PDA

View Full Version : Postgame: DC 2- TFC 0 (this should be interesting)



Pages : [1] 2

Batman
05-05-2012, 05:05 PM
here we go

jaxul
05-05-2012, 05:07 PM
I really have huge amounts of respect for those that continue to go to the stadium and sing all match long. I don't know how you do it but I can't. It has become a one way street. We are getting NOTHING back from the team.

ManUtd4ever
05-05-2012, 05:07 PM
What's left to be said that hasn't already been said?

Are there any MLS records of futility that TFC hasn't broken yet?

How much longer do we have to put up with this shite?

QSIM
05-05-2012, 05:09 PM
For a league that supposedly thrives on parity... we haven't fielded a competitive team in 6 years, and we haven't won a game this year. We are SHIT.

Richard
05-05-2012, 05:10 PM
I think the last major protest should have been about Anselmi and the whole MLSE executive staff, its the common denominator in the last 6 years.

volunteer
05-05-2012, 05:10 PM
dat sexy Ajax style football!!

also 0-8, TFC doesn't have to win any games and we can still break records like nobody's business!!

TFC!! TFC!! TFC!! TFC!! TFC!!

:scarf::scarf::drum:

tfcleeds
05-05-2012, 05:10 PM
Nothing more to say really that hasn't already been said in countless other postgame threads. Other than the fact we now own another MLS record! :facepalm:

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 05:11 PM
Sad , very sad and it looks like Frings will be out for a couple as well . Is it just me or doesn't Frings look to stiff and slow ? Can I go out on a limb and say that Frings will spend more time injured this season than games played ? Frings is to slow and to stiff . But seeing how we will be looking for a coach soon , perhaps we can give him that job ?

Batman
05-05-2012, 05:11 PM
I really have huge amounts of respect for those that continue to go to the stadium and sing all match long. I don't know how you do it but I can't. It has become a one way street. We are getting NOTHING back from the team.

I completely agree.. it's almost to the point of being embarrassing to be a supporter. We've been abused so much I can't even sit anymore.

boozilla
05-05-2012, 05:11 PM
The Vaseline giveaway at the stadium sums it up.

TFCRegina
05-05-2012, 05:12 PM
More bureaucracy than a government department.
Some of the highest ticket prices in the league.
Continued leadership or lackthereof from Day 1 staff that hold all the power.
Increasingly disappointed fanbase
No internal will to make real changes

That's all I can really say.

I can't blame the players, can't even blame Winter.

You could hire Jose Mourinho and this team wouldn't make playoffs.

Leadership starts at the top, not in the manager position, but the president's or chairman's position.

ag futbol
05-05-2012, 05:13 PM
dat sexy Ajax style football!!

also 0-8, TFC doesn't have to win any games and we can still break records like nobody's business!!

TFC!! TFC!! TFC!! TFC!! TFC!!

:scarf::scarf::drum:
There are only two things that I hate, people that are intolerant of other people's cultures and the dutch!

QJ882QYzr-M

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 05:13 PM
What's left to be said that hasn't already been said?

Are there any MLS records of futility that TFC hasn't broken yet?

How much longer do we have to put up with this shite?

I think the question is, do they wait till the inevitable loss in the rematch in DC to fire Winter?
cuz whoever the new coach ends up being, he would have a near impossible task starting on a winning note in DC

Soccerpro
05-05-2012, 05:14 PM
Tough for spot MLSE. They came into the season promising stability and claiming the merry-go-round days were over.

Winter and co. didn't do enough in the off season to fix this team. The CB problem was never dealt with properly. They overpaid to get Plata back. Their two DP superstars are showing their age by being constantly injured. JDG sucks. The young players suddenly don't look ready this year. No one on the team can score.

I don't know how to fix this.

Do MLSE admit that Winter is the next Ruud Guillit like Alan Gordon claimed?
Do they ship him out and give the reigns to Mariner to end the backroom power struggle that's been widly reported?

What a mess. What's clear is this season is over and yet again they need a "new direction" for next year.

ManUtd4ever
05-05-2012, 05:15 PM
I truly hope that a new/interim coach is on the sidelines on Wednesday, if for no other reason than to energize the club. The CCL is our only hope now that the regular season is officially a write off.

Raging Reggie
05-05-2012, 05:15 PM
All i wanna know is if Trane threw his kit on the pitch..........

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 05:16 PM
Go Vancover ?

Nestease
05-05-2012, 05:19 PM
They overpaid to get Plata back.


Care to share how much he is getting paid this season?

Batman
05-05-2012, 05:19 PM
I think the last major protest should have been about Anselmi and the whole MLSE executive staff, its the common denominator in the last 6 years.

Definitely Anselmi..not sure if Paul Bierne should go because he has nothing to do with the on field product.... but definitely Anselmi should bare responsibility of two disaster football operations on his watch.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but last week when interviewed, Anselmi speaking about Winter and the problems etc. said "they'll" have to fix this.

Note the word "they" vs. "we". Interesting turn of phrase Tom.. I guess it isn't your responsibility, huh.

[NBF]
05-05-2012, 05:21 PM
For a league that supposedly thrives on parity... we haven't fielded a competitive team in 6 years, and we haven't won a game this year. We are SHIT.Exactly, all the other teams have improved and its like TFC dont have to compete against them every year. They never evaluate the players correctly. Like you said, in a league where you literally dont have to scout to build depth(because of the MLS Draft) they can't even find enough players that can play at the MLS level.

Richard
05-05-2012, 05:21 PM
Care to share how much he is getting paid this season?

I dont have the link but it was said to be 500k fee to bring him hear(not salary).

Edit: Here is the link http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?3138-Plata-s-transfer-fee

Cashcleaner
05-05-2012, 05:22 PM
Here ya go, Mr. Winter. All your luggage packed and ready to go. Did a bit of a clean up of your old apartment as well. You'll find your tickets in the small black carry-on bag. It...ummm...well it's there somewhere. Anyway, have a good flight and be sure to send me a postcard when you land at Schiphol.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_0U0GxScN0aQ/TRynjE95ILI/AAAAAAAABeU/BZNWxw4Dy1g/s1600/pile%2Bof%2Bluggage.jpg

Now, as for you Mr. Anselmi...

Soccerpro
05-05-2012, 05:25 PM
Care to share how much he is getting paid this season?

500k to sign him. It's been in a ton of recent media articles lately.

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 05:27 PM
Plata never has less then 3 touches. But, he has a bad 3rd touch and when he occasionally doesn't, his 4th touch will definitely let him down.

Running after the defender who now has the ball is Plata's version of a 5th touch.

He can't cross and he won't pass.

Nestease
05-05-2012, 05:29 PM
I dont have the link but it was said to be 500k fee to bring him hear(not salary).

MLSE can afford it. What matters is what counts against the cap. I think some of you think this guy is making 100+ this season, because he is not. Even after his new contract, he is still one of the lowest paid players on this team. It will all come out when the salaries are disclosed.

Couchy81
05-05-2012, 05:29 PM
I really have huge amounts of respect for those that continue to go to the stadium and sing all match long. I don't know how you do it but I can't. It has become a one way street. We are getting NOTHING back from the team.

That's exactly how I felt after the Chicago game, and for me that was my last game I will attend this season until something big happens, not simply firing Winter. He will be the scapegoat and again people will get hope that something will be different after all these years, when in fact it is MLSE that is the problem, not the many coaches who have tried to turn this team around. It is not a coincidence all the coaches have failed.

Richard
05-05-2012, 05:30 PM
MLSE can afford it. What matters is what counts against the cap. I think some of you think this guy is making 100+ this season, because he is not. Even after his new contract, he is still one of the lowest paid players on this team. It will all come out when the salaries are disclosed.

Transfer fees count towards the cap actually, in this case its spread out over the length of the contract.

bones
05-05-2012, 05:32 PM
Something has to change. The coach has to understand that every time he shuffles different players into the same system it results into, well, the same bad result. I'm sure after years of development through a youth system and several major type promotions from the youth system into the first team having played that way for years, THEN we'll be able to attempt to run with this style. But asking MLS quality players to play a system they've practically never done and roughly only 2 players (both hurt) having grown up with it, just isn't working. You'd think that Mariner would have a chat to say "hey buddy, try something a weee bit different next time". Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

Jack
05-05-2012, 05:32 PM
I've got nothing left. 0-8...

The playoff promise is laughable. The man is deluded.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 05:33 PM
That's exactly how I felt after the Chicago game, and for me that was my last game I will attend this season until something big happens, not simply firing Winter. He will be the scapegoat and again people will get hope that something will be different after all these years, when in fact it is MLSE that is the problem, not the many coaches who have tried to turn this team around. It is not a coincidence all the coaches have failed.

Anselmi aint going anywhere,MLSE has big plans for him,he may get Peddie's job.

Cashcleaner
05-05-2012, 05:34 PM
That's exactly how I felt after the Chicago game, and for me that was my last game I will attend this season until something big happens, not simply firing Winter. He will be the scapegoat and again people will get hope that something will be different after all these years, when in fact it is MLSE that is the problem, not the many coaches who have tried to turn this team around. It is not a coincidence all the coaches have failed.

But it's not like we can call for MLSE's collective resignation. The one person who bears the responsibility for TFC's misfortune time and time again is Tom Anselmi. I do not believe we can prosper as a team as long as he is in charge. I have no doubt that he will always remain a part of MLSE in some executive capacity, but we need this club to have a DEDICATED and EXPERIENCE President in charge.

sashavukelich
05-05-2012, 05:35 PM
Thomas Rogen in. 'nuff said.

Winter has absolutely lost the plot.

boban
05-05-2012, 05:35 PM
That's exactly how I felt after the Chicago game, and for me that was my last game I will attend this season until something big happens, not simply firing Winter. He will be the scapegoat and again people will get hope that something will be different after all these years, when in fact it is MLSE that is the problem, not the many coaches who have tried to turn this team around. It is not a coincidence all the coaches have failed.
Well said.
:cheers:

And all this constant talk of firing Winter is :deadhorse:. Firing him is treating the symptom, while the disease, problem, issue (whatever) persists.

Redcoe15
05-05-2012, 05:35 PM
More bureaucracy than a government department.
Some of the highest ticket prices in the league.
Continued leadership or lackthereof from Day 1 staff that hold all the power.
Increasingly disappointed fanbase
No internal will to make real changes

That's all I can really say.

I can't blame the players, can't even blame Winter.

You could hire Jose Mourinho and this team wouldn't make playoffs.

Leadership starts at the top, not in the manager position, but the president's or chairman's position.

THIS!!! THIS!!! A thousand times THIS!!!

bones
05-05-2012, 05:35 PM
Anselmi aint going anywhere,MLSE has big plans for him,he may get Peddie's job.


Not if Belgers has anything to do with it. Remember the organ grinder isn't in control of the show now, the monkey is driving that bitch!

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 05:38 PM
But it's not like we can call for MLSE's collective resignation. The one person who bears the responsibility for TFC's misfortune time and time again is Tom Anselmi. I do not believe we can prosper as a team as long as he is in charge. I have no doubt that he will always remain a part of MLSE in some executive capacity, but we need this club to have a DEDICATED and EXPERIENCE President in charge.

If anything, Anselmi gets removed from TFC management.MLSE will not fire him

ag futbol
05-05-2012, 05:39 PM
I have to question what MLSE is going to do in the future to improve on past results. They've milked every franchise they own to the n'th degree.

Basically they have to buy an NFL team now to find more suckers, otherwise they've milked the cow dry.

TFC USA
05-05-2012, 05:40 PM
Excellent showing. We only lost 2-0, didn't let Dero score, and created chances.

Winter will turn things around and we will go 26-0-8. Fucking elite coach that man is.

I'm as happy as can be!!!!!

Plonk. We suck. If you suggest otherwise or even suggest we keep the status quo I will accuse you of being an MLSE plant. I'm not even joking.

Another awful showing.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 05:41 PM
Not if Belgers has anything to do with it. Remember the organ grinder isn't in control of the show now, the monkey is driving that bitch!


Excellent point, all bets are off after the sale is complete

Brooker
05-05-2012, 05:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrrch43CweU

T-boy
05-05-2012, 05:42 PM
Dear MLSE.

I am a season ticket holder in section 113. I have been a season ticket holder since year one. I am embarrassed and humiliated that my football team now owns the record of the worst start to any MLS season. I demand that Aron winter be removed from his position of Head Coach of my football team immediately. I will NOT attend another TFC home game this season until he is removed.

Sincerely,
R Morris.

Sally Mack
05-05-2012, 05:46 PM
Definitely Anselmi..not sure if Paul Bierne should go because he has nothing to do with the on field product.... but definitely Anselmi should bare responsibility of two disaster football operations on his watch.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but last week when interviewed, Anselmi speaking about Winter and the problems etc. said "they'll" have to fix this.

Note the word "they" vs. "we". Interesting turn of phrase Tom.. I guess it isn't your responsibility, huh.

In the town hall, when we asked who would be held responsible if we didn't succeed, Beirne admitted it would be him. I doubt Beirne will take any accountability for this mess, even though he loved posing with klinsmann for photos.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 05:46 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrrch43CweU

Not "bits and pieces?

sashavukelich
05-05-2012, 05:47 PM
What coaches are available now in MLS?

1) denis Hamett (coached Chicago)
2) Preki? (??)
3) Teitur THoradson? (van?)

Ajax TFC
05-05-2012, 05:49 PM
There are only two things that I hate, people that are intolerant of other people's cultures and the dutch!

hey, hey, be nice. And stop hating yourself :D

Toronto_Bhoy
05-05-2012, 05:55 PM
So when Jerkun recommended Winter for the job, I asked "Who do we blame when we can't acquire the talent to play 'Total Football' and it all ends in tears"?

