metapan made it to the quarterfinals last year. Houston and Seattle on the other hand should run all over their groups.

I like the new format because each game is hugely important. It's going to be a hell of a battle to get to the knockout stage, should be fun. Especially now that we get another chance at Santos. It's pretty much another two-legged tie to determine who moves on.

Initial B
06-06-2012, 09:52 AM
If I were the guy planning the draws, I think this would be the most logical groupings (WITH NO EXCEPTIONS!):

Pool 1:
4 MEX,
3 US (USOC winner, top US team in each MLS Conference at end of season)
1 MLS (Playoff Champion regardless of nationality)

Pool 2:
2 HON
2 GUA
2 CRC
2 PAN

Pool 3:
1 CAN (ACC Champ, ACC runner-up if ACC Champ is also MLS champ)
1 NIC
3 SLV
3 Carribean

This seems to meet the criteria for most of CONCACAF's desired outcomes. We just have to accept that no matter what happens, any team holding the Canadian spot is going to be the toughest group. But at least now we have the possibility of not facing off against mexican teams right off the bat (unless MLS sides are not allowed to play against each other, but as I said - no exceptions).

<Edit: Does anyone know how to contact the CONCACAF Clubs Committee? Their website has no email addresses for contacts.>

TOBOR !
06-06-2012, 10:02 AM
^ I like this - but change MEX to 3 and give the extra spot to the defending champ from previous year (which may be Mexican, giving them back their fourth spot).

Or, if, say, TFC were to have won it, and subsequently defeated Vancouver for the MLS Cup, you could end up with 3 Canadian teams in it.

habstfc
06-06-2012, 03:51 PM
This is laughable, imagine at this years euro's they decided england, spain, italy, france, and germany could not be in the same group.

joeyjones
06-06-2012, 05:01 PM
This is laughable, imagine at this years euro's they decided england, spain, italy, france, and germany could not be in the same group.

in the UEFA Champions League, how are the teams "seeded"?

maxpower
06-06-2012, 08:11 PM
I think that Canada really needs more than one seed. But the only thing holding us back is our lack of proper professional teams.

PAOK17
06-07-2012, 02:22 AM
in the UEFA Champions League, how are the teams "seeded"?
For those who don't quite understand the way UEFA CL works there is a very logical explanation.

In UEFA they use a coefficient system to both rank all of the clubs within UEFA and to rank the national leagues. The ranking of the clubs determines the seeding of the individual club in the competition and the ranking of the national league determines the number of entries from every country.

I'm going to first explain how the ranking of clubs works.

Every time a club plays in a UEFA competition (whether CL or Europa) regardless of the round (whether prelim, group stage or knockout) the team can gather "points" according to their performance in that match. A win for example (I am not exactly sure about the actual point system) can earn a club 1 point and a draw say 0.5 point. These points get added to a team's coefficient. Regardless of the point system, it is solely based on that club's performance in Europe and is a lot simpler than the FIFA rankings in that I don't believe it weighs competition "difficulty."

With these coefficients, every team is therefore ranked. Based on these rankings you know the seedings in preliminary rounds and the group stages. For example, when doing the group stage draw, the top 8 teams involved are put in Pot 1, the next 8 in Pot 2, and so on. Your national league's strength has no relevance to which pot a team will be placed. For example, Man United is usually in Pot 1 because of their strong play in CL NOT because the English league is considered a strong league. Likewise, Tottenham was placed in Pot 4 a few years ago because they really never actually played much in UEFA competition and therefore hadn't gathered enough coefficient points to be placed in a stronger pot. In other words, if by some miracle the EPL finished next year as 1. Stoke, 2. QPR, 3. Wigan, 4. Villa, there is a good chance that all for would be Pot 4 teams.

Now the National League coefficient depends only on the clubs' performances in all UEFA competition from that league. That is every time an English team wins in UEFA, England's coefficient goes up. There is no connection with the National Team at all. It is for this reason that England has more teams than say Netherlands. So like the individual clubs, national leagues are ranked and this determines the number of teams permitted from each league in the UEFA competitions. However, the national league's ranking has no influence on how the individual teams are seeded as mentioned above.

So having read that, I'm sure many here are probably annoyed at how CONCACAF can possibly function the way it does. Though 4 Mexican teams and 4 US teams sounds logical, the automatic seedings of teams based on where they are from is pretty ludicrous as it doesn't reward clubs that play well in the competition like UEFA does. Furthermore, yes we can argue that we only have one team since we play a four team competition, but that rule isn't explicitly stated by CONCACAF either. The seedings and the number of teams from each country still remains completely arbitrary which is unlike UEFA.

Lastly, 3 team groups is silly as we saw from the original Canadian championship. There is going to be so much match fixing in the last round.