I'll ask again, "Who do we blame?"

rocker
05-05-2012, 05:55 PM
What coaches are available now in MLS?

1) denis Hamett (coached Chicago)
2) Preki? (??)
3) Teitur THoradson? (van?)

Hamlett sucks. He just inherited a good Chicago team.

Nicol or Rongen are the only ones I can think of that had some success at some point in this league and are available (without tampering, the way Seattle tampered with Columbus to get Sigi). Anyone else is taking another chance.

TFCRegina
05-05-2012, 05:57 PM
So when Jerkun recommended Winter for the job, I asked "Who do we blame when we can't acquire the talent to play 'Total Football' and it all ends in tears"?

I'll ask again, "Who do we blame?"

Only one person to blame. And he's been at TFC since day 1, providing a leadership vacuum that has allowed this environment of futility to foster itself.

jloome
05-05-2012, 05:57 PM
Hamlett sucks. He just inherited a good Chicago team.

Nicol or Rongen are the only ones I can think of that had some success at some point in this league. Anyone else is taking another chance.

Rongen was 1-9 and fired in his last chance as head coach at Chivas, and hasn't had a winning season in MLS in 13 years. Nicol's teams were on the decline steadily in New England. Both are yesterday's coach.

T-boy
05-05-2012, 05:58 PM
So when Jerkun recommended Winter for the job, I asked "Who do we blame when we can't acquire the talent to play 'Total Football' and it all ends in tears"?

I'll ask again, "Who do we blame?"

I'm not sure why people are obssessing about "who to blame" for hiring Winter.

I've said before, football teams usually go through many different managers until they find the right now. Winter ISNT the right one, so he needs to go. It's as simple as that! Nothing else has to change other than winter needs to be removed from his position.

denime
05-05-2012, 05:59 PM
Rongen was 1-9 and fired in his last chance as head coach at Chivas, and hasn't had a winning season in MLS in 13 years. Nicol's teams were on the decline steadily in New England. Both are yesterday's coach.

and both are already on TFC pay list.

ag futbol
05-05-2012, 06:01 PM
and both are already on TFC pay list.
What are you saying here? is that a typo or do you know something we don't?

sashavukelich
05-05-2012, 06:02 PM
Hamlett sucks. He just inherited a good Chicago team.

Nicol or Rongen are the only ones I can think of that had some success at some point in this league and are available (without tampering, the way Seattle tampered with Columbus to get Sigi). Anyone else is taking another chance.

Solid Rocker, but why not Tamper? I don't get why we just don't play dirty and offer the best MLS coach a yacht full of money??? It's not like that has anything to do with the cap, it's really our only leverage at this point.

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 06:02 PM
I really have huge amounts of respect for those that continue to go to the stadium and sing all match long. I don't know how you do it but I can't. It has become a one way street. We are getting NOTHING back from the team.

Should you though? I know this is a "supporters" website, but really, the people still going down and chanting for this team, getting behind the team week in, week out, might they be a part of the problem?

Everybody wants to come up with a creative, meaningful "protest" to try and illicit change with this team, apparently oblivious to the fact that the most effective "protest" anybody can do is to simply not go.

Maybe "respect", isn't really what you should hold for those people. Pity, annoyance, befuddlement...all feelings I think might be a little more apropos to hold towards those poor souls still making the sludge down to BMO to suffer through the alleged "football" being played down there.

Anybody still going down to BMO is part of the problem. They're part of the reason this team never improves. I know people feel it makes them "better" fans, but Leaf fans have been doing this for decades, and where has it gotten them?

denime
05-05-2012, 06:03 PM
What are you saying here? is that a typo or do you know something we don't?

No it is not a typo,it is an info from US.

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 06:06 PM
Should you though? I know this is a "supporters" website, but really, the people still going down and chanting for this team, getting behind the team week in, week out, might they be a part of the problem?

Everybody wants to come up with a creative, meaningful "protest" to try and illicit change with this team, apparently oblivious to the fact that the most effective "protest" anybody can do is to simply not go.

Maybe "respect", isn't really what you should hold for those people. Pity, annoyance, befuddlement...all feelings I think might be a little more apropos to hold towards those poor souls still making the sludge down to BMO to suffer through the alleged "football" being played down there.

Anybody still going down to BMO is part of the problem. They're part of the reason this team never improves. I know people feel it makes them "better" fans, but Leaf fans have been doing this for decades, and where has it gotten them?

Have you forgotten that this is Toronto ? Remember the Leafs and there ticket sales ?

123 elite
05-05-2012, 06:08 PM
Should you though? I know this is a "supporters" website, but really, the people still going down and chanting for this team, getting behind the team week in, week out, might they be a part of the problem?

Everybody wants to come up with a creative, meaningful "protest" to try and illicit change with this team, apparently oblivious to the fact that the most effective "protest" anybody can do is to simply not go.

Maybe "respect", isn't really what you should hold for those people. Pity, annoyance, befuddlement...all feelings I think might be a little more apropos to hold towards those poor souls still making the sludge down to BMO to suffer through the alleged "football" being played down there.

Anybody still going down to BMO is part of the problem. They're part of the reason this team never improves. I know people feel it makes them "better" fans, but Leaf fans have been doing this for decades, and where has it gotten them?

How exactly is wanting to watch a live football match in your own city being part of the problem? The problem is the management, the players and whetever is going on in the background. Its the same shit show whether its full or empty and has been since day 1. See last years morning rematch against Dallas for proof of an empty stadium not making any difference to a performance

Shakes McQueen
05-05-2012, 06:10 PM
Hey look, we lost another game. It's safe to say I probably won't be watching the next one.

- Scott

TorontoGooner
05-05-2012, 06:10 PM
I have re-written this message 5 times for fear of being removed from this forum. This is diplomatic as I can be:

Though some may consider it admirable to sing the entire 90 minutes, it just makes us look foolish and delivers no message to the players what so ever. There is a difference between loyal and being gullible. TFC have a great core support, such as the RPB's, NEE and U-Sector, but sadly its the 18000 odd other seats in the stadium that need selling. Continuing to sing just gives the MLSE more marketing power and a false sense that everything is ok.

I was sorely disappointed that there was nothing the way of a protest or any kind of hostility at the end of today's game. Everyone just packed up their things, grumbled, and walked away. That's not being a real football fan, that's being weak. I saw no passion from anyone really, and discussing throwing a shirt on to the pitch a week in advance kind of loses its spontaneity, and thus message, in the end. As a player, I would get the impression that no one gives a shit.

Two things need to happen. First, stop singing and applauding the players when they lose. And secondly, start congregating around the main stand after the game and give anyone on the MLSE payroll dog's abuse as they leave. I know this is Canada but can we at least show some aggression to get something done.

8 straight loses is inexcusable, pathetic and frankly, embarrassing. They don't deserve my support, your support or any loyal supporter who spends their hard earned money week in, week out. I won't be returning for a long time. Shove it, MLSE. And keep up the good work RPBs, you deserve more than this shit.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 06:12 PM
Should you though? I know this is a "supporters" website, but really, the people still going down and chanting for this team, getting behind the team week in, week out, might they be a part of the problem?

Everybody wants to come up with a creative, meaningful "protest" to try and illicit change with this team, apparently oblivious to the fact that the most effective "protest" anybody can do is to simply not go.

Maybe "respect", isn't really what you should hold for those people. Pity, annoyance, befuddlement...all feelings I think might be a little more apropos to hold towards those poor souls still making the sludge down to BMO to suffer through the alleged "football" being played down there.

Anybody still going down to BMO is part of the problem. They're part of the reason this team never improves. I know people feel it makes them "better" fans, but Leaf fans have been doing this for decades, and where has it gotten them?

What amazes me is how the legit media have not made anyone in management accountable.No radio or tv interviews asking WTF?
I have seen some stories in the newspaper, but The Fan basically ignores them

SoccMan
05-05-2012, 06:12 PM
The problem started when MLSE with people who did not know the difference between the MLS( the soccer league) and MLS( the real estate association) thought they could operate a soccer club. Somehow off the field they got lucky by putting people in the seats which they did as good as any team in the league,however, on the field was a different story and since day one the on field product has sucked until reaching rock bottom which is where we are at today.

nimamalek
05-05-2012, 06:12 PM
No beer no gear til the playoffs are here! Drink before the game and stop buying shitty over priced gear

nimamalek
05-05-2012, 06:15 PM
I have re-written this message 5 times for fear of being removed from this forum. This is diplomatic as I can be:

Though some may consider it admirable to sing the entire 90 minutes, it just makes us look foolish and delivers no message to the players what so ever. There is a difference between loyal and being gullible. TFC have a great core support, such as the RPB's, NEE and U-Sector, but sadly its the 18000 odd other seats in the stadium that need selling. Continuing to sing just gives the MLSE more marketing power and a false sense that everything is ok.

I was sorely disappointed that there was nothing the way of a protest or any kind of hostility at the end of today's game. Everyone just packed up their things, grumbled, and walked away. That's not being a real football fan, that's being weak. I saw no passion from anyone really, and discussing throwing a shirt on to the pitch a week in advance kind of loses its spontaneity, and thus message, in the end. As a player, I would get the impression that no one gives a shit.

Two things need to happen. First, stop singing and applauding the players when they lose. And secondly, start congregating around the main stand after the game and give anyone on the MLSE payroll dog's abuse as they leave. I know this is Canada but can we at least show some aggression to get something done.

8 straight loses is inexcusable, pathetic and frankly, embarrassing. They don't deserve my support, your support or any loyal supporter who spends their hard earned money week in, week out. I won't be returning for a long time. Shove it, MLSE. And keep up the good work RPBs, you deserve more than this shit.

I think supporter groups are part of the problem they keep eating the shit they're given

JackBauer24
05-05-2012, 06:15 PM
We should really go for the Canadian Championship, clearly we can't do this MLS thing.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 06:18 PM
The problem started when MLSE with people who did not know the difference between the MLS( the soccer league) and MLS( the real estate association) thought they could operate a soccer club. Somehow off the field they got lucky by putting people in the seats which they did as good as any team in the league,however, on the field was a different story and since day one the on field product has sucked until reaching rock bottom which is where we are at today.

MLSE are masterful at everything but actually fielding competant teams.

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 06:18 PM
How exactly is wanting to watch a live football match in your own city being part of the problem? The problem is the management, the players and whetever is going on in the background. Its the same shit show whether its full or empty and has been since day 1. See last years morning rematch against Dallas for proof of an empty stadium not making any difference to a performance

Its not about the on-field performance. In fact it is specifically about off-field performance.

Of course your presence, or lack thereof, doesn't make a difference to the players, but it sure as shit makes a difference to the suits. And the suits (i.e. the sleazebag Anselmi) are who need to be sent a message. Putting effort into a nice protest TIFO doesn't send any message to Anselmi other than "we still care, we are still here spending money".

In the same way Leaf fans who continue to fight over season ticket scraps have contributed to 45 years of futility, TFC fans who show up week after week regardless of how many YEARS of futility they witness, are part of the reason things don't change.

SoccMan
05-05-2012, 06:18 PM
The mainstream media does not care, TFC is the last thing they care about. Classic example, the Fan 590 did the game today, no pregame nothing, and as soon as the final whistle sounded that was it no kind of after game talk nothing. They went right to their regular Saturday afternoon guy who mentioned a few words about the game and that was it, he went back to talking about every other topic but TFC.

gracos
05-05-2012, 06:20 PM
Its is obvious that if we keep a revolving door of coaches, that we obviously dont know what is expected from the club, we know that the coach is not the start of the problems, so we have to start even higher, and its by getting Anselmi to retire than we might be better off

TFCknw
05-05-2012, 06:20 PM
I wouldn't blame the supporters. In fact, it has gone totally downhill. There were people actually sitting in 112 today. I didn't recognize many people in that section. There is nothing to cheer for, period.

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 06:21 PM
MLSE are masterful at everything but actually fielding competant teams.

Now, now, don't exaggerate, the Marlies are in the playoffs! :D

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 06:23 PM
What amazes me is how the legit media have not made anyone in management accountable.No radio or tv interviews asking WTF?
I have seen some stories in the newspaper, but The Fan basically ignores them

The closest we ever get to that is Anselmi having a friendly chat with Bob Macown where he fields bunch of softball questions about the Leafs and Bob might ask one soccer question, completely tongue in cheek.

I haven't spent a dime on TFC since the day I heard Anselmi on with McCown, and when McCown asked Anselmi is they would be discounting tickets for a friendly because it was going to be, essentially the TFC academy playing, Anselmi just chuckled.

If you are still spending money on this team, Anselmi is literally laughing at you.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 06:23 PM
I wonder when Winter's pressor will be posted

Couchy81
05-05-2012, 06:25 PM
If the media blew this up to Leaf levels none of the casuals would be going to games, it's the lack of media coverage keeping the team in business to this day. Not the supporter groups.

denime
05-05-2012, 06:27 PM
I wonder when Winter's pressor will be posted

on tfc site:
RELATED: Postgame interviews to come

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 06:27 PM
The closest we ever get to that is Anselmi having a friendly chat with Bob Macown where he fields bunch of softball questions about the Leafs and Bob might ask one soccer question, completely tongue in cheek.

I haven't spent a dime on TFC since the day I heard Anselmi on with McCown, and when McCown asked Anselmi is they would be discounting tickets for a friendly because it was going to be, essentially the TFC academy playing, Anselmi just chuckled.

If you are still spending money on this team, Anselmi is literally laughing at you.

He's not laughing at me.I have watched every single game televised since day 1.I was ready to make the jump and attend games this year.......

etro
05-05-2012, 06:28 PM
I want my money back.

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 06:28 PM
So, if denime's sources are correct, Winter will be out pretty soon. We will be seeing either Nicol/Mariner, or Rongen/Mariner. A logical move, as obviously removing Winter is a first step when things go this badly.

It may not solve the root problems with this club, so more pruning will probably be needed. However, Toronto sporting culture being what it is, if TFC can achieve comfortable mediocrity (reaching the playoffs), the average schmuck will be satisfied. After all, they don't take TFC all that seriously, but do want to be entertained. 0-8 is not entertaining.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 06:32 PM
Does Dr Evil stick around?

MG42
05-05-2012, 06:35 PM
The Vaseline giveaway at the stadium sums it up.

Seriously could anyone even believe that? This team is too much lol

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 06:37 PM
CTV Toronto ‏ @CTVToronto (https://twitter.com/#%21/CTVToronto) Is it still news to report that Toronto FC lost again? Anyway, they lost 2-0 to D.C. today.

:lol:

They're a laughing stock.


Seriously could anyone even believe that? This team is too much lol

Wait, the Vaseline giveaway was real?!

:lol:

Couchy81
05-05-2012, 06:39 PM
http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/images/styles/AnimatedArena/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by boozilla http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/images/styles/AnimatedArena/buttons/viewpost-right.png
(http://redpatchboys.ca/forums/showthread.php?p=1484680#post1484680)The Vaseline giveaway at the stadium sums it up.

Seriously could anyone even believe that? This team is too much lol

It sounds like a freaking inside joke for MLSE.....

denime
05-05-2012, 06:44 PM
It sounds like a freaking inside joke for MLSE.....

it really does,TFC Fan:sheep:ML$E

It hurts less with Nivea Vaseline for man!

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 06:45 PM
Are there any MLS records of futility that TFC hasn't broken yet?



Goal-less streak crossing two seasons. That record is still held by the pre-Kreis RSL, and probably won't be broken, even by TFC.

So even the coaches of other teams are saying that our team is too talented to be 0-8, so obviously it's not the players who are the problem (even if our defense is poor).

denime
05-05-2012, 06:46 PM
AND HERE WE GO,Winters post game : http://www.torontofc.ca/video/2012/05/05/aron-winter-may-5-2012

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 06:49 PM
AND HERE WE GO,Winters post game : http://www.torontofc.ca/video/2012/05/05/aron-winter-may-5-2012

Winter has that same "deer in the headlights" look that Preki had just before he was canned.

TorontoGooner
05-05-2012, 06:50 PM
Sorry, I was either dreaming or I missed it today, but were they actually handing out free vaseline today?!

MG42
05-05-2012, 06:50 PM
Sorry, I was either dreaming or I missed it today, but were they actually handing out free vaseline today?!

Yes.

TorontoGooner
05-05-2012, 06:52 PM
Yes.

Oh, FOR FUCK'S SAKE. THAT'S IT FOR ME. WE REALLY ARE A FUCKING JOKE.

It's almost as if the MLSE are having a laugh at us. Scrap that, the fuckers are having a laugh at us.

denime
05-05-2012, 06:52 PM
Sorry, I was either dreaming or I missed it today, but were they actually handing out free vaseline today?!

Last 3 home games,not only today.

http://homedales.co.uk/wp-content/themes/shopperpress/thumbs/Vaseline_Men_Refreshing_Oil_Control_FaceWash_100g_ 3pack.jpg

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 06:54 PM
Oh, FOR FUCK'S SAKE. THAT'S IT FOR ME. WE REALLY ARE A FUCKING JOKE.

It's almost as if the MLSE are having a laugh at us. Scrap that, the fuckers are having a laugh at us.

They have been for years. Search for any of Tom Anselmi's appearances on Prime Time Sports. The man is literally laughing at TFC fans.

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 06:59 PM
Winter has that same "deer in the headlights" look that Preki had just before he was canned.

Oh god , I just can't watch his post game interviews :(

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:01 PM
I fully agree.. Went to the game in LA and I didn't think that was going to be the highlight of the year, wow was I ever mistaken.. This team is an embarrassment, it run by a bunch of clowns!! Instead of things getting better after 6 years it's only getting worse.

Respect to the boyz who come out every week to cheer the team on, I have no idea how you do it. I bailed on my seasons before last year started and it was one of the best decision I ever made. I would feel like I was getting robbed if I was actually paying to see this shite!!

All I can say is 'tis pity', such a wonderful thing this could have been..

PS. My bad meant to quote Batman's 6:11 post...

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:05 PM
Absolutely correct.. The problem and has always been at the top...

You hear that Paul, Tom and etc? Where is Paul now a days? Dont see him on here too often tooting the mlse horn now that things went south.

PS. Meant to quote TFCRegina's 6:12 post.. Lol

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 07:06 PM
They could lose the next 10, an Winter isn't going to bail on his system.It's his culture, it's like asking if he will bail on being Dutch
Winter has that same "deer in the headlights" look that Preki had just before he was canned.

ElvistheEvilScotsman
05-05-2012, 07:09 PM
Mumble mumble mumble. We were unlucky. Mumble mumble mumble. The players all believe (from what i saw of Frings at the beginning of the match and when he left he has had it with mumbles).

Im feeling like i have wasted so much time supporting this useless organization. I thought we had hit rock bottom and it was only going to get better. Im going to take a long break from tfc.

Pookie
05-05-2012, 07:11 PM
Serious question.

On paper, do we have a better starting 11 than any team in this league? If so, which ones?

If not, there is your answer as to why we are where we are. And it all starts with resource allocation and vision from the top

bigbamboom
05-05-2012, 07:12 PM
My answer to send a clear message:

All my stuff, my "kit", including sweatshirt, game shirt, scarf, 2 toques and nice Adidas warm up - on sale on Kijiji. Imagine if every unsettled fan posted their stuff on Kijiji, 1000+ ...I mean everyone - stuff for sale, would cut into MLSE where it hurts, we flood the market with cheap gear, where MLSE gets hit, in the pocket book.

They'd take notice.

Waggy
05-05-2012, 07:14 PM
Thank you sir, may I have another?

Mishko
05-05-2012, 07:15 PM
My answer to send a clear message:

All my stuff, my "kit", including sweatshirt, game shirt, scarf, 2 toques and nice Adidas warm up - on sale on Kijiji. Imagine if every unsettled fan posted their stuff on Kijiji, 1000+ ...I mean everyone - stuff for sale, would cut into MLSE where it hurts, we flood the market with cheap gear, where MLSE gets hit, in the pocket book.

They'd take notice.

Good call.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 07:17 PM
Johnson really sounds like he wants to spill on what he thinks is wrong , but can't

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 07:19 PM
Johnson really sounds like he wants to spill on what he thinks is wrong

You may have a point . His frustration on field has been evident the last 6 games

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:20 PM
Dear MLSE.

I am a season ticket holder in section 113. I have been a season ticket holder since year one. I am embarrassed and humiliated that my football team now owns the record of the worst start to any MLS season. I demand that Aron winter be removed from his position of Head Coach of my football team immediately. I will NOT attend another TFC home game this season until he is removed.

Sincerely,
R Morris.

Bud, they don't care if you show up this year or not, they already have your money.

scooterTFC
05-05-2012, 07:23 PM
Serious question.

On paper, do we have a better starting 11 than any team in this league? If so, which ones?

If not, there is your answer as to why we are where we are. And it all starts with resource allocation and vision from the top
This!!!

Our problems aren't limited to formation, system and tactics. We simply don't have enought talent on the roster. And that problem goes back to the Preki era... But clearly the new management team hadn't rectified the problem. Looking back I think you'd have to say that the mojo years had the most talented rosters.

Rudy
05-05-2012, 07:29 PM
Something has to change. The coach ......You'd think that Mariner would have a chat to say "hey buddy, try something a weee bit different next time". Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

BINGO. In 8 straight losses, Winter hasnt figured out that he needs a radical change. whatever he's doing, has not worked. Time for an immediate radical change in plan. No sense on beating a dead horse.

denime
05-05-2012, 07:30 PM
What are you saying here? is that a typo or do you know something we don't?


So, if denime's sources are correct, Winter will be out pretty soon. We will be seeing either Nicol/Mariner, or Rongen/Mariner. A logical move, as obviously removing Winter is a first step when things go this badly.

It may not solve the root problems with this club, so more pruning will probably be needed. However, Toronto sporting culture being what it is, if TFC can achieve comfortable mediocrity (reaching the playoffs), the average schmuck will be satisfied. After all, they don't take TFC all that seriously, but do want to be entertained. 0-8 is not entertaining.

I would not read much into Nicol stuff,the fact that he declined Rapids few months back,and hearing how Mariner and Winter don't see eye to eye,I would not be surprised if he was not already approached or even hired by MLSE in case Winter fails.

ML$E has $$$ to spend and that's why I think this theory of mine might be right.Who fucking knows what is going on behind the close doors?

They might wait for season tickets renuwal and than hire Nicol in oreder to get more $$$.

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:30 PM
No beer no gear til the playoffs are here! Drink before the game and stop buying shitty over priced gear

What about 'stop paying for over priced shitty game day tickets'? That's the ONLY way you will truly hurt ML$E..

Pookie
05-05-2012, 07:31 PM
By top I mean Anselmi :)

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 07:31 PM
You're asking a guy born and raised on "total football" to change?

good luck with that

DangerRed
05-05-2012, 07:32 PM
What more can I say that I haven't said already?

ryan
05-05-2012, 07:33 PM
Johnson really sounds like he wants to spill on what he thinks is wrong , but can't

Aye that was some interview

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:37 PM
If the media blew this up to Leaf levels none of the casuals would be going to games, it's the lack of media coverage keeping the team in business to this day. Not the supporter groups.

I actually felt this way last year, when they put so many games on goltv, it's was like they knew how crap they would be and decide to hide that fact from the casuals.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 07:38 PM
Aye that was some interview

He did to a degree anway, when he scoffed at playing counter as the home team

Torontotonto
05-05-2012, 07:38 PM
Definitely Anselmi..not sure if Paul Bierne should go because he has nothing to do with the on field product.... but definitely Anselmi should bare responsibility of two disaster football operations on his watch.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but last week when interviewed, Anselmi speaking about Winter and the problems etc. said "they'll" have to fix this.

Note the word "they" vs. "we". Interesting turn of phrase Tom.. I guess it isn't your responsibility, huh.

They both should be shown the door.

Toronto
05-05-2012, 07:40 PM
Winter isn't Dutch. He's Surinamese. It's been all one big misunderstanding. If I can wake-up, Mo will still be in charge. It's all a bad dream. The grass is never greener.

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 07:44 PM
Even JDG said during his interview that " they are doing as they are told " .

This current situation is going to kill all motivation that the players have :(

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 07:46 PM
I would not read much into Nicol stuff,the fact that he declined Rapids few months back,and hearing how Mariner and Winter don't see eye to eye,I would not be surprised if he was not already approached or even hired by MLSE in case Winter fails.

ML$E has $$$ to spend and that's why I think this theory of mine might be right.Who fucking knows what is going on behind the close doors?

They might wait for season tickets renuwal and than hire Nicol in oreder to get more $$$.

Exactly.. That's there style, wait till the renewal period is just around the corner and sell 'hope', cuz that's all they have to sell..

Torontotonto
05-05-2012, 07:49 PM
Thats all they have been giving out every game with exception of the magnetic schedules the first two home games.
Clearly sending the fans a message.
BEND OVER

:sheep:

Blizzard
05-05-2012, 07:50 PM
So when Jerkun recommended Winter for the job, I asked "Who do we blame when we can't acquire the talent to play 'Total Football' and it all ends in tears"?

I'll ask again, "Who do we blame?"

This has been discussed. Klinsmann brought a list of people to the table. PB and TA made the decision on who they wanted to go with.

T-boy
05-05-2012, 07:51 PM
Bud, they don't care if you show up this year or not, they already have your money.

I will be calling the club on Monday and telling them exactly what I think of winter and the club right now. I will demand to talk to the highest possible person in the company. Some fans need to speak up to the club and not politely clap on the sideline after the game.

they may have my money, but they no longer have my support as long as Aron Winter is head coach.

I'm seriously pissed off this evening. And this is from a guy who was an Oxford United season ticket holder for years, and watched the club go from the Premiership (old first division) relegated all the way down to the Conference. I honestly see less at TFC right now that I ever saw at Oxford, even though they were relegated to the non league! I am THAT disappointed with TFC and Aron Winter right now.

That team had NO fight today, NO passion, NO confidence, and NO ability to win a football game. I have ZERO confidence that Winter can turn this around.

The Black Pearl
05-05-2012, 07:51 PM
Even JDG said during his interview that " they are doing as they are told " .

This current situation is going to kill all motivation that the players have :(

Some player will spill off the record,just watch

DangerRed
05-05-2012, 07:56 PM
"When you tie, you get points, you will get confidence"

Does no one see? This guy isn't even talking about winning anymore!!

Whoever voted to keep him as manager, can you please tell me why?

ArmenJBX
05-05-2012, 08:00 PM
Tom Anselmi was hovering around outside the press conference room. I spotted him. John Molinaro went after him; Anselmi vanished.

tfcleeds
05-05-2012, 08:02 PM
Tom Anselmi was hovering around outside the press conference room. I spotted him. John Molinaro went after him; Anselmi vanished.

One can only hope he gets canned once the sale is complete, all I can say. No balls, no accountability.

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 08:08 PM
I will be calling the club on Monday and telling them exactly what I think of winter and the club right now. I will demand to talk to the highest possible person in the company. Some fans need to speak up to the club and not politely clap on the sideline after the game.

they may have my money, but they no longer have my support as long as Aron Winter is head coach.

I'm seriously pissed off this evening. And this is from a guy who was an Oxford United season ticket holder for years, and watched the club go from the Premiership (old first division) relegated all the way down to the Conference. I honestly see less at TFC right now that I ever saw at Oxford, even though they were relegated to the non league! I am THAT disappointed with TFC and Aron Winter right now.

That team had NO fight today, NO passion, NO confidence, and NO ability to win a football game. I have ZERO confidence that Winter can turn this around.

T-Boy, I agree that at this point Winter needs go, however it's more then just him, Tom A just off the top my head.. Some of the top mlse heads should be rolling.. With regards to winter I think his biggest problem is that he can't speak or even understand english. if you have ever heard any of his interviews he sounds like a bumbling fool, never mind that fact that when he answers any question he's goes off in tangents like he didn't even understand the question. How in gods green earth can this guy get his point across to the players, most have which have never played this style of football?

As for the second point I bolted, I couldn't agree with you more. But it was not just today, the game in Montreal was no better. That was some of the worst football I have ever witnessed. If anybody recorded that game be a sport and let an insomniac watch it, you'd do them a favour.

I wish you all the best on you call Monday, I truly do. But until people stop buy these over price game tickets nothing will change. I hope tfc proves me wrong but looking at there track record I highly doubt it.

Cheers,

Blizzard
05-05-2012, 08:11 PM
T-Boy, I agree that at this point Winter needs go, however it's more then just him, Tom A just off the top my head.. Some of the top mlse heads should be rolling.. With regards to winter I think his biggest problem is that he can't speak or even understand english. if you have ever heard any of his interviews he sounds like a bumbling fool, never mind that fact that when he answers any question he's goes off in tangents like he didn't even understand the question. How in gods green earth can this guy get his point across to the players, most have which have never played this style of football?

As for the second point I bolted, I couldn't agree with you more. But it was not just today, the game in Montreal was no better. That was some of the worst football I have ever witnessed. If anybody recorded that game be a sport and let an insomniac watch it, you'd do them a favour.

That's rubbish. I've had the opportunity to chat with the man on three occasions for probably a total of 45 minutes. His grasp of English is very good. He is a bit shy and that is his problem with speaking on camera but to say it is because he can't speak or understand English simply isn't true.

Pookie
05-05-2012, 08:26 PM
Let's not lose focus as we debate Winter's english skills. His record hasn't been good enough.

That said, neither was Dasovic's, Cummins', Carver's, Preki's, or Mo's. At some point it:

- stops being the coaches. Is 7 times really going to yield better luck in a dysfunctional organization?

- questions need to go higher and Anselmi cannot continue to speak in terms of "they", this is the club he is leader of. If he isn't up to being the leader, give up the paycheque and let someone else do it. His team is dysfunctional. The team he built. The team he built this year, last year, the year before that, the year before that, the year before that, and the year before that

- and questions need to go to the players as well. I personally think we have handicapped the roster by not focusing on US Domestic players while gifting quite a few Canadians a roster spot. That said, the players that are here are the players that are here. Game is a series of 1 v 1 battles. Are you not good enough to win your battles or would you like some help? This is a developmental league after all. Do you not aspire to get better? Get a transfer to a better league? Earn a cap for your country? Come on, show some passion.

69Chevy396
05-05-2012, 08:28 PM
Excellent. Since he understands English as well as you describe, and since you have spoken to him before, next time you speak to him, please tell him in simple, clear English to go to hell.

UltraSuperMegaMo
05-05-2012, 08:33 PM
Excellent. Since he understands English as well as you describe, and since you have spoken to him before, next time you speak to him, please tell him in simple, clear English to go to hell.

Steady on. He might be terrible at coaching in the MLS. but I don't think he's a bad person deserving of comments like that.

I think it's time for him to go or move over to the academy or something. Time to call the guy at the PR Islanders.

DaBandit
05-05-2012, 08:35 PM
That's rubbish. I've had the opportunity to chat with the man on three occasions for probably a total of 45 minutes. His grasp of English is very good. He is a bit shy and that is his problem with speaking on camera but to say it is because he can't speak or understand English simply isn't true.

Ok perhaps that's true, I have to take your word for it as I have never spoken to him personally. But not once have I been able to get the plot from any of his interviews, I find he talks in circles, and misses the point of many many questions. I hope for the team sake your right, because if he's like that in meetings or in practices it's no wonder the guys can't seem to get his system down.

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 08:47 PM
That's rubbish. I've had the opportunity to chat with the man on three occasions for probably a total of 45 minutes. His grasp of English is very good. He is a bit shy and that is his problem with speaking on camera but to say it is because he can't speak or understand English simply isn't true.

Well then he is pulling a Sammy Sosa when he speaks at his pressers. All he ever says is 'ummmm.......I think.....uhhhh.....that.....we.....uhhhhh.......a re making......uhhhh.....prorgress....'

He intentionally obfuscates his responses because, and I can't state this plainly enough, HE DOES NOT HAVE ANY ANSWERS.

RealG-TFC
05-05-2012, 08:48 PM
Steady on. He might be terrible at coaching in the MLS. but I don't think he's a bad person deserving of comments like that.

I think it's time for him to go or move over to the academy or something. Time to call the guy at the PR Islanders.

This. He might actually be of some use there.

cochrdoc
05-05-2012, 08:50 PM
2 more goals against how many are we going to give up.Time for a new manager.He is out of his element.There must be some players we can waive to make room on the roster.Montreal looks alot better then this mess.Vancouver has turned it around in a year.

Batman
05-05-2012, 08:50 PM
guys...whos's the guy that hired mo.

Who's the guy that extended Mo's contract... and wait a minimum of 1 year too long to can him.

Who's the guy that hired a big time consultant to come up with this plan.

Who's the guy who hired winter.

Who's the de facto president of TFC.

Tom Anselmi.

Whether he has anything to do with the current on field product, or not, he's the guy, who hired the guys who do.. and it's been a fuck up for 6 years..

And when the going gets tough he said "they" not "we" have to fix it.

All for one...ya, right.

Political master..yes.. president of a soccer club.. no fucking way.

Rudy
05-05-2012, 08:51 PM
Ok perhaps that's true, I have to take your word for it as I have never spoken to him personally. But not once have I been able to get the plot from any of his interviews, I find he talks in circles, and misses the point of many many questions. I hope for the team sake your right, because if he's like that in meetings or in practices it's no wonder the guys can't seem to get his system down.

i disagree with the notion that he doesnt understand questions, and doesn't answer them well. but when someone keeps getting asked "why do u keep losing", or "why shouldnt you be fired", what on earth do u want them to answer and say? of course they're gonna ramble on andon, mumble, and go in circle. what so u want him to respond specifically and say? "yes, i cant win, and i shud get fired"?..... come on!

Just One Man
05-05-2012, 08:52 PM
This. He might actually be of some use there.

He has talked like an Academy coach since he got here. He was never an MLS coach. I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but anybody who bought that "total football", "Ajax system", "culture change" BS does not, and never did know jack squat about this league.

Winning MLS teams are not built through a long-term, internal system of player development. Not now anyway. Maybe in 20 years, but not now.

Roogsy
05-05-2012, 08:53 PM
I have re-written this message 5 times for fear of being removed from this forum. This is diplomatic as I can be:

Though some may consider it admirable to sing the entire 90 minutes, it just makes us look foolish and delivers no message to the players what so ever. There is a difference between loyal and being gullible. TFC have a great core support, such as the RPB's, NEE and U-Sector, but sadly its the 18000 odd other seats in the stadium that need selling. Continuing to sing just gives the MLSE more marketing power and a false sense that everything is ok.

I was sorely disappointed that there was nothing the way of a protest or any kind of hostility at the end of today's game. Everyone just packed up their things, grumbled, and walked away. That's not being a real football fan, that's being weak. I saw no passion from anyone really, and discussing throwing a shirt on to the pitch a week in advance kind of loses its spontaneity, and thus message, in the end. As a player, I would get the impression that no one gives a shit.

Two things need to happen. First, stop singing and applauding the players when they lose. And secondly, start congregating around the main stand after the game and give anyone on the MLSE payroll dog's abuse as they leave. I know this is Canada but can we at least show some aggression to get something done.

8 straight loses is inexcusable, pathetic and frankly, embarrassing. They don't deserve my support, your support or any loyal supporter who spends their hard earned money week in, week out. I won't be returning for a long time. Shove it, MLSE. And keep up the good work RPBs, you deserve more than this shit.

This...

Rudy
05-05-2012, 08:55 PM
Well then he is pulling a Sammy Sosa when he speaks at his pressers. All he ever says is 'ummmm.......I think.....uhhhh.....that.....we.....uhhhhh.......a re making......uhhhh.....prorgress....'

He intentionally obfuscates his responses because, and I can't state this plainly enough, HE DOES NOT HAVE ANY ANSWERS.

Agree 100%.

Greatest Ripoff
05-05-2012, 08:56 PM
guys...whos's the guy that hired mo.

Who's the guy that extended Mo's contract... and wait a minimum of 1 year too long to can him.

Who's the guy that hired a big time consultant to come up with this plan.

Who's the guy who hired winter.

Who's the de facto president of TFC.

Tom Anselmi.

Whether he has anything to do with the current on field product, or not, he's the guy, who hired the guys who do.. and it's been a fuck up for 6 years..

And when the going gets tough he said "they" not "we" have to fix it.

Political master..yes.. president of a soccer club.. no fucking way.

x1000000000

Get someone in here who has a fucking clue to run this team from the top down.

UltraSuperMegaMo
05-05-2012, 09:01 PM
Realistically, who are they going to get in now? They're going to have to make a change just to make a change to breath some life into the situation. I'd like to see Rafael Carbajal, maybe do what Di Mateo is doing for Chelsea with TFC.

ManUtd4ever
05-05-2012, 09:02 PM
LOL, how appropriate is it that free vaseline was given away to fans leaving BMO Field today? After several weeks of supporters getting reamed, it's the least they can do!

narduch
05-05-2012, 09:06 PM
Realistically, who are they going to get in now? They're going to have to make a change just to make a change to breath some life into the situation. I'd like to see Rafael Carbajal, maybe do what Di Mateo is doing for Chelsea with TFC.

I have a feeling that the first move will be to put an 'interim' manager in place (maybe Rongen or Mariner).

Than around season seat renewal time a big announcement with the new management team.

Or course with the MLSE sale to Bell/Rogers maybe nothing major happens.

I think TFC should find away to steal Bob Bradley from Egypt.

jloome
05-05-2012, 09:07 PM
I don't think we can underestimate how important it is to have a few of the key right players, and when we don't have an in-form Danny K, Frings half-crocked, Plata considered a major player, we just don't have much offensive punch.

Frankly, our lineup is just weak. We have maybe a couple of guys who would compete for starting roles on other teams; that's partly Winter, but it's big-time on Mariner and the front office. We're just not a competitive lineup.

Statistically, in the first half, this was a deadlock, even possession and four shots for each side, one on net. Second half, Pontius, Najar and DeRo just carried the game. And we didn't have anyone on the pitch that dangerous. Maybe Johnson, in the box; Lambe has some potential and is usually p. solid statistically. But who else is going to break something open for us? Plata's so small that when he scuffs a shot, it doesn't even make it to the net, and every cross he tries is blocked easily because he's dwarfed.

There just wasn't that much different between the non-role players. Santos had a terrible game, coughing up the ball 17 times and completing about 40% of his passes; the rest of the non-star D.C. lineup was equally mediocre. But three key players carried them.

denime
05-05-2012, 09:11 PM
I have re-written this message 5 times for fear of being removed from this forum. This is diplomatic as I can be:

Though some may consider it admirable to sing the entire 90 minutes, it just makes us look foolish and delivers no message to the players what so ever. There is a difference between loyal and being gullible. TFC have a great core support, such as the RPB's, NEE and U-Sector, but sadly its the 18000 odd other seats in the stadium that need selling. Continuing to sing just gives the MLSE more marketing power and a false sense that everything is ok.

I was sorely disappointed that there was nothing the way of a protest or any kind of hostility at the end of today's game. Everyone just packed up their things, grumbled, and walked away. That's not being a real football fan, that's being weak. I saw no passion from anyone really, and discussing throwing a shirt on to the pitch a week in advance kind of loses its spontaneity, and thus message, in the end. As a player, I would get the impression that no one gives a shit.

Two things need to happen. First, stop singing and applauding the players when they lose. And secondly, start congregating around the main stand after the game and give anyone on the MLSE payroll dog's abuse as they leave. I know this is Canada but can we at least show some aggression to get something done.

8 straight loses is inexcusable, pathetic and frankly, embarrassing. They don't deserve my support, your support or any loyal supporter who spends their hard earned money week in, week out. I won't be returning for a long time. Shove it, MLSE. And keep up the good work RPBs, you deserve more than this shit.

I agree with good part of your post,except your comment about team support.I will not stop support boys on the field no matter who the coach or owner is.I will go and do protest FO ML$E if RPB decide to do that,I will not stop supporting boys on the pitch.

If you feel they don't deserve your support it's to bad,they will need us more than ever now when they are down.

Rudy
05-05-2012, 09:11 PM
Danny K out, Nick S out, and Frings left. three key players down can explain it.

Roogsy
05-05-2012, 09:11 PM
"When you tie, you get points, you will get confidence"

Does no one see? This guy isn't even talking about winning anymore!!

Whoever voted to keep him as manager, can you please tell me why?

If we don't want to see this club achieve an even more shameful (to all of us) 0-9, Winter needs to be gone by morning and all the Winter backers need to finally wake up.

mowe
05-05-2012, 09:12 PM
He has talked like an Academy coach since he got here. He was never an MLS coach. I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but anybody who bought that "total football", "Ajax system", "culture change" BS does not, and never did know jack squat about this league.

Completely agree. Let's not forget that the ONLY coaching job Winter has ever had is the Ajax reserves. He's never dealt with adversity like this before and he's shown he's not ready to run a team. If the players repeatedly fail in the system you're trying to implement, it's time to change your tactics. I was a big Winter fan and really wanted him to succeed but now I can't wait to get rid of him so the players can get a fresh start. It's been more than a year and it's clear this isn't working.

Now as to who would replace him I'm not sure. I don't know if Rongen would be that much better and it's not like Mariner has much head coaching experience either. Maybe Nicol is the answer, who knows. Another candidate could be Jason Bent, but I doubt MLSE would go for him.

jloome
05-05-2012, 09:14 PM
Danny K out, Nick S out, and Frings left. three key players down can explain it.

No, not three key players, three players we completely can't win without. The rest of our lineup is JUST TOO WEAK. Jesus, neither of our centre backs would start at any other club in the league; I'm watching right now as Montreal beats KC, and KC has Aurielle Collin on their backline, a good french centre half who can spray 60 yard passes on a dime. We're just way behind the curve.

TorontoGooner
05-05-2012, 09:15 PM
I agree with good part of your post,except your comment about team support.I will not stop support boys on the field no matter who the coach or owner is.I will go and do protest FO ML$E if RPB decide to do that,I will not stop supporting boys on the pitch.

If you feel they don't deserve your support it's to bad,they will need us more than ever now when they are down.

They don't need my support, they just want my money. When they show a bit of heart, a bit of care, then I'll sing until the end.

TheEdge
05-05-2012, 09:19 PM
Why can't TO get Ibramich, Cuban type owners who actually care about winning.

Alselmi is an architect by trade and has constructed the most pathetic jungle gym I have ever seen.

I tried to explain away their losses that they outplayed their opponents; bad luck etc.

0-8 is no fluke. Manager has to go. Question? Where is Mariner these days? No defense for Winter? Hmmm?

cmonyoureds
05-05-2012, 09:23 PM
All i wanna know is if Trane threw his kit on the pitch..........

Anyone? 'Cause I was thinking about this when the second goal went in. Can't believe waiting for the answer to this is the highlight of this game for me.......

69Chevy396
05-05-2012, 09:23 PM
Danny K out, Nick S out, and Frings left. three key players down can explain it.

Sorry, am I missing something here? How many mls games has TFC won with these three in the line up?

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 09:25 PM
They don't need my support, they just want my money. When they show a bit of heart, a bit of care, then I'll sing until the end.

TG, have you supported any team other then TFC and Arsenal?

Cause a lot of us have. And when those teams are run by people like or worse then Anselmi, its awful.

Another example - think of Darlington supporters......sugar daddy with an ego creates a huge stadium that they can't fill, leaves them with massive on going debts and little revenue opportunities, and now they are not only out of the league, they are going bust, even after supporters raised over 300K pounds to try to save it.

And still people support the team.


As for when they show a bit of heart, the players have shown that this season over and over and over again.

I realise you think MLSE = TFC but for many of us, that's not true.

And that's the crux of the divide among supporters.

Beach_Red
05-05-2012, 09:27 PM
If we don't want to see this club achieve an even more shameful (to all of us) 0-9, Winter needs to be gone by morning and all the Winter backers need to finally wake up.

It's been three games since Winter's meeting with Anselmi and the rumour he was given four games to turn things around - two losses and 0-0 in Montreal. Yesterday there was a PR article in the Star about how Anselmi is a "handshake" man of his word (though, curiously, the article also pointed out he'd need board approval to fire the coach - probably because the board has said they won't spend another dime on the team and they'd have to pay out Winter and anyone moving into the head coach position probably has a clause in their contract for more money).

So, even if they win the next game, could anyone call that turning the team around?

denime
05-05-2012, 09:29 PM
TG, have you supported any team other then TFC and Arsenal?

Cause a lot of us have. And when those teams are run by people like or worse then Anselmi, its awful.

Another example - think of Darlington supporters......sugar daddy with an ego creates a huge stadium that they can't fill, leaves them with massive on going debts and little revenue opportunities, and now they are not only out of the league, they are going bust, even after supporters raised over 300K pounds to try to save it.

And still people support the team.


As for when they show a bit of heart, the players have shown that this season over and over and over again.

I realise you think MLSE = TFC but for many of us, that's not true.

And that's the crux of the divide among supporters.

Nicely said.

tfcleeds
05-05-2012, 09:31 PM
Don't worry - we still have a long ways to go yet to even challenge the all-time futility records for a football team. Ibis Sport Club, a Brazilian team, went almost 4 years without winning a match. In fact, one of their nicknames to this day is "the worst team in the world".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%8Dbis_Sport_Club

Beach_Red
05-05-2012, 09:35 PM
TG, have you supported any team other then TFC and Arsenal?

Cause a lot of us have. And when those teams are run by people like or worse then Anselmi, its awful.

Another example - think of Darlington supporters......sugar daddy with an ego creates a huge stadium that they can't fill, leaves them with massive on going debts and little revenue opportunities, and now they are not only out of the league, they are going bust, even after supporters raised over 300K pounds to try to save it.

And still people support the team.


As for when they show a bit of heart, the players have shown that this season over and over and over again.

I realise you think MLSE = TFC but for many of us, that's not true.

And that's the crux of the divide among supporters.

All we're looking for is the best of a bad situation. Yes, MLSE is a difficult company to work for but does the team really need to be 0-8 and not be able to score a goal against an expansion team in Montreal? Isn't it possible there's a coach put there with a little more experience dealing with bad ownership, lower-salaried players and all the other things that have to be dealt with here who might be able to get a 2-6 record, or, crazy as it sounds, 2-3-3?

Max_TO
05-05-2012, 09:41 PM
Montreal beat KC in KC to boot . Can't wait to hear what trash Winter tries to say about Montreal before our next game against them

Anyone care to guess as to when Toronto will win there first MLS game ?

Couchy81
05-05-2012, 09:41 PM
Don't worry - we still have a long ways to go yet to even challenge the all-time futility records for a football team. Ibis Sport Club, a Brazilian team, went almost 4 years without winning a match. In fact, one of their nicknames to this day is "the worst team in the world".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Íbis_Sport_Club

Hmmm those away colours look eerily familiar

69Chevy396
05-05-2012, 09:52 PM
If I were Tom the boss I would invite American Samoa over for an exhibition game or two and to make it even TFC would be allowed to play with 14 men.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:04 PM
Plata never has less then 3 touches. But, he has a bad 3rd touch and when he occasionally doesn't, his 4th touch will definitely let him down.

Running after the defender who now has the ball is Plata's version of a 5th touch.

He can't cross and he won't pass.

None of this is true and its too easy to take this out on any one player.

He's had some great games for us and actually was named RPB player of the year last year.

Please, everyone, get a grip and stop singling out players as the cause for the shambles that we see our beloved team in today.

Where were you with your comments when we were voting for RPB player or the year last year? UNLIKE your "Location" you were actually nowhere.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:07 PM
That's exactly how I felt after the Chicago game, and for me that was my last game I will attend this season until something big happens, not simply firing Winter. He will be the scapegoat and again people will get hope that something will be different after all these years, when in fact it is MLSE that is the problem, not the many coaches who have tried to turn this team around. It is not a coincidence all the coaches have failed.


Or fled. And it seems like Torsten is right behind them.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:13 PM
Something has to change. The coach has to understand that every time he shuffles different players into the same system it results into, well, the same bad result. I'm sure after years of development through a youth system and several major type promotions from the youth system into the first team having played that way for years, THEN we'll be able to attempt to run with this style. But asking MLS quality players to play a system they've practically never done and roughly only 2 players (both hurt) having grown up with it, just isn't working. You'd think that Mariner would have a chat to say "hey buddy, try something a weee bit different next time". Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

I love this one.

And in this context, shouldn't we consider firing the coach every year for the clubs entire existence and expecting a different result also qualify as insane?

Fort York Redcoat
05-05-2012, 10:16 PM
Every needs to take the message from an Ultras sticker I read today. I believe I found the inspiration for it here:

-4pg6Jh94Lo

thank you Corey Hart.

That is all.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:18 PM
Well said.
:cheers:

And all this constant talk of firing Winter is :deadhorse:. Firing him is treating the symptom, while the disease, problem, issue (whatever) persists.




THIS. Fuck Winter, who cares? No one at the top is held responsible, and beyond this, I suspect (no proof) that the real problem is souring from the top, namely Anselmi. At the very least, he is the only constant in the 6 years of horrid miserable failure. He is obviously meddling where he shouldn't.

Kosta300
05-05-2012, 10:27 PM
All that will come out of these defeats are more excuses from the folks of MLSE. I have 8 season tickets and I know I will not be renewing next season. It's almost embarrassing giving tickets to clients these days for them to sit through this. The worst part is a lot of tickets have gone unused since no one even wants them. In the first few years this was not he case so I have seen a lot of people have gone sour on TFC with what is going on now. Still incredible that fans still come out for every game so MLSE is still the only winners here. When a team in its first season like Montreal can be more competitive- won tonight as well-you know that this mess starts from the top!

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:29 PM
I'm not sure why people are obssessing about "who to blame" for hiring Winter.

I've said before, football teams usually go through many different managers until they find the right now. Winter ISNT the right one, so he needs to go. It's as simple as that! Nothing else has to change other than winter needs to be removed from his position.


Because it might have something to do with who the fuck is running this shit show.


THAT PERSON needs to be fired, NOT WINTER.

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 10:31 PM
Frankly, our lineup is just weak. We have maybe a couple of guys who would compete for starting roles on other teams; that's partly Winter, but it's big-time on Mariner and the front office. We're just not a competitive lineup.


This is the biggest problem, and anyone hopeful that canning Winter will save the season is dreaming. Winter deserves some blame for his inflexibility, and he may have lost the locker room (which would make it inevitable that he would go), but the biggest problem is the divided FO that Ben Knight has referred to in a couple of articles and podcasts. With the behind-the-scenes politics, it would be impossible for Sigi or Bruce Arena, or anyone to turn this team around. I'm especially concerned that Earl Cochrane seems to have the power to turn down getting in players, that is really scary.

When LA got rid of Ruud Gullit, they also had to get rid of Alexi Lalas and Beckham's guys to turn the team around. If TFC gets rid of Winter, they will also have to get rid of Cochrane and Anselmi, or there is no point.... they might as well keep Winter and minimize their costs, because attendance is going to tank next year anyways.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:32 PM
Solid Rocker, but why not Tamper? I don't get why we just don't play dirty and offer the best MLS coach a yacht full of money??? It's not like that has anything to do with the cap, it's really our only leverage at this point.


Because its against league rules and comes with consequences which were kind of swept under the rug last time. Next time... maybe not.

ArmenJBX
05-05-2012, 10:33 PM
Let's not forget Mr. Earl Cochrane.
I feel like his name needs to come up way more often

burlington Red
05-05-2012, 10:34 PM
I will be calling the club on Monday and telling them exactly what I think of winter and the club right now. I will demand to talk to the highest possible person in the company. Some fans need to speak up to the club and not politely clap on the sideline after the game.

they may have my money, but they no longer have my support as long as Aron Winter is head coach.

I'm seriously pissed off this evening. And this is from a guy who was an Oxford United season ticket holder for years, and watched the club go from the Premiership (old first division) relegated all the way down to the Conference. I honestly see less at TFC right now that I ever saw at Oxford, even though they were relegated to the non league! I am THAT disappointed with TFC and Aron Winter right now.

That team had NO fight today, NO passion, NO confidence, and NO ability to win a football game. I have ZERO confidence that Winter can turn this around.


what reaction did you get from The Oxford board when you called to register your disgust at their decline.

Jeff s
05-05-2012, 10:35 PM
Something has to change. The coach has to understand that every time he shuffles different players into the same system it results into, well, the same bad result. I'm sure after years of development through a youth system and several major type promotions from the youth system into the first team having played that way for years, THEN we'll be able to attempt to run with this style. But asking MLS quality players to play a system they've practically never done and roughly only 2 players (both hurt) having grown up with it, just isn't working. You'd think that Mariner would have a chat to say "hey buddy, try something a weee bit different next time". Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

I love this one.

And in this context, shouldn't we consider firing the coach every year for the clubs entire existence and expecting a different result also qualify as insane?

Dunno why people keep saying "firing".

Mo was moved to GM
Carver and Cummings left on there own.
The only person that was fired was Preki, and rightfully so.

But firing a guy in his second year, with an 0-8 start is considered insane.
Montreal got a win in KC with their first year manager.
Whitecaps are doing well with their first year manager.

I don't know... I just can't come up with an excuses. We've all seen it. Managers coming in without bringing much players in and still changing the team completely.

Just listen to Johnson's interview, he pretty much flat out said he thinks his counter attacking tactics is stupid. It's a sign that him (and im sure many others) are disagreeing with Winter's ridiculous tactics.

I have an idea though. Looking at our past manager, how about we get a guy thats like you know... an actual manager. We go and get assistant managers and youth managers. Just get a guy thats managed a team before. Please!

Oldtimer
05-05-2012, 10:36 PM
Let's not forget Mr. Earl Cochrane.
I feel like his name needs to come up way more often

Yes... :) He is certainly involved here.

ArmenJBX
05-05-2012, 10:40 PM
My fear is that Aron Winter will be dismissed, Tom Anselmi will be spared, and Earl Cochrane goes under the radar throughout the process.

If Winter goes, Cochrane needs to go too. He has done nothing to earn his job. He is not a soccer guy. He is not capable of holding an executive position on this team.

Please - eventually, the RPBs will have enough, if things keep going south - PLEASE, do not point only at Winter; ​MAKE COCHRANE ACCOUNTABLE TOO.

ManUtd4ever
05-05-2012, 10:42 PM
I'm beyond the point of anger and frustration. At this point, I'm genuinely concerned about the future of this franchise.

I still find it remarkable that just two months ago (it seems like ages ago), TFC was able to recapture some of the magic from the first couple of seasons with their improbable CCL run, culminating in two of the most electrifying home matches I've ever attended against L.A. and Santos Laguna. The atmosphere was as great as it's ever been, and it seemed like TFC was finally on the path to respectability. The most beleaguered and resilient fan base in the league seemed to be on the cusp of finally getting rewarded for years of unwaivering support.

Now, I fear that this collapse of epic proportions has done irreparable damage to the image of the franchise, and apathy has finally set in among the majority of the once loyal fan base, including the most ardent of supporters.

I'm just hoping for a miracle at this point. The playoffs are a pipe dream of course, but if an immediate change at the managerial level can help lead this team to a respectable record for the duration of the season, and perhaps another CCL appearance, perhaps there will be a franchise worth salvaging once the new ownership group officially purchases MLSE.

If TFC continues on it's current trajectory, the club will be nothing more than an afterthought next season for the overhelming majority of sports fans in this city.

moralis
05-05-2012, 10:42 PM
This is how I feel:

I believe supporter groups need to be unified and tell TFC Management and MLSE (Tom Anselmi) ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. We have to say this is OUR CLUB not MLSE's. They are tearing our club apart.

Man, I feel like shit. What happened to our club.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:52 PM
Sorry, I was either dreaming or I missed it today, but were they actually handing out free vaseline today?!


Sorry. If this is true it is both a brilliant marketing campaign by Vaseline and the fucking stupidest thing MLSE could possibly have done. Do they think this is fucking funny?!?

What a complete disgrace. Is there nothing that this company won't do for some money??? Openly disgracing you're own conduct and your customers is too much.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 10:53 PM
Oh god , I just can't watch his post game interviews :(


Exactly.

Don't bother.

Roogsy
05-05-2012, 10:57 PM
Because it might have something to do with who the fuck is running this shit show.


THAT PERSON needs to be fired, NOT WINTER.

Actually both. You think if Anselmi gets fired all of a sudden Winter becomes a better coach?

To use the analogy being used...yes you treat the underlying illness but you do also treat the symptom especially if it too is causing damage...which Winter is.

Pookie
05-05-2012, 11:02 PM
I'm beyond the point of anger and frustration. At this point, I'm genuinely concerned about the future of this franchise.

...

Concerns me too. My wife and I talked on the way home about giving up our season tickets. Though we were disappointed with the game, this was brought on by the belief that the franchise itself is fundamentally flawed in terms of vision and ability to implement it.

Not talking about 4-3-3 or some variation, I'm talking about where we get our players from. Quality all down through the roster is poor and there seems to only be a focus on our Academy as the saving grace. As a parent of an aspiring player, great. As a fan... PAYING THE HIGHEST (or 2nd HIGHEST depending on where you sit) per game prices in the league... this is ridiculous.

The MLS requires roster management in which domestic and international players are identified and acquired. We seem to plug in kids with little experience and hope that dropping big wads of cash on aging (and very talented at one point) DPs will give us a net competitive team. It doesn't work when one DP struggles and the other two are hurt all the time. It just leaves the kids.

We lack leadership to alter this course and invest resources to make us competitive in this league using the league rules. Firing of Winter will not change this. We can pretend all we want that TFC will singlehandedly change the way soccer is played in North America by way of Canadians developed within the geographies of London, Ontario to Ottawa. I just don't see it happening in the near future.

Roogsy
05-05-2012, 11:04 PM
Just listen to Johnson's interview, he pretty much flat out said he thinks his counter attacking tactics is stupid. It's a sign that him (and im sure many others) are disagreeing with Winter's ridiculous tactics.



It was not long ago people were adamant Winter had not lost the lockerroom. With some people it takes something jumping out and biting them in the face before they realize it was there all along.

ArmenJBX
05-05-2012, 11:07 PM
A few weeks ago, Winter hadn't lost the locker room.
Now, though? I'm not sure that's the case anymore.

Johnson's comments are his own though, and he's been growing angrier and angrier by the game.
I think Winter's problem is he's not inspiring much confidence and isn't making it clear enough to his team that wins are important. He's far too passive.

Pookie
05-05-2012, 11:08 PM
Actually both. You think if Anselmi gets fired all of a sudden Winter becomes a better coach?

To use the analogy being used...yes you treat the underlying illness but you do also treat the symptom especially if it too is causing damage...which Winter is.

Yes and no. I see where you are going.

But if there is a leader in charge that makes resources available to Winter/Mariner in order to identify better players, then perhaps the results could change.

I'm not talking about adding another scout to look at kids from Fergus, Ontario. I'm talking about money put into player identifcation across North America and robust network of International scouts/networks to manage that part of the roster rules.

TFCRegina
05-05-2012, 11:10 PM
Fire them.

Fire them all.

No arguments. No marketing campaigns.

I don't believe any more.

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 11:11 PM
None of this is true and its too easy to take this out on any one player. He's had some great games for us and actually was named RPB player of the year last year. Please, everyone, get a grip and stop singling out players as the cause...

A couple of things in response.

That is pretty much my view having watched him all season. Yes he did good last season but now he's doing too much.

As for singling out players, this is a post match thread.........its kinda what people do.

andyc
05-05-2012, 11:12 PM
I get the discussion about Anselmi and Cochrane but at the end of the day even Mo on his own did better than Winter with no DP's and a bunch of pylons in defense (and a bunch of Canadians).... MLS has improved but clearly Winter has lost the plot with 0-8 and needs to go away from the first team right now.

We can deal with the governance structure over the summer but right now we need an experienced first team manager.

Beach_Red
05-05-2012, 11:13 PM
Yes and no. I see where you are going.

But if there is a leader in charge that makes resources available to Winter/Mariner in order to identify better players, then perhaps the results could change.

I'm not talking about adding another scout to look at kids from Fergus, Ontario. I'm talking about money put into player identifcation across North America and robust network of International scouts/networks to manage that part of the roster rules.

It's probably going to be a long time until more resources are made available to this team. Ticket sales are down, merchandise sales are down, how are the TV ratings? They've spent all the money they're going to spend. They haven't hired scouts yet, it's unlikely they'll start now.

billyfly
05-05-2012, 11:13 PM
I would just like to clarify that this isn't my fault. I missed 2of the home games including today.

narduch
05-05-2012, 11:14 PM
I'm sure we will see articles in the paper tomorrow with quotes from Anselmi on how we are only 11 points out of a playoff spot. Plenty of time to catch up.

By the way, don't forget to get your tickets for the Liverpool game, you know, the 'celebration of soccer' on July 21!

Alonso
05-05-2012, 11:15 PM
Let's not lose focus as we debate Winter's english skills. His record hasn't been good enough.

That said, neither was Dasovic's, Cummins', Carver's, Preki's, or Mo's. At some point it:

- stops being the coaches. Is 7 times really going to yield better luck in a dysfunctional organization?

- questions need to go higher and Anselmi cannot continue to speak in terms of "they", this is the club he is leader of. If he isn't up to being the leader, give up the paycheque and let someone else do it. His team is dysfunctional. The team he built. The team he built this year, last year, the year before that, the year before that, the year before that, and the year before that

- and questions need to go to the players as well. I personally think we have handicapped the roster by not focusing on US Domestic players while gifting quite a few Canadians a roster spot. That said, the players that are here are the players that are here. Game is a series of 1 v 1 battles. Are you not good enough to win your battles or would you like some help? This is a developmental league after all. Do you not aspire to get better? Get a transfer to a better league? Earn a cap for your country? Come on, show some passion.


EXACTLY.

Who gives a fuck who the coach is at this point. The people hiring the coach haven't a fucking clue what they are doing.

Fire that guy first.

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 11:17 PM
I'm sure we will see articles in the paper tomorrow with quotes from Anselmi on how we are only 11 points out of a playoff spot.

By the way, don't forget to get your tickets for the Liverpool game, you know, the 'celebration of soccer' on July 21!

That's a skydome thing......not a TFC run show. And I still think its run by the same fools that organise the Bills in Toronto disasters.

narduch
05-05-2012, 11:19 PM
That's a skydome thing......not a TFC run show. And I still think its run by the same fools that organise the Bills in Toronto disasters.

TFC agreed to play the game, they can't be blameless.

narduch
05-05-2012, 11:20 PM
I would just like to clarify that this isn't my fault. I missed 2of the home games including today.

You probably would have enjoyed the sarcastic "Lets go Blue Jays/Marlies" chants.

The way it upset some fans with no sense of humour was also pretty funny.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 11:23 PM
If we don't want to see this club achieve an even more shameful (to all of us) 0-9, Winter needs to be gone by morning and all the Winter backers need to finally wake up.


I really think its the undermining and meddling from the top that is the problem.... not the 6 coaches that have left frustrated by it.

TFC Cityboy
05-05-2012, 11:24 PM
this club is a fucking joke...don't know who's to blame but something has to change and soon.
Carry on like this and there will be tumbleweeds in the satnds by July.
WE ARE THE JOKE OF THE MLS

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 11:25 PM
It was not long ago people were adamant Winter had not lost the lockerroom. With some people it takes something jumping out and biting them in the face before they realize it was there all along.

Oh my gosh.......a forward who likes to play with the ball at his feet and rush doesn't like the CA approach?!?!?!

I is shocked and appalled.:svengo:

Players talk like this behind doors all the time. Any clue as to what Fernando Torres will say to management about not getting to play today in the FA Cup final? Or the other guys who don't fit into that manager's current approach? Does this mean Di Matteo has lost that dressing room? No.....it means not everybody likes his manager.

The only really intriguing thing is he felt he could say it to GOL. That proves to me there are factions within the team, again not surprising.

sully
05-05-2012, 11:27 PM
And they agreed to play a meaningless mid season game on top of this. Do they want me to shoot myself in the head?

tiberius
05-05-2012, 11:27 PM
Paul Bierne, Tommy (the fuck) Anselmi, and Earl Cochrane (no pun required) have to go. We have cleaned out the players and the coaches over and over and over. These fucking leaches need to go NOW NOW NOW. (Sorry I forgot - get rid of all those marketting morons too) - gee breee - you have never stuck up for the average Joe? - Buy bye! Any other changes are just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Don"t shit on Winter - get to the fuckin root of the problem!

OgtheDim
05-05-2012, 11:28 PM
TFC agreed to play the game, they can't be blameless.

The marketing is soooooooo Rogers in style and approach. Blame TFC for accepting the friendly yes. But the celebration of soccer thing is right out of the Bills in Toronto playbook.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 11:31 PM
Completely agree. Let's not forget that the ONLY coaching job Winter has ever had is the Ajax reserves. He's never dealt with adversity like this before and he's shown he's not ready to run a team. If the players repeatedly fail in the system you're trying to implement, it's time to change your tactics. I was a big Winter fan and really wanted him to succeed but now I can't wait to get rid of him so the players can get a fresh start. It's been more than a year and it's clear this isn't working.

Now as to who would replace him I'm not sure. I don't know if Rongen would be that much better and it's not like Mariner has much head coaching experience either. Maybe Nicol is the answer, who knows. Another candidate could be Jason Bent, but I doubt MLSE would go for him.

I really don't think that Winter has had a lot of control or say about the line-up from day 1.

For example when Cann was thrown to the wolves in Winters first year for the first few games as a wing back instead of centre back to look like a fool and a pylon. I think Winter is obviously not a stupid man, and was trying to make a point to someone above that Cann isn't good enough for his system because he can't play multiple positions.

I'm also concerned that Carver, Dero, and others have said the "truth will come out one Day" like there lives are being threatened if they speak about their time here. This has nothing to do with the coach, and all to do with the organization starting with Anselmi.

Or

lerxst
05-05-2012, 11:39 PM
Is 0-8-0 good? Did we win the cup?

tfcleeds
05-05-2012, 11:43 PM
I really think its the undermining and meddling from the top that is the problem.... not the 6 coaches that have left frustrated by it.

True enough. But Anselmi leaving right now just isn't going to happen. The earliest a possible scenario involving his departure COULD happen would be when the sale to Belogers is officially completed, probably sometime over the summer. Even then, there is no guarantee he will be gone.

What matters NOW is that this rot stops, and we don't go 0 for some ridiculous number of games, which will only increase the discontent and low morale at the club. Winter's had enough time to show he has what it takes to lead us forward. There has been no real indication that he can. His dismissal/resignation alone won't solve all the problems, but it's a start.

Richard
05-05-2012, 11:47 PM
I really don't think that Winter has had a lot of control or say about the line-up from day 1.

For example when Cann was thrown to the wolves in Winters first year for the first few games as a wing back instead of centre back to look like a fool and a pylon. I think Winter is obviously not a stupid man, and was trying to make a point to someone above that Cann isn't good enough for his system because he can't play multiple positions.

I'm also concerned that Carver, Dero, and others have said the "truth will come out one Day" like there lives are being threatened if they speak about they're time here. This has nothing to do with the coach, and all to do with the organization starting with Anselmi.

Or

If there is one thing i want to see happen when they leave(its gonna happen folks) is them explaining the MLSE organization. I dont think Winter or BDK more so will give a shit about spilling the beans on whats going on over here, they will be back in Europe and i dont think anyone over there is going to care what happened here. I think BDK more so wont care about any confidentiality agreements as his style seems to be straight up no bullshit.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 11:48 PM
My fear is that Aron Winter will be dismissed, Tom Anselmi will be spared, and Earl Cochrane goes under the radar throughout the process.

If Winter goes, Cochrane needs to go too. He has done nothing to earn his job. He is not a soccer guy. He is not capable of holding an executive position on this team.

Please - eventually, the RPBs will have enough, if things keep going south - PLEASE, do not point only at Winter; ​MAKE COCHRANE ACCOUNTABLE TOO.


Agreed completely.

Winter is small fish and not the cause of 6 years of futility. Anselmi and Cochrane have run this team for the last 6 years and must go. They have meddled and undermined those they have placed in charge. And now they can take responsibility for their actions.

Alonso
05-05-2012, 11:52 PM
Actually both. You think if Anselmi gets fired all of a sudden Winter becomes a better coach?

To use the analogy being used...yes you treat the underlying illness but you do also treat the symptom especially if it too is causing damage...which Winter is.


I don't think Winter has had free reign on the decisions involving the club and therefore don't blame him for the results. Someone above him is making decisions that he is not in agreement with. His hands are tied in my opinion.

brad
05-05-2012, 11:54 PM
And they agreed to play a meaningless mid season game on top of this. Do they want me to shoot myself in the head?

If ticket revenues are declining - they will look elsewhere to make money.

tiberius
05-06-2012, 12:02 AM
... I have 8 season tickets and I know I will not be renewing next season... It's almost embarrassing... That is embarrassing - join the club!!! Some woke up after year 3, or 4, or 5, what made you hang on? With that five year screw up - it seems surprising to still be holding 8 seats??? Paul Bierne, Tommy Anselmi, and Earl Cochrane (no pun required) have to go. Until they are ALL GONE our tickets are worth zip! Carry On Boys - no light in the tunnel until the three wise men are history!!!!!!!!!!! Piss on winter all you want - DeKlerk - a fine man - but piss on him too if you must - Mariner - who cares?? Piss on the players if you must - but realize it is the three WISE MEN WHO NEED TO BE GONE!!!!! - they have given Toronto fc THE ULTIMATE 8-0 RECORD - Thank you Tommy , Paul and Earl .

Alonso
05-06-2012, 12:02 AM
A couple of things in response.

That is pretty much my view having watched him all season. Yes he did good last season but now he's doing too much.

As for singling out players, this is a post match thread.........its kinda what people do.

Fair enough. he's is not the reason we've lost 8 in a row and that is all I wanted to get across.

I really dislike the picking apart of our players after every loss as if we got rid of the latest scapegoat everything would be just fine. We have to have some class here people.... don't throw your own brothers under the bus for fuck sakes.

Alonso
05-06-2012, 12:09 AM
True enough. But Anselmi leaving right now just isn't going to happen. The earliest a possible scenario involving his departure COULD happen would be when the sale to Belogers is officially completed, probably sometime over the summer. Even then, there is no guarantee he will be gone.

What matters NOW is that this rot stops, and we don't go 0 for some ridiculous number of games, which will only increase the discontent and low morale at the club. Winter's had enough time to show he has what it takes to lead us forward. There has been no real indication that he can. His dismissal/resignation alone won't solve all the problems, but it's a start.

I really think that if the fan base demanded it, that it would happen.

Auzzy
05-06-2012, 12:11 AM
I wonder if any journalist has tried to interview Klinsmann about TFC's state of affairs.

I know we'll never find out, but I would love to know what he actually recommended, and how much of that was implemented.

Alonso
05-06-2012, 12:15 AM
If there is one thing i want to see happen when they leave(its gonna happen folks) is them explaining the MLSE organization. I dont think Winter or BDK more so will give a shit about spilling the beans on whats going on over here, they will be back in Europe and i dont think anyone over there is going to care what happened here. I think BDK more so wont care about any confidentiality agreements as his style seems to be straight up no bullshit.


This is my hope as well... I think that only a threat of a law suit from a confidentiality agreement could possibly keep the others silent.

tiberius
05-06-2012, 12:22 AM
If we don't want to see this club achieve an even more shameful (to all of us) 0-9, Winter needs to be gone by morning and all the Winter backers need to finally wake up. Awe come on Roogsy - the players, winter, de klerk are all the symptoms, not the problem - Paul Bierne, Tommy Anselmi, and Earl Cochrane (no pun required) have to go. We have cleaned out the players and the coaches over and over and over. These leaches need to go NOW NOW NOW.

Are you really saying getting rid of Winter is the BEST Answer? I doubt it... Bierne, Anselmi + Cockrane - THAT WILL TURN THE SHIP AROUND - Who has the best answer - You or me??? You know I am right! Admit it.

tfcleeds
05-06-2012, 12:22 AM
I really think that if the fan base demanded it, that it would happen.

Anselmi's too concerned about building his own personal fiefdom at MLSE to care what the fanbase thinks. Ultimately, he wants Peddie's job after the sale is officially complete. While I don't think that's a given, unfortunately, it could very well come to pass. I think he'd be more than happy to pass on the 'TFC portfolio' to someone else, but he's still going to be around. That's what scares me.

tiberius
05-06-2012, 12:28 AM
Actually both. You think if Anselmi gets fired all of a sudden Winter becomes a better coach?

To use the analogy being used...yes you treat the underlying illness but you do also treat the symptom especially if it too is causing damage...which Winter is.

Wow! So the guy who put Winter in place is not responsible?? Or who put Mo in place? Or who put Preki in place??? Anselmi put him there - FIRE ANSELMI - is he your brother in law or somethin? :wink5:

tfcleeds
05-06-2012, 12:32 AM
Uhh, yeah, he's my brother-in-law alright, and I'm really just a plant for MLSE. Actually, I'm Tommy A.

:picard:

flamehawk
05-06-2012, 12:34 AM
Have people seen the quotes from DC players after the game from Kurt Larson's twitter?

Olsen: "They made it very difficult in the first half. Put a lot of numbers behind ball … We made some adjustments."

Dero: "You're 0-7, why not just go for the win. It’s supposed to be attacking style football and they sat back. They're not an 0-8 team with that talent. Something’s wrong there. They’ve got good players. You see Frings throw his arm band off. It will be interesting to see about that, but I know what he’s going through. I’m with DC right now, but this is my city and it’s sad to see the state it’s in right now."

Ratven
05-06-2012, 12:40 AM
Have people seen the quotes from DC players after the game from Kurt Larson's twitter?

Olsen: "They made it very difficult in the first half. Put a lot of numbers behind ball … We made some adjustments."

Dero: "You're 0-7, why not just go for the win. It’s supposed to be attacking style football and they sat back. They're not an 0-8 team with that talent. Something’s wrong there. They’ve got good players. You see Frings throw his arm band off. It will be interesting to see about that, but I know what he’s going through. I’m with DC right now, but this is my city and it’s sad to see the state it’s in right now."

It's just craziness.

tiberius
05-06-2012, 12:43 AM
H.... Something’s wrong there. They’ve got good players. You see Frings throw his arm band off. It will be interesting to see about that, but I know what he’s going through. I’m with DC right now, but this is my city and it’s sad to see the state it’s in right now."

Hmmm... Is it Winter or Paul Bierne, Tommy Anselmi, and Earl Cochrane (no pun required) that have to go? We have cleaned out the players and the coaches over and over and over. Whoo do you believe? Dero or "Handshake Anselmi??? Frankly, I wouldn't touch Anselmi's slimey slick hand - even if he bought drinks and munchies at a town hall...

tiberius
05-06-2012, 12:45 AM
Uhh, yeah, he's my brother-in-law alright, and I'm really just a plant for MLSE. Actually, I'm Tommy A.

:picard:
Not talkin to you leeds - talking to the head guy who wants to lynch the coach....

iy12l
05-06-2012, 02:02 AM
Is there a video of Frings throwing his armband on the ground? I couldn't watch the game, I really want to see it!

Cashcleaner
05-06-2012, 02:27 AM
Anselmi is the bigger problem we've got here. Roogsy is right in that Winter won't magically become a coaching phenom with Tom out of the picture but the man with the responsibility of hiring and firing coaches and managers has had over 5 seasons to get thing right and just has not delivered.

Winter needs to go, but perhaps above all else, so does Anselmi.

ExiledRed
05-06-2012, 04:34 AM
Im drunk, I almost cant be bothered.

I havent read a single post in this thread. Its what.... 8 pages already.

I dont even need to post now.. Winter just does my work for me. Seriously. I dont need to say anything and the writing is on the fucking wall without me, Roogsy, jack, trane, and many others (including a thousand booing fans at the stadium) having to spell out the words.
goodnight.

deltox
05-06-2012, 06:24 AM
yes we are mad and yes this record sucks some serious ass.


but how will you feel when your season tickets cost more next yr?

Strait shooter
05-06-2012, 06:34 AM
This team might have a chance at success if they get rid of Tom Anselmi, Earl Cochrane and Paul Bierne. These are guys "playing" at running a professional team, they think they know what they are doing but don't have a clue. These three need to go NOW as they are the root cause of the craziness. I agree with Roogsy, Winter won't suddenly become a better coach. But without getting rid of the first three guys, any coach will have a challenge in the organization. It starts from the top and flows down. I am no longer a TFC supporter, but still want this team to have some success as it benefits the soccer culture in the country as a whole. I like the thread comparing Montreal and Vancouver set-ups and why they might be having a good start to the season.

v00d00daddy
05-06-2012, 06:37 AM
Im drunk, I almost cant be bothered.

I havent read a single post in this thread. Its what.... 8 pages already.

I dont even need to post now.. Winter just does my work for me. Seriously. I dont need to say anything and the writing is on the fucking wall without me, Roogsy, jack, trane, and many others (including a thousand booing fans at the stadium) having to spell out the words.
goodnight.

You're right. Fire winter. That will make this team a good one overnight. Lol

Don't blame the guys who build the team. Don't blame the guys that sign the players.

Don't blame the actual players.

Blame one man. It's all his fault we're 0-8.

He's gonna be fired or leave. Of that much I'm sure. Unfortunately the only thing I'm more sure of is this:

If the other idiots at TFC remain, nothing will change in the long term.

We may win a couple more games but all the problems will persist. This fucking club reminds me of the CMNT and Cdn soccer in general.

But if course...it's all the fault of one singular man.

Lol

Pookie
05-06-2012, 06:53 AM
True enough. But Anselmi leaving right now just isn't going to happen. The earliest a possible scenario involving his departure COULD happen would be when the sale to Belogers is officially completed, probably sometime over the summer. Even then, there is no guarantee he will be gone.

What matters NOW is that this rot stops, and we don't go 0 for some ridiculous number of games, which will only increase the discontent and low morale at the club. Winter's had enough time to show he has what it takes to lead us forward. There has been no real indication that he can. His dismissal/resignation alone won't solve all the problems, but it's a start.

Honest question, does a new coach with the same roster mismanagement issues:

- a team built around young players sprinkled with talented but either injured or underachieving DPs
- a team that has 8-9 untradeable assets (Canadians that count as Internationals for US based MLS teams)

... does this coach do any better this year?

If not, why inject a new guy into an incredibily poisonous situation? All this talk of "meddling" and losing culture... clear out the building then give the new guy a chance. The most important thing will be to earn the trust and confidence of the players. Seems like whoever comes in is going to have a deck stacked against them.

I'm not tied to Winter but unless it changes at the top the only reason to let him go would be mercy at this point. There is little to no tactical value to bringing in a new coach at this point in time if the leadership above him doesn't change.

Just One Man
05-06-2012, 07:11 AM
The bending over backwards by people on this board to let Winter off the hook is unbelievable. 0-8 and people still don't think change is necessary.

We all want Anselmi, Cochrane and Beirne gone. We all know they are the "leadership" that has been running this team into a ditch since 2007, but poor management at the top is not why we are 0-8. It is why we have never made the playoffs, but it isn't why we are 0-8. We are 0-8 because Winter is either too fucking stupid, or too fucking incompetent to make adjustments.


A few weeks ago, Winter hadn't lost the locker room.
Now, though? I'm not sure that's the case anymore.

Johnson's comments are his own though, and he's been growing angrier and angrier by the game.
I think Winter's problem is he's not inspiring much confidence and isn't making it clear enough to his team that wins are important. He's far too passive.

Anybody who needs "wins are important" to be made clear to them needs to be cut and/or fired immediately.

narduch
05-06-2012, 07:14 AM
I wonder if any journalist has tried to interview Klinsmann about TFC's state of affairs.

I know we'll never find out, but I would love to know what he actually recommended, and how much of that was implemented.

There was an interview last year with Gerry Dobson where Klinsmann essentially tried to wash his hands of the TFC mess.

narduch
05-06-2012, 07:16 AM
yes we are mad and yes this record sucks some serious ass.


but how will you feel when your season tickets cost more next yr?

I'm going to find it awfully hard to renew my 2 season tickets for next season unless there is a price reduction. If things continue like this I may even demand 2007 pricing from the club. We are worse than an expansion team.

My friend that has 2 tickets on my account already said he is done.

Max_TO
05-06-2012, 07:21 AM
You probably would have enjoyed the sarcastic "Lets go Blue Jays/Marlies" chants.

The way it upset some fans with no sense of humour was also pretty funny.

If they really want to make a point , they should go back to the good old fashion Arrrrrgooooo's chant , then we will really see things happen !

Chris Wren
05-06-2012, 07:34 AM
Everything regarding the game has been said. Winter must go. Once again I'd like to ask why the RPB drummer feels a need to drone along to the game and then half ass it for chants. Drum to keep a beat, not because you're bored. I don't need TRN light, thanks.

denime
05-06-2012, 07:34 AM
Have people seen the quotes from DC players after the game from Kurt Larson's twitter?

Olsen: "They made it very difficult in the first half. Put a lot of numbers behind ball … We made some adjustments."

Dero: "You're 0-7, why not just go for the win. It’s supposed to be attacking style football and they sat back. They're not an 0-8 team with that talent. Something’s wrong there. They’ve got good players. You see Frings throw his arm band off. It will be interesting to see about that, but I know what he’s going through. I’m with DC right now, but this is my city and it’s sad to see the state it’s in right now."

There is article in the today's news thread and your quotes are out of contest the way you post them here.


Olsen:“It’s a tough league to turn your team around in,” said United head coach Ben Olsen, whose club sent Aron Winter’s Reds to the worst start (0-8-0) in league history. “I really feel for (Toronto FC) and the fans here because it’s such a great supporting cast.

“We’ve been in a rut as well,” Olsen said.

The Black and Red won just six times in 2010, a number the Reds matched under Winter a season ago.
“We started to slowly figure out what kind of guys we wanted in our organization,” the DC coach continued. “We’re nowhere close to turning things around.”



DeRo:“It’s a stressful place to be right now and I feel for (Toronto’s) fans,” the former TFC captain said. “I just encourage them to keep showing their support.”

“You’re 0-7, why not just go for the win,” De Rosario said. “It’s supposed to be attacking-style football and they sat back … A team like that is not an 0-8 team. With the talent they have, something’s wrong (here). They’ve got good players.”


Instead of seizing the opportunity to bury his former organization, the Canadian international said he’s beyond that point. After landing at a club that was more than willing to sign his cheque, he offered what appeared to be heart-felt sympathy for a club he once said he would end his career with.


“You see (Torsten) Frings throw his captain’s arm band off and walk off the field so it will be interesting to see about that, but I know what he’s going through,” De Rosario said. “I’m with DC right now, but this is my city and it’s sad to see the state (TFC) is in right now.”



Making matters worse for TFC, Torsten Frings left the game in the 67th minute after colliding with teammate Doneil Henry in the D.C. goalmouth on a corner kick and injuring his shoulder. He threw down the captain’s armband on the field when leaving.
“I did not mean anything negative when I removed the armband,” Frings, who will be further evaluated, said in a statement post game. “I was in pain and had to leave the field for treatment.
“I have too much respect for the club, my teammates and the position for it to mean anything else.”

gomesv
05-06-2012, 07:35 AM
Please - eventually, the RPBs will have enough, if things keep going south - PLEASE, do not point only at Winter; ​MAKE COCHRANE ACCOUNTABLE TOO. [/QUOTE]


Eventually you will have had enough.....please do tell when that might be.....because supporting this team only helps to mask the problems

narduch
05-06-2012, 07:37 AM
By the way, anyone who thinks the south end supporters are just blind cheerleaders needs to attend a game and see how different it is compared to 2007.

The passion and life has been sucked out of us. In the first there was barely any chanting other than for Dichio. It was a bit better in the 2nd half with a capo but its stills not as good as it use to be.

ryan
05-06-2012, 07:37 AM
A new coach is going to inherit the same problem and have little chance to succeed. Management needs to have it's shit sorted before that step should be taken.

denime
05-06-2012, 07:41 AM
Please - eventually, the RPBs will have enough, if things keep going south - PLEASE, do not point only at Winter; ​MAKE COCHRANE ACCOUNTABLE TOO.


Eventually you will have had enough.....please do tell when that might be.....because supporting this team only helps to mask the problems

Do not expect from us to stop supporting this team ever,we might protest against coach/FO and so on,but we will always stay behind the boys on the pitch,and this Wednesday we will do it more and better than last few games,because players need us,they need our support in the stands and game vs Montreal is more then just a game.

GuelphStorm2007
05-06-2012, 07:42 AM
It is time for the likes of Anselmi Bierne etc to go Why couldn't someone else own this team like a Stronach someone who ctually cares hell I would be happy with Franck De Angelo

DR HOLLIDAY
05-06-2012, 08:20 AM
The Vaseline giveaway at the stadium sums it up.

LMAO, I have been to three games this year and they always hand that stuff out, LMAO

Beach_Red
05-06-2012, 08:23 AM
A new coach is going to inherit the same problem and have little chance to succeed. Management needs to have it's shit sorted before that step should be taken.

Yes, but for now it's time to stop the bleeding. No one will expect a new coach to get us into the playoffs this, and now probably not even next year, but something has to be done to start to turn things around. We could go 0-10 or 0-12 or...

If ever there was a situation that called for an experienced guy and some short-term results, this is it. What the team needs now is someone who's been through something like this before. Even if it's just someone pulled out of retirement for the rest of this season. This really has to end now.

Pookie
05-06-2012, 08:37 AM
I'm going to find it awfully hard to renew my 2 season tickets for next season unless there is a price reduction. If things continue like this I may even demand 2007 pricing from the club. We are worse than an expansion team.

My friend that has 2 tickets on my account already said he is done.

I'm with you. About 30 mins ago, I submitted my blog to sportsnet and it tackles this very issue. I looked at per game pricing relative to the rest of the league by vantage point (ie. Center Line, North Stand, Supporters, etc).

Not surpisingly we have the most expensive in most categories and never outside of the Top 3. In fact, our Supporter seats are the most expensive on a per game basis and the guy who sits in 109 is paying $720 more per year for a pair of seats than the average MLS team.

Ridiculous.

Roogsy
05-06-2012, 08:42 AM
I don't think Winter has had free reign on the decisions involving the club and therefore don't blame him for the results. Someone above him is making decisions that he is not in agreement with. His hands are tied in my opinion.


The excuses just keep coming.

So what....Anselmi is calling the plays and formations from the MLSE box? He's giving the pep talks at half-time? Is he also running the practices midweek?

It's pretty unbelievable that you guys will blame everyone but the guy actually doing all of that. Yes he's probably seeing lots of interference, but that's like blaming Anselmi for Johnsons misses. When you're out there on the pitch, it's the 11 players and the manager. That is who is responsible for the results. I can just see it now. Kocic screws up a save and we all collectively look up at Anselmi and yell "Screw you Anselmi!"

MG42
05-06-2012, 08:42 AM
http://www.torontofc.ca/sites/toronto/files/tfc_Beirne.jpg

Oh hey guys just FYI we still have tickets available for Wednesday night! Awesome!

Roogsy
05-06-2012, 08:48 AM
Awe come on Roogsy - the players, winter, de klerk are all the symptoms, not the problem - Paul Bierne, Tommy (the fuck) Anselmi, and Earl Cochrane (no pun required) have to go. We have cleaned out the players and the coaches over and over and over. These fucking leaches need to go NOW NOW NOW.

Are you really saying getting rid of Winter is the BEST Answer? I doubt it... Bierne, Anselmi + Cockrane - THAT WILL TURN THE SHIP AROUND - Who has the best answer - You or me??? You know I am right! Admit it.

If you want the big picture to improve, yes, there has to be a cleaning at TFC from top to bottom.

If you want immediate results, Winter's dismissal is the best thing.

It's like having an infection and you go to the hospital. They do two things. 1) Give you antibiotics and 2) Give you Tylenol. Why the two?

The antibiotics treat the actual infection. It could take days before the benefits of treating the infection achieves results. But in the meantime, the hospital has to bring down the fever that is a result of the infection or the patient could suffer additional bad side effects. So they give the patient tylenol to treat the sympton.

People are acting like one big solution will solve TFC's problems and that's not the case. When there is such massive screwing up at the organizational level, it requires a strategy to put it back together. Strategies have various elements. With TFC, the first HAS to be to stop the bleeding. And that is done by letting Winter go. Then comes the fundamental changes needed at TFC and that is where you address the various ingrained problems at TFC and that is a longer term treatment, which yes does include getting rid of Uncle Tom.

So no, you're not right. If we want to stop the bleeding at this team, trying to cure the illness will not do it, it has to be done by treating the symptom...and that is done by getting rid of Winter. That should be job #1. Not that TFC won't do it before it's too late right? No they haven't dont that before have they? :facepalm:

Roogsy
05-06-2012, 08:52 AM
You're right. Fire winter. That will make this team a good one overnight. Lol

You are all missing the point that before Winter arrived we still had this management team of Anselmi, Cochrane and all and while there was plenty wrong and plenty of drama, we never started 0-8 and actually had decent runs at various points.

Yes, they should be gone and yes if they do leave the team will benefit in all aspects including results on the pitch. But UNTIL that happens, the only thing that will immediately solve the problems (even on a temporary basis) is Winter leaving.

It won't make the team "good overnight" but it will definitely give the team a better chance to play at their maximum potential which when you have the THIRD HIGHEST PAYROLL in the league, should be a helluvalot better than 0-8 regardless of what is going on at the MLSE offices.

Pookie
05-06-2012, 08:55 AM
At some point, Dr's stop working on patients who are not likely to recover.

Roogsy, you mention stop the bleeding. For what purpose? Do you really think 2012 playoffs are a realistic outcome for a new coach that takes over before the weekend?

If the season is lost, why inject a new coach into this situation. If Anselmi goes in the offseason, the new coach isn't necessarily "his guy"... we could be in a hiring situation all over again.

denime
05-06-2012, 08:56 AM
You are all missing the point that before Winter arrived we still had this management team of Anselmi, Cochrane and all and while there was plenty wrong and plenty of drama, we never started 0-8 and actually had decent runs at various points.

Yes, they should be gone and yes if they do leave the team will benefit in all aspects including results on the pitch. But UNTIL that happens, the only thing that will immediately solve the problems (even on a temporary basis) is Winter leaving.

It won't make the team "good overnight" but it will definitely give the team a better chance to play at their maximum potential which when you have the THIRD HIGHEST PAYROLL in the league, should be a helluvalot better than 0-8 regardless of what is going on at the MLSE offices..

And you know that,because...?

Roogsy
05-06-2012, 09:01 AM
At some point, Dr's stop working on patients who are not likely to recover.

Roogsy, you mention stop the bleeding. For what purpose? Do you really think 2012 playoffs are a realistic outcome for a new coach that takes over before the weekend?

If the season is lost, why inject a new coach into this situation. If Anselmi goes in the offseason, the new coach isn't necessarily "his guy"... we could be in a hiring situation all over again.

When Drs stop the bleeding, their thought isn't to recover that which has already been lost. It's only to stop things from getting worse. You think 0-8 is bad? How bad do you think things will get if we go 0-10 or worse? At this point the season is lost. It's now about not allowing the most ardent fans to leave this team along with the fairweather fan. Everyone has a breaking point and TFC is testing all of them.

Because of the Anselmi situation, it does complicate matters. His stay or departure won't be answered for quite some time. In the meantime, we can't allow the damage to continue at TFC just because at the corporate level they havent sorted things out. They need to put a caretaker manager in place and ride the season out and hire someone like Vancouver did, mid-season but who won't take over until the season is over. At least then we will have a coach in place by October or November, not friggin' January.

Roogsy
05-06-2012, 09:03 AM
.

And you know that,because...?

Management 101.

It's not like I have been wrong so far have I? While you guys dilly-daddle and support Winter en route to an epic record of futility.

Beach_Red
05-06-2012, 09:03 AM
At some point, Dr's stop working on patients who are not likely to recover.

Roogsy, you mention stop the bleeding. For what purpose? Do you really think 2012 playoffs are a realistic outcome for a new coach that takes over before the weekend?

If the season is lost, why inject a new coach into this situation. If Anselmi goes in the offseason, the new coach isn't necessarily "his guy"... we could be in a hiring situation all over again.

Clearly this management is not able to put a long-term plan together. They tried to buy one from a company called Soccer Solutions and we have to put with Bill Archer (ffs) pointing out how the "plan" is the same one every other team has.

Yes, it's time to stop the bleeding. It's time to stop the embarrassment. Of course no coach brought in now is going to save this season, but it's time to stop making it worse.

Bring in some very well-respected, experienced guy. Lure him out of retirement. Stop oir team from being a world-class joke.

What's it going to take, 0-10? 0-12? 0-20?

Just One Man
05-06-2012, 09:03 AM
.

And you know that,because...?

Because it is statistically impossible to do worse...

tfcleeds
05-06-2012, 09:04 AM
At some point, Dr's stop working on patients who are not likely to recover.

Roogsy, you mention stop the bleeding. For what purpose? Do you really think 2012 playoffs are a realistic outcome for a new coach that takes over before the weekend?

If the season is lost, why inject a new coach into this situation. If Anselmi goes in the offseason, the new coach isn't necessarily "his guy"... we could be in a hiring situation all over again.

I don't think anyone thinks we can make the playoffs now. The question is, how long are you content with seeing this losing streak continue? We've already set a MLS record for losses to start a season - I don't want to see how long we can keep it up. I just want some freaking wins. I don't care what we have to do to get them. If injecting some new blood (i.e. a new manager) is what is required at this point, so be it.

And I don't think that's being kneejerk - Winter's already been in charge longer than any other TFC manager